| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 401.1 | The Meditation With A Purpose | MLCSSE::SU | S. Paulo Su | Thu Oct 15 1987 12:42 | 145 |
|
This is a simple matter
To become self-realized is such a simple thing in Sahaja Yoga.
It is an awaking of a power which is within everybody. It is as
simple as is described by the Pharises to he who knocks the door
shall opened; whoever shall seek shall find the truth within his
reach. We - human beings have been seeking for centuries without
much success, for we often seek outwardly instead of inwardly.
Saint Augustine said, "I have been looking for God all over,
everywhere. And finally I found that He was inside, within me,
and I had been outside."
God is manifesting within us. Our consciousness remains outside,
in the outer "instrument", but the true crying of the soul for
union with God is in the meditation that brings our consciousness
inside where God is. With this, we know that we have to knock,
in a sense, and seek inwardly within ourselves.
The true meaning of rebirth.
To be reborn, in Christianity is a certification of becoming a
Christian. One is led to believe that such certification is the
only ticket to enter the kingdom of God. In Sahaja Yoga, Sri Mataji
says "to be reborn is a transformation, it is an evolution". The
enjoyment of life is only possible if we could get connected with
the Spirit and that connection to the Spirit is only possible if
you sprout into that through self-realization you become the Spirit
as Christ has said in simple words that you have to be born again.
Becoming self-realized is a process similar to the transformation
that occurs when an egg becomes a bird, and the life within become
another form of life with wings. To be in oneness with the Holy
Spirit is to be "of the Spirit". Sri Mataji - the master of this
transformation technique says, "to fill with Holy Spirit is not a
mystery in Sahaja Yoga. Everything can be explained."
Speaking of Yoga, our thoughts are connected with the picture of
Indian Guru, standing upside down, twisting his two legs like
a wet towel, squeezing out the water...or one who pull out his own
tongue and rolls it back like a roll. At least, that was what
I thought when I first heard about it. Relax, my friends.
This is a meditation in which you don't even need to set in
crossed legs. Transcendental meditation huh? Transcendental
meditation is becoming another form of university seminar which
you paid some amount of $300 to get a meanless mantra and work
at it.
It is known that some guru masters can manipulate people's
conscious mind and become millionaires through their teachings
in the Western world. Being aware of all this, one may think that
the founder of Sahaja Yoga - Sri Mataji, her full name is Sri Mataji
Nirmala Devi, will charge you an arm and leg to teach you become
self-realized. As matter of fact, in all her television interviews,
she has clearly stated that it is an absurd and immoral idea to take
a cent from people for telling them how to bring out their own
self-knowledged inner power. Sahaja Yoga is always free.
Sri Mataji does not certify you with the divine healing power of
Holy Spirit. You were born with the power! Christ does not charge
membership to enter the kindom of God. Budda did not ask for
contribution to teach the love of God. To understand this is very
important - that you can not purchase God or God's love since it is
rightfully yours no matter what. This knowledge of kindling the
love of God was born with Sri Mataji. She was born with this candle
light with the grace of God. Her mission is to light everyone's
candle in this critical stage of the salvation of the human race.
The love of God is free for everybody, therefore Sahaja Yoga is free
for all seeker.
You are your own guru.
To knock or not to knock, to seek or not to seek, it is your choice
and absolute power. It may sound complicated to you but to become
self-realized is such a simple matter. When you are self-realized
you can feel the cool breeze (the Holy Spirit) present on top of
your head. You also feel the cool breeze on both of your palms with
tingling vibrated-sensation (a communication vehicle between your
physical/mind body and the Holy Spirit). All this is just the
beginning. The process of rebirth is taking place. You are being
baptized by the Holy Spirit. The cool breeze in the hand is the
energy of the Spirit that flowing by which your mental and physical
problems can be cured in a natural harmonious way.
This transformation, this evolution must take place.
You have to break the old life-shell and be reborn. Unfortunately,
this baptization (the instant rebirth) was mistaken earlier. A
transformation must happen in order to be reborn again.
A frog must become a prince by turning into a prince. But, by
thinking he is a prince will not make him become a prince.
Through self-realization your life becomes baptized with the Holy
Spirit; you become a collective being. By means of the collectivity
you become a more sensible and loving person knowing that all divine
truth (the knowledge) will be yours when you need it to do your work
of this life (the purpose of being in this planet). Becoming collect-
ive is an evolution. You will become so compassionate, gentle, kind
and lovable. You are protected by the Holy Spirit. Most of of all,
you become a part and parcel of the blissful domain - the kingdom of
God. You will be constantly fine-tunning youself all-over, physically
and mentally. And, you will be rid of human impure desire/habits,
so that you can purfy severn chakras (the senen subtle energy centers
that make a tiny Cool Breeze that is struggling through at the
begining). This will lead to the automatic balancing of the vital
Sympathetic nervous systems of Pingala Nadi (right channel) and Ida
Nadi (left channel). You will live in total joy.
Ultimately the goal is that you and the Holy Spirit become oneness;
and thereafter you and the universe become one. This is the vast
sense of the transformation. You will become a collective being
- a prophet. I should differentiate between a prophet and a psychic
here. You become the first, a wiseman (but not "wise guy").
In Sahaja Yoga, the person is fully aware and alert and receives
inner silence and experience without doing any unnatural movements.
He sits in a completely easy pose throughout. The breathing is
normal or slightly slower than normal. The connection with our
divine origin is established. This transformation (rebirth) is a
slow process, because the damage of your system that you have incurred
throughout your life must be repaired. To reinforce and nourish
this connection with our divine origin we must work it out individual-
ly. You will experience the changing of your life according to your
own effort and dedication. Nevertheless, the experience is of
enlightened joyfulness instead of any kind of suffering.
Our colleague Phil Ward and Chris Kyriacou have also written on
this topic on various Notes conference (Hydra::Holistic #19.* and
Regent::Religion #90). This introduction of Sahaja Yoga is to tell
you that I have benefited from reading those notes discussion too.
It is my turn to share my experience with you.
Sri Mataji is coming to U.S. from Europe around November 16th-23rd
touring the major cities in the States. During her public programs
she will give a lecture about her philosophy and her understanding
of the unity of all religions. She will also offer the experience
of self-realization to anyone who desires it. For more information
about her Boston program or programs in other cities, please post
inquiry here or contact Boston Sahaja Yoga Center at 617-646-7547.
Wish you were there too. :-).
|
| 401.2 | The Science of Sahaja Yoga | MLCSSE::SU | S. Paulo Su | Thu Oct 15 1987 12:48 | 400 |
| There is a time for the All Mighty Father - God.
There is a time for the Holy Son - the light of Christ.
And now is the time for the Holy Spirit - the "Holy Mother" who
nourish us, guide us in this world.
"So this is the Aquarian Age - the age of Holy Spirit; the blossom
time has come. The Kundalini has to rise and ignited to complete
the evolution of human beings." - These are the words of Sri Mataji.
When you experience something wonderful, you just feel like to
share with someone. The following discussion has great detail of
the way of Sahaja Yoga. I just re-posted from Holistic notes
for you. I am sure many of you will be interested.
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Note 19.0 Types of Meditation. 5 replies
HYDRA::BARANSKI "Never Argue With An Idiot." 137 lines 12-FEB-1986 11:26
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-< What is the meaning of life? >-
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Note 66.0 Kundalini, Meditation 1 reply
GVA04::PHILIP 130 lines 23-OCT-1985 11:52
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"Meditation" comes from roots which basically mean "to be in the
centre". Which means being in the present, the real, not in
projections about the future or memories of the past, which are unreal.
There is a connection here with the discoveries of neurologists in
the 60's and 70's about the different functions of the hemispheres
of the brain; the left side of the brain is involved with rational,
analytical mental activity, which might include planning and
consideration of the future, and the right side with affective,
aesthetic, and "intuitive" activity. (This picture is very much
simplified, but I believe it is basically OK.)
Now, what these scientists discovered only 10 to 20 years ago had
in fact been known in the Indian and Chinese religious traditions for
thousands of years. The Chinese talked of the "Yin" and "Yang" as two
complementary or opposing forces which must be held in balance for
the good life. And the indian tradition of yoga talks of the two
channels in the left and right-hand sides of the body's subtle
nervous system, called "Ida Nadi" and "Pingala Nadi" respectively.
(Nadi means "river" or "channel" in sanskrit, or we might say
"nerve" which also gives the sense quite well.)
These channels correspond in the body to the nerves of the sympathetic
nervous system which pass immediately to the left and right sides of the
spinal column. These "Nadis" are shown in yogic literature as crossing
at the level of the eyebrows to reach the brain, corresponding with the
well-known fact that the activity of the left-hand side of the body is
controlled by the right-hand hemisphere of the brain, and vice versa.
The yogis of old discovered a lot about the workings of this subtle
nervous system, and the contrasting properties of its left and right
sides.
This could be summarised by a chart (not necessarily of opposites):
[4mLeft Side[0m [4mRight Side[0m
Ida Nadi Pingala Nadi
Feminine, maternal Masculine, paternal
Past Future
Emotions Creativity
Yin Yang
Cold Hot
Inertia Agitation
Heart Reason
Romantic Classical
and so forth.
In addition to these two channels, a third subtle channel exists,
called "Sushumna Nadi" in sanskrit, which runs up the centre
of the spinal column and corresponds in the gross body to the
vagus nerve of the parasympathetic nervous system. Being in between
the left- and right-side channels of the past and the future
respectively, this is the channel of the present whose action
establishes a balance between the other two.
This picture is very much simplified, of course; the Chinese who
discovered, largely through their meditation, the meridians known in
acupuncture, made a very much more complex map of these thousands
of nadis. However the picture is very broadly accurate and suffices
to explain a great deal about ourselves.
The problem is that in normal human beings only the left and right
side channels of the subtle nervous system function, the central channel
being dormant, awaiting a triggering. For this reason the central
channel remained mysterious, being referred to in the Buddhist
tradition as "The Middle Way" which is not only a prescription
for ideal conduct but also an allusion to the middle path of
Sushumna which is the way of our spiritual evolution and for
which a just, or dharmic, way of life is necessary. (This is
why a good life is important not only for the well-being of
society, but also, and more important, essential for one's own
spiritual progress.) Islam has the same notion in the word Sharia,
which means at once "law" and "way", asserting the identity of
the divine law or prescriptions which we have to follow for our
growth and the path of Sushumna. Similarly, the Chinese referred
to the mysterious Tao which holds in balance the Yin and the Yang.
Now, how to be in the present? How to activate the path of
Sushumna? How to be in meditation?
Indian yogic teachings have for long talked about the energy of
Kundalini, which lies dormant in the triangular bone - the coccyx
in the os sacrum or sacred bone - at the base of the spine. They
tell how this energy, once awakened, rises up the central channel
to reach the crown of the head, where it rises even above the head
and the yogi feels refreshed by a shower of the grace coming directly
from the unconscious. As it rises along the sushumna it cleanses
and activates the central nadi which, being more subtle and more
powerful than the side channels once awakened, brings these into
balance. As the kundalini rises above the level of the brain our
mental activity dies down and we become silent although still alert
and aware of things taking place within or outside of us.
The awakening of kundalini is effortless on our part, needing only
the right circumstances; we are like a candle being lit by another
candle. It is spontaneous - "sahaja" in sanskrit, meaning "inborn".
One of the first manifestations of the kundalini awakening may be a
sensation of tingling in the hands as the kundalini makes her way
up the Sushumna, which gives way to a feeling of a cool breeze
felt on the hands which may also be felt on the top of the head
and on other parts of the body. The experience is subtle, always
gentle and full of grace in normal healthy people, although people
with physical or other problems may take a little while to feel
anything. References to the cool breeze are not confined to yogic
literature; the greek word pneuma refers to the breath of God
which is the manifestation of the Spirit; the arabic word assas
and the hebrew word ruach likewise describe the sensation of a
zephyr felt when the link with the unconscious is established
through the awakening of Kundalini. Kahlil Gibran alluded to
it beautifully:
"It was but yesterday
That you were moving with
The moving sea,
And you were shoreless
And without a self.
Then the wind,
The breath of life,
Wove you,
A veil of light on Her face,
Then Her hand gathered you
And gave you form,
And with a head held high
You sought the heights.
But the sea followed after you,
And Her song is still with you
And though you have forgotten
Your parentage,
She will forever assert Her motherhood,
And forever will She call you unto Her."
- The Garden of the Prophet.
Such has been the experience not only of the saints of the past in
India and other countries, but also of many thousands of people
in the west in recent years.
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Note 19.2 Types of Meditation. 2 of 5
GVAEIS::PHILIP "Phil Ward, Geneva-Etang X248" 116 lines 16-FEB-1986 08:37
-< More on Kundalini Yoga >-
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Some more on Kundalini awakening, in particular my own experience.
It's a vast topic but here goes...
Kundalini has the power to cure cancer, and a number of
other "incurable" diseases, including blindness, epilepsy, diabetes,
addiction, certain forms of paralysis, and most particularly mental
illness. I did not have any of these when I got realization (Kundalini
awakening), but I had been suffering from chronic diarrhea for several
months as a result of having eaten rather indiscriminately and of having
been to some of the unscrupulous "gurus" who are to be found in India,
where I had spent a year on the hippy trail. I had already had 3
courses of medical treatment from doctors in India and Sri Lanka
who had failed to cure the problem, which went away inside a week
after realization. But this healing is a by-product; the important
thing is that one should desire one's spiritual ascent. After
realization, you are in touch with the unconscious, which in a
subtle way guides and looks after you, so that if you desire your
spiritual well-being, other aspects of your well-being such as
the material, the physical, and the emotional get taken care of by
the unconscious. It's quite remarkable, and I wouldn't mention it
had I not experienced it. Kundalini cures such diseases as cancer
by re-integrating the calls of the body that have lost their
connection with the whole; Kundalini has this power of integration.
The structure of the universe as a whole resembles the creation
story of Genesis 1, where God creates the universe in seven stages
which correspond to the seven chakras or centres of energy in the
human body as in the cosmos. Thus the microcosm of the human body
mirrors faithfully the macrocosm of the universe. However this
correspondence cannot be seen through objective research into the
universe, but is experienced as one goes deep in meditation and
becomes gradually aware of it. After realization, one becomes linked
to the universal unconscious, whose guidance registers on the central
nervous system via the parasympathetic as cool vibrations; the
identification with the individual "I" gradually weakens, and one
spontaneously comes to feel oneself as a part of the collective being.
My personal experience came after just over a year spent traveling
in the East to different ashrams and gurus that people had told me
about. (I also did more conventional things like trekking in the
Himalayas, which was great fun!) Briefly, I went first with a friend
to the ashram of one noted charlatan who until recently lived with
a few thousand disciples and sixty odd Rolls Royces in Oregon, and
spent a day or two there astonished at the state of the "sannyasins"
we were amongst. They all seemed completely hypnotized; and in fact
some of them looked so pale and ill that one might have thought they
had been put in a wash and then spun-dry, which made me realize
the origin of the term 'brain-washing'. There was no love among them;
we just saw them sitting together over cups of tea and analytically
knocking one another, on the basis of whatever psycho-therapy
they had just been learning. My friend and I could not see why it was
necessary to wear orange robes in order to make spiritual progress,
so we left.
Other stops on the journey included some ashrams in south India,
for instance at one ashram which was originally the seat of a very great
saint, Ramana Maharshi, but which has now been administered for three
decades by local brahmins and businessmen and the spirit has gone out of
the place. (To give an example, the ashram is built on the side of
the holy mountain of Arunachala, which is said to be the god Shiva
Himself. The trustees wanted to build a concrete path to the top
complete with electric lighting, to attract more visitors!) Another
visit to the seat of another well-known fraud who materializes
objects and claims on this basis to be God. This just seemed like
cheap circus tricks, although I was impressed with the number of
people who hung around.
I also spent in total about three months in monasteries with
various Buddhist teachers, doing what is known as "Vipassana"
meditation. Unfortunately the use of the attention to follow
the activities of the body and mind, and particularly the breath,
place great stress on the sympathetic nervous system (the left and
right sides) as the parasympathetic is not active, and as I
learned afterwards I was not doing myself any good. Many people do
these sorts of retreats and come out of them feeling great, as I
did, but the effect is not through the parasympathetic, which
nourishes, and the effect goes away very quickly leaving a sort
of vacuum into which all manner of negativity can come.
(I might mention in passing that a number of friends of mine have
tried Transcendental Meditation, and all have come out with
very negative opinions about it. What happens in TM is again
just a sympathetic phenomenon, the stilling of the right side
and the activation of the left side through the repetition of
an allegedly meaningless mantra (the TM mantras are in fact not
only meaningful but quite powerful in a black magical sort of way).
The left side, being where the heart is, is the side of rhythm,
and it is stimulated in an unhealthy way by these mantras, and
one is taken away from the path of Sushumna. People indeed feel
calm, but what happens is a lowering of awareness, as the
attention goes into a sort of void, whereas spiritual development
should heighten our awareness. After a while people find that the
mantra goes on and on in their heads automatically and indeed
becomes difficult to stop, and this is sometimes followed by other
unpleasant experiences such as hearing voices, accidents, torpor,
and even physical pain; in short, spirit possession.)
Okay, the question is now, how does one get one's Kundalini
awakened? One cannot do it oneself; it is a act of grace. It is very
simple, and quite extraordinary. On the way back from India, I was
told by a friend in Delhi of a remarkable Indian lady called Sri
Mataji Nirmala Devi, who has the power to awaken the Kundalini
simply by her presence, or even, what is even more remarkable, in
the presence of a photograph of her. Of course, I could not
believe this at first, until my friend sat me down in front
of such a photograph and told me to hold my hands towards it,
palms upward, whereupon I did feel a slight coolness in my hands,
and, on holding my hand above my head, I could feel Kundalini coming
out from the top of my head like a cushion of air. Since that time
I have had the good fortune to meet Sri Mataji on several further
occasions. ("Sri" connotes respect, and "Mataji" means "mother" or
"holy mother". She has lived in London since 1974 when her husband
was elected to his present post as Secretary-General of the United
Nations International Maritime Organization.)
I would like now to digitize a photograph of Sri Mataji so that
anyone reading this Notesfile with access to a VT240 or VT125 could
try the experience. Anybody know what hardware and software would
be necessary? In the meantime I would be happy to send a more
conventional photograph to anyone who sends me mail.
Phil
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Note 19.3 Types of Meditation. 3 of 5
LASSIE::TBAKER "My Karma Ran Over My Dogma" 11 lines 17-FEB-1986 13:54
-< Realization? >-
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re:2. > within a week of realization
I'd be interested in what you mean my realization. The definition
I'm most familier with is that of one who has fully recognized and
personally experienced (and is continuingly experiencing) complete
oneness with God/the absolute/infinity.
Also, the sentence quoted above implies that you are realized, what
ever definition you wish to place on it.
Tom
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Note 19.4 Types of Meditation. 4 of 5
GVAEIS::PHILIP "Phil Ward, Geneva-Etang X248" 46 lines 25-FEB-1986 05:09
-< Realization! >-
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Realization is a state in which the Kundalini energy is awakened
and rises the full length of the central path to flow out from
the top of the head and thereby make the link (_yoga_) with the Divine.
The definition described in .3 would describe a person who is God-
realized, who has completely gone beyond samsara, the ocean of
illusion and the cycle of birth and death. However there is another
stage, that of self-realization, in which one is on the way to
God-realization; the process of self-perfection through the action
of the Divine Grace. This is the stage in which the Atma (Self)
manifests through the connection with the Divine through the
Kundalini, and a gradual and spontaneous process of purification
takes place.
The process of purification is one of cleansing the energy centres
(chakras) of the subtle nervous system through the action of the
Kundalini, which is accompanied by an improvement in every aspect
of one's well-being. The organs of the body are controlled by the
different chakras and when the chakras function properly the organs
themselves function properly. Hence the power of Kundalini to cure
different diseases.
This process brings immediate and practical benefits. For instance,
one friend of mine used to smoke 80 cigarettes a day before
realization. He got his realization one evening at a public meeting,
and when he went home afterwards he started to smoke a cigarette out
of habit, only to discover he didn't enjoy it at all; he threw
the pack away and hasn't smoked since. Quite simply, you enjoy being
the Atma, so that external sources of enjoyment on which you might
have been dependent previously become less important. And the Atma
expresses itself in life in a multitude of beautiful ways.
In the state of God-realization the chakras are completely cleansed
and integrated and open and the divine qualities associated with each
manifest completely; God acts through us completely, there is no
difference between us and God, we are in complete beatitude. This
was the state of the Buddha after his enlightenment. Self-realisation
is a partial stage where we still have work to do, but already the
peace and the bliss of the Divine make themselves felt.
So I am realized in the sense of self-realisation, which scarcely
makes me unique as there are thousands of people in the world who
have had Kundalini awakening and who practice _sadhana_
(spiritual effort, essentially meditation) to maintain this
contact with the Divine (including at least four of us who happen
to work in DEC) and the number is increasing very rapidly.
Phil
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Note 19.5 Types of Meditation. 5 of 5
VNABRW::EICHERT 8 lines 16-SEP-1986 01:56
-< Growing Realization >-
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Growing Realization
First there was myself
then myself and God
then God and myself
then God and us
then God and God.
|
| 401.3 | C'mon baby, light my candle .. with a cool breeze | ISTG::DOLLIVER | Todd O. Dolliver | Mon Oct 19 1987 17:21 | 76 |
| re .1;
I find this topic fascinating, and I appreciate your re-posting of the
information in this conference. I, for one would be very interested in
having you also post a schedule of Sri Mataji's visit to the United States,
and Boston in particular.
Samaja Yoga seems like a spiritual get-rich-quick scheme, which I am
slightly wary of, especially since only a few people are currently capable
of producing the effects. However I believe that many schools have lost the
"spark" and have made the self-realization process appear to be comprised
of endless drudgery and sacrifice while it is possible to accomplish the
same things much more simply with more specifically focused efforts and
energies. While I am sure that getting your "candle lit" is seen to be only
the beginning, it sure seems that it could provide people with an excellent
head start.
I have been a TM meditator for about 12 years and have not experienced the
drawbacks presented by Phil Ward in .2 (and I question whether they are so
far-reaching), yet I have been lax in my meditating in recent years, and I
could envision a dedicated TM'er encountering some problems of imbalance.
While in college ('76) I had a prolonged experience which I attributed to
the effects of Kundalini energy, and to this day I have found no better
explanation. In this case, however, it was not a "cool breeze" but a heavy
sandstorm which literally shook my entire body for several weeks, and had
severe enough physical and psychological effects to require hospitalization.
The locus of shaking gradually moved up and down my spine several times
(taking about a week for each full cycle) until when it again moved up 'into'
my skull I suddenly felt like I was falling into an abyss. Surprisingly, at
the nadir of the abyss I experienced an extreme feeling of centeredness and
stability. From this point on I healed quickly, although doctors never found
anything wrong with me, and could not explain my illness or my recovery.
I am certain that I both conciously and unconciously 'allowed' myself to be
open to this experience, which included some extreme emotional 'highs' as well
as the 'lows', and with no teacher to supply guidance I guess that I could be
considered lucky to have made it through with my nervous system intact.
In any case, my experiences and readings on Kundalini have taught me to treat
this energy with respect (but not fear), yet I have specific concerns over the
manner in which Sahaja Yoga is presented.
It seems that once your "candle is lit" in Sahaja Yoga, you are on your own.
I have developed some confidence in my own abilities to handle some potent
energies, yet couldn't this energy overwhelm some people? What could a person
do if they felt overwhelmed, or is this something that _couldn't_ happen with
the nature of the Sahaja Yoga energies? In particular, shouldn't Sahaja Yoga
be accompanied by more specialized training?
Also, in a number of my readings on Kundalini, two methods are presented
for cleansing the chakras to allow smooth passage for the Kundalini energies.
One method involves cleansing the lower four chakras and orchestrating the
operation of these 'personal' chakras with the fifth (throat) chakra, then
developing the sixth 'third eye' (pineal) chakra, and finally attempting to
open the seventh and final chakra (pituitary) to allow 'connection with the
infinite'.
The other method involves application of potent cleansing energy directly to
the seventh chakra, and guiding high-powered energy down through to the lower
chakras essentially reaming them out. While this second method is clearly
more direct, the first method is virtually always considered as the 'preferred'
method due to dangers with the second method involved in handling high-powered
energies of the higher chakras by incompletely cleansed lower chakras.
It appears to me that Sahaja Yoga can be characterized by the second method
of raising Kundalini, and this raises my concern. Is there some sense in
which most current books on Kundalini can be considered to apply only to the
sympathetic systems of the Pingala Nadi and Ida Nadi, and thus the warnings
don't apply to the methods used in Sahaja Yoga? Since typically the rising
Kundalini energy is described as feeling warm or hot there is clearly something
different about the Sahaja "cool breeze", but is it reasonable to state that
no adverse effects are possible? (Especially when people are on their own?)
Looking_to_get_rich_quick_but_wary_of_the_risks,
Todd
|
| 401.4 | Try it you'll like it... | THE780::MANSFIELD | | Mon Oct 19 1987 20:51 | 22 |
| Todd re. .3,
Unlike the TM organization, the Sahaja Yogas do not charge for their
service. I shared your fear of getting caught in the vortex of
a cult until I slowly ventured into the new method of practicing
mediation. Try it for yourself and send us a followup message.
Surely with all you went through with TM, there could be little
harm in trying something new.
When the energies in the body are in balance, I feel the cool breezes
that we have discribed. When I am upset or generally out of balance,
I feel warm or hot tingling sensations. Perhpas you are on the
right track and could benefit from mediation using Sri Mataji's
photo.
I too was perviously a TM practitioner and had some adjustment to
the new practices. However, I never felt as relaxed or balanced
with TM as with Sahaja Yoga.
Try it you'll like it,
Elaine
|
| 401.5 | | MLCSSE::SU | S. Paulo Su | Tue Oct 20 1987 14:36 | 71 |
|
re: .3
>... post a schedule of Sri Mataji's visit to the United States, and Boston
> in particular.
We do not have definitely schedule for her program in the States,
nor which cities she is going to visit yet. When such schedule
is in place, I will post it here for our colleagues in DEC.
>... Samaja Yoga seems like a spiritual get-rich-quick scheme, which I am
> slightly wary of, especially since only a few people are currently capable
> of producing the effects.
Such "spiritual get-rich-quick" scheme still requires your own
dedication, your own effort. You have to transform yourself to
become a collective being. If you gave up your meditation work and
chose to pamper yourself into damaging your system, your "get-rich-
quick" scheme can also become "get-poor-quick" results. There are
thousands of people in India (as people over there are not as
materialistic) and hundreds of people in Europe become realized each
year. It is not only a few as you think. We all really should worry
about ourself first before we can help others. Sahaja Yoga works best
on collectivity, it is not selfish work. When you are realized soul,
you can help others effectivily. In United States, Sahaja Yoga is not
popular yet. People in this side of the pond are so materialistic to
such an extent that they ask how much do you have to pay to become
self-realized; they can not believe that you do not have to pay to
such good thing. Therefore, they do not want to become part of it.
This is exactly how the human ego is separating us from our Creator.
> It seems that once your "candle is lit" in Sahaja Yoga, you are on your own.
After your candle is lit, there are new dimensions beyond that.
You become collective being. Gradually, you purify more and more, and
become more perception to your surroundings. You are your own guru.
You are not totally by yourself for you are guided by the Holy Spirit.
There are so much Sri Mataji can teach you after realization (Once
Kundalini has risen and established the Yoga, or union with the
Divine all pervading power.). Yes, you are on your own in the sense
of no one else is in control of you.
> Is there some sense in which most current books on Kundalini can be
> considered to apply only to the sympathetic systems of the Pingala Nadi and
> Ida Nadi, and thus the warnings don't apply to the methods used in Sahaja
> Yoga? ...warm or hot there is clearly something different about the Sahaja
> "cool breeze", but is it reasonable to state that no adverse effects are
> possible? (Especially when people are on their own?)
I do not believe there is a book can cover Kundalini throughly.
Just as in Jesus Christ, I do not think of a book can "contain" such
a great Lord - the son of God by itself completely.
For many people who heard about raising of the Kundalini, they
responded "Huh! that is very dangerous.". Yes, as you know, little
knowledge can be dangerous. For you know not what is on that road
ahead of you. Sahaja Yoga teachs you how to protect yourself against
negativity, how to surrender (not fight) your ego, how to cleanse
your chakra...etc. Sahaja Yoga teachs balancing of left and right
sympathetic nervous system. When a person felt warm or hot during
awakening of Kundalini, it is caused by the blockage of each center
chakra. Friction creates heat. One must learn to deal with
cleansing those centers.
Surely there is no adverse effects on the gentle cool breeze
and the vibrations on your finger-tips. It never occurs
that a Sahaja Yogi/Yoginis died of Cancer or heart troubles.
Not only that a realized soul can correct those problems if
they have those problems before they become realized.
|
| 401.6 | Lighting the candle | SHIRE::PHILIP | Phil Ward Mgmt. Sci. Geneva-Etang | Wed Oct 28 1987 11:57 | 82 |
| re .3;
In fact, we don't _do_ anything to get realization, just as a
candle being lit doesn't do anything except be ready and open to the
enlightenment. So to discuss different techniques for obtaining realization
is to miss the point a little; there aren't any techniques. (Although there
are plenty of people selling "techniques".)
In the past, seekers were obliged to take themselves away from the
mass of humanity and meditate in a remote place in a forest or in the
mountains for years on end, gradually purifying their subtle being under
the guidance of a realized guru, and only getting realization after a
tremendous sadhana. What is new about Sahaja Yoga, which since it is the
Yoga for the blossom time of humanity must be a yoga capable of being
enjoyed by ordinary householders such as ourselves, is that first comes the
realization and then the purification. As Sri Mataji has said, the old way
was as if we had to tidy a dark room and only then switch the light on; in
Sahaja Yoga, first we are given the light, then we can "tidy the room" much
more easily and see for ourselves what we need to do for our spiritual
growth.
(Todd, the dramatic experiences you describe seem to follow quite
closely on your starting with TM, from the dates you give; I wonder if
there is a connection.)
> only a few people are currently capable of producing the effects.
Last Monday night, Sri Mataji was in Rome, Italy, where she gave
realization to an audience of more than a thousand people, practically all
of whom felt the vibrations, the cool breeze and the peace as described in
previous notes. She was also interviewed on Italian television, and many
people phoned in having felt the cool breeze from her image on the TV. (I
just heard this from a friend who was there.) So many, many people are
capable, as each newly-realized person is himself capable of giving
realization. In Indian villages I have seen thousands of people at a time
experience realization in a single programme.
> It seems that once your "candle is lit" in Sahaja Yoga, you are on your own.
Not so. The best thing is to practise Sahaja Yoga with others,
following the rules and simple practices (okay, after realization there
are some very simple "techniques" which help to keep the subtle body in a
good state) which Sri Mataji has taught us. Your local Sahaja Yoga centre
can tell you more. People grow much faster and much more enjoyably in a
collective context than by themselves.
> I have developed some confidence in my own abilities to handle some potent
> energies, yet couldn't this energy overwhelm some people? What could a
> person do if they felt overwhelmed, or is this something that _couldn't_
> happen with the nature of the Sahaja Yoga energies? In particular,
> shouldn't Sahaja Yoga be accompanied by more specialized training?
It is your own spiritual energy; how could it overwhelm you? I have
never heard of anyone having such an experience.
> Is there some sense in which most current books on Kundalini can be
> considered to apply only to the sympathetic systems of the Pingala Nadi and
> Ida Nadi, and thus the warnings don't apply to the methods used in Sahaja
> Yoga?
Dead right, especially all the descriptions of intense heat, etc,
that you see in some of the more nonsensical books on the subject. As Sri
Mataji has said, it as though a peasant from some remote village who has
never before seen electricity finds a power outlet and sticks his fingers
in; he receives a big shock, and concludes that electricity is something
very dangerous. But if you understand, you just plug in the lamp and
turn it on. Kundalini is a maternal energy and her manifestation is
strong, but very gracious and gentle at the same time.
Don't forget that the cool breeze has been described in numerous
traditions, the "assas" of Islam, "Chaitanya" of the Hindus, "ruach"
of the Jews, "pneuma" of the graeco-Christian tradition...
> but is it reasonable to state that no adverse effects are possible?
Well, I've been practicing Sahaja Yoga for seven years now and I've met
hundreds of sahaja yogis, and I'm still waiting to hear of any adverse
effects...
Enjoy!
Phil
|
| 401.7 | A Unique Discovery | MLCSSE::SU | | Tue Dec 01 1987 10:29 | 401 |
|
With the permission of the East Coast Sahaja Yoga Center, I have
copied the following writing of Sri Mataji for our DEJAVU noter.
I think the message will surely affect or be very meaningful to
many of you deeply because you are the special kind who seek the
truth of God relentlessly. Many of you are particularly endeavor
of the spirit channeling, ouija board, psychic (extra sensory),
crystal healing, meditation, ancient holy scripts, tarot, palm
reading, witchcraft, haunted stories, dreams and mind control,
astral projection, reincarnation, karma...all that related to the
supernatural. In the pursuit of all those interests, we sometimes
expose ourselves without proper protection, and thus endangering
ourselves into the mesmerizing of further darkness. It is possible
that we can play into the hands of unthinkable and become engulfed
by the unthinkable evil forces. In many discussions in DEJAVU,
RELIGION, PHILOSPHY Notes Conference, we often forgot what was the
original goal we were trying to achieve. Instead, we chase the tail
of the wind to egoistic satisfaction and end up in a furious argument.
Most of us are intellectual engineers, computer scientists; our
awareness of such subjects is constantly changed as our understanding
goes deeper. I am very confident that our attention here will
be rewarding. The following wonderful lecture will, in particular,
explain a lot of phenomena which have been discussed by many of you
before.
Sahaja Yoga - A Unique Discovery. (by Sri Mataji)
Man in his search of joy and happiness is running away from his self,
which is the real source of joy. He finds himself very ugly and
boring because he is absolutely unknown to his self. Human being
seeks joy in money or possessions, in power or human limited love
and ultimately in religion that is also outside. The problem is how
to turn one's attention inward.
The inner being which is our awareness is an energy (I call it energy
of Divine Love). All the evolution and manifestation of material
energy is guided by the supreme energy of Divine Love. We do not
know how powerful and thoughtful this unknown energy is. The silent
working of awareness is so automatic, minute, dynamic and expansive
that we take it for granted. At first it appears as silent throbbing
vibrations through our being after self-realization. Because we
cannot fix our attention on to something that has no form (abstract
being), our attention is wandering outside on forms. Now a method
has been found out to tap the Divine power and this is called as
"Sahaja Yoga".
At the very outset, I have to say that the working of "Sahaja Yoga"
is very simple, although the operation within is quite complicated.
For example if you want to watch television it is very easy. But
to explain the engineering technique of a television set is very
difficult and complicated. It also needs a qualified engineer to
understand and explain its working. I will try to explain it in
the simplest way but please note that it is really complicated if
you want to know it in detail. The best way to enjoy television
is first to switch on and watch and then to understand its
engineering. As a mother I would say that I have done the cooking
for you. Why should you worry as to how it is done. If you are
hungry you should start eating. If you are not actually hungry
but only inquisitive, what can I do? I cannot force you nor can
I make you hungry by discussions or lecturing. I leave it to your
wisdom and to your freedom to feel the longing from inside.
The word 'Sahaja' (Saha + ja) means born with you (inborn).
Whatever is inborn would manifest without any effort. Hence
"Sahaja Yoga" is the name given to my system, which is effortless,
easy and spontaneous. It is natural to Nature (you may call it
life's source, vitality of Divine).
To understand life let us take a case of something that is living
- a germinating seed. The seed grows by itself into a tree, blooms
into flowers and the flowers get transformed into fruits. Any
human effort cannot change the process of growth of a seed into a
tree. The gardner can only look after the growth of the tree.
In the same way the process of growth of our consciousness to
further the evolution takes place effortlessly.
When the foetus is about 2/3 months old in the mother's womb, the
column of rays of consciousness emitted through the all-pervading
Divine Love, pass through the brain to enlighten it. The shape of
the human brain being prism-like, the column of rays falling on it
gets refracted into four diverse channels corresponding to the four
aspects of the nervous system.
They are:
1. Parasympathetic nervous system
2. Sympathetic nervous system (right)
3. Sympathetic nervous system (left)
4. Central nervous System (This need not be discussed as
it is the link with objectivity).
(1) The set of rays that fall on the fontanale bone (apex of the
head known as Taloo) pierce in the centre and pass straight into
medulla oblongata through a channel (Sushumna). This energy, after
leaving a very thread like thin line in the medulla obllongata,
settles down in 3 1/2 coils in the triangular bone placed at the
end of the spinal cord (Moolandhar). This is known as 'Kundalini'.
The subtle energy enters through the center of the brain (sahasrar
Brahmarandhra) and precipitates on its way in 6 more centers. The
gross manifestation of this subtle energy in the "sushumna" channel
of the spinal cord is termed as Parasympathetic nervous system and
"chakras" are expressed as plexuses outside the spinal cord.
Surprisingly, we have the same number of plexuses and subplexuses
outside as the number of "chakras" and their petals inside the spinal
cord. Very little is known about this system to the medical science.
It is termed as the autonomous nervous system - the system which
works spontaineously on its own. For example, if we want to increase
the rate of our heartbeat we can do it so by exerting the heart
(activity of the sympathetic nervous system) but we cannot reduce the
rate of the heart (activity of the parasympathetic nervous system).
