Conference kaosws::canada

Ok, I'll byte.  This will turn into another French/English confrontation but here
it comes.

There is no doubt in my mind that that was a racist comment among the other
degrading comments he's made in the past.  He refers to the "good language" as
opposed to the "bad language"?  Make no assumptions, we know what languages he's
referring to.

Re: Bourassa making racist comments.  Please elaborate.  What comments were they?
Making racist comments is one thing, passing a law in favour of preserving the
French language is another.  BTW, I do disagree with Quebec's language laws but
I have never heard Bourassa make a racist comment.  If anything, he's trying to
find the right balance between the preservation of French and respect for human
rights by trying to change Quebec's language laws as we speak.

In any case, legislating is useless in my mind.  Don Cherry appears as though he's
only looking for attention and trying to get more people to listen to his show.
He lost all the credibility he had in my mind when he stated on television that
a fist fight in the NHL is OK once in a while and it's OK for young
kids to fight sometimes.  "Every kid does it" as he puts it.

Among Cherry's other comments:

	"The Quebec Nordiques should move the team out of the province because
	 they don't sing the national anthem in English there."

	Refering to good performance from a Newfoundlander player in the Junior 
	World championships a couple of years back.  "Way to go Newfoundland.
	Way to go Clyde Wells for opposing Meech Lake."
	Political comments like that don't belong in sports in my opinion whether
	I agree or disagree with them.

I hate the guy but I still watch him on Coach's corner.  His strategy is working.

/Mario

    Gary Gary Gary, don't you know by now that the Francophones can outlaw
    our language, stamp on the Canadian flag, prevent out of province
    trades people from working in Quebec, move Government agencies into
    Quebec against all common sense...and so on. and it is OK ?
    
     However if the shoe is put on the other foot, it is an outrage!
    
     Having said that, Don's comments were way out of line. He was
    expressing a sentiment (poorly mind you) that the ROC is exasperated
    with Quebec, and is no longer going to quietly put up with spoiled brat
    province of Canada. I suggest Quebec gets used to it, because there is
    alot of anger towards that province out here in the ROC. Just today
    Ottawa Regional council has started a debate over refusing to accept
    bids from Quebec companies. I expect Quebec to be upset, but since they
    have been doing it for years, it should be expected. What half baked
    thought processes are they useing that would expect to be able to
    refuse out of province trades, and expect to be able to work in the
    same provinces that they ban from working in Quebec ?
    
    			GET REAL !!!
    
    							Derek

    I don't think cherry said "the good language".  As I recall, it was
    more like he loved the Sault, "...and you know why," with a significant
    look at Mclean, who nodded, and may have said domething about language.
    
    I thought it was out of line, but Cherry's Cherry.  If some politician
    wants to make an issue of it, he or she is a fool.
    
    -Stephen

    I'm not asking if Cherry was "out if line" or if you agree with him or
    not.
    
    With respect to Bourassa (and others) - Cherry was promoting one language 
    over another and Bourassa does the same thing, and carries it further
    by using the power he has to pass laws that go way beyond uttering an 
    opinion.
    
    If Cherry (or anyone else) makes his language preference known and that
    statement is considered racist (and by association, the person),
    shouldn't logic dictate that anyone who makes their preference known be
    considered racist, and be similarly dealt with (censored etc.)?
    
    Again, I'm not arguing whether Cherry (or Bourassa) is right or wrong,
    and I'm not "taking sides".  This is a simple question of logic...
    
    Lockyer
                                                                   

Cherry is a sports figure.
Bourassa is a politician.

Issues relating to Hockey belong to hockey figures.
Issues relating to politics belong to political figures.

Need I say more?

Cherry has no business getting involved in politics.

Re:

>    With respect to Bourassa (and others) - Cherry was promoting one language 
>    over another and Bourassa does the same thing, and carries it further
>    by using the power he has to pass laws that go way beyond uttering an 
>    opinion.

Bourassa was democratically elected to *pass laws*.  Somehow, I don't think
Cherry was hired to promote his political views on Hockey fans.

Re:

>    If Cherry (or anyone else) makes his language preference known and that
>    statement is considered racist (and by association, the person),
>    shouldn't logic dictate that anyone who makes their preference known be
>    considered racist, and be similarly dealt with (censored etc.)?

What language you prefer has nothing to do with being a racist.  I prefer
French as I'm sure most unilingual anglos prefer English.  We are not
necessarily racists because of it.  However, making racist comments has 
everything to do with racism.  If the line "the good language" was used then
that's racist.  Logic dictates.

/Mario

    Mario,
    
    An MP wants Cherry censored because of the supposedly racist comments
    Cherry made last Monday night, not anything he may have said previously. 
    What is racist about what he said on Monday?  If Cherry had said
    "French is the good language", would that be racist?
    
