Conference napalm::commusic_v1

    
    >"Because of the QUADRAVERB's massive onboard memory the reverb programs
    >are astonishingly realistic, crossing over the theoretical limits
    >of where the human ear can detect the difference between a simulation
    >and the real thing.
    
    Gee, it's been so long since school... Could someone refresh my
    memory as to what the theortical simulation limit in humans is?
    
    Edd

    ' massive onboard memory ' should probably read as 
    ' ma$$ive onboard memory '.  My guess is it will list at $600, sell
    for $400 and drive the MIDIverb II to a real price of $250.  So,
    maybe I'll pick up a Microverb II for $150?
    
    Steve

    Since 'real' reverb has lousy frequency specs having 20khz top end
    makes it less than real....not that I'd prefer a top end of 8khz...
    
    dbII

    Are they gonna clean up their QC act?
    
    Edd

RE < Note 1656.2 by MIZZOU::SHERMAN "socialism doesn't work ..." >

>   ... maybe I'll pick up a Microverb II for $150?
    
	You don't have to wait for that price, BTW, they're selling for that
now.

	Dan

    re: .3 .5 you can get uverbs for $125 or less if you shop.
   
    re: .4 QC, as I understand it the latest product off their lines
    does not have the problems that were prevalent earlier this year.
    But then again, this could be untrue.
     
    dbII

    Yeah, guess I've been out of touch with the latest FX prices.  Please
    excuse.  But, I saw a posting on usenet today that says the Quadraverb
    is listing at $445.  Probably will continue to sell at close to
    list.  Maybe I ought to check out getting another MidiVerb II ...
    
    Steve

    Seeing as the ^4-verb is programmable, I think I'll go ahead and check
    one out.  I wonder if it affords parallel FX capabilities (as opposed
    to serial).

    Does anyone know the phone number and/or address for Alesis?

-b

    ...look in 1064.* (HR-16). I'm sure I posted the address somewhere...
    
    Edd

    In case you haven't found the address, I have it handy. It is
    
    P.O. box 3908
    Los Angeles, Ca. 90078
    Fax # 818-503-0943
     
    Mark
    

    My Quadraverb arrived last night.  Here's a 4-hour review...
    
    1) Like another reviewer, I shake-tested my Q-verb before I plugged it
    in.  There was a LOUD telltale rattle!  Upon opening up the Q-verb, I
    found the traditional "spare nut" rattling around loose inside the
    housing!  No spare bolt- I looked but couldn't find it. 
    
    2) The board inside the QV is only about the size of a Microverb.
    I wouldn't be surprised if the QV electronics gets "shrunk" to
    MicroVerb size sometime in the next couple of years.  It dissipates
    a lot of heat (24 MIPS in one rack space... move over 8840!) so
    that would have to be worked around too.
    
    3) The QV is QUIET.  Also has plenty of drive; it pushed my Bose
    Roommates directly, without buffering by my mixer.  However, the
    CQM didn't like the QV output at first and required me to add a
    1K resistor on the input before it would listen to QV output.
    
    4) Some of the QV programs are "application-specific"; such as for
    acoustic guitar or strings.  That is, they sound lousy on patches
    that they aren't designed for.  The guitar-specific programs are
    purest feldecarb for keyboards.
    
    5) Using the gate is tricky; I still haven't got it down to
    predictability.  The factory programs work fine, though.
    
    6) The QV "graphic equalizer" mode is much quieter than analog graphic
    equalizers- and about as useful... that is, a cludge.  The parametric
    EQ's are wonderful, though.  
    
    7) The Leslie simulator is excellent- motor control can be mapped
    to MIDI IN aftertouch or other controllers (modulation, etc).  It
    even speeds up and slows down _slowly_, just like a real Leslie.
    It almost makes me change my mind about not liking the "Leslie sound".
     
    8) Trick: The QV can have up to four effects simultaneously- and
    the four effects are NOT just serially combined.  They each "read"
    from (typically) at least two possible inputs of effects earlier
    in the chain (mix proportion is controllable) and the output becomes
    _available_ to any effect later in the chain.  The final output
    is a 4-way mix of all four effects.  You can have a purely serial
    output, or an (almost parallel) mix, or combinations in between.
    
    
    	BUT YOU _MUST_ REMEMBER TO SET THE "MIX" UP!
    
    
    I shout intentionally- the default "mix" is pretty uninspiring,
    and if you think that's what a QV sounds like, you'll be disappointed.
    Further, the "bypass mix" is also programmed- and can mess you up
    if you're in the habit of using bypass.
    
    9) The reverb density, reverb diffusion, and reverb feedback are
    all independently programmable.  This makes it easy to build a
    "Stonehenge" or "Grand Canyon" patch.  
    
    10) Almost all of the useful patch parameters are MIDI modulateable.
    You can have up to eight modulators at any one time. MIDI THRU is
    implemented.  There is a SYSEX format but it's not documented in
    the interim manual. 
    
    11) Favorite patches: Loose Leslie and King's Chamber.
      
    
    	-Bill

    Last night we had the Quadraverb plugged into Eirikur Hallgrimsson's
    synth setup.  The audio source was a dreaded Y* SHS-10 toy keyboard
    with built-in rhythm patterns. :-(
    
    Without the QV, it sounded like you might expect- like a toy keyboard
    with built-in rhythm patterns.  It got old real fast, as they say.
    
    With the QV online, and acting _only_ as a reverb, it sounded better.
    Not really wonderful, but musically harmless.
    
    Then we connected the QV to another keyboard ONLY via MIDI.  This
    second keyboard did not generate any audio- only MIDI control to
    the QV.  Thus, we could program the QV to be "played" in real time
    by the second keyboard operator.  
    
