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Conference napalm::commusic_v1

Title:* * Computer Music, MIDI, and Related Topics * *
Notice:Conference has been write-locked. Use new version.
Moderator:DYPSS1::SCHAFER
Created:Thu Feb 20 1986
Last Modified:Mon Aug 29 1994
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2852
Total number of notes:33157

256.0. "Roland Octapad Review" by SIVA::FEHSKENS () Wed Feb 26 1986 14:50

The Roland Octapad (PAD-8 is the official model number) is now real and
generally available.  It lists for about $550.  And it works! Real good!

The Octapad is an 8 pad MIDI drum module controller.  I.e., it takes
a trigger signal from a drum pad and turns it into a MIDI note on/note 
off pair, or a MIDI program change command.  These MIDI commands can 
be sent to ANY MIDI-compatible device (synth, sequencer, drum machine,
etc.), although the Octapad is primarily designed to play (i.e., trigger)
MIDI drum machines.

The PAD-8 is 13" deep, 20 1/4" wide, and 2 1/2" thick.  It requires 
another 2 1/2" behind it for cable access.  It's relatively lightweight
and very portable, but it can't really be played on your lap - it 
should be mounted on a stand of some sort.  Unfortunately, it's too 
deep to fit comfortably on a standard 14" "Buck Rogers" basket type of 
snare stand - you can make it work by just resting it on such a stand 
with the support arms almost flat, but it's just resting there rather 
than being securely affixed to the stand.  Roland offers an "all purpose
clamp set" (APC-66) option, but I haven't seen this and don't know 
what it does.

The playing pads themselves are fairly small - 3 5/8" wide by 4 3/8"
high (depth dimension); this is a little bigger than a regulation size
playing card.  The pads are arrayed as two rows of 4.  They are surfaced
with a shiny black mylar-like material that has a good feel when played 
with sticks.  The pads are quieter than old style (pre-SDS-9) Simmons
pads, and show no visible signs of having been played on after quite a 
bit of thrashing.  The pads are EXTREMELY well isolated; even though 
their edges are separated by only 1/8" (there's also a 3/16" wide 
black rubber-like gasket around each), there is NO interaction at all
between adjacent pads.  You can even hit the silver plastic case without
triggering anything (not recommended as a regular thing - it's one of
these modern "engineering" plastics, and it's pretty impact resistant,
but I don't know how much abuse it, unlike the pads, can take).  Hitting
the black rubber gasket WILL trigger the enclosed pad.  The pads, though
small, are big enough that any competent drummer can play "around the 
pads" with no trouble.

OK, now to the interesting stuff.  Each pad can be separately programmed
with the following 6 parameters:

	1) MIDI channel (yes, each pad can send on a different channel)
	   All 16 channels are available.
	2) note number sent when pad is struck; MIDI note numbers 0 - 99
	   are available.
	3) sensitivity - determines what velocity is sent with the note
	   on command, as a function of how hard you hit the pad.
	   Values are on an arbitrary scale of 1 - 16.  Yes, the pads 
	   are dynamics sensitive.
	4) curve - determines the dynamic range of the pad.  Values are
	   on an arbitrary scale of 1 - 5.  1 means full dynamics, 5 
	   means no dynamics.
	5) minimum velocity - determines the minimum velocity sent 
	   with note ons, regardless of how softly you hit the pad.
	   Values available from 0 - 64, which I believe correspond to 
	   actual MIDI velocities.
	6) gate time - determines how long after the note on is sent 
	   that the corresponding note off is sent.  Values are on an
	   arbitrary scale of 1 - 60.  1 is very short; driving a 
	   synth, this produces a staccato effect.  60 is fairly long
	   (around 5 seconds? - I should have calibrated this parameter).
	   (NOTE - the PAD-8 sends a note on with 0 velocity for note 
	   off.  This is in fact defined in the MIDI spec, but some 
	   early MIDI implementations don't interpret this correctly.
	   Not a problem with anything designed recently.)

Not much more you could want out of a pad interface!  The only thing I 
could ask for is a way to sync the gate time to a MIDI clock, so you 
could specify the gate time as some multiple of 16th notes, and 
optionally time correct your playing.  Picky, picky.

But wait, there's still more!  In the back are inputs for 6 more pads!
Any kind of pads!  Like Simmons pads, or DDR-30 pads.  The PAD-8 will
remember the above 6 parameters for these 6 pads as well!

