Conference napalm::commusic_v1

    Do you mean a 1000 voice memory?
    
    It sounds like a Matrix-6R with expanded memory.  The 6R is bi-timbral
    (but that feature is mostly useless with only six voices to start
    with).  They even yhave about the same price.
    
    Steph

    
    Gee...where is this gonna end???
    
    1000 programs??????   How many can you use?????
    
    It'll take you six months just to hear them all once   :-)  :-)
     
    
    
    BTW  the ad says *800* of these are presets....200 are user editable
    (that sounds nice compared to the miserly 32 or so on many low-cost
    expanders).
    
    

    From Keyboard ad ...
    
    "1,001 Reasons to hear the Matrix 1000 ..."
    
    195 Keyboards
    118 Strings
    130 Woodwinds and Brass
    239 Synthesizers
    119 Basses
    74 Lead Sounds
    125 Effects and Percussion Sounds
    ____
    1000
       1 Suggested Retail Price $575
    ____
    1001
    
    "The sound that made synthesis great, now available at a price that
    makes synthesis easy.  The Matrix-1000 lets you choose from 1,000
    of the best analog sounds instantly - no more changing cartridges
    or loading from cassette.  And its six voices have been designed
    to give you famous Oberheim sound at a fraction of the price of
    other synths.
    
    Matrix-1000 - 1000 Sounds instantly.
    
    "With its unique "Group Mode" you can hook up to six Matric-1000's
    together for a 36 voice instrument, or hook one up to a Matrix 6
    or 6R for 12 voices with true rotate and reassign.  And of course,
    analog has always been considered the perfect compliment for digital
    instruments.  The matrix-1000 adds warmth of the professional Oberheim
    soud to any digital set-up.  It comes with 800 pre-programmed sounds
    by some of the worlds' best programmers in ROM and an additional
    200 sounds in user-loadable RAM and all of its sounds and MIDI formats
    are Matrix-6 compatible so it can be used with any MAtrix-6 librarian
    or editor"
    
    [Picture shows a one-rack-space unit, 10-number keypad, several
     other buttons, 3-digit LED readout]
    
    -Jim

    They should have just given 1000 user editables.
    
    We all have our own axes, here's mine again.
    
    
    Personally I find that hundreds of easily available patches is one
    of the best features of my set up.  (I have thousands, total).
    
    Imagine a string patch.  I bet you can imagine dozens of different,
    useful sounds which fall into this category (low, high, pizzicato,
    agitato, etc.).  Since a keyboard doesn't offer the type of control
    which would provide all these sounds from a single patch, naturally,
    you will have different patches for each of these sounds.
    
    You simply need to start thinking of the sounds as banks.  (A string
    bank, a piano bank, a horn bank, etc.), so your 30 or so useful
    sounds turn into 30x20 = 600 individual patches.
    
    
    Also, having lots of patches allows ME to carry less equipment when
    I go to a jam.
    
    Not many people seem to have an opportunity to experiment with this
    kind of flexibility, since it is just not something which can be
    appreciated at the music store.
    
    Try it, you might like it.
    
    (Of course nobody ever pays any attention to this type of
    recommendation, but at least I have fun composing it).
    
    Steph
    

    Re: .3
    
    Owning a 6R, the ad makes it sound even more like a 6R with 10 times
    the patch memory, and that is ALL.
    
    Also, I have the thousand sounds which I assume come with the
    Matrix-1000.  Some are really good, and others are worthless.  I
    think there are more worthless ones than good ones, frankly.
    
    I can think of other ways I'd rather spend $600.
    
    Steph
    

    I'd have a real problem with just 6 voices.  

    For ME, the biggest loss in the new Matrix is that they no longer
    display the VOICE NAMES, only patch numbers. This is becoming one
    of my purchase criteria (along with rack mounting) for such items.
    
    	- Rick (happy Matrix-6 owner)

    I suppose I should have surmised that from the ``Three LED'' read
    out.
    
    Re: .6  Dave:  The Matrix-6 architecture supports five different
    voice retriggering algorithms to soften the blow of only having
    6-voices, and in my opinion, all those algorithms don't help one
    bit.  (I'm only sore because they didn't include the one that I
    wanted).
    
    Steph
    

    
    It should be in stores pretty soon and I'm looking forward to hearing
    one.
    
    Bad news for Worcester, MA area MIDIots is that *Kurlan's* is going
    to be selling it.
    