    Now _that_ was a wonderful sound.  As in "It would be a good lead",
    it remained musically interesting for long periods because of the 
    controllable tambour and "feel" generated by the QV signal processing.
    The real trick is that the QV player had to coordinate with (and slightly
    anticipate) the SHS-10 player.
    
    I don't know of any other process or patch that would give a similar
    feel and dynamics to the sound.  I don't know if it can even be
    done with only one pair of hands without sequencing or multitracking.
                     
    (one of Eirikur's housemates came in part way through the session,
    wondering how Eirikur made that wonderful sound... we showed him
    the SHS-10 (which he had played with often).  He gave us a look
    of absolute incredulity, stated "This room is far too weird for
    me.", and walked out, shaking his head. )
                                                                         
    	-Bill
                                                                      

    
    [I recently got this in the mail; enjoy -WSY]
                                                
    ------------------------------------------------------------------
 
 
 
                          Alesis QuadraVerb
                     System Exclusive Information
 
                        Bob Page .. 12-Feb-89
 
                    Internet/UUCP: [email protected]
                              BIX: page
                         Phone: +1 508/687-6004
 
 
 
This information is presented in the hope that it will be useful, but
no warrantees about its accuracy are expressed or implied.  I'm
interested in any changes/additions you have.  Feel free to use this
information in any way for any purpose, but please don't pretend you
wrote it (leave my name in this document).  I'd be happy if you send
me code you write based on this info, but of course that's up to you.
 
Alesis is currently saying they are not going to release the QuadraVerb
info "at this time".  That could mean the "format" is subject to change,
or they are withholding the info until some pet software companies get QV
patch editors to the market, or maybe some other reason, I dunno.  In any
event, I needed the info, so I created it.  And on with the show...
 
 
QUADRAVERB SYSTEM EXCLUSIVE DATA ENCODING FORMAT:
 
You first need to understand how the QV encodes its data for MIDI
transmission.  Although all 8 bits of a byte are used internally, the
MIDI specification reserves the highest bit for status messages, so
these high bits have to be "removed" from the data stream.  The 8-bit
QuadraVerb data is encoded for MIDI transmission into 7-bit data.  The
encoding looks like this:
 
Seven QuadraVerb bytes (each line represents one byte):
   Byte 0: a7 a6 a5 a4 a3 a2 a1 a0
        1: b7 b6 b5 b4 b3 b2 b1 b0
        2: c7 c6 c5 c4 c3 c2 c1 c0
        3: d7 d6 d5 d4 d3 d2 d1 d0
        4: e7 e6 e5 e4 e3 e2 e1 e0
        5: f7 f6 f5 f4 f3 f2 f1 f0
        6: g7 g6 g5 g4 g3 g2 g1 g0
are transmitted as eight MIDI bytes:
   Byte 0: 00 a7 a6 a5 a4 a3 a2 a1
        1: 00 a0 b7 b6 b5 b4 b3 b2
        2: 00 b1 b0 c7 c6 c5 c4 c3
        3: 00 c2 c1 c0 d7 d6 d5 d4
        4: 00 d3 d2 d1 d0 e7 e6 e5
        5: 00 e4 e3 e2 e1 e0 f7 f6
        6: 00 f5 f4 f3 f2 f1 f0 g7
        7: 00 g6 g5 g4 g3 g2 g1 g0
 
Here is a C fragment to decode the data (note that you don't want to
decode the SysEx status messsages; they are not encoded):
 
  unsigned char c, oc;
 
  oc = 0;
  for (i=0; ((c = getc(ifp)) < 0x80); i++) {
     i %= 147;			/* end of program */
     if (shift = i % 8) {
        oc = (oc << shift) + (c >> (7-shift));
        putc(oc, ofp);
     }
     oc = c;
  }
 
All the info given below assumes the data has been decoded.  If you are
going to send the data back to the QV after editing it, you have to encode
it first.  Code fragment left as an exercise for the reader.
 
 
QUADRAVERB SYSTEM EXCLUSIVE COMMAND FORMAT:
 
Note you have to tell the QuadraVerb to accept MIDI SysEx data before any
of this will work.  Although it's possible to instruct the QV to disable
SysEx via MIDI SysEx; it's not possible to re-enable it; you have to go do
it from the front panel.
 
A QuadraVerb SysEx command string looks like (in hex):
    f0  - SysEx start
    00  \
    00   - Alesis mfr code 
    0e  /
    02  QuadraVerb ID number
    cc  QuadraVerb command code
    pp  QuadraVerb command code parameter
    dd  data stream (variable length)
    ..
    f7  End of SysEx
 
  The command codes are:
    01 Change Parameter
    02 Load Program
    03 Dump Program
 
  The parameters depend on the command and are discussed below.
 
 
-- Dump Program (command code 03):
To have an external device request a QuadraVerb program dump, send the
following MIDI sequence to the QV:
       f0 00 00 0e 02 03 pp f7
where '03' is the "dump data" command, and 'pp' is the hex parameter:
       00-63  single program, 0-99
       64     edit buffer
       65     all program memory
 
Keep in mind if you're doing many edit/compares on program 27 you
probably want to be dumping the edit buffer, not program 27, as #27 is
only modified once the STORE is done.
 
 
-- Load Program (command code 02):
The format is similar:
       f0 00 00 0e 02 02 pp (data) f7
where 'pp' is the same as in the above description.  The data must be
encoded before being sent.  If you do it right you should send 155 bytes
out the MIDI port (including SysEx etc) for an individual program.
 