But wait, there's STILL MORE!!  If 14 pads aren't enough, you can gang 
two PAD-8s together (it has a MIDI in specifically, and only, for this
purpose) to control up to 28 separate instruments/voices!

But wait, there's EVEN MORE!!!  You can remember 4 different configurations
of these 6 parameters for these 14 pads, and retrieve them by touching 
a button, or serially by stepping on a footswitch.

Unfortunately, there's no way to save this state via MIDI system 
exclusive, tape or a cartridge.  Unfortunate, because that's 14 (pads) *
6 (parameters per pad) * 4 (pad configurations, or patch presets as they
call them), or 336 parameters.  Actually there's 338, because there are
2 global parameters - the MIDI channel that program change commands are 
sent on, and the program "bank" part of the program change number (the
high order 4 bits of the program change number).

Programming the PAD-8 is almost straightforward, but like so many of 
these gadgets the user interface has some warts.  There's a switch on
the back that puts it in "edit mode".  You can only edit in one patch/
configuration at a time - to go to edit a different configuration (they're
labeled "a", "b", "c" and "d") you have to get out of edit mode (i.e., 
flip the switch in the back), select the patch you want (via a front 
panel button) and go back into edit mode.  While you're editing 
there's no indication of which patch you're working on.

The default edit mode is "global", which simultaneously changes the 
selected parameter for all pads, except that "note number" is never
globally set.  If you take full advantage of all of the capabilities 
of the PAD-8, you will find this a pain, as it's too easy to trash
individual pad parameter values by forgetting you're in global mode.
To edit in "individual" mode you hold down the MIDI channel button
(obvious, isn't it?) while flipping the edit switch on.  You select the
pad of interest by hitting it; you select the parameter you want to
change by pushing a labeled button (i.e., there's one for MIDI channel,
note number, sensitivity and curve).  There's no button labeled
minimum velocity or gate time - you select those parameters with the
patch select buttons labeled "a" and "b".  Similarly the parameter you
are currently editing is identified by labeled LEDs, except there's no
labeled LED for minimum velocity and gate time; when selected, they 
light up MIDI channel and note number lights at the same time for 
minimum velocity, or both sensitivity and curve for gate time.  As I 
said, obvious.

The current parameter value for the selected pad is displayed in a two 
digit LED numeric display.  While editing this display is said to "blink";
actually what it does is flicker somewhat subtly.  At least the digits 
are big - the display is about 1" high.   Parameter values are
adjusted by up and down buttons; to take big steps, you hold down one 
button (the direction you want to go) and then push the other button.
The PAD-8 sends commands in edit mode so you can hear the effect of
your parameter changes by hitting the pad as you change the parameter
value.

The routine for specifying the two global program change parameters is
similar, except you need a footswitch to tell the PAD-8 you want to talk
about program change stuff rather than pad stuff.  With the switch down
in edit mode, the MIDI channel button selects the MIDI channel for
program change commands, again using the up/down buttons.  The high 
order 4 bits of the program change number to be sent are set by going 
into edit mode with footswitch down, but without hitting the MIDI 
channel button; then the up/down buttons control the bank number, 
displayed in the numeric LEDs as 1 - 8 and using two of the LED 
indicators to indicate the high order bit (0 or 1) of the program 
change number.  You actually send a program change by getting out of 
edit mode, standing on the program change footswitch and hitting a pad.
The 8 pads supply the last 3 bits of the program change number, with
values 1 - 4 across the top row and 5 - 8 across the bottom row.  The
external pads overlap values 1 - 6.

The PAD-8 is AC powered, but by an external power supply.  This is one 
of those classic little black boxes, but it's got a 6 foot power cord 
going into the little black cube rather than the tines being built 
into the cube.  This is a really nice feature that I hope catches on -
it makes it possible to plug it into a power strip without using up two
plug positions.  There's no battery power, but there must be one of 
those damn Lithium batteries inside powering the memory.  When the 
battery finally dies, I hope you've written down all your parameter
values someplace.

