Conference napalm::commusic_v1

    Why do you say this is not part of the TX/DX architecture?
    
    4 op FM sounds alot like the Fb01, DX100/21/27 architecture to me.
    
    Edd

    Hmmm...  Silly me.  It's just that when I see ads for DX/TX patch
    editors I immediately assume they are for DX7/TX7/TXn16 (i.e. 6 op FM).
    Is this *not* the case? 
    
    Also, aren't operators on DX7/21/27/100, TX7/n16, Fb01 all sines?
    
    On the TX81Z there are a number of different waveforms for each
    operator (I don't know exactly how many or which ones, but I imagine
    they include sine, ramp, triangle, pulse, etc.) 
    
    Isn't this unique (so far) amongst the Yamaha FM machines?
    
    
    Richard 

    I understand that the DX7 model II also has several waveforms per
    operator.  However, it has six operators, so it is different from
    the TX81Z.
        John Sauter

    
    	I was looking at/for TX81Z a few (3 ?) weeks ago.  In my rush
    to get something that was available I left the store with an FB-01,
    which I'm fairly satisfied with.  I had left my number with a few
    mail/phone order places, and guess what ?  Late last week they started
    calling me back to ask if I still wanted one.  Due to some unusually
    fast (for me) thinking I told them, 
    
    "thanks, but the price locally seems to be dropping, it looks like a
    whole ship load of 'em came in". 
    
    This brought the usual, "hang on a minute",  followed by pretense at
    hitting calculator buttons, 
    
    "how much did you say they are in Mass ?",

    "I didn't",   
    
    "Well, er, how much are they",  
    
    "first tell me what your calculator just said" 
    
    "Well, er, um, $429, how does that sound ?" 

    "It sounds like what you said a coupla weeks ago.  I'll give Y'a
    clue, I can get it for under $400 up here"

    "Who's offerin 'em for that ?"
    
    "Never mind, can you match it ?"
    
    Click, click,  "$395 plus UPS, no sales tax 'cos you're out of state,
    we'll authorize UPS to accept a personal check"
    
    "Thanks, but no thanks.  I'll wait til they're under $350 here"

    "We can ship it today, you'll have it by the end of the week"
    
    "Thanks guys, bye"
        
    	I think they were announced in January, first appeared in February,
    its now mid April and they're discounted 20% already.  When does
    this price curve flatten out ?  Is it a premium system that they
    use to squeeze extra $$$s out of the folks who just havta have the
    first unit in their town ?  If so there must be a lot of those buyers
    who jump on the new item real quick, because in 3 months they're
    trying to get to the let's_think_about_this_twice buyer.
    
    	Reg
    

    re .4  Price of TX81Z
    
    Not being much of a shopper, I decided not to haggle.  I paid $425
    cash for mine.  And if I hadn't done it there and then, I would
    never have done it.  It's the same with the piano.  If I had waited
    for yet a better, cheaper machine, I'd be waiting until next century.
    
    re .3  DX7II(F)D
    
    I don't think they have new (non-sine) operators.  I read the Keyboard
    review the other night, and it seems they would have made a big
    deal of it, since this would be a new feature.
    
    
    Richard

    
    	I gotta horrid feeling that Ronnie is gonna rain on our dreams.
     Apparently he opens the envelope today at some press conference.

    	Reg
    

    
    Hey guys....we are waiting for a review of your Tx81z.
    
    It doesnt have to be as in-depth voluminous as one of Fehsken's,
    
    but maybe you can tell us what it *doesnt* do that you thought
    
    it would, and what non-sine FM sounds like....ok?
    
    rr
    

    Hey ron....it's (yes, I know, laugh at me) "still on order".  Y'all'll
    get a review in some due time after I receive it.
    
    (And if you give me one of your many FB01's I'll even do a side-by-side
    comparison for you. :-)
    
    Richard

    
    So where did MENTOR::REG get the quote of $395?????
    
    
    	hm??????????????
    
    ron
    

    
    	Gee, didn't I reply to your mail Ron ?   Let's see, was I
    MENTOR::REG that day or EUREKA::REG_B ?  Never mind, its the source
    of the $395 you wanted, right ?   Where's my notes for that...?
    I'll have to get back to you Ron, can you wait a coupla days ?
    
    	Reg
    

    
    hey, cute....
    
    	but ah,
    
    		like it's fiction like I thought?
    
    uh huh. 
    
    well I got a quote of $299.99

    
    	re .11	OK Ron, if $299.99 includes shipping and no sales tax
    I'll take two of 'em.  How about a pair of MKS 20s at $499 too ?
    Have 'em shipped to my address, charged to your VISA #.
    
    
    
    	Just to prove I'm really a nice guy, the answer is;  Profound
    Sound.  May not be too good of an idea to mention my name because
    I've been price shopping with them .  The original referral was
    given in this conference by Brad Schafer.  The number is 800-63-SOUND
    Shane or Bruce are the folks to deal with, they seem to be the ones
    that can dicker.
    
    	Reg

    
    after a bunch of phone calls:
    
    	$405 including shipping.
    
    	Taint bad. Might be able to get lower.
    
    ron
    

    re .13	See, toldYa so.  I assume it WAS Profound Sound ?  Nice
    Guys, but I'll wait for the next price notch.   Its MKS 20s that
    I *REALLY* want to see come down, maybe by next tax refund there'll
    be a MKS 20B or II or something and I'll be able to help someone
    out by taking an oh_so_obsolete MKS off their hands.  Anyone care
    to guess the going price for a used MKS 20  365 days from now ?
    