-- Change Parameter (command code 01):
       f0 00 00 0e 02 01 gg pp dd dd dd f7
where 'gg' is the 'parameter group' you want to change:
       00 - program
       01 - reverb
       02 - delay
       03 - pitch
       04 - eq
       05 - midi
       06 - store
       07 - config
       08 - mix
       09 - mod
       0a - name
and 'pp' is the parameter number within parameter group (for example in
'reverb', parameter number 0 is 'Reverb Type', and the numbers increase
the same as if you used the PAGE UP key).
 
The "dd dd dd" string is the value you want in that parameter.  It must be
encoded, even if it fits in 7 bits.  Sometimes the value takes two bytes;
in that case they should be sent MSB first, then LSB (this is the opposite
of the HR-16).  When one byte is encoded it will become two bytes;
likewise two become three.  If you're sending two bytes (after encoding)
send them first, then 00, then f7.
 
The QV will also send you these Change Parameter requests every time a
parameter is changed using the front panel.  If somebody selects the Delay
Time parameter and pushes the button to go from 1 to 400ms, you're going
to get 400 of these messages.  You will get messages every time the VALUE
buttons get pushed, even when nothing changes (like being in program mode
and pressing the down key when you're already at program zero), so be
prepared for them.
 
You can't send running parameter change requests; each one has to be
a separate SysEx message.
 
 
 
QUADRAVERB SYSTEM EXCLUSIVE PROGRAM FORMAT:
 
A single program has 128 bytes of data.  When it's encoded and shipped
over MIDI, it's 147 bytes (without SysEx headers).  That's why the decode
fragment above has that magic number in it.
 
Unused locations have zeros in them.  The EQ bytes change meaning
depending on whether graphic EQ is being used, so both are given.
Everything here is listed in decimal.
 
Graphic EQ parameters, only used in the Graphic_EQ->Delay configuration:
 
 Byte   Description            Default  Range
   0     ???                      ??    ?? [usually set to 14]
   1     16Hz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
   2     32Hz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
   3     62Hz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
   4    126Hz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
   5    250Hz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
   6    500Hz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
   7     1kHz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
   8     2kHz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
   9     4kHz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
  10     8kHz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
  11    16kHz                     14    0-28 (14 is center)
  12     ???                      ??    ?? [usually set to 24]
Graphic EQ also seems to change all modulation targets to 16Hz boost/cut.
 
Here's the complete list, in byte order.  Note that all parameters have
a 'default' value you can get by pressing both VALUE buttons at the same
time - if you're building a patch editor you might want this info so your
user can hit a button to get the default value for some parameter.
 