The PAD-8 comes preprogrammed to drive a Roland TR-707, TR-727 or
TR-909.  I quickly reprogrammed mine to drive the tympani sample in
my MIDIbass.  Having access to 8 tympani in 1 1/2 square feet is
neat!  It's also ideal for driving a synth with tuned percussion voices
(e.g., marimba or xylophone).  An Octapad, one of the new electronic
bass drum trigger pedals (which don't need a pad as the triggering
element is built into the pedal) and a drum machine makes a truly 
incredible sounding yet portable-with-two-hands electronic drum kit.

Overall, I think this is an exceptionally capable MIDI controller.
It's few deficiencies are magnified by how good it is already.  It would
have been nice if the case had a place to rest a pair of drumsticks
(you really can't play it with your hands - you have to hit the pads hard
enough to hurt to get a response, even at maximum sensitivity), and
if the user interface were wart-free and the whole thing fit readily 
on a standard snare drum stand.  Otherwise this piece of gear represents
Roland at its BEST!
T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name		DateLines
256.1True...true...MOSAIC::SAVAGEThu Feb 27 1986 12:338
    I have an Octapad and I also think it really a great device. Roland
    never ceases to amaze and delight, eh?
    
    I also have to say that you "give great review". Buy more things
    and tell us about them :^)
    
    Dennis
256.2All I Need is $ERLANG::FEHSKENSThu Feb 27 1986 16:304
    I'd be happy to buy more things just to review them if you'd supply
    the $!  ;-)

    len.
256.3WOWMIDAS::RHODESFri Feb 28 1986 18:237
    
    
    This industry never ceases to amaze me.  Looks like I'm an obsolete
    drummer again this week...  :-)
    
    Rhodes.
256.4Technology Never Obsoletes MusiciansERLANG::FEHSKENSMon Mar 03 1986 09:4310
    re .3 - why do you say that?  I still love my acoustic Ludwig 7
    piece set - good as the sounds in the DDR-3 are, and nifty as the PAD-8
    is, they still can't beat the sound and feel of a real kit.  The
    main appeal of this new stuff is mainly its portability and the
    opportunity to practice usefully without inciting your neighbors
    and housemates to nuke you.  And electronics STILL can't TOUCH real
    cymbals!
    
    len.
256.5octapad/707 capabilitiesMENTOR::COMMWed Mar 19 1986 14:075
when you have the octopad connected to the roland 707, into a roland
    juno 2, and you program the 8pad say for examp, a gong.
now.. when you program the 707 for a basic beat and as its running,
    strike the 8pad, will the 707 sequence that voice from the 8pad
    and play it along with the sequenced beat??????
256.6NoERLANG::FEHSKENSWed Mar 19 1986 16:2925
    I think what you're asking is "can I program a TR-707 in real time
    from an Octapad".

    The answer to that question is an unequivocal "NO", and it's the
    TR-707's limitation; it can't be programmed over its MIDI in,
    it can only play what comes in on its MIDI in.  Nor will a 707
    output the MIDI equivalent of an internal sequence over its
    MIDI out.  A 707 will only remember what it's been told via its
    front panel buttons, either in step mode or real time mode. When
    it's playing an internal track, the only thing that goes out on the
    MIDI out is timing information.  Otherwise, you could route the 707's
    MIDI out to a MIDI sequencer with overdub capability, and then overdub
    from the Octapad.  Everybody I know who's got a 707 and isn't
    comfortable with step mode programming wants to program it from
    pads, and there's just no way to do that.  Sorry.  You give up a
    little for the convenience of an integrated unit, although this
    looks like a major oversight on Roland's part.  I'll bet their next
    drum machine (not the 505, which is just a cheap 707/727 hybrid)
    fixes this, and it's due.
    
    You can get what you want from an MC-500/DDR-30 combination, but
    that's $2K worth of hardware!
    
    len.
256.7TR707 and MIDI outRSTS32::DBMILLERFormerly GROK::MILLERWed Mar 19 1986 17:0010
    The TR707 and TR727 have two playback modes.  The normal mode is
    to sound the voices internally, and to output MIDI clock signals.
    The second is to not reproduce sounds, but to instead send
    MIDI note on/off info as well as the clock signals.  This
    means you could program the 707 to play the Octopad, but it's
    an all or nothing affair - you can't play some voices internally
    and some not.  I wish it could do both at the same time, as then
    you could program the hand clap/tambourine to play the gong, and
    then turn the individual volume control down so that the sound
    really wouldn't play.
256.8What do you mean??RAINBO::SAVAGEWed Mar 19 1986 17:4223
    I'm not sure quite what you mean but I think the answer is no.
    
