Conference hydra::dejavu

    HBO had a good documentary on UFOs about a year ago...
    

    tell us about it, please?

Re: .2

Hello....I'm sorry I haven't replied earlier, but I've been busy.


The following is off the book cover of Light Years:

In 1975 a Swiss caretaker named Eduard "Billy" Meier disappeared on his
motorbike into a forest near his village.  He returned with several clear
photographs of a large, silvery disk hovering in the sky.  Over the next five
years Meier produced hundreds of bright, detailed photographs.  He also
recorded the sounds of "beamships", colected several metal samples, and made
films of the ship in flight.

Dozens of witnesses have seen the beamships and corroborated Meier's fantastic
story.  His evidence, investigated by a professional security team headed by
a retired U.S. Air Force colonel, has been examined by scientists at IBM,
NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Arizona State University, and the McDonnell
Douglas aeronautics company.

For the past three years Gary Kinder, author of the highly acclaimed "Victim:
The Other Size of Murder", has investigated the Meier story.  Here, in a
thoroughly compelling narrative, Kinder presents all side of this controversial
case - the most remarkable, well-documented UFO story in history.


Quotes from scientists that have investigated this:

"I cannot explain the metal sample.  By any known combination of materials I
could not put it together myself, as a scientist.  With any technology that
I knw of, we could not achieve this on this planet.  I think it is important
that those of us who are in the scientific world sit down and do some serious
study on these things instead of putting it off as people's imagination".
                               -Marcel Vogel, research chemist, IBM, 22 years;
                                holds 32 patents; invented magnetic disk coating
                                memory system still used in IBM systems thougout
                                the world.

"In the photographs there were no sharp breaks where you could see it had been
somehow artificially dubbed.  And if that dubbing was registered in the film,
the computer would have seen it.  We didn't see anything."
                               -Eric Eliason, research computer scientist,
                                United States Geological Survey, Flagstaff, AZ;
                                developed software for processing space
                                photography beamed back by both Viking and
                                Voyager.

"The sound recording's got some surprising things in it.  How would you
duplicate it?  The sound of the spacecraft was a single sound source recording
that had an amazing frequency response.  If it is a hoax I'd like to meet the
guy that did it, because he could probably make a lot of money in special
effects."                      -Steve Ambrose, sound engineer for Stevie Wonder;
                                inventor of the Micro Monitor.

"From a photography standpoint, you couldn't see anything that was fake about
the Meier photos.  That's what struck me.  They looked like legitimate photo-
graphs.  I thought, God, if this is real, this is going to be really something."
                               -Robert Post, head of the photo lab at NASA's
                                Jet Propulsion Laboratory.




It's really a fascinating book!  Meier has barely a sixth grade education.
I believe that he is also physically handicapped (it's been awhile since
I've read the book).  He's got thousands of still photographs, sound
recordings, metal samples, and movies of the space craft.  He also has
written down all that the inhabitants of the crafts have told him.  He's got
thousands of pages all about technology, and philosophy & religion.  The
beings are supposedly from the Pleiades.  The colonel that investigated this
case is in the middle of translating all of the information (from Meier's
native tongue - Swiss German, I think).  This is definitely the best proof
so far, I think, of the existence of extra-terrestrials visiting us.

That documentary that I mentioned in .0 has a little bit about Meier towards
the end of the film.

Also, I saw Gary Kinder on a talk show a couple of months ago, and he said
Meier is still in contact, regularly, with this beings to this day....
    

    	The guy (and the book) just blew the whole story.  The "aliens"
    could not have come from the Pleiades star group, as the stars are
    very young stars in the early stages of forming!  They probably
    have hardly had the time to form protoplanets, let alone develop
    intelligent life!  It took billins of years for Earth to attain
    humanity, and we are nowhere near yet capable of sending humans
    on interstellar journeys.
    
    	I've noticed that most bogus UFO stories usually have the aliens
    coming from such celestial places which are known to the public
    which has little or no knowledge of astronomy, and that's where
    they get caught in their own lies.  For example, I have read UFO
    stories about aiens who came from the Crab Nebula - which just happens
    to be the remains of *supernova*, an exploding star which would
    have wiped out anything nearby, including its solar system; from
    another galaxy - not impossible, but the distances are immense,
    especially when there are so many possiblities in our Milky Way
    Galaxy alone; from planets in our Solar System - that right there
    proves their ignorance, as no other planet in the solar system could
    support intelligent life, certainly not the kind of life reproted
    from UFO sightings.
    