The parasympathetic nervous system is a system which is like a petrol
pump through which the petrol of Divine Love fills us. But as soon as
a human child is born and the navel cord is broken a gap is created
in the "sushumna" (the subtle channel in the spinal cord), and also
outside, one can see the gap between the solar plexus and the vagus
nerve of the parasympathetic nervous system. This gap is known as
void in the Zen system of religion and Maya (or Bhav Sagar) in the
Indian thought. Later when ego and super ego bloat up like balloons
and cover our brain at the apex of the left and right sympathetic
nervous systems, the fontanale bone gets calcified and the all
pervading vital force of the Divine Love gets cut off completely.
Then the human being identifies himself as a separate entity and
the consciousness of I (Aham) presides. This is the reason why man
does not know his "universal unconscious." He is severed therefrom
by his ego (I).
(2) The sympathetic nervous system is created to use this vital
energy. There are two systems i.e. left and right. These two
channels which carry this energy in subtle form in the medulla
oblongata and are known as Ida and Pingala respectively. The right
side system (in the right handed man) caters to the emergencies of
the active consciousness (extra efforts and emergencies) and the
left side system - (medically they say it remains dormant) - caters
to the subconscious mind of the psyche (libido).
Hatha Yoga comes from words Ha and Tha, meaning the Sun and Moon.
Both these sympathetic nerve systems are called as the Sun and Moon
channels (i.e. Surya nadi and Chandra nadi). By this yoga you can
control the activity of the sympathetic i.e. you can use more energy
that is stored or else completely stop the activity of the sympathetic
for a short time. By using the stored energy you cannot achieve
eternal flow of the divine. With control over the sympathetic you
can slow the heart rate or even stop the heart for a short time and
may achieve all physical gross symptoms of para sympathetic but you
cannot activate the parasympathetic which is the channel for your
real yoga (meeting of the divine). With Hatha yoga you may even
control your mind. But the mind thus governed is heavily conditioned
for the spiritual flight into the divine. One may keep good health
and good mind to be a good citizen in a society but that is not the
only aim of life.
Both sympathetic and parasympathetic act on the plexuses; but in
opposition to each other i.e. the parasympathetic relaxes the plexuses
but the sympathetic squeezes the energy by constricting them. one
fills in the vitality and the other consumes it . There is a gap
in the parasympathetic nervous system (sushumna) but no gap in the
sympathetic nervous system at the navel point. This is the hurdle
that has rendered all our search and entry into the parasympathetic
fruitless so far. It is like three ladders, two of them touching
the ground while the central one is hanging in the air. So whenever
we try to rise in our consciousness, we move on to the sympathetic
system. If we pass towards the right side we enter onto the activity
which goes on bloating in the balloon of ego. Thus we feel responsible
and active. When this activity increases beyond limits, like a growing
tree whose roots are not equally grown, the being falls to the ground.
Over activity of sympathetic nervous system causes tension,
sleeplessness and ultimately all deadly diseases like cancer which
are caused by the constricted plexuses which are drained out of their
energy. If you make parasympathetic dominate the right side, then we
can antidote the effects of over activity and all the diseases and the
effect caused by this side get cured automatically.
The left side sympathetic nervous system (libido) has the power to
store all that is dead in us. It connects you with store houses of
the subconscious mind and also with the collective subconscious
(Bhootlok or Paralok). At the backside of the brain at the apex of
this channel the super ego exists like a balloon. It becomes heavy
by storing, the conditioning of the mind through libido. So if the
tension is heavy it breaks the super ego into many fragment. If you
still overexert by conditioning, a partial vacuum is created and this
sucks another dead personality from the collective subsconscious
(Paralok) in your super ego. So in your pursuit of truth, if you
take to futher efforts and indulge in concentration in training of
mind or forced abstinence or forced meditation or complete slavery
to emotional attachment of the mind, the libido with the aid of the
affected super ego may connect you to the collective subconscious
(Paralok) where all dead souls, bad, good or saintly, exist. These
souls start manifesting through you and you get siddhis or extra
sensory perceptions. Actually these are the different subtle (dead)
personalities dominating us through super ego.
There is another method which may be effortlessly employed by many
so called teachers by which they turn the "chakra" in the direction
of the libido and this can put you into your subconscious. This
method either makes this aspirant go into a trance or accept the
complete domination of the dead spirits introduced by the teacher
through the plexuses.
In the first case, the Sadhaka feels relaxed, his mind is switched
off, but after a few years of practice, he realizes his weakness
that he cannot face reality and he takes to heavy use of drugs.
In the second case, the aspirant becomes a complete slave of the
teacher and starts giving away all the material possessions to the
teacher without understanding the logic behind it. These teachers
never explain the technique they have employed, nor do they give
their powers to anybody else. In short, all efforts that you put
in the name of religion or mishandling of Kundalini by so called
realized people, can only activate sympathetic nervous system
(Ida and Pingla) that cannot make any progress to bring about the
play of parasympathetic (Sushumna).
All mesmeric powers such as materialization power (enslaving masses
for money power or fame), visionary powers (Drishti siddha), speech
powers (Vani Siddha), curing powers, transcendental feeling (power
of switching off the mind), separation of body and many other powers
are very ordinarily found among those who practice the control of
spirits (Pretsiddhi or Smashan Vidya). All such powers can be proved
as powers of the dead in any one of our experimental Centers.
These are no Divine powers because the Divine has no interest in
these gross subjects. It is only interested in the miracle of the
inner being and its further manifestation to bring about human
evolution. Thus those who indulge and use their attention
(i.e. chitta) on such "siddhis" and those who run after such gross
miracles find it difficult to follow "Sahaja Yoga."
We have noted that when such people confront "Sahaja Yoga", they
start trembling and shaking like lunatics who also behave in the
same way. If with very great difficulty such a person reaches the
state of self-realization, he completely loses all interest in such
powers and in their exhibition. Actually then he is freed of all
extra dead personalities who dominated him. There is no need to
pass through the subconscious strata to jump the unconscious.
The subconscious is an end by itself and one gets lost who enters
into its realms. These strata are placed vertically and the only
direct way is through prarsympathetic through Sushumna, the central
path which takes you to the Divine, the universal unconscious through
"Sahaja Yoga".
It is very dangerous to use the powers of the subconscious which may
become uncontrollable and torture the practitioner and Sadhaka.
Those who are temporarily benefited may suffer irreparable loss to
body, mind or grace.
All religions have promised inner silence when you reach the state
of self-realization, the inner miracle of the subtle awareness and
not gross jugglery. the Gita says that you become the witness
(Sakshi Swarup) of the play of Divine. Many modern thinkers are
also talking about the new awareness. This has been described as
"thoughtless awareness" which results in collective consciousness.
We hear of many prophesies made by ancient and modern writers about
the evolution of a new race of super human beings of unique awareness.
These are no longer empty words. Through the discovery of "Sahaja
Yoga" it is possible to achieve the transformation of the human
consciousness to higher planes promised by the various seers.
The subject of Kundalini is no longer a book knowledge. You can
see with naked eyes the breathing of the Kundalini at the Mooladhar
and also can feel the different "chakras" existing in the spinal
cord with your fingers. Formerly, bridging the gap in the "sushumna"
was the insurmountable problem but it is being discovered that if
this gap could be filled with the vibrating power of Divine Love,
the Kundalini rises like a majestic mother and breaks the apex of
the brain (Brahmarandhra) without giving the slightest trouble to
child (Sadhaka). It happens in a split second in the short-spell
between two successive thoughts. Of course, if the aspirant (Sadhaka)
is diseased or his "chakras" are constricted by overactivity of the
sympathetic nervous system, the Kundalini being the mother of every
individulal and embodiment of love, knowledge and beauty knows how
to reveal her love beautifully and to give rebirth to her child
without causing any hurt.
There are many descriptions about Kundalini warning us against the
dangers and perils of the "taming" of Kundalini. Also many books
describe various gross or frightful experiences of the Kundalini
awakening. Actually this is caused because Kundalini cannot rise
without the "Sahaja Yoga" i.e. if it is tried to be awakened by
someone who is not self-realized, the Kundalini does not leave her
seat or else without the proper invitation the Kundalini becomes
adamant and angry. Thus the sympathetic gets into activity. When
she is accused of sex, She sends heat waves over the sympathetic
nervous system which causes the constriction or blockage of the
plexuses and the path of the Kundalini is completely broken down.
Sometimes one gets into funny gesticulations or loses complete
awareness of the outside. Moreover with mishandling of "Chakras"
and Kundalini due to the ignorance or greed of the teacher, the
chances of realization of the aspirant can become very poor and
sometimes impossible.
The mind that is very much conditioned or the mind which is the
slave of self-indulgence or of egoistic actions and thoughts is
also a very slow conveyance for "Sahaja Yoga." Even if you read
too much about the deconditioning of the mind, you may get only
conditioned; if you try to decondition by efforts, you can become
conditioned much worse than what you were. Deconditioning is only
possible through Divine Love. The main condition of the "Sahaja
Yoga" is that your will and freedom are all the time respected.
In "Sahaja Yoga" the person is fully aware and alert and receives
inner silence and experience without doing any unnatural movements.
He sits in a completely easy pose throughout or he may also lie
down (Sahajasana or Shavasana). The breathing is normal or less
than normal.
Religions are also the expressions and experiments of the realized
souls, the seers. They also talk about the inner being, second birth
and about self-realization. In the beginning in India they tried
to take the attention inside by introducing symbols that they saw
of this unconscious universal being within. This gave rise to
pantheism and aspirant's attention got stuck to the symbols (Sakar)
and to rituals which killed the main objective.
So the other type of experiments of talking only about the abstract
(Nirakar) gave rise to many other religions which ended up as dogmas
or isms. The reason is obvious that talking about the flower or the
honey cannot take you to the honey but can only create dogmatic isms
in the mind. You have to be a bee to reach there i.e. you have to be
reborn. This has to happen within, to take you inside.
It is too great an achievement and unbelievable but I feel the
search of ages has brought great results.
The mind, with a child-like innocence achieves very quick results.
Whatever may be the loads of the mind, if the longing is honest and
earnest, sooner or later, the aspirant can get self-realization.
After reaching this state the vibration start emitting from the
extremities. They are described by Adi Sankaracharya in his work
Ananda Lahari.
These vibrations are the waves of Divine Love which can fill also
other persons' inner-being and give him same experience of
self-realization. This how the chain reaction starts. One light
enlightens another.
The physical manifestations are as follows:
The pupils of the eyes get dilated. (Parasympathetic action);
The face becomes radiant; the body becomes light; the tension is
completely removed; rising of the Kundalini can be seen by others
and felt by the aspirant; first the throbbing is clearly felt at
Sahasrar (apex of the brain) and when it stops the complete silence
is felt within and in all awareness; the flow of the grace is felt
coming down, cooling the whole being; as the attention moves to the
subtle the gross attachments drop out. A person gradually loses
identification with falsehood and artificiality. In the matter he
sees beauty and not its posssession value. In knowledge he
identifies himself the truth and he is not afraid to profess, nor
does he indulge in the double standards of life. His flow of love
becomes spontaneous, generous, without any tinge of attachment,
possession or any return and, the person becomes ageless, a hollow
personality.
Now let us see what happens inside.
The attention of the consciousness moves to the inner being
(Kundalini). As the thread (sootra) of a necklace is passing
through every bead of the necklace, the inner consciousness
(Kundalini) is also passing through every human being.
As soon as our attention moves to our inner consciousness we can
move on to everybody's Kundalini. One starts feeling the Kundalini,
its nature, its position in other persons. Collective consciousness
is thus established. Now you become a universal being. After some
days you cannot say who is the other person? The power of love is
so great and dynamic that with the movement of your fingers you can
move the Kundalini of thousands. It becomes child's play.
This is how the en-masse evolution of human beings will take place.
These are the signs of advent of Golden age of Truth (Satya Yuga).
Let us forget whatever hardships we have suffered in our search in
the past. It does not matter if some could not find it before this.
You have to open your mind and understand that though the discovery
is unprecedented it does not make any seeker or predecessor small.
If some experiemnts are made it does not matter if ultimately we
have found out the way. It is a collective achievement. Perhaps
in the chaos of Kaliyuga it was to happen and many of us, who have
been earnestly searching in many lives, are reborn to have their
promises fulfilled by the Divine. May be we were our predecessors.
On the tree of life there might have been very few flowers but
now the blossom time has come. Their fragrance of longing has
collectively materialized the manifestation of "Sahaja Yoga."
Many are going to jump into the realm of thoughtless awareness
where you get introduced to yourself and start identifying with
your universal nature. Those who deserve will get the throne of
their inner being which rules the skies of peace and the oceans
of divine love and supreme knowledge whithin, which is limitless
(Anant).
|
| 401.8 | For All in Boston Area | PCCSSE::SU | | Fri Mar 04 1988 12:01 | 15 |
|
"You cannot know the meaning of your life
until you are connected to the power
that created you."
-Sri Mataji
There will be introductory meditation on Thursday March 10th
and 24th at 7:30 pm at Gutman Library, Harvard Square.
(at the corner of Brattle Street and Appian Way, across from
American Repertory Theatre.)
No money taken. All are welcomed.
|
| 401.9 | So_how_was Sahaja? | ISTG::DOLLIVER | Todd O. Dolliver | Fri Mar 25 1988 11:16 | 9 |
| I hoped very much to attend one of the Sahaja Yoga meetings on March
10th or 24th but since I am moving into a new house _and_ moving into
a new life (getting married :-)) I was unable to make it.
Could someone who did attend either of these meetings please post
a reply describing what these meetings were like?
Thanks,
Todd
|
| 401.10 | Introductory Workshops | MOSAIC::SU | | Tue Apr 12 1988 13:30 | 34 |
|
Your Self-realization is possible now. Awaken
the joyous nature of the spirit within you,
spontaneously. Sahaja Yoga integrates all
aspects of life : Spiritual, emotional, mental
and physical.
Another introductory workshop meeting will be at:
Cambridge Friends School
5 Cadbury Road, Cambridge, Ma.
On Monday, April 25, 1988
7:30 to 9:30 p.m.
Direction : Five minutes from Harvard Square:
Go West on Mass Avenue, past Porter Square, left at Kentucky
Fried Chicken onto Walden Street, right on Sherman, left on
Cadbury. All welcome ! Free Admission. Please come and
experience for yourself. You may ask any question you may
have.
For the New Yorker, the same introductory workshop is offered
at :
United Methodist Church
1200 North Avenue
New Rochelle
Every Thursday at 7:30 p.m., For more info call (914)-636-4406
Free Admission.
|
| 401.11 | The Knowledge Within | MOSAIC::SU | | Tue Apr 19 1988 13:48 | 677 |
|
The Knowledge Within
H.H.Mataji's address given @Kingston UK 6/11/80
Today we have gathered here to know something about
our Self. If the knowledge is from the books or from
some person who says that he knows about Self, how far
will it reach us? It can only go up to mental level
and we can only understand it through our mental
understanding. The mental understanding comes to us
through our rationality, through our intellect which
in itself is a limited thing.
So we enter into another understanding which is still
very limited. If I tell you that there is a Self which
resides in our heart and that there is a power within
us which is all the time waiting for an occasion to give
you your second birth, it tell you that, then you will
only understand me mentally. This has all been said
already, what is so new about it? At the most I can
give it in a very modern fashion, something quite
intellectual which will make you have more mental feats
to go round and round. You will sit down and analyse and
reach nowhere.
I say there is a power, no doubt, which is called
"Kundalini" within us. So many say that because it
is written long time back. Thousands of years back.
Christ has said it that you are to be born again, that
you are to be baptised, not by theological college people,
but by somebody like John, the baptist, who had the
authority from the Divine. This power does lie dormant
within you but everybody writes differently about it.
Very few really agree. This is another confusion one
faces. That there is a power lying within us and some
say that it gives you electric shock, some say that you
start jumping like a frog and some say that you start
flying in the air. Such confusion, while you are seekers,
seekers of ages you have been seeking. You are genuine
seekers and then while seeking you don't know where to go
and what to expect; you jump into problems.
The other day when I went to Switzerland, one of my
children, who had arranged the programme, he told me
"Mother, here people are very sceptical about Indian
Gurus." I am very happy about it, really very very
happy that they have started thinking about it because
they have been deluded and deceived and now they are
disillusioned completely. And they find it impossible
to believe anyone who talks of God. So the first topic
that he wanted me to discuss during my stay there was
"Demystification of Gurus". Quite a challenging topic.
But this I said in 1970 in India, in 1973 in America,
but no one would like me for that. They say, 'Why should
you criticise others".
Falsehood is falsehood and reality is reality. You
will now know through some of those people who are here
that how you have been misled, how you have been deceived
for money which you cannot understand because you have
gone beyond it now. You are seeking beyond money.
You know that money is not going to give you joy.
You know that very well. But those who have not
yet known that still they are climbing up the cusp,
they have not seen the ditch below. Such people try
to give you some sort of a jargon and receive lot
of money from you. It is a very shameful affair, I
feel myself.
But that does not mean that there is no reality. If
there is no reality, how can we have copies of that?
If there are no flowers, how will you create plastic
folwers? So, if you find somebody so unreal, you must
know that you have to find out the Real. And when
you are finding the real, you must know that you must
keep yourself absolutely alert about it that you are
not going to accept anything but real. But you can be
hypnotised, you can be brain-washed, because you do
not know all these things. Somebody says some words
in Sanskrit language, you get so enamoured by that as
if Sanskrit language is something out of the blue, e.g.
some of the disciples, who went to certain Gurus, got
"Mantras" which if you tell an Indian, he will laugh
out his stomach; like a Mantra given "AINGA". Now
tell any Indian and he will laugh and people had paid
three hundred pounds for such a nonsense like that
which means nothing, which cannot be a Mantra. Why
do you need a Guru for Mantra? There is a science about
it. Because we do not go into the understanding of it
and we just jump on to it, because they want you to,
because they want money. Simple thing. It is an
enterprise.
You have given up everything for the sake of your
seeking. You have seen that the value of these material
things will not take you anywhere, you have seen beyond.
Your value system is different but if the value system of
some people is different from you they can exploit you.
So the natural reaction, I can understand very well,
should be such.
But there it reality and that it exists within you
and that there is Self within you and once discovered,
you find your Absolute. To tell you that you should
become a very quiet and serene person would be absurd.
To tell you that you should be such a master over your
passions and your lust and your greed that nothing should
sort of dominate you, this is like giving a big lecture
to you. It has no meaning.
You have gripped it yourself these things and how will
you leave it, when your grip is so strong. You have
to grip something else. It is simple common sense.
If you find something, much more valueable, much more
dynamic, much more joy giving, establishing your sense
of security, you will give up all these nonsensical
things.
But see how it works out. A gentleman, who came from
a horrible Guru to me, who was absolutely pestered and
finished by that Guru. He used to deliver only
introductory lectures. And he said, "I used to get
300 people for introductory lectures in the same hall
in which you are giving lecture, Mother". What do you
say to people there, isn't it queer? He is a well
known person who charges you money, who gives you
courses; he has ruined so many people. It is like,
just as I was watching people going into a pub and
coming out of it all drunk. Others are attracted much
more, seeing them drunk like that. Sometimes it is
impossible to understand human nature and when the
Reality stands before you, you crucify that. How do
you explain all this? And the acceptance of reality is
your glorification. Are you going to add anything to
Reality? Supposing I wear a diamond necklace, it is
going to adorn me not to the diamond necklace. This
is billions and billions of times more brilliant than
all these things which adorn us. If you accept that,
you will be glorious, you will be lusturous. Isn't it?
Think about it. Because we are charmed about these
outside things, their deceptive ways, their cunning
ways and that we are hypnotised. That is the only
explanation. That's how they have managed so far.
One after another this hypnosis spreads like fire.
You ask them what did you find. "Don't ask us, we
are very happy people". After 3 days you find that
person has committed suicide. We are not aware still
that this is the most important, the most and vital
time in the history of human beings.
The last judgement has started. We are facing the
last judgement today. We are not aware of it. And
all the Satanic Forces have come out like the wolves
in sheeps' clothes. And they are trying to attract
you and you do not judge them. You only sit down and
judge the Reality. It has started, it is a fact. It
has started.
Now, let us see from God's point of view how He is
going to judge you. It is quite easy to say that we
do not believe in God. Very easy to say taht we don't
believe in this Government. But if you do anything
wrong, then you know there is a government acting. In
the same way it is very easy to say that we do not
believe in God. He is so compassionate, He is so loving,
He is so kind, that He has given us our freedom to know
ourselves. And we rely on Him, we take Him for granted.
He has made us human beings from Amoeba to this stage.
He has spread out such a beautiful world around us.
He has done all that. But there is a judgement which we
have to face now and the judgement that is going to come
from God. It is not going to be the way that we
understand that He sits like a magistrate and calls you
one by one "come along" and then you have a pleader there,
sitting.
But in a subtler way, He has already put the judging
forces within you. See in the evolution he has worked
it out. In the evolution, how beautifully He has worked
it out. From amoeba to this stage, how have we come?
Many animals were discarded. He saved some animals e.g.
from Mammoth family He saved Elephant. He saved many and
so many were discarded one by one all these years. In
the same way, human beings who have been very much on
the extremes have been discarded. You see the history.
Now you won't find anyone killing his seven wives these
days. I mean impossible, you cannot do it. Person like
Hitler came up. Finished. Anybody who came up with any
extreme ideas of domination or anything, was finished.
Those ideas die out. People are ashamed of them and new
ideas come up into human beings - accepting balance,
tranquality, peace.
We are talking about it. People talk about peace, but are
we really wanting peace within ourselves? And if we
are really wanting it, what are we doing about it?
Actually the judgement has started and to judge you God
has already placed the whole magistracy within you.
All the magistrates are already sitting down there.
Christ has said, "Those who are not against me are with me".
These are the magistrates. And these magistrates have
settled down within you on different Centres in your
spinal chord and in your brain.
It is very interesting and all these seats are like
a panel sitting in your brain and when the light of
Kundalini rises through these centres, when these
centres are enlightened within you, you start
enlightenment being manifested on your fingers.
The end of your fingers get enlightened, the sensitivity
of your fingers tell you what centres are there
affected within you. This Kundalini rises and comes up
to this point, the fontanel bone area or the Talloo as
they call it, the soft bone here in your childhood,
and it breaks it. Actually it breaks it. You can see
in a person, who does not have much hair here, the thing
just going down a little. First it pulsates. You can
even see the pulsation of the Kundalini in the trianglar
bone which is sacrum and when this Kundalini rises, you
can see even the movement of this Kundalini. Not in all
but in some. Because if the person is first class or
you can say if the aeroplane is first class the landing
is first class, its shooting off is first class. In
such a person, there is no obstruction, you can not see
the Kundalini pushing up. For example, when I came to
this place there was no problem on on the traffic, so
we just smoothly came away, nobody noticed us. But if
there was a traffic problem, there would be jamming here
and jamming there. In the same way when this Kundalini
rises in a person who has a problem on its Centres,
it shows. You can see with your naked eyes.
This is what is Kundalini awakening. Not that some
people say that they started jumping like a frog. Now,
we must use our brains. Brains have to be intact in
modern times. Are we going to become frogs now after
becoming human beings? Are we to become birds, after
becoming human beings? Your sciences, like psychology
itself, I mean many of them, believe that you have to
jump into your unconscious - achieving your collective
consciousness. Very clearly it has been said by these
people. Then we must expect something of that nature
where we jump into our collective conscionsness. It
is not that because I am saying it or anybody else is
saying it but it has to happen to you.
The other day I was in Hamstead, I know what is happening
with some one. Some people did get their vibrations,
they did feel the cool breeze coming from their hands
but some did not. They said that they have got it and
they just disappeared. This is not the way you are
going to treat yourself, you are to love yourself and
you have to adore your seeking and you have to get your
fulfilment. As your mother I must tell you this is a
very serious matter. There is no Guru shopping going
on here, you have to get your realization. You have to
get it. It is so fortunate that the time has come, when
you are living and that you can have it because of that
you took your birth during this time because you are
Seekers of very ancient times as I told you.
It is written in one of our scriptures in India - called
as "Nala-Akhyan". When Nala, one of the tortured souls
by Kali, caught hold of the Kali. It is said that now is
the rule of Kali. Kali is the sinister fellow, the one
who brings all confusion and confuses people. He confused
Nala. By that he got separated from his wife. So when
Nala got hold of this Kali, he said, "Now, I am going to
kill you. I am going to kill you once for all, so that
you do not create confusion into people anymore". So
Kali said, "Alright, you can kill me, I will accept it
but first of all you should know my MAHATMYA (importance)
I do have some MAHATMYA (importance)". Nala said, "What
importance can you have? You create confusion in the
minds of people, what importance can you have?" He said
that, "When I will be ruling i.e. when he will as in
these modern times ruling means creating confusion in our
minds. Everything has become relative now. We talk like
that, "Yes it may be alright, may not be alright, may
be good, may not be good". That is the time when the
confusion will be reigning on this earth that is Kali
Yuga (the modern times). Then those great saints and
those great people the Seekers, the Sadhakas who have
been searching God in the hills and dales and in the
caves will come back as ordinary householders and they
will get the REALITY. In this confusion only, they are
going to get the vision of REALITY, they are going to
become the REALITY. They are going to get their self-
realization". And Nala forgot all his vindictiveness
and his anger and what Kali had done to him. He said,
"On this point I forgive you because I respect them so
much. For that collective good I give up all my personal
problems. Let this happen."
That only in Kali-Yuga, the sun of Sat-Yuga, the World
of Truth, the age of enlightenment is going to come and
those Saints who were seeking the reality in the forests
are born today in this World. You can see them, they
are saintly. They can see the joke of artificial life so
clearly. They know it is all absurd but then they do not
know what is the Real. But the time has come and it has
to be worked out and it will be worked out.
It has worked out in your great country and now, say,
a thousand people are there very much in it who have
understood it. There must be about at least 300 people
who are actively working it out at different places and
I am very happy to come to this old city of Kingston,
where the stone for the enthroning of the king was put.
Must be something special about it.
But the people have lost their sensitivity to Reality,
not only in this country but every where, much more in
India, you will be surprised. They are all getting
sophisticated. They are getting developed. They do
not know what you have found by your development. If
anybody tells them, they think, "You want to enjoy all
fruits of development and you are just telling us lies".
So it is very necessary for you to understand for definite
purposes that the Judgement has started. And for that
Kundalini is placed within you. But I must say She is
a great Judge, you will not find such a Judge anywhere
in the whole universe, because She is your own mother.
And, She is Nirvyaj She is just giving. She does not
want anything from you, nothing whatsoever. She wants
that you must get your property. You must get your Self.
You must get all your powers. She doesn't want anything
from you. That you should know your Self. That you
should become your Absolute. That is what She wants.
She is your Mother born again and again with you. She
has recorded all your problems you have created for
yourself for Her ascent. She knows everything about
you and She judges you on this point, "How much you
are sincerely wishing your ascent". That's all.
She knows you out and out. When She rises, She shows
those symptoms, She shows what is wrong with you. But
She is your own, absolutely your own. There is no one
greater your own than She. She is your friend and She
judges you because you must get the Best; because She
knows what is the Best for you. For, a child may like
to put his hands in the electric socket but the Mother
says, "Don't do it, Don't do it". But the child does
not listen, he gets angry. Still She says, "No, No, you
cannot do it." Because She loves you. Loves in the
purest form; where you do not expect anything from the
other person. And such a power lies dormant within you,
which is just waiting for an occasion that when she rises,
when She sprouts like the germinating power in a seed,
when She comes up, then there should be some one who
should look after you. There should be some one who
should guide, there should be someone who should docode
and tell you what you feel on the fingers mean, and what
is happening to you. Otherwise you will not know your
moorings, you will not know where you are going and you
will fall into a trap of ignorance or may be you may be
still there not knowing much.
So She wants to use somebody there as the mouthpiece.
It is that the Unconscious has to speak through someone.
And that someone has to be a person of the same nature
as the Kundalini is. Those who make money from you and
extort you and leave you in the lurch, how can they be
called as Gurus? They are the thieves standing outside
the door. They are just waiting for an opportunity to
catch hold of you because they have already been judged,
discarded and they are going to the Jail and they want
more people to go with them.
This Kundalini when She rises, She first soothes you
physically. That is you can say as a by product you get
your Health, e.g. Cancer can not be cured without the
Kundalini awakening. This I have been saying. When
doctors get cancer, they come to me and they get cured.
But I am not sitting down here to cure Cancer, not at
all nor any Sahaja Yogi is interested in Cancer patients.
But if you want to have your Realization you Cancer will
be cured, troubles will be cured, your health will be
alright. I mean those who have realization, are sitting
here, had been suffering physically or mentally, some
of them were even epileptic and had very bad physical
problems, there were some who had blood-cancer, some of
them had other type of physical problems.
With all these things you are faced with the Divine -
Love of God - His desire. Kundalini is the representative
of His Desire. Desire of the ocean, of the Compassion
and of Love. That He wants to bestow His kingdom upon
you - That He wants to make you the prince of His kingdom.
This is a very very serious thing and we have to concentrate
upon this point.
The judgement has to be done and there is a power within
us which is to judge. This power is the desire of God,
of that God who is Almighty, who has given us our freedom.
He is not going to challenge it. His might, His strength,
His powers are not going to stand against our freedom.
But his desire is within you existing on the Kundalini and
this desire rises within you, enlightens you but it does
not force you, it does not take away your freedom. It
enlightens you to see. You have freedom to be in this room.
It is not forced that you sit here or there or walk away.
Nothing is forced upon you. But you are given a room
which is enlightened. So you use your freedom in a better
way with more understanding, because you are enlightened,
you can see and then you know what to accept and what not
to accept.
First thing is to enlighten you. Unless and until you are
enlightened you are in confusion, you cannot see through.
Then it is left to your freedom to decide. So She cures
you, She improves you, She bestows all the blissful things
upon you. She takes you away from the worries of grosser
level like after realization, many people have solved their
material problems. Not that they have become Mr. Ford or
someone like that but the attitude changes and the material
problems get solved. Because there is a Centre for that
also within us. Your family problems get solved. Husband
wife problems get solved, so that you are freed. Your
grip over these things that worry you, is released and that
now you can see with greater freedom what you have to choose,
what course to take. After giving all these concessions and
all these advantages and all the possible help, then you are
judged. Can you think of any magistrate that generous ?
And such a thing exists within us. We have to be very
thankful to God for what He has done for us. We have
no idea. We have taken Him for granted. We have not
been able to thank Him for what He has done for us and
how kind He has been to us. For a small thing we try
to get rid of Him from our hearts. Still He exists,
the Kundalini exists within us. Try anything against it,
She exists. I have seen some people having Kundalini
which is beaten up, there has been horrible marks of
pain and anguish and She is just turning Her sides in
anguish but still She exists for that moment when She
will give you what She is there for. What a blessing!
Where can you find all this? It is all within you which
has to work out.
But even when they get their realization, I find, they
just disappear, even after realization. Can you imagine?
Progress in the West has been like that. You move 3 steps
forwards and 4 steps backwards. Really you will be amazed.
I don't know what has gone wrong with the Western mind
which is disillusioned by the material gains. But when
it comes to Sahaja Yoga, their calibre is just of the
lowest type, sometimes, one cannot understand. Now can
these people have no self-esteem, while in the villages
of India people get it and have it just like that no
rumblings, nothing. They are just there. Complications
are there, I agree. But you must have self-esteem. It
sometimes, really makes you feel sick.
Perhaps you do not know that in this country I have worked
on seven or eight people for four years. For four years,
can you believe it? Not that there is something wrong with
you. You are seekers, you are saints born in this country.
What has happened to your saintiness? Why so flippant, why
so superficial? Why don't yu touch it deeply? Why don't
you understand your Self? I just fail to understand why
don't you respect your Self. I respect you and I love you
very much because I know you, I know you from ages. You are
the lost children, I know that but I don't know how to
establiish that within you. Sometimes my condition is the
same as that of your Kundalini.
You have to be in a great haste to get it. You have to
become absolutely dynamic and blow it out and talk to
the people that this is the situation and emergency.
Can't you see what is happening in the World? Can't
you see the confusion? But the situation is taken for
granted. Even if it is faced, it is faced in a very
intellectual way that you feel guilty about say, Vietnam.
Very good idea, sitdown here. Easychair politicians,
thinking about Vietnam or file it up.
You are the chosen ones who have to receive it and it
has to happen. But to take Reality you think hundred
times and to get into dirty, filthy circle - it just
clicks. Whom should I blame for this? These horrible
Gurus or these horrible people, who have put up a show
for you or it is your knave attitude towards the morality.
I shudder to see the way the things are sometimes and
the way the people are taking things for granted also.
It is your responsibility today, the ones who are
supposed to be the Seekers to see that you bring forth
the Reality to the people and tell them that please see
and get it. Because you are their fellow beings. You
are their kith and kin. How can you leave them even if
you get your own realization? Even if you enter into
the kingdom of Heavens, you will not forget them, you
will think of them and you cannot be happy. Even when
you get your realization also, unless and until all
those saints who, out of their ignorance, are lost, you
will think of them. I have to work out through you. I
cannot work it out alone. If I could then there would
have been no difficulty. If God could work out just like
this, give them realization, just finished. Establish
them alright. But it will not. Because you have the
freedom. Why you have the freedom? Because without your
freedom you cannot come to that calibre by which you are
raised. We do not realize where we are today, we do not
realize. Sometimes I feel, I am talking to walls, e.g.,
you will find that some people are slaves of watches.
They have no time. "I have no time, I am so very busy".
Why are you saving time? For what? You are saving time
for the "becoming" not for wasting it in the parks or in
horrible places like races etc.
You are saving time for "becoming" because you are a
diamond. You are to be chiselled out yourself. You
are not saving it for wasting. I mean the best
advertisement will be " Save fifty pounds to spend three
thousand". Something like that. You are saving your
time not to waste it. Saving it for something extremely
precious, extremely vital and important, something that
you have been seeking. But I do not know how some times
to keep you on that level of depth. Of course some of
the people are such high calibre even in this country
that they are very satisfied. You do not know how much
has been done in this country also by God. For example,
I went to see Stonehenge, Stonehenge is the creation of
Mother earth. You can see the vibrations. You can feel
it. There are so many things done in this country.
Kingston itself is so vibrating. I was amazed. What did
you find? At least 100 people went into that carriage
and some came in here walking, going up and down. Some
walked in, some got out. They aren't decided still.
Still no proximity to sensitivity. No sensitivity towards
the Reality. They cannot feel. May be - may be, it will
work out. I am sure it will work out. I am the most
optimistic person you can ever see. See, optimism is
my nature, I believe. It is going to become. Only thing
your so called "freedom" comes in the way. So try to
understand that this freedom is given to you so that you
can become your Self and not that you should become an
animal. An animal; what is the use of giving realization
to, say, a chicken? Can I give also? That is the point.
Many people say, "Mother, I have done lots of good things".
I ask, "What good things have yu done", "I don't eat
chicken". Now, I say, "Why are you saving chickens for me,
you better save yourself ". All sorts of funny ideas they
have.
It is you, the Seekers, the buds on this beautiful Tree
of Life, they are the ones for whom this creation is
created. They are the ones who have to get it. They are
the ones who have to have it. The whole universe has
blossomed into them and they want to become what - worms?
Just think about it.
By God's grace we start the programme of realization,
which may take perhaps a split of a second, it might
have already worked it out because today I was little
going too much, I think. Kingston is a good place.
May be one day it will become a very great place, I
feel. But let us see how much you use the power that
is flowing in the area. I hope something will work out.
Now after realization you have to take it up seriously,
You have to work it out because after finding it also,
it is not that you suddenly jump on the sun or the moon.
Even going to moon what did you get? You could not
understand anything. So you have to go into all the
areas of your being because the movement will start inside.
You have to take your attention to all the areas within you.
You have to settle down your attention and now attention
will lose the grip over non-sensical things. All the
priorities will change. The greatest thing is that when
It pierces the Sahastrara, the joy starts pouring and you
start feeling that cool breeze of the Holy Ghost and you
start feeling every where. You can find out. Now you can
judge others and yourself. You can help others automatically.
You have not to go out for that, you have not to get
medicines, you don't have to get anything. Just you being
there, you help others in their Salvation as if the whole
mechanism starts working. The whole technique starts
working and you start seeing the whole thing. You will
be amazed.
You have to know how to work it out on your own self and
others. It is a great fun. We are all in the Great Fun
mood and you should also enjoy with us. And it is wonderful.
No time for misery. Only thing one feels is that why these
people are doing like this. Like grown ups and mature
people we look at little children why are they putting
their hands in the fire.
May God Bless You.
|
| 401.12 | Meditation Workshop | MOSAIC::SU | | Fri May 20 1988 13:30 | 13 |
|
There is another Boston Introductory Meditation Workshop tonight
at The Friends Meeting House, 5 Longfellow Place, Cambridge, Ma.
May 20th, Friday from 7:30 to 9:30 PM.
It is only five blocks from Harvard Square, off Brattle,
in Longfellow Park.
All Welcome!
No money taken.
|
| 401.13 | Sri Mataji in Person, San Diego | SHIRE::PHILIP | Phil Ward Mgmt. Sci. Geneva-Etang | Mon Jul 18 1988 07:38 | 115 |
|
*** SRI MATAJI IN PERSON !!! ***
Sri Mataji Nirmala Devi will be speaking and giving Self-realisation
at a public meeting in San Diego this Friday evening. Admission
is free. Not to be missed should any of you be in the area.
Where: The Organ Pavilion, Balboa Park
When: Friday July 22, 7:30 p.m.
Feel free to bring your children (unless they're going to make a
noise...) and your friends who may be interested.