    The Octapad has an output that can be used to drive a midi input.
    
    A midi splitter (thru) can make it drive a 707 and a juno 2. If
    the juno 2 has midi thru the ocatapad can drive the input of the
    juno 2 and the input of the 707 can be hooked to the thru of the
    juno 2. The pad will then actuate the midi numbers the pads are
    set for. If the juno 2 is set to make a gong sound it will work.
    
    If you are asking if the 707 will pick this up as a part of it's
    programmed sequence and send it to the juno 2 the answer is no.
    Sort of. You can make the 707 trigger the gong sounds on the juno
    but you will not be able to get the 707 internal voices to work
    at the same time. Whenever the 707 is putting out midi note information
    these voices quit making any sound.
    
    Does this answer it for you?
    
    Dennis Savage
256.9How Do You do It?ERLANG::FEHSKENSThu Mar 20 1986 11:1610
    How do you get a 707/727 into this second mode, where it doesn't
    make any sounds but sends the internal sequence over its MIDI out,
    encoded as note ons/offs for the note numbers mapped to the voices?
    As I mentioned in my original reply, if you could do this, you could
    dump the 707/727's sequence to a MIDI sequencer with overdub
    capability, then overdub from the Octapad, driving the 707/727 and
    Juno from the sequencer, on different channels.

    len.
256.10707 MIDI notes outRSTS32::DBMILLERFormerly GROK::MILLERThu Mar 20 1986 11:3818
    In Track Play mode, you hold the Shift Key down, and then press
    the MIDI channel button followed by the Instrument guide button.
    Each time this is done, the 707 will alternate between making
    the sounds, or sending MIDI notes.
    
    Sorry about the comment about driving the Octopad from the 707,
    I got messed up.  Recording the 707 sequence and playing it
    back using the sequencer will work fine.  In fact, you may not
    need separate channels depending on what you want to play on the
    106.  The 707 can be set up to respond to any note you want for
    each voice, or you can use the factory presets.  The 727 has its
    factory presets in a different range than the 707, and I have
    driven both of them from a computer while they were on the same
    channel.  Any note not in the machine's range is ignored.  If
    the 106 has it's own range, then you may be able to set up the 
    two to work on the same channel.
    
    -Dave
256.11Where's that famous Japanese attention to detail?CTHULU::YERAZUNISSnowstorm CanoeistMon Mar 07 1988 11:5429
    I brought my brand-new Octapad and the HR-16 to a rehearsal.
    Everything's cool, till I attach the mounting post and clamp.  Then the
    top two pads go dead.  Inert.  ZERO. 
    	
    Take clamp off.  Still dead.  Take out the four allen screws that
    hold the mounting post.  Pads are back.  OK, put the screws in-
    but don't turn them. Pads still OK. Turn them in... and as soon
    as they start to snug up, the pad directly above each of the screws
    goes dead.
    	
    Since there were only 364 days left on the warranty :-) I decided
    to find out WHAT was broken (and hopefully salvage some of the
    rehearsal. You know, the show must go on, ha ha ha)
    	
    I pulled the back and sure enough, two of the ten (not eight, ten)
    transducer wires were pinched through the insulation by the case  
    screw mounts.  Four inches of electrical tape cured the problem.
    
    Why ten transducers instead of eight (one per pad)?  Well, all eight
    pads mount to a steel plate with through holes for the per-pad
    transducers. Two extra transducers mount directly to the steel.
    I suppose the extra transducers are used to get some measure of
    the transferred-shock (to back-compensate and avoid cross-triggering)
                                                       
    Other than that, it's well built.  Looks like they expected people
    to bash on the thing. :-)
    
    	-Bill Yerazunis
256.12HPSMEG::LEITZnam daed no em nruTMon Mar 07 1988 12:0912
re: .11 

Gee, I guess the 'coin toss' did me a service: I banged on -my-
brand new octapad all weekend for about 48 hours straight playing
with everything I could find worth trying on my HR16...

I experienced only one problem: one of the four rubber strips used for 
feet on the bottom of the pad housing fell off somewhere...
                       ...but i'll live with it!
;-)

[the octapad is grrrreat!]
256.13HR-16 cliche for sale....JAWS::COTEPortamento:== Red Thing In An OliveMon Mar 07 1988 12:258
    Tell me it's not so!!!
    
