Conference hydra::dejavu

    
    The tao that can be told
    is not the eternal Tao.
    The name that can be named 
    is not the eternal Name.
    
    The unnamable is the eternally real.
    Naming is the origin
    of all particular things.
    
    Free from desire, you realize the mystery.
    Caught in desire, you see only the manifestations.
    
    Yet mystery and manifestations
    arise from the same source.
    This source is called darkness.
    
    Darkness within darkness.
    The gateway to all understanding.

    My favourite translation is by Jane English and Gia Fu Feng. There
    are some very beautiful black and white photos illustrating the
    book. I keep goin' back an dippin' in...
    
    "Without looking out of your window, you may know the ways of heaven"
    
    Brian

    Nothing, for me, compares to the teasing mysteriousness
    of Lao Tzu's words. Hinting at something but...

    I wonder if it's the translation from an old, oriental,
    pictographic language which creates the atmosphere?
    Or is it using words to try to put a 'whole' together
    out of 'pieces', when really what words are best at is
    cutting the world up?

    John_in_the_middle_of_a_bright_windy_autumn_day.

    Cindy, your .1 reply reminded me of the lyrics to a song by Suzanne Vega.
    I'll enter it here rather than under the lyrics note since it has to do
    with what was in your reply.

	Night Vision
	Suzanne Vega, Solitude Standing

	By day give thanks
	By night beware
	Half the world in sweetness
	The other in fear

	When the darkness takes you
	With her hand across your face
	Don't give in too quickly
	Find the thing she's erased

	Find the line, find the shape
	Through the grain
	Find the outline, things will
	Tell you their name

	The table, the guitar
	The empty glass
	All will blend together when
	Daylight has passed
	
	Find the line, find the shape
	Through the grain
	Find the outline, things will
	Tell you their name

	Now I watch you falling into sleep
	Watch your fist curl against the sheet
	Watch your lips fall open and your eyes
	   dim
	In blind faith
   
	I would shelter you
	Keep you in light
	But I can only teach you
	Night vision

    Reply to .6, Cindy,
    
    This sounds extremely Discordian.

    
    re: .7 (Mikie?)
    
    Discord depends on what frequencies two or more independent entities
    are vibrating on.  Where are you on the FM dial? ;-)
    
    I liked it. 
    
    Guy

    
    I realized all of a sudden that the original author's name wasn't
    mentioned in the base note. 
    
    The author is *Lao-tzu*, and there are a total of 81 writings - that
    number you see up at the top is the number of the specific writing. 
    They're being entered in order.
    
    Mikie - you're right!  (;^)  Perhaps Lao Tzu was a laidback Discordian?
    
    Cindy

    Reply to .10, Cindy,
    
    Maybe, maybe not. Perhaps the Discordians are a front for Lao-tzu...
    
    Which translation are you using? We have three different ones and none
    have the same translation as any other.

    Reply to .8, Guy,
    
    I usually like 93.9 and 96.5 FM. B^)
    
    Actually Discordianism is a humorous attempt at tearing down unneeded
    structures. There is a Zen story about Nanin who was visited by a
    teacher or professor. When the tea was served Nanin kept pouring. The
    professor unable to contain himself said "Stop pooring. It's full
    already."  Nanin replied that so was his mind so full of uneeded
    "stuff" that he would be unable to learn anything from Nanin.
    
    Discordianism serves the same purpose but from a different perspective.

    
    Mikie,
    
    This copy is from 1988 by Stephen Mitchell.
    
    Cindy

    
    
    From a well springs nothing.
    I sit by the well
    Becoming nothing.
    
    Ten Sen

Mitchell also gives wondrous notes to each chapter. It seems as if he tries to
spoonfeed the words of the Tao by entering notes in the back of the book giving
even more insight. Chapter 12 is a fine example of it; I won't enter all the
notes; only part of it:

>    Colors blind the eye.
>    Sounds deafen the ear.
>    Flavors numb the taste.
>    Thoughts weaken the mind.
We need spave in order to see, silence in order to hear, sleep in order to carry
on with our wakefulness. If the senses are too cluttered with objects, they lose
their acuteness and will eventually decay.

>    Desires wither the heart.
Once it has let go of desires, the heart naturally overflows with love (...).

>    The Master observes the world
>    but trusts his inner vision.

Arie

    
    
    Writing about the Tao is not the Tao.
    Then again, everything is the Tao.
    
    L.

    The Tao which can be named...
    	(The menu is not the meal...)
    is not the true Tao...
    	(therefore eat the meal, not the menu.)