    Funny.  Here it is January '89 and local stores still have waiting
    lists for Matrix-1000's.  The lowest price I've seen so far is $480
    from Sam Ash (apparently no waiting).  Seems to be a pretty popular
    unit.  On the other hand, a Matrix-6R might still be a good
    alternative, but as I understand it, these go for about $700 when/if
    you can find them used.  Have I got it right?  Any speculations
    about future prices or availability?  My guess is that I'll be able
    to pick up a Matrix-1000 for $395 in August.
    
    Steve

    I got my Matrix-1000 at EUWurlitzer for $475+tax.  It helps if they
    like you and you have cash in hand.
    
    The 6R costs a lot more, has 1/5 as many patches, but can be programmed
    by itself.  You need a -6, -6R or computer+software to program the
    -1000.  But it does have 1000 patches, many of them even usable!
    
    len.
    

    Wow.  $475, eh?  I stopped by Acton music during lunch while in
    transit to the Mill today.  Just for kicks they showed me a Juno-1
    going for $550.  Sounds nice to my ears.  But, the wife has only
    given me permission to spend about $300 on an analog synth if I
    want it now.  I left my name with the folks at Acton for if they
    come across a nice, used analog synth for cheap.
    
    By the by, while I was there I fiddled around with a D-20.  I was
    absolutely *shocked* to discover that the presets sound a *lot*
    like my TZ presets.  Guess my ears are getting better at hearing
    digital ...
    
    Steve

	In the  U.K.   the  Matrix 100 is available without delay
	and at a price of �375.

		BArry

    Just to wrap it up, I ordered one from Caruso.  They gave me $100
    for trading in my CZ-101.  I know, I know, I could have gotten a
    better price if I sold it through the want ads.  But, I don't think
    it would have been worth the hassle.  Anyway, with the trade in
    I'm paying about $350 for the 1000.  Now, I'm going through the
    guilt trip I always go through about spending money ... At least
    my wife is not upset with me, seein's how I kept the (with trade in)
    dollar figure within acceptable limits.
    
    I was happy with my system before.  Now, I feel like it will be
    more complete.  I'm not going to miss the CZ.  I found that I just
    can't stand the sound anymore.  Seemed like I always had to layer
    it with something.  All the rest of the equipment sounds so much
    better to me than the CZ.  I've never really been quite pleased with 
    any of the patches on the CZ except for organ patches.  The lack of 
    velocity sensitivity on the CZ has also become painful.  And, I've
    found that when I want to experiment with a new sound I naturally
    diddle with the TZ instead.  Anyway ...
    
    Steve_sans_CZ

    
    
    I'me surprised that noe of you Matrix 1000 buyers have picked up
    on the Cheetah MS1 yet. IS this because it isn't available in over
    there. I listened to bot recently and couldn't really tell the
    difference other than the MS is multi-tymbral ( and I mean multi
    tymbral) and costs about half the price. (Oh and isn't made by
    Oberheim.)
    
    					Paul.
    

    
    Cheetah seems to have pretty poor distribution over here in the
    US.
    

    Not just poor, almost non-existant.  Can anyone tell me where I can try
    out a Cheetah product within a reasonable drive from Nashua or Boston?
    
    	Eirikur
    

    
    I think Dan Eaton had spotted a Cheetah of some sort at LaSalle's
    in Boston.  
    
    Dan????
    
    

    Not having seen one, I'll simply pass a rumor along ... I've not heard
    much good about the manufacturing quality (or sound quality for that
    matter) of Cheetah products. 

    Oberheim, on the other hand, is famous for its great sound, not to
    mention that most units tend to be quite durable.  FWIW ...

-b

RE < Note 1147.18 by AQUA::ROST "Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" >

	Yes, I did spot one or two at LaSalles, but they were very sketchy
about whether they intend to stock them.  I've been there a number of times
since then and saw no further traces.

	Dan

    To my surprise, I found the Matrix-1000 at home waiting for me.
    Got to play with it a little.  It's very nice.  I think the sounds
    really complement the other stuff.  My only nit is that the spec
    sheet that lists the sounds should have been sealed in plastic.
    
    Steve

    
    
    re -234 etc..
    
    Yes Cheetah are not known for the quality of build but more for
    the price which you pay.
    
    They produce 4 basic oduct 2 master keyboards a drum machine and
    this new ms6.
    
    I can only comment on the MS6 which looked and sounded reanae iadn
    was very similar in construction looks and sound to the matrix 1000
    which was directly above it in the rack.
    
