Conference 7.286::golf

I haven't heard anyone ever complain about Ping irons. I too am in the
    market for new clubs. I've pretty much decided on Ping because they
    feel great, come in an upright lie (Green or Blue for me), and they
    hold up well. Woods are not an issue - I do not like the Ping woods.
    
    The big question is whether the cost (about $400) for Ping irons
    makes them a better choice than lesser priced quality sticks.
    
    	Eric
    
    

    re: .0
    
    I too have recently been in the market for new clubs.  I looked
    at the Pings as well as some others.  I settled for the Wilson 1200GEs.
    I found the 1200GEs to feel much like the Pings only for me, a little
    bit better.  Have you tried the 1200GE clubs?  I think you can do
    better than $400 for these irons and have what I consider the same
    high quality.
    
    Paul

    	Thanks for the great info you future Masters Champions.
    
    	Cost wise I have a friend who can get me a set of the irons
    	(I don't care for the woods either) for about $200.00
    
    	I don't think I have even touched any Wilson 1200GE's. But I
    	off to the Golf Discount House to see how I like them.
    
    	If anybody has anymore information, keep it coming, and thanks
    	again for your help.
    
    	Monty  (DECLNE::OKELLEY)
    	        Atlanta

    Pings are very nice.  I just purchased a set of Ping replicas (irons
    only) for my Dad for fathers day.  I got them from my Instructor
    who just started selling them, they are going like hot cakes.  They 
    look and feel VERY much like Ping irons, for $165.00 (tax included).  
    My Instructor, who plays Pings, bought a set for his son, and says
    that he likes them as much or more than his set of Pings.  I played 
    them when I took my Dad out this past Sunday, and liked them 
    very much ( I currently play Pinnacle's).  If you are interested in 
    trying them, I'll let you know where I got them, and how to get there.
    
    Peter
    
    PS: they are guaranteed.

    I have used Wilson 1200's and Staff's before I purchased a full
    set of Pings ( 1-S, Driver and 4).  I found the Ping clubs to be
    forgiving, while just as rewarding for a good stroke as the Staff.
    
    One other point: I walk and carry my clubs.  The Ping clubs are
    definitely lighter.  I have the Eye 2, White, +3/4", thus about
    the largest you can purchase.
    
    Finally, as for cost, check with the local Pro's.  I was able
    to purchase my clubs at very near the cost from the factory.
    
    Tim Butler
    River North
    Macon, Georgia
    8-351-3325/3327
    (912) 929-2593

    What was the name of the imatation brand?
    
    Roger
    

    CURIUM::WRIGHT
    
                           1200GEs
    
    LOVE MY 1200GEs GREAT BALANCE,NICE FEEL AND WEIGHTED WELL.FOR THE
    PRICE I'D TRY THE WILSONS.
    
    
                           
    

    RE: .7 I'll get more info for you tonight.
    
    Peter

For those of you who are interested in purchasing replicas of "brand
name" clubs have I got a deal for you. I happen to make golf clubs as
a hobby. I own a set of PING irons (orange -1/2 for the short person).
I paid about $500 for the 2 thru SW. Since then I found that I can make
the same club (with a different name) for a lot less. 

For more information send a mail message to MDVAX1::ALEXANDER (I don't
get into the notes as often as I'd like).

Leave your name, E-mail address, and any questions you might have.

     Yes I`ve played with Pings and clubs similiar to pings. There are
    many advantages to these clubs.Because of the perrimeter weighting
    the "sweet spot" of the club is enlarged, therefore off-center hits
    turn out much better.These are cast steel clubs instead of forged
    clubs;the ball will come off the club with more speed and you will
    find yourself hitting about one club further than with traditional
    forged clubs.The brushed finish will look better longer than the
    chrome finish.The only disadvantage is it is harder to put spin
    on the ball to be able to stop quickly on the greens. Also the clubs
    are very expensive.For an alternative clubs read 69.3 under "Buying
    and Selling".            
                   Tom:JXO
              
                   
    
    

    I WAS ALSO LOOKING TO BUY A SET OF PINGS A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO BUT
    WAS TOLD BY MY PRO THAT PINGS ARE A VERY LIGHT CLUB AND WOULD NOT
    HELP OUT MY GAME SINCE I HAVE A FAST BACK SWING AND ALSO A TENDENCY
    TO HIT A LONG WAY. HE RECOMMENDED TITLEST ACU-FLO D-3 STIFF SHAFT
    WHICH HAVE WORKED GREAT FOR ME. PINGS I WAS TOLD IS FOR THE LOW
    HANDICAPER WHO HAS A SMOOTH SWING. IF A COULD SLOW MY SWING DOWN
    AND GET MY HANDICAP TO AROUND A 2-3 I WILL CONSIDER THEM AGAIN
    BUT I AM STILL PLAYING TO AN 7-8 AND I STILL HAVE A QUICK BACK
    SWING.
    