    Thanks Mikie....I needed that!
    
    ;^)
    
    L

    How now, brown Tao?
    
    DR

    So what is Tao?!  Perhaps we can summarize a little:
    
    Tao is the form and the formless. Tao is the Mother of
    all the mothers.  Tao is the silence.  Tao is the Primodial Power.
    Tao is Adi Shakti.  Tao is the Holy Spirit, the breath of life, the
    wind, Athena, the water bearer, the cool breeze, the vibration, and is
    the same Kundalini - the pure desire of God.
    
    To achieve Tao is to awaken your Spirit within you - a process
    sometimes called enlightenment, reborn, self-realization...An actual
    transformation which will end all the mystical doctrines, dogmatic
    ideologies, religion difference and superstitutions.
    
    I prostrate before Tao.
    
    

    
    Great!  Let everyone achieve Tao.  What a wonderful world we would
    have.
    
    Mary

    re; -.1
    
    The only problem is to discuss it or to analyze it will not achieve
    Tao!  The meaning of "do-nothing" (wu wei) in Lao-Tze is to be in
    thoughtless awareness.  The only way to get there is through
    meditation.  To be in the state of meditation, you have to awaken the
    Tao in you first.  
    
    Today, Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi is travelling around the world is just 
    doing that only, and the rest of it is depending on you yourself.
    
    With that open mind, Sahaja Yoga can help you to achieve the awakening
    of Tao in you.  No one else is beneficial except you and yourself
    (Spirit) come out as lotus flower come out of muddy water.  The new
    high level of awareness of humanity is our collective goal, even Lao-Tze
    want us all to get to that state.
    
    

    That one is going up on my wall Arie ... thanks

  A good traveler has no fixed plans
  and is not intent upon arriving.
  A good artist lets his intuition
  lead him wherever it wants.
  A good scientist has freed himself of concepts
  and keeps his mind open to what is.

  Thus the Master is available to all people
  and doesn't reject anyone.
  He is ready to use all situations
  and doesn't waste anything.
  This is called embodying the light.

  What is a good man but a bad man's teacher?
  What is a bad man but a good man's job?
  If you don't understand this, you will get lost,
  however intelligent you are.
  It is the great secret.

    
    Arie,
    
    Could you give me the author, publisher, etc of the translation
    you are using?  I like it very much.
    
    (Not to mention that your timing is amazing - with regards to
    applicabilty in my life.)
    
    alison
     

    alison,
    
    see .0 for more info on title and author.
    
    The book *is* amazing. In addition to the translation, there are many
    insightful footnotes. 
    
    You will enjoy it.
    
    :-)
    
    Arie

	Know the male,
	yet keep to the female:
	receive the world in your arms.
	If you receive the world,
	the Tao will never leave you
	and you will be like a little child.

	Know the white,
	yet keep to the black:
	be a pattern for the world.
	If you are a pattern for the world,
	the Tao will be strong inside you
	and there will be nothing you can't do.

	Know the personal,
	yet keep to the impersonal:
	accept the world as it is.
	If you accept the world,
	the Tao will be luminous inside you
	and you will return to your primal self.

	The world is formed from the void,
	like utensils from a block of wood.
	The Master knows the utensils,
	yet keeps to the block:
	thus she can use all things.

	Do you want to improve the world?
	I don't think it can be done.

	The world is sacred.
	It can't be improved.
	If you tamper with it, you'll ruin it.
	If you treat it like an object, you'll lose it.

	There is a time for being ahead,
	a time for being behind;
	a time for being in motion,
	a time for being at rest;
	a time for being vigorous,
	a time for being exhausted;
	a time for being safe,
	a time for being in danger.

	The Master sees things as they are,
	without trying to control them.
	She lets them go their own way,
	and resides at the centre of the circle.

	Whoever relies on the Tao in governing men
	doesn't try to force issues
	or defeat enemies by force of arms.
	For every force there is a counterforce.
	Violence, even well intentioned,
	always rebounds upon itself.

	The Master does his job
	and then stops.
	He understands that the universe
	is forever out of control,
	and that trying to dominate events
	goes against the current of the Tao.
	Because he believes in himself,
	he doesn't try to convince others.
	Because he is content with himself,
	he doesn't need others' approval.
	Because he accepts himself,
	the whole world accepts him.

	Weapons are the tools of violence;
	all decent men detest them.