    1. wasnt Profound sound. They wanted $429 plus shipping,
    	 as I remember...

    2. I plan to have and use my MKS20 for a lonnnnnng time.
    
    	Bet all the other owners do too....

    ron
        

    Well, I finally got the TX.  It's a lot of fun.  I have to agree
    with something KMII was saying about his FB01.  More voices, please.
    The pf80's got 16 voices internally, and it does some smart stuff,
    like if I play a low note, hold the key, and, while depressing the
    damper pedal, I play a lot of notes with my right hand, it will
    recycle the voices through the notes played by the right, but it
    won't steal the voice playing the low note, since the key is still
    depressed.  The TX, however, will recycle the voices in the order
    they were assigned, period.  It's gonna take some time to get used
    to playing it `correctly'.
    
    Another deccie, who doesn't seem to participate in this conference,
    posted a note to rec.music.synth describing an interesting glitch
    with one of the performance patches.  On the TX and the FB01, the
    performance patches are where you assign the `single' patches to
    various voices, and assign detuning, midi channel, stereo channel,
    chording, effects, etc. to each individual voice.  So, when using
    the factory performance patch `Amazon Flute' she says playing a
    number of notes, very quickly, will eventually cause all of the
    B and Bb keys to go out.  She uses a KX88 as a controller.  She
    was also able to get this to occur at the music dealer on their
    unit, using their keyboards (she didn't mention what they were).
    Well, I wasn't able to get my unit to recreate this.  My guesses
    are that it might have been a known bug and has been fixed already
    (mine seems very new - it has HJ87 screened on the back, which I'm
    guessing means June 87 - anyone know?) or the fact that my keyboard
    (the pf80) doesn't transmit aftertouch/mod info.  Anyone else out
    there have a TX81Z that could try this, as well?  Or some other
    smart-a...er, smart comments?
    
    I will *definitely* be getting a mac patch editor for this beast.
    Front panel programming with 6 keys is silly.  The latest Keyboard
    (or was it MT?) had an ad for a program called TX81Z Pro or some
    such.                    
    
    Richard
    
    (P.S.  Yes, I invited the usenet poster to join us here in
    COMMUSICland, but I haven't gotten a response from her yet.)
    
    

    I also tried to duplicate the 'Amazon Flute' bug without success,
    using a Wersi keyboard controller. Maybe I didn't try long enough,
    the original posting to the net said a "few minutes" and I stopped
    after 2 or 3.
    
    Rob

    I was told that it had to do with a sick interaction of Micro tuning
    and onboard effects.  Only if you have a sound with both of these
    does it lose.  But I don't have one, so I can't confirm.  (I doubt
    that they've fixed it so quickly, but I could be surprised.)
    
    Steph

Hello --- I was the usenet poster of the problem with the TX81Z 
performance 16.   Here is what I found out for those of you who may run
into this problem in the future:

It seems that the problem occurs in performance mode when the performance is 
configured to use microtonality and also uses the TX81Z delay effect.

A ROM update (v1.3?) is available (free) from authorized Yamaha dealers.
The one with the problem is V1.1

Nancy

    Any idea about how I can tell which version I've got?

    sure. Try the bug. If its there. You got 1.1.
    
    (sorry! I couldnt resist!!!!!!)
    
    ar. ar.
    
    

 >>   Any idea about how I can tell which version I've got?


Put the TX81Z into self test mode by holding down both left arrow and the
cursor mode key while powering up the unit. The self test mode displays the
software rev. code. 

To get out of self test mode, cycle the power off and on again.


Nancy

    Well, I tried the test and I've got 1.2, dated February 1987.  Golly,
    if there really is a rev 1.3 out there, anybody know what bugs were
    fixed in 1.2?
    
    Steve

    But it's dated February '87 as well.  Maybe none of the 1.2's were
    supposed to get out.  (Maybe it has a Murphy's Loop in it -- the
    bug only shows up when you need the unit most. ;-)
    
    Richard
    

          
    RE: .22
    
>   Put the TX81Z into self test mode by holding down both left arrow and the
>   cursor mode key while powering up the unit. The self test mode displays the
>   software rev. code. 
     
    WARNING : We tried this with my friends TX over the weekend and blew
    away all the sounds and performance setups he'd been working on.
    Besides going into a self test mode, it also apparently does a reset to
    the factory presets. Oops. Very interesting 'feature'.
         
    Rob
    
                                                          

    Hmmm.  I don't believe this happened to me.  I have only programmed
    in two patches (from the DX100/21/27 note in this conference!) and
    I think they are still there.  I will check tonight and report back.
    What rev. did this occur on?  Perhaps this was the 1.2 bug?
    
    Richard
    

    
    His is a version 1.2 (Feb '87). I'm not sure if it was just putting
    it in this mode or the fact we actually went ahead and answered
    some of the self test questions that did the damage. But something
    definitely reset the sounds. A classic lesson in why you should
    have a backup. (He didn't!)
    