Phil
--------
A little biographical sketch of Sri Mataji for newcomers:
------- Born in the heart of India
Sri Mataji was born at Chhindwara, north of Nagpur in central India, on
the 21st of March 1923, at midday. She took birth in the ancient
patrimony of the Shalivahan kings, an ancient imperial dynasty from
which her family, the Salves, is descended.
Her father, K. R. Salve, was a politician, active in the struggle
against British colonialism. After independence he became the only
Christian member of the Indian federal legislature. Apart from his
political concerns, he was a man of immense culture, knowing several
languages and having translated the Koran into Hindi.
Sri Mataji's mother was the first lady in India to obtain a university
degree, in mathematics, but decided to consecrate herself to her family
and the upbringing of her eleven children.
When the family's property was sequestered by the British, Nirmala,
eleven years old, was sent to Gandhi's ashram in nearby Wardha during
the school holidays. She shared the life and the tasks of the children
of the place and the meditation at which the Mahatma presided at 4
o'clock each morning.
------- Studies and Prison
Nirmala Salve chose to study medicine, in order to discover the links
between spirituality, the subtle body, anatomy, and the individual
evolution of the human being through the several stages of his
existence.
At this period, her material means were very much reduced, and when she
was 18 years old her father was arrested. She was obliged to leave the
university and go into hiding for several months. Subsequently
imprisoned herself, she was molested during her interrogation by the
British.
When she recalls this part of her life, she underlines its importance.
"...Liberty is necessary, political liberty, in order to be able to
speak freely, especially about God." ... "because my life, my mission,
my existence, everything for me only exists for the emancipation of
humanity."
------- Family Life
After independence, Nirmala Salve married Chandrika Prasad Srivastava,
who was later to become the head of the Shipping Corporation of India.
They had two daughters, to whose upbringing Sri Mataji devoted most of
this part of her life. The years of struggle were succeeded by a happy
family life.
At the end of the sixties, the marriage of her two daughters brought
this third period of her life to an end. The ceremonies, complex to
organize as Indian ritual demands, ended her immediate maternal
responsibilities to her daughters, and she was thus able to devote her
attention to her spiritual calling.
------- The Mission
The sixties were the years in which numerous westerners, hippies and
seekers, started to appear in India. Their passage was accompanied by a
proliferation of all sorts of "gurus", and to her sadness Sri Mataji
could see that the true teachers hid themselves from the public,
leaving only the power-, popularity-, and money-hungry in the
market-place of the seekers.
In 1970 she resolved to publicly denounce all the false gurus, and to
call all the misguided westerners to be reconciled with themselves, and
to find the original source within themselves which permits this
integration.
At this period, her husband, Mr. Srivastava, was appointed
Secretary-General of a United Nations Agency in London, the
International Maritime Organization. (He had since been re-elected
three times by a handsome majority of the U.N.'s member states to this
post, which he holds to this day.) In 1974, Sri Mataji and Mr.
Srivastava moved to London.
Sri Mataji pursued her spiritual work in London, returning every winter
to India to be with her children in the main cities of India and in the
hinterland of Maharashtra. Her audience in India tends to come from all
classes of society, with the simple village people being particularly
receptive to her message.
For Sri Mataji, human evolution is not yet complete. The present time,
with its possibilities of communication, allows humanity to open its
awareness to a new collective dimension of being. This new dimension
exists already in the Unconscious, as Jung had remarked earlier in the
century, but it now had to enter the field of human consciousness.
How is this new awareness to come about? - to this question Sri Mataji
brings an answer. Her teaching reconciles and integrates all the
different facets of the human being, as well as on a larger scale
integrating and transcending all the races, castes, nationalities,
religions, and fields of knowledge.
|
| 401.14 | An Open Invitation | MOSAIC::SU | | Thu Mar 09 1989 17:33 | 22 |
|
You are cordially invited
by Sahaja Yoga International
to an Evening Presentation on
"Personal and World Transformation"
Saturday, April 8th at 7:30 P.M.
Boylston Hall, Harvard Yard
(Adjacent to Widener Library)
Harvard Square, Cambridge
Boston, Massachusetts
For more information call:
(617-646-7547)
Note:
Thou shall never be asked for donation or any
admission for Sahaja Yoga Presentation.
|
| 401.15 | Know the infinite and you will become the infinite | VIDEO::SU | | Thu Apr 06 1989 15:36 | 94 |
| This base note #1023 (We're part of the fire that is burning...) touch off
our main objective of this entire Dejavu notesfile again - the pursuit of
the root knowledge, the Truth.
The concept of God's image does not mean human race can think outwardly that
we are to think we can do anything we want and lead to our own destruction -
the resolution of the earth planet.
The entire human race is a part and parcel of the whole, as this base note
span off. We have to understand the meaning of this and come to union with
the Spirit (the awakening, the reborn process). I am not talking about the
Christian baptize process, but the real transformation has to happen within
ourself (each individual). Until than, until that self-realization process
take place within us, whatever we do we are doing from the level of ego and
superego (the movement of past and future subconscious; the Yin and Yan; the
emotion and action process).
The message of the millennial tradition - Know the infinite and you will
become the infinite. For William Blake and several others, to know God is to
become God. The absolute knowledge, or entry into the living truth, implies
an absolute transformation.
The message from Infinite Voyage - the knowledge of West, the advance of
human knowledge is leading us to what may be the predictable disaster.
Let's use the analogy of a tree of life to explain this knowledge.
In the West, the knowledge we have is the knowledge from outside as branches,
leaves, the barks, the flower and the fruit...etc., but none of the roots that
beneath the surface of the Mother earth. But, one must know the roots on which
the tree is standing. Unless and until we know the roots, we cannot progress
in proper way.
In the nature, all kind of trees grow in its particular height but it does
not cross over each other. Not only we see they grow, we also see its own
limitations, includes the beauty of seasonal cycle. The water go up the
tree, nourish the leaves and evaporated by the sun. But the water rises up
to the leaves again. Then the tree leaves forms as a catalyst for the rain
to come in and then it rains. During the Winter season, there is no sunshine,
and so the leaves drop out because of the shortage of water. Because of this
falling leaves action, it also work as a reconstruction as a nourishment of
nitrogen to the roots. This is the nature spontaneous integrated control
of cycling of the seasons. In the animal world, this also happen among the
different wild animals - we can say that they are under the bondage of God.
A frog will behave like a frog. A lion behave like a lion, so does a tiger
behave as a tiger and everyone in the jungle knows the difference. No one
minds a tiger eat another small animal our from hungry. Nature has its own
understanding and sharing until the human being has enter the place and
started to project our own ideal outwardly. We loose our contact with the
roots, the nature part, the spirit within us.
The difference of knowledge of roots and branches is exactly the difference
of East and West. The West knows the sciences of branches, leaves but not
the knowledge of East (the study of the roots, the Spirits). Being an image of
God but moving away from God is making us to be lost in distress further and
further.
Two years ago, I have come to study all religions of the world. I have come
to understand that all great religions are merely a branch or fruit of the
same tree of life. It was all because of the followers of the Great Masters,
we saw the difference of religions organization as today. By the teaching
of Sahaja Yoga from the great Indian spiritual master Shri Mataji, we can
learn the real transformation of Spirit awakening take place. We come to
experience that indeed the roots knowledge is what we have been seeking for
the whole entire human history. By understanding this root knowledge, we can
attain the epitome of human evolution - to be union with our Creator again.
This also touch off Jung's discovery (he was a realized soul) that we can
achieve the state of collective subconscious. Jung's statement is a great
achievement for Psychology Science to depart from miserable mis-informed
Freud theory.
Better yet, today we have arrived the new age of Collective Consciousness -
one more giant steps from Collective Subconsciousness.
Through Sahaja Yoga, we achieve the nature spontaneous awakening of the pure
desire of all primordial power within us (the Spirit). Our physical body
become part and parcel of the whole. We become a drop of the ocean of Divine
love and joy. This is not an empty statement like many noter has put in this
Dejavu notesfile as to prove that he can create a word-jungle. Sahaja Yoga,
develop by Shri Mataji, is the greatest meditation technique unveil to
human race.
Many people has asked me what is the difference of Sahaja Yoga and all other
Yoga in this world? I can tell you this honestly that Sahaja Yoga begins
at where all other Yoga stop. Sahaja Yoga go beyond all mystical point.
It is one technique you can prove it to yourself by feeling the cool breeze
(pneuma, the zephyr, the breath of life) in your own hands. Sahaja Yoga
is not a blind faith. After you receive this lights of Divine, you can
also give it to the other person as you have become a drop of the ocean.
By attaining the roots knowledge, whatever you are endeavor in this tree
of life, you will be rewarded with blossom of Divine love.
Best regards,
Sarvesh
|
| 401.16 | Let them eat air | USAT05::KASPER | In the eye of a storm hope is born | Thu Apr 06 1989 17:11 | 10 |
| re: .15 (Sarvesh)
I like your tree analogy. Imagine what would happen if all the branches
of the greatest oak on earth suddenly possesed ego consciousness and
could manipulate the trees roots to it's own ends. How much longer do
you think it would last? Not very long, I would guess.
Where does one find out more about Sahaja Yoga?
Terry
|
| 401.17 | Other recommendations | SCOPE::PAINTER | Wage Peace | Thu Apr 06 1989 19:58 | 21 |
|
From another source: "The Gnostic Gospels" by Elaine Pagels
The last chapter of this book is entitled "Self-Knowledge as Knowledge
of God". I'm recalling this from memory, however from the "Book
of Truth" (one of the Gospels), it is written (paraphrased here):
"What you bring forth from you will save you. What you do not bring
forth from you will destroy you."
The answers are to be found from within. When you are able to
consciously recognize the destructive patterns in your life, only
then will you have a chance of turning them around. This is the
task we are faced with, both at an individual level and at a planetary
level.
For those interested in Jung, his last work entitled "The Unexplored
Self" is highly recommended. It is relatively short and easily
understood.
Cindy
|
| 401.18 | How do you know? | OSLLAV::SVEINN | Truth is a pathless land... | Fri Apr 07 1989 05:53 | 18 |
| re: .15 (Sarvesh)
I agree with most of what you wrote in your entry,especially
that all great religions are merely a branch or fruit of the
same tree of life.This is a very tolerant statement,but reading
a little more of your entry,you write this incredible line;
>Sahaja Yoga,developed by Shri Mataji,is the greatest meditation
>technique unveil to human race..
How can you utter such a statement?It's sounds like cheap
advertisement.What you really say is that you (think you) know absolutely
every known meditation method known to the people on this earth,and
that you know what is "the real thing".I think this is arrogance,
perhaps the statement is the truth for you.But you know...there is a big
world outside....
Svein Nordrum
|
| 401.19 | oops | USAT05::KASPER | In the eye of a storm hope is born | Fri Apr 07 1989 09:53 | 8 |
| > For those interested in Jung, his last work entitled "The Unexplored
> Self" is highly recommended. It is relatively short and easily
> understood.
I believe it's _The Undiscovered Self_ ... Good book, I recommend it
too.
Terry
|
| 401.20 | double oops! | CLUE::PAINTER | Wage Peace | Fri Apr 07 1989 12:57 | 4 |
|
Thanks Terry - you're right.
Cindy
|
| 401.21 | If you are in Boston or ... | GWEN::SU | | Fri Apr 07 1989 18:17 | 100 |
|
Re: -.18 (Svein)
|...,but reading a little more of your entry,you write this incredible line;
|>Sahaja Yoga,developed by Shri Mataji,is the greatest meditation
|>technique unveil to human race..
|How can you utter such a statement?It's sounds like cheap
|advertisement.What you really say is that you (think you) know absolutely
|every known meditation method known to the people on this earth,and
|that you know what is "the real thing".I think this is arrogance,
|perhaps the statement is the truth for you.But you know...there is a big
|world outside....
At least, I must agree with you that it was an incredible line I put there.
I admit that I am fully aware of what I said objectively.
The very same words are uttered by thousands of people who got their
incredible Kundalini awakening. These words are not coming from thin air
without a convincing reason.
A cheap advertisement is a wicked charlatan who have your money in mind and
out to plot it away from you. What I really said is that I know from my
personal experience that Sahaja Yoga is the only Yoga today that raise your
Kundalini (the pure desire of God in you) majestically like scripts has
described. There were others in the past may have done so, but not
in en-mass scale as today Shri Mataji has carried out all over the world.
In fact, just yesterday I received a letter from India saying that Shri
Mataji gave two public programs back in Delhi, India four weeks ago. The
first one was attended by approximately 3000 people. The second one was
attended by about 2000 people in a beautiful auditorium; many of them were
educated intellectuals, so Shri Mataji spoke in English. Those en-mass
self-realization were tremendous. No one else has done that in the world
for nearly two thousand years.
Allow me to tell you a true story here: Jaganath Baba, came down from the
Himalayas for one of Shri Mataji's programs. Somewhat skeptical, he was
arguing with the disciples while waiting for Shri Mataji to make Her
appearance. As soon as Shri Mataji entered the hall, he prostrated
completely (ashtango namaskar) at Her feet, calling her "Adi Maya, Adi
Maya". Later on he told the disciples that as soon as Shri Mataji had
entered the hall, suddenly he saw everybody's Kundalini rise, like the
children in class standing up for the teacher. It was an unpreceded
happening. This is the true power Shri Mataji and She is giving us
that spirits awakening (the reborn transformation) in the compassion of
a Mother would give the best to her own children.
Now a true story like that, if I want to tell you one by one, I will be
here writing a book. My objective is to tell you that Sahaja Yoga indeed
is a unique Yoga, the next to the best if not the best thing that could happen
to human being. (In case some one also will bring up the subject of how
can you say such thing!) I am not here to challenge you ego, but I'll do
my best to help your seeking, if you decide to seek the truth through
your heart(!) and not through your head. No doubt, I have seen many DECie
in this notesfile they are seekers of the Truth. But, seeking without
discrete (discrimination of true and false) is just a waste of your time
and some instance do more damage to your physical harm.
re: -.16 (Terry)
Shri Mataji first started to teach Sahaja Yoga in 1970 - a promise she has
kept to her husband that She will devote her full attention to their
children until they grow up to twenty years of age. She first came to U.S.
and specifically warned the public of the Charlatans (some are criminals from
India) who came to the West to make personal fortune by making a tomfoolery
out of innocent (somewhat naive) seeker. Unfortunately, the American is
basically an excitement gatherer at that time still. The materialistic
and egoistic life style make you think that if it does not cost you a penny
to get it, then it does not have any value in it.
Some opportunist even offered a business proposition to Shri Mataji that
they can advertise for Her by charging a fee for every Cool Breeze She
brought up the seeker. Imagining if She agrees to that she can have as
many Rose Royce as Oregon Charlatan besides the fame as "rich and famous".
Certainly, the Truth can not be changed - you can not purchase God.
So, you ask : "Where can I find more about Sahaja Yoga?"
There are only a dozen of Sahaja Centres in the whole big North America.
They are located in Boston, New York, Cincinnati, Fort Worth Texas,
Houston, Los Angeles, San Diego, San Francisco and Tronto, Vancouver etc.
The so called Centres are just happened that some Sahaja Yogis live in
that city. There is really no organisation exist. I know you live in
Atlanta, Georgia, and there is no centre around that vicinity.
I knew many yogis they get their realisation through all different cities.
Some people travelled as far as to Nepal and got their self-realization.
As time comes and if you really desire the awaken of your Holy Spirit, it will
work out for you.
For now, you can find a lot of information about Sahaja Yoga through this
notesfile #401.nn. When you have a chance to go to one of those cities,
please do not hesitate to contact me or other yogis who also contribute to
this file for more information in that vicinity.
Best Regards,
Sarvesh
|
| 401.22 | The blind ones and the matter of the Elephant | OSLLAV::SVEINN | Truth is a pathless land... | Tue Apr 11 1989 08:39 | 47 |
| Re: -21 (Sarvesh)
I respect your Sahaja Yoga,and I don't doubt that it is of greate value
for you and many others,let there be no doubt about that.
But what I really can't understand is your exaltation of this yoga,saying
that this is the greatest thing which could happen to the human beings.
Of course it is so for you and the other followers.Other people who follow
different spiritual paths would probably say the same thing about their way.
It is just this situation that often plants the seed for potential conflicts
and even wars..
In your entry -.17 you mentioned the *humble* analogy about that each religion,
spiritual way,etc.. was a branch or a flower of the same tree.What about your
yoga? Is'nt that also a flower of this tree,and not *the tree*?
Well,at last I would like to quote an old Sufi tale from the book "Tales of
the Dervishes" by Idries Shah,which really says it all,I think... :-)
~ The blind ones and the matter of the Elephant ~
Beyond Ghor there was a city.All its inhabitants were blind.A king
with his entourage arrived nearby;he brought his army and camped in the
desert.He had a mighty elephant,which he used in attack and to increase the
people's awe.
The populace became anxious to see the elephant,and some sightless
from among this blind community ran like fools to find it.As they did not even
know the form or shape of the elephant they groped sightlessly,gathering
information by touching some part of it.
Each thought that he knew something,because he could feel a part.
When they returned to their fellow-citizens eager groups clustered around them.
Each of these was anxious,misguidedly,to learn the truth from those who were
themselves astray.
They asked about the form,the shape of the Elephant;and listened to all
that they were told.The man whose hand had reached the ear was asked about the
elephant's nature.He said:"It is a large,rough thing,wide and broad,like a
rug".
And the one who had felt the trunk said:"I have the real facts about
it.It is like a straight and hollow pipe.awful and destructive."
The one who had felt its feet and legs said:"It is mighty and firm,
like a pillar."
Each had felt one part out of many.Each had perceived it wrongly.No
mind knew all:knowledge is not the companion of the blind.All imagined
something,something incorrect.
The created is not informed about divinity,There is no way in this
science by means of the ordinary intellect.
regards
Svein Nordrum
|
| 401.23 | Introduction to Sahaja Yoga | VIDEO::SU | | Wed Apr 12 1989 10:52 | 31 |
| re: -.22 (Sveinn). I will response to your comment when there is more
time for me to enter the notes again. Thank you.
Friends, a three week course begins Friday, April 14th, at 7:00 PM
in the Weare Room at the Blacksmith House, Cambridge Center for Adult
Education, Brattle Street, Harvard Square, Cambridge, Massachusetts.
This course covers the following topics:
1. Daily Problems and Their Solutions.
- Addressing good and evil.
- Meditation: What is beyond? How problems get solved.
2. Chakras and the Subtle Body.
- Chakras and Nadis: the basis of the Psyche.
- Reality: awareness beyond thought and how to achieve it.
- Collective Consciousness: awareess of the Self.
3. Health and the Subtle body
- The causes of disease.
- Techniques for cleansing the Chakras.
These classes will be followed by a three week intermediate course. Details
to be announced. This course is being sponsored by Sahaja Yoga International.
There will be no charge for the admission, except some materials, handout at
cost.
|
| 401.24 | I ate the Whole Thing? | DNEAST::CHRISTENSENL | | Wed Apr 12 1989 17:15 | 19 |
|
re: .22
Seems to me that one eats his dinner one bite at a time. A bite is
not the whole dinner. Could it be said that we never realize dinner
as it really is; but rather an accumulation of morsels?
There may be One True Way. I don't know. I have engaged in several minor
ways and at the time thought I had the whole meal. Time and experience
proved a feast larger than I had imagined. Was I wrong or in error
in my youthful years. I think not.
Looking back now I see that I was engaged with something. I feel it is
the engagement itself we should herald.
Larry
|
| 401.25 | Water,give me water... | OSLLAV::SVEINN | Truth is a pathless land... | Thu Apr 13 1989 09:53 | 17 |
| re. -24;
>There may be One True Way. I don't know. I have engaged in several minor
>ways and at the time thought I had the whole meal. Time and experience
>proved a feast larger than I had imagined. Was I wrong or in error
>in my youthful years. I think not.
Agree,Larry.I think at each stage during lifetime we are given just as much
as we can perceive at that moment.When water are being poured into a cup,
the cup can of course not hold any more water than its own volume.Water
always finds its own level.
It is to be hoped that this cup,which we all carry,will have the chance to
grow in volume as we go through life...
Svein
|
| 401.26 | | ATSE::FLAHERTY | Evolving, not revolving | Thu Apr 13 1989 11:45 | 8 |
| In agreement with Larry (.24) and Svein (.25) or to put it another
way with one of my favorite quotes:
The years teach us much the days never knew.
Ro
|
| 401.27 | The knowledge of the Root is what we are missing | VIDEO::SU | | Thu Apr 13 1989 18:35 | 61 |
|
Re: -.22 (Svein) -The blind ones and the matter of the Elephant
I always love the story of the blinds trying to describe the fact about
elephant, only I didn't know the origin of the source. It is one of the
beautiful parables I have told my children many times. On circumstance, those
blind people are quite brave. In a way, they are all correct in part and wrong
in the whole.
The fruits or blossoms of the tree of life, they are all real and true.
However, when we talk about the world religions, we are talking about the
original master incarnations, prophets or saints but not the ritualistic
and dogmatism "organized" religions. The dogma and ism ideals was not
intended by those origin masters in mind when they were still alive. So,
when you become self-realized, you know all religion are the true but part
of the whole. At this state, you understand the integral aspect of all
religions - the all Truth. There is no need to fight over God is on which
side - all men are brothers.
Mohammed himself had to defend himself so hard in his time and that does not
mean all Muslims can kill people as today in the name of Jihad. Budda came
in a time of Hindu ritual craziness so he did it the other way. Moses brought
out the ten commandments to straight out the Jew went out of his hands and
that does not mean the Jewish can only live by the rules also. Hindu Bramins
set the law of birth right to protect their own welfare. In real life, their
children are not all born realized as Bhramin. We knew Christianity very well,
so I don't need to elaborate on the reborn process. There are other religions
I don't know about but that is not excluded from this human errors.
The purpose of this introduction of Sahaja Yoga is not to convince you to
believe it. I knew from my heart that it is impossible to do so. The
purpose of this notes is to bring up your curiosity and so that you can look
into it and verify it yourself.
Seeking without an open mind is impossible. Seeking with an open mind but
without your own discrimination (discrete) is dangerous. Dangerous according
to loss of the money matter, false teaching from false guru could make you
loss you health by damaging your subtle nerves system (Chakras). We already
knew certain Yogas in the spiritual market (you buy?) today cause cancer and
leprosy if not psychosomatic problems. Indeed, there are many good valid
Yoga also available, as saying of "there are many roads to Rome...", the
matter is which one you want to take. It is our freedom to choose.
Sahaja Yoga sounds very simple. As you have noticed that Shri Mataji has
developed a system of getting your "self-realisation" first. Then, after
that you take your sweet time to do your house cleaning work - purify your
inner Chakras one by one. The method is a reverse order of Budda which took
him many life time to cleans his Chakras one by one and at the same time
maintain its purity until he achieved his God-realisation.
To say you have no doubt on what I am telling you is cheating yourself also.
I had doubt two years ago. Now that two years has past and not only I
have not lost anything of my own (perhaps my ego is diminishing a little), I
have gained some thing we all want very much - the inner joy, the love of
divine within us.
I have to write about this as a token of being a part and parcel of the whole.
Best regards,
Sarvesh
|
| 401.28 | | 25532::STANLEY | What a long, strange trip its been | Thu Apr 27 1989 17:20 | 4 |
| Is there any chance that Shri Mataji will come to this country this
year? I hope so.
Mary
|
| 401.29 | SRI MATAJI in USA 1989 | VIDEO::SU | | Mon May 01 1989 16:19 | 20 |
|
rep: .28 (mary)
Shri Mataji will visit US this year. Tentative schedule is June
12 till June 30.
She will probably speak in NEW YORK, MIAMI, SAN DIEGO, CINCINNATI,
HOUSTON and maybe BOSTON.
I dont know how much you know about Sahaja yoga, please read also
notes 1041.0 .
If you are impatient to get it, you can go and meet any Sahaja Yogi,
he or she can give realisation to you.
Let us know the area where you live, we can pass you a phone number.
There are a few Sahaja Yogis in BOSTON, NEW YORK, SAN DIEGO,
CINCINNATTI and HOUSTON.
See You.
|
| 401.30 | Come to see the Elephant! | MUNTRA::LUZI | | Fri May 12 1989 05:02 | 27 |
|
re: Larry, Sveinn
I think noone of us (Sahaja-Yogis) would already dare to think that we ate
the whole dinner - but we all got the wonderful chance to see the
whole elephant - to see the whole beauty of the tree of life.
Imagine one of the blind ones suddenly got his eyesight.
Wouldn't that mean he is able to tell everyone how the elephant looks like?
Everyday I learn something else about me and we all still go through a lot
of mistakes and painful learning-processes - but we know exactly where we
go and how we can work our problems out - it does not mean we don't have
problems anymore.
I always desired to know where I have to go and what I have to find and
after coming to Sahaja-Yoga I suddenly knew it exactly and I still do.
But I'm sure we are all far from saying that we are the perfect enlightened
beings. - Why don't you just try it yourself?
If Sahaja-Yoga integrates all the World-Religions (branches) - why can it
not be the tree?
Please forgive us if something sounds a bit arrogant and give
yourself a chance to make your own experience with Sahaja-Yoga.
Nobody asks you to come - it is up to to feel the joy with us or not.
regards,
Eva
|
| 401.31 | Problems? "what me worry?" | REGENT::WAGNER | | Fri May 12 1989 10:47 | 19 |
|
.30 Eva,
If a person could vibrate fully in the sixth or seventh chakra, he or
she would find that there would be no more problems for him or her
Excepting for the challenge(not problem) of maintaining spiritual
devotion in the sixth chakra and being vigilantly on guard for the
ever so subtle seduction of Egotism in the seventh chakra.
Pehaps Sahaja yoga is not the entire tree because it is not the
only philosophy/discipline that integrates all the world religions.
There are at least several that I know of. besides what does the
process of becoming fulfilled have to do with established religions?
I would guess that the philosophy of Tantra and Tantric Yoga would
be more effective for the Western Mind.
Ernie
|
| 401.32 | No. | CADSYS::COOPER | Topher Cooper | Fri May 12 1989 11:29 | 11 |
| RE .30 (Eva):
> Imagine one of the blind ones suddenly got his eyesight.
> Wouldn't that mean he is able to tell everyone how the elephant looks
> like?
If you believe that, than you have missed at least half of what I see
as the point of the allegory -- of course I'm just one blind
philosopher among many.
Topher
|
| 401.33 | "Blind men cop feel from elephant" | 17736::BEST_G | Ghost of the Aragon | Fri May 12 1989 12:21 | 10 |
|
Well Topher, I'm also blind, but after having checked out this
"eliophant" I've come to the same conclusion concerning such claims
made by the sighted. (Couldn't we have picked a less smelly, dirty
creature; I can't seem to find a washrag around here. :-) )
grope....curse....
Guy
|
| 401.34 | One man's ...whatever | DNEAST::CHRISTENSENL | | Fri May 12 1989 13:00 | 18 |
| Oh I dunno, reading some replies in DEJAVU seems like everyone is now
starting their own "club of enlightenment": 'come to me and I'll
fix you up.'
A story I often tell is about myself walking down Sunset Blvd,
Hollywood Ca. with tambourine in hand and passing out literature
about a group I was studying with. As I passed a narrow alley-way
a small black shoe-shine boy shouted: "Shoe Shine Mister, It'll change your
life". Well, I just ust started to laugh and realize he was probably
right and a shoe shine was just about as effective as anything else
provided the recipient was in the appropriate frame. I tossed the papers in
the nearest trash can and headed home. I was asked to leave this particular
group a short while later. (another story)
Larry
_still all inputs are welcome_
|
| 401.35 | May be ... when you become a drop of the ocean | VIDEO::SU | | Fri May 12 1989 17:46 | 51 |
|
Ooops, we got into a word-jungle again!
blind adj. 1.without the power of sight; unable to see; sightless.
2.of or for sight-less persons.
3.not able or willing to notice, understand, or judge.
4.done without adequate directions or knowledge [a blind search]
5.disregarding evidence, sound logic, etc. [blind love, blind
faith]
6.reckless; unreasonable
7.out of sight; hard to see; hidden
8.dense; impenetrable [a blind hedge]
9.closed at one end [a blind duct]
10.not controlled by intelligence [blind destiny]
11.a)insensible b)drunk
12.illegible; indistinct [a blind letter]
13.not bearing flowers or fruit, as imperfect plants
14. Aeron. by the use of instruments only [flind flying]
15. Archit. a)having no opening [a blind wall]
vt.
1.to make sightless
2.to make temporarily unable to see; dazzle
3.to deprive of the power of insight or judgment
4.to make dim; obscure
5.to outshine or eclipse
6.to hide or conceal
This kind of reminding me of the Bible studies I attended in the past; some
people like to interpret the parables word by word and miss the point at end.
I agree with you that a little notesfile information will not convince
you or make you believe something you never experience it yourself.
No one is trying to sale you something or deny you something but share
with you of some unique experience. In India villages, thousand's people
get their own unique (the very same) self-realisation experience in
the open field program. In Europe, people also amazed at the soothing
sensation of rising Kundalini in their own body and realizing the whole
new dimension of meaningful life leading ahead. In U.S., the recognition
of Sahaja Yoga is very slow, perhaps because people are so up
to materialism and outside excitement of psychic interference.
However, Truth is not to be judged by the salesmanship. And perhaps
you can read with an open mind because I am very sincerely as your fellow
DECie.
Still, with my best regards to you all.
Sarvesh
|
| 401.36 | KUNDALINI RISING in the West | DNEAST::CHRISTENSENL | | Fri May 12 1989 23:47 | 1 |
| .... and most fully human MR. SU
|
| 401.37 | Yoga | CSOA1::ROARK | | Sat May 13 1989 22:51 | 134 |
| Hi,
Here are some comments on Guru, other paths, and finally on Yoga in
general. Most of this comes from notes I've made or remembered from what
reading and some from experience. There are many paths for yoga and religions.
Each leads to the same goal according to many masters.
Guru: 'gu' is the symbol of darkest night, 'ru' is the symbol of radiant
light. So a Guru is one who dispels the dark or shows the light
of truth. A Guru could be that one who is destined to initiate
in yoga. Also the Guru could be your best friend or enemy. Anyone
(or maybe your pet) who reflects where there is a need to grow is
really a Guru. Eg. If I don't like a person, the dislike comes
from within me, the other person is only providing for the reflection
of this thought or feeling. This shows me where I need to work. So
the person I don't like is my guru in this growth situation.
My thoughts are that a Guru (spiritual teacher) practices,
teaches what is practiced and provides an environment where seekers
can come together to further deepen the contact and growth. Some
may not elect the third item.
Other Paths:
No one wants to be following a path that is not the Supreme path, so each
seeker may claim their path to be the one and only sometimes.
I've known TM'ers that have benefited greatly from the program and others
that have been disenchanted. I've no issue with TM. Mantra works.
All meditation is transcendental in nature from my viewpoint anyway.
I also know disciples of Bhagwan Rajneesh. They also benefited.
It's unfortunate that events took the turn that they did. I've friends
that follow paths of Sufi, Zen, Tibetan Buddhism, Yoga, Christianity and
others. I don't see one path as better than another. I see each valuable
for growth. I was attracted to a particular path because of my karma (attitudes
and behavior) and there is something for me to learn in that particular way.
I look at other's choices in the same way.
Regarding money:
In the first yoga class I took, the instructor shared that at first he didn't
think anyone should have to pay a fee to learn yoga. The instructor thought
about it and decided to charge. It was explained by an example from the story
of Snow White. The witch asked Snow White for a glass of water before she
gave Snow White the apple. This set up Snow White to receive. So the water
is money and the poison apple is yoga ;^).
Yoga, general comments:
There is some confusion of terms in what I've read about Yoga. Some
say Yoga starts whenever one begins to practice, some say it begins when
the prana is released or kundalini awakened, and others say yoga begins
with the attainment of samadhi. Also some consider prana and kundalini to
be the same, others do not.
The following considers prana to be apart from kundalini, prana and kundalini
as a different manifestation of the same energy.
When the prana is released through shaktipat the seeker automatically
experiences what had to be attempted by means of will before.
Yoga does not have to be learned from anyone after this point. It
has been acutalized and will continue to grow with proper attention.
Automatically will the asanas, mudras, yamas, niyamas, pranayama, and so
on occur to purify the body and mind and finally come to the point where
the kundalini is awakened and the remaining purification takes place.
There are quite a number of shaktipat gurus around. It does not take
a master to give shaktipat to thousands of people at once. A master can give
this grace to give shaktipat to one or more of his disciples and that disciple
can even pass it on. One of the shaktipat gurus I know of in the West
used to give out shakti rather freely and strongly. After the first
couple of years he saw that people had psychological difficulties with the
experiences and now the shaktipat experiences seems to occur very much
more subtly. The grace falls equally on everyone.
Yoga paths:
Yoga is one. There are three main and many secondary
yogas. This is only because of difference in attitude and so on among
seekers. Basically, the one with a rational bent of mind practices
jnana yoga, emotional nature practices bhakti yoga, and of active nature
practices karma yoga. Each of the main types incorporates the attributes of
the others as well.
Sanatana (Eternal) Yoga is one, there are two orientations: reason and action.
The third, love, is included in the two. Due to differences in age, attitude,
condition, seekers choose different techniques, and the techniques have
different labels given to the same yoga.
Bhakti Yoga is also called Mantra Yoga, Nada Yoga, Laya Yoga, Japa Yoga
etc.
Jnana Yoga is also called Raja Yoga, Astanga Yoga, Nirbija Yoga, Sabda Yoga,
etc.
Karma Yoga is also called Siddha Yoga, Sahaja Yoga, Bindu Yoga, Kundalini Yoga,
Maha Yoga etc.
There also traditions named as Tantra, Vedanta, Bhakti, Yoga etc.
Each of the paths has it own techniques. Control and discipline of prana
is directly or indirectly involved in all of them. The sense-organs and
mind are controlled and disciplined only through the control of prana.
In the not so recent past yogis would only arouse the kundalini shakti
in a seeker of worth by initiating with shaktipat(transmission of spiritual
energy). This situation seems to have changed with masters granting
the grace to disciples, and transmission to many at once.
A person who has the grace to give shaktipat can do so to thousands at
once. Shaktipat or grace of God can also come through the thought of God or
Guru, touch, or look by picture or presence. A competent guru can release
the prana energy of the disciple through shaktipat. This starts the
practice of yoga automatically, after this the seeker need not learn yoga
from anyone. Guidance of a guru could probably be useful through some of
the stages like kechari mudra, if kundalini takes that particular path.
The release of prana is also called God's or Guru's grace. The release gained
through systematic practice without a Guru is called by God's grace. The
release of prana is not the awakening of kundalini, it does help in awakening
kundalini. The first important result of shakitpat is the release of prana
which can bring about the awakening of kundalini. Some people call kundalini
and prana the same thing. Prana can neither penetrate the chakras and granthis
(plexus of nerves) or fully purify body and mind, for this it needs kundalini.
Sometimes shaktipat results in the immediate awakening of kundalini. Shaktipat
is of two kinds, light and heavy. A seeker receiving heavy shaktipat will
probably be so consumed with the practice of yoga that life in the external
world with job etc. would be very difficult. It takes commitment to establish
practice and continue.
Yoga gives one the opportunity to start with body, mind or spirit. So there
is something, I think, for anyone. More important for me is that the
heart of a path is to grow in love, regardless of other experiences offered.
Regards,
timmo
|
| 401.38 | "Whom Atman chooses, by him is he attained." | 17736::BEST_G | Ghost of the Aragon | Mon May 15 1989 14:00 | 9 |
|
re: -.1
I agree with what you said about the heart of the path was to grow in
love. Enlightenment takes many forms and has many names, but for me
the deciding factor in "getting there" is the desire to do so.
Guy
|
| 401.39 | | VIDEO::SU | | Mon May 15 1989 15:26 | 34 |
|
******* To My Flower Children *******
You are angry with Life
Like small children
Whose Mother is lost in Darkness
Your sulk expressing despair
At the fruitless end of your journey
You wear ugliness to discover Beauty
You name everything false in the name of truth
You drain out emotions to fill the cup of Love
My sweet children, my darling
How can you get peace by waging war
With yourself, with your being, with joy itself
Enough are your efforts of renunciation
The artificial mask of consolation
Now rest in the petals of the lotus flower
In the lap of your gracious Mother
I will adorn your life with beautiful blossoms
And fill your moments with joyful fragrance
I will anoint your head with divine love
For I cannot bear your torture anymore
Let me engulf you in the ocean of joy
So you lose your being in the Greater one
Who is smiling in your calyx of self
Secretly hidden to tease you all the while
Be aware and you will find Him
Vibrating your every fibre with blissful joy
Covering the whole universe with light.
-Mother Nirmala
|
| 401.40 | That's a lot of info | REDWOD::GRAFTON | | Thu May 18 1989 15:47 | 8 |
| Tim,
I'm glad you entered that. I'm slowly learning all the new words and
phrases and what they mean, and this helps.
Jill
|
| 401.41 | you have to get it, not just analyse!! | VIDEO::SU | | Sat May 20 1989 00:01 | 40 |
| re .37 and other chacra theorethics.
it is good to "know" so many things about chacras and all that Yoga stuff.
But, please look at it this way:
If a newborn baby is thirsty, it just drinks the milk.
Should you first teach him all about human anatomy before you will allow it to
drink? Nature has everything beautifully planned. You just give it the milk
and if the baby is ready it will drink. Simple as that.
Other analogy:
Would you first read a book to learn how to breathe?
When watching television, do you first want to know all about electronics, or
do you just switch it on and watch it?