 Byte   Description            Default  Range
   0	Low EQ Frequency MSB
   1	Low EQ Frequency LSB     200  20-999Hz
   2	Low EQ Amplitude MSB
   3	Low EQ Amplitude LSB     280  0=-14db, 280=0db, 560=14db, 0.05 steps
   4	Low EQ Frequency MSB
   5	Mid EQ Frequency LSB    2000  200-9999Hz
   6	Mid EQ Bandwidth         100  20-255 (0.2-2.55 octaves)
   7	Mid EQ Amplitude MSB
   8	Mid EQ Amplitude LSB     280  0=-14db, 280=0db, 560=14db, 0.05 steps
   9	High EQ Frequency MSB
  10	High EQ Frequency LSB   8000  2000-18000Hz
  11	High EQ Amplitude MSB
  12	High EQ Amplitude LSB    280  0=-14db, 280=0db, 560=14db, 0.05 steps
  13	Leslie High Rotor Level   20  0=-20db, 26=+6db
  14	Low-Mid EQ Freq. MSB
  15	Low-Mid EQ Freq. LSB     100  20-500Hz       (really 100Hz default!)
  16	Low-Mid EQ Bandwidth     100  20-255 (0.2-2.55 octaves)
  17	Low-Mid EQ Ampl. MSB
  18	Low-Mid EQ Ampl. LSB     280  0=-14db, 280=0db, 560=14db, 0.05 steps
  19	High-Mid EQ Freq. MSB
  20	High-Mid EQ Freq. MSB   6000  2000-18000Hz
  21	High-Mid EQ Bandwidth    100  20-255 (0.2-2.55 octaves)
  22	High-Mid EQ Ampl. MSB
  23	High-Mid EQ Ampl. LSB    280  0=-14db, 280=0db, 560=14db, 0.05 steps
  24        [unused]
  25        [unused]
  26	Pitch Mode                 1  0-5 m/s_chorus, m/s_flange, phase, detune
  27	Pitch Input                1  0=pre-eq, 1=post-eq
  28	LFO Waveshape              0  0=triangle, 1=square
  29	LFO/Phaser Speed          20  0=1, 98=99
  30	LFO/Phaser Depth          50  0=1, 98=99
  31        [unused]
  32	Pitch Feedback (%)         0  0-99
  33	Detune Amount             99  0=-99, 99=none, 198=+99
  34	Leslie Stereo Separation  99  0-99
  35	Leslie Motor Control       1  0=off, 1=on
  36	Leslie Motor Speed         0  0=slow, 1=fast
  37	Trigger Flange             0  0=off, 1=on
  38        [unused]
  39	Delay Type                 1  0=mono, 1=stereo, 2=ping-pong
  40	Delay Input 1              1  0=pre-eq, 1=post-e1
  41	Delay Input Mix           99  0=input1, 99=center, 198=pitch/leslie
  42	Left Delay Time (MSB)         1-400ms (1-800ms mono)
  43	Left Delay Time (LSB)    100  If graphicEQ: 1-750ms (1-1500ms mono)
  44	Left Delay Feedback (%)    0  0-99
  45	Right Delay Time (MSB)        (Right not used in mono)
  46	Right Delay Time (LSB)   100  1-400ms (if graphicEQ: 1-750ms)
  47	Right Delay Feedback (%)   0  0-99
  48        [unused]
  49        [unused]
  50	Reverb Type                0  0=plate, 1=room, 2=chamber, 3=hall, 4=rev
  51        [unused]
  52	Reverb Input 1             3  0=pre-eq, 1=post-eq, 2=pitch, 3=delay_mix
  53	Reverb Input 2             1  0=pitch out, 1=delay out
  54	Reverb Input Mix           0  0=Input1, 99=center, 198=Input2
  55	Reverb PreDelay           40  1-140ms
  56	PreDelay Mix             198  0=Pre, 99=center, 198=Post
  57	Reverb Decay              50  0-99
  58	Reverb Diffusion Amount    8  0=1, 4=5, 8=9
  59	Low Frequency Decay       60  0=-60, 30=-30, 60=0
  60	High Frequency Decay      40  0=-60, 30=-30, 60=0
  61	Reverb Density             8  0=1, 4=5, 8=9
  62	Reverb Gate                0  0=off, 1=on
  63	Reverb Gate Hold Time      0  0-99
  64	Reverb Gate Release Time  80  0-99
  65	Reverb Gated Level (%)     0  0-99
  66        [unused]
  67        [unused]
  68	Configuration              0  0-4
  69	Direct Signal Select       0  0=pre-eq, 1=post-eq
  70	Direct/EQ Signal Level    99  0-99 (EQ Out if Direct Signal Select = 1)
  71	Master Effects Level      50  0-99
  72	Pitch/Leslie Out Level    50  0-99
  73	Delay Output Level        50  0-99
  74	Reverb Output Level       50  0-99
  75        [unused]
  76        [unused]
  77        [unused]
  78        [unused]
  79        [unused]
  80	Mod 1 Source               0  0-125 (see list below)
  81	Mod 1 Target               0  (see Modulation Targets section below)
  82	Mod 1 Amplitude            0  0=-99, 99=0, 198=+99
  83	Mod 2 Source
  84	Mod 2 Target                  Sources: 0=pitch_bend, 1=after_touch,
  85	Mod 2 Amplitude                        2=note_number, 3=note_velocity,
  86	Mod 3 Source                           4-125 correspond to MIDI
  87	Mod 3 Target                           controller numbers 0-121.
  88	Mod 3 Amplitude
  89	Mod 4 Source
  90	Mod 4 Target
  91	Mod 4 Amplitude
  92	Mod 5 Source
  93	Mod 5 Target
  94	Mod 5 Amplitude
  95	Mod 6 Source
  96	Mod 6 Target
  97	Mod 6 Amplitude
  98	Mod 7 Source
  99	Mod 7 Target
 100	Mod 7 Amplitude
 101	Mod 8 Source
 102	Mod 8 Target
 103	Mod 8 Amplitude
 104        [unused]
 105        [unused]
 106	Edit Name Character  1    32  The following 96 characters, in order:
 107	Edit Name Character  2         !"#$%&'()*+,-./0123456789:;<=>?
 108	Edit Name Character  3        @ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ[Y]^_
 109	Edit Name Character  4        `abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz{|}><
 110	Edit Name Character  5
 111	Edit Name Character  6        The second Y is the Japanese 'Yen' or
 112	Edit Name Character  7        Chinese 'Yuan' (monetary) symbol.  The
 113	Edit Name Character  8        last two characters are right and left
 114	Edit Name Character  9        arrows.  The backslash and tilde
 115	Edit Name Character 10        characters are not available.
 116	Edit Name Character 11
 117	Edit Name Character 12        Note this list is in ASCII order, and
 118	Edit Name Character 13        the ASCII equivalent is what's stored.
 119	Edit Name Character 14
 120        [unused]
 121        [unused]
 122        [unused]
 123        [unused]
 124        [unused]
 125        [unused]
 126        [unused]
 127        [unused]
 
 
MODULATION TARGETS:
 
The target numbers are not constant; it depends on what configuration you
are using, so you can't always change the target to #48 and know it always
means your modulator affects Low EQ Frequency.  What a pain.
 
  0	Reverb Input Mix
  1	Reverb PreDelay
  2	Reverb PreDelay Mix
  3	Reverb Reverse Time	(Reverb Decay?  I think the LCD mislabels this)
  4	Reverb Diffusion
  5	Reverb Density
  6	Reverb Low Decay
  7	Reverb High Decay
 
 16	Delay Input Mix		(L/Mono Delay Time if GraphicEQ)
 17	L/Mono Delay Time	(L/Mono Delay Feedback if GraphicEQ)
 18	L/Mono Delay Feedback	(R Delay Time if GraphicEQ)
 19	R Delay Time		(R Delay Feedback if GraphicEQ)
 20	R Delay Feedback
 
 32	LFO/Phaser Speed	(Leslie Stereo)
 33	LFO/Phaser Depth	(Leslie Motor)
 34	Pitch Feedback		(Leslie Speed)
 
 48	Low EQ Frequency	(16Hz boost/cut)	(Leslie High Level)
 49	Low EQ Amplitude	(32Hz boost/cut)
 50	Mid EQ Frequency	(62Hz boost/cut)	(Low-Mid EQ Frequency)
 51	Mid EQ Bandwidth	(126Hz boost/cut)	(Low-Mid EQ Width)
 52	Mid EQ Amplitude	(250Hz boost/cut)	(Low-Mid EQ Amplitude)
 53	High EQ Frequency	(500Hz boost/cut)	(Mid EQ Frequency)
 54	High EQ Amplitude	(1kHz boost/cut)	(Mid EQ Bandwidth)
 55				(2kHz boost/cut)	(Mid EQ Amplitude)
 56				(4kHz boost/cut)	(High-Mid EQ Frequency)
 57				(8kHz boost/cut)	(High-Mid EQ Bandwidth)
 58				(16kHz boost/cut)	(High-Mid EQ Amplitude)
 59							(High EQ Frequency)
 60							(High EQ Amplitude)
 