    Tell me it's not true that Butch "So You can program a box - Big
    Deal" Leitz got an Hr-16 before I did...
    
    I hang my head in shame...
    
    Edd
256.14HPSTEK::RHODESTue Mar 08 1988 09:007
Congrats, Butch.

The extra sensor(s) used to measure and reduce crosstalk is a *very* 
clever idea indeed.

Todd.
256.15Auggghhghghgh - I've been hit!CTHULU::YERAZUNISHiding from the Turing PoliceMon Mar 14 1988 21:2921
    Two pieces of RBD� in the Octapad.  Both have to do with "change
    patch" functionality.
    	
    1) The channel that "patch change" is transmitted on is NOT saved
    on a per-layout basis (i.e. there is only one channel, shared among
    patches A, B, C, and D).  In fact, it isn't saved in non-volatile
    RAM at all- it returns to a "1" on power-cycling.
    	
    2) Likewise, "bank number" is not saved on a per-layout basis, 
    nor across power-cycles.  
    	
    
    	                      
    -Bill
    
    
    �RBD: Roland Brain Damage.  Taking a wonderful feature and adding
    another wonderful feature in such a way as to render both wonderful
    features negatively useful.
256.16Blasticks do not mix with Octapads.MIDEVL::YERAZUNISHiding from the Turing PoliceTue Apr 05 1988 14:0013
    John Arnold lent me a pair of Blasticks to try on the Octapad.
    
    The result is that Blasticks on an Octapad/HR-16 are INEFFECTIVE.
    The Blasticks are too soft and gentle to get good triggering and
    the HR-16 can't really use the multiple hits to good effect.
    
    Blasticks _are_ effective in brushing off dried milkshake from denim,
    however...
    	
    (for those who don't know- Blasticks are plastic drum-brushes. 
    There are about 20 thin nylon rods, about 1/8" dia x 10" long, set in
    wood handles.  They make a nice gentle hit on cymbals and snares.)
256.17An Old Familiar ProblemDRUMS::FEHSKENSTue Apr 05 1988 15:2021
    re .16 - the concept's interesting (triggering a drum synth with
    something brushlike to provide a whole slew of triggers in a short
    time period; assuming that's what you were after) but it's not likely
    to work with any drum synth, so it's not really the HR-16's fault.
    Or the Octapad's, for that matter; pad isolation and resistance
    to spurious triggering from ambient noise apparently dictated the
    Octapad's design to be struck with real sticks.  For example, it
    can't be effectively played with the bare hands/fingers, at least
    not without eventually hurting yourself.
    
    Anyway, the problem with the HR-16 and all other drum synths I am
    aware of (except maybe the Korg DDD-1/5 and DRM-1, which implement
    a partial solution) is the "envelope reset" phenonmenon.  Real
    drums don't squelch any "in progress" vibration each time they're
    struck; whatever decay is in progress continues, and somewhat
    modifies the drum's response to successive strikes.  This is why
    tight rolls on a drum machine don't sound like the real thing, and
    why drum machine cymbals sound so little like the real thing when
    played like the real thing.
                   
    len.
256.18Blasticks rationale...AITG::ARNOLDBack from Brown University (sort of)Tue Apr 05 1988 17:0327
    My thanks to Bill for trying the Blasticks on the Octapad and Len
    for the analysis.  In my mind, the multiple triggering would have
    been a nice but unexpected bonus.  Primarily, I've been considering
    an Octapad-ish setup to complement the acoustic drums I've got in
    my basement.
    
    On the "real" drums, I find that the Blasticks reduce the volume a
    little (to me, that's good) and provide an interesting sound to the
    drums and cymbals.  One of the things I wanted to know is whether I
    could effectively play an Octapad with them while playing some of the
    part on the kit.  I guess the answer is no. 
    
    Of course, miking the drum kit in an acoustically "live" basement
    would be a problem regardless of the outcome of the
    Blasticks-on-the-Octapad experiment.  I'll keep scheming!
    