	 Please don't  write  all-uppercase  text in notesfiles - it's a lot
	 harder  to  read  than  normal  mixed-case, and it also looks as if
	 you're SHOUTING ALL THE TIME which is sort of annoying.

	 I hate to be picky, but what else should the moderator do? :-)

	 -- POL

    Did anyone see the ad from Nevada Bob's, offering refunds on PING
    clubs? Apparently it applies whether you bought them at Nevada Bob's
    or elsewhere. Sounds like you could pick up a set of PING's pretty
    cheap, as long as you're not concerned about the USGA's ruling on
    square grooves, etc.
    

Hi, there

How's playing golf ? 

Great!

Does anyone know the price of the Ping iron set in the States ?

 As I plan to go to the States in first of November ,if the price is reasonable

, I'm going to buy the Ping iron set.

I have heard the rumor that everybody want it because of its performance and

the price goes high . The performance is that the ball hitting by Ping 

can be stopped easily even on the hard green.  

Are there any information about the shop near Boston they give me a discount ?

Thank you,

			Yoshinobu Otosu     Osaka ,Japan
			(Mail stop	  TKTV05::OTOSU)

        Ping irons typically cost $55.00 per club and are designed for a
custom fit with the golfer.  This may have changed, but Ping had a policy
of only selling to small golf shops -- not the Nevada Bob type discount
outlet.  In most cases the club professional takes some basic measurements,
may watch a swing or two, and will then "order" a custom set of Pings. 

	In my case I have an upright lie (I'm 6'2"), the shaft is 3/4"
longer, and the grips are oversized.  Oh, and I almost forgot to mention
delivery.  I had to wait almost 3 months for the clubs [in the winter
months].  If you plan on picking up a set of Pings it might be difficult 
to get something that fits your game unless you purchase [and can find]
a standard set on-the-shelf.

	I bought the complete set of Pings -- 1 iron through SW. I have
friends who are playing better with Pings.  I haven't noticed any
"advantage" in playing Pings over the past year.  I previously played
PowerBilt Citations prior to making the change to Ping.   My favorite club
is the SW -- in the sand, on the fairway, or short pitches over hazards to
the green.  The rest of the irons are okay.  I am considering making a
change to  either a Titleist Tour Blade or MacGregor Muirfield for better
feel. 

	I'm curious.  Of those folks that have Pings, how many believe
their game has improved?  Are there any folks who haven't noticed a
difference?

Jeff

    
    I USED to play Pings. I used them for about 2 years, and developed
    an atrocious hook, as well as hitting very high shots. I changed
    last year to Hogan Apex PC's and heve been very pleased! The forged
    blade gives me better feel, and the non-offset allows for a better
    ball flight trajectory. By the way Hogan clubs are 2 degrees flat,
    so for other lie angles you will need to see a clubfitter.
    
    
    					Fred Deady

    I changed to pings this year. I have dropped my handicap a little,
    but I would have to credit that to practice, I have spent a lot
    of time practicing. The price for a set of pings (3-w) was $415.00.
    I was lucky in that they were a canceled order and when I decided
    to buy them they had just arrived at the pro shop. I definitely
    like the feel of the clubs, but they are also my first set of good
    clubs. My first set was a starter set, hence I have little to compare
    them to. If you are planning on purchasing a set definately look
    around for a good price, I priced them at 5 or 6 places before I
    bought them. I bougth them at Charmingfare Links in Candia, N.H.,
    just east of Manchester in tax free N.H.. Saved about $100.00 by
    shopping around.
    
    If I can help you let me know.
    
    
    Dave

RE:< Note 12.19 by HARLEY::DAVE "FLST, 69 L 46" >

Thanks Dave,

I will try to go the shop you recommended.

    Charmingfare Links in Candia, N.H.

( I've got how to get there by note article #376 you replied.)

Have a good shot !!!!

    I too use ping golf clubs. I bout them two years ago and wouldn't
    trade them for anything.
    
    There was a noticeable improvement to my game after I started playing
    with my ping irons. I haven't exactly reached pro status, but I did
    start hitting the ball a lot longer. While I am not a very big person,
    I can hit the ball with my ping irons as far as many other woman
    golfers who use woods.
    
    I am not up on the technical explanations for these types of
    improvements, but I am convinced that I can thank my ping clubs
    for it.
           
    Looking forward to next spring...

    I'm interested in the ping repli-clubs.  Please send info to
    WALLAC::MORTON  I work in the Tempe plant (TFO) and my phone is area
    code (602) 731-4107.  (We don't have a DTN.
    
    

    Hey Morton!
    
    Look in the back section of either "Golf" or "Golf Digest" fo the
    GOLFSMITH ad.  Send for a catalog. They have Replipings in both
    forged steel and berrlyum-copper.  If you build'emyerself you can
    save major dinero, dude!   I built'em, I play'em, I like'em.
    