 64	Direct/EQ Mix Level	(Effect Mix Level if GraphicEQ)
 65	Effect Mix Level	(EQ Mix Level if GraphicEQ)
 66	Pitch/Leslie Mix Level	(Delay Mix if GraphicEQ, Reverb Mix if cfg 5)
 67	Delay Mix Level
 68	Reverb Mix Level
 
 
 
FULL PROGRAM DUMP FORMAT:
 
A full dump is all 100 programs, end to end.  HOWEVER, the MIDI encoding
starts over at each program (that's why you see the i %= 147 statement in
the decoding fragment above).  The edit buffer is not dumped on a full
dump, so after decoding, your data should have 12800 bytes.
 
No MIDI parameters are ever dumped, and there is no checksum information.
I don't know how to get the version of the ROM (without opening the case).
 
[END of document - hope it was useful.]
 
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Message-Id: <[email protected]>
In-Reply-To: Forty-watt plasma rifle?'s message of Wed, 22 Feb 89 14:25:09 PST <[email protected]>
    

    Nice machine - bought one and hooked it into Allen Digital Computer
    Organ - really terrific from Classic concert hall/church, theatre
    organ, way out stuff too - equalization/pitch/delay/reverb/mix all very
    useful in creating tasteful and realistic acoustical settings as well
    as the stuff mother doesn't want to hear - first music bucks I've spent
    in 12 years or so - and worth it definitely!  Tried MIDIVERB II on
    trial first - great, but glad I coughed up near double bucks for the
    QUAD.

< Note 1656.14 by CVG::BEYERSDORFER >
                             -< Nice - very Nice >-

Lenny baby! Is dat you? Are you still here?  :)

I just bought one myself. The thing is awesome. I listened to Jay, the
guitar guy at Wurly's in Worcester, trying one out with a cheapo guitar
and distortion pedal. Unbelievable!

dave

	Errrr,,   How much are these fetching ?   Full list ?

	....and what IS full list ?   $445 ?

	Reg	{Oh, just curious}

    Could someone in here help me out??  I am trying to sync up my
    Quadraverb with my MIDI foot controller.  My foot controller has
    128 banks, and the QR has 100...anyways, I've tried it a couple
    of different ways, but the units do not seem to be listening to
    one another.  Could someone who knows the QR real well help out
    please??
    
    Thanks in advance,
    Buck, MIDIot

    
    
    	If the Quad is the only piece of midi gear u have, make sure
    it is in omni mode (listening on all channels). This may solve your
    problem.....rich

    RE: -1
    
    NO, I have two pieces of MIDI gear...the QR and an ADA MP-1 preamp.
    I want to be able to assign programs on the QR to my pre-programmed
    preamp settings.  I know it can be done, just as to how is what
    I cannot figure out.  I have read and re-read the manual, and to
    me it leaves a lot of loop holes in the explanation of midi-mapping.
    I have tried it several ways...two worked..sorta...one way the programs
    followed each other respectively...ie prog 44 on the mp-1 = prog
    44 on the QR...not good.  Also, there was one where it was switching
    prog.'s on the QR in what appeard to be random intervals??  I can't
    figure out what is wrong here.  Both units are on the same midi
    channel...and I believe I set it up right (mp-1 prog # on left = QR
    prog # on the right...ie mp1 #30 = qr #13)...its still not working.
    
    Anyone out there able to help out??

    
    
    	I don't own a Quadraverb, but I have a Midiverb II, which has
    midi mapping. The documation on It was pretty good when it came
    to midi mapping. 
    	Basically, you want to map the QV: When it recieves program
    change #44, go to patch #n. On the Midiverb, you pressed program,
    inputted the program change number the unit would recieve, then
    pressed the patch button and input the patch you want the unit to
    go to. Then save/prog were depressed at the same time. Or some such
    garbage like that.
       Also watch the zero relativity of the units. Some devices start
    with patch zero and some start with one. Without mapping, sending
    program change #44 might get you patch #43 or #45.
       Hope this helped...............
    
    				Rich
    

    Substantial review of the Quadraverb in the latest MIX.  They liked
    it.  Details to follow.
    
    len.
     

    Hi - I might be getting a second affects processor this week (I
    own a Roland DEP-5). Is the QUAD still the best bang for the buck,
    or is there a new something in that price range? I'll have to dig
    up my recent Keyboard with the effects unit review. I know the DEP-5
    wasn't reviewed. I think they've stopped production on those.
    
    Thanks!
    Bill

The ART stuff is also good.  I'd like the ART SGE "guitar" processor.  9
fx at once.

Chad

I'm pretty fond of my Quadraverb. Any specific questions?

dbii

    Dave,
    
    I read a review in Keyboard - May I think - where it pretty much
    placed the Yamaha SPX900 (@ $995) at the top of the heap as far
    as studio quality reverb. It doesn't have stereo ins, which I would
    think would be a big drawback. It IS double the Quad price, and
    they gave a good rating to the Quad as far as being clean with a
    wide bandwidth.
    
    How do you like the reverb in the Quad?
    
    The Quad has studio, recording quality reverb as well, doesn't it?
    Keyboard said that there wasn't much difference between the different
    types of reverb in the Quad - i. e. Hall vs. Plate. - Do you agree
    with this - and what difference would it make?
    