    - John -
    
    P.S.  I'm hoping to become a more active COMMUSICian again now that
    	  my Master's thesis is almost done.  On my list of things-to-do
    	  are reviews of COMMUSIC I-IV (yes, COMMUSIC I came out just before
    	  I left for school and still sits patiently waiting for me
    	  to review it).  In the meantime, let me put in a plug for
    	  the Graduate Engineering Education Program (GEEP).  If you're
	  interested in that sort of thing, it's worth checking out (even
    	  though it does cut into your free time for music).  Now, where did
    	  I leave my guitars?  I think they're over here...
256.19What's a reasonable price these daysDREGS::BLICKSTEINYo!Fri Feb 03 1989 11:346
    Can anyone give me a good idea on what a used Pad-8 with the clamp
    and a stand should run?
    
    This information is needed ASAP.
    
    	db
256.20umm, sAAy, Dave...HPSMEG::LEITZbang a gongTue Feb 14 1989 12:4616
 I'm just catching up on my notes.
 Wha'd you find out?
 I bet you found out the same thing I did when I was looking for
  these & ended up with a new one: good luck finding one used. I've
  never (NEVER) seen one for sale used, Daddy's, want-ads, anywhere.
 If you found one (find one), a good price will depend on what you 
  consider a good price, since: you never see them for sale used. (!)
 I would consider 300 a great price. 400 an ok price. other than that,
  just buy a new one for 500 (or so). (If you find one cheaper than
  300, X-L-ENT!)

	(or buy mine for 600 so i can buy the new pad8� for 700! ;-) )

ps, get the store to throw in the mounting post hardware. a universal
    2 joint clamp will run you 15 to 20. Then mount it on any old stand
    that will support the weight (cymbal stand, maybe).
256.21Daddy's had(has) oneNORGE::CHADIch glaube Ich t�te Ich h�tteTue Feb 14 1989 13:444
Daaddy's Nashua has one used for $379.  (At least they did last week).

chad
256.22Lotsa used ones aroundDREGS::BLICKSTEINSo What? BEEG Deal!Tue Feb 14 1989 14:154
    Daddy's gets em in used pretty regularly.  They generally go for
    about $370 or so.
    
    	db
256.23Pad-80/E-Pedal...some dayHPSRAD::NORCROSSSLIM !!Tue Feb 14 1989 17:4218
EU Wurlies, Boston, was going to  give  me  a  new  Pad-80  for  $590 on
     Saturday...but the one that they thought was new turned out to be a
     demo unit that found its way back into a box and onto the shelf.  I
     turned it down since I didn't want a used one.

Also, I saw a sign in Sam Ash, Queens N.Y.:  Pad-80's for $600.  (That's
     the price that Wurlies was beating for me).

-------
While I  was  at  Wurlies,  I  looked  at  the "E-Pedal" manufactured by
     "Electronic Percussion" (I think).    This  is  a  bass-pedal which
     doesn't have a "pad-hitter".  Instead of hitting a pad, it just has
     a  velocity  sensitive  switch under the  pedal.    The  action  is
     adjustable with springs.  I was going to buy one of these for about
     $200 along with the Pad-80.  I thought  that  it  expensive  for  a
     silly switch, but that it was build sturdy and had a good feel.

/Mitch
256.24yowie-wowie. 590?!?!?HPSMEG::LEITZkumquat, drum squatWed Feb 15 1989 08:305
	WOW, 590 for the -80!

	Man - I gotta start thinkin' serious
	about snaggin' the -80. Great!!!!
256.25Pad-8/Pad-80 questions...XERO::ARNOLDConformance Driveway really exists!Mon Jun 12 1989 10:4338
    I was reviewing the original Pad-8 review (256.0) and what I could
    remember about the Pad-80 and have the following questions:

    (1)  The Pad-8 review states that the Octapad (I) limited note numbers
    	 to 0-99 (probably due to the 2-digit display).  Is this a
    	 limitation?  If so, does the Pad-80	 (Octapad II) retain this
    	 limitation?

    	 Reason for asking:  Kurzweil PX-A sound block spreads sounds over
    	 88 keys and the sound<->key mapping can't be changed.  I can't
    	 recall what the note numbers of a standard 88-key keyboard are but
    	 if they extend beyond 99, some of the sounds would be inaccessible.

    (2)	 Can the Pad-80 be set up to have 2 (or more) note-ons sent out
    	 from 1 hit.  I recall reading that depending on velocity,
    	 different note numbers could be sent (stacking sounds on 1 pad)
    	 but don't recall the ability to stack notes on a single hit.