    EXAMPLE 1:  You can build a set of irons,  3 thru sw in
                berrlyum-copper, with graphite shafts for 
                about $360 and you don't have to be a super
                handyman either! 

    
    re.23
    
       It is a good way to go.  A friend just put a 3, 5, 7, 9, pw,
    and 3 wood (all left-handed) for my son for $140.  They were the
    ping-a-likes Tour II's.
    
       Incidently, if, anyone out there needs an excellent set of left
    handed starter (junior) clubs, contact me.

    I purchased Ping copies "Tour Model II". The 3 thru wedge iron set
    was $169, and I love 'em.....
    
    Steve

      I watched a little of the money tourney yesterday and they were
    talking about Ping clubs being grand-fathered and stopping the
    manufacture of Eye-2 clubs. Anyone know the story on this? Thanks
    
    Dave

    
    Dave,
    
    I heard the same thing you did and found it quite interesting.
    
    A little more on what they said. They said that boths sides had
    given in a little and there was a possibility of what you mentioned.
    In that, Ping would stop the manufacturing of the eye-2 and start
    making V grooves if they were to grandfather all the existing eye-2s.
    
    Ping also got an injuction so that they PGA players are still playing
    with the eye-2s as of right now, but the PGA has appealed this (results
    of the appeal should be known next month)...!!!!!!!!!
    
    ABC also had a little interview with Calcavecchia after the tourney and
    asked his thoughts on the advantages of square grooves (he just won the
    Spalding Invitational with V grooves, Tommy Armours). He said that it
    is what is at the grip end of the club that matters (the player). They
    also had him hit two shots from the rough, one with V grooves and one
    with square grooves. As it turned out the ball that was hit with the
    V groove actually checked up quicker (not that hitting two balls
    prooves anything conclusive, but it was interesting to note).
    
    Gene
    
    

>    They
>    also had him hit two shots from the rough, one with V grooves and one
>    with square grooves. As it turned out the ball that was hit with the
>    V groove actually checked up quicker (not that hitting two balls
>    prooves anything conclusive, but it was interesting to note).

What they didn't point out was that the V groove ball ended up significantly
further than the U groove ball.  This fits with my understanding of a flier
which is one where the ball flies through the air further than normal.

Larry

>What they didn't point out was that the V groove ball ended up significantly
>further than the U groove ball.  This fits with my understanding of a flier
>which is one where the ball flies through the air further than normal.

Larry,
    
    The first shot hit with the U grooves came up about 15-20 feet short of
    the hole and the one hit with the V grooves ended up 10-15 feet past
    the hole and checked up... You call that the difference between a "normal" 
    shot and a "flier"...?
    
    Gene

Re: -.1

>    The first shot hit with the U grooves came up about 15-20 feet short of
>    the hole and the one hit with the V grooves ended up 10-15 feet past
>    the hole and checked up... You call that the difference between a "normal" 
>    shot and a "flier"...?

Gene,

  If my didn't deceive me I don't believe that it backed up.  It did sit
  however sit right where it landed.  I wasn't trying to say that he hit a
  "flier" but that the shot showed a sympthom of a flier.

  Since my handicap is not low enough I blame most of my shots that fly the
  green on over clubbing, bad yardage, etc.  However I have hit some that I
  know were definite fliers.  It's the one time in your life you won't give
  anything for added length!

  Larry

    
    Larry,
    
    Sorry for my misinterpretation of your note. I thought you were saying
    that the V groove shot was in fact a "flier" (which to me means not
    only that it might be airborn for a little more distance, but will
    also take off when it lands)...
    
    I believe that you also misinterpreted my note as I did not say that
    it backed up, but that it checked up - meaning that it did not role
    as far after it hit the green as did the shot hit with the U grooves.
    I would like to see Mark or any of the big boys try to get the ball
    to stop on the greens around here....:-) ;-)
    
    In any case to heck with the contraversy that is going of with V vs.
    U grooves, just give me some clubs and some warm weather so I can
    play....!!!!
    
    Gene

>    I would like to see Mark or any of the big boys try to get the ball
>    to stop on the greens around here....:-) ;-)

     Yeah, you've got to play bump & run, run, run to get the ball close
     on frozen ground.  Imagine if the 17th at TPC was up North.

     Larry

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
                               -< The Good Game >-
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Note 169.1                      PING Availability                         1 of 1
PNO::MORGAN                                          20 lines  30-DEC-1987 10:27
                         -< SO HOW DO THEY MAKE THEM >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    
    
    Ping clubs are made by an interesting process. Since I live in Phoenix,
    I had the chance to visit the Ping Manufacturing facility in town.
    
    The putters are very interesting indeed. The blades are made by
    placing shiny putter blades into a vat of vibrating rocks to dull
    their finish. they are then sent to the shaft room where an epoxy
    is put on the shaft and pushed onto the blade. Grips are fastened
    and sent to the stockroom. I have never seen so many putters in
    a single room.
    
    The woods are cut by robots and a liquid sweetspot is placed onto
    the clubhead. After this dries, the club is painted and polished.
    