    Rob

    If I may diverge a little bit... My free copy of AFTERTOUCH finally
    arrived with the demo of 81Z sounds.  That was inpressive.  My wife
    was particularly impressed because she couldn't tell if the instruments
    being emulated were real or not.  It's also tantalizing to know
    that it is possible to get those kinds of sounds out of the 81Z.
    Of course, Yamaha is trying to sell the wind controller, but it
    seems obvious to me that the real magic is in the patches for the
    81Z.  They mentioned a book that can be had with purchase of the
    controller that will tell how the guy did the sounds, but who wants
    to buy the controller just to get the sounds.  What I suspect is
    that we'll soon see a lot more stuff on how to squeeze those neat
    sounds out of the 81Z (aside from all the opportunists that only
    claim to have the sounds now).  I, for one, would really appreciate
    it if anybody has any good leads to such publications. Or, (do I dare
    suggest?) if one of you *rich* guys out there winds up buying Yamahas
    wind controllers, maybe you could give us some pointers?  Heck,
    I'd even toss in a couple of bucks if anybody wants to pool it for
    the publications...  Just an idea.  Sure liked those strings on
    the demo.
    
    Steve

    2 things the controller contributes to the sounds.
    
    1. The 'hold' button/switch/pedal/whateveritis that latches 
       to one midi chanell, then you play to voices on it...and
       press to change to 2nd midi channel. NOTES ON the first
       are apparently held as you play the voices on the 2nd 
       channel.(means that when you switch back, some note offs
       go out?). THIS gives you 
    
    2. Lots of control using tounging, wind pressure, key velocity?,
       that doesnt normally come out of your keyboard....
    
        The ability to do single/multiple triggering I cant determine
    	where comes from. Listen to the killer E bass solo: not all
        notes are plucked. (like a real guitarist would do). How they
        get that over midi aint clear either...unless 2 note ons creates
        no re-trigger, and note on/off/on does. But that aint in the
        midi spec! AND my gripe is that most kbds wont send that info!!!!
        even tho they could.
    
        ron.
    
  

    
    Does anyone have a lead on where I can hear one?
    
    Apparently Yam is doing what they did with the FB01:
    
    announce.
    1 shipment out to dealers.
    months go by. interest generated. advertisements but NO SHIPMENTS
    then they finally show up...
    
    Daddys nashua:  "we expect to get them any month now" MONTH???!?!
    
    

    All those mean 'n' nasty 'n' ugly Fortune-100 equivalent companies
    do that.  I would never want to work for a firm which employed such
    shoddy practices...
    
    In all seriousness, there are, I believe, some guitar controllers
    which rely on just the behavior you described.  Note-On->Note-On
    doesn't re-trigger (skips the attack or whatever).
    
    The E! implements a ``guitar-mode'' which allows the DX7 to deal
    with the fact that it doesn't get as many note offs as note ons.
    According to the manual, this was ``a direct response to the requests
    of a number of guitar controller manufacturers.''
    
    This must really screw up some sequencers.
    
    Steph

    
    why? You just need to be able to capture information from
    the controller that generates 2 note-ons...OR if screen
    based composition, maybe a slur creates note onS....
    
    Bottom line, of course, is that your VOICE must handle 
    2 consec. note ons right, as well as your controller
    SOMEHOW sending 2 note-ons...playing 'legato'
    (or sloppily) could result in this, but the controller
    has to be informed that thats the desired behavior.
    
    Some do something close in mono mode...some dont.

    BTW, theres nothing in the midi spec (v1 at least...) that 
    couples note ons and note offs. (or even talks about it)
     So multiple note ons is legal. NOW, if only they had 
    SAID something about it, we'd have much more functionality
    in our boxes.....
    

	Could somebody throw a quick list of the TX81Z's spec's into
	this note ?  You know, how many many voices, how many outputs,
	how many patches, etc.  Sorry to seem so obtuse, but I haven't
	been keeping up with the literature lately.  

	Thanks,
	 Art

Some TX81Z competition?

Dan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - CUT HERE - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 
Newsgroups: rec.music.synth
Path: decwrl!decvax!ucbvax!ucbcad!ames!think!husc6!seismo!mnetor!utgpu!lansd
Subject: Cheapo version of the D-50?
Posted: 12 Jul 87 00:55:11 GMT
Organization: University of Toronto Computing Services
Checksum: 56363
 
 
 
    I was speaking with a Roland dealer here in Toronto today and he
mentioned that Roland is planning an under $1000 (Canadian) rack mount
tone generator utilizing the D-50 sound generator chip.
    I mentioned the rack mounted D-50, but he said it wasn't that at
all. It would hit the stores in October, and would be competing with
the Tx81Z.

    Is $1000 Canadian = $500 US?
    
    Edd

    I heard from the guy in Acton that it was going to be $700 ($699) list.
    It is claimed to do up to eight simultaneous timbres, and dynamic voice
    allocation. 
    
    Boy, some folks sell a keyboard for $100, and others sell it
    for $1200.
    
    Steph
    

    re  ...the last couple	I think there's some confusion with
    the "Now new; no, newer than THAT"  TX802, which is a whole bunch
    more than the TX81Z and about the price of the D50, ~$18xx.yy
    
    	Reg
    

    Well it seems like Yamaha is busy updating their TX81Z microcode,
    I just got one and the  rev is 1.4 dated 25-mar-87.
    
    Any better?
    
    Svein.
    