Do you see the point?
Same with self-realisation.
When the time is such that you can get it naturally, then you better get it
first. Later you can learn all about it if you like.
What more can one say.
Please make sensible replies only. If you think we are exagerating, or that we
do not know what we are talking about, please forget us. No reason to get upset.
We do not take anything from you, we just want you to know this:
" The time is such that you CAN get it. If you don't want it, it's your
business"
Sri Mataji is visting US in June. Please read 1041.? note for detail.
All the best,
Johan
|
| 401.42 | I know how to drink... | BTOVT::BEST_G | Ghost of the Aragon | Mon May 22 1989 10:14 | 7 |
|
Even you, as evidenced by the analogies of your reply, must reason and
analyze. Doesn't all written communication occur on this level? You
can no more see if we are enlightened by our words than we can see by
yours.
Guy
|
| 401.44 | Your Opportunity Strike Again | VIDEO::SU | | Wed Jun 07 1989 16:51 | 144 |
| The following is the schedule of Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi, giving
self-realisation to the North America and South America in person.
Mo 12 Jun Program in New York
Auditorium of Public School
6, 45 East 81th St. (between Park and Madison Ave.)
New York City. 7:30pm
Tu 13 Jun Program in New York
Warwick Hotel, 65, W.64 St. New York City at 7:30pm
We 14 Jun Program in Cincinnati, Ohio
Th 15 Jun Program in Tronto, Canada
Sa 17 Jun Program in Vancouver, Canada
Tu 20 Jun Program in San Diego, California
Tu 22 Jun Program in Miami, Florida.
(First time in Miami, since Miami was called the Gate of
Hell by the DDA)
Th 24 Jun Program in Bogota, Colombia.
Su 27 Jun Program in Rio, Brazil
Tu 29 Jun program in Salvador, Brazil
Those cities listed above without detail program location can be contacted at
the nearest center list below for more information.
West Coast:
Dr. Vinod Worlikar
17031 South Maria Ave.
Cerritos, Los Angeles CA 95071
t. 213/926-4070
David Dunphy (San Diego Centre)
6276 Lakewood St.
San Diego, CA 92122
t. 619/546-9379
Ursula Doring (San Francisco Centre)
191 Canal St. #23
San Rafael, CA 94901
t. 415/459-0123
East Coast:
Christine de Kalbermatten (New York Centre)
96 Shadow Lane
New Rochelle, NY 10801
t. 914/636-4406
Bhaskar & Linda Kharde
869 Washington Ave.
Pleasantville, NY 10570
t. 914/769-3991
Mark Sutherland (Boston Centre)
27 Ashland St.
Arlington Heights, MA 02174
t. 617/646-7547
Craig Williamson (Maine Centre)
436 Preble St.
South Portland, ME 04106
t. 207/799-5749
Florida: (Miami)
Patrick Hughes
6700 Landings Dr., #105
Lauderhill, Fl. 33319
t. 305/485-7739
Ohio:
Bala Kanayson (Ohio Centre)
10351 Arbor Hill Lane
Evendale, Ohio 45241
t. 513/563-6438
Jay Harris
717 Broadliegh Rd.
Colombus, Ohio 43209
t. 614/237-1297
Kansas:
Nancy Craig
226 Fillmore
Topeka, Kansas 66606
t. 913/351-6440
Texas:
Betty Hubbell
715 Crossroads
Houston, Texas 77079
t. 713/531-7458
Mangal Singh Dhillon
1800 Hemphill
FT Worth, Texas 76110
t. 817/924-2191
CANADA:
Lori Wills (Vancouver Centre)
1261 Keith Road
West Vancouver, BC V7T1N1
t. 604-922-3382
William Brigden (Toronto Centre)
Ap. 708
11 Gulliver Road
Toronto, Ontario M6M2M3
t. 416/247-5749
Mona Lacroix (Calgary Centre)
523 Maidstone Drive N.E.
Calgary, Alberta T2A4B6
t. 403/248-3196
Colombia:
Claude &Brigitte Begle
Calle 110A-4-48
Sta Ana
Bogota
t. 571/213-3515
Brazil:
Duilio Cartocci
Nirmala House
Alameda das Cajazeiras 35
Caminho das Arvores
40000 Salvador - BA
t. 55 21 541-6473
You can buy a airplane ticket to the city where Shri Mataji is
visiting, but you cannot buy your self-realisation.
Best regards,
Sarvesh
|
| 401.45 | Self-realization in Cincinnati | CHFS32::LTAYLOR | | Wed Jun 28 1989 16:06 | 180 |
| Several months ago I began to follow the discussion about
Sahaja Yoga in this NOTES file. While some of the claims
made for this method seemed rather exaggerated, I was none
the less intrigued by what I read. Several signature charac-
teristics emerged which lead me to travel to Cincinnati and
receive self-realization from Mother Nirmala.
First, the Sahaja yogis such as Philip, Johan and Paulo
write with a confidence that comes from their enthusiasm
with the experience of the "cool breeze." This confidence
may come across to some as cocksure, even arrogant, but it
has been my experience that such enthusiastic declarations
are far more nourishing than dry theological proofs, no mat-
ter how logical.
Another positive characteristic is the group's disdain of
money. The simple phrase, "You can't pay for it," is often
used. Surely the Sahaja Yoga organization must have some
sort of cash I/O, but never is the inquirer told that the
experience of self-realization carries with it a financial
obligation.
Sahaja Yoga also appears to me to skillfully balance person-
ality with Divine abstraction. Mother Nirmala admits that
she is a means to focus your attention and desire on the
mother within. The kundalini energy is associated with the
feminine and comes very close, in my opinion, to Jung's an-
ima. It is one thing to read and speculate about the female
nature of the soul and quite another to encounter a flesh-
and-blood woman who acts as a surrogate for that soul to
manifest.
For these reasons and others, I thought it would be worth my
time and effort to drive from North Carolina to Cincinnati
and meet Mother Nirmala. Two friends accompanied me. One is
a long-time male friend who has many years of experience in
the spiritual realm. The other is a woman who is a more re-
cent acquaintance. All together we have probably more than
sixty years of experience with everything from New Age
avatars to Zen roshis. The collective question on our minds
as we rolled nearly 500 miles was whether Mother Nirmala is
for real.
We arrived in Cincinnati a couple of hours before the pro-
gram was to start at an outdoor pavilion located in Eden
Park. Checking into the hotel, we freshened up and got a
bite to eat. Soon we were making our way to the park and ar-
rived at the site of "An Evening of Enlightenment" about an
half hour before the program was to begin. The pavilion was
a modernistic concrete structure designed for theatrical
performances. The audience sat on benches arranged in con-
centric arcs in a later day version of a Greek amphitheater.
The sky was as uncertain as a baby's bottom. Only a little
more than a hundred people braved the threatening clouds.
On our way to our seats we spotted a man dressed in a suit
who had a large button on his lapel. The button was about
four inches in diameter and contained a color photograph of
Mother Nirmala. My friend, Fritz, admired the button and
struck up a conversation with the first Sahaja yogi we were
to meet that evening. Fritz wanted to know where he could
get such a button fully expecting to be directed to a table
where Mataji memorabilia could be purchased. We were po-
litely told that the buttons were not for sale, and I saw no
evidence of any money changing hands the entire evening.
They didn't even pass the hat once or comment on expenses
that they incurred putting the program together.
As we sat down we observed that the stage was largely bare
except for a chair with microphone and a large chart of the
chakras to one side, a somewhat smaller black-and-white pho-
tograph of Mother Nirmala on the other side. There were a
couple of floral arrangements but nothing ostentatious.
Everyone's concern became a reality when it started to driz-
zle. Umbrellas began to pop up like mushrooms and I wondered
if the people behind us could see. Promptly at 19:30 a tall,
balding, bearded man about thirtysomething began to speak at
a microphone that had been set up at the extreme side of the
stage. He introduced himself as Johan, and I knew immedi-
ately that this must be the same Johan who posts articles
about Sahaja Yoga in the DEJAVU and HOLISTIC NOTES files.
Fortunately, just as Johan began to speak the rain stopped.
It did not rain again the rest of the evening.
Johan is originally from Brussels, Belgium and delivered a
clear, albeit accented (very chic), exposition about the
chakras, kundalini energy and the channels this energy trav-
els. Most of this information can be found in DEJAVU NOTES
401 and 1041 or HOLISTIC NOTES 19. He spoke with confidence
and enthusiasm even though he seemed to know that what he
was saying sounded fantastic. When Mother Nirmala walked on
the stage Johan stopped in mid-sentence, not so much from
deference but from an evident joy in seeing her.
How shall I describe Mother Nirmala? Physically, she is of
medium height and a bit overweight by American standards.
She has a youthful appearance, her 66 years having added
only a few gray hairs and wrinkles. She was dressed in a
white muslin sari and wore a rather large red dot on her
forehead. Her movements were fluid, and she did not show any
ill effects from the exhaustive schedule she was following.
Psychologically, she seemed, to me at least, the personifi-
cation of MOTHER. Her voice was warm yet authoritative. Her
ample flesh with its lack of sharp angles was inviting and
safe. Central casting could not have chosen better :-).
She spoke briefly about the nature of truth, the need for
seekers to experience the "cool breeze," and how this is the
"blossom time" when self-realization is available for any
sincere seeker. Her agenda was clearly to impart the experi-
ence rather than explain it. After a brief question and an-
swer period she asked that everyone leave their seats and
sit on the concrete apron directly in front of the stage.
The self-realization ceremony was a sort of guided medita-
tion. Mother Nirmala first instructed us in how to place the
hands on various parts of the body that correspond to chakra
locations. When everyone had these hand placements correct,
she began the meditation to raise the kundalini and initiate
the "cool breeze." We were told to place our right hand on
the appropriate spot and to repeat a question or affirmation
a certain number of times. It began at the heart and ended
at the top of the head. I won't go into all the details
since that might spoil the experience for others. Suffice it
to say that the statements affirm the seekers freedom of
choice and deal with the issues of identity, guilt, forgive-
ness and truth.
The ceremony was simple, yet moving and allowed me to deal
with some core issues in a non-threatening way. In less than
fifteen minutes it was over. I felt good but did not feel
the "earth move" spiritually speaking. Mother Nirmala asked
us to place our right hand over our heads to feel the "cool
breeze." I tentatively moved my hand to the top of my head
not knowing what this "cool breeze" was supposed to feel
like or even knowing that I would feel anything different.
Nothing is my prior experience prepared me for what my fin-
gers perceived. There was a very distinct "breeze" blowing
out of the top of my head! A 3 inch column of what felt like
cool moving air was located over the former site of the
fontanel(baby's soft spot). The air in the pavilion was ab-
solutely still. I could not feel this breeze anywhere else
except the top of my head. I had to admit to myself that
Mother Nirmala delivered the goods. She also said that a
cool vortex of energy could be felt in the palm of each
hand. As the evening progressed I increasingly felt this
phenomenon as well. I thought at first that my hands were
simply cold, but even if I folded them under my armpits the
cool vortex could still be easily perceived.
Mother Nirmala invited everyone up on the stage to shake
hands with her and exchange some personal words. During this
time she worked with some of the people who were having dif-
ficulty feeling the "cool breeze." She could identify which
chakra was blocked and used her hands to clear the obstruc-
tion. After each person had his audience with Mataji one of
her "staff" gave him two sheets of information. The primary
purpose of this material was to publicize the local weekly
meeting of Sahaja Yogis.
It has been a couple of weeks since my pilgrimage to Cincin-
nati. Even though the experience of the "cool breeze" was
convincing to me, working with this energy has been frus-
trated due to a lack of follow-up. The Sahaja yogis sent me
a package of material a week later, but this just seemed to
emphasize how little the experience depended on written text
of any kind. I use a photograph of Mother Nirmala that was
included in the package and have practiced the morning and
evening meditation techniques outlined in the material. The
meditations are profoundly peaceful but not qualitatively
different from my normal practice of more than twenty years.
I would recommend that others receive self-realization from
Mother Nirmala. She is a dear, sweet soul who can touch you
very deeply. Men especially may find that the mother image
Mataji personifies speaks to their soul in a surprisingly
direct way.
|
| 401.46 | Cool breezes don't signify self-realization. | MISERY::WARD_FR | Going HOME--as an Adventurer | Thu Jun 29 1989 11:49 | 20 |
| re: .45
Aligning the chakras does feel good...I don't do it myself very
often, although I attempt to do it for massage clients; this past
weekend, however, during a 2-day Lazaris workshop, we all got the
opportunity to do it during a meditation (as only a small part of the
meditation) and it was definitely noticable and stimulating.
I think your experience is great for you...the only thing I wish
to mention, that I think has been mentioned here before, is that
someone does not "give" you realization. Self-realization is not
a small process whereby one practices it a couple of times a year
at the foot of some "master." Self-realization is a state of being
which is exercised with elegance and excellence. I would hardly
call going to a workshop of any kind a means to be given
self-realization, not that it is impossible, just unlikely. Simply
experiencing an orgasm is not being self-realized. To feel it
all the time, might be, however.
Frederick
|
| 401.47 | Yes it is, you can feel it | SHIRE::PHILIP | Phil Ward Mgmt. Sci. Geneva-Etang | Fri Jun 30 1989 06:11 | 39 |
| Re: .46, to clear up some misconceptions.
> ...Someone does not "give" you realization.
Hundreds of thousands of people the world over (including
about 1500 last week in San Diego and 1800 a day or two ago in
Bogota, Colombia) can refute that statement, having received Self-
realisation from Shri Mataji in the way the author of .45 so
beautifully described.
> Self-realization is not a small process whereby one practices
> it a couple of times a year at the foot of some "master."
Of course not. It's the most tremendous thing that can happen
to you, bar none. It's what all seekers are seeking, even if they
sometimes get lost on the way. You enter a state of collective
awareness, peace and mental stillness, and bliss. Physical and
psychological problems are gently washed away. Shri Mataji has
given these blessings freely to thousands and thousands of people.
Who else can say the same?
> I would hardly call going to a workshop of any kind a means
> to be given self-realization, not that it is impossible,
> just unlikely.
One's Self-realisation (in the sense of the awakening of
Kundalini) is a happening which has to take place at some time. It
can take place in the presence of Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi, or of
her photograph, for anyone who has the sincere desire for it.
> Simply experiencing an orgasm is not being self-realized. To feel
> it all the time, might be, however.
This is utter rubbish; self-realisation has nothing whatever
to do with orgasm. (And one's spiritual evolution has nothing to do
with sex at all.) Small children in their innocence can feel and
enjoy vibrations as well as, or better than, adults.
Phil
|
| 401.48 | IMHO | USACSB::CBROWN | Huggieboo | Fri Jun 30 1989 07:20 | 35 |
| Re: .47 (Phil)
> Of course not. It's the most tremendous thing that can happen
> to you, bar none. It's what all seekers are seeking, even if they
> sometimes get lost on the way. You enter a state of collective
> awareness, peace and mental stillness, and bliss. Physical and
> psychological problems are gently washed away. Shri Mataji has
> given these blessings freely to thousands and thousands of people.
> Who else can say the same?
Craig, Karl Marx, Adolph Hittler, Jesus, Lazaris, Mohammed, various
popular religious REVIVAL preachers, (B.G.) ect..ect..
but ultimately... you give it to yourself on conditions of your
own choosing. The only common factors are desire and innocence.
> > Simply experiencing an orgasm is not being self-realized. To feel
> > it all the time, might be, however.
Why does the word "orgasm" appear in so many of Fredericks notes? ;-)
> This is utter rubbish; self-realisation has nothing whatever
> to do with orgasm. (And one's spiritual evolution has nothing to do
> with sex at all.) Small children in their innocence can feel and
> enjoy vibrations as well as, or better than, adults.
Well.... we only have our body in the "material world". Emotions
and thoughts can be wrong or misleading.... isn't it then somewhat
rational to say that the one truth of this world "in the material"
mimics the truths of the other worlds (like spiritual?)?
And if we can have physical orgasms... why not spiritual ones??
Anyone experiancing anything in innocence can enjoy anything better
than a programed adult/person.
Craig
|
| 401.49 | Buddhist philosophies deal with the unconscious mind | MISERY::WARD_FR | Going HOME--as an Adventurer | Fri Jun 30 1989 12:27 | 49 |
| re: .47 (Phil Ward---not related)
I understand your good feelings. I do not refute them in
the slightest. In fact, I wish we all had more opportunity to
"be" in that state (actually, we do, but most of us don't do it.)
The "argument" here is over your term "self-realization." Self-
realization is not some throwaway term to be bantied about
stretched to the limits by someone who feels good. I don't care
if 970 million people experience what your're talking about, that
is *not* self-realization. The clue is especially evident when
you describe children with it. Children are *not* self-realized.
They can be very beautiful, aware, loving, etc. and can feel the
full gamut of emotions, cleanly and honestly...but they are not
self-realized. Self-realization is a massive synergy combining
not only self-love (in the fullest sense of that word) and self-
awareness (a term you use to describe your experience) but especially
(where we exponentially separate in our definitions) it is an
awareness of impact. Children have a very limited perception of
impact. Many, if not most, adults have a very limited perception
of impact, as well. As a person grows into self-realization,
as they progress past self-esteem and self-respect and self-love,
they begin to take on more and more responsibility. As the function
of responsibility increases, so does the awareness of not only self,
but awareness of others. That entails tremendous impact. The more
evolved one becomes, the more aware they become of their impact...
and the more responsible they become. Now, maybe I'm seeing things
differently from everyone else here, but if you've said anything like
this, I've missed it. As far as I can tell, all you have described
is an awareness of one's own unconscious mind, perhaps...along
with feelings of self, physically and ethereally. This is hardly
what I would call self-realization, and I think it's a shame that
any group of people would delude themselves enough to call it as
such. You know, you could attend a human potential movement seminar
any weekend (as primitive as they are) and leave feeling "bliss" as
you described it. Without awakening any Kundalini, to boot.
Using the chakras to tune and align oneself is overwhelmingly valuable,
but it, again, is not self-realization.
I may mention orgasms a lot because I like them. :-) Seriously,
I think that it is humanity's physical "freebie" into sensing the
bliss that exists beyond what we usually are. I work towards feeling
orgasmic all the time...not necessarily physically (especially since
my body wouldn't last very long if I did) but emotionally, especially.
[Don't worry, I'm not that close...yet.] A self-realized person
may not feel orgasmic and yet a self-realized person probably could
with much greater ease than one who isn't.
Frederick
|
| 401.50 | | DNEAST::CHRISTENSENL | | Fri Jun 30 1989 17:50 | 7 |
| There is an old Zen saying:
"It takes a year for the stink of enlightment to wear off."
L
who-heard-it-somewhere
|
| 401.51 | Even if misunderstood, truth is what it is! | VIDEO::SU | | Sat Jul 01 1989 14:46 | 91 |
|
re.45, 49
sir,
You have certain concepts and you make it so clear that it has little in
common with what we are talking about, so can I ask you politely to find the
notesfile where your concepts match the subject.
We have no intentions of forcing this knowledge on anyone, but we do want
to make it available to many people.
Not as an answer to you, sir, but for those who may read these notes and
eventually be influenced by your suggestions, I write following.
Many scriptures have tried to communicate to human beings what they have to
seek. These truths have been interpreted, conceptualised and finally come to
us in forms that are not near truth any more. Some of these teachings have
conditioned some so deeply, that if truth comes before them, they cannot
recognise it. Such persons will consequently run away from truth and will
go on following the concepts they have about truth.
-----
CHILDREN:
Children are not necessarily realised, but if they are not born realised, they
can become realised more easily than some some "hard nut" adults.
For realisation one has not to "understand" anything, it is a natural
evolutionary state in human awareness. All is built-in since our creation;
as the seed knows in which circumstances it has to sprout and become a
tree, so does Kundalini know how to rise when the circumstances are right.
Shri Mataji has that coefficient within Her that starts this NATURAL
process.
Christ gave us a clue when He said we should become like children.
--------------
COOL BREEZE
Another clue one can find in Bible, where it describes the moment where the 12
receive the Holy Ghost (or self realisation). It says that there was a
wind, though doors and windows were closed. The flame depicted on their
heads shows the open sahasrara chacra and the flowing Kundalini.
There are many other Bible passages, where the presense of
God is related to the perception of a "wind".
-Koran says that at the moment of resurrection (self-realisation), your hands
will speak. This is exactly what is happening when the cool breeze flows
through your hands after genuine Kundalini awakening.
- The word "Spirit" comes from Latin SPIRARE, which means "blowing".
_ In Hindu mystiscism it is called as Chaitanya, flowing through the being
after liberation.
-Jews call it the Ruach.
So many other clues were given. The clues could not be deciphered, but once
one experiences it, it becomes evident what all these scriptures really meant.
It becomes then obvious that ALL of them talked about the same thing, but
we are finding ourseves in a situation that I could describe as follows:
Suppose I discover a flower that you have never seen or smelled. How can I
describe to you how this flower smells? Talking about it can give you ideas,
but you will only know clearly after you have smelled it. And now we are
facing people who have heard about this flower and they are arguing about
its smell without ever smelling it. Please see the point.
I also want to ask for your tolerance if all this sounds arrogant to you. If
there would be a better way to tell people about it, please let us now, but if
truth would be so easily understandable by the brain, people would have
respected the great incarnations when they were here to talk about it.
The message of Shri Mataji is simple and clear: "These modern times are
special. It has never been so easy to get self-realisation. Tell it to the
world that I am here NOW to give it and that NOW is the time to get what
all have been seeking many lifetimes."
We are using these notesfiles to talk about it. For anyone who wants to
find out more about it, information is freely available and we will gladly
answer all your genuine questions about it. But please save us from
arguing about the smell of the flower if you never smelled it.
Mataji also says: "This time I will not be crucified."
johan.
|
| 401.52 | Sahaja in the UK | LEG::GURRAN | Your reality or mine... | Tue Jul 04 1989 12:33 | 10 |
| Hi,
Is there in the UK that has had contact with Sahaja Yoga, either
successful or not?
Also does anyone have a list on dates that Sri Mataji (sp) will be
holding seminars here in the UK ?
Regards,
Martin
|
| 401.53 | Can we ask for tolerance without also offering it? | SHALOT::LACKEY | Service rendered is wisdom gained | Wed Jul 05 1989 11:34 | 38 |
| Re: .51 (Johan)
>You have certain concepts and you make it so clear that it has little in
>common with what we are talking about, so can I ask you politely to find the
>notesfile where your concepts match the subject.
To the contrary, "Self-realisation" has been a significant sub-topic in
your discussion of Sahaja Yoga. In fact, the name of the topic includes
the word "realisation." Frederick's response was directed specifically
to the idea of Self-realisation. Consequently, his reply was not
inappropriate. Perhaps Frederick is as confident in his understanding of
the topic as you are with yours.
It sounds as though you are suggesting that any disagreeable replies
should be directed elsewhere. If, as individuals, we find it difficult
to _value_ differences, we should at least _tolerate_ them out of respect
to this open forum.
If you simply don't want the topic of Sahaja Yoga to be diluted by a
discussion of Self-realisation, then perhaps we should create a topic
for that purpose. Note 912 (The Characteristics of Enlightenment) may
suffice for this purpose. However, if Self-realisation continues to be
a primary topic within this note, then Frederick's replies should be
just as welcome any others.
The capacity to experience belongs to everyone. Many, for whatever
reasons, seek to label their experience with words. None of us should
judge anothers experience based on their label, and none of us should
judge the label without the corresponding experience.
Self-realisation is a term which is wielded by many a teacher and group.
It is also a term which many use to define either their own experience
or the experience of others. I would recommend that this discussion be
carried further in another topic, but not criticized for having been
pursued here.
Jeff
|
| 401.54 | Feeling and thinking required. | MISERY::WARD_FR | Going HOME--as an Adventurer | Wed Jul 05 1989 12:12 | 46 |
| re: .53 (Jeff)
Thanks for the hand. I agree with what you say.
re: .54 (Johan)
I smell my own flowers, Johan. You can talk about the flowers
you are smelling until they exude through your skin, but unless I am
interested in smelling them, it won't make any difference. I have
no interest at this time to go to see Mataji (sp?) or to be
"enlightened" by her. I would be cautious (as in "shields up!")
in anyone who announces that they are the reincarnation of Jesus
or someone similar and who further states that my only hope is via
their message. Chalk it up to a rebellious attitude if you want. :-)
[See, gang, I really am more of a skeptic than most of you imagine!
;-)] Based on what you have written, I would define your experience
as awakening the Kundalini and if I were to label this topic it
would be as "Sahaja Yoga...Kundalini awakening" or something similar.
The concept of self-realization is, like Jeff states, definable
in many different ways. Perhaps the closest thing to it's definition
in the Western world is Abraham Maslow's steps to self-actualization.
Actually, Maslow was working on expanding his list near the time of
his death and never quite "got" it all. Self-realization as I
described it has nothing to do with the Kundalini...or, at least,
very little to do with the Kundalini. Please understand (I'm not
the only one here who has to understand, am I?) that I am not
invalidating your experience nor the experience of others surrounding
this woman's work or the *concept* of "Sahaja yoga." I encourage
others to try it if it appeals to them to do so. I would not go
out of my way to do so, but I would probably not avoid it if it
were offered to me in an appropriate manner/time/set/setting. My
big "beef" is with your term "realization." Quoting from ancient
novels (i.e., the Bible, Koran, etc.) doesn't impress me, either.
And, as you suggested, perhaps they were all referring to the
Kundalini, and *not* "self-realization" as you would like to suggest.
Some people like the smell of roses, others of jasmine, yet
others of gardenia. If I am content with the smell of my orange
blossom, I just might not be interested in the smell of your hibiscus.
If I can't stand it, on the other hand, then maybe I'll come sniffing
your way. Thank you for telling us how it smells over in your patch,
your "duty" has been done. Whenever (if you do) you want to smell the
flowers in mine, let me know.
Frederick
|
| 401.55 | Shri Mataji in Europe | SHIRE::PHILIP | Phil Ward Mgmt. Sci. Geneva-Etang | Thu Jul 06 1989 03:51 | 35 |
|
For those of us in Europe, there will be opportunities to meet
Shri Mataji and get the experience of Self-realisation as follows.
She will be speaking in English with translation into the local
language. I'll just mention the dates and cities where Shri Mataji
will be speaking, with a phone number or email address you can
contact to get details of where and when (or look out for posters):
Mo 10 July Paris tel 1 43 81 16 12
Tu 11 July Paris
We 12 July Brussels tel (02) 346 00 64
Th 13 July Amsterdam tel (020) 600 13 53
Fr 14 July Frankfurt tel (069) 59 07 70
We 19 July Munich tel (089) 17 36 37
Th 20 July Munich or Eva Luzi MUNLEG::Luzi
Mo 24 July Vienna tel (0222) 38 15 59
Tu 25 July Vienna or Helmut VNABRW::Eichert
Mo 31 July London tel (01) 622 16 34
Tu 1 August London
Fr 4 August Milano tel (02) 832 00 57
We 9 August Geneva tel (022) 61 23 92
Th 10 August Geneva or Phil Ward, SHIRE::Philip
14th-20th August Helsinki, tel (080) 753 46 15;
Leningrad, Moscow
Shri Mataji will be going to Australia in September.
|
| 401.56 | another opinion | PACKER::HANDY | | Thu Sep 07 1989 16:57 | 16 |
| Hi,
I would like a few words on this topic.
Having been a seeker of truth for many years i can relate well to every
mans opinions.Not till I decided to be a Finder did i come to my
present state of awareness.I recieved my self-realisation about six
weeks ago.thanks to these notes files.No two people will see the same
reality unless viewed from the same summit,or vantage point.There is
no way for a micro-person to understand macro-reality untill they
experience it.As i tune into (accept) the fact that i am an energy
being i am able to relate to the concept of sahaja.Personally
it is the only worthwhile thing i have found in the entire New-
Age movement,to give my time.You can lead a horse to water......
Blue Skies,
Howard
|
| 401.57 | Thousands Attend Russian Programs | ROXIE::SU | | Mon Sep 11 1989 17:10 | 15 |
| Shri Mataji has just returned from an historic visit to Russia which
marks a turning point for Sahaja Yoga in the West.
In Leningrad, 2,000 people attended the public program, and another
2,000 waited outside, unable to get into the crowded hall. The hall in
Moscow accommodated 1,000 which left 5,000 waiting outside. Forty
Sahaja yogis from different countries were also there. An official
news team accompanied Shri Mataji everywhere so that the Russian public
has also become aware of Mother's visit.
Sahaja Yoga has been officially recognized by the Soviet Government,
which sponsored and paid for Her entire trip. Shri Mataji has
commented that the Russians are simple people who respect and worship
the Mother. She was very pleased with the "miraculous" response.
|
| 401.58 | Meditation Workshop in Worcester, Mass. | VIDEO::SU | | Mon Sep 18 1989 16:26 | 25 |
|
Weekly meetings will be held in Worcester, Mass. every Thursday
evening from 7:30 to 9:00pm at St. Vincent Hospital School
of Nursing, Child Care Center (in the rear of the building).
Direction from Rt. 495:
Rt. 290 West, take Exit 13 - Kelly Sq. - go left
onto Vernon St. (Rt. 122A South) and through lights,
Bear right at fork (Monahan Pharmacy) staying on Vernon
St. Take first road on left - Spurr St. - go left into
parking lot. Entrance is on right.
Direction from Mass. Pike:
Rt. 290 East, take Exit 13 - Kelly Sq. - go left
onto Vernon St. (Rt. 122A South) and through lights,
Bear right at fork (Monahan Pharmacy) staying on Vernon
St. Take first road on left - Spurr St. - go left into
parking lot. Entrance is on right.
No money is ever charged for Sahaja Yoga Program.
For more information, please call:
(508)-829-6433 - Worcester
(617)-646-7547 - Boston
|
| 401.59 | Choosing The Right Path | VIDEO::SU | | Mon Sep 18 1989 17:00 | 40 |
| There are many people seeking spiritual enlightenment. Some of
them come to the conclusion that they need a teacher or master.
So where do you start? There are hundreds to choose from, not
all of them sincere or authentic, so what do you look for?
To begin with, you should not have to pay any money: none of the
great prophets charged money for what is man's natural birthright.
Altering your appearance to extremes is another pointless idea:
wanting to be different is usually a manifestation of ego, and
has nothing to do with spiritual growth.
It is generally accepted that, in order to lead a spiritual existence
one's material desires and immoral activities should be curbed, as
true freedom necessitates being free from such desires - all
established scriptures tell us this.
Extreme physical and mental practices are also unnecessary and may
even be harmful. What we are seeking is beyond thought and beyond
physical effort. Enlightenment cannot be achieved through the
intellect or through tying your body in knots.
Don't be fooled by trickery - many guru techniques are very low grade
and are done to impress those of us who are spiritually naive. Many
people become obsessed with guru and cannot stay away from him. This
is mesmerism, an unhealthy state - we should not be dependant on
anyone, everyone must become his or her own master.
Look at the way the teacher lives his life: he should be the
embodiment of purity, humility and compassion. There should be no
secrecy involved, as the truth belongs to everyone and cannot be made
into an organization or business enterprise.
Finally, there are various inner experiences to be felt, many of
which can come from the subconscious or supraconscious regions of
our psyche, e.g. flashing light, strange noises, fear, ghosts, etc.
These are not beneficial and have no bearing on reality. So please
be sceptical and discriminating before you put your spiritual welfare
into someone else's hands. Many people have suffered mentally and
physically as well as financially.
|
| 401.60 | The other "catches" seem honorable, however. | MISERY::WARD_FR | Going HOME--as an Adventurer | Tue Sep 19 1989 13:24 | 24 |
| re: .59 (::SU)
"in order to lead a spiritual existence all materialistic desires
and immoral behaviors should be curbed..."
This is definitely one of the religious tenets I hate. That all
religions spout this garbage without any sense of responsibility
for it is horrible. In the first place, what is immoral behavior?
What you say, what the government says, what the "holy fathers" say,
what your society says? Where does this end?... In the second
place, to say that all materialistic desires are "wrong" is an
insult and a contradiction to our own physicality. Don't tell me
to deny my physicality and then guilt-trip me for having physical
desires.
Next, who says enlightenment is free? If humanity rests in
physicality and money is also within physicality, is it no less
a part or teacher to us? Who says we cannot find enlightenment
in physicality? If we can't, then we're doomed.
Anyway, I could go on and on, but the point has been made.
I really have problems with this program as somehow being righteous
and true and somehow beyond the plebian, mundane nothingness of
the undeserving humans.
Frederick
|
| 401.61 | It does sound religious, but it's true! | BTOVT::BEST_G | stuck on the ECK mailing list | Tue Sep 19 1989 14:25 | 18 |
|
Frederick,
Who says that morality is only imposed by the (insert church or state
of your choice here)? Can't morality also be an internal ideal? That
would make morality a very individualistic idea indeed.
By what you write shall we assume that we should go out and buy a dozen
Mercedes and run around with half a dozen beautiful women on each arm?
Will we find happiness in that? I suppose we might eventually, but I
believe that there is a shorter or more direct path....
(Hmmmm....I can do without the Mercedes....)
:-)
Guy
|
| 401.62 | It's not up to others to judge one's morality... | MISERY::WARD_FR | Going HOME--as an Adventurer | Tue Sep 19 1989 14:46 | 24 |
| re: .61
Guy, with those thoughts, maybe we should buy a half-dozen
women and run around in Mercedes...(all right, I'm only being
facetious.) That was my point exactly...that morality is an
issue that must come from within, not to be dictated by/from
without. (This is called judgement.) But then it gets more
responsible than this. As one realizes that what they do to
others is what also happens to themselves, then these convenient
attitudes don't look so good (if you can't have a Mercedes or
if you can't buy women or, and more importantly, if you are at
the whims of a society that allows you to be bought/sold/used.)
No, if it doesn't backfire in this lifetime, then it probably
will in another. So once again one needs to look at impact, not
only on self (which is usually easier to see) but on the reality
around. Is the attitude (opinion, etc.) helpful or harmful to
others, not only self? Is this the most helpful way to grow or
just the most expedient? What do all the voices inside say (the
child within, the adolescent within, the negative ego...?)
So, where is this morality coming from? From "innocence" or
"guilt"? From a sorrowful past or from an abundant future?
Frederick
|
| 401.63 | That's why it's individualistic... | BTOVT::BEST_G | stuck on the ECK mailing list | Tue Sep 19 1989 15:10 | 11 |
| re:.62 (Frederick)
It looks like we are mostly in agreement.
>Where does this morality come from....?
Good question. Mine seems like it's always been there, just more
clouded at some times than others. I guess it's pretty subjective
though, and could be debated ad infinitum...
Guy
|
| 401.64 | | CSC32::MORGAN | Celebrating the Cybernetic Age. | Tue Sep 19 1989 15:21 | 72 |
| Reply to the last -.few,
I was just reading this am an interview of Israel Regardie by
Christpher Hyatt published in UNDOING YOURSELF TOO (Falcon Press 1988).
Both Reagrdie and Hyatt state that what gets them both in the most
trouble, including their major influence, Crowley, was insisting that
spirituality and sexuality were extremely beneficial to a spiritual
lifestyle.
None of the major teachers or teachign systems allowed for this. Here's
an interesting quote...
Hyatt
[Thanks, but I prefer religious and theraputic orientations which are
more experiential than theoretical. Too much theory always disturbs me.
I know we've talked about this before. The lack of life in many people
who have gotten into the occult. Many of them have become sort of dead.
They lost their sex life, the lose their party life, and a lot of them
lose all spontaneity. In face, I doubt if many of them have any life at
all.
Regardie
You're right. They probably never had much real life to them. This
picture however extends more or less over the whole occult field, a
sort of moral miasma.
....
Hyatt
However we have people like Waite (who are librarians of the most
dogmatic kind) who have had or attract the kind of audience that we're
talking about, a very moralistic, staid, old-fashioned, non-expressive,
non-orgasmic...
Regardie
Yes, non-orgasmic in nature. It's the old Christian morality again. He
was steeped in that. And he attracted those few people who were
already steeped in it like him. Anybody else, would have loathed him.
....
Hyatt
Waite sure wouldn't fit in well with a guy like you or Crowley or
Rajneesh or anyone who was pro-life. I imagine that some people who
have read your works can't imagine you having lots of fun driving
around in a sports car at age 77.
Regardie
We're getting into trouble again, but what you said is sad but true.
This is one reason why I generally avoid people in this field. They
can't integrate the fact that someone like me can have a lot of
fun--and be simply ordinary in so many ways. they expect of me a
certain role and become dissapointed when they find me so different
from their expectations.
Hyatt
Isn't that always a problem in the occult...that a wierd separation is
made bewteen the spiritual and the material. I find that very annoying.
Regardie
You're lucky. You haven't had that early orientation which separates
them.
Hyatt
No, I never had.
------------------------------------
Me
I objected some time ago to the separation between spirit and flesh.
They are inseparable. One without the other is dissolution. And we
still don't have a sufficient definition of spirit.
|
| 401.65 | | CSC32::MORGAN | Celebrating the Cybernetic Age. | Tue Sep 19 1989 15:25 | 11 |
| RE: <<< Note 401.63 by BTOVT::BEST_G "stuck on the ECK mailing list" >>>
>>Where does this morality come from....?
> Good question. Mine seems like it's always been there, just more
> clouded at some times than others. I guess it's pretty subjective
> though, and could be debated ad infinitum...