        If anyone of golf nuts ever visits Phoenix, stop by the Ping
     Plant and see how they make those crazy clubs!!
    
    
                     Eugene in Phoenix

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 373.0                      ping color codes                       5 replies
MJOSWS::FAGLEY "leavin' early...golf to play"        10 lines  24-AUG-1988 14:17
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
    Hello,
    
      Can anyone explain the difference in the color codes on ping irons?
    I am thinking about buying a used set of orange dots and want to
    know if they are right for me.  (yes, I know, go hit 'em).  I think
    I wouldn't mind being influenced by the manufacturers suggestions
    for each color code.
    
    Rick...(15 on a fairly good day)

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
                               -< The Good Game >-
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Note 373.1                      ping color codes                          1 of 5
PARITY::KEVIN "The perfect swing...the endless sear" 14 lines  24-AUG-1988 15:38
                             -< it tells the lie >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The color code on the Ping irons refers to the lie of the club.
    (2� upright, flat or standard)  I don't remember what the orange
    signifies.  Are they right for you?  No way to really tell.  The
    best way to figure that out is to put a piece of masking tape on
    the bottom of the club.  Then hit balls off a piece of plywood
    (maybe the driving range mats would do) and look at how the tape
    wears.  If it wears evenly then it's probably ok.  A quick and dirty
    method is to take a normal stance as if to hit the ball.  If the
    club is not soled properly then don't bother with the hitting test.
    
    Good luck!
    
    
    						KO

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 373.2                      ping color codes                          2 of 5
ODIXIE::WESTCL "Gator Golfer"                         6 lines  26-AUG-1988 17:05
                         -< Green, Black, and Orange >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Green is upright, black is standard, and orange is flat.  I think
    there are a few other colors, too, but don't see them very often.
    
    .1 was right-on about a good way to test (swing with tape on bottom).
    
    Closs

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 373.3                      ping color codes                          3 of 5
HARLEY::DAVE "FLST, 69 L 46"                          4 lines  30-AUG-1988 13:00
                                -< get fitted >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Go down to a club that sells Ping. Have the pro fit you, then
    you'll know.
    
    Dave

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 373.4                      ping color codes                          4 of 5
MJOSWS::FAGLEY "leavin' early...golf to play"         5 lines   1-SEP-1988 11:20
                                -< Ping cost? >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      What should I expect to pay for a new set of Ping irons 2 thru
    SW?  Also, what do you think a set one season old in good condition
    should cost?
    
    Rick

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
                               -< The Good Game >-
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Note 373.5                      ping color codes                          5 of 5
MAMTS1::KVENEZIO                                      8 lines   2-SEP-1988 16:00
                                 -< NOT CHEAP >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I have seen the ping irons from $47.00 to $56.00 per club. That
    would be $470. for 2 thru the SW at best.
    You should figure $300. to $350. for a 1 year old set in good shape.
    Be sure to check the grips. Regripping could cost you as much as
    $6.00 per club. It is also a good barometer of how much play they
    have seen.
    
    Good Luck, Ken

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
                               -< The Good Game >-
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Note 376.0                  To Ping or not to Ping???                 14 replies
ANT::ALFORD                                          17 lines  25-AUG-1988 09:16
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
	I have a friend looking for a new set of clubs and would like to buy
	Ping eye 2 irons. However, with the PGA possible ruling on square 
	groves and the USGA controversy over Ping eye 2's being illegal
	he is afraid of buying a set now, only to find out later that he can 
	not play in amateurs tournaments. Have any of you golfers out there 
	that belong to Country Clubs or play in local tournaments heard 
	anything about how amateurs are going to be affected by the USGA or 
	PGA ruling? Are certain club tournaments (eg:club championships) going 
	to follow the USGA if they rule that the Ping eye 2 are illegal? Will 
	local tournaments like the Labor Day Four Ball at Wachusetts C.C. 
	disqualify players using Pings? Or just your opinion, on the PGA 
	possibly separating itself from the USGA and amateurs on what is 
	legal equipment.


							Bruce	
						

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 376.1                  To Ping or not to Ping???                    1 of 14
PARITY::KEVIN "The perfect swing...the endless searc" 9 lines  25-AUG-1988 10:52
                         -< Golf Digest has the scoop >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    
    There is a good article in this months Golf Digest on the square
    groove controversy.  Tell you friend to investigate custom club
    shop in the area.  There are at least 10 versions of the Ping Eye
    2 with legal square groves and V groves.  You can also get them
    with the custom lies of the original Ping.
    
    
    						KO

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 376.2                  To Ping or not to Ping???                    2 of 14
ODIXIE::WESTCL "Gator Golfer"                         6 lines  26-AUG-1988 16:55
                          -< PGA Tour Reverses Stand >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Just last week the PGA announced it will NOT enforce it's previous
    ruling against "square grooves", a la Ping.  The PGA said that it
    plans to go along with the USGA's rulings, which, to date, have
    not outlawed the Ping clubs. 
    