    
    When asked how he could produce things so cheaply the owner of th}ie
    company said "I don't know how the others produce things that are
    so expensive! "
                   
    
    
    
    Sorry about the line !~r
    
    				Paul

    re: sealing the Matrix-1000 patchlist in plastic:
    
    Easy to do!  Xerox it onto good paper, then visit a good stationery
    store and buy two 9x12 sheets of "plasti-seal".  It's a self-adhesive
    clear plastic that you can apply to the Xerox copy to make it much
    more durable.
    
    	-Bill

    I'll hafta do that.  By the way, they do list all the dump info
    format.  I think with a little luck I'll be able to dump a patch
    to my QX5 and diddle with it there.  Slow, I know, but at least
    I'll have access.  Also, 'twould seem that if one is not careful,
    one could permanently trash the 200 user-programmable patches. Bad
    news.  I'll have to make sure I back them up via MIDI dump.  The
    beast sounds great.  Passed my boy's test.  He played with several
    of the patches for long periods of time and demanded I try new ones.
    By far, this has to be the highest quality set of patches I've ever
    come across.  It will take a long time before I am able to realize
    the potential of this machine.  Many of the patches sound like 
    potential song intros just with a few chord hits.  The fatness really
    complements the sampler and the TZ.  It's really, really nice.
    
    Steve

            Well, I was doing some sequencing last night and I came across
    this bass sound that I absolutely *LOVE*. I literaly stopped what I
    was doing and just played this patch for almost an hour. I had come
    across this patch before, but never spent any time with it. It is
    patch 746 JOCKO. I had to turn the volume slider on the EPS off
    so that I could convince myself that this wasn't a sample, but
    synthesized by the Ob. It is so damn GOOD! I felt like Jocko was
    in my basement!! This patch is so expresive. It's even got his
    slow vibrato technique in the patch. I think aftertouch modulates this.
    The attack changes very subtlely as you play with diferent velocities.
    It is so hard to keep track of patches in this instrument, but this
    one I'll remember!!! M1000 owners,,go home tonight and PLAY with this
    patch. 8^)  8^)
    
    Frank

    Must be contagious. My TX81Z's also have a "Jaco" bass patch.
    
    I'm not quite as enamoured of mine as you seem to be with yours.
    
    Edd

    Well, I've got a diskette of Oberheim patches for my Emax, and there's
    a wonderful 2-octave bass sample called 'Jocko', and I used it on
    Commusic III, in the piece called 'Seven'.  I still like it,a nd
    it takes up very little sample space.
    
    karl

Super-dumb question: Does the Matrix 1000 support portamento?  As in
can I send it a mono-mode message, a portamento-on message (CC65?) and a
portamento-rate message (CC??) and get it to behave like an old monophonic
analog synth?

I just tried to see what Oberheim's thinking here was by examining Bill Y.'s
Expander.  No dice.  It's so general that it will allow you to CONSTRUCT
voices that have portamento, but it does not "have knowledge" of the idea.

	Eirikur

What, no answer to my .-1 (.28)?  Can't be true.  I want to order one!

	Eirikur

Eirikur,

>What, no answer to my .-1 (.28)?  Can't be true.  I want to order one!

People are still recovering from shelling out 700 smackers for the PX... :^)
I know *I* would like to get a Matrix 1000 also, but my wife would think
otherwise, I'm sure.....

Dan

    Well, the M-1000 definitely does have a mono mode, as a large number
    of the presets use it.  I believe it is one of the few programmable
    parameters you can get at from the front panel, but I'll have to
    check.
    
    I don't recall whether or not it supports portamento.  I'll check
    tonight and reply tomorrow.
    
    len.
    

It's interesting to learn (here and in conversations) that I'm one of the few
people who really depend on portamento.  A lot of people who didn't play
the early monophonic analog machines don't seem to 'take to' portamento.

	Eirikur

>< Note 1147.32 by KALLON::EIRIKUR "Hallgr�msson, ACA and CDA Prod. Mgr." >
>                              -< showing my age >
>It's interesting to learn (here and in conversations) that I'm one of the few
>people who really depend on portamento.  A lot of people who didn't play
>the early monophonic analog machines don't seem to 'take to' portamento.

I think portamento is great. I've used it from the very beginning (bought 
my 1st synth in 1973). It seems that the portamento on synths now works 
differently than on the early machines.

Mike D

    Ditto. Any patch I use in MONO mode gets portamento...
    
    Edd

    Portamento would be a whole lot more usable if it were possible
    to select constant rate or constant time, and to define the rate
    or time in terms of MIDI clocks.  Some of my machines do constant
    rate portamento, and som do constant time portamento.  Some only
    do monophonic portamento, and some do polyphonic portamento for
    that supremely wierd science fiction effect.
    
    len.
    