    	So to all you would-be UFO hoaxers out there, study your astronomy
    first!  If you say your aliens came from some nearby G2 class star
    in a starship running on fusion power, THEN I might believe you.
    
    	Larry
    

    	Sorry, but I'll need a lot more proof than the word of a man
    with a sixth grade education to believe the story.  This is not
    to say that your ideas are invalid, though.
    
    	Larry
    

.6 Larry

What about the piece of metal, photographs and recordings that were
examined by the so-called experts???

Jay

    It sounds like Larry doesn't want to believe anybody or anything
    that doesnt come right out and bite him. 8^)
    
    I can hardly wait for them to finally make themselves publicly 
    known. It's my personal belief that humans were placed on this 
    earth and have been monitored constantly all along. Just imagine
    all of the life sustaining planets in the universe having been
    seeded in this way. What an amazing diversity in cultures there
    must be. It doesn't take to much intelligence to understand that
    with such a diverse amount of life forms that occupy this planet,
    due to evolution, that the scale of evolutionary changes possible
    in an entire universe must force us to believe that more intelligent
    life forms than ourselves, with much more advanced sciences, must
    and do exist.
    
    I'm a believer who doesn't need proof.
    
    				Rich
    
    


                                                                        

    	Hey, I don't want any aliens biting me (unless they're real
    cute)!  :^)
    
    	I too happen to believe that the Universe is full of life, and
    there is already proof of that - WE exist; but even so, I still
    believe that there is quite a bit of life out there elsewhere, I
    just want to see it for myself, that's all.
    
    	As to those "metal fragments" - okay, then where are they now?
    What has been done with them?  Why hasn't there been a bigger
    investigation?  Why isn't the whole scientific world going crazy
    over them?  I've heard this "strange alien metal studied by scientists"
    before, and EVERY TIME someone really high up wants to study them,
    they "suddenly disappear".  In the words of SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE's
    Church Lady, "How conveeeeenient!"
    
    	Belief is one thing, blind faith in something you know nothing
    about personally is another.
                   
    	Larry
    

    Re .10 (Henry) [re .9 (Larry)]:
    
      >I believe the military intervenes whenever it feels it should
      >and covers up what might threaten national security or confidence.
      >This might not be bad, depending on how you look at it, but it
      >becomes very difficult to obtain more info after they step in.
       
    I believe Larry was saying something different.  Often we hear of
    _spectacular_ claims, but when we try to follow them up, _pfft_!,
    suddenly there's a problem, usually blamed on faceless  people
    osstensibly connected with The Government.   I once got a highly
    questionable (and rambling) direct mail ad from someone huckstering
    a copy of a tape recording allegedly taken at a UFO landing.  Prior
    to the reported arrival of the UFO, the writer of the ad told of
    approaching a car in which were two people, one of whom "appeared
    to be a high-ranking officer in the Air Force," and the other of
    whom "appeared to be a government agent, possibly from the F.B.I.
    or C.I.A."  It sounds rather impressive until you stop to think:
    how can someone "appear" to be a government agent in agencies where
    all the members wear civilian clothes?
    
    "Cover up" is often the last refuge of a con man.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr. 

    But "Men In Black" are a *very* common aspect of UFO sightings.
    They show up after a sighting, confiscate evidence and warn 
    witnesses to "forget" what they saw.  They have been discussed in
    numerous UFO writings (according to the MUFON journals).  Unmarked
    helicopters are also included in these reports.
    Mary

    	And just who are "they" supposed to be?
    
    	Larry
    

    In Shirley MacLaine's book, Out On A Limb, she talks about aliens.
    Her and her friend David take a trip to PERU, where apparently UFO's
    have been appearing for many years.  There is a sign on a road in
    PERU and I will quote from the book:  EXISTEN LOS PLATILLOS VOLADORES
    CONTACTO CON OVNIS.  In English:  FLYING SAUCERS DO EXISTS.  UFO
    CONTACT POINT.
    
    Further on in the book, David claims to have had contact with an
    alien being.  When Shirley asks David where she is from, his answer
    is "The Pleiades."
    
    I'm not saying that I necessarily believe all the was written in
    the book, but it does mean that more than one source is referencing
    The Pleiades as the place where *some* aliens come from.
    
    Debbie
    

    "they" refers to Men In Black.

    Re .14:
    
    >................When Shirley asks David where she is from, his answer
    >is "The Pleiades."  
    