    Closs

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 376.3                  To Ping or not to Ping???                    3 of 14
MAMTS1::KVENEZIO                                     27 lines  29-AUG-1988 10:10
                           -< GROOVIN' CONTROVERSY >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The controversy is not the groove itself ( V versus Square) it is
    the distance between grooves and the method of measuring that distance.
    Because I am custom fitting many sets of "PING" clones I am trying
    to stay informed on this subject. The USGA and the PGA have discovered
    that the groove type does not have an impact on spinning the ball.
    They have discovered that the distance between grooves does. The
    closer together the groove, the more spin imparted. PING has been
    ruled out because of the distance between grooves. Karstin Solhiem
    has challanged the ruling and claims that his method of measuring
    the distance between grooves is in accordance with the USGA standards.
    
    To answer the question on the legality of PINGS in tournament play,
    The USGA will ban PINGS from play in all tourneys using USGA rules
    sometime in the early 1990s. I think it is 1991 however local rules
    can override the USGA decision. This will probably be done in things
    like club championships and mixed scrambles. If your friend is at
    the caliber of the US Amateur qualifying he may have a problem.
    
    I don't see PING giving up on the fight and I think the consumer
    might win this one. The contoversy has not hurt sales. My feeling
    is why shouldn't a 103 shooter have a chance to break 100 or an
    83 shooter have a chance to break 80 with a little help from his
    clubs. If they want to work on something they should look at a solid
    ball being hit with a metal driver. Now theres an advantage.
    
    Your fellow struggling linkster,
    Ken

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 376.4                  To Ping or not to Ping???                    4 of 14
IMBIBE::KINGSBERRY                                    7 lines  29-AUG-1988 15:28
                              -< The Real Thing >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Re .1 , there are not 10 versions of Ping irons, there are probably
    at least that many copies or "imitation Pings".  I think you get
    what you pay for.  A friend of mine (who owns a golf shop) recommends
    Pings not for the grooves, or the cast clubhead, or the weighting,
    but simply because they are the best manufactured club on the market.
    
    Alan

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 376.5                  To Ping or not to Ping???                    5 of 14
SCOMAN::KOZAK                                        12 lines  29-AUG-1988 22:38
                           -< HOGANS ARE AT THE TOP >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    BEST ON MARKET?
    
    BEEN TAKING SOME SERIOUS LESSONS THE LAST THREE YEARS AND ALL I'VE
    BEEN HEARING FROM THE PRO IS THAT HOGANS ARE THE BEST MADE CLUB.
    HE EVEN WEIGHS THEM ABOVE PING FOR THIS. HE AGREES PINGS ARE VERY
    WELL MADE, BUT THE INDIVIDUAL QUALITY OF THE AREA NEAR THE HOSEL,
    AMONGST OTHER AREAS (SHAFTS, FLEX POINT ETC.,) HAVE HOGAN AT THE
    TOP. 
    
    SOUNDS LIKE IT STILL GOES BACK TO INDIVIDUAL CHOICE!
    
    KEN

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 376.6                  To Ping or not to Ping???                    6 of 14
PARITY::KEVIN "The perfect swing...the endless sear" 34 lines  30-AUG-1988 10:09
                          -< I respectfully disagree >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    RE:    < Note 376.4 by IMBIBE::KINGSBERRY >
                              -< The Real Thing >-

>>    Re .1 , there are not 10 versions of Ping irons, there are probably
>>    at least that many copies or "imitation Pings".  
    
    That's true, the 10 versions are copies (imitations) of the Ping
    iron.
 
    
 >>  they are the best manufactured club on the market.
    
    This would make a good discussion at the 19th.  There really is
    nothing superior about the Ping irons.  They are an investment cast
    stainless steel head, the shaft is nothing special and it's just
    a regular old rubber grip.  Very little difference between these
    and any other "name" club.  The woods on the other hand are, ........
    well quite frankly overpriced junk.
    
 >> I think you get what you pay for.  
    
    Usually that's true, but in this case it's all hype.  These clubs
    are not going to improve your game any more than the other peripherial
    weighted clubs will.  As for the groove thing, my personal opinion
    is we as club players don't hit the ball well enough for the grooves
    to make any difference.  
    
    The only real advantage these clubs have is that the manufacturer
    can charge more for them becasue of a superior marketing effort.
    
    
    						KO

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 376.7                  To Ping or not to Ping???                    7 of 14
WORDS::NISKALA "Hanz 'n Franz want to puuump you up" 11 lines   1-SEP-1988 09:02
                       -< Not imitations but real Pings >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    re. last 2
    
    	There are quite a few versions of Pings. I remember looking
    at a Ping advertisement board, and there was about 10 different
    lies that could be purchased. They ranged from very upright to
    very flat and it must have been about 8 or 9 to lies to make up
    that broad range. Just going from memory, so please don't jump 
    down my throat.
    