    Do you notice any differences? (It'd be a killer if all the patches
    were changed...)
    
    Steve

    I got mine a couple of weeks ago at Daddy's in Nashua, where they had
    just come in, and it has V1.5 ROMs dated sometime in June (I forget the
    exact date).  Too bad they don't come with release notes!

				*** Daryl ***

    Has anybody come across a good patch editor/librarian
    for the TX81Z that runs on a Mac?
    
    Regardless of Yamaha's claims of programmability, setting
    up a voice (with, what is it, 92 parameters?) on a 
    2 line X 30 char. display is a pain in the *ss!!
    
    Thanks,
    Kevin

    I've seen an ad.  I don't remember the company, but I think the
    program was called TX-PRO, or some such.  I believe it was in one
    of the past 2 (not the lates one) issues of Keyboard.  I will try
    to remember to look it up and post the info.
    
    Richard
    

    I'm a brand new member of this conference.  Just got a KX88 controller
    and the TX81z.  I have it hooked up through an Amiga 1000 running
    ProMIDI Studio.  I'm also brand new at music.  We wanted to get
    a piano (for us and the kids to learn) and decided that we didn't
    have enough room yet (if any of us show any aptitude there will
    probably be a baby grand after building a house).  The keyboard
    had about the closest feel that I could find to a piano (although
    I understand that the Kurzweil MIDIboard is supposed to be better).
    
    The TX81z seems to fit my partners requirements for 'piano sound'
    and I like that added instruments. The question that I have concerns
    the TX81Z's grand piano patch.  It seems ok until I start playing
    C1 and then it just doesn't sound like a piano anymore.  Anyone
    with the same experience?  Anyone know of a GREAT piano patch for
    it?         
    
    I'm also interested in anyone with an Amiga out  there and what
    kind of software is available. I've seen the base notes, but they've
    seemed to have died out.
    
    					Jim Collum
    
    
    p.s. I listened to the MKS20 at the store. now THAT was a piano!
    Unfortunatly, it was outside the current budget (but i'm saving)
    
    
    		
    

    	By C1, do you mean ``a really low C''?  If so, that is to be
    expected.  All those patches, but especially the ones that are supposed
    to emulate ``real'' instruments have range limitations.  In some
    Yamaha architectures, this can be a result of scaling some parameters
    with respect to the note number and getting a ``good approximation''
    over a certain range of notes, and things falling apart outside
    of this range.
    
    Steph
    

    Yep, a 'really low C' (Octave 1 on a piano keyboard).
    I've seen some adds in Electronic Musician and Keyboard 
    for TX81Z patches (you know... 747 patches for 69.95).  Has 
    anyone tried these? Anyone know of a real good piano patch?
    (or even 2... one optimized for the high range and one for the low?)
    I'm new to electronic music, so please bear with me (but i'm a fast
    learner)

    					Jim
    

    While it won't work in any of the 4-ops, there was some company
    advertising a DX7 piano patch in Keyboard for $21.95....
    
    "Shipments in June to diminish effects of free trading..."
    
    Anyone ever hear it?
                  
    Edd
    

    
    dont hold breath.
    
    save the $$ you wanna spend buying cartridges and patches
    which wont satisfy your piano requirements either....
    
    and eventually you'll have your mks20.
    
	worth the wait.
    
    

I have quite the opposite complaint.
My DX100 piano patchs wimp out at the *high* end, but sound pretty good in
the low to mid range.  I have a factory patch called "Left Hand" that
is pretty good (warning: it's non-velocity sensitive), and my favorite 
is called "Uprt Piano" which is also non-velocity sensitive.  Both sound 
good in the low register, but sound like crapola above C3 or so.

My solution?  I use what I got.
If you want a piano, buy a piano or MKS20.

Todd.

	... don't know if this was discussed before...

	Upon powering up my TX for the first time last night, I noticed a slight
'humming'.  Put my hand on the box and felt a slight vibration.  I've never
noticed this kind of thing with any other synth unit before.  Is this the normal
behavior of a TX or (gulp) do I have a diseased unit?

	Nice sounds, though.  I think I like it.

	Dan

	BTW, the humming was from the box itself, not an audio hum through the 
amplification system.

    Mine makes no noticeable hum or vibration.....it just gets a little
    warm.
    
    				-Jeff

	Speaking with Ron Ross, he suggests the power transformer may have
some looseness...

	I'll try it again in the next few days and see if it still happens.
I *did* have it set atop another rack unit that may have emphasised the 
resonance (sheet metal against sheet metal).  Still, I want to deal with it
as soon as possible to insure returnability...

	Dan

    Try flipping the plug over.  I found the same problem and determined
    that it was related to which side of the plug was 'hot'.  When I
    flipped the plug over, the hum went away.  Looks like they didn't
    ground the case very well ... 
    
    Steve

RE < Note 761.53 by ECADSR::SHERMAN "Sure... blame the *computer* " >
>                            -< Flip the plug over >-

	Thanks, I'll try it.  

	Dan

	Has anyone, yet, done any significant programming using the alternate
waveforms on this beast?  Somehow, by now I would have expected to hear a real
hoohaw about that option.  Has there been any articles written to expound?
Anyone purchase third party patches that blew them away?  Is it really no big
deal?

	Or does no-one have time any more for programming?

	Dan

I'd like to nominate Yamaha for an award.