    	 Reason for asking:  Some of the Kurzweil's drum sounds appear
    	 better, fatter, etc. if you play (for instance) 2 snares at once. 
    	 (By the way, the Kurzweil drum soundfile has NO interaction
    	 between any sounds.  Thus, the obvious limitation is that playing
    	 a closed hi-hat does NOT truncate an open or semi-open sound still
    	 active.  As noted elsewhere in the conference, any "real" drum
    	 machine would probably include this feature.  Oh well.)

    (3)	Does the Pad-80 have the "hi-hat" feature like the PAD-4 (or
    	whatever that single-pad Roland product is that contains MIDI brain
    	and can take up to 3 extra pads hanging off of it) in which the MIDI
    	note sent is determined by the status of a footswitch?  With this
    	mode, one can play a hi-hat sound on the same pad alternating
    	between open/closed depending on the switch.  I'd find this more
    	natural than using multiple pads or a velocity crossover, I think.

    Thanks for any help you can give me as I decide whether to look for a
    used Pad-8 or a used/new Pad-80.

    - John -
256.26Piano Keyboard's Note NumbersDRUMS::FEHSKENSMon Jun 12 1989 14:0018
    I can answer a few of your questions:
    
    The lowest note on a piano keyboard (the low A) is MIDI note # 20.
    The highest note (on a piano keyboard) is thus 107.  Middle C is
    MIDI note 60.  The octapad's ability to invoke note #s 0 - 20 is
    thus not terribly useful, unless your drum machine uses these note
    numbers to move certain drum sounds "out of the way" of more useful
    pitched sounds being accessed over the same MIDI channel.  The
    octapad's inability to generate note #s 100 - 127 is probably in
    practice not a serious limitation; note #s 108 - 127 are beyond
    the end of the piano keyboard.  The octapad won't let you get at
    8 of the notes (#s 100 - 107) that the PX-A generates.
    
    The octapad does have a "hihat switch" capability.  I don't know
    about the "pad-4".
    
    len.
256.27pad-8 EZ chartsHPSMEG::LEITZbutch leitzFri Jul 07 1989 14:53555
%!                      note: delete the NOTES header up to this line!
%!
%! When you print this POSTSCRIPT file, you'll get 
%! 4 charts, 1 for each bank of an Octapad (Pad-8). (Actually I cheated
%! and appended 1 chart 4 times to one file).
%! 
%! I've used these charts to map what assignments I had going where
%! (to HR16s, D50s, other midi places). They're convenient (for me)
%! and have proved their worth in the couple months I've been using
%! them - a battery died on an octapad I had been using, and I could
%! refer to the charts to reset a couple of the banks exactly the
%! way I had them without having to run around looking at note values
%! and voice assignments on all the SGUs.
%! 
%! If you print to an LPS40 or LN03R with the following print statements,
%! you'll be golden:
%! 
%!    PRINT /QUE=<your$LPS40$queue> /PARAM=(DATA=POST,NUMBER=4)
%! or
%!    PRINT /QUE=<your$LN03$queue>  /PARAM=(DATA=PS,NUMBER=4)
%!
%! These charts can be elaborated easy enough for a PAD-80...but I
%! don't have one (yet!) - so if you have any suggestions, send me mail.
%!
%! Butch Leitz,  7-JUL-1989 13:45:04.72
%!
%!
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%%Trailer
256.28GREAT IS THE ONLY WORD I FOUND !!!TDCIS3::RENOUVELThu Jan 25 1990 06:3411
    GREAT GREAT GREAT I'VE PRINTED YOUR FILE YESTERDAY EVENING,AND I
    REALLY THINK THAT YOUR IDEA IS GREAT .
    
    COULD SOMEBODY EXPLAIN ME HOW TO DO TO CHANGE THE OCTAPAD PATCHES,
    FROM THE ATARI RUNNING CUBASE ?
                                                                     #
    THANKS FOR YOUR ANSWERS.
    
    REGARDS AND LATER ON.
    
    PAT.
256.29Wanted: Cheap FootpedalHPSRAD::NORCROSSUpon the wind of changeWed Mar 14 1990 12:414
Wanted:   Inexpensive (<$70) solution to trigger foot/kick pedal input of
an Octapad (PAD-8). Velocity sensitivity not required.

/Mitch