    
    						Keith

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                               -< The Good Game >-
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Note 376.8                  To Ping or not to Ping???                    8 of 14
MSEE::KELLEY "on_in_regulation, GRAPHITE"            11 lines   6-SEP-1988 11:55
                          -< terminology problem... >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    
    RE:---
    
    	I think we have a terminollogy problem here. There are not
    	different VERSIONS of pings, what they offer with different
    	lies and lengths and grip size, etc are all the same club
    	head. Any custom club maker can offer the same thing for
    	most clubs they make and can also adjust the lies on most 
    	existing irons and woods...
    
    	Gene (BTW, if anybody is in the market, let me know)

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
                               -< The Good Game >-
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Note 376.9                  To Ping or not to Ping???                    9 of 14
MSEE::KELLEY "Custom clubs/club repair"              14 lines   6-MAR-1989 11:37
                   -< More controversy on square grooves... >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    
    	New controversy about square grooves... The PGA tour has announced
    	that they will ban the square grooved clubs starting Jan 1st
    	1990. This goes against the USGA ruling, which is the where
    	the problem comes from (the USGA "HAS" been the rule making
    	body). 
    
    	There was a statement made during the seniors tourney yesterday
    	that every tounament on the regular tour thus far this year
    	has been won by a player with square grooved clubs! They also
    	said that 2 out of every three players carries at least 1 square
    	grooved club...!
    
    	Gene

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
                               -< The Good Game >-
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Note 376.10                 To Ping or not to Ping???                   10 of 14
HARLEY::DAVE "it's tee time !!!"                      5 lines   6-MAR-1989 13:02
                            -< money poorly spent >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Sounds like the lawyers are going to get some big bucks that could
    otherwise be spent on improving the game.
    
    Dave
          who leaves for south of the Mason-Dixon on Wednesday

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
                               -< The Good Game >-
================================================================================
Note 376.11                 To Ping or not to Ping???                   11 of 14
BOSHOG::VARLEY                                       10 lines   7-MAR-1989 10:22
                   -< I Hope Beman's ? is as Big as His Ego >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
     Beman ought to but the hell out of stuff like this! As far as I'm
    concerned, there are two major rules makers - the U.S.G.A. and the
    R.& A.; everybody else plays bass.
     We could live without the PGA tour, the egos and the bucks, but
    golf in America needs a parent body, and I think it starts with
    the U.S.G.A.
    
    --My 2 cents,
    
    --The Skoal Bandit

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                               -< The Good Game >-
================================================================================
Note 376.12                 To Ping or not to Ping???                   12 of 14
MJOFS::FAGLEY "beat the resident"                    10 lines  11-APR-1989 19:02
                             -< PING redesigned? >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Hey folks,
    
      Read an article the other day... PING will be redesigning their
    irons.  It seems U-grooves are OUT in 1990.  They are still appealing
    though.  
    
    (I think it was the GOLF insert in USA today last Friday?)
    

    Rick

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
                               -< The Good Game >-
================================================================================
Note 376.13                 To Ping or not to Ping???                   13 of 14
TAZRAT::POWIS                                        23 lines   7-JUN-1989 07:08
                           -< square groove update >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
...from VOGON News Service, 6/7/89
    
                             PGA Bans Ping Irons

                            VNS TECHNOLOGY WATCH

       Karsten Manufacturing's Ping Eye 2 golf clubs are the top selling 
       single brand in the world, with more than 2 million sets in use.
       But the Ping Eye 2s are at the center of what might be golf's
       most bitter debate ever. Because of the square grooves on the
       club's face, both of golf's most powerful bodies, the USGA and
       the PGA Tour Inc., plan to outlaw the clubs in professional
       competition starting next January. The tour's reasoning: square,
       or U-shaped grooves enable pros to put so much spin on the ball
       that they can control their shots from even the most trying
       positions. Tour officials, being purists, feel those shots should 
       be more difficult. The USGA has no gripe with square grooves. But 
       it says the Eye 2 grooves are too close together. They only miss
       by about a hair's width, but a rule is a rule. So as of January
       1996, the club will not be allowed in any amateur tournament that 
       follows USGA rules, which would include nearly every local
       championship and country club event.
       {Business Week May 15, 1989}

                    <<< USER$1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]GOLF.NOTE;1 >>>
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Note 376.14                 To Ping or not to Ping???                   14 of 14
IOENG::DENNY                                          3 lines  25-JUL-1989 08:11
                           -< re-cutting Ping faces >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Does anyone know if there is or will be a way to have the faces re-cut
    to make them legal when the ruling goes in affect?  I've got a set of pings
    and love them.

    I'm thinking of buying a set of Pings.  I answered an ad from
    Golf Magazine listing my glove size, height, and figertip to floor
    measurements to determine the color code.  That was over three
    weeks ago.  Does anyone know how long it takes before Karsten
    Mfg. Co. responds?  Will it take forever if I order them direct
    from the manufacturer?  I thought I could save a few dollars, or
    at least have them made to my specs.  
    