The explaniation I like best is that morality is someone else's ethics.
|
| 401.66 | An Invitation | VIDEO::SU | | Tue Sep 19 1989 16:13 | 65 |
|
SUBJECT: Lecture on YOGA
Speaker: Johan De Cocker - Belgium
When: Monday September 25 7.30 pm
Where: Boylston Auditorium - Harvard Yard
Topics:
Actual "yoga":
- ancient teachings now degraded to a sort of sophisticated
gymnastics for relaxation.
- the reality of entering into subconscious and supra-conscious
areas of awareness and the dangers of meditation techniques.
Health:
- emotional, mental, physical and social well-being. Only an
integrated approach is the answer.
- can we be physically aware of the triggering of a disease,
before the symptoms manifest?
- the Parasympathetic nervous system and the forces that are
controlling it.
- influence of culture, education, media, materialism. Why are
we the slaves of our habits, likes and dislikes? How can a
human retain his balance in a society of extremes?
The unique discovery:
- Sahaja Yoga and other yoga, the difference. It cannot be
studied, but consists of simple practices of recognizing
internal imbalances and correcting them, before disease
manifests. Thus a person cures himself.
----------------
This lecture is based on the teachings of the contemporary philosopher
Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi (born in 1923). She was known by Mahatma Gandhi.
She is the wife of the Secretary General of the UN Maritime Organization.
She is a mother and grandmother. Her unique system of integrated well-being
(Sahaja Yoga) was first introduced in 1970 and now daily practiced by many.
Earlier this year she drew the headlines because of her remarked tour
through the Soviet Union where she introduced this system to the high
officials of the Ministry of Health and also to the public by several
public programs.
Admission free. More information please contact:
Johan De Cocker
27, Ashland street
Arlington Heights, MA. 02174
617-646-7547
|
| 401.67 | 'enlightenment'--an aside | SA1794::CLAYR | | Tue Sep 19 1989 19:42 | 34 |
|
This is a little aside, but the question of 'enlightenment' and
what it does and does not consist of etc. seems to get debated quite
a bit. Now we even talk about whether it has a price associated
with it. The whole problem with any discussions about enlightenment
is that they all 'inherently' miss the point. It's the same thing
as when people talk about God. There's a human tendancy to put limita-
tions on things by describing them from our own distorted perspectives.
'Enlightenment' (realize that this is just my own perspective)
is not a condition. It isn't dependent upon any space/time events
or actions or ideas. One can never state "I will be enlightened
by this time next year" or "I was enlightened for a while back in
'66" any more than one could state "what a drag--I don't exist
anymore!". All I'm really trying to say is that enlightenment is
actually our true condition, for all past/present/future. One quote
that always stood out in my mind is "Before Abraham was, I AM",
from somewhere in the New Testament. That sounds more or less like
an 'enlightened' statement. In Nichiren Shoshu Buddhism, merely
vocally affirming devotion to the timeless eternal truth is said
to be enlightenment. Obviously, I'm still caught in the trap here
of trying to use words to describe a 'condition' associated with
enlightenment, but verbally it is not possible get out of this rut.
Anyway my whole point in a roundabout way is that to understand
enlightenment (like that's possible) we must step completely away
from all concepts and into the eternal heart of our own unlimited
existence.
roy
|
| 401.68 | | CSC32::BLAZEK | ever and always body and soul | Tue Sep 19 1989 22:14 | 19 |
|
.67> 'Enlightenment' (realize that this is just my own perspective)
.67> is not a condition. It isn't dependent upon any space/time events
.67> or actions or ideas.
My intention isn't to debate you, but I would like to say that
there are times when, internally, I feel more enlightened than
others. Times I feel more focused and sure of certain things.
I have not felt enlightened nor overly spiritual the last year
or so. I almost feel as if I lost something and I'm not ready
nor sure of where to find it.
So I think it is dependent on ideas, or at least a state of
mind/soul/consciousness/being. For me, it is not consciously
controllable. As one who feels like a floatie in a glass of
water (or the ocean), I just needed to express that feeling.
Carla
|
| 401.69 | Where's the Ocean? | USAT05::KASPER | Life's a gift, learn to accept it | Mon Sep 25 1989 14:05 | 16 |
| re: .68 (Carla)
> For me, it is not consciously controllable. As one who feels
> like a floatie in a glass of water (or the ocean), I just needed
> to express that feeling.
Like sometimes you feel as if you're on top of a great wave, can
see what's ahead, what you've left behind and where you're going
and can feel the breeze against your face. Then, at times, in the
"valley" between the waves where you can't seem to see the top of the
wave that last swept under you or the one that is coming up behind.
I know the feeling...
Terry
|
| 401.70 | | CSC32::BLAZEK | dream wars and a ticket to seem | Tue Sep 26 1989 18:41 | 5 |
|
Terry, that is a very apt analogy. Thank you for relating!
Carla
|
| 401.71 | "Irelate to you all,only know better,different" | PACKER::HANDY | | Wed Sep 27 1989 13:27 | 30 |
| re:fred and others,
Hi, I dont want to blow up any bridges,just explain my
own experience.
on morality,we all have within ourselves our onw true state
of being,from which we know right from wrong.Nobody really needs
anybody else to tell them.[this is truely judgement,if you judge
others you are judging yourself.]
This enlightened state of being that people try to
conceptualise and intelectualize can only be experienced,to really
know within the truth.The statement" undeserving lowly humans" may
very well be true,but it is available to us here today by the grace
of god.The only question is will i take advantage of this grace for
my own spiritual accent.This is truly the food that the seeker seeks.
The finding my way back home.to actually FEEL the conciousness of your
own very soul...to know the peace that exist just above your sixth
chakra.No spirit and Most Gurus cannot or will not give it.
The churches will denounce this because they loose controll.
What enlightened being needs a priest? or a church for that matter.
God is everywhere!!So i say to you all,put down your words,fears,
confusions,everything outside of yourselves.The answers are to be found
within...Only through sahaja can you have realisation in these days.
Unless you have 20 years or so to sit on top of some mountain.
Be brave,courageus,dont knock what you cannot know.I am nobody,but I
Know.......H.H.
|
| 401.72 | Burning Bridges | USAT05::KASPER | Life's a gift, learn to accept it | Wed Sep 27 1989 13:47 | 19 |
| RE: .-1 (HH)
> Hi, I dont want to blow up any bridges...
Don't worry, you didn't (mine, for one)
> Only through sahaja can you have realisation in these days.
I tend to disagree with you. I think "the church" that you mentioned
says the same thing about salvation, don't they? That they're the
only way? Why shouldn't I look at sahaja as just another institution?
How do you *know* it's the only way for me? Maybe for you, probably
not for me. All that I've read in this note about sahaja being "the
only way" to me is very limiting. The possibilities are infinite,
sahaja is only one of them and it isn't necessarily "the way" for
everyone. So, as I said, you didn't blow up any of my bridges but
you may be burning the ones behind you.
Terry
|
| 401.73 | One can be a fool anywhere... | MISERY::WARD_FR | Going HOME--as an Adventurer | Wed Sep 27 1989 13:47 | 15 |
| re: .71 (H.H.)
I don't have much argument against most of what you wrote.
I think it's quite valid, in fact, for me, too. What I would
disagree with in what you wrote, however, is the part that
says that there is no other way.
I have also disagreed from the beginning of these discussions
as to what the terms and concepts are. Your definition of
self-realisation is not the same as my term for self-realization.
I don't think we need to restate these definitions...all I wish
to do is to make that clear.
Frederick
(who is not more important than anybody, but is *not* nobody.)
|
| 401.74 | "something about compassion" | PACKER::HANDY | | Wed Sep 27 1989 17:19 | 20 |
| re:72
The church is only interested in controlling.In my mind.All the
worlds religions are taking a piece of the whole and calling it the
original,or the truth.The possibilities are only infinite after you
realize what you are.{experience}.What sahaja means is" spontaneous"
or what you are born with.What could be simpler and not for everyone???
This is the thing that Budda had and all the great prophets experienced
as the ultimate reality.Why when something like this is presented to
people as in the past they crusified{sp} them.that is just a reflection
of ignorance.nothing personal.its just the human condition i guess.
I did also mention another way to become enlightened.Sit in an
isolated area mountains are good for this.Purify your chakras one
by one and you to can do this.it took budda 40 some years.I personally
dont have that kind of commitment.I personally know a whole lot of
enlightened realised souls who are there own gurus and not one of them
got it outside of sahaja.let me know if you do!!!the only thing to fear
is fear itself.ive heard that before.good vibrations.
H.H.
|
| 401.75 | The blossom time has come | VIDEO::SU | | Wed Sep 27 1989 19:06 | 48 |
|
re: Fred et al.
I like to quote something from Christ not even church can understand today:
"Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see
the kingdom of God."
"Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the
Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the
flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not
that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it
listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it
cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit."
Now, please don't accuse me that I copied this from the "Christianity".
Really, I want to say that Truth does not have copyright. It does not
belong to any body in this world or any organization or institution in this
world. We people in Dejavu notes know that Budda, Christ, other incarnations
from Hindu, Mohammed...all have similiar parable.
Human race is very privileged race. Unless you were born in human in the
first place, you cannot reach the Consciousness State. We can say we human
being were made of water and Spirit. So it Meaning that you have to enter
the Kingdom of God through narrow gate (the Angya Chakra in the middle way
which were ruled by Christ, the quality of purity and forgiveness has to be
sustained). Even those being (half man, half god) like Indra, Asura...
has to be born again in human physical being and giving a chance to ascend
through the middle way. Fred has mentioned the physical world and all that;
this is where I am getting at - the flesh level. In this flesh being, there
is an energy within you that it has to be awakening so that you transform
into different state of being. You become the Spirit.
Christ did not believe Synogogue (church,temple) has control over the
Consciousness State where the great joy of yoga exists, just as you believe
today. It was someone else came after him mess it up. So, you still try
to sale God in different form?
I only wish you were in the Harvard Uninversity last monday (the 25th) that
you should see those young students look at their hand with wide open eyes,
wide open mouth with the look of amazement when they got their Kundalini
energy awakening (self-realisation) and feeling the cool breeze in their
hands as well as on top of their head. With an open mind you can experience
that also and you become the Spirit.
Christ did not give self-realisation then. He came to achieve another
state of human evolution and he did it by being crucified. I say it
again that he has nothing to do with today's church.
|
| 401.76 | Cool breezes from ear to ear... | MISERY::WARD_FR | Going HOME--as an Adventurer | Thu Sep 28 1989 11:57 | 13 |
| re: .75 (::SU)
I sayeth unto thee that mine state of wind floweth
away beyond the kingdom of confusion. Verily, verily, I
sayeth, to thee I abandon discourse, for the rings of fire
circulate round yonder temple of birth. For mine is the
kingdom of mine own, and thine is of thine own, and thus
they be parted. Go and hold thy peace, and share it with
them who eateth with thee.
Frederick
|
| 401.77 | Member of the SRC (Sahaja Realization Club) | REGENT::WAGNER | | Thu Sep 28 1989 12:10 | 59 |
| .75
SO you guys say all you have to do is move some thing called
"kundalini" up and out through your head and all of a sudden you
become "realized?"
"..and the feeling of cool breeze in their hands as well as on the top of their
head."
This could be duplicated by auto suggestion and hypnosis. And I maintain that
it probably was experienced in this way. I say this because Guatama buddha
never placed any emphasis on any kind of feelings. Buddha did not start by
teaching the beauty of realization. Does feeling this cool breeze give one
insight to everyday situations so they can be handled effectively? Does this
technique allow one to work easily and fluidly with their Dharma? Buddhism
promises nothing. It teaches us to be what we are, to relate to where we are,
constantly, and it teaches us to relate to our living situation accordingly.
This is what realization is about-living day-to-day effectively and joyously.
.74 (Handy)
"I personally know a whole lot of enlightened realized souls who are their
own gurus and not one of them got it outside of sahaja. Let me know if you
do!!!"
How do you know? Do they carry credentials? Is there a union? Is there a
certificate or examination or review board for realized persons? Again, I
propose that if any of those "realized persons" do not maintain the joy and
openness to **ANY** situation that comes along, then their enlightenment was
perhaps only momentary and they are living on past feelings.
I probably have met one or two persons throughout my 41+ years of
living who could be described as enlightened. Not because they told me so,
but because of how they act in day to day situations with contentment and
accepting of whatever comes along. I myself do not profess to be enlightened
and will continue to question those who profess very loudly that they are. In
fact I will "proudly" claim i am nobody, which reminds me of a story...
One day a Rabbi in a moment of enlightenment threw himself on the floor of the
synagogue and proclaimed "I am nobody! I am nobody!" A moment later the
Assistant (forgot his title) does the same thing; "I am nobody! I am nobody!"
Just at that moment, the janitor comes by and gets caught up in the moment and
throws himself down and shouts "I am nobody, also." The Rabbi looks at his
his assistant and says "Look who thinks he is a nobody!"
This shows how easy it is to get caught up in the *idea* of enlightenment,
or salvation, or even suffering and totally miss the point. The point of
getting past the dualistic barrier and into openness and compassion. As long
as one thinks that someone else (religion, or people, or governments) is trying
to control, there is a duality. "Me" or "them." There cannot be total
compassion for one and all (even our enemies) if there are boundaries between
"me" and "them." If you only get good feelings by giving compassion to only a
select few, and reject the rest(certain religions, certain governments,certain
types of spirituality), Then are those good feelings you get really a sign of
enlightenment or a symptom of ego satisfaction? I'll leave this for you to
answer.
Ernie
|
| 401.78 | OK, now that you're enlightened... | CGVAX2::PAINTER | One small step... | Thu Sep 28 1989 12:22 | 10 |
|
To condense somewhat some of the earlier replies...
So you are enlightened and you felt a cool breeze. Great. Wonderful.
I'm happy for you.
My question then is "So what?" What do you plan on doing with this
enlightenment? What are you going to do next?
Cindy
|
| 401.79 | | HYDRA::LARU | goin' to graceland | Thu Sep 28 1989 12:39 | 15 |
| I suggest that those of us who are not "enlightened" have no way
of determining whether anyone else is enlightened, either.
and that loudly (or softly) proclaiming the invalidity of
someone else's path only serves to enlarge the boundaries
between us.
I also suspect that any of us who are "truly" enlightened have no
need nor desire to question another's path...
Why do so many of us feel the need to prove that another's path
is inferior????
/bruce
|
| 401.80 | I may have been wrong... | BTOVT::BEST_G | Walking this dream everlasting | Thu Sep 28 1989 12:56 | 22 |
|
re: .79 (Bruce)
At the risk of sounding like a spiritual schmuck - I feel that
sometimes we're "on" and sometimes we lose it. When we reach one
of those temporary highs we feel like we know it all and should
therefore spread the word so we can help others. But we can't do
that. The closest we can come is to be completely passive in
presenting our ideas. If others choose to listen to them or happen
to resonate with them, then so be it. We should not expect others
to listen. But life is really contradictory when it comes to this
stuff - just look at me - I'm trying to be objective, but I'm still
preaching....;-)
"Don't'cha follow me now..."
Todd Rundgren
Guy
|
| 401.81 | "nobetter,but it works for me" | PACKER::HANDY | | Thu Sep 28 1989 13:23 | 9 |
|
re:78
The cool breezes are felt as a sign that there is a conection
with the divine in each of us.The more important aspect is that there
is a profound {for me}change in consciousness.A peace,silence in
the mind,no anzieties.Extreme emotional attachments drop away.We
become our spirit,more dynamic human beings.Living in the light...
|
| 401.82 | The subtle working of realization | VIDEO::SU | | Thu Sep 28 1989 13:55 | 78 |
| Self-Realisation is a subtle process:
Kundalini is a dormant energy lying coiled in the triangular bone
(coccyx) at the base of the spine until the time of its awakening.
When Kundalini is awakened the subtle centers of our being (chakras)
are enlightened as the Kundalini rises within our spine, culminating
in the experience of spiritual enlightenment.
There are seven major chakras, which are experienced as seven
locations in the spinal column. Their gross expressions are the
plexuses of the autonomic nervous system.
The chakras are the landmarks of our inner geography and of man's
spiritual evolution through time. Each of the seven main chakras
is governed by a power of Divine Almighty, an aspect of the divine
nature, which helped us to evolve through the different evolutionary
stages of the tree of life. The first to be created was the quality
of innocence, and this chakra lies below the Kundalini, protecting
Her. This chakra, many of you following the tantric form, has been
mistaken to be awaken by the act of sex! In self-realisation the
chakras, representing our seven selves, become threaded together by
our Kundalini to achieve perfect integration.
By acknowledging the qualities of these divine aspects in ourselves
we allow the deities to become awakened (so we were made as image
of God!). They enlighten the chakras and expand the inner space,
allowing the chakra to open so that the Kundalini can rise within
us.
When Kundalini crosses Agnya chakra in the forehead we become
thoughtlessly aware, and when it pierces the fontanel bone at the top
of the head we feel a cool breeze on the hands (self-realisation).
We have become connected with that all-prevailing power which loves,
thinks, organizes and understands, and we feel the joy of divine love
flowing over us like a refreshing stream.
Kundalini is our Mother, we are her only child, and she has been with
us through all our lives just waiting for this moment of fulfillment.
When Kundalini pierces the top of the head it reaches the seat of the
Spirit (Atma) which resides in the heart. The Spirit is the innermost
part of our being (Self) and is the reflection of God Almighty within
us. We now come to know the true nature of our Self.
The nature of Spirit (Atma) is to be a witness to everything we do.
After the metamorphosis of self-realisation we gradually become one
with the witness, which we feel consciously as vibrations. Wisdom
dawns on us as we now have the guidance of the Absolute. Balancing
and harmony become simple and spontaneous.
We can also feel this universal nature in another human being
(collective consciousness). By putting our hands towards them we can
find out the state of their Kundalini, and give them awakening and
then enlightenment - like one enlightened candle which enlightens
another. Collective consciousness is an actuality that can be
empirically tested by any realized person.
If one chakra is blocked the Kundalini will go to that part and
nurture it. This may be seen as a pulsation on the spine, or felt
as a pricking or burning on one of the fingers. Each finger or part
of the hand has a precise correlation with one of the chakras.
This was described in Koran - "That day shall we set a seal on their
mouths but their hands will speak."
The block may be due to various causes, for instance physical damage,
toxic substances, negative attitude, or psychic invasion by a dead
spirit.
By the grace of Kundalini, when a realized soul gives vibrations or
puts a bond of love (bandhan) to the block, the obstruction can be
dissolved. The pulsating stops, the Kundalini rises, and a lightening
of the spirit results.
The term of "enlightenment soul" by no means to be arrogant. It is
just to described that a person is in the state of awakening. The
enlightenment and self-realization also has depth in its own to be
developed by oneself. There is no club to join, or you cannot buy
it any where.
|
| 401.83 | Would like some clarification | BOOKIE::ENGLAND | I'm a part of It's a part of me | Thu Sep 28 1989 14:07 | 28 |
| Re: .71 (H.H.)
I have a few questions regarding your message (noted above).
> -< "I relate to you all,only know better,different" >-
Perhaps I'm misunderstanding what you mean here. Please tell me,
how do you know you know better and what is your purpose in stating it?
> Only through sahaja can you have realisation in these days.
> Unless you have 20 years or so to sit on top of some mountain.
Wow...this is really narrowing it down. But as you said at the
beginning of your message, this is *your* experience.
For your reference, I (and probably many others in this file) have
experienced things that have been discussed in this note...and I have
never used Sahaja Yoga. This is not meant to discount your
experiences, but rather to suggest that there are many ways to get to
the same point. I'm glad for that, or we'd all be in worse trouble
than we're already in! It is my experience that there are lights
coming from many directions.
> Be brave,courageus,dont knock what you cannot know.I am nobody,but I
This is an interesting line. Exactly what is it that I cannot know?
Jerri
|
| 401.84 | My limited experience | HYDRA::LARU | goin' to graceland | Thu Sep 28 1989 14:56 | 42 |
| I attended an introductory session to Sahaja Yoga in
Cambridge about a year and a half ago...
There were about 25 people there, some of whom had obviously
been there before (they did things before they were told).
We sat in chairs, facing a picture of [whatever-her-name-is],
a map of the body showing the chakras and path of the
kundalini, while waiting for latecomers and to set up the tape recorder
that would play [her] introduction to SY. I remember that
there were some "technical difficulties." I fell asleep
during the introductory remarks, which were cut short because
we were running late.
We then listened to a tape that led us through what to me was
a relaxation/meditation exercise. We were also led through
some recitations/affirmations (as I recall). We were then
to place our hands over our head to "feel the cool breeze of
the kundalini." I like to think of myself as a skeptic
at these things; I've always been afraid of placing myself
in the hands of any group that "knows what's best for me,"
whether it's EST or Scientology, but part of me certainly
*wanted* to feel it. During the meditation, the leaders
walked behind us, checking our kundalini for themselves
(we were supposed to have our eyes shut, but my paranoia
sometimes gets the better of me).
I'm still not sure whether I "really" felt something, but
part of me thought that *maybe* there was "something"
out-of-the-ordinary happening, even though I was still
very much afraid of "being had."
However, I was told told by some off the leaders that the
stuff was really *pouring* out, suggesting to me a torrent
(maybe my brains falling out, Arthur? :-)... All
participants were welcomed to attend further sessions
iin a private home at another time.
It seemed to me at the time just a little too much like
hype, and I didn't follow up.
/bruce
|
| 401.85 | Feelings, nothing more than feelings, whoa, whoa, woooo... | USAT05::KASPER | Life's a gift, learn to accept it | Thu Sep 28 1989 15:01 | 43 |
|
Of those who support the idea that sahaja is "the only way", how
do you know that I am not a realized soul or fully enlightened?
Because I don't practice what you do? From this notes file, or by
passing me on the street, would you know? Am I to think that if I
feel a cool breeze on my hands or my toes tingle or my ears ring
that I am enlightened? I don't think so. Enlightenment (or whatever
you want to call it) is much more than all that has been said around
this subject. Ernie (I think) put it well when he said it's learning
to live day-to-day and learning to do it with love. Cool breezes on
my hand won't necessarily facilitate this behavior. I have to do it
*consciously* - much easier said than done. And, there are many
ways to accomplish it. If one looks, one can see this love in the
others they meet and in themselves - they all have their own ways.
Does Mother Theresa practice sahaja? How about Nelson Mandella?
Or the student who stood in front of the Chinese tank? Obiwan or
Luke Skywalker? ;-)
I know it has been said that sahaja isn't the only way, that one could
sit on a mountain for 40 years, but are there really any short cuts?
Do you really think it's that easy to fool the all-mighty ego? A
cool breeze on the hand and 'poof' the ego is gone? If what I've
learned about kundalini (and maybe some others can help here), this
is energy not to be taken lightly, that a pre-muture awakening could
be physically dangerous. And the alternative, to spend my whole life
working and waiting for such an awakening, would be a waste of my time
anyway. There's to much life to live, too many people to meet and
love, too many things to do to sit and wait. If it comes, it comes...
Is there such a thing as "fully enlightened" anyway? If so, isn't
that what we refer to as God/Goddess/All-that-is? Even to speculate
that G/G/ATI is a static state doesn't seem right to me. All this
physical feeling stuff as a baramoter to self-realization is fine and
well for some, I suppose, but one can really get caught up in seeking
the effects of something rather than focusing on the real stuff. A
short story I heard could be applied here:
A student met his/her teacher one day and with joy, exclaimed
"Master I have been meditating for twenty years and I can
finally levitate across the river!", to which his/her master
replied, "For ten cents you could have taken the boat."
Terry
|
| 401.86 | | CSC32::MORGAN | Cybernetic Society Arrives Today! | Thu Sep 28 1989 15:15 | 4 |
| I'd like to echo Cindy's question to our participants...
So some of us got realization (something like gettin' religion).
Whatcha' goona' do with it? Trade enlightenments like baseball cards??
|
| 401.87 | | USWAV1::JOLLIMORE | | Thu Sep 28 1989 15:20 | 6 |
| Whatca' gonna do with it?
Everything!
Once you get it, you do nothing without it.
I charged mine to my Visa.
Jay
|
| 401.88 | Make checks payable to Public Enlightenment Co. | AOXOA::STANLEY | It takes dynamite to get me up... | Thu Sep 28 1989 15:34 | 4 |
| I *knew* I should've gotten a Visa card! Jay, just how much did it cost?
Maybe I can put it on lay away. :-)
Dave
|
| 401.89 | | CSC32::MORGAN | Cybernetic Society Arrives Today! | Thu Sep 28 1989 15:47 | 15 |
| I do not wish to denigrate our Eastern counterparts. Realization(s) and
enlightenment(s) are very important. They are life changing alterations
in our neural-programming.
But perhaps our Western minds have discerned a certain 'finality' to
realization(s) and enlightenment(s) which remind us of our previous
experiences of 'getting it.' And for some strange reason humans seem to
be always 'getting it' somewhere, from someone. Why there are so many
'getting its' that we can't keep up with them all now.
'Getting it' seems to lead tp a place of peace, but I suggest that it
leads only to a place of rest, from which we can venture onward into
new realms and back again.
My appologies if I've offended our Eastern counterparts.
|
| 401.90 | A practical answer for a practical question. | VIDEO::SU | | Thu Sep 28 1989 16:22 | 31 |
| Life after self-realisation is like you turn on the light and
you can see well whatever you are doing and you can not go wrong.
The self-realisation has many stages just like moon has many phases.
The ultimate goal is God-realization as Buddha has achieved, but
it is not possible in one life time. The very first thing you
will notice is you become younger, your eyes shining. Your health
is a by-product of self-realisation. Your personality emit joy and
peace.
For us, the cleanse of the chakras become practical chores.
Your brain become dynamic, your creativity expand. If you are
an artist, everything you created has vibrations. Your solution
to problem become effortless. There is no stress since you have
no worry for tomorrow. Life become spontaneous nature.
Since you are connected with the unconsciousness, you are protected
out and out. No tree will fall on you. No accident will happen to
you when you take a plane. If you are on a bus and it rolls down
the side of the mountain, nobody will get killed because of you.
If you watch an misshape is happening, your attention will divert
it from unavoidable. You become your own witness.
Your prayer will be granted if it is not on a gross level. "Thy will
be done on earth as it is in heaven."
The karma will have no effect on you any more.
As you establish your own guru principle, you will discover your
own power. You become an angel, a saint. And, you can trade all the
baseball cards you want IN YOUR WAY.
|
| 401.91 | | USWAV1::JOLLIMORE | | Thu Sep 28 1989 16:46 | 9 |
| .88 Dave: How much ya got??? heh heh ;')
.89 Mikie? I think you answered your own question. Whatca gonna
do with it? Rest in it, then venture onward to new realms and back
again. And, I was serious in my reply (except the last line ;')
Once you reach any stage of enlightenment it changes what you do
and how you do it from then on, or so I'm told ;')
Jay
|
| 401.92 | Our game of quest is at end. | VIDEO::SU | | Thu Sep 28 1989 17:10 | 42 |
| The famous German philosopher Schelling remarked once: "If God would
appear to me with the truth in the right hand and the quest of the
truth in the left, asking me to choose between the two, I would rush
towards his left hand telling him : "Oh Father, keep the Truth for
yourself alone."
Does this slightly straight forward statement correspond to a wide
spread attitude of the modern seeker? Are we more interested in the
game of "truth seeking" than in the Truth itself? Today this
hypothesis is put to test by the message of Shri Mataji.
Shri Mataji's message is very simple. She says: "Do you want the truth?
come and get it."
What happens to those who come?
They arrive at a program of Sahaja Yoga, sit quitely, eventually listen
to Mataji's exposure of mysteries of Kundalini Tantra... and they
stretch their hands toward Her. After sometime, the pupils start
dilating. They may feel a bit sleepy. A gentle breeze, like a cool
wind, comes in the hands. The breeze has been described in the sacred
Christian scriptures as the breath of the Holy Spirit, the Power of God
the Almighty. It is the Chaitanya Lehari of Adi Shankaracharya. But
they do not know it. They just sit peacefully in front of Shri Mataji,
absolutely serene, extremly happy, watching inside the bubbling of a
new joy. They are the newly born children of the Truth shining with
God's own beauty. Their eyes are full of wonder. They smile or may be
they laugh. A great silence has taken place inside. In this silence
they know they are pure, they are noble, they are free. It is like
waking up after a long dream. I know it because it has happened to me.
"Come and get it." Some seekers cannot take it. "How is it possible?"
they argue. They hide themselve, they escape...without having the
courage to come. Because after all, "the seeking" is such a nice role,
identified with so many engrossing emotional and mental tunes, "Get
it" would put an end to all this.
In the play of the Quest, in the game of hide and seek, we used to like
the salty taste of tears. But everything human has it beginning and
its end. Such is also the case for the play in which we were calling
our Divine Mother and Father.
|
| 401.93 | >no need to read between lines< | PACKER::HANDY | | Thu Sep 28 1989 17:20 | 5 |
|
re:Jerry,
.92 and all other statements by great yogi says it all.
|
| 401.94 | Transcendental Terminology | CIMAMT::TOLAA | | Thu Sep 28 1989 18:13 | 61 |
|
I went to a Sahaja Yoga meeting in New York where I supposedly
received realization. I think there's a big gap in terminology here.
Maybe what Mataji, the head of Sahaja Yoga means by "realization"
is more "realization of potential" than the ultimate event that most
people understand it to be. I thought I did experience something of
this "cool breeze" phenomenon but it was very faint and didn't seem
very significant to me. However, I'm sure it must deepen and grow
stronger in those who give it their regular attention.
Kundalini is something very real and yet it's easy to dismiss it as
hypnosis, autohypnosis, or wishful thinking. Then again, you could
dimiss orgasm on the same grounds, if you were a virgin.
On the other hand, I have to strongly disagree that with the
statement that Kundalini awakening = realization!
Kundalini itself is a vehicle, not a goal. And it is probably
not the only vehicle to the goal. It's a route to realization through
purification of the nervous system and its subtle correspondent --
the chakra system.
There are classic descriptions of Kundalini phenomenon in old traditional
texts such as the Hatha Yoga Pradipka. No mention there is made of this
"cool breeze" stuff. The Kundalini can feel soothing and
"cool" at times, but it can also create a literal fever or burning sensation.
Its most often likened to a fire because it consumes, transforms, and
always reaches upward.
In the vast majority of cases Kundalini awakening just doesn't make
Joe or Jane Average an instant Jesus Christ. It may not even make one
a visibly better person immediately, though it does set in motion a
process which makes the ultimate event possible. It's said that the Kundalini
can take several hundred years to do its work (belief in reincarnation assumed).
One thing the Kundalini does do immediately for many if not most people
is open an inner sense that makes real spiritual feelings and perceptions,
not fantasies and concepts, possible for the first time in their lives
and shows them the often-missed difference between the two. It also gives
the conviction that there IS a state of being to strive for and sometimes
a sense of "presence" and even protection and guidance. This is great,
but to say that its Realization is to demean the word.
A Kundalini awakening, according to my teachers, is a one-time, permanent
affair, not something you have again and again. But its only the
beginning, the moment of rebirth. There's a tremendous amount of
growth to be accomplished by the Kundalini itself and by YOU before
realization is anything but a fanciful word.
In my own case, I received, "Shaktipat," the transmission that awakens
this energy about seven years ago from a teacher. I have to admit
that I'm still a jerky person with a lot of deficiencies. But I do
find that when it happened I was able to sit for meditation with ease
and go very deep like never before and this has persisted over the years,
though there are dry periods sometimes. Also, my yearning for growth has
increased. I attribute this to the working of this awakening force.
Though I'd say realization is probably still a long, long way down
the pike. "Realization" implies being "realistic."
|
| 401.95 | I'll have another TOLAA-COLAA, please. | MISERY::WARD_FR | Going HOME--as an Adventurer | Fri Sep 29 1989 11:37 | 7 |
| re: .94 (::TOLAA)
Thanks for that. You put nicely into words what several
have "sensed."
Frederick
|
| 401.96 | Understanding and experience | CHFS32::LTAYLOR | Nothing unreal exists. | Fri Sep 29 1989 11:46 | 29 |
| A very basic, though difficult, spiritual principle is being
overlooked in this discussion of Sahaja yoga. Mother Nirmala
offers a direct experience, and it has been my experience
that my understanding is not only unnecessary to receive
that experience but often gets in the way.
I put so much reliance on the rational mind (especially in
this business) that it becomes almost personally insulting
when someone says my understanding doesn't matter. I
approach a raving lunatic come out of the desert who doesn't
care a bit about my well honed and polished theological
systems. He dunks me in the river and, viola, I experience
something ineffable.
The Zen roshi listens patiently while I pour over my
spiritual angst. Instead of engaging my ideas he hits me
with a stick. I can either get mad and mutter to myself what
an asshole this guy is or receive his gift and experience
him directly.
My own experience with Mother Nirmala touched me on many
different levels. She is a dear, sweet woman, and I am
grateful she extended herself to me in such a sublime way.
Like everyone else, she has her own understanding of the
world. It may not be very compatible with my own, but I know
that fact does not diminish the power or the glory of the
experience we shared.
Larry
|
| 401.97 | Realization can happen anywhere..if I can go there | BOOKIE::ENGLAND | I'm a part of It's a part of me | Fri Sep 29 1989 12:15 | 57 |
| Re: .93 (H.H.)
> re:Jerry, (Jerri)
> .92 and all other statements by great yogi says it all.
Not to me. It doesn't answer the questions I was asking you about what
you said.
> -< >no need to read between lines< >-
Then why are you directing me to another response? :-)
I was curious about your statements that said you were better and that
there were things I could not know. If you don't want to answer, that's
fine with me.
Re: .92 (SU)
I felt good feelings from a few of the feelings you described because
they are feelings that I feel too...and something that I appreciate very
much. Although many people might not believe me, I don't care. As I
said, I have never taken Sahaja Yoga, but seeing as how I think truth
and realization and love and awareness are everywhere (because they are
part of US)...then I can celebrate these shared feelings with others,
regardless of how they might think they've gotten those things, or how
they define it.
> They just sit peacefully...
> absolutely serene, extremly happy, watching inside the bubbling of a
> new joy. .... Their eyes are full of wonder. They smile or may be
> they laugh. A great silence has taken place inside. In this silence
> they know they are pure, they are noble, they are free. It is like
> waking up after a long dream. I know it because it has happened to me.
Yes, I feel these things a great deal...it feels quite natural to me
in my day-to-day living, and not something I look at as an unexpected
experience. It varies in degrees but it is not dependent on my surroundings;
it fluctuates with my own state of mind and what *I* am doing with it.
During many, many steps I take, I look at the things around me, the beauty,
the love, the feeling of oneness; I am part of it -- it is not a movie I'm
walking through. It is not a quest I am on. It is not a goal I must reach.
It is a PART of ME! So yes, I believe I can understand many of the feelings
you are referring to -- it just appears that we are arriving at these places,
through different means.
> Are we more interested in the
> game of "truth seeking" than in the Truth itself?
I think so (for many of us). I think that is why people try to define
specific paths, and rules about those paths. I believe that if you're
reveling in the glory of it all, there is little interest in defining paths.
At that point, it just doesn't matter how anyone gets there. I think it
matters more that we share what we discover; not the path we took.
Jerri
|
| 401.98 | | PACKER::HANDY | | Fri Sep 29 1989 13:29 | 15 |
| re:97(Jerri)
I dont recall saying I was better,I said thatI know better.
Alot of people develope defense mechanisms in their atitudes
and personality that blocks the possibility of real growth and
change.What the truth is.is.
The only reason I said "cant know" is from the responses.
Obviously if someone acts like they dont know how can they
ever understand.Its like describing colors to a blind person.
You have to have some insight,or you cant relate...
|
| 401.99 | Response | CGVAX2::PAINTER | One small step... | Fri Sep 29 1989 15:17 | 36 |
|
Re.98 + a few (Handy) and (VIDEO::SU)
It's interesting that the experience you are describing (sans the cool
breeze, of course), is about the same as what happens in Christian
revival meetings, or even at Billy Graham gatherings. All of these
people become 'enlightened' and believe the path to salvation is to
'Get Jesus and get saved'. The wonderful thing about this is that a
major difference has been made in their life - they realize that they
really are connected to the Divine as opposed to being barnacles upon
the earth not good enough to be loved by God/Goddess/ATI. And if they
call upon Jesus' name, He will indeed be there for them. There are
also a lot of pictures, crucifixes and other sorts of objects around so
that they remind themselves on a regular basis about the experience
they first had.
From my own personal vantage point (or IMO), more mature Christians
realize that, as St. Paul wrote in one of those books in the New
Testament that we are to all walk the paths of our own salvations in
fear and trembling. This translates into the fact that it is not by
faith that we are 'saved', but by deeds as well...in fact by the very
way we live moment by moment. "Traveler there is no road...the road is
made by walking." - Mesaros (I believe).
Who are these 'changed' people and how can you tell? As written in the
Bible, "Ye shall know them by their fruits." To me this applies not
only to Christians but to all people who profess to be a part of the
Divine, whether they receive their 'enlightenment' via a Holy Book, an
audience with a religious person, or by looking at a blade of grass
growing in a dried mud flat and recognize the miracle that life can exist
where it does not appear to be possible.
This is the point behind my question - now that you're enlightened,
what are you going to do next?
Cindy
|
| 401.100 | "Really love your peaches..." | BTOVT::BEST_G | Walking this dream everlasting | Fri Sep 29 1989 15:32 | 8 |
|
re: .99 (Cindy)
> "Ye shall know them by their fruits."
Anyone who eats bananas is enlightened in my book. ;-)
Guy
|
| 401.101 | Shake my tree and I'll......... | CGVAX2::PAINTER | One small step... | Fri Sep 29 1989 17:10 | 7 |
|
Oh dear, did I misquote again? (;^) Gotta read that book again
someday.