...an award for absolute *WORST* user interface and manual with regards
to the TX81Z. Argh!!!!

Anyhow, question time....

When setting the frequency of an operator on the TZ, there is a parameter
I haven't run into before; FIXED or RATIO. Hacking around the machine and
wandering through the manual, I think I've figured out the gist of it...

           RATIO: The method we all know and love. Hit a higher key
                  and the sound increases in frequency.

           FIXED: Best explained by example: The whack off a piano
                  key into the bed doesn't change pitch as a result
                  of which key you hit.

Firstly:  Do I have these right?

Secondly: Are they mutually exclusive? If I set an operator to a frequency
          using the RATIO controls, does this preclude setting the same
          operators FIXED parameters? Are they related somehow??

I spent part of this weekend trying to load some of the patches published
in AFTERTOUCH into the TZ. One in particular drove me bonkers; "MoloElPnos",
as published on pg. 16 of the 4/87 issue. It shows a frequency of *5.49* for
operator 1. Could this be a Yama-typo? I certainly couldn't find that fre-
quency on either the DX or the TZ...

Another thing that struck me silly was the setting of FIX RANGE for RATIO
controlled operators. This lead met to believe they are interdependant, in
spite of what I'd conjured up before-hand.

Will wunna you wizards out there set me straight?

Edd
                

    Doesn't the DX2* have fixed frequency ops?  (You do have one of
    those, don't you?)
    
    You are correct about the uses.  Fixed frequency is often used for
    thunks, and other enharmonic things (like buzzes in gongs, etc).
    
    You can also get nice string sounds by using a fixed op of a low
    frequency (<10 Hz) as a carrier and a ratioed modulator.  The fixed ops
    are one of the major sources of power in the DX architecture. 
    
    About fixed, and ratioed being exclusive.  Yes. They are.  An operator
    is oscillates either at a fixed frequency, or at a frequency which is
    some factor of the fundamental (keyed) pitch.
    
    If the op is set up fixed, then the two frequency adjustments control the
    absolute frequency of the op.  Otherwise they control the factor
    of the fundamental at which the op will oscillate.
    
    As far as the TZ, I know that it has less adjustment in the frequency
    department than the DX7, so I can't really help you too much, except
    to speculate that when the op is ratioed the ``fix-range'' control
    does not control the ``fix-range'' (it can't) but rather controls
    some amount of the ratio.  But it could be irrelevant.  Usually
    they just dump out all the parameters of the voice, even if they
    aren't relevant.
    
    Steph

    There are some bugs in the TX81Z patches in Aftertouch. In an editorial
    in one issue, they blame it on some patch editor software that they
    were using. However, the symptom  sounds different than you describe.
    
    	- Rick
    
    P.S.  I didn't think the manual is any worse than other Yamaha manuals.
    	(Of course I own a DX7 already, don't you own a DX27 Edd?)
    
    

    I've got both a DX21 and a TX81Z.
    
    My gut feeling was that the FIXED and RATIO parameters were
    exclusive, but the manual only alludes to such. Seeing the
    parameters set in the same patch listing is what threw me..
    
    It Aftertouch format seems confusing as hell. F'rinstance, in
    order to show a ratio frequency of .50, they indicate a "frequency
    coarse" setting of 1. A ratio of 1.00 is indicated by 4. This refers
    to the position of that ratio in a table of those available!!!!!
    Unbelievable!!!! Here I am trying to set 'fixed frequency coarse' 
    to 4, and 'ratio frequency' to 1.00!!! I'm dumb!!!!!
    
    But it *is* one hell of a unit!
    
    Edd
    
    P.S. As bad as the Yamaha manuals are, *ROLAND* takes the cake...
         "Press button of wishing voice for generation of patch voice..."
                                                  JX3-P Manual
    
     

    Update, part n...
    
    Someone asked earlier if the non-sine waveforms were anything to
    write home about. Diligent sucker that I am, I set out last night
    to find out...
    
                              OH YES!!!!
    
    They make all the difference in the world, akin to having extra
    operators....
    
                       *        *        *
    
    After all my bitching about the programming interface, I must now
    recant. As luck would have it, I already have the TX81Z programmer
    module, previously referred to as a DX21. (OK, $800 is a little
    steep for a programmer...) Now obviously I can't controll parameters
    on the TZ that don't map directly to the DX (like the alternative
    waveforms) but basically it's DX out to TZ in and I'm all set! Nice!
    
    Last night I also wanted to try transferring patches between the
    2 machines. This may be old hat to some of you wizards but *I* was
    shocked as all hell to find out how easy it was!! I'd anticipated
    some sort of 'dumping' procedure (dump single to MIDI, dump bank
    to MIDI, dump all), but NOPE!!! Simply connect DX out to TZ in and
    select the DX patch you want to transfer. Done. How much easier
    could it get? Now just save it to wherever you want on the TZ.
    Works the same way in the other direction, but any TZ patch with
    non-sine waves gets a little unpredictable.
    
    Now all I gotta do is build/buy a big switching matrix. Maybe
    4in X 4out???
    
    Edd
    
    

I just bought a TX81z to use with my WX7 wind controller. I ran into the bug 
mentioned somewhere around *.20-.25. I wonder if anyone knows if this really 
is fixed. 

I'll check the rev level when I get home.