    Thanks,
    Bill
     

    re .55
    
    Send me the specs and I will walk them over.  I live a couple of miles
    from the factory and I would like to see the inside.
    
    Harold (Phoenix_hacker_extrodinaire)

    
    RE: .55
    
    Bill, 
    
    Have a custom set of Ping look-a-likes made and save yourself
    big bucks and time...
    
    Gene
    

    RE: .55
    
    Still have my heart (head) set on buying the real thing.  I've got
    my specs back from Ping.  Now need a Pro Shop who'll sell them.
    Does anyone know of a Country Club that doesn't mark up as high
    as most others?  i.e. (where can I get a decent deal, and not feel
    like I've been ripped off)  Don't get me wrong, I don't mind paying
    big bucks, but I do mind paying more than I have to.
    
    Bill
    

    RE: .58
    
    Friends who have price shopped around both ageed that the pro shop
    at Wayland CC had one of the better priced deals. Might be worth
    a look.
    
    Ted

    
    RE: .58
    
    Bill,
    
    You might be better off to wait to see what happens with Pings
    case in court next month. If they wind up changing their grooves
    to conform to the USGA rules, then you might be able to get a
    better deal on the current Ping EYE-2... And then again maybe not,
    just something to think about...
    
    Gene
    

    
    	Well the suit that was filed by Ping against the USGA was
    	settled out of court. From what I caught of the settlement,
    	they are going to grandfather the existing Ping Eye-2 irons
    	(does this mean all the ones they still have in the warehouse
    	and in pro shops...?) and start making a slightly new design
    	that will conform with the USGA rules...
    
    	Yeah, I think this was a good move from both sides...
    
    	Gene

    
    
    	Maybe someone from the phoenix area might want to answer this,
    or actualy anyone who know's.
    
    
    	Does Ping (Karsten) allow people to buy direct from the factory??
    I bought Pings last year and want to regrip with the Gold/oversized
    grips that I ordered them with. The only problem is that only one
    golf shop in the area has these grips.(rest sold out), and they
    want, get this  $7.00 each, installed, they wouldn't even cut me
    a break if I wanted to put them on myself, still 7.00. I asked the
    guy about his reasoning and he replied. "Where else are you going
    to get them". Anyways, any one who know's, it will be appreciated.
    
    Thanks,
    John

    
    
    	John,
    
    	You said you checked the "golf shops". I am not sure if you
    	mean places like Nevada Bobs or what, but you should be able
    	to get them at some of your local pro shops...
    
    	Gene

    Gene,
    
    	I checked out every known golf store and proshop in the area,
    and only found them at this one store. There are plenty of the "stock"
    white grips but none of the oversized, gold grips. Considering that
    my father just paid 7.50 for 4 jumbo golf pride grips, I would have
    a hard time justifying 7.00 apiece at the mentioned shop. Thanks
    in advanced.
    
    John-

    
    
    John,
    
    What are some of the other shops getting for the regular size grips?
    If they are asking a price that is agreeable to you for those, then
    why not just get them and add a layer or two of extra tape to build
    them up to the size that you want...
    
    Gene

    Follow the Master!!
    
    Did you notice on Sunday that Faldo had tape round the top of his
    clubs. Apparently he's been getting a lot of pain when striking
    the ball and some physio gave him the tip. He said that building
    it up really helped.
    
    Maybe he did this as he couldn't afford the $7 need for the larger
    grips either...8^)
    
    Phil.

    
    
    	Thanks for the info and help, I ended up finding some after
    all, bought them last night, 14 for 54.95, not installed. 
    
    Thanks,
    John

    Just for anyone's info-
    
    Just called Karsten's, the manufacturer of Pings, and they said
    they installed the gold/oversized grips at the factory for $6.00
    each.  What the pro shops charged was up to the pro shop.
    
    Glad you found what you wanted at a decent price.
    
    Harold

    
    Where did you find the grips? I also use the over size grips and
    need to do it soon.
    
    Thanks
    
    Dave

    My wife gave me a set of Pal Joey clubs, made in Australia.
    
    The pro's at two shops she went to said they are exactly the same
    as Ping. As a matter of fact, Pal Joey lost a law suit Ping brought
    against them for some reason or other. The only difference, supposedly,
    is the Pal Joey's do not have a dot on the heel of the club.
    
    From what I can see, they look like Pings. Of course, it hasn't been
    above 20 in the last week, so I have yet to play with them..
    
    Anyone have any experience with these clubs ???
    
    Jim
    

 Any suggestions on the best place (price) to buy a set of Ping Eye 2's.
    
    
 Greg

>                       -< Best price/place for Pings?? >-
>
> Any suggestions on the best place (price) to buy a set of Ping Eye 2's.
****
	When I bought mine, the best price was at the Pro shop at the Marlboro
	Country Club...

Larry

    This note is directed primarily to European noters.

    I will be relocating to The Netherlands  this summer.  Originally  it
    was supposed  to  be  to  Geneva  area as I mentioned in another note
    where I asked  for courses in that area.  Don't worry, I am not going
    to ask for info  on  dutch courses, I already have a map with details
    of every single course there.  I even got a book with most courses in
    Europe.
    