<<< Note 1147.35 by DRUMS::FEHSKENS >>> -< Choose Your Constant >-

Boy, do I ever agree with Len.  I wish pitch-bend was better defined, too, in
terms of semi-tones or perhaps fractional note numbers or something like that. 
T'would make sequences more portable, and editing bends much easier.  I think
that one way that I use portamento is to get a more controlled bending effect
without having to develop massive control wheel/lever/whatever chops.  Of
course taking that approach, the sequence or MIDI file is even less predictably
editable.

	Eirikur


    

re: < Note 1147.36 by KALLON::EIRIKUR "Hallgr�msson, ACA and CDA Prod. Mgr." >
                    -< Pitch bend is similarly undefined. >-

re: <<< Note 1147.35 by DRUMS::FEHSKENS >>> -< Choose Your Constant >-

For those of us who are unlightened about this wonderful portamento, how do
you use it effectively and musically? I have used it on occasion with some
wind instrument settings, but it seems to get in the way. Any tips? 

Geoff_who_has_bad_chops_and_thinks_like_and_is_a_sax_player

    

On the assumption that the Matrix 1000 is identical in programming
architecture to the Matrix 6 (it is, right?), I can venture a few words
about the portamento and mono modes:

It gives you a lot of great control, but I wish I had more, or different.

First off, the only real mono mode is called ``unison'' where all six
voices sound at once.  This is overkill.  There is such a thing as
``too fat,'' and this is usually it.  When I'm working those vintage
70s solos, I wish that I could get just ONE voice, and trill using key
priority, which brings me to my second beef.

There is no programmable priority, only low-note priority.  I vastly
prefer high or last (gee, if I had better technique, it wouldn't matter).

Third, they don't seem to keep track of enough note ons in the internal
state, if I accidentially hit a key, and then release it, with another
pitch of interest still held, I can be left in silence.  I forget how
many notes, (six, maybe?) and if you told me about the limitation
without showing me, I wouldn't think it was a big deal.  As it turns
out, it's annoying, especially for ``performance'' oriented playing.

And portamento... remember portamento? This is a song about
portamento... You have many parameters with which to play: rate, depth,
curves, etc..  However, I found it non-trivial with all this plus
programmable modulation to simply implement on/off selection.

I'm sure a determined programmer could do it, but I said, to heck with
it, I know how to do Styx covers on my DX7, and it doesn't sound that much worse.

Maybe someday I'll get back on an analog grass roots kick (that'll be
the day).  Anyhow, don't let me put you off ;-)

Steph

Uh, gee, if I want to bend up a third, I hit the portamento-on footswitch
(ideally this is a momentary pedal), and simply play the note a third up from
where I am, without releasing the first key (if that avoids re-articulating
or re-attacking the note).  I may make a guessed-at adjustment of the
portamento-rate control just before I do this.   I'm not really sure that this
requires less chops then using the bender, it's just my way, and I'm not in
practise at it, since I am currently without any hardware that does portamento.

	Eirikur    

RE: what's port & howzzit useful

    Basically, port comes in two forms: mono and poly.  

    Mono usually means 'slide from the the last or current (first) active
    trigger'. For example, you've got an old Arp unit (one 'voice') and
    have port on.  You play a middle C, then an octave above middle C - and
    you 'slide' the pitch up an octave.  If you have a newer polyphonic
    synth that only does mono pitch port (Prophet-5?), you'll slide from
    either the last activated trigger (if no keys are currently being
    pressed) or the first activated trigger (if keys are currently being
    pressed).

    My understanding of a complex case - suppose you've played a C-3, and
    now play an F-triad beginning on F-4.  The chord will slide as though
    you've pitch bent all notes evenly (intervals remain intact).

    Poly-port is a bit more arcane in its implementation.  The OB-Xa was
    the one of the first synths to popularize this.  Poly port slides from
    the last pitch in the chain.  For example, the Xa is an 8 voice synth.
    Assume you've played the following, in order: 

	VOICE	NOTE
	-----	----
	1	C-3
	2	G-3
	3	B-3
	4	D-4
	5	F#4
	6	A-4
	7	C#5
	8	E-5

    All notes will slide from C-3.  If you play the 9th note, voice 1 will
    be stolen and will slide from G-3.  10 will slide from B-3, 11 from
    D-4, etc.  Strange in the case of chords, and *very* strange when in
    MONO mode. 