Geoff

    Well, for what it's worth, I ordered new PROMs from Shane about
    two months ago.  I called him yesterday, and he said that Yamaha
    told him they would be shipped 'any day now'.  So, when they finally
    do arrive (maybe next week?)  I'll load 'em up and see what the
    latest version of the software is...
    
    Steve

    Shane came through!  My PROMs arrived yesterday.  Actually, it's
    just one chip.  It's version 1.6 and is dated Feb. 1988.  I was
    hoping it would have new sounds, but it doesn't.  But, I'm glad I'm
    current.  Shane didn't charge me a dime for it ...
    
    Steve

    What *do* you get?
    
    Edd (who_could_probably_find_the_answer_by_reading_backwards)
    
                                            
    (.krow t'ndid ti dna taht deirt I, epoN)

    You get a 27512 (if I remembers correctly).  Ironic thing, tho ...
    The old PROM was made by Hitachi, the new one is made by TI.  Maybe
    American PROMs are getting cheaper? ;-)
    
    I had hoped to get new sounds.  What I got was bug fixes.  But,
    it didn't cost me anything, so ...
    
    Steve

RE < Note 761.65 by MIZZOU::SHERMAN "socialism doesn't work ..." >

	Did you install it yourself?

    Shore 'nuff.  T'ain't hard atall.  'Course, you have to take the
    proper precautions to avoid zappin' it ...
    
    Steve

RE < Note 761.67 by MIZZOU::SHERMAN "socialism doesn't work ..." >

	Care to elaborate?  And, I take it, you have voided your warranty?

	Dan

    Naah.  No voiding of warranty.  The PROM inside is stuck in a socket
    - not soldered.  And, the screws have none of that protective gunk
    on them.  A dealer would have done the same thing.  Besides, my
    TZ is more than a year old already, so there might not be any warranty
    to worry about anyway.  The PROM came from Yamaha.  Shane didn't
    charge me partly because Yamaha didn't charge him.
    
    Now, as far as warranty voiding goes, I probably voided the warranty
    by altering my QX5 to have 2 MIDI outs instead of a MIDI-out and
    a MIDI-thru.  Again, the thing's more than a year old ...
    
    Steve

RE ROM upgrade...

	Anyone calling on this upgrade (particularly to Shane at Profound) are
asked to have their serial number handy.  I get the impression Yamaha requires 
it.

	Dan

    Yup.   I had to give Shane the serial number.  But, it's a small
    price to pay ...
    
    Steve

I have an interesting problem with my TX81Z. It goes like this -

I select a voice and play it in the single mode - works fine. I then try to 
use the performance features of the unit and layer or stack the same voice to 
get a fatter sound. The trouble then starts - there is some hesitancy 
introduced into the sound and the unit makes a sound preceding the main sound 
that is much like a hiss or a splat (more graphic images could be used here, 
I'm sure). Even if I reduce the voices in the performance setup to one, I get 
the same results.

If I switch back to play single mode - no problem. Any ideas out there?????

Geoff

RE < Note 761.72 by MCIS2::ROACH >

	I've never noticed that phenomenon on my unit...

    I'd start by checking the EFFECTS parameters (especially the DELAY)
    in both the single voice mode and the performance set-up...
    
    You do realize you're losing polyphony as you stack voices, yes?
    Confusing the voice allocation algorythm could cause a glitch...
    
    ...course, I s'pose you *could* have a bogus machine.
    
    Edd

    FWIW - You have to allow for some hesitance when switching between
    performances.  The current voices will abruptly be silenced and
    there will be about 0.5 seconds before the TZ can respond.  At first
    this may seem like a bug, but I think that Yamaha designed
    the thing having in mind that a user might use a couple of them
    in a system working together.  
    
    Steve

    I got a chance to see the "TZ-QUAD" expansion board for the
    TX81Z recently, after seeing it advertised in Keyboard.
    
    It *quadruples* the available memory in a TZ giving you 4*24
    RAM slots and 4*24 (32?) performance memories. Seems like a
    good idea, especially for people using a TZ in a live situation
    where a performance is set up for each song. Yamaha simply didn't
    provide enough slots...
    
    The UI is, to my mind, a little wierd. The LCD blinks according
    to which bank you're in. (1 blink, bank 1; 2 blinks, bank 2...)
    Other than that, everything seems normal.
    
    The board fits right inside the TZ; no ribbon cables, etc...
    
    It has it's own lithium battery...
    
    For $100, I'll probably buy one. Cheaper than a second TZ. Too
    bad it doesn't increase polyphony....
    
    Edd 

The TX81Z is capable of playing up to 8 individual voices at a time
inside what Yamaha calls a "Performance". Each of these voices is
called an instrument.

In order to assign a patch to an instrument via sys-ex Yamaha requires
that 2 messages be sent, one for the MSB (most significant bit) and one
for the LSB (least significant bit).

The breakdown of the sysex-message is as follows...