    As it has been mentioned often  here golf equipment is very expensive
    in Europe.  On  my  last  trip  I has some free time and stopped in a
    golf shop and was able to certify this. wow!
    
    Getting to the point, I am considering buying a new  set of clubs now
    with plans to sell it in Europe.
    
    So the question is:   what  should  I  buy.  And the main criteria is
    what would be easier to sell there among the big name clubs.
    
    I am considering either Ping Eye IIs or Tommy Armour 845's.   My  gut
    feeling tells me Pings.
    
    There  is the possibility that someone  here  may  ask  me  to  bring
    him/her a set, but please understand that  my  primary  motivation is
    making some money, so I plan to sell  the  clubs  below  dutch market
    value, but way above US price. I think this is fair.
    
    Thanks in advance for your inputs
    
    Tavo
    

(I am not sure what happened, but I thought I had entered a note and now I
can't find it, so apologies if I dupplicate it, I hope not)

This  note  is  primarily  to  European  noters, but welcome  evreybody's
oppinion.

I had mentioned in another note that I may be relocating to Europe, well,
unless something unforseeable happens, I am, to Holland not the Geneva as
I was told before.

After a good sugestion of  a  good friend (and I know you'll read this) I
am thinking on buying a set of brand clubs to sell there.

So the questions is which brand  I will sell more easely.  I am obviously
thinking of Pings, but New England Golf Supply has the Tommy Armours at a
good price.

So what should it be?

Tavo

    I 've decided to give this sport a try, and a fried, a former pro, has
    lined me a set of near new Ping Eye Irons for $295, and a woods for $50
    a piece. He is giving me a putter. Is this a good price?
    
    thx
    
    Peter Q.
    

    
    That's a real good price for those clubs. But I don't think it's a good
    price for a NEW golfer. Kind of expensive if you don't like the sport.
    You might be better off renting or buying a beginner set for about
    $150. 
    
    Mike

    Not of major concern. I am moving back overseas to Australia. Given the
    differing cost of things over there, I could probably sell them for
    much more than I paid...
    
    Peter Q.
    

    
    In that case, I'd go for it. I think you'll stand a better chance of
    appreciating the game with a decent set of clubs. 
    
    Mike

    
    If you can get the irons for $295.00  BUY THEM. That's dirt cheap. I
    haven't seen them anywhere for less that $450.00.
    
    	Smitty

    -.1
    
    $450.00 new, but certainly not used...  In the States, that is.

    Anyone hear what happened with the latest Karsten vs. PGA that was
    supposed to start last month?
    
    Also, can anyone tell me what the difference is between a eye 2 and an
    eye 2 + ?
    
    Bob

    	Hi can anybody tell me the best and cheapest place to get a set of 
     PING EYE 2 irons in FLORIDA as my wife will be going over in 2 weeks time 
    and I have asked her to bring me back a set.Even second hand irons will
    do if they are in good condition,I need 3-SW.
    
    
    			Thanks in advance.
    					
    
    						Tom.

    
    Well golfers,  you  can  now  stop worrying about what to do with you
    Eye-2's when you join the PGA tour.
    
    Karsten and the  Tour settled out of court in what seems to be a very
    favorable settlement for Karsten. Mayor agreements:
    
    - Square groves are no longer banned from tour sponsored tourneys
    - The tour will pay  undisclosed amount to Karsten (believed to be in
      the low single digit millions)
    - The USGA is the only ruling organization
    - A committee, made by non-players  and  tour officials, is to decide
      future tour equipment issues

    Nobody is saying "I won", but I  am sure that Karsten got the biggest
    smile out of the room.
    

                                     New Ping ISI Irons

        Has anyone had an opportunity to see and/or hit the new Ping ISI
        irons?  A friend of mine, who plays with Ping Eye's, described the
        steel version as looking "...massive, like a flattened Ping Zing 2."

        Any comments?

        FYI - another friend, who makes clubs part time, has ordered a Spider
        5 iron from Kent Sports, Inc.;  they are supposed to have the
        "...same identity as the new Ping ISI-K irons..."  :)

I just bought a set of Ping ISI Irons. I still have eye-2s, which I'll
probably keep. I like the look of them  over the zings. So far, I like
them. I've even ordered the matching 2 iron and sand wedge.

	My friend did end up selling his Ping Zing II's and using the money 
	to have a set of Spiders made (they are similar to Ping ISI but only 
	cost him $7.50 (head) + $3.75 (shaft) + $1.55 (grip) for each club
	2 thru PW).  He could not afford the Ping ISI-K set with a child in 
	college.  Also, he decided to keep his Alien sand wedge, so he did 
	not buy the Spider sand wedge.

	His general comments: a great improvement over the Ping Zings, both 
	in feel & look.  Nice large sweet spot, but he is able to work the 
	ball well.