    The aliens ought to be more specific than that.  The Pleiades comprise
    a loose collection of stars some of which can be seen as a small
    constellation.  It's like someone asking where you are from, and
    you answer, "the Western Hemisphere."
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.
                  

    	But WHO are the alleged "men in black"? 
    
    	And as far as the Pleiades issue is concerned, please reread
    my Note 584.4 as to why advanced aliens could NOT have come from
    there.
    
    	Larry
    

    No one knows Larry.  All that is known about them is that they dress
    completely in black and have been known to show up after a ufo
    sighting.  There might be more information about them in various
    UFO journals and reference books but I've never heard nor read any
    information that identifies them as representing or being from a
    particular group.  Your guess is as good as mine.

    Re .18, .19:
    
    The Men in Black are obviously agents of the Illuminatti, who in
    turn have been in control of the Space Brothers for many years (Close
    Encounters of the Fourth Kind are when the Illuminatti take you
    over).  They drive around in black limos, lurk in dark corners,
    and drink their coffee without cream or sugar. ;-D
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.

    re .18
    
    It seems to me that all one can say about the Pleiades is that,
    based on the way we currently interpret our data, we know of
    no place in the Pleiades that xxxxxx light years ago could
    have supported life as we know it....
    
    perhaps the 'aliens' were indicating someplace beyond the Pleiades,
    that doesn't yet register on our intruments...
    
    perhaps....
    
    	Bruce

    	In any event, these "aliens" should have been more accurate
    than to say "the Pleiades".  Somehow I just don't buy "something
    hiding behind" the Pleiades.  You cannot just "hide behind" a
    relatively loose, very young star cluster.  Also, the distance involved
    is many thousands of light years here from the Pleiades - not exactly
    a walk across the street, despite what STAR WARS seemed to show.
    
    	I agree with an earlier Note which states that many UFO stories
    were probably construed from science fiction concepts.  Too bad
    they didn't study their astronomy further...
    
    	Larry
                                                                    

    
    	John Keel's books have some interesting theories on the
    "Men In Black"... see "The Eighth Tower" and "The Mothman Prophecies".
    Also see "Messengers Of Deception" by Jaques Vallee.
    
    	They seem to be an integral part of the ufo phenomenon.
    Often the "men in black" pose as investigating officers, and
    confiscate evidence.   They often show up to investigate
    sightings that have not yet been reported !   Some serious
    investigators believe that the "men in black" are acting so as to
    discredit legitimate ufo investigators.
    
    	In some cases the "men in black" have oddities in their 
    actions or apperance;  odd racial features, or extremely long 
    fingers.   I read a report where they were driving a vintage
    Stutz Bearcat automobile, that appeared to have been in 
    storage since it was purchased.

	In general, the arrival of "men in black" at the houses
    of those who have experienced UFOs, seems to be one more of
    the odd features of these weird events.   People who find
    themselves involved in the UFO experience also tend to have 
    phone problems and perhaps other anomalous problems.

    	Alan.

    Perhaps they are reading this notes file..............

    I don't know about the Men In Black but I wouldn't be too surprised
    if the NSA reads this file._:-)

    Maybe the "MEN IN BLACK" are actually aliens who are trying to cover
    their track?
    
    Debbie

    Paranoia runneth deep!
    
    (;^)

    Re .26:
    
    No, they're galactic scavangers who hope to hock the artifacts.
    [The Illuminati convinced them it was a Good Thing to do.] :-)
    
    More seriously, there have been _lots_ of stories surrounding UFOs
    (call it a "mythos").  Some may be real; others may be imaginary.
    But the Men In Black stories have never been proven or disproven.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.

    re: .24
    
    	I wouldn't be suprised.
    	
    				Geoff

    
    Come on, guys...their identity was revealed by an earlier clue about
    folks having telephone trouble after a sighting. These Men in Black
    are *obviously*
    
    
    
    The Phone Police!
    
    Tananda
    

    
    I'm one of the men in black, and i'm watching all of you..B^D
    Anyone got a dime for a phone call?     ;-)
    
    
     Well the way us men in black see it, just because life could not
     have been created on a certain planet or star or what have you,
     it does not mean that life cannot colonize on an existing planet.
     especially when the life form may somewhat superior to us. So
     in conclusion, if you have the technology, you can colonize anywhere
     your little heart desires, in turn why could'nt the aliens come
     from where they say. It could have been there ancestors new home.
    
    
                                                   regards
    
                                              (not really a man in black)
    
                                                        Dan'l