Conference napalm::commusic_v1

Not old hat, but yes, I've been playing with this type of thing too.

My biggest problem is getting ahold of sysex info. Dr. T's isn't too friendly
about pushing sysex (kind of like programming a calculator isn't very friendly
either), but at least it does. It can be very frustrating, but the results
are always worth the effort.

RE < Note 1935.1 by TALK::HARRIMAN "1000 Pints of Lite" >

	Funny you should say that about Dr. T's.  I have the C64 version and I
would have thought it would be fairly simple to enter sysex in step-write
mode.  I've never done it in KCS, admittedly, but I was a bit surprised at
your comments.  Why is it frustrating?

	Dan

    
    In my group we occasionally use sysex when setting up patches for a
    specific song. The ESQ-1 allows you to edit patches, so we might change
    the envelope to control volume realtive to other sounds we'll use later
    in the song. Also, any minor edit will put the patch in the compare
    buffer, and that way the player can switch between two sounds by just
    pressing the compare button (don't have to select thru the menu
    screens). Just a couple of minor things, but it can make a performance
    a lot easier by having fewer little things to worry about.
    
    
    Rob

    I have the KCS Level II, and I would think the problem .1 refers to is
    that you have to hit "*" then the value (in decimal) for each byte.
    For long messages, this gets rather tedious.

				*** Daryl ***

	re: Dan (.2)

	Well the problem is that KCS doesn't learn sysex, nor does it allow
	you to make macro-level event types, so any sysex you do is purely
	verbatim, which is tedious enough for one device. Last count, my
	MIDI network was up to 11 devices, each with (of course) a different
	sysex subprotocol, and it's own implementation. Arghhh.

	No, I don't know of any easier software either, although if I did
	I would have given it a try.

	/pjh

	I just started using sysex messages within sequences.
	I have a MT32, and there are quite a few additional
	features available, that you can only get at thru system
	exclusive messages. There are not enough knobs on the control
	panel to match the functionalality of the box.

	For example, thru the control panel, you get one reverb
	that is in effect across all (mylti-tymbral) instrument
	voices (and percussion). Not very slick. However, with
	sysex messages you can select from HALL, PLATE, DELAY,
	and ROOM type reverbs, and modify the time and the 
	level of the reverb effect. Reverb can be turned on/off on
	a sound by sound basis, so (for example) you can eliminate it on
	drum tracks, and lay it on heavy for keyboards. 
	Much more flexability. 

	And, thru sysex, you can modify almost any of the 
	parameters that define the sounds. The MT32 includes 
	memory for up to 32 additional patches.

	I hope to modify a few of the existings sounds to make them more
	of what I need. For example, I'd like to get a VOX organ sound
	like the Doors used. The MT32 only has a few organ sounds, and
	none of them are the "VOX". It may take me some hours to
	accomplish this, but thats cheaper (and more challenging) than
	dropping a wad on another sound module.

	I'm currently working on a "song" for my MC300 that will be 
	exclusively system exclusive messages. Of course, it won't be 
	used as a song to play, but I'll use it as a place to store and index
	all of the more useful sysex messages, so I can copy them quickly 
	to real song sequences as needed.

	Note 1894 is a topic for sysex messages for the MT32 (and
	also any MC300/500 tricks for sysex)

/rick

	I've revived the idea some more. My latest tack with sequencing is to
	have the sequence do more of everything, including the setup and
	configuration for a song, and the mixing. The mixing is another topic,
	but the setup is definitely something of a timesaver. Trouble is, 
	getting the damn sysex documentation and making sense of it is more
	effort than the coding.

	Anybody got a good method for cataloguing SYSEX info outside of
	BULKDUMP?

	Better yet, anybody got a catalog of SYSEX commands for devices? Sounds
	like an idea for a book.

	/pjh

    
    	Is there any Macintosh cheap or shareware sysex librarian
    	availible? If so, where?
    
    	Also, Does anyone know where I can get Macintosh
    	PD or shareware, generic or ESQ-1 editor librarian.
    	(I cant afford the Opcode $169 one)
    
    	Pete
    

    I use ConcertWare MIDI for the sysex stuff... it's called MIDI Macros
    in CW parlance. V5.0 is the newest version and looks pretty good.
    
    I busted my pocketbook for the Opcode librarian, and am glad I did.
    Would the Hypercard MIDI stack "thing" help??  (sorry, cannot recall
    the exact name just now) -- I know these things are out there. Perhaps
    you should search through MACINTOSH conference, too.
    

    The Hypercard thing you refer to is probably the "Benson" utility.
    It can indeed load and store SYSEX dumps, but it is not a librarian.
    The disk-format is a simple text file with all the byte values in
    decimal!  It is also not particularly fast.
    
    I too use the CW+MIDI "MIDI Macros" feature.  If I want to change the
    Volume of the violin part to 24, I just put a little thing in the score
    at the right place that looks like "Volume(24)" and the right thing
    happens.  It has a little library you set up of the SYSEX sequences
    for each parameter.