"Ye shall know them by their WORKS."
-----
Cindy
|
| 401.102 | ...I'll...have lots of bananas...yeah, that's it!... | BTOVT::BEST_G | Walking this dream everlasting | Fri Sep 29 1989 17:16 | 8 |
|
re: Cindy
I think I'm in big trouble....
;-)
Guy
|
| 401.103 | buy a big, bright, green, pleasure machine | ULTRA::G_REILLY | | Fri Sep 29 1989 17:58 | 29 |
|
re: .99 (Cindy)
> Who are these 'changed' people and how can you tell? As written in the
> Bible, "Ye shall know them by their fruits." To me this applies not
> only to Christians but to all people who profess to be a part of the
> Divine, whether they receive their 'enlightenment' via a Holy Book, an
> audience with a religious person, or by looking at a blade of grass
> growing in a dried mud flat and recognize the miracle that life can exist
> where it does not appear to be possible.
For me, I don't think that works alone can indicate enlightment. Primarily,
'good works' are culturally and contextually dependent. Secondly, it's
very easy to perform 'good works' without any hint of enlightment. (Take
Jim and Tammy Baker, for example, providing of course that one admits that
what they sold to people could be construed as 'good works'.)
For me, I tend to recognize those who are seeking enlightment by the
feeling I receive from them (a telepathic sort of experience.)
> This is the point behind my question - now that you're enlightened,
> what are you going to do next?
That's EASY! Go and try to enlighten others, of course! :-) (joke, just
a joke.)
alison
|
| 401.104 | After Self-Realisation. | VIDEO::SU | | Fri Sep 29 1989 18:21 | 30 |
| re: -.99
What do you do after self-realisation?
Now that you feel the tiny bitty winny cool breeze on top of your head,
you are into a new state of awareness. You can prove that there is a
subtle system of chakras in your body and you continue meditate in
silence. You develop your vibration awareness and all the quality of
chakras within you. Sahaja Yoga has many techniques to cleanse your
subtle system. The more you are in the center (the middle way of
Sushuma), the deeper experience you gain. You become your own witness.
For many Yoga, self-realisation is the end but in Sahaja Yoga this is
just a beginning.
You have to establish your position in the Kingdom of God...
Again, the meditation is a state, is not what you do. You have to be there
by yourself to experience it. As Larry have pointed it out - analyze
will not get you anywhere.
I hope I have answered your question.
This also answer a few question in the previous entry, that if you are
a realized soul, immediately you will recognize the Truth, the reality
in front of you. And only in Sahaja Yoga, you will understand the
meaning of vibration in yourself. You will know how to help yourself
and others - the application of it in life. All this become possible
because of Mother Nirmala.
After you become enlightened, you can enlighten other human being.
Sahaja Yoga begins at where all other Yoga stop. You become one with
reality. Sahaja Yoga goes beyond all mystical point.
|
| 401.105 | Reality? | VIDEO::SU | | Fri Sep 29 1989 18:40 | 14 |
| re: -.103
It was not possible before 1970, before Mother Nirmala started to give
self-realization en-mass that one enlightened soul can enlighten
another soul in this nature, spontaneous way as one lighted candle can
lit another candle.
We have talked about reality so much in this notes conference. What is
reality? At least, we can say when American astronauts went to the
moon, at the time when they re-entered the earth all human being forgot
their difference in race, politics, nationality and everyone prayed for
their safe landing. In that instance, we have touched the reality - we
become one collective human being. And, this is all Sahaja Yoga is
about - to be oneness within God.
|
| 401.106 | Interesting | CGVAX2::PAINTER | One small step... | Fri Sep 29 1989 19:38 | 9 |
|
Re.105 (SU)
The word 'missionary' comes to mind here. I've only ever heard of
Christian ones...but...
In any case, go forth and enlight! And have fun.
Cindy
|
| 401.107 | Just another view | BOOKIE::ENGLAND | I'm a part of It's a part of me | Fri Sep 29 1989 20:11 | 10 |
| Re: 103 (Alison)
Interesting, there are so many interpretations of a concept.
When I read Cindy's reply, I didn't think of "fruits" meaning
"good works". To me, fruits are something naturally produced...
not something you go and do. In that context, fruits might be
things like the kind of "vibes" or "waves" a person sends out,
their energy, and the kind of mental attitude they might have.
Jerri
|
| 401.108 | do we fail in communicating, or are you not ready? | VIDEO::SU | | Sun Oct 01 1989 11:28 | 136 |
|
Dear Terry, Cindy and others who critiscise Sahaja Yoga:
It's Sunday morning and I am reviewing what has been written in these notes in
the last months. Some mixed emotions of sadness and dissapointment come up and
I cannot avoid this reflection:
Since 1970 Shri Mataji travels the world and must have talked to more then a
milljon people, hundreds of thousends have felt it. Of those only a few had the
courage to go on with it and to develop it. Why is it such a difficult matter
to comunicate? Is it fear? May be some are ready, some are not? But all are
seeking !!!!!
Somehow or another you are all disturbed by some aspect of us presenting this
Sahaja yoga to you. Either you feel we are too arrogant in our statements and
your ego reacts a little: "what do these wise guys think they are??"
Else you compare what we are saying to what you already know about yoga,
kundalini, enlightenment, love etc. When what we are saying doesnt't fit in
the concept that is already there(in your brain), also you react : "it is
impossible , can't be that simple, etc. "This is your own conditioning
reacting.
So whatever we try, we seem not being able to get around either your ego or
your conditioning and this makes us really feel helpless. Is it for you all
really impossible to even consider that it could be true what we are saying
about Sahaja Yoga.?
We are talking to you about something that is free, that is within yourself
and that "you" have to find. (or to be shown). Once you found it "you" have to
develop it if you are courageous enough.
What do we find as reactions? You people think we are fools, that we are been
befooled or that we are to unintelligent to understand what seeking is all
about. From the many that are testifying you have seen that we all have been
seeking and trying all kinds of things, just like you. Who of you can say that
he found what he is seeking for? If so, please tell us about it. But all we
hear is concepts and concepts and concepts.
If we claim with such a confidence that we found it, there must be something
isn't it. Why don't you give us a chance? Because it's free? Because it is to
simple for you to believe? May be you feel we are preaching?
Would you rather listen to us if we say: pay us 10.000$ and we tell you
about the great secrets of enlightenment?
-------------------
Now if you haven't switched to another channel, let me give it another shot.
First of all, enlightenment comes in different stages. It has nothing to do
with what you KNOW. One can read books and books and books and may know all
about all the scriptures, IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ENLIGHTENMENT.
Enlightenment is a natural state of being. Once it starts manifesting, it has
to be developed. Eventually it grows and can lead to full enlightenment.
But it has to START. This is the minimuum of minimuum. One has to press the
button. Just as a seed will not sprout as long as one is not putting it in the
earth.
And when this process of human natural evolution starts, the individual that
it happens to IS AWARE OF IT , AND HE KNOWS THAT IT IS HAPPENING TO HIM.
Ego and concepts are still there, but some light is also there.
Before was ONLY ego and concepts.
No Sahaja yogi will ever claim to be a great enlightened soul, but what he can
claim is that it has started within him and that he is aware of that.
But at the same time he is more aware than ever (much more than you even can
imagine) how low he is in this enlightened state. Actually we could talk about
endarkened state, because one realises HOW DARK IT REALLY WAS (and still is)
But this awakened Kundalini, very, very slight but distinguishable, shows him
clearly where his problems are, where he is wrong in ego, in habits and in
conditiongs. And he can correct himself if he wants to. At the same time
however, it brings relativity to the problems in life and everything becomes
easier.
If you are still on line, consider this.
In nature all is working according to some unwritten laws. We know that if we
pollute too much, trees can die.
Same in human beings. There are inner laws, same for all of us. If we pollute
to much our brain, our emotions the system starts to fail. Medicine has
discovered only a few obvious things, but the gross of it is unknown. The
point I'm trying to make is that: When Kundalini is up, YOU FEEL IN YOUR
SYMPATHETIC WHEN YOU ARE CROSSING THESE LAWS, long before the system will fail.
Suppose it is like that, then if you really know what and
where is wrong, then only you can do something about it.
This has to do with the famous cool breeze. (or cool vibrations)
Another way of saying the same thing is the laws in nature define the
universality of GOOD and BAD in an absolute way. (from natures point of view
and not by mental analysis).
Any action (thougt,emotion etc.) in tune with evolution will increase the flow
of this cool breeze. Any action against will be felt as a diminishing or even
loozing the breeze. (this irrelevant of what the person thinks about that
action). You have to try it to believ
Before you react and say that its too simple or arrogant or whatever, please
consider. If there is the slightest chance that there is some truth in what I
say, then you better find out instaed of critisizing.
Now please instead of knocking us down, please ask us about it. How it is
done? What good it does. How does it work in children. What about education?
What about society? Morality? How does it acts in the nature?
How many try to do Sahaja Yoga? Why so many give it up?. What are the problems
one is facing when one CHOOSES TO BE A REALISED SOUL. What motivates us to
keep telling you about it, dispite you ridiculising it?
In a scientific, common sense approach, so many wise things you can ask about
it.
There is no money nor membership. (maybe the most difficult part to believe)
We are ancious to tell anybody who asks all about it. But you do not allow us
to go beyond chapter one. This knowledge is secret, not because it is not
available, but simple because nobody wants to hear about it, everybody seems
to know better. So it remains secret(=know to a few). Sad isn't it?
One last thing, even if you accept to consider what we are saying. Reading or
knowledge doesn't do it. IT HAS TO HAPPEN. The breeze has to flow, then you
know you are on-line with yourself (with nature)
Sahaja Yoga is not a concept, it is an awareness. You feel nature and its laws
(the truth) acting on your nervous system.
If you want to argue it out by putting your actual concepts against awareness,
may be this yoga is not (yet) for you.
Even one cannnot understand or believe that a flower will turn into fruit,
it will happen anyway. Nature does what it has to do. If you are are seeker
and I did not convince you now, one day you will get it anyway.
more sincerely than you can imagine,
johan
|
| 401.110 | the thin end of a big wedge? | GVAADG::DONALDSON | the green frog leaps... | Mon Oct 02 1989 05:35 | 39 |
| Perhaps some of us ought to retract our claws and
cut out the bitchiness? This conference has a high
'coefficient of tolerance', I think we should extend
the same tolerance to fundamentalist Sahaja yogins as
we would to fundamentalist Christans. No? Anyway...
I once read a book called 'The One Quest' by Claudio Naranjo.
Quite good. It tries to discriminate between the various
approaches to 'knowledge of god'/enlightenment. By the
standards of that book Sahaja followers are 'devotional'.
The path they follow *demands* no questioning of The
Mother and Her words. But, this has no bearing on whether
the path leads somewhere or not. Try to separate your
reaction to their devotion from your assessment of their
claims.
As far as the semantic problems with enlightenment, perhaps
we could see the 'cool breeze' experience as the thin end
of a very big wedge. As I read the Sahaja Yoga (SY) replies
they clearly say this state is the start of a process - it's
Mother pointing her children in the right direction.
I have tasted SY and I found my rationalistic mind could
not walk fully the devotional path. From the very beginning
I questioned the cool breeze (are my palms sweaty etc).
But for six months I gave it my best shot. They are very
sincere people and SY seems to be (at the very least)
benign. I would echo some previous replies, try it, it
won't hurt and it just might... (Do you remember Blaise
Pascal's reasoning about God?).
The SY group (when I knew them well) felt that logical
argument was damaging to their relationship to Sri Mataji
and enlightenment. If they still do, then I applaud the
authors in this conference who are replying.
DEJAVU would be less without them.
John D.
|
| 401.111 | to arie | VIDEO::SU | | Mon Oct 02 1989 09:31 | 51 |
| re. .109 ARIE
thanks for this straightforward reply, arie.
"sahaja yoga the only way?"
any path that leads to self-realisation can be a valid path. The point
we are making is "In Sahaja Yoga you get your self-realisation NOW !!!,
and not in the distant future. " In this way it is the only path in
moder times.
"you seem to deny the existence of truth outside the path you are on
now"
truth is everywhere, allways and unchanging. Like when the sun is
shining, the light spreads everywhere, BUT one needs Eyes to see it.
In the same way, truth is everywhere, but truth cannot be percieved
without self-realisation. And for that Kundalini HAS TO BE UP.
As you may know, what we are percieving with the senses is only an
aspect of truth. There is a nice tale of people who saw only part of an
elephant and from that limited view they pictured the whole as
something totally different from the elephant. Same thing. All paths
have something, but the picture of the whole is not correct. Sorry if
this sounds arrogant.
"where to me enlightenment is a state where all barriers are gone."
Try to see our point. Sahaja Yoga can give you self realisation even
with the barriers that exist. After realisation the real nature of the
barriers can be seen and thus it becomes easier to remove them.
If people try to remove the barriers with mental
process it can take many lifetimes, provided that they are on the right
path to begin with. Sahaja Yoga suggest you only take without any
comittment or obligation.
"ego"
Sorry to say, ego even being an illusion, it is a reality if we are
slave of it, and it can ONLY be removed by Kundalini.
Sorry again for our weakness to communicate in words. But we are good
in one thing: giving self-realisation. One day the strenght of your
desire may allow you to jump over our and your "barriers" to see if you
too can get selfrealisation.
johan
|
| 401.112 | What's under the hood of this vehicle? | CIMAMT::TOLAA | | Mon Oct 02 1989 10:55 | 22 |
| John in .110 brought up some good points. The statements that
Sahaja yogis feeling that logical argument is harmful to their relationship
with their teacher and the "fundamentalist" nature of their approach
reminds me of something an Indian meditation teacher named Dr. Rao
(who lives in Chelmsford, Mass) once said.
Some of us were talking to him about different saints he had met and
someone brought up the founder of the Hari Krishna order -- Pradupada (?).
Dr. Rao stated that he had met Pradupada and felt that he was definitely
a realized soul. Some us were surprised, knowing the dogma and
cultural baggage of the Hari Krishna teachings (though the singing
and food are great).
We asked how a realized soul could be so rigid and seemingly narrow-minded.
He replied that without that kind of focused intensity of belief, many
would not have the strength to reach the goal.
Maybe for a fundamentally devotional teaching (though it may have an
esoteric side), the attitude of "this and no other" is as essential as it
is between two lovers.
|
| 401.113 | Get your Realization now... | REGENT::WAGNER | | Mon Oct 02 1989 11:29 | 74 |
| .111 SU (i think)
"It can 'only' be removed by Kundalini."
There you go again implying that S.Y. is the only way.
Kundalini is only a concept and this concept too must eventually be shed
because it is a subtle form of dualism. Something seperate from ourself
exists and must be manipulated for us to reach our goal of "Spiritual
enlightenment." Again, the concept of Kundalini is primarily a yogic concept.
It is not even mentioned in other eastern Philosophies.
"What motivates us to keep telling you about it (Sahaja yoga, EW)?"
Your Ego.
It has been said that a master teaches effortlessly by letting the
lessons unfold before him. When the lessons are over the only thing he
says is "very well done."
"Sahaja yoga is not a concept, it is an awareness. You can feel nature and
it's laws acting on your nervous system."
This is awareness in its most limited sense because it is focused down to
feelings one perceives from the external world. When we are focused down to
one or two "feelings" we are oblivious to the rest of the universe. This is
the process of not seeing the forest for the trees. The objective is to
expand our awareness not narrow it down, to see the entire forest (and every
nuance of a situation) so we can find our way out.
"You get your realization NOW!"
I got my "realization" NOW, also-Not from Sahaja Yoga-but I examined it, stuck
it in my back pocket for later use, forgot about it, sat down and smashed it.
Do I still have it or don't I? Would have it been better to wear it as a
badge on my chest? To show everybody that i have been enlightened?
"Enlightenment" has no intrinsic(sp?) value. In and of itself it is
worthless.
As Cindy said, the proof is in the "fruit" of your actions. Fruit meaning end
result. I know it is difficult to show that you have realization "NOW"
through this media. But the fruits of your action sort of indicate to me that
you are dwelling too much on the "cool Breeze" feelings you get which is a
sort of hedonism. There are at least several masters who proport that through
compassion (openness) a "warmness" overtakes one, but this is more of an
attitude than actual warm fuzzy feelings we all hope to get. And they go on to
say that this (ruthless) compassion is part and parcel to the experience of
insight (realization). Since you place importance on Technique as opposed to
openness, and have made no mention of compassion as it relates to Sahaja Yoga,
It is very difficult not to believe that you are on a very subtle ego trip.
Again, I maintain that one can experience insight (realization) in
direct proportion to one's desire to be completely open. or inversely to ones
fear of being open to any situation. Whether it be through meditation,
yoga, prayer or whatever, one's ability to have "enlightenment" NOW, depends
upon one's ability to use these different paths to become fearlessly open to
anything. That is the intent behind every method; to drop all concepts and
preconcepts (including that of Kundalini) and being totally receptive to the
situation of the moment. It is not to hang onto the path, because to hang on
to a given path is to feed our ego. And we don't wear our paths like a badge
either. WE MUST BECOME THE PATH. Not just have the path become part of us
because that implies duality. If one can drop all preconcepts, concepts
here and now, and act appropriately for the situation, then we will
be "enlightened" NOW.
Even Jesus said " Who callest thou me good? There is none good but one,
That is, God." Mark 10:18
It wasn't in the name of humility or modesty that Jesus said these
words. Jesus understood that the labels of "enlightenment, goodness,
compassion, etc. are not badges to be worn but a process undergone on
the path of becoming open.
Ernie
|
| 401.114 | | CSC32::MORGAN | Cybernetic Society Arrives Today! | Mon Oct 02 1989 12:46 | 6 |
| Reply to .113, Wagner,
...and I have come to associate Duality with Duelity. When good/bad or
realized/unrealized forces come into conflict there is Duelity.
What every happened to maya?? B^)
|
| 401.115 | Probably a failure in communication. | CGVAX2::PAINTER | One small step... | Mon Oct 02 1989 12:53 | 46 |
|
RE.108 (SU)
I am not criticizing SY. If it works for you, and if it works for
others, then great.
My own awareness of my connection of the divine came from a different
source, and that happened 2.5 years ago. It is no more or less valid
than yours. It was then that I became aware of the concept of
spiritual growth.
There are many 'gifts' written about in Christianity, and one of those
is the 'gift of tongues'. Many people at 'revival' meetings who have
'received the Spirit' are all of a sudden speaking in tongues (a
language that they believe connects them with the divine.) I suspect
(but do not draw a hard and fast conclusion) that this 'gift' which
seemingly comes from within is yet another variation of the 'cool
breeze' you feel. Granted, Christians do not talk about kundalini, and
probably SJ'ers don't talk about Christ, the Holy Spirit and God the
Father, however it is one observation of a parallel that I cannot help
but see.
As for your comment about my possibly being 'not ready', well, there is
a whole conference full of well-meaning Christians over on IOSG:: who
also tell me that I'm 'not ready' for what they are talking about...(;^)
...so if by your definition I appear to be 'not ready' for what you have
to say (or the Mother of SJ), well, OK, that's fine. My sister recently
'converted' to Jehovah Witness and went through her spiel because this
was precisely what made her aware of her connection with the divine.
Your relationship with the divine is something I cannot measure by my own
experiences because of the fact that we are each walking our own paths.
Given my observations that all paths with Love do eventually lead to
the same place anyway, there is really no sense in debating it or
trying to pull each other off our respective paths thinking that my way
is a shorter one than yours. You've done your job in presenting yet
another alternative for people who are as yet not aware of their
connection to the divine. Hopefully you will put some lost souls who
are searching, in touch with that which will help them to realize their
own connection to the divine. If you do, then great.
Just waving at you from my own path.......
In Peace,
Cindy
|
| 401.116 | smile...we're halfway home! | BLKWDO::KELLOGG | East Coast Beaches | Mon Oct 02 1989 13:05 | 6 |
| great reply Cindy!!!!!
can you guys get your ego's outta the way and let us (set user/nowrite)
readers get past chapter 1 ?
and we thank you for your support......
|
| 401.117 | Maya became too real. | REGENT::WAGNER | | Mon Oct 02 1989 13:25 | 26 |
|
.114 (Morgan)
I agree with the intent of your last statement but can there be
conflict with realization?
"realized/unrealized forces come into conflict there is duelity."
My definition of "Realized" is one who has insight into the entirety
of all situations. A realized person has insight into the entire
situation and would see the actions required to circumvent any
conflict. I can see unrealized/unrealized as having conflict, but
perhaps I am nitpicking. (;'>
"what ever happened to maya??"
It became too real, too solid and passed as a temporary fad. (:'{}
It seems that the self will go so far as to agree that everything
is illusion but the self. Any concept or idea that impinges on
the realness of the self, is done away with by the ego. To even
begin to think that even the self is illusion, seems nonsensical
if not down right "self destructive."
Ernie
|
| 401.118 | Convincing is for egos | BOOKIE::ENGLAND | I'm a part of It's a part of me | Mon Oct 02 1989 15:54 | 55 |
| Re: .108 (Johan)
I mean this with respect and love...
I think the problem may be that you are approaching this as if no one in
this notesfile already knows awareness and truth -- and that you may know
more than the rest of us. You may know more about Sahaja Yoga...of which
we might be willing to learn, if you didn't make it sound like we can't
know anything without it (because maybe you feel like *you* didn't know
anything without it.)
You may not be getting the responses you hope for if you are not accepting
of the truth and awareness that already exists in others.
>Either you feel we are too arrogant in our statements and your ego reacts
No, it is the projection of limitations on others -- simply because you
might not be aware of how else it could be.
>No Sahaja yogi will ever claim to be a great enlightened soul, but what he can
>claim is that it has started within him and that he is aware of that.
I have shared my own experiences about this with you -- but I'm not sure
it mattered to you. Could it be that you're more interested in your
"position" of being the one to tell people about these things, than in
seeing them realize it or in discovering and delighting that they already
have?
>But at the same time he is more aware than ever (much more than you even can
>imagine)
I find it somewhat insulting that you assume how much *I* can imagine. I do
not think it is truthful, the way you put a blanket of limitations over
everyone else, ignoring the truth and light in them because they do not act
in the exact ways that you are familiar with.
Perhaps you are very excited and happy about the realizations you have had,
and perhaps hearing that some other people have realized truth and awareness
in other ways from themselves, is a bit threatening because you then judge
that your own realizations are invalidated. But they're not.
>In a scientific, common sense approach, so many wise things you can ask about
>it.
Why should I explore truth with someone if they haven't even seemed to
realize the truth about me?
>more sincerely than you can imagine,
Johan, I can imagine a great deal. I suggest that you are projecting your
own limitations on what you think other's are capable of. As long as you
do that, you may offend people who you would otherwise want to share
discussions with.
Jerri
|
| 401.119 | | CSC32::MORGAN | Cybernetic Society Arrives Today! | Mon Oct 02 1989 16:05 | 13 |
| Re: <<< Note 401.117 by REGENT::WAGNER >>>
> "realized/unrealized forces come into conflict there is duelity."
> My definition of "Realized" is one who has insight into the entirety of
> all situations. A realized person has insight into the entire situation
> and would see the actions required to circumvent any conflict. I can
> see unrealized/unrealized as having conflict, but perhaps I am
> nitpicking. (;'>
Picking nits is fun! B^) Ok define "all" and "insight". You see where
the short-sightedness of "realiztion" occurs?
|
| 401.120 | wanne be friends | VIDEO::SU | | Mon Oct 02 1989 21:23 | 45 |
| re: .115 cindy
"SJ'ers don't talk about Christ, the Holy Spirit and God the Father"
So far we may not have, but let me summarize what Shri Mataji says
about that:
Kundalini IS the Holy Spirit within man. Holy Spirit (God the Mother) is
the power of the Spirit (Atman) residing in the heart and which is the
reflection of God the Father within man.
Christ said that we have to be born of the Spirit. The awakening of
Kundalini is that moment of being born from the Spirit or real baptism.
Spirit from Spirare (wind or whirling or blowing)
Bible: when the 12 were together and the Holy Spirit descended "there
was like a wind although doors and windows were closed" (cool breeze)
Christ: " I will send you the Holy Ghost and he will tell you all
things".
Shri Mataji spoke in now more than 2000 lectures on many subjects.
Christ, Krishna, Mohammed, Moses, Socrates, Guru Nanak and so many
others. She has announced AIDS before it was known, She announced all
the details of a new disease that will also be incurable and spread all
over the world. If you are interested in her statements, just name the
subject and we will try to summarize Shri Matajis commentaries.
re .118 Jerri
thanks
re. all of you who feel insulted.
I read my .108 again and agree there was a little too much steam blowing
off. Wanne be friends, not ennemies. After all we are in the same
seeking boat. But please let us try to keep this note on subjects and their
relation to Sahaja Yoga.
Most of the existing spiritual teachings and experiences one can have, have
been adressed and evaluated by Shri Mataji. Some of them are coming from
Subconscious or Supra-conscious areas of awareness. In that case they are
not less real, but may carry some dangers for the one practicing it.
Johan
|
| 401.121 | Response | CGVAX2::PAINTER | One small step... | Tue Oct 03 1989 11:55 | 20 |
| Re.120 (SU)
>Kundalini is the Holy Spirit within (wo)man.
Yes - precisely. This is why Christianity is also a valid path as
well, as are many paths. Only the language and the path is different.
You felt it as a cool breeze. The Apostles had flames on their heads
when they received the Spirit (from my very early remembrances of what
was taught to me in Sunday School well over 20 years ago). Who knows -
I might have had a cool breeze on my head when it happened to me a few
years ago, but I didn't bother to check. (;^)
Even Christ said about miracles - "These things and greater ye shall
do." The power comes from within, and we all have it. We only need
to realize it. For you, your catalyst was the Mother. For me it was
a close friend. For Joseph Campbell, it was primarily books.
In Peace and mutual understanding,
Cindy
|
| 401.122 | cool breeze not a one time experience- it grows | VIDEO::SU | | Wed Oct 04 1989 08:41 | 9 |
| re.121 cindy
maybe you are overlooking one detail, that is that the cool breeze has
to be there(on the head and in the hands) all the time wherever one is.
It is not a one time experience.
It is there when you work, when you speak, when you sleep. It only
disapperears when the subject steps off the path.
regards, johan
|
| 401.123 | | CSC32::MORGAN | Cybernetic Society Arrives Today! | Wed Oct 04 1989 10:26 | 18 |
| Reply to .122, Johan,
Sure it's there all the time. Everyone once in a while I acheive it
through breath control and relaxation.
To me it's not only a cool breeze, it's also a clearing of stuff out of
the mind. It's a nice sensation but nothing permenant. It could be
permenant but why should anyone lived a life that is similar to those
that are druged?
For me real work can happen in a psycho-environment but putting food on
the table requires a different sort of mind.
I can guarentee you one thing, in a little while, perhaps a few years
your interest will wane. Then it's time to move on to a newer
"realization."
It's a never ending, open ended process.
|
| 401.124 | "With a little help" | PACKER::HANDY | | Wed Oct 04 1989 12:11 | 12 |
| re:morgan
To you it is nothing permanent,the drugged feeling you mention
is caused by catches or alot of garbage in your chakras.This is not my
opinion,Ive experienced it myself,only someone helped me clear away
the negativity and the feeling dropped off.Kundalini awareness is a
very Dynamic state.It can allow you to do everything you do to your
very highest potential.Can put more food on the table than you could
eat.So to me it is better to maintain connection with my spirit
allways,then i can determine the truth.
|
| 401.125 | | CSC32::MORGAN | Cybernetic Society Arrives Today! | Wed Oct 04 1989 12:24 | 3 |
| Reply to .124, Handy,
Ok, then what if the "connection with spirit" is an illusion?
|
| 401.126 | "The Truth Just Is" | PACKER::HANDY | | Wed Oct 04 1989 13:34 | 27 |
|
re:Cindy
Are you talking about the illusion of seeing mirages or strange
lights when you close your eyes?? Or perhaps its the illusion of
getting your hand burned when it is put into the fire.This is of what i
speak.The feeling of cool breezes is on my hand! Same as heat from
fire.
There was a strong word which i used in my last reply,that is
garbage. Really none of us has this.bad choice of words.These things
are problems that we carry around with us,or just negative vibrations
from our past.Alsoeveryday stress that the sympathetic nervous system
developes in reaction to these situations.
I have some material from the" Journal of International Medical
Sciences Academy" on a report from Dept. of Physiology,Sucheta
Kripalani Hospital, New Delhi.
Titled Some Effects of Sahaja Yoga and its Role in the Prevention of
Stess Disorders.
I dont believe that something which is illusion could have such
an effect on peoples para-sympathetic nervous systems.As recorded by
scientists and doctors,using Machines and modern blood analysis.
Let me know if you are interested,or anyone else on this conference.
|
| 401.127 | | CSC32::MORGAN | Cybernetic Society Arrives Today! | Wed Oct 04 1989 14:20 | 41 |
| RE: <<< Note 401.126 by PACKER::HANDY >>>
> re:Cindy
I think I asked about the illusion question. So I'll go from there.
> Are you talking about the illusion of seeing mirages or strange lights
> when you close your eyes?? Or perhaps its the illusion of getting your
> hand burned when it is put into the fire.This is of what i speak.The
> feeling of cool breezes is on my hand! Same as heat from fire.
There are different levels of illusion here. The first is the
neurological illusion that creates both the stange lights with eyes
closed and the illusion that a particular path is suited for most, if
not all, people. These are simple neurological illusions which seem to
be real but aren't consensual realities. They are perceived, ie.
presumed realities which maynot be shared by all in a consensual
setting.
> I have some material from the" Journal of International Medical
> Sciences Academy" on a report from Dept. of Physiology,Sucheta
> Kripalani Hospital, New Delhi. Titled Some Effects of Sahaja Yoga and
> its Role in the Prevention of Stess Disorders. I dont believe that
> something which is illusion could have such an effect on peoples
> para-sympathetic nervous systems.
Sure. Some forms of discipline helps many people. That can't be argued
against. And I don't thnk anyone really wants to agrue with that
conclusion. (Except me on days I wanna' ask lotsa' pressing questions.
B^) And I'm sure SY helps many people live fuller, better lives. But
SY, like others, is a neurological program. it can be changed and/or
superceeded.
The prevention of stress is acheived by relaxing. It matters not one
bit which neurological program teaches it as long as the individual can
use the teaching.
Enjoy!
|
| 401.128 | will come back later | VIDEO::SU | | Thu Oct 05 1989 06:33 | 8 |
| re. harry
let's take it easy harry.
seems no on ethere really interested for more about this.
Lets get off the lines for a while. will call you tonight.
johan
|
| 401.129 | don't go away... | HYDRA::LARU | goin' to graceland | Thu Oct 05 1989 10:19 | 18 |
| Johan & Hank...
I request that you contine to enter here whatever information you
have and choose to share... there are many here who are interested
but do not speak up. I suspect that, as always, *some* hackles here
have been raised because of communication style, *some* because
cherished belief systems have been threatened, and for who-knows-what
other reasons.
I do not think you should let yourselves be shouted down.
BTW, there have been many western studies that have shown
correlations between various meditative techniques and
enhanced health.
/bruce
|
| 401.130 | Where men of all races have come together | VNABRW::EICHERT | Helmut Eichert, Vienna | Thu Oct 05 1989 11:07 | 70 |
|
ON THE SHORES OF BHARAT
On the shores of Bharat [India]
Where men of all races have come together,
Awake, O my mind!
Standing here with outstretched arms,
I send my salutations to the God of Humanity,
And in solemn chant sing His praises.
At whose call no one knows,
Came floating streams of men
And merged into the sea of Bharat.
The Aryan, the Non-Aryan, the Dravidian,
The Huns, the Pathans and the Moghuls -
They all have merged here into one body.
Today the West has opened its doors,
And from thence come gifts.
Giving and taking,
All will be welcome on the shores of Bharat,
Where men of all races have come together.
In mad exultation, singing songs of victory,
Have they come, crossing deserts and mountains;
They all dwell within me
And in my blood echo their varied melodies.
O Terrible One!
Let the heavens resound with Your music;
Even those, whom in disdain we kept apart,
Will gather around thee, O Bharat,
Where men of all races have come together.
Here one day in the hearts of men
The message of the One resounded.
In the fire of "Tapasya" all differences were forgotten,
And the many forged into One.
Round that fire of sacrifice
We all have to meet with bowed heads
And unite,
On the shores of Bharat
Where men of all races have come together.
In that fire,
The blood-shot flame of suffering is aglow.
On mind, bear this suffering
And hear the call of the One.
Conquer all shame, all fear,
And let vanish all humiliations.
What great life will emerge
At the end of the days of suffering.
The night ends,
The great Mother is awake
On the shores of Bharat
Where men of all races have come together.
Come, O Aryan and Non-Aryan,
Hindu and Muslim,
Come, O English and you Christian,
Come, O Brahmin,
Purify your mind and clasp the hand of all;
Come, O downtrodden,
And let vanish all burdens of your humiliation.
Tarry not but come you all
To anoint the Mother
On the shores of Bharat
Where men of all races have come together.
Rabindranath Tagore, from "Gitanjali"
|
| 401.131 | Are they not the seas of God? - Whitman | CGVAX2::PAINTER | One small step... | Thu Oct 05 1989 12:41 | 7 |
| Re.130 (Eichert)
>Where men of all races have come together
And women too.
Cindy
|
| 401.132 | Come and purify your subtle system within you. | VIDEO::SU | | Thu Oct 05 1989 13:05 | 7 |
| Of course he is talking about the gathering of Sahaja yogis and yoginis
in the shore line of Ganapatipuri in Maharasthra every year!
Tagore talked about "men" as well as "women".
"O Terrible One", "the fire", "the great Mother" are all the same one
as the Water Carrier (the age of Aquaius), the Kundalini or the Holy
Spirit.
|
| 401.133 | please stay, johan | IJSAPL::ELSENAAR | Fractal of the universe | Thu Oct 05 1989 18:56 | 21 |
| RE .128 (johan)
> Lets get off the lines for a while. will call you tonight.
johan,
I would like to join bruce and ask you to stay "on-line". As you (and I) have
read, DEJAVU is the notesfile where paths like the Sahaja Yoga are discussed,
and where all kinds of disagreements are fought out. errrr discussed :-)
I think we have, by stressing too much the differences in opinion, not done
right to your attitude towards Sahaja Yoga. While there also are a lot of
commonalities.
By entering my first reply in this topic, I most certainly have added to some
feelings of hostility. And that's not the right "spirit of DEJAVU". :-) So I've
deleted that one.
We still may disagree, but let's at least keep disagreeing in harmony ;-)
Arie
|
| 401.134 | A Puja talk to share with the seekers of the Truth | VIDEO::SU | | Fri Oct 06 1989 18:32 | 140 |
|
re .129 .133 Bruce, Arie and others that may be there sharing same opinion
Self realisation is a natural and spontaneous evolution process. It takes its
own course, related to the desire (free will) of the individual. But it has to
be started first. We like to tell you about some other things yogi do.
Maybe instead of hearing the yogis opinions, its a better idea to let the words
of Shri Mataji speak.
Shri Mataji gives basically two types of speeches. There are the public
programs where anybody can be present, where she speaks to seekers about the
basics of self-realisation and after which she gives the experience of
Kundalini awakening to all present. For that she has to open in a minimum way
all the chakras of all present.
The other type of sessions are what is called "puja". These sessions
concentrate on one particular chakra and all its qualities. In puja Shri
Mataji tries to open that particular chakra in a deeper way, by absorbing
whatever impurities are there and then filling the chakra with cool
vibrations. Again, the Mother does it for all present at the same time.
Because of this deeper level, puja is only attended by Sahaja yogis who are
able to keep their chakras open by their own effort.
Puja is celebrated on particular auspicious days, where time, position of
planets, place etc. are very important. There are usually about 16 pujas every
year, spread over the year, place and time and type of chakra treated, always
determined by Shri Mataji. The Yogis try to prepare for this event as to be
able to absorb as much as possible of the particular vibrations that Shri
Mataji generates at that event.
Again here it is not to be taken for granted. Whatever one gets in Puja it is
up to the yogi's desire if he (she) can maintain the level of awareness that
he may temporary reach during the puja-meditation.
It is typical that before every puja, Shri Mataji speaks to the yogis. Of
course, these talks are all recorded and available to anyone. It is our
experience that listening to the tape afterwards generates the same effect as
being physically present at that time, but in a much reduced intensity.
We like to share a Puja talk of February 29, 1984, where the attention was on
the Heart Chakra. Because of the length, we will "broadcast" it in episodes.
-------------
Maha Shivatri Puja, 29th February 1984 at Pandharpur, Neera River, India.
Address by Mataji Nirmala Devi
In these modern times a place which is supposed to be a holy place becomes a
most unholy place. It's such a topsy turvey condition these days, and when we
are trying to establish something very fundamental that's like a little
seedling, that has to come out of the stones, you see it has to fight lots of
things so we have to keep our brains intact and be sensible about everything
and try to see what we can achieve through our patience and understanding.
It's very important.
I think that today is a very great day for all of us because this place is the
place of Virata - of Shri Vittala. It is the place where Shri Vittala
appeared to a devoted son and when he asked Him that: "You'd better stand on a
brick", He stood there, and they say that He stood there waiting. Some people
say that the statue that we see came out of the Mother Earth on this stand and
that's what Punda carried saying: "These are the ones who came to see me and
my parents. I was busy with them. So they are standing on the same brick
which I threw".