    Can there be that much difference between these two as far as "studio
    qulaity" reverb?

    I'm putting together a tape that I want to eventually sell, so studio
    quality is important to me! I'm also wondering how it stacks up
    against the Yamaha FX500, which seems to be in the same price range
    as the Quad.
    
    Thanks!
    Bill

    I can't speak for the Yamaha units, but I think the Lexicon LXP-1 or
    LXP-5 deserve your attention. The Qverb is a joy to program, does 4
    effects at once, and has a 20 kHz bandwidth. The Lexicon units have a
    15 kHz BW, but sound sweeter because Lexicon's algorithms are better.
    They are also quieter. However, they are pure torture to program unless
    you spend $400 on the programmer, the LXP-1 only does one effect at
    a time, and only reverb. The LXP-1 has very advanced reverb features
    that outclass any machine under $1500. The LXP-5 has a simpler reverb
    but does 5 effects at one time, including chorus, flange, pitch shift,
    and other modulation effects.
    
    I use the Qverbs for my synths, the LXP-1 for reverb on the whole mix,
    and the LXP-5 for vocal processing. I program the Qverbs and use the
    factory presets on the Lexicons. I've stayed away from Yamaha because
    they sounded harsh and grainy in the past. The newer units may be
    better, though. Hope this helps!
    
    Chris

I find the extended QV algorhythms the best (in the 3 band eq/reverb mode) 
but the quadmode reverbs are good too...care in mixng and programming will 
help, I can't compare it to the Lexicon units, but it's better than a MIDIverbII
(I own one of these too...)

bandwidth is 20K, 165 bit sampling and SN is 85 db...

Studio quality reverb? I'd say yes, perhaps not the best money can buy but very 
very good.

dbii

oops that's 16 bit sampling...darn dsylexic fingers

dbii

    Another vote for Quadraverb- it's a cinch to program.  
    
    The difference between QV plate and the other QV reverbs is that the plate
    tend to have a resonance peak (almost like a comb filter) at the
    typical vocal frequencies; it sounds very good on a voice and pretty
    mediocre elsewhere.  
    
    [having 8 realtime continuous MIDI controllers on a QV is a _real_
    gas!  It can make an SHS-10 sound like something worth listening to! ]
    
    
    	-Bill

    I'll have to take a look at the Quad in the next day or so. It seems
    to get pretty high marks. I gave a listen to the Yamaha FX500 last
    night and it sounded real nice. I seemed pretty easy to program,
    but has on a mono input. You can't do any bulk-dumping with it either,
    but there are 30 user programmable RAM slots. It had a pretty good
    LCD display - I think it was 2 16 character lines. It has 60 presets.
    The presets are ROM, but you can edit them and save the edits in
    one of the 30 RAM slots.
    
    I also gave a listen to the Digitech 256. It has I believe 256 RAM
    slots that come loaded with 256 presets. I gave a listen to the
    first 50 or so, but wasn't as impressed as I was with the Yamaha.
    I probably didn't give it as much of a fair listen, though.
    
    I've seen a picture and read up a little on the Lexicon LXP-5. Keyboard
    gave it a great review as far as sounds, but said it was a bear
    to program, and there is no LCD character display. I think I'd need
    the visual LCD display to help me along. You can get their MCR
    programmer for it, but that is fairly expensive - lists for around
    $ 400.
    
    Thanks for your comments!
    Bill

    Is there a reverb that allows you to enter the deconvoluted unit
    impulse response, in stereo of course, of any hall?
    That way you could emulate any hall at all.
    Oh wait, I think there is, a Digital-Signal processing box that
    attaches to a pdp11 or microvax.
    I think new england digital makes it.  I may be wrong.
    Tom

    While I was at RPI, another grad student there was was working on
    capturing-for-posterity the impulse responses of most of the "great
    concert halls of the world".  He (and his counterparts in Germany, 
    France, etc.) eventually published their information, along with their
    analysis of "what impulse response characteristics make a hall great".
    
    I guess you could make up ROM cards from the data:  "Here's what you
    sound like in Beyreuth, and here's you in Lincoln Center, and here's
    you in the Troy Music Hall, and..."
    
    The guy's name was Mastracco; check the Acoustical Engineering Society 
    (AES) journals for the last few years and see if you can find the paper.
    
    	-Bill

The Quadraverb lets you set parameters for reverb density, and reverb decay time,
and on the hall reverbs you can adjust the low and high freq decay's,
theoretically simulating the size and characteristics of a wide range of rooms.

dbii

    I believe Roland's high end reverb (the $4K one, with the fiber optic
    digital interface) works this way.
    
    len.
    

    Regarding the QV (if it ain't too late)...

    I have one, and agree with all the pros mentioned earlier ... it's
    fairly easy to program (although I hate one menu per window U/Is), is
    very clean, and the 3 & 4 FX at once modes are very nice.  The fact
    that it responds to up to 8 MIDI CCs simultaneously is gravy. 

    However, the reverb algorithms are, to my ears, not very diverse (read:
    they all sound alike).  I think a _Keyboard_ review of the box said
    something to this effect.  There is also an annoying audio clicking
    introduced if/when you use the front panel buttons (other than BYPASS)
    during operation, especially program advance/backup buttons.  Finally,
    there is a *very* nasty audio spike when the unit is powered up/down. 

    I wish there was documented SYSEX that I could use to toggle BYPASS
    (mute) mode. 

    In spite of the drawbacks, I like mine a great deal.