  Word 1    Word 2    Word 3    Word 4    Word 5   Word 6  Word 7
   
   $F0       $43       $1c       $10       $pp      $dd     $F7

Word 1: "Here comes a sys-ex!!!" Always $F0.
Word 2: Yamaha I.D. number. Only Yamaha machines are going to respond.
Word 3: MIDI Channel of TX81Z *BASE* channel. First byte is always 1,
        second byte is $0-$F (1 thru 16 with -1 offset). It is important
        to remember that this is the MIDI channel of the *BASE* channel
        of the TZ, which is probably going to be different than any of
        the MIDI channels assigned to the individual instruments contained
        in the performance.
Word 4: Sub-group type. $10 indicates you are addressing PCED (Performance)
        parameters. The manual indicates that this word should be $13, but
        that doesn't work.
Word 5: Parameter. Each instrument in the performance is referenced by it's
        own unique MSB and LSB. The table that follows reflects only instrument
        #1. In order to address instruments 2 - 8, use the following values
        in this word.

                           MSB        LSB

        Instrument 1:      $01        $02  (shown in table to follow)
        Instrument 2:      $0D        $0E
        Instrument 3:      $19        $1A
        Instrument 4:      $25        $26
        Instrument 5:      $31        $32
        Instrument 6:      $3D        $3E
        Instrument 7:      $49        $4A
        Instrument 8:      $55        $56

Word 6: The datum!!
Word 7: EOM. Always $F7.

By sending two sys-ex messages with the appropriate values, you can assign
any patch from any bank to any instrument in a performance.

Practice safe sys-ex.

Edd


                TX81Z Instrument Assignment sys-ex strings.

          (Instrument 1 only. Substitute appropriate value for word
             5 in each string to address other instruments.)


PATCH           MSB                            LSB   

 A-01  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $20 $F7
 A-02  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $21 $F7
 A-03  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $22 $F7
 A-04  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $23 $F7
 A-05  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $24 $F7
 A-06  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $25 $F7
 A-07  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $26 $F7
 A-08  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $27 $F7
 A-09  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $28 $F7
 A-10  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $29 $F7
 A-11  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $2A $F7
 A-12  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $2B $F7
 A-13  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $2C $F7
 A-14  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $2D $F7
 A-15  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $2E $F7
 A-16  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $2F $F7
 A-17  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $30 $F7
 A-18  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $31 $F7
 A-19  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $32 $F7
 A-20  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $33 $F7
 A-21  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $34 $F7
 A-22  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $35 $F7
 A-23  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $36 $F7
 A-24  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $37 $F7
 A-25  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $38 $F7
 A-26  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $39 $F7
 A-27  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $3A $F7
 A-28  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $3B $F7
 A-29  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $3C $F7
 A-30  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $3D $F7
 A-31  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $3E $F7
 A-32  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $3F $F7

 B-01  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $40 $F7
 B-02  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $41 $F7
 B-03  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $42 $F7
 B-04  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $43 $F7
 B-05  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $44 $F7
 B-06  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $45 $F7
 B-07  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $46 $F7
 B-08  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $47 $F7
 B-09  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $48 $F7
 B-10  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $49 $F7
 B-11  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $4A $F7
 B-12  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $4B $F7
 B-13  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $4C $F7
 B-14  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $4D $F7
 B-15  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $4E $F7
 B-16  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $4F $F7
 B-17  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $50 $F7
 B-18  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $51 $F7
 B-19  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $52 $F7
 B-20  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $53 $F7
 B-21  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $54 $F7
 B-22  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $55 $F7
 B-23  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $56 $F7
 B-24  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $57 $F7
 B-25  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $58 $F7
 B-26  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $59 $F7
 B-27  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $5A $F7
 B-28  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $5B $F7
 B-29  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $5C $F7
 B-30  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $5D $F7
 B-31  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $5E $F7
 B-32  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $5F $F7

 C-01  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $60 $F7
 C-02  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $61 $F7
 C-03  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $62 $F7
 C-04  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $63 $F7
 C-05  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $64 $F7
 C-06  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $65 $F7
 C-07  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $66 $F7
 C-08  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $67 $F7
 C-09  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $68 $F7
 C-10  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $69 $F7
 C-11  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $6A $F7
 C-12  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $6B $F7
 C-13  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $6C $F7
 C-14  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $6D $F7
 C-15  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $6E $F7
 C-16  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $6F $F7
 C-17  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $70 $F7
 C-18  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $71 $F7
 C-19  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $72 $F7
 C-20  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $73 $F7
 C-21  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $74 $F7
 C-22  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $75 $F7
 C-23  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $76 $F7
 C-24  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $77 $F7
 C-25  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $78 $F7
 C-26  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $79 $F7
 C-27  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $7A $F7
 C-28  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $7B $F7
 C-29  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $7C $F7
 C-30  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $7D $F7
 C-31  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $7E $F7
 C-32  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $7F $F7

 D-01  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $00 $F7
 D-02  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $01 $F7
 D-03  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $02 $F7
 D-04  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $03 $F7
 D-05  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $04 $F7
 D-06  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $05 $F7
 D-07  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $06 $F7
 D-08  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $07 $F7
 D-09  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $08 $F7
 D-10  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $09 $F7
 D-11  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0A $F7
 D-12  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0B $F7
 D-13  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0C $F7
 D-14  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0D $F7
 D-15  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0E $F7
 D-16  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0F $F7
 D-17  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $10 $F7
 D-18  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $11 $F7
 D-19  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $12 $F7
 D-20  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $13 $F7
 D-21  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $14 $F7
 D-22  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $15 $F7
 D-23  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $16 $F7
 D-24  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $17 $F7
 D-25  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $18 $F7
 D-26  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $19 $F7
 D-27  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1A $F7
 D-28  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1B $F7
 D-29  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1C $F7
 D-30  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1D $F7
 D-31  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1E $F7
 D-32  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $01 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1F $F7