Now the whole story has to be taken in a very sensible way with common sense in
it. That God Himself is capable of all kinds of miracles. We who are created
by God are doing some things which look miraculous, say if you take about 100
year old situation of this world. We can say that today we are seeing many
things which could be miraculous. 100 years back no one could have thought
that we could have all these elements down here in such far fetched places.
But, all these miracles come from the Power of God. So, we are the creator of
that wee bit - very wee bit of that miracle. So, all the miracles of God
cannot be explained and should not be explained. They are beyond our minds ad
to make people feel the presence of God. God can do anything.
He can move into all the three dimensions and also in the fourth dimension and
can do whatever He feels like. That's what you have seen now in your every
day to day life - how many miracles take place - to all of you. And you can't
understand how it works out even, it works out things that are not living and
people are quite amazed at how these things happen.
So we have to believe now, after seeing all this ourselves, that He is God.
And He can do anything that He feels like, and we are nothing - we are
nothing. There should be no rationality about it, of understanding God's
miracles. How can it be? How could it be? You can't explain it. Only when
you achieve that state of mind where you believe through your experiences that
God is all powerful. It's very difficult, this concept. It's very difficult
because we are limited people. We have limited powers. We cannot understand
how God could be all powerful because we haven't got the capacity. So this
God who is our Creator, Who is our Preserver, the One Who desired that we
should exist, Who is our Existence itself, is an all powerful God.
All-powerful. He can do whatever He likes with you, He can create another
world. He can destroy this world. It's only if He has to desire.
My idea of coming to Pandharpur for Shiva Puja was this: That Shiva represents
the Spirit. And the Spirit is residing in all of you in your hearts. The
seat of SadaShiva is on top of your head, but is reflected in your heart.
Now, your brain is the Vittala. So, to bring Spirit to your brain means
enlightenment of your brain. "Enlightenment of your brain" means the limited
capacity of your brain has to become unlimited in its capacity, to realize God
- I will not use the word "understand" but to realize God. How powerful He is.
How miraculous He is. How great He is. Another is that the brain of man can
create - of course, out of the dead, but when the Spirit comes into the brain,
then you create living things - living work of Kundalini. Even the dead
start behaving like the living, because you touch the Spirit in the dead. Like
the nucleus inside every atom or molecule has the spirit of that molecule. And
if you become your Spirit, we can say the "brain"of a molecule and an atom is
like the nucleus body of the nucleus, but the one that controls the nucleus is
the Spirit, that resides within the nucleus. So now you have got the
attention of the body - the whole body of the atom, then the nucleus, and
inside the nucleus is the Spirit. In the same way, we have this body, the
attention of the body and then we have the nucleus that is the brain and the
Spirit is in the heart. So, the brain is controlled through the Spirit. How?
That around the heart there are seven auras, which can be multiplied into any
number - seven raised to power 16 hundred - which are the ones which watch the
seven chakras - raised to power 16 hundred - 16 thousand.
Now this Spirit is watching through this aura - watching, I am again saying,
watching through this aura. This aura is watching the behavior of your seven
centers in your brain. Is also watching all the nerves that are working in
the brain, "watching" again. But when you bring the Spirit into your brain
then you go two steps ahead because when your Kundalini rises She touches your
SadaShiva and SadaShiva informs the Spirit. Informs in the sense it reflects
in the Spirit. So that's the first state where the watching auras start
communication to your different chakras in the brain and integrating it. But
when you bring your Spirit to your brain - this is the second state -then you
really become self-realised in the full way, in the full way. Because then
your Self that is the Spirit becomes your brain.
(to be continue?)
--------------
I hope you enjoyed it, and to be continued if you are interested.
regards, johan
|
| 401.135 | Observation | CGVAX2::PAINTER | One small step... | Fri Oct 06 1989 19:52 | 22 |
| Re.134 (SU)
johan,
Please continue.
There is only one statement which I take issue with, and perhaps it is
a communication gap again, however it is the statement which says that
'we are nothing'.
I believe we are everything. Every person, each and every one of us,
is known to God, and loved by God. And we all matter to God a great
deal. This is the message which the holy ones (Jesus, Mohammed, etc.)
have continued to bring to us over the centuries, in fact this is
precisely *why* the holy ones keep coming to us - to remind us of this.
It is said quite succinctly in the book of John in the Bible that
"God is Love".
Perhaps you mean to say that we, as separated from God, have no power
unto ourselves, as opposed to "we are nothing"?
Cindy
|
| 401.136 | nothing = everything | DNEAST::CHRISTENSENL | Keeper of the Myth | Sat Oct 07 1989 14:15 | 10 |
|
How about: who we are is no-thing. Being is. Being is unsubject
to the physical laws of the Universe. We are not these bodies,
yet in practice, the fulfillment of our Beingness chooses a body
and a life time to suit its own purposes.
etcetera, etcetera, etcetera
l
|
| 401.137 | | NOPROB::JOLLIMORE | | Mon Oct 09 1989 09:10 | 5 |
| .134 johan
Please continue.
Jay
|
| 401.138 | Part II of Maha Shivatri Puja Talk by Mother Nirmala | VIDEO::SU | | Mon Oct 09 1989 12:24 | 126 |
| ... (continue from .134)
This action is very dynamic. It opens, then, the fifth dimension in the human
being. First when you become realized, collectively, you cross the fourth
dimension but when your Spirit comes into your brain then you become the fifth
dimension - means you become the Doer.
Our brain, now , for example, says "all right - lift this thing up", so you
touch it with your hand, you lift it up. You are the doer. But when the brain
becomes the Spirit the Spirit is the doer. And when Spirit is the doer then
you become a complete Shiva: self-realised. In that state if you get angry
you are not attached. You are not an attached person to anything whatsoever.
If you posses anything you are not attached. You cannot attach because Spirit
is detachment - complete detachment. You don't bother about any attachments
whatsoever. Even for a second you are not attached. Now I would say to
understand the detachment of Spirit we should study ourselves very well,
clearly: "How are we attached?" We are attached firstly by our brain. Mostly
by our brain. Because all our conditionings are in our brain and all of our
ego is also in our brain. So, emotional attachments are through our our brain
and all our egoistical attachments also are through our brain. That's why it
is said that after realisation one must try to practice the Shiva Tattwa
(principle) by practicing detachment.
Now, how do you practice this detachment? Because we get attached to something
- of course, through our brain but through our attention. So, we try to do
what we call "Chitta Nirod" - it is to control your attention. Where is it
going? In the practice of Sahaja Yoga, if you have to rise higher, you have
to prove your own instrument and not the instrument of others. This is one
thing one should know for definite. Now, you just watch your attention.
Where is it going? Watch yourself. As soon as you starting watching yourself,
your attention, you become identified with your Spirit. Because if you have
to watch your attention you will have to be your Spirit. Otherwise, how will
you watch it? So now see where is your attention going? First, the attachment
is, in all gross ways, to your body. So we see Shiva doesn't know attachment
to His body. He sleeps anywhere. He goes to the cemeteries and sleeps there.
Because, not attached, he can never be caught up by any bhoots or anything.
Nothing of the kind. He is detached. The detachment is to be watched and
seen through your own attachments.
Now because you are realized souls, not yet the Spirit, it has not yet come
into your brain, of course, but still you are realized souls.
So what you can do is at least to watch your attention. You can do that. You
can watch your attention, very clearly. By seeing where your attention is
going. And then, controlling your attention also you can do. Very simply. To
control your attention you have just to remove your attention from this to
that. Try to change your priorities. All this has to be done now. After
realisation a complete detachment. So the body demands comfort. Try to make
body uncomfortable a little bit. Try. What you think to be comfortable, try
to make it a little uncomfortable. That's why people went to the Himalayas.
You see coming to this place itself has got a lot of problems. So going to
the Himalayas - you can imagine so after realisation they used to take body to
Himalayas. "Alright, go through all this. Let's see how you act." So what
you call a penance side starts now. In a way, it's a penance which you can do
very easily because now you are realized souls - with enjoyment. A little try
to make this body - For Shiva, it doesn't matter whether He's in a cemetery or
His own Kailaisa, or anywhere. Where is your attention. You see that your
human attention is hopelessly bad. Very entangled nonsense it is. "We did
this because of this" - is an explanation; or others have to give an
explanation. No explanation is needed - to be given or to be accepted. Or to
be asked for. No explanation. To exist without explanation is the best way.
In a simple Hindi language, "Je se raku je se hiro." - whichever way you keep
me I'll remain in that state, and I'll enjoy. Further in this poem Kabir
says: "If you make me go on an elephant (the royal conveyance) I'll go. If
you want me to walk, I'll walk." "Je se raku je se hiro." So no reaction on
that one, no reaction, no explanation, no reaction.
Now, second is about food. That's the first seeking human beings had as
animals. No attention on food. Whether you have salt or not, whether you
have this or that. No attention on food. Actually, you should not remember
what you ate this morning. But we think as to what we are going to eat
tomorrow. We consume food not for running this body but for a sort of more
satisfaction of tongue pleasures. Once you start understanding that
pleasure is a sign of gross attention, any kind of pleasure is a very gross
sensation. Very gross it is. But, when I say no pleasure it doesn't mean
that you should become serious people and people of sort of as if somebody is
dead in your family. But you should be like Shiva, so detached.
He came on a bull (which was running very fast) to get married. Sitting on a
bull with His two feet like this, you see. And the bull is running fast and
He is holding the bull, the feel like this. And He's coming for His wedding.
And with Him are coming people with one eye, without noses, all kinds of funny
people coming with Him. And His wife feeling quite embarrassed at the
nonsensical things people are talking about Shiva. He's not bothered what His
reputation would be. But that doesn't mean that you become the hippies. You
see the problem is that once you start thinking like that you become hippies.
Many people believe that if you try to behave like Shiva you become Shiva.
Many believe that way that if you take "ganga" you become Shiva because Shiva
used to take "ganga", because He was consuming all that to finish it off from
this world. So, if it's ganga what does it matter - give Him everything.
He'll never get drunk. No question. He's consuming all that. Or they think,
if they live like Shiva - the way He was detached about things, He was least
bothered about His appearance. What appearance Shiva needs? It is that
whatever He appears as is beauty. He doesn't need anything to be that . So
attachment to anything is ugliness. It is ugliness. It is nonsense. But you
can dress up whatever way you like. Or, even if you are in the most ordinary
dress you look the most magnificent person/ But it's not that if you say that
- alright, in these circumstances, let us go about with one sheet wrapped
around. The beauty that has evolved within you through Spirit gives you that
power that you can wear whatever you feel like. Makes no difference to your
beauty. The beauty is there all the time.
But have you achieved that state? And that state only you achieve when your
Spirit enters into your brain. With ego oriented people it is more difficult.
And that is why they cannot enjoy things. At the slightest pretest they topple
down. And Spirit, which is the source of joy, just doesn't come, doesn't
show. The joy is beauty. The joy itself is beauty. But that is a state one
has to achieve. The Joy itself is beauty. But that is a state one has to
achieve. Attachments come by various methods. You go a little ahead with it
then you have attachments of your family. What will happen to my child? What
will happen to my husband? What will happen to my mother? What will happen to
my wife; this, that... Nonsense. Who is your father and who is your mother?
Who is your husband and who is your wife? For Shiva, He doesn't know all these
things. To Him, He and His power are inseparable things. So He stands as a
singular personality. There is no duality. When there is duality then you
can say "my wife". You don't say "my nose, my ears, my hands, my, my, my, my,
my..." Go deep down. Till you say my, there is some duality. Then I say "I
the nose" -there is no duality. Shiva the Shakti; Shakti the Shiva. There is
no duality. But we live throughout on duality. And because of that there is
an attachment. If there is no duality what is the attachment? If you are the
light and you are the lamp, then where is the duality? If you are the moon and
you are the moonlight, then where is the duality? If you are the sun and you
are the sunlight, you are the word and you are the meaning, then where is the
duality?
( To Be Continue )
|
| 401.139 | The conclusion of Maha Shivatri Puja Talk | ROYALT::SU | | Wed Nov 15 1989 14:58 | 84 |
| (continue from .138)
But when there is this separation there is duality. And because of this
separation you feel attached, because if you are that how will you be
attached? Do you see that point? Because there is a difference and a distance
between you and yours, that's why you get attached to it. That's me; who is
the other? This whole universe is me; who is the other? Everything is me; who
is the other?
It's not that it's a brain wave or an ego brain wave. So who is the other?
Nobody. That's only possible when your Spirit comes into your brain and you
become part and parcel of the Virata itself. Without it is the brain, as I
told you, then everything you do - when you show your temper, when you show
your affection, when you show your compassion, anything, it is the Spirit that
is expressing because the brain has lost its identity. The so called
"limited" brain, it has become the unlimited Spirit.
If a color is dropped in an ocean, the ocean becomes colorful - is not
possible. But, try to understand - if a little color, limited color,
is dropped into the ocean, the color loses its identity completely.
Think of the other way around. If the ocean is colored and is poured into
atmosphere, or onto any part, a little, wee bit, or onto any spot, onto any
atom or anything: it all becomes colorful. So the Spirit is like the ocean
which has the light in it. And when this ocean pours into the little cup
of your brain, the cup loses its identity and everything becomes spiritual.
Everything! You can make everything spiritual. You touch anything - it is
spiritual. This sand becomes spiritual. The land becomes spiritual. The
Atmosphere becomes spiritual. Everything becomes spiritual. So it is the
ocean that is the Spirit while your brain is limited. So the detachment
from your limited brain has to be brought in. All limitations of brain
should be broken so that when this ocean fills that brain it should break
that little cup and every bit of that cup should become colorful. The whole
atmosphere, everything, whatever you look at should be colorful. The color
of the Spirit is the light of the Spirit and this light of the Spirit acts,
works, thinks, coordinates, does everything.
The first procedure is to take your brain towards Spirit principle by telling
it: "See - where are you going Mr. Brain? You are putting attention to this.
You are putting attention to that. Getting involved. Now detach! Become the
brain yourself. Only the brain. Detach. Detach."
And then, take this detached brain, completely filled with the color of the
Spirit. It will automatically happen. As long as you have these limitations
to your attention it will not happen. So one has to really deliberately do
this Tapasya. Every individual. I hope so many of you will become the
Spirit Principle in my lifetime. But don't think I'm asking you to suffer.
There is no suffering in this kind of an ascent. If you understand that this
is the complete joy state. That is the time when you become "nirananda".
I hope that whatever we do in an outward way, in a gross way, happens also
in a subtler way. But I find it rather, sometimes, difficult because your
attention is still involved in temper, lust, greed, everything. Try to
detach yourself. Try to redeem it. Try to control your speech. Whether you
express temper in your speech or you express your compassion, or you are
artificially compassionate, try to control. Detachment must start expressing
itself in your realisation - detachment!
What is surrendering? It is nothing because when you are detached you are
surrendered, automatically. When you are holding on to other things you
are not surrendered, that's all. What is there to surrender?
Today I hope we all pray that: "Oh Lord, give us strength and that source of
attraction by which we give up all other attractions, of all the pleasures,
of joy, of ego, of everything that we think of." But that we should fall
into the pure joy form of the Spirit Principle absolutely.
I hope I've been able to explain to you why I am here today and why today is a
very big day. You all who are here are especially very lucky people. Once
you get detached you'll start feeling responsible. Responsibility not giving
ego, but responsibility which is executing by itself, which is expressing by
itself, manifesting by itself.
May God Bless you.
(This entire speech has been extracted and shorten for Dejavu notesfile.)
|
| 401.140 | Sahaja Yoga and politics science | ROYALT::SU | | Mon Nov 20 1989 13:50 | 188 |
| The following speech explain the political movement of today's world.
The openning of East Berlin Wall opens the flood gate of right movement,
a sign of failure of extreme human selfish power (another form
of Nazi power). Our question is when we reach a point in the self-
destructive left movement of self-indulgence democracy, do we have
a gate, a chance like Communist world to open? The left movement is
manifest lethargic into every corner of the modern society.
American must come out of this hiding shell to greet the people of East
Communist bloc's movement and solve and reform this problem all together
and be a world leader again instead of being label as "decaying American
democracy".
The award-winning documentaries about American government and politics
producer Sherry Jones eye-witness the two influential deputies of the
Supreme Soviet debated the wording of free press legislation commented that
it was like watching a latter-day Jefferson and Madison at work.
Shri Mataji said you can only go to the center through right side. Which
also means only through collective-desire you can make human salvation
happen.
Sahaja Yoga - the solution to all problems
by Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi
All political, economic, social and religious problems can be
solved through Sahaja Yoga. Sahaja means 'born with' you and
Yoga means the union with Divine. Firstly, one should keep an
open mind like a scientist to see whether whatever hypothesis
is put forward can be proved or not. Then, if it is proved, one
should be honest enough to accept it as law, I mean the law of
the Divine. Before we start proving it let us witness the basic
defects in our understanding of the problem.
We forget that we have made all ideologies. All isms like democ-
racy or communism are man-made. These isms can not rule us but
we have to govern them for our benevolence. The way people get
identified with them they lose complete sight of the vision for
which they were created. Now it is the time to look back and to
look forward.
After seeing the failure of our political ideologies, logically
one can see clearly that both these isms have reached their
extreme ends. It is very evident that both of them are suffering
the pangs of blindfolded movement towards the left or right
side. The root cause of their sickness is that they are made
in the light of human awareness which can only move in a linear
direction till it recoils upon itself.
Democracy is the movement towards the left. It is accepted that
individual freedom is his birthright. No one wants to know that
human beings are imperfect and that they may not use their so
called birthright for the collective benevolence. Thus democracy
means the least control, least discipline and least collective
morality. Thus an individual can become malignant and overpower
the whole nation with his money. A few rich can control the
Parliament elections and the collective freedom. Now the time
has come to get the dividend of this trauma of democracy.
Communism is the other movement towards the right side. It
started for the benevolence of the collective and not for the
rights of the individual. There is no individual freedom for po-
litical rights or ownerships. Stern administration discipline is
enforced creating a frightful existence. In the extreme cases it
is a complete regimentation of the country as Stalin manifested.
There are strict limitations on earnings and throttling curbs on
free thinking. The human awareness is completely brain washed.
This forced goodness for the collective makes the nations weak
because the individuals who make the collective are like pup-
pets. They lose the sensitivity to feel the collective joy and
if they visit a democratic country they become terrible self-
indulgent. This shows that this artificial training has done no
good to the character.
One can see the change in the attitude of the leaders in these
nations. Those in the left are trying to go towards the right
and those in the right side are moving towards the left. Perhaps
in their ignorance they think that the grass is greener on the
other side. In their respective movement they have to stop in
the center if they want to have balance. This is what Sahaja
Yoga is doing that it gives balance to an individual as it is an
en-masse movement, it also gives balance to the collective.
To ascend to the Divine is the only pure desire and is the only
solution for saving the nations from the doomsday. This is said
by many saints and seers of our country. We Indians are still
under the darkness of slavery and do not want to know the wealth
of Indian Wisdom. We are so much enamoured by the superficial
glitter of the West that we close our eyes to the fact that West
is moving towards its destruction very fast.
The economic wants are also described as satiable in particular
but not in general. That means the so called desire we have,
are never going to be fulfilled in their totality. Today we very
much want one thing and when we achieve it we want something
else. In the democratic countries there is a wild race for
creating new wants and new problem for making the machines work
for twenty four hours a day. The household is filled with junk
showing the relics of the dead desires. To counter balance this
we have the anti-culture movements who take to the other extreme
of drugs etc. On the other side in the Communist countries the
desires are controlled by force and regimentation. But once
these bounded people get to the so called free countries they
become wild like primitive people worse than the free people.
So what is pure desire? What is the want that satisfies fully? I
may say this desire is to become one with the Divine.
The Divine is the Love of God Almighty, 'Chaitanya' as described
by Adi Shankaracharya - the cool breeze. That is the cool breeze
of the Holy Ghost (Adishakti). This is the 'Ruh' described in
the Holy Koran.
The movements of human awareness are very swift and shaky. They
create uneasiness, tensions and diseases. Once the balance is
established through Sahaja Yoga and the relation with the vital
power of Divine is established, it transforms human personality.
He becomes a super man, free from temptations, completely inte-
grated, peaceful, compassionate, joyful and above all he gets
all the powers of his Spirit.
Similarly the man made religions are coming in their ugly mani-
festation. They have defiled the Divine, denied the reality and
their fake grounds are shaking. In their extreme cases one can
see the movement towards the left or right. The left movement is
money oriented, and the right movement is power oriented; they
are in no way spirit oriented. But one should not in any way
disregard the evolutionary living power which has made us human
beings. The introspection should make us inquire and question :
"What is wrong with us?" etc.
Firstly, we discover that we do not have the means to have ab-
solute direction of right and wrong. Every opinion is relative.
Secondly, we don not have a personality that can sensibly use
power or money. Thirdly, we lack the strength to withstand temp-
tation of evil and falsehood. Whatever ism we follow we are
dissatisfied, frustrated, unhappy, sickly and aggressive human
beings at par with each other.
There are many ways suggested but the living process of a seed
to become the tree is the same. The living force of evolution
has to work through Sahaja Yoga. In all human ventures we end
up in a pond of worms who are eating everything or of sinking
shifting mire which overpowers. To emerge victoriously out of
these two dangerous jaws of destruction is only possible if the
leaders of the nations get self realization through Sahaja Yoga
and are enlightened by self-knowledge of the collective (this
would manifest on their central nervous system). Thus appearing
on the stage of reality as "Lotuses of Divinity spreading the
fragrance of human ascent into its glorious destination."
|
| 401.141 | Cool Breeze... | ZGOV05::JAMESLIAW | | Tue Jan 09 1990 02:21 | 17 |
| I feel the cool sensations sometimes too in front of the
photo and also sometimes when it is not around.
Been doing it for some months now.
Still waiting to see other effects like a better life
,etc,(side effects of linking with the Spirit). Anyway,
the bad effects are caused by oneself anyway.
Anybody else anything to add to liven up this file?
Regards James - A Buddhist
James
|
| 401.142 | News from down-under. | ROYALT::SU | | Fri Mar 16 1990 15:41 | 49 |
|
Here some news just arrived from downunder...
Shri Mataji was visiting in New Zealand from March 12 till 15th.
Later during Her stay Brian had arranged for Shri Mother to be
interviewed live by New Zealand most renowned, cynical radio
broadcaster, what we call here a 'hard case'. He has a reputation
for giving the people he interviews a bad time.
The interview commenced and he started asking Shri Mataji some
very penetrating questions about Sahaja Yoga, the world situations,
help, money in Sahaja Yoga and as the interview progress he got
more and more positive. Then he asked her :
"Are you a Messiah a prophet ?"
To which Shri Mataji did not reply, but suddenly he started
feeling cool breeze in his hand. Then he forgot he was live on
radio and started saying "Hey I can feel this cool breeze in my
hands when I bring my hands together I feel like I am holding
a cool ball of wind. Me the greatest sceptic, when I started
interviewing Shri Mataji I did not believe a word of what she
was saying, now I can feel it."
As this was being broadcast all the office workers in the building
could not believe what he was saying as it was so out of character,
they started coming from their desks and looking through the
studio window in disbelief. The interviewer then said that he could
not feel it in his head, Shri Mataji then worked on him, and
he could then feel it in his head. He asked what about everyone
else and Shri Mataji replied they can get it too just tell them
to put their hands out to radio and they will get it.
Apparently it was an incredible scene as the interviewer, and
all the office workers peering into the studio had one hand
directed to Shri Mataji and one hand above their head feeling
the cool breeze.
Later Shri Mataji said that although the interviewer had a bad
reputation underneath he was quite humble, and really ready
for it, that is why he felt it so strong.
Shri Mataji held two public programs in Auckland, both quite
successful and attended by around 300 people.
(Currently she is in Sydney, Australia.)
|
| 401.143 | Freeing The World 'For Free' | ROYALT::SU | | Fri Apr 27 1990 11:08 | 59 |
| <<< HYDRA::DISK$USERPACK02:[NOTES$LIBRARY]HOLISTIC.NOTE;2 >>>
-< Holistic Forum >-
================================================================================
Note 19.11 Types of Meditation. 11 of 11
ROYALT::SU 52 lines 27-APR-1990 09:59
-< Freeing The World 'For Free' >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is an article that was published in the "Australian" on the 16th
of March 1990 during Shri Mataji Australian tour.
FREEING THE WORLD 'FOR FREE'
False prophets are easy to identify because they are all
money-oriented, says Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi, 67, commonly known as
The Mother and regarded by many Indians and Westerners as the greatest
living saint.
Shri Mataji believes people are attracted to gurus who charge money
because they think something that is free is not worth anything.
It is, She says, a symptom of the philosophy that is destroying the
world.
"But Mother Earth is not for sale. And self-realisation is invaluable.
You cannot pay for it," She said.
Shri Mataji, on Her fifth visit to Australia, offers "self-realisation"
through the practice of Sahaja Yoga, an ancient system of meditation
that uses signals and sensations felt in the central nervous system to
achieve greater awareness and intuition.
She has brought Her message to people in 40 countries over the past 20
years and is being rewarded with a global explosion in the practice of
Sahaja Yoga.
To Her surprise, when She visited Leningrad, Moscow and Kiev last
August, thousands of people had to be turned away when She spoke.
Sahaja Yoga is now being given a three-month trial in an orphanage and
school in Moscow with a view to introducing it throughout the Soviet
education system.
She believes "self-realisation" among thousands of Soviets and Eastern
Europeans last year was responsible for the series of revolutions that
overthrew Communism.
She also believes the Soviet President, Mr. Gorbachev, is a "very
powerful saint" who has the capacity to change the world.
"That transformation gives a great chance for humanity to be saved,"
She said.
Shri Mataji will speak at the Sydney Hilton today and tomorrow and the
Canberra Convention Centre on Monday.
-Anne Jamieson
|
| 401.144 | Sahaja Yoga in Austria | VNABRW::EICHERT | Helmut Eichert, Linz | Tue May 08 1990 04:38 | 11 |
| For those interested in Sahaja Yoga in and around Austria:
There are regular meetings and introductions in the following places:
Wien, Stockerau, Krems, St. P�lten, Perchtoldsdorf, Wr. Neustadt,
Bratislava, Sopron, Eisenstadt, Graz, Klagenfurt, Steyr, Linz,
Salzburg, Innsbruck and Bregenz.
Please contact me for details:
Helmut Eichert @LNZ, vnabrw::eichert
|
| 401.145 | Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi is coming. | ROYALT::SU | | Tue May 22 1990 18:44 | 42 |
| To all the seekers of the Truth,
Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi will be here in North America in person from
May 25th till June 8th. During this period of time, there will be few
public programs available to all.
June 7 (Thursday) at 7:00pm
at "Terrace on the Park"
52-11 Flushing Meadow Park
Queens, New York
Intersection of the Grand Center Parkway and the Long Island
Expressway:
By car: From the Grand Central Parkway, take the exit for the Long
Island Expressway. Do not get on L.I. Expressway. Follow signs to
108th Street. Follow signs to Terrace on the Park.
From the Long Island Expressway, exit at 108th St. Follow signs to
Terrace on the Park.
By subway: Take the #7 train to 111 St. station. Walk 10 blocks.
Or, take the #7 train to 103rd St. station. Take the Q23 bus to 52nd
Avenue. Walk 1 block to 111th St.
Also, The UNSRC Cultural Society will present Shri Mataji on a program
"The Awareness Breakthrough" at Dag Hammarskjold Auditorium on
Wednesday, June 6th at 5:00pm. You will need an invitation to get in.
Please send mail to me for invitation. The entrance to the Auditorium
at the UN is located at First Avenue and 42nd Street.
"As a mother I would say that I have done the cooking for you. If you
are hungry you should start eating. I leave it to your wisdom and to
your freedom to feel the longing from inside."
- Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi
For more information: (718)-520-0175
|
| 401.146 | Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi in Austria | VNABRW::EICHERT | Helmut Eichert, Linz | Fri Jun 15 1990 03:36 | 7 |
| There will be two public programs with Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi
in Vienna:
Monday, 18.6.1990, 19:30 and
Tuesday, 19.6.1990, 19:30
in Kongre�zentrum, Margareteng�rtel, 1050 Wien
Helmut
|
| 401.147 | Couldn't resist | ELMST::VERMA | Virendra, MRO4-3/H10, DTN 297-5913 | Fri Jun 15 1990 16:57 | 2 |
| After reading some of the earlier replies, no wonder Christ suffered so
much.
|
| 401.148 | Only Your Own Experience Count. | ROYALT::SU | | Mon Jul 09 1990 13:17 | 198 |
|
Base on Sahaja Yoga's Viswa Nirmala Dharma - the Universal True
Knowledge, we have discussed quite a bit of Lord Christ (even in
VAXWRK::INDIA #140.* Jesus in India). In Sahaja Yoga, you can prove
the existence of God (The supreme unconscious, the power which create
human being), and further you can even prove Christ is the son of God!
Now perhaps I should clarify it a bit. When we say prove, we don't
mean proof in the epistemological sense, or in the sense whereby you
can demonstrate the existence of God for all to see. Rather, Sahaja
Yoga will convince anyone who approaches it with an open mind - neither
accepting like a blind faith or rejecting the tenets put forth.
The ideal student is the person committed to find out what the truth
is, what the actual state of affairs is. He or she approaches Sahaja
Yoga as an experiment to test a set of hypotheses.
We cannot prove the existence of God with a dialectic! Sahaja Yoga is
very simple yet very difficult big subject. Furthermore, reading about
it, or discussing it, won't prove my point. You have to make the
choice to find Truth. Sahaja Yoga helps you do that. It provides a
direct teleological experience, gives you direct, lucid, and complete
contact with the living Base of existence itself.
So, what is Sahaja Yoga? I know many of you probably wondering about
and you are afraid to get into something really cannot understand at
this point.
Yoga is Sanskrit for union. To achieve yoga is to achieve union
with the Divine. Tragically, the word has come to mean something
else in the West Here yoga labels everything from stretching
exercises to self-hypnosis.
Real yoga takes you beyond the limitations of mind and emotion.
Its practice is exceedingly rare and difficult to find. The state
of yoga is an experience described by many seers, saints and
incarnations. Jesus Christ, Buddha, Lao-Tze, and Muhammad, all
spoke of it. Lesser known seers have written about it, including
Kahlil Gibran, William Blake, C.S. Lewis, Henry David Thoreau and
Kabir. But, again, from your perspective, such assertions are
conjecture. They have to be. Sahaja Yoga is not a dogma. In
fact, we say it's wrong to believe in God without firm, expirical
evidence. On the other hand, it's equally wrong to reject our
experiment, out of hand.
The experiment of Sahaja Yoga is simple. You don't need to take
drugs. You don't need to sit and chant a repetitive mantra until
your brain turns to jelly. You don't need to concentrate. You
don't need to do anything immoral or illegal. You don't have to do
any stretching or exercises. You don't need to wear a saffron
robe or any other such nonsense. You don't need to change your
diet. You don't have to pay any money for your Self-realization.
You don't have to read any propaganda. You don't need to sit in a
funny position. And you don't need to believe. It only takes fifteen
minutes of your time each day. And, it works.
Suppose you were to start practicing Sahaja Yoga. Let me tell you what
you could expect. I can cite scriptural and literary quotes which
recount every experience I am about to describe. These come from many
of the world's scriptures and from other literary works. Each
substantiates the experiences of Sahaja Yoga. But these citations are
more interesting after you've experienced what they describe, and they
really do nothing to further my challenge. If you explore Sahaja Yoga,
...Well, I don't really have to do this, because all of the Dejavu noter
are avid reader.
To start the experiment you need to meet with some Sahaja yogis.
You will almost certainly achieve what we call Self-realization during
your first meditation. This is the same experience as the Buddhist
enlightenment and the Christian second birth or baptism (real). For
some people this experience is quite dramatic, for others it is subtle.
But none will suffer any bit as the biginning of this 401 earlier notes
discussed.
Whether or not you feel anything during your initial meditation is
inconsequential. Eventually, you will begin to feel the manifestation
of your own spirit (Sanskrit: Atma ). Of course, you don't need to
believe that. You'll just note that you are feeling unusual sensations
on your hands, on your scalp, and in your body. These sensatins are not
painful whatsoever.
You may feel a slight warmth or tingling which gradually gives way to
the feeling of a cool breeze. This is the cool breeze of the Holy
Ghost (Hebrew: Ruach, Sanskrit: Chaitanya). You don't need to believe
that - just note the experience when it happens.
You will feel the cool breeze blowing across the palms of your hands
and out the top of your head, above the fontanelle membrane. We call
this part of the head the Brahmarandra or the Sahasrara Chakra.
As your sensitivity increases, you will be able to feel the Sahasrara
Chakra open. This is a very enjoyable experience, you are in total joy
of silence.
This openning of Sahasrara is a manifestation of your enlightenment.
Hindu mythology describes the Sahasrara as a thousand petalled lotus.
In Christian terms, it is the tongues of flames. Christian artists
unwittingly depict it as a halo, or a white pigeon! May be Christians
derived their concept of heaven above from the fact that the Sahasrara
Chakra opens just above the head.
Thoreau called the Sahasrara the fruit on top of your head and
metaphorically refers to the experience of Self-realization throughout
his journals.
Again, you don't need to believe this. You should just take note when
you feel something happening.
You will find these sensations interesting and enjoyable, but they
don't prove my hypothesis. You will find that proof in the state of
consciousness that accompanies these physical manifestations. This
state is something that you have to experience because I cannot
describe it. I will say that Self-realization is a good poetic
description.
Everything gradually becomes so clear. Some said it was like waking
from a hazy sleep.
I sincerely believe that Sahaja Yoga will change humanity. The
experience is undeniable. The problem is that you can't just read about
it or watch it on television. You have to try it.
Unfortunately, few people have ever even heard of Sahaja Yoga. But the
word is spreading gradually. I try to tell anyone who will listen. So
far, very few people have been willing to lend me an ear.
The words from Russia last week, I heard 5000 people in Moscow got
their self-realization and 10'000 in Leningrad where an Olympic Stadium
had been used for Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi's public program.
Nick, I hope you don't mind I took the words right from your mouth.
No discussion of Sahaja Yoga is complete without mention Shri Mataji
Nirmala Devi.
She was born in Chindwara, India, on March 21st in 1923. Her father
was a noted language scholar and was the only Christian member of
independent India's Central Legislative Assembly. Her mother was a
mathematician.
Mahatma Gandhi invited her to work with him at his ashram. She became
his child-guru.
As a young woman, Shri Mataji played an active role in India's struggle
for independence. Later she studied medicine and psychology.
She married, raised a family, and is how a grandmother. Her husband is
C.P. Shrivastava, the Secretary General of the United Nations
International Maritime Organization of 16 years. Last December he
retired from U.N..
In 1970, after the marriage of her daughters, she began teaching Sahaja
Yoga. She now spend most of her time travelling worldwide, giving
public programs and lectures.
I hope this notes will satisfy your curiosity and provoke you to
investigate further.
Some of you may be think that Sahaja Yoga looks like a crazy Eastern
cult. On the surface it may resemble a New Age racket, but let me
assure you that the similarities end there. Yes, there are other forms
of meditation, but they are not the same. They do not achieve the same
results and can cost you a fortune.
[ End of note ]
|
| 401.149 | Heaven forbid! (;^) | SCARGO::PAINTER | And on Earth, peace... | Mon Jul 09 1990 17:40 | 10 |
|
Re.148
>Christian artists unwittingly depict it as a halo...
Oh dear, now you've gone and let the cat out of the bag.
0(;^) 0(;^) 0(;^)
Cindy
|
| 401.150 | FYI - Send mail if you are interested. | ROYALT::SU | | Thu Sep 20 1990 14:04 | 40 |
| Dear Noters,
Currently we are running a 7 weeks (once a week) after work continuous
cost free Sahaja Yoga Meditation class at Lotus 1-2-3 Corporation in
Cambridge, Massachusetts. The responses were overwhelmed and we are
surprised to see so many seekers in that small company.
At the end of second session, the attendents (almost all of them) were
expressing their experience of cool breeze coming directly on top of
their fontanelle bones and the vibrations (both cool and hot) they were
perceiving on their very palms. The proof were just phenomenal. Among
them, many admitted that they are atheist but now they have proved that
there is an energy (the image of all pervading power exists within their
subtle system - the physical body. This courses will continue to teach
them the techniques of Sahaja Yoga on how to interpret this vibration and
how to use it to cleanse various center exist in our nervous system; how
this Sahaja Yoga meditation can apply to our daily living etc.
Now, we are considering to run the same course in Digital along the
stretch of highway 495, which is convenient for the employee of Shrewsbury,
Marlboro, Hudson, greater Maynard area (Stow, Parker Street, and the
Mill), Littleton, Westford, Chelmsford or even for the folks across the
boarder of New Hampshire. If we can round up 20 serious seekers, we can
sign up a corporate conference room such as White Mist Hall of Fame at
Hudson plant as meeting place after the working hour (say, from 6:00
to 8:00pm).
If you are interested with above purposal or you have suggestion to this,
please send E-mail to ROYALT::SU. Talking about artificial organization,
this is the most you will see of Sahaja Yoga. After such event, you are
on your on. This meditation course definitely will help you to manage
the stress level in our state of the company.
Best regards,
Paulo
|
| 401.151 | A few questions | CGVAX2::PAINTER | And on Earth, peace... | Sat Sep 29 1990 23:56 | 31 |
|
Hi Paulo,
It is interesting to compare my experiences at Kripalu with Sahaja
Yoga, having gone back to .0 and read the first few initial notes.
One thing that became very clear to me was the lack of integration of
the mind, spirit *and* body in many or most spiritual-type disciplines,
whether they be traditional Western and Eastern religions or (I
hesitate to use this term, but...) new age-type beliefs and practices.