-b

    Union Music was having a sale but was out of stock, so I placed
    an order for one. I hadn't gotten around to checking out all the
    units I wanted to yet, and the sales person said it's no problem
    if I change my mind before it comes in. I have to say that the
    Yamaha FX500 sounded very good to me, but does only have a mono
    input. This would be no problem if I use the effects send from the
    mixer as the unit's input - just a problem if I feed stereo outs
    from something directly into it.
    
    I did a test over the weekend with my DEP-5, and found out that
    sure enough, a stereo input comes out of the effects as mono,
    since this unit, and most other's, sum the stereo ins together
    for effects processing. I did this test with a wide piano - it
    came out not wide. Only the dry signal comes out as it went in stereo.
    
    I suppose that this is how reverb works in real life - standing
    next to a piano - you get the wide stereo effect - but the reverberated
    sound coming back to you isn't going to have that separation.
    
    I'd like to give a listen to the Lexicon's if I get the chance also
    - but the QV does sound good!
    
    Bill

	I thought I'd move this question here...

>		 In Lezlie, config, pitch section is used to simulate the 
>		 effect.  In this case, params are motor control (on/off),
>		 motor speed (slow/fast), stereo separation, high rotor
>		 level (EQ boost), output level

	Care to share how the QVerb uses pitch shift to create a leslie effect?
I have an SPX50D that has a pitch shifter - I wonder if I can port the concept 
over?

	Dan

    Doppler effect?
    
    Edd

RE < Note 1656.38 by WEFXEM::COTE "My kingdom for a pizza..." >

	Can you be more specific, and show how the concept translates into 
parameter settings?    

	Dan

    No, I honestly can't. I don't own a QV.
    
    But I assume you are familiar with the Doppler Effect. A rotating
    speaker will 'dopplerize' a sound as the horns rotate and change
    distance from the listener. Since the msuic is made up of lots of
    frequencies, there's lots of phase changes going on. Add this to the
    changing frequencies and you can see that at any given time something's
    being cancelled, something's rising, and something's falling.
    
    It's easier to hear than explain... ;^)
    
    Edd

Even if you did own a QV it wouldn't help, lezlie is one of the possible 
configurations,, that parameter is on or off...

dbii

    
    Re: .37
    
    Dan, you can't use the pitch shift on the SPX-50 to do Leslie
    simulations because you can't *modulate* the amount of shift.  
    
    							Brian

    To elaborate a bit on what Dave said, the "lezlie" is some kind of
    preset "configuration" (read: algorithm) that combines pitch shift and
    EQ to generate the effect. 

    I'm pretty sure that the thing uses an LFO to modulate phase and EQ
    parameters - in other words, it uses a combination of phase shifter and
    detune (swept between a bit sharp and a bit flat) driven by an LFO.
    Boosts to the rotating speaker are accomplished my MIDI modulating the
    high EQ level.  It ain't perfect, but it ain't bad. 

    Unless you have an LFO that can modulate several sources simultaneously
    (including individual bands of EQ in varying degrees), you probably
    can't replicate the effect on an SPX ... but I've been wrong before. 

-b

RE all

	O.K., I guess its not all that simple...  I just saw brad's comment
about how the Leslie effect uses pitch shift and wondered whether I could use
what I got in a similar way.

	Dan

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Note 2246.0                  Help with Quadraverb!!!                  No replies
PUGGS::DESROCHERS "SAVVY Good Band * Music * Time"   20 lines  23-JAN-1990 16:09
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


	Hello out there!!!

	I have just purchased the Alesis Quadraverb as part of our P.A.
	vocal effects.  In addition, we have a separate Compressor unit.

	From from what I've heard (from Bill Buckley), it's not easy at
	all to program.  So, considering it will be used strictly as a
	VOCAL effect, how about some advise ??  I should also say that
	Savvy does NOT have a sound person so it would most likely be
	set at one to four different settings.

	Any Favorite settings??  Parameter info??  Direction??

	Any info that would help us avoid struggling and re-inventing
	the wheel would be VERY appreciated!!!!

	Thanks alot,
	Tom
	

I think the QUAD is very easy to program.

dave

    I agree. You should have no trouble programming it, or at least
    modifying the existing patches to your own taste.
    
    Chris

    I, too, think the QV is easy to program - I suppose whether or not you
    think it difficult depends on your orientation.  I mean, some people
    like to code in COBOL, others like Macro.

    Anyway, one thing to keep in mind is how you intend to use the unit.
    Mix is a programmable parameter - if you are using the thing in an
    effects loop on a mixer, you'll probably want to set mix to 100% wet
    and use the returns to control levels (unless you want to try and
    modulate mix live using MIDI controllers). 

    Another hint - if you're interested in better reverb programs, use the
    EQ --> Reverb configuration where possible.  "QuadMode" reverbs are
    okay, but not as "robust" as the leaner configurations. 

-b

    
    I'm yet another happy quadraverb programmer.  
    
    What are you having trouble programming?  We might be able to 
    give you some hints online, if you can tell us what you want.
    
    	-Bill

    The Quadraverb can now do sampling, with the addition of a new chip
    which became available this week(about $30.00). Check your local
    dealer for details.-Gypsy

    Mail ordered the Quadraverb Plus upgrade via card contained in the
    last issue of Alesis Reflections about 3 weeks ago.  Installed it last
    night - no prob.  Sounds great so far as I have had a chance to try
    it.  $32.00 including S&H - also comes with addendum to the QV user
    guide and instructions for user installation of upgrade.

    I put my QV upgrade in last night too.  It was late, so I only played
    with it for 1 hour afterwards...
    