    Garry

"French is the good language"

	IS RACIST.

"Jewish is the right religion"

	IS RACIST

"Black skin is the wrong colour"

	IS RACIST

Re:

> Sounds like: "I don't like it, so it must be racist!"

Sorry Garry, you've got the wrong guy.

/Mario

    Mario,
    
    IF
    >>"French is the good language"
    >>        IS RACIST.
    
    Then how can the systematic suppression of all languages (except of
    course the "good" language) to promote another language not be racist ?
    
    							Derek.

    Mario, you are very brave.
    
    I am not biting.
    
    Firstly, even by Gary's own admission, it is *not* an accurate quote.
    So... who knows what Don Cherry said, or meant to say.
    
    Secondly, this string has nothing to do what Don Cherry said.  Note
    .0 is simple bear-baiting for bringing up Qu�bec's language laws.
    
    The subject is called "Don Cherry, Racism and Language", yet I suspect
    very little will be discussed about Don Cherry and his alleged racist
    comments.  Much more will be said about Qu�bec Liberal Language
    Policies.
    
    Normand Cardella 
    

    Hey Normand, can we stick to the discussion and not assume that there's
    any hidden agenda or ulterior motives...
    
    You are correct that I can not recall exactly what Cherry said or the exact
    words that the CBC News folks used.  In any event, I do not believe
    (ie. I did not hear him say it myself and the CBS News item did not
    quote him as saying it) Cherry uttered the word "French", nor do I believe 
    he put down French.  He merely made a comment in support of the use of 
    English in SS Marie.  Does a statement of support for a language make
    you a racist, unfit for employment and/or warrant censoring?
    
    Mario:  Let's assume that I agree with you about what is a racist
    statement.  Wouldn't you agree that there are many people besides Don
    Cherry who say similar things and are therefore racist?  Aren't some of
    those people in public office?  What's worse, a racist sports
    commentator or a racist politician?  Who should be censored first?
    
    Regards,
    
    Garry
             

I'm referring to quotes Derek, like the one Don Cherry is alleged to have said.

I've never heard Bourassa ever say any such things.  If you're asking me to
admit that the Quebec government's policies appear to be racist then you've got
it out of me.  They are.  But the Quebec government is changing it's policies
as we all know.  >60% of the French population agree that we should allow
bilingual signs.

Going back to the original topic of discussion:

>    So, are Cherry's comments racist and should he be censored?  Is what
>    Cherry said any worse than Robert Bourassa (or anyone else) publicly 
>    making statements in support of French and passing laws (contrary to 
>    the Quebec and Canadian constitutions) to illegalize it use?  Should 
>    Bourassa be censored for making racist comments?

Cherry's comments racist?    Yes and out of place.  If he wants to make such
comments, he should do it in his own time, not on CBC's time.  Should he be
censored?  No.  But I hope someone at CBC is looking at this closely.

Any worse than Bourassa's *racist* comments?  Should be re-phrased to "racist"
policies.  They're just as bad.

Should Bourassa be censored for making racist comments?  Should be re-phrased to
passing "racist* legislation.  Answer:  No.  Bourassa was democratically elected
to rule and is doing just that.  Can the federal government censor a provincial
premier?  I don't think so.


/Mario

    
    >>I've never heard Bourassa ever say any such things.  If you're asking me
    >>to admit that the Quebec government's policies appear to be racist then
    >>you've got it out of me.  They are.
    
     I have a feeling it is not you I am trying to make the point to. It's
    the people who can't see the "problem" I have issue with.
    
    							Derek
    
    

    So glad to see my tax dollars going to such a great cause.
    If our overpayed, candya$$ MPs, sitting in Mulroney's castle,
    would pay more attention to what's happening in our country than Don
    Cherry's off the wall comments we'd be a better country.
    
    Cherry has always stated his beliefs, and is honest about them - 
    whether we agree with him or not - unlike most of our fork 
    tongued politicians.
    
    Cherry has always been a sh*t disturber and always will be. I don't
    think the man is a racist, but he certainly knows how to keep his name
    in the news. Isn't that what politics and entertainment is all about.
     
    Gary, did you hear who the MP was ? 
    
    Terry
    Terry   

    I'm glad you guys don't watch french TV or listen to french radio, we
    have the same type of outbursts too against the (english) bad language.
    
    Jean
    

	re .15

>    I'm glad you guys don't watch french TV or listen to french radio, we

	Jean,
	And after all those notes you've put in about how much better off
	the anglophones would be if they could partake of French language TV.

	:-)

	Tony

    The Grand Canal is great!!!
    
    
    Thank you very much.

    Gee... and I was going to start a note suggesting Don Cherry for PM!!!!
    