RE: Note 1935.7  by TALK::HARRIMAN 
    
>	Better yet, anybody got a catalog of SYSEX commands for devices? Sounds
>	like an idea for a book.
    
    Actually, I think there *is* such a book.  I think Steve DeFuria (sp)
    put out a book of sys ex's a while back.  Ya might want to check the
    MIX bookshelf catalog, or Electronic Musician (I *think* that's the
    rag he writes for.
    
    Rodney
    

    He writes for Keyboard, but the Mix Bookshelf does carry the MIDI
    SysEx Book (I think that's what it's called).
    
    len.
    

	It figures DeFuria would have written it. Just what I needed, I guess.
	I was hoping someone had gotten it all into BULKDUMP or something,
	or at least knew the HR-16 sysex headers and subcomands. Whatever.

	/pjh

    PJ - BULKDUMP works with the HR16 with no mods ... but you've gotta use
    the old version (v2.0). 

    Just tell it to GET a bulk, then tell the HR to spill its guts. It's
    not automatic, but it works - and the dump can be sent back to the HR
    with no problems. 

-b

	Well that's good news. Now who has the SYSEX incantations? 

	I still haven't found DeFuria's sysex book.....

	/pjh

    re -1
    I may be wrong here Paul, but from memory if you can initiate the
    bulk dump from the front panel of the transmitting unit and the
    receiver is in "record mode" it just takes a true dump of what it
    sees, assuming that there is no handshaking a la Roland.
    
    When you re-transmit the dump, as long as the receiver is now waiting
    for the dump it accepts it o.k. so you never really have to get
    int system exclusive bits and bytes. It all depends on having front
    panel access to initiate the actions.
    
    So why would you need incantations?
    
    Ken
     

	No I was looking to see if it did more than just dumps and loads.

	I still haven't gotten an answer to that question.

	i.e. is there a registered parameter or sysex to tune the drums,
	or change settings.

	whatever. 

	/pjh

    Can somebody type in the string that would change a Yamaha TX81Z patch
    from alg 1 to alg 2? Assume TZ is on MIDI ch.1.
    
    I *thought* the documentation was pretty straight forward until I tried
    to do it... arg...
    
    Edd

    O.K., here it is (and I tried it out to be sure...)
    
    	$F0	(Sysex header)
    	$43	(Yamaha ID)
	$10	(Since you assume MIDI channel 1)
       	$12	(Group/subgroup header)
       	$34	(hex version of parameter number 52)
    	$01	(change to alg 2)
    	$F7	(eox)
    
    	Dan

    > $34 (hex version of parameter 52)
    
    AH-HA!!! 
    
    > $10       (Since you assume MIDI channel 1)
    
    Which bit is the channel ID? 1 or 0? (0=1 with offset of 1??) My
    documentation referred to a 1 followed by channel ID. Would "1F" be
    the proper ID for MIDI channel 16???
    
    Thank you!!!
    
    Edd

    Just about everything in the actual MIDI protocol is zero-based.
    Program numbers are coded 0-127 even though the user sees them as
    1-128, channel numbers are coded 0-15 even though the user sees them
    as 1-16, and so on.
    
    The hex "10" has the channel number minus one in the low 4 bits.  The
    "1" in the high 4 bits is there to distinguish this particular kind of
    message from some other formats.

RE -< Hex, ahem, I knew that... >-

	Yeah, I tried using 52 first and it proceeded to change the patch name.

�    > $10       (Since you assume MIDI channel 1)

	As -.1 said, the '1' is common to any channel, its the '0' that 
indicates channel number (again, by the offset).  Yes, ch 16 would be '1F'.

	Dan

    Thanks Dan.
    
    ...the world need more people with TZs *AND* MC-500s! 
    
    Right, len?
    
    Edd

    Don't rightly know about the TZ part (just kidding Edd, one's on
    my Christmas list, if I can find another rack mount chorus to go
    with it), but the world would surely be a better place if more of
    us could swap MC500 disks.  Now, if only you Mark I holdouts would
    upgrade to Mark II!
    
    len.
    

    The MIDI File standard is supposed to solve that problem.  If the
    MC500 doesn't have a way to communicate sequences to others in the
    standard format, then it is behind the times.

>    The MIDI File standard is supposed to solve that problem.  If the
>    MC500 doesn't have a way to communicate sequences to others in the
>    standard format, then it is behind the times.

touche :-)

I used midi files to take about 40 small sequences from MTP to Notator with
nary a hitch...

MIDI files *are* the standard

Chad


:-)

    I found the following apparent mistake in the Yamaha TX81Z sys-ex
    documentation.
    
    The book states that in order to change parameters in the performance
    section of the TZ you should enter the following string....
    
               $F0 $43 $1c $13 $pp $dd $F7
    
    ...where 'c' is the channel number in hex, 0-F; 'pp' is the parameter and
    'dd' is the data value.
    
    This is wrong (apparently). It will change ACED parameters, the
    additional voice parameters not found on the earlier 4-op machines.
    
    The correct string (tested) is...
    
                 $F0 $43 $1c $10 $pp $dd $F7
    
    Edd