    The multitap delays are great!  I thought they'd be a waste but they
    actually are really nice.  Try setting the delays to relatively-prime
    numbers and adding lots of feedback.  :-)
    
    The sampling is simple- monophonic, but *very* high quality.  Max
    sample of 1.5 seconds
    
    The ring modulator is really a pair of pitch shifters... oh well.  They
    work OK but not very spectacularly- maximum shift is +- 300 Hz.  
    
    The resonators are weird... they seem to be hi-Q filters.  I still have
    to work with them some more to understand how to get effective use
    out of them.  I may need to use percussive sounds (or voice) to excite
    them properly.
    
    It's probably worth the $30 to upgrade.
    
    	-Bill

    Question on multitap delays:
    
    Is this simply a delay line where you get multiple outputs. i.e. say
    max delay is 1000 ms, you can have taps at perhaps points like 300 and
    700 ms?  How many taps are allowed?  What do you use it for?  8^)  8^)
    
    							Brian

    
    No, not quite.  You have a delay line and you specify the spacing
    between each output tap (total delay must be less than 1550
    milliseconds).
    
    The output taps are summed together and go to "output", and you
    can add feedback of the summed taps back to the delay line input
    if you want.
    
    Oh yeah- you can also do reverb and EQ on the delay line output.
    
    	-Bill
    

    Re: taps
    
    So, can you specify random spacing, and if so, how many taps, can you
    go right up to the limit (i.e. any combination that adds up to the
    total?).
    
    My Y-word box hasn't got tapped delays and I'm curious as to what I'm
    missing. As an alternative, I can set up delays with each channel
    having independent length.  Each channel can also have its own feedback
    (this sounds ultra-weird) or you can sum the feedback, in which case
    your max delay time doubles (to a mere 500 ms on my ancient box).  Does
    Alesis allow this sort of thing?
    
    						Brian

    
    The max is 8 taps, and (unfortunately) the 1500 millisecond delay is
    only available when you are in monophonic mode.  (there is a stereo
    delay, called "ping-pong", but I haven't used it enough to tell you
    the details).
    
    	-Bill 

    Answer a question (if you please) for a friend who is to shy 
    to ask one himself.
    
    The Alesis Quadraverb does NOT have a overdrive/distortion/buzz
    whatever...  Correct ?
    
    Imagine arguing with a certified GTS sufferer and Midi Rack Puke ??
    :)
    
    jeff

    Depends on which model it is.  The Quadraverb GT *DOES* have overdrive.
    
    Mike

    I am not shy... I'm ignorant.. and sometimes stupid, but mostly
    HUNGOVER...
    
    Lowell
    

    Well, I finally upgraded my Quadraverb+; the upgrade includes:
    
      �  better reverb algorithms (ostensibly)
      �  ring modulators (5 of 'em)
      �  resonators
      �  sampling (aka "freeze")
    
    Problems:
    
      �  what good are ring mods as FX?  I dunno howta use 'em
      �  same for resonators
      �  I can't figure out how to get sampling to work.  Anyone
    	 got a manual that can help me out?
    
    Hoboy.
    
+b

    Re: ring mod
    
    Most ring mod effects have some sort of fixed oscillator feeding one
    leg of the modulator, your input feeds the other.  The output of a
    *true* ring modulator when you have two inputs at F1 and F2 is:
    
    (F1-F2) + (F1+F2)
    
    Notice that the inputs are absent!  Also that if F1 and F2 are not
    harmonically related, the output has non-harmonic tones.  What this
    gives you is a metallic sound, similar to what you hear in gongs,
    bells, trashcan lids, etc.  Some so-called ring modulators are really
    balanced modulators, which give you the original input components as
    well as the sum and difference components.  If the inputs *are*
    harmonically related, you get harmonic sidebands.  This is similar to
    how FM works.
    
    A good example of ring mod in "normal" (???) music is Jan Hammer's
    playing on the first Mahavishnu album "Inner Mounting Flame" where he
    plays a Rhodes through a ring mod.  Believe it or not, as I write this
    I'm listening to a tape by the UK blooz-rock band the Groundhogs. Their
    guitarist Tony McPhee used ring mod a lot on his solos, creates a
    really gnarly metallic edge to things.  
    
    							Brian
    
    P.S. Ring modulators were Oberheim's first big product, long before they
    got into making synths.

    re .61 - Brian's explanation makes more sense if you understand that by
    F1 and F2 he means frequencies, not amplitude functions over time;
    i.e., the output of the ring modulator is a signal containing the sum
    and difference *frequencies* of the inputs.
    
    Ring modulators are sometimes described as multiplying two functions
    together.  I don't have a table of trigonometric identities handy,
    but I think the ring modulator is based on an identity something like
    
    	sin(a)*sin(b) = c*sin(d*(a+b))+j*sin(k*(a-b))
    
    len.
    

    The scary this is, I kinda understand this gibberish.  8-)  Anyone
    wanna take a stab at resonators?  I thought I woulda received a
    documentation update, but I didn't.  Grumble.
    
+b

Brad, did your old programs dissappear with the upgrade or were they ok?

dbii

    They remained intact.  Sadly, I was hoping for a few example progs that
    used the new FX.  I can't figger out how to get the stupid sampling
    option to work!!!  >8-(
    
    Incidentally, the upgrade was a piece of cake.  Pop one ROM, replace it
    with another.  Sweetwater gave me mine for nothing (beats paying Alesis
    $30 for one).
    
+b

    
    >..Quadraverb upgraded.. Anyone got a manual that can help me out?
    
    I have a Quadraverb manual....send me mail with your address and
    I will make a copy of the sampling portion for you.
    
    I don't use the sampling portion that much...I have SampleCell in
    my Mac......I trigger effects via Opcode's OMS and Studio Vision
    setup....using the faders in Studio Vision.
    
    Kris..