    This string aside, I LIKE DON CHERRY and have no problem admitting it. 
    He is something a lot Canadians (E&F) are too afraid or mellow to do:
    SPEAK THEIR MINDS.  Yes, he's a sh**-disturber but every now and then
    that is what is needed.  Would the country be a worse place if more
    people were like Don Cherry;? I'm not so sure, politics aside.
    
    my deux centes
    
    Doug
    

    Now wait a minute Doug, you will have to change your last name and the
    sooner the better.  After reading your answer, I tought STUART BROOKS
    had somehow "changed" and allowed his true feeling to come out.  
    
    Oh well
    
    Jean
    

    
    OH GEE.... ANOTHER *DEBATE*....
    
    
    	Garry, if you need to know the meaning of racist, try the
    dictionary... Whats this anyway...
    					 pick on Mario day...??
    
    I say let the skin heads at them, and then we'll have both, entertainment 
    AND racism !! ... at its finest...
    
    I watch french TV all the time.... its really NO different than English
    TV.... except Bourassa's on both, and Cherry's only on the English
    channel....  Then there's BLEU NUIT.... nope, no racism in there.... 
    No Bourassa either....or Cherry for that matter... 
    
    Imagine , making an issue about something I THOUGHT I
    heard, and SUPPOSING "I Said"....   
    
    Niuk...Niuk...
    
    Oh me Oh my...
    
    

    Don Cherry is a sports figure that, in the past 5 years has gained and
    lost a good amount of respect from both the French speaking and English
    speaking sectors of Canada.
    
    When the man utters a word, it's usually at a time where the topic has
    been recently brought up or is of a sensitive matter.
    
    I like him because he speaks his mind and sometimes I wonder if he's
    going to be on the television much longer because of his comments.
    
    The way I look at it is if you respond vocally to anything he says,
    then you're a sucker for doing it and who knows, maybe you're the
    prejudiced one.  You have to remember that Don
    Cherry has been doing this for a number of years and has good reason 
    for speaking the way he does.
    
    He's got a bad mouth but he's a good role model for youngsters getting
    into hockey.  He believes in the old hockey rules and so do I and I
    think he tries to apply those rules to life. He's a simple man.
    
    People on television will say things that not everyone agrees to so
    don't get all pumped up about Don.

    
    
    
         I was talking to a friend of mine on the weekend who has 
    had the honour of meeting Don Cherry in person.  Don was telling
    my friend unofficially that He has struck a network deal with the
    CBC for the 95 programming season.
    
         Apparently, Coaches' Corner will remain the same as it should,
    as well as a half hour pre-game show similar to the "NFL TODAY"
    format.
    
         The guys would be Don, Ron Maclean and Clark Gillies.
    They would analyze all games to follow that night.  I myself couldn't
    be happier to hear this great news!  I feel it will change the face
    of hockey as we know it!
    
         Expect a ratings bonanza across all of North America.
        
         How do you guys feel about this???
    
    

    When it comes to talking hockey or sports in general, Don is  good
    to the viewing audience.  
    He's not bad at being an ambassador for the physical Canadian style
    of game.
    He sticks his CHERRY RED-NECK out and leaves it out there, when he
    takes on, the presence of European players in the league, questionable
    rule changes, questionable rulings handed down by the league, anything
    that impacts the sport of hockey. He has his stance, and it belongs 
    on Coaches Corner and Grapevine and any spin off program.
    
    He entertaining...he's good TV.
    
    
    When he leaves the sporting forum to run amock in the political
    arena...then I rather watch Rush LimBORE. 
 
    
    So will he get syndicated on SRC too... +:-)
    
    richard
    
 ps.
    Isn't it interesting how a few years ago Hockey Night in Canada and
    even Gobal later had a commentator Dave Hodge that spoke his mind.
    He got canned for it..both times. AND he was/is a good journalist. 
    A tamed Dave Hodge now lives on TSN. 
    
    
    

    
    
         Great reply, Richard!
    
    Could you possibly place your reply in the HOCKEY notes file
    #330 which is the Official Don Cherry note there.  I think you
    will find much of the entries there quite interesting if not 
    refreshing.
    
                                                  Regards,
    
    
                                                  Blair

    What did Don have to say about the Canada-Sweden game. I didn't hear
    anyhting from him. 
    I'll bet he would have been a lot more colorful than Greg Millen 
    and Don Chevrier, CTV's Olympic hockey play by play team.
    
    If anyone wants to know why Cherry is so popular in Canada, all one has
    to do is watch an Ottawa Senators game on TV. Millen and Chevriere are
    the commentators, and they are about as exciting as watching paint dry.
    
    Don adds some color back into the game - good or bad, that's
    entertainment.
    
    Interesting, Cherry is going to retire from his Grapevine show 
    that's on TSN. It's currently the highest ranked show on TSN. Don 
    says he's getting too old to do the Grapevine, HNIC and all his public
    appearances.
    
    Terry