 I-01  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $00 $F7
 I-02  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $01 $F7
 I-03  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $02 $F7
 I-04  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $03 $F7
 I-05  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $04 $F7
 I-06  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $05 $F7
 I-07  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $06 $F7
 I-08  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $07 $F7
 I-09  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $08 $F7
 I-10  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $09 $F7
 I-11  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0A $F7
 I-12  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0B $F7
 I-13  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0C $F7
 I-14  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0D $F7
 I-15  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0E $F7
 I-16  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $0F $F7
 I-17  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $10 $F7
 I-18  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $11 $F7
 I-19  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $12 $F7
 I-20  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $13 $F7
 I-21  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $14 $F7
 I-22  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $15 $F7
 I-23  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $16 $F7
 I-24  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $17 $F7
 I-25  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $18 $F7
 I-26  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $19 $F7
 I-27  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1A $F7
 I-28  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1B $F7
 I-29  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1C $F7
 I-30  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1D $F7
 I-31  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1E $F7
 I-32  $F0 $43 $1c $10 $01 $00 $F7    $F0 $43 $1c $10 $02 $1F $F7

    I am writing a simple patch editor/librarian in HyperCard for my TZ,
    and preparatory to that I am writing another little program that
    converts all those MIDILIB patch banks (832 patches!) from Bulk
    Data Format into simple VCED and ACED format.
    
    This now works except for one thing: the documentation for the VMEM
    dump (page 74) does not show where the operator-enable mask is stored.
    This is parameter 93 in the VCED table (page 72).

    Am I correct in assuming your problem is turning individual ops
    on or off??
    
    Edd

    That is what I am missing: the flags that turn the OPs on and off.
    I know how to do it in VCED; it is parameter 93.  What I am missing
    is how to do it in VMEM.  It does not appear in the chart.

    All the experiments I just finished indicate there is no VMEM parameter
    for operator ON or OFF. In fact, despite the documentation of p.93 in
    the VCED dump, it appears that the operator state is not transmitted
    as part of either an individual or bulk voice dump. To make matters
    even more bizarre, I found it IMPOSSIBLE to save a patch with an
    operator turned off. It's easy enough to turn it off while in edit
    mode, but if you save the patch and then go back to edit mode you'll
    find the operator is turned back on. (At least I did...)
    
    I also did a VCED dump and took it apart. Parameter 93 doesn't show up
    as part of the data. 87-92 show up, even though the TX81Z doesn't use
    them. (The DX21 and the TZ share sys-ex formats. Only the DX knows what
    they mean. (PEG)). The next byte following these was the checksum,
    followed by F7 (EOX).
    
    Have you successfully used p.93 in VCED mode??? Or even seen any
    evidence of it's existance??? Everything I've seen leads me to believe
    it's Yamaha's idea of a joke....
    
    Edd

    I've never used it, as I am just starting on this whole librarian,
    patch loading business.
    
    Maybe we are supposed to just ignore the op-enable mask and if we don't
    want an operator to set its OUT parameter to zero.
    
    (Actually, I run into very few patches that don't use all 4 ops.)
    
    Nothing surprises me any more about the TZs documentation.  It seems
    like there is a major typo every paragraph or so.  Like "ACED" showing
    up as "SCED"; just sloppy typing and evidently no proofreading at all.

    Setting the output level to zero would be how I would do it...
    
    Your experience backs up my own; the operator enable mask doesn't
    exist despite the fact that it's documented.
    
    In all fairness, I've found Yamaha's documentation to be pretty 
    good. (I'm working on an Ultrix system so consider the source.)
    There are typos and inaccuracies, but I've always been able to get
    enough info out of the doc-set to at least prove the error...
    
    Edd

    From USENET.  For those who know how to ftp, here's a source of patches
    for the TX81Z and DX11.
    						Brian
    
Path: ryn.mro4.dec.com!nntpd.lkg.dec.com!news.crl.dec.com!deccrl!bloom-beacon
    !snorkelwacker.mit.edu!hsdndev!wupost!sdd.hp.com!hplabs!hpfcso!hplvec!sutula
From: [email protected] (Bryan Sutula)
Subject: DX11/TX81Z voice patches now available
Date: 13 Sep 91 18:08:29 GMT
 
I have  finished  the archive of  TX81Z/DX11  voice  patches I have been
assembling, and just put it on an anonymous ftp machine.
 
If you want the collection,  which is now over 2000 voices, you can find
it on  louie.udel.edu,  under  pub/midi/patches/TX81Z.  Read the  README
file, and don't forget to ftp the compressed  files and DOS  executables
in binary mode.
 
I will  try to  answer  questions  and  help  with  problems  as my time
permits.  Right now, it's pretty scarce!
 
--
Bryan Sutula
[email protected]

    Since a compressor is still on my wish-list, I'm constantly running
    a battle with levels vs. dynamics.
    
    I've recently started compressing my patches. It's easy. Simply lower
    the KEY-VELO value for all the CARRIERS. Your patches will still take
    on overtones as the modulators respond to the velocity, but the needles
    on your VU meters won't be bent everytime you hit velo 127.
    
    Edd