    Mono-port is useful for big sweeping effects if the rate is very slow.
    If the rate is set very low, you get a small 'pre-bend' effect on each
    note - examples include ELP's "Lucky Man", or Styx' "Lady". 

    Poly-port is useful for effects - the one example that comes to mind is
    Queen's "The Game" (from albums of same name) where they used an Xa on
    the bridge just before the lead to get some big synth sweeps. 

    Note that this is not gospel, but just my experience using it over the
    years ... I could be all screwed up in my description. 

-b (who likes Oberheim's MONO mode 8-)

    My Juno-106 has polyphonic portamento, and an interesting effect
    was to play a really wide spread "chord" (i.e., random collection
    of six notes) covering the whole keyboard, then turn portamento on with
    the slowest rate, then hit a chord in the center of the keyboard. 
    You get these wild slides from all over the place that finally resolve
    into the centered chord.
    
    len.
     

Ok, I've recieved my Matrix-1000 from Sam Ash.  I'm pretty disappointed with
this thing.  The manual contains NO diagrams of the voice structure, no
explanation either.  Several items refer to the "front panel parameter display
number," which must be left over from the Matrix-6 manual.  You can't display
or edit anything about a patch on the Matrix-1000.  And it doesn't respond to
portamento on/off or anything logical like that.  You're supposed to use the
presets on this thing and be happy--but I'm not all that happy.

I've been tinkering with the sysex.  The following should twiddle parameter pp
to value vv in the current voice, but it doesn't do a thing.   I can't get it
to recognize any sysex messages.

F0 10 06 06 pp vv F7

Am I doing something wrong?  Anybody out there program one of these things?
I'm using MidiControl on the Mac, and I know that it is working because I can
twiddle things on my MKS-7 with it just fine, and just did so.

	Eirikur

The Opcode patch editor for the Macintosh lets you program by dragging virtual
patchcords.  At $149.00, I'll let them worry about the Sysex details.  I can't
do checksum for patch dumps with MidiControl, anyway.

	Eirikur

    You can sort of intuit the voice structure by reading the patch
    parameter data in the back of the manual.  Yes, the documentation
    leaves a great deal to be desired.
    
    I got the Dr. T's/Caged Artist M-1000 editor for the Amiga, and
    the documentation there is no more help.  The manual is a generic
    "for all synths" manual, and the actual screens are basically just
    tables of parameter values.
    
    I'd suggest trying to find a Matrix-6 manual someplace.  I'm hoping
    that the Alexander Publishing boys will come up with a nice
    Matrix-6/6R/1000 book sometime soon.
    
    len.
    

RE < Note 1147.44 by DRUMS::FEHSKENS >

	Oberheim DOES have a more complete MIDI manual for the Matrix-6 (and 
thus for the Matrix-1000).  It can be ordered by calling Oberheim directly.
Not that it is any easier to comprehend....

	Dan

Well, I've finally spent some time hacking around with the voice editor
(Opcode) for the Matrix-1000.  You really can do amazingly weird things with
this machine.  I was trying to come up with some kind of intuitive portamento
control, and I played with using velocity, pressure, etc, to change the rate.
Neat.  There are also a lot of really remarkable patches in this box.  I
still think that there are just far, far too many "analog pad" sounds with the
release cranked-up too far.  But, for every few dozen of those, there's a real
gem like "Ballgame" (distant crowd).

In summary, I'm very happy with this machine now that I can actually get it to
do what I want.  It's a real pity that the factory patches don't conform to the
defined controllers for portamento, etc, but it is certainly fixable.

	Eirikur

    Help! I can't get portamento to work on my M-1000. I've just re-read
    this entire note and although many people have referred to portamento
    on the M-1000 or asked for help, no one has posted a reply actually
    explaining how to do it. The unit does not respond to controller data 
    for portamento on/off, yet there is a portamento parameter in the voice
    architecture. Eirikur, have you divined the secret?
    
    Chris

re:           <<< Note 1147.47 by TALLIS::PALMER "Colonel Mode" >>>
                           -< more portamento woes >-

Yes, I have solved this, but the situation isn't pretty.  The M1000's presets
do not come with the MIDI portamento controller mapped to controlling
portamento.  You can easily fix this with a patch editor, but, of course, NOT
from the front panel.  Fie on Oberheim.  It's a great-sounding box, but this
lack of attention to detail is really annoying.

I'm serious, in the ROM patches, the portamento-rate destination has nothing
routed to it.  It's really hard to believe.

	Yours in incredulity,

	Eir�kur