	Weapons are the tools of fear;
	a decent man will avoid them
	except in the direst necessity
	and, if compelled, will use them
	only with the utmost restraint.
	Peace is his highest value.
	If the peace has been shattered,
	how can he be content?
	His enemies are not demons,
	but human beings like himself.
	He doesn't wish them personal harm.
	Nor does he rejoice in victory.
	How could he rejoice in victory
	and delight in the slaughter of men?

	He enters a battle gravely,
	with sorrow and with great compassion,
	as if he were attending a funeral.

	The Tao can't be perceived.
	Smaller than an electron,
	it contains uncountable galaxies.

	If powerful men and women
	could remain centered in the Tao,
	all things would be in harmony.
	The world would become a paradise.
	All people would be at peace,
	and the law would be written in their hearts.

	When you have names and forms,
	know that they are provisional.
	When you have institutions,
	know where their functions should end.
	Knowing when to stop,
	you can avoid any danger.

	All things end in the Tao
	as rivers flow into the sea.

	Knowing others is intelligence;
	knowing yourself is true wisdom.
	Mastering others is strength;
	mastering yourself is true power.

	If you realize that you have enough,
	you are truly rich.
	If you stay in the center
	and embrace death with your whole heart,
	you will endure forever.

    
    The great Tao flows everywhere.
    All things are born from it,
    yet it doesn't create them.
    It pours itself into its work,
    yet it makes no claim.
    It nourishes infinite worlds,
    yet it doesn't hold on to them.
    Since it is merged with all things
    and hidden in their hearts,
    it can be called humble.
    Since all things vanish into it
    and it alone endures,
    it can be called great.
    It isn't aware of its greatness;
    thus it is truly great.
    

    "Those who assist a leader by means of the Tao do not use arms to
    coerce the world, for these things tend to reverse--brambles grow
    where an army has been, bad years follow a great war.
    
    Weapons are inauspicious instruments, not the tools of the enlightened.
    When there is no choice but to use them, it is best to be calm and free
    from greed, and not celebrate victory.  Those who celebrate victory are 
    bloodthirsty, and the bloodthirsty cannot have their way with the
    world." 

    "Deep knowledge is to be aware of disturbance before disturbance, to be
    aware of danger before danger, to be aware of destruction before
    destruction, to be aware of calamity before calamity.  
    
    Strong action is training the body without being burdened by the body,
    exercising the mind without being used by the mind, working in the
    world without being affected by the world, carrying out tasks without
    being obstructed by tasks.
    
    By deep knowledge of principle, one can change disturbance into order, 
    change danger into safety, change destruction into survival, change
    calamity into fortune.
    
    By strong action on the Way, one can bring the body to the realm of
    longevity, bring the mind to the sphere of mystery, bring the world to
    great peace, and bring tasks to great fulfillment."

Mary,

A favorite book of mine based on the Tao is entitled Grace Unfolding 
coauthored by Ron Kurtz (Hakomi originator) and I forget the other 
person.  It is about integrating the Tao with body-centered 
psychotherapy.

Ro

    Do you happen to know the ISBN number, Roey?

Will look it up tonight for you, Mary.  I gave a copy to my father-in-law on 
Father's day and it quickly became one of his favorites too and he has 
given copies as gifts to other since then.

Ro

Hi Mary,

The ISBN # is 0-517-58449-2 and is published by Bell Tower, NYC


from the back cover:

"It takes half a lifetime to realize what all spiritual masaters have 
taught us -- that true pwoer comes from the synthesis of opposites.  
Save yourself a lot of time and read this remarkable book!"

	- John Bradshaw

"A fasinating blend of Eastern spirituality, Western psychotherpay, 
feminist consciousness, and real caring.  It is a clar, gentle, and 
sometimes humorous voice, it speaks to us of therapy as partnership, 
as 'being in communion,' with the task of the therapist to help us be 
more aware of our unique individuality, our connection with all life, 
and -- above all - our own inner wisdom."

	- Riane Eisler (author of The Chalice and the Blade)

"This is a breakthrough book.  it gives a new dimension of clarity and 
effectiveness to a profession badly in need of improved results.  
Johanson and Kurtz help us fine-tune our skills so that we can enable 
the client to feel so safe, so understood, and so accepted that his or 
her enormous healing power emerges in a way *never before possible*."

	- Ken Keys, Jr.

"Its quitet voice, wise, compelling, speaking to both clients and 
therapist, is remarkably effective."

	- David Loye (author of The Sphinx and the Rainbow)

    Thank you Ro.