You mentioned a couple of notes back that no exercises or postures were
necessary for the realization to occur. That's fine, however how does
one practicing Sahaja Yoga go about integrating the physical body into
the picture, given that Yoga means union?
To explain further, based on my recent experience, at the Kripalu
Center, what is taught is Kripalu Yoga, or "Meditation in Motion". I
had the deepest meditation state ever just after dance aerobics - it was
as if my mind, body and spirit were truly united and I was tapping into
high voltage. It was more than post-exercise cooldown since the
experience has stayed with me, provided I continue to exercise, stay
close to my vegie diet and generally listen to my body wisdom. The
whole experience was far deeper than this since it has led to some very
transforming experiences recently, however it is difficult to convey
the totality of these experiences in a short note.
Thanks,
Cindy
|
| 401.152 | | ROYALT::SU | | Wed Oct 03 1990 14:50 | 67 |
| Hi Cindy,
You may be able to compare this notes to that notes, but I don't think
you can compare Kripalu with Sahaja Yoga because you have not
experience Sahaja Yoga yet.
The unique of Sahaja Yoga is you first experience the state of become
self-realization. After this self-realization, your subtle physical
system is awakening and you start your own real work...as nothing comes
easy goes. You become your own master.
As you already know, the objective of meditation is to achieve full
integration with the inner self, or Spirit. In Sahaja Yoga, this is
accomplished through thoughtless awareness. With this integration
comes an awareness of vibration, the cool breeze of the Kundalini while
she moves through the seven subtle centers called Chakra.
It is the "only" way through the awakening of the Kundalini from the
dormant state, this true meditation in thoughtless awareness is
possible.
I knew many noters immediately will jump on me for saying "this is the
only way". This also is happening in India many guru came out and
complaint to Shri Mataji: "How can you give such precious gift to any
one else so easily." I must admit that I did not do any of the penance
in order to receive such "jagrut" (awakened). But, nevertheless, you
and I have the same opportunity to receive this as long as you have a
desire same as mine, for such time has come indeed. Many also will
argue with you till the end of the world saying "How dare you said you
got it and I don't". Doesn't matter! Read on and you will know.
To continue your question: "How does one practicing Sahaja Yoga go about
integrating the physical body into the picture, given that Yoga means
union?"
After you have gotten your self-realization, you can achieve the union
of Spirit, mind and body. This means you know where you are off
balance in your own subtle mind and physical body. By that you learn
to compensate it and bring yourself into the middle way - the balance.
The vibration in your own hand and each part of your body will guide
you and you use the techniques in Sahaja Yoga to purify your chakras.
Since you become your own master, you experiment and you will know it
is all absolutely true as it is not just mental believing. In
practice, this is the state that you are not only healing yourself but
you can also know and heal other person's subtle system. You become
microcosmic.
To continue, you can achieve the state of "Nirvikalpa", in which the
collective consciousness state you are even more subtler and subtler.
You will be in the state of doubtlessness. I think I already have gone
beyond your question.
To sum it up, the self-realization is a new beginning for everyone. I
only regret that I started my own in such a late time of my life. It
certainly is going to be a "short note" for me.
-Paulo
|
| 401.153 | Continuing on... | CGVAX2::PAINTER | And on Earth, peace... | Wed Oct 03 1990 15:44 | 11 |
|
Yes, Paolo, however you cannot compare Kripalu to Sahaja either since
you have not had that experience.
So for the moment the best we can do is compare notes.
To continue - I received what is called by Yogi Desai as Shaktipat
(Shakti) energy from my spiritual teacher this lifetime, about three
years ago. From what you write, this sounds similar.
Cindy
|
| 401.154 | ? | ROYALT::SU | | Wed Oct 17 1990 17:20 | 16 |
| Perhaps, you can tell us what is the Shaktipat energy you received
three years ago?
What can you do with this Shaktipat energy to help your individual
spirit ascend?
How much do you have to paid in order to receive that?
Carl Jung stated the existence of collective consciousness in this
Universe, and he further said we human race can only achieve there
through collective ascension. All the yogis in Sahaja Yoga would
like to explain and share what they have learn and gain, with a good
reason of course.
- Paulo
|
| 401.156 | Reference to C. G. Jung | ROYALT::SU | | Thu Oct 18 1990 13:52 | 23 |
| re: .-1
"An archetype", Jung tell us, "is a great 'original image transmitted
by the collective Unconscious to our own individual unconscious. The
original images constitute the most general and the most ancient and
distant representative forms known to humanity. They are as much
feeling as thought, and they have a sort of life of their own,
independent and autonomous." When our libido outgrows its infantile
and personal form, plunged into the unconscious, it discovers "the
hidden treasure which has served humanity for all its history, whence
have come the gods and the demons and all those thoughts of a greater
force and power without which man ceases to be man."
Please reference to the following book of C.G. Jung.
Psychology of the Unconscious, Collected Works, Princeton 1960
Metamorphoses of the Soul and its Symbol, Princeton
Psychology and the Unconscious, Geneva 1973
- Paulo
|
| 401.157 | collective ascension ? | DWOVAX::STARK | the world is about to change | Thu Oct 18 1990 15:34 | 10 |
| Paulo,
> through collective ascension.
I can't find references to this particular term anywhere, what does it
mean ? Is it a Jungian term or a Yogic one ?
thanks,
>Todd>
|
| 401.158 | Does a yogi fly? | ROYALT::SU | | Thu Oct 18 1990 16:46 | 15 |
| Sorry to confuse you. I don't mean to quote word for word. You just
have to read the book and find it out for yourself.
Human being will never agree on term or word. Ascension is very difficult
to grasp or to understand. Through meditation, in the state of thoughtless
awareness, when one achieve the yoga - the union with the spirit
(Atma), the brain thinking become dynamic. You will be able to
understand the Scripts which you do not understand before.
In that state of yoga, we become one collective Being. you and I are the
same. "...through collective ascension" is one being, one great power
with the all pervading energy.
So, is it a Jungian term or a Yogic term? The true answer will be none
of those.
|
| 401.160 | Reply | CGVAX2::PAINTER | And on Earth, peace... | Fri Oct 19 1990 13:49 | 0 |
| 401.161 | First installment | SCARGO::PAINTER | And on Earth, peace... | Mon Oct 22 1990 00:58 | 36 |
| Re.154
Hi Paolo,
I will add details later on, however I did not pay anything for
Shaktipat - it is not for sale. Though our terms may be different, I
believe that what you experienced and what I experienced are parts of
the same.
My first encounter with this energy (I will call it) came through a
friend three + years ago. At the time, neither of us knew of any of
these things. I was at Kripalu in the bookshop a few weeks ago, and
began reading some books written by Yogi Amrit Desai where he explained
the Shaktipat process and then realized that what he was describing in
the book was indeed what happened between my friend and me. However in
our case it was not a conscious act vs. your experience with the Sahaja
woman. As it turns out, this friend is my Gurudev (beloved spiritual
teacher) in this lifetime. At some level I've always known this - it's
just that the book and the description put words around it. I'm composing
that letter to him now, along with sending him a copy of the book...is he
ever going to be surprised! (;^)
Now, I don't know if there was a cool breeze at the top of my head or
not, since I didn't check. In the days following that though, life
suddenly made sense, including the holy texts - their meanings were
revealed to me in a deeper direct personal way. I also *found* (was
guided) to this notes conference (see note 358.* for my first entry).
On that day I consciously began my spiritual growth path. It's been an
intense 3+ years.
I will begin a note on the Kripalu Yoga and Center in the near future.
I also encountered the same energy out there and had some further
revelations take place as a result...the most profound being a direct
experience with just how the mind, body and spirit are related.
Cindy
|
| 401.162 | Any plans for Ireland? | ESSB::BROCKLEBANK | | Wed Nov 07 1990 09:54 | 7 |
| Hi Paulo,
Having read through this entire topic I'm sceptical but still open
minded about Sahaja Yoga. As the emphasis seems to be on experiencing
it, can you tell me whether Shri Mataji has plans to give a workshop
here in Ireland.
Regards,
Dave
|
| 401.163 | Truth is what it is ! | SNOC02::KYRIACOUC | | Sun Jan 13 1991 20:54 | 98 |
| Dear All.
I have been following this note with great interest and all seems a
bit quiet of late so I thought I would add a note.
The discussions with regards Sahaja Yoga and the things said about
it have been quite interesting and stimulating. When I say this
it is in reference to the rational mind, because in many instances
issues have arisen because of the insuffiencies of the written
word to convey the vitality of experience. As a global mode of
communication it is the best mode available to us. Many discussions
have arisen by what each of us mean when we use words like;
'self-relisation', 'meditation', 'Holy-Spirit'. After discussion
we may come to a position where we agree upon what we means by
our use of these words, but do we have the same understanding
of the truth of those words. I have just used another word
"truth" which you may say is subjective. Each of us has
our own truths. What is true for me based on my expreince may
not be true for you, so what is truth ?
However the great souls of the ages have said that "Truth is what
it is". This I suppose takes a deal of faith to accept that
underlying this existence there are fundamental truths. Such as
the existence of God.
Fundamental is a word used in derision by many in this topic
because it implies "one and only", and "absolute". The
traditions of western science with which many of us have been
educated teach that absolutes are unattainable. And readily
admit that all our ideas desribing nature are theortical.
Every day our theories change. Some say that it is not possible
for the creation to come to an understanding of the power which
created it.
There is a truism which I feel is reflected in many of the
repsonses to this topic which is "that all paths though they
go in different directions will lead to God". Appealing as this
is, all truism are not true, for this one gives the Ego the
necessay space and freedom to do what it wishes without
uncomforable constraints. The path to God exists, all the
great Avatars have said so. According to the place and time
they could only reveal a small part of this path . There are
many appealing side streets and turns along the way. How
do we know if we are travelling this path or along many
of its diversions?
If there is truth who do we get to it? If evil is the master
of deception who do know truth from falsehood. Now comes my
admission, as you have probably guessed by now I am a
practicing Sahaja Yogi. Through the awakening of the
Kundalini each of us has the ability to determine
truth for ourselves. Self-Realisation as described in this
notes file is the beginning of a process whereby a new
new dimension of awareness is available to the individual.
It is like you have the use of a new sense to add to the other
five senses. This new sense is what is called 'vibratory
awareness', after the Kundalini (Holy Spirit) is awakened
you start to feel its cool vibrations using this new sense.
You perceive these cool vibrations both in yourself
and throughout the creation for the Holy Spirit is the power
of the Creator which pervades the entire existence.
By its nature the truth of which I earlier spoke is in harmony
with the Creator, the co-efficient of its existence is the
Holy Spirit or Kundalini. If you accept the possibility that
Sahaja Yoga can awaken the Kundalini and allow you to to begin
to perceive its workings on your central nervous system. Then
the possibility exists for you to determine truth for yourself.
If something is in harmony with the universe you can perceive
its the cool vibrations. This is not a physical wind which you
feel, such as from a draft, but a subtle spiritual energy.
How can this happen ? By attending one of the lectures given
by Shri Mataji or attending a Sahaja Yoga Centre.
This happening for you is the achievement of Shri Mataji, before
Her advent this process could only be achieved on an indivual
basis between an person with this awakening passing it on to
seeker desiring it. As far as recorded history there has never
before being a person who could awaken the kundalini for an
entire audience, this possibility is unprecedented. This answers
the How? we ask Why Not?
Chris
|
| 401.164 | Welcome from upover | CGVAX2::PAINTER | And on Earth, peace... | Mon Jan 14 1991 16:31 | 32 |
| Re.163
Hi Chris,
Indeed, there is no adequate substitute for direct experience.
I practice Kripalu Yoga, and as you may have noted, I've been
participating in this topic every once in a while. A few months ago I
sent a note offline to Paolo Su asking him if he would like to share
experiences, however he never replied, so if you would like to do so,
I'd welcome that.
Contrary to your claim in your last paragraph about nobody else being
able to awaken Kundalini in an audience, there indeed have been, and
the Yogi who founded Kripalu Yoga (really a blend of more traditional
yogas with an intuitive addition) is also able to do this. He stopped
for several reasons though - the primary reason is that he felt it more
beneficial for people to (I'm paraphrasing here) begin the process with
hatha yoga postures and more conscious living in general, then the
benefits of shaktipat energy would be of more use. Thus, those around
him benefit from his presense in that he still is a channel for the
energy nonetheless (like Christ was) and those who are ready to receive
the energy can draw it from him - it's more of passive role he has
taken in making this energy available to the world. The shaktipat
energy, by the way, is a common Sanskrit term and appears in the 1990
Yoga Dictionary by Georg Feuerstein (it's an excellent book no matter
what form of yoga you practice, and sahaja is mentioned as well).
If you would like to, contact me offline and perhaps we can have a
positive discussion and sharing.
Cindy
|
| 401.165 | The Sky is blue, The Kundalini Cool. | SNOC02::KYRIACOUC | | Mon Jan 21 1991 19:15 | 129 |
|
Hello Cindy,
Surely as you said there is no adequate substitute for direct
experience, and how much more valid is an experience if it is
a shared collective experience. What I mean is an experience
where each person feels the same thing, and the experience can
be verified by the individual and an impartial observer. This is
what the beginnings of self-realization are in Sahaja Yoga.
Everyone feels the same thing as has been written in the major
treatises on this topic in the past. Also others can feel the
awakening of the kundalini even though they themselves may
not have this awakening.
Self-realization is not a subjective experience open to the personnel
interpretation of the individual. Anything which is fundamental has
be the same in everyone. For instance our central nervous system
tells us that the sky is blue, it cannot be red to one, black
to someone else, then green to someone else again. Then we all don't
agree to believe in our own individual experience, and that each of us
is right about the sky. Some of us are wrong, the sky really is blue.
There is something wrong in those who report it otherwise, maybe
they have their eyes closed, or they think they are looking to the
sky but are really looking at the grass, or the flowers. We might
say no the sky is above us and it is blue, and the others say no,
it is down here. Yes within their own experience their perceptions
are true, yet they are missing the point.
The point is self-realisation through the Kundalini is a verifiable
experience within a person, as has been written throughout the ages,
and has been experienced today. People may confuse it with other powers
and sensations it cannot be that which it is not.
This I feel is the position of your Yoga, and as you may have noted
it is not the cool vibration passing out of the top of head as
has been recorded throughout the ages, it is another experience.
The word shaktipat is a general Sanskrit word meaning power, not
necessarily the power with the ability to achieve self-realization.
In our last analogy it equates to color, it is the perception of
color it is not blue. Because if this energy was the kundalini the
experience of it would be the same, as the perception of blue is
the same for all.
One might say how can we be so sure about the manifestation of the
kundalini and the experiences of self-realisation. The answer to
this is that the process of self-realisation and the awakening of
the kundalini is well documented in the traditional Indian Scriptures.
Within the Vedas, Shasstras, the Puranas of Markadenya and the writings
of Adi Shankaracharya and Ganeshwara especially, all write about self-
realisation in a logical and related way. Their is no controversy
among them about kundalini it is only in modern times with our
rational mind that we doubt that which has been discovered through
countless ages of spirituality. Put the modern Yoga Dictionary down
for a moment and read Ganeshwara if you want to know of the kundalini,
or even better come and hear Shri Mataji for She is the master of
Kundalini.
> The shaktipat energy, by the way, is a common Sanskrit term and appears
> in the 1990 Yoga Dictionary.
Sri Mataji has said that She cannot understand what has happened
to logic when it comes to spirituality. That people can discard
all that was discovered and discussed in all the Scriptures about
yoga, self-realisation and the kundalini and take to new fades is
nonsensical. She has classed the 'shaktipat' system in this group.
This is a new fade it is not discussed in any of the traditional
Scriptures. It was not talked about by any of the enlightened souls
of the past, who discussed in depth the kundalini and the process
of self-realisation. She said she has had to correct the imbalances
within the subtle systems of the followers of this path in order to
awaken the kundalini.
> Contrary to your claim in your last paragraph about nobody else being
> able to awaken Kundalini in an audience, there indeed have been, and
> the Yogi who founded Kripalu Yoga (really a blend of more traditional
> yogas with an intuitive addition) is also able to do this. He stopped
> for several reasons though - the primary reason is that he felt it more
> beneficial for people to (I'm paraphrasing here) begin the process with
> hatha yoga postures and more conscious living in general, then the
The claim that the advent of Shri Mataji is unprecedented in history
in that She has can awaken the kundalini en masse is not made
lightly and stands.
Within all the Scriptures of the past there is no mention
of an individual who has done this task before. Those who could
awaken the kundalini did so on an individual basis, so for
this reason it is unprecedented. You say your guru can do this
but for the most altruistic of reasons has stopped. As mentioned
previously the kundalini has specific qualities, if the energy your
guru is dealing with does not meet these, then it is not the
Kundalini. Also it is very convenient for someone to claim an
ability then to refrain from proving it, it is a common trick
among all the money making false gurus from India. It is like
the people who claim to teach people to fly. First drop them
from a bridge and see how well they fly, if so them maybe they
can teach. Why you would want to fly is another question,
Qantas does me fine.
I have seen Shri Mataji awaken the kundalini in tens of thousands
of people. How do I know? Because I was there. Chinese, Indian,
Greek people when they put their hands above their heads they all
feel the cool breeze of the Kundalini. Many of these people could
not speak English and could not understand a word of what Shri
Mataji said, but afterwards reported the cool breeze.
It is very easy to tell if what I say is the truth, attend one
of Shri Mataji's public program, or visit one of the centers.
Within one evening you can tell for yourself because you will
or will not experience this for yourself.
Chris.
|
| 401.166 | The Divine Fire | ATSE::FLAHERTY | Peacing it together | Mon Jan 21 1991 21:58 | 69 |
| I have reservations about 'mass kundalini awakenings', in fact
wonder if it may not be dangerous. The following excerpt referencing
kundalini is reprinted without permission from a book entitled
Meditation by Grace Cooke. I feel it addresses the concerns I have
regarding the subject:
Some people may not understand how any problems can arise in spiritual
development. Others are well aware of the dangers involved in
tampering with what is called "kundalini" and for this reason would
not attempt to awaken the 'sleeping princess' (as kundalini is
sometimes called). It should therefore be made very clear to the
reader what kundalini is, because forewarned is forearmed. If a man
[this book was written before gender language was considered, therefore
man refers to both men and women) knows what dangers lie in his path he
can, with this knowledge, avoid them.
It has, we hope, been made clear that we are working with the higher
chakra - the heart, the throat and the head-centers, which are
sometimes referred to as the higher, or the golden, triangle in man.
These centers are animated by the creative power which lies like a
sleeping serpent coiled at the base of the spine - kundalini.
Normally this power remains dormant and in that state is harmless; and
many students, knowing this, prefer to leave well alone. In the
natural course of deep meditation however there comes a time when this
sleeping power awakens and becomes active. Herein lies the danger, if
the student is ignorant of the significance of kundalini; but with
knowledge of how to control the uprush of this creative force all will
be well. To the ignorant there is most surely danger.
It must be borne in mind that this creative power is closely allied to
the sex force, which can be the mightiest foe as well as the greatest
friend to man. In this it is like other natural forces, such as
electricity for example; which when understood and harnessed to man's
use has become a tremendous asset and blessing in this present age,
whereas if the laws governing its use are broken disaster can ensue.
During the practice of meditation, the kundalini force of creation
might be released, but even then there is nothing to fear, for all
will be well if the student has obeyed the golden rule - that is, if
he has surrendered his heart to the Christ-Light and has learnt to
discipline his emotions, his thoughts and his physical body. This
means that his whole being must be centered on God so that, in every
aspect of life, he seeks constantly the good, the true, the beautiful,
and abstains from habits which are the enemies of spiritual man, such
as indulgence in selfishness, cruelty in all its forms, violent
emotions, negative or impure thoughts and gross forms of living,
eating and drinking.
For it should be made plain that whatever is gross and evil in man's
composition will be stimulated (possibly beyond his control) if
kundalini is awakened. (footnote: Much of this applies mainly to the
East, where methods of unfoldment are widely different. In the West,
these dangers seldom arise, provided the student is wise and careful.)
On the other hand, all the best, all his divine qualities will equally
be stimulated and strengthened. It therefore opens up magnificent
opportunities for the growth and development of the Christ in man when
the lower nature has been disciplined and brought under control. This
is why so much stress has been laid on the need for purity of living
and thinking, and for the strict following of the Christ-Spirit in the
heart.
***************
The chapter then goes on in depth to describe what White Eagle has to
say about kundalini. Since I find his teachings ring true and are
personal for me, I won't share them here.
Ro
|
| 401.167 | Don't worry, it's quite safe! | SHIRE::PHILIP | Phil Ward Mgmt. Sci. Geneva-Etang | Tue Jan 22 1991 03:40 | 59 |
|
As to the "danger" of Kundalini, Shri Mataji used the
following analogy, also hinted at in .166: Suppose a man comes in
from a remote Indian village with no electricity, and comes across
an electrical socket for the first time in his life. To find out
what this strange object does, he pokes around inside it and
finishes up getting a strong electric shock. Of course, he
concludes that electricity is something very dangerous and
unpleasant and it's best to have nothing to do with it.
But if you know what you're doing then you just plug in a
light and you find electricity is very useful and helpful. It's the
same with Sahaja Yoga. I've seen thousands of people receive Self-
realisation (one evening last July in a sports stadium in Sofia,
around ten thousand people) and never come across anyone who felt
ill effects. On the contrary, those who pursue the experience
further find it helps them with all sorts of physical and
psychological problems.
> It must be borne in mind that this creative power is closely allied to
> the sex force...
This is utter nonsense. Kundalini has nothing to do with sex.
This misunderstanding, and others like it, have given rise to all
sorts of false practices and consequent problems, just as the
peasant, with a wrong understanding of electricity, sticks his
fingers in the socket and gets hurt.
> It has, we hope, been made clear that we are working with the higher
> chakra - the heart, the throat and the head-centers, which are
> sometimes referred to as the higher, or the golden, triangle in man.
> These centers are animated by the creative power which lies like a
> sleeping serpent coiled at the base of the spine - kundalini.
The Kundalini passes through and acts upon all the chakras, not
just the three mentioned here. (Except that - just a detail -
Kundalini doesn't pass through the first centre, Mooladhara chakra,
because the Kundalini rises from the sacrum and this chakra is
placed beneath the sacrum.)
> For it should be made plain that whatever is gross and evil in man's
> composition will be stimulated (possibly beyond his control) if
> kundalini is awakened.
Not true at all, in the experience of the thousands of people
who practise Sahaja Yoga. As you discover yourself to be the
Spirit, the gross and evil sides of human nature come under control
and become less important, in a gentle, natural and spontaneous
evolution.
> On the other hand, all the best, all his divine qualities will equally
> be stimulated and strengthened.
Now, this is true! But Kundalini awakening must come first,
and _then_ the divine qualities such as purity of living and
thinking will develop. (No harm in having them beforehand, but they
develop anyway after Self-realisation.)
Phil
|
| 401.168 | | DSSDEV::GRIFFIN | Throw the gnome at it | Tue Jan 22 1991 15:11 | 18 |
| Re: .165
I have a problem with you definition of a fundamental reality of color
perceptions, and perceptions in general.
In your example using colors, not all people can truly see blue. But they learn
to say the sky is blue, because that is what they have been told. To them it
may be more green or grey, in a measurable way, because the eyes do not receive
all color wavelengths equally (I am obviously referring to colorblind people).
These same people may actually experience kundalini, but because of some
difference in their neurological or nervous system, it is perceived differently.
What you describe may be the norm, but not what everyone experiences. I'm not
claiming to know for myself, but experience has taught me that such rigid
requirements can be incomplete when referring to personal internal sensations.
Beth
|
| 401.169 | The Mother within preserves us all. | SNOC02::KYRIACOUC | | Thu Jan 24 1991 00:32 | 113 |
| Dear All.
With RE. 166 reservations about the awakening of the kundalini.
> I have reservations about 'mass kundalini awakenings', in fact
> wonder if it may not be dangerous.
Such reservations are indeed quite normal especially since
many of us have no experience or knowledge of this energy. Some
say this energy is dangerous, some say not, how are we to know,
it is natural to be a bit wary. We who have experienced its
awakening in a small way, say it is one of the best things
that can happen to you in your life !
My impression about what Grace Cooke write about the kundalini
is that she dancing at the edge of the bushes a bit in her descriptions
of the kundalini, but has not experienced its awakening for
herself (based on her explanations. As Phil said in .167 the
kundalini is:
>> all the best, all his divine qualities will equally
>> be stimulated and strengthened.
> Now, this is true! But Kundalini awakening must come first,
> and _then_ the divine qualities such as purity of living and
> thinking will develop. (No harm in having them beforehand, but they
> develop anyway after Self-realisation.)
The kundalini is the also known as "the Mother within", or the
feminine power within us, reflected as the desire within us
to be reunited with God. As Shri Mataji as said each of us
has this individual Mother within us, and once awakened how
can She be harmful or injurious to you. Once awakened the
kundalini flows to all the charkras soothing and nourishing
the damage of the charkras incurred through the misuse human
beings have made of their free will.
The kundalini is the life force in Nature, and the means by which
we achieve communion with the power which created us. To describe
it as dangerous in any way is misplaced. As Phil said re. 167 the
aspects of the kundalini are diametrically apposed to the stimulation
of the gross within people. Reports to the contrary have come from
people who have not the ability, or authority, and have attempted
to raise the kundalini.
| Sushumna Nadi
| (or the Path of the Kundalini)
.
. . Sacrum Bone (Residual Home of
. . the Kundalini)
.......
-----
| |
| | Mooladhara Chakra the 1st Chakra
_______
The problems reported with regards the kundalini can be better
understood with a basic understanding of its position within the
subtle system. As shown the kundalini resides within the sacrum bone
awaiting awakening by the vibrations of an authorized soul. Below the
kundalini is the Mooladhara Chakra which is the centre controlling
our sex. This centre also prevents access to the kundalini to all
those people who are unauthorized, who do not have their kundalinis
awakened. If such attempts are made, then the Mooladhara centre prevents
this unauthorized access and may produce the heat, or sensations of
danger reported. However this has nothing to do with the Kundalini,
this energy is still dormant. It is the qualities of the Mooladhara
protecting the kundalini which may have resulted in these experiences.
The kundalini has some prescience and once awakened will rise to the
degree with which the subtle system of the seeker can sustain. So it
is never overpowering. As mentioned, the fact that it has happened in
'mass' situations is nothing to be fearful of. More to contrary it
is a testimony to the 'normalness' of the experience. All these
people have control over their faculties at all times and are in
no way distressed. You are always in control of the situation,
if at any time you choose not have the energy awakened you can
quite easily walk away.
> In your example using colors, not all people can truly see blue.
With RE. 168 the difficulty of explaining about the kundalini is
that is a spiritual energy, not a physical one. When the kundalini
awakens one of the ways it manifests on the physical system is
the sensation of coolness. This is recorded in history and reported by
tens of thousands around the world. Your analogy with people
who are color blind is as applicable to experiences of the kundalini
as of color. People can pursue spiritual paths which rather than
preparing the ground for the awakening of the kundalini, actually
damage this system preventing the kundalini from awakening. Much
like being color blind. They may have lost the innate ability to
perceive the kundalini.
>These same people may actually experience kundalini, but because of some
>difference in their neurological or nervous system, it is perceived differently.
The point being they are unable to perceive the kundalini, or it
may not be able to awaken. As has been said there are other
energies present within the body which they are perceiving which
have nothing to do with the kundalini.
How will you know? find out for yourself as many have said it is
the most natural and easiest of tasks when conducted by an
realized soul. Shri Mataji has been proclaimed within Her own
country as the Master of the Kundalini. Believe me She can do the
job.
Regards Chris.
|
| 401.170 | Appreciated | CGVAX2::PAINTER | Pray for Peace, people everywhere... | Thu Jan 24 1991 17:52 | 11 |
| Re.169 and a few back
Hi Chris,
Unfortunately I have only a moment at this time to respond...I shall do
so at greater length in the near future - thank you for your response.
One question - when you say you practice Sahaja Yoga, what does this
practice entail?
Cindy
|
| 401.171 | It only takes a spark to get a fire going. | SNOC02::KYRIACOUC | | Thu Jan 24 1991 19:31 | 57 |
| Dear Cindy.
> How do you practice Sahaja Yoga.
When we receive self-realisation the kundalini rises and
pierces through the last Chakra at the top of the head. As
many have said this is a natural evolutionary process, much
like the sprouting of a seed, the whole system is built with
this intended purpose. Many people feel it as a cool breeze
or vibration coming from the head or on the palms of the hands,
and a feeling of peace and well-being is experienced. It is a
living process for which you cannot pay, and for which you
cannot put in any effort, however it does require a humble
attitude, a pure desire, and an open mind. This is the best
approach.
The first experience of self-realisation is only the beginning
as only a small thread of the kundalini has risen within us.
If you could imagine, the kundalini is like a large rope, so
more is needed to be done to further awaken it. It is then up
to us nurture the experience, like a newly sprouted seed, we
must water it, remove the weed which may stop its growth. This
is the 'practice of Sahaja Yoga' where we begin to manifest more
fully this initial awakening. For this there are simple techniques
we learn to us.
We learn about the chakras in the subtle body, which are part of
mechanism which works out our realisation. These chakras
correspond to the plexuses of the nervous system in the physical
body. the chakras express the state of our physical, mental,
emotional and spiritual being. As we nurture our self-realisation
we start to become integrated in all four of these areas. Once
the realisation process is begun we gain the ability to give
realisation to others.
After realisation we begin to experience the Truth on our central
nervous system. If something is true, or on the evolutionary path,
then we feel cool vibrations on the palms of our hands. If something
is against the evolutionary path of man we feel no vibrations or maybe
even heat or pain. Once the kundalini is raised a tingling or hot
sensation is also felt on the hands to indicate which of our
chakras is in an unbalanced state and requires attention. Each of
the fingers of each of the hands corresponds to a specific Chakra.
The ability to feel the vibration of the kundalini on the hands allows
one to specifically pin point the problems in the chakras and using
the kundalini one is able to clear these problems.
So the practices of Sahaja Yoga are simple techniques using the
kundalini to cleanse and heal the subtle system, to bring the
energies within us into balance, and to strengthen the power of
the attention. These techniques are applied to correct the problems
within the subtle system so that the kundalini can be further awakened.
As this process continues, so the degree and depth of self-realisation
and the peace with us increases.
Chris
|
| 401.172 | And once the fire is burning, it can't help but burn brighter | CGVAX2::PAINTER | Pray for Peace, people everywhere... | Fri Jan 25 1991 23:31 | 60 |
|
Hi Chris,
Thank you.
I have had the experiences you speak of. My palms vibrate with cool
energy, and when energy is not flowing properly, the vibration goes
away. There are participants in this conference who can verify this.
...and who vibrate similar energy as well. I have had two fairly
major and recognizable kundalini awakening experiences (though I did
not know at the time what they were). During the first one, suddenly
2000 years of Judeo-Christianity made sense, and during the second one,
the links between East and West were revealed to me...intuitively.
My first experience was 3.5 years ago, and the person who transferred
the energy to me was a good friend who, interestingly enough, lives in
Australia. Neither of us were conscious of what was going on at the
time. I recognized what had happened while reading a book 3 years
later. The second experience was at Kripalu Center last September where,
during a meditation, my body filled with light and there was no
division - all was One. Later I was to read of this experience in one
of the books in the bookstore, and indeed it is a common one. As my
education has been along the spiritual path, my experiences come first,
then the books to explain them appear in my path when the time is right.
(;^) Such was the case with the dictionary, and so forth.
As for your comment about an objective reality, yes, I agree...however
it is not to be found on the physical plane itself. Somehow the analogy
of blue sky pales in comparison of what it really is though.
I do not doubt what you write, nor do I doubt the Mother's ability.
This is not where I'm coming from. It is through my own personal
experiences though that I know of others who can, or have, performed
this same thing. Each person chooses their own path - the yogi who
founded Kripalu Center has chosen to focus his energy into creating a
place for people to go to heal themselves. The Mother has chosen a
slightly different path. Yogananda chose the path of Kriya Yoga back
in the early 1900's. All are valid (not to say that all
self-proclaimed gurus are valid, certainly not, as we all know), but
the paths of others who are legitimate do indeed lead to the same
place. Having been in Gurudev's presense at Christmastime, I am
certain he is legitimate. When I had the first experience at
Kripalu though, he was not there physically...but the energy was.
Kripalu Center is a non-profit organization, and the cost to stay there,
including meals, lodging, yoga classes, aerobic dancing, sauna and
whirlpool and special programs (yoga, etc) is around $70.00/night. The
cost is offset by people who work there (serving, or seva). One would
be hard-pressed to find this reasonable rate with all that is offered,
in any hotel. I'll send along a catalog if you'd like - contact me
offline.
The kundalini energy has been called many things throughout the
centuries of religious history, including the Holy Spirit, Chi, Cosmic
Mind, Bio-energy, Soul, Shakti, Orgone and Elan-Vital. It is the
energy of the Goddess - the true Mother of all.
Hopefully this will give you a better idea of where I'm coming from.
Looking forward to further exchanges.
Cindy
|
| 401.173 | Just an aside | YARD::GURRAN | My reality or yours ? | Mon Jan 28 1991 04:29 | 8 |
| Cindy,
Thanks for sharing that. I have been reading Dejavu for sometime now,
and can't help wondering about the "major participants". Your entry has not
only helped me to understand you a little more, but also the issues around the
various kundalini enhancing methods.
Thankyou.
|
| 401.174 | You're welcome, Martin. | CGVAX2::PAINTER | And on Earth, peace... | Mon Jan 28 1991 11:26 | 1 |
|
|
| 401.175 | The Powers of the Self-Realised. | SNOC02::KYRIACOUC | | Thu Jan 31 1991 00:09 | 93 |
| Hi Cindy.
>I have had the experience you speak of.
Since we are talking about treading the same path of
self-realisation. To clarify the matter I would like to relate
the powers and abilities that a Yogi who treads this path
should possess. Again this description of the abilities of
the Yogi who possess self-realization are described within
the traditional Holy Scriptures described in .165 . Traditionally
one who has the experience of self-realisation is able to
do the following:
. Raise the kundalini within themselves at will to the seventh
Chakra and beyond.
. Perceive at which Chakra the kundalini is at present working.
. To determine the spiritual condition of each of the seven chakras.
. To use the kundalini to correct any imbalances within the chakras.
. Determine the balance within the three Nadis, and to balance
the energies therein.
. The ability to do the above mentioned tasks for yourself
and for others who so desire self-realisation
. To achieve 'thoughtless awareness' through the maintenance of
the kundalini at the seventh charkra.
. The beginnings of collective conscious.
It is not enough to feel some cool vibrations but all of the above
mentioned spiritual powers are the signs of the self-realised. For
now you have the ability to become your own Guru or teacher, because
you no longer need a guru to tell you what is wrong with you and
what is needed to correct that problem. You can do this for
yourself ? as discussed in .171, we can and do.
This is also one of the test for any individual who claims to be a
'guru' , minimum of minimums they should demonstrated all of the above
mentioned abilities. Also for someone claiming to be a guru
. There should not be any relationship of any kind between the
guru and the disciples for the gratification of any desire
beyond the innocent guru/disciple relationship.
. There should be no relationship between money, the guru and
disciple. Through the ages any guru who takes money from the
disciples under any circumstances were classed as devils,
or false gurus.
. The guru should be the shinning example of what he preaches.
. The guru should have the utmost purity and innocence and be beyond
the shackles of desire.
These are the means for determining the self-realised ,and the
genuiness of a guru.
> It is through my own personal experiences though that I know of others
> who can, or have, performed this same thing.
As my reply in .165 the advent of Shri Mataji is unprecedented,
She is much more than a Yogi or a guru.
She can grant the above mentioned spiritual powers to tens
of thousands of seekers in a split of a second. First do you
posses the above mentioned powers after your years of seeking?
Have you seen, with your own eyes, some else who can grant these
powers to the seekers, en masse ? If they claim to then I suggest
you put them to the
'First drop them from the Bridge' test mentioned in .165
> The kundalini energy has been called many things throughout the
> centuries of religious history, including the Holy Spirit, Chi, Cosmic
> Mind, Bio-energy, Soul, Shakti, Orgone and Elan-Vital. It is the
> energy of the Goddess - the true Mother of all.
Shri Mataji is recognized within Her own country as India's greatest
living saint, and acclaimed by them as the true 'The Mother' of all.
Chris.
|
| 401.176 | Question | CGVAX2::PAINTER | And on Earth, peace... | Mon Feb 04 1991 21:20 | 12 |
|
Hi Chris,
I'm preparing a response to .175, and had one question - the knowledge
of the chakras and diagnosis - was this information somehow
telepathically/intuitively transmitted to you by your Mother, or was
this information you heard/read/learned about after your cool breeze
experience?
Thank you.
Cindy
|
| 401.177 | There is God ! I know. | SNOC02::KYRIACOUC | | Tue Feb 05 1991 21:47 | 61 |
| Cindy.
A quick response. The knowledge of the Chakras can be found in many
of the scriptures mentioned. Today there is a range of information
some of it half-baked. The question is how do you know which information
is correct, and which is conjecture (more of that later).
The diagnosis of the Charkras is one of the powers I mentioned in
.175 and it is one of the abilities gained after the Kundalini is
awakend. As mentioned previously after self-realisation a new
awareness is opened up for the individual whereby the condition
of the chakras is felt through an afferent expereince on the
fingers and toes. Basically each chakra has a reflection on each
of the fingers or toes. When we raise our Kundalini and move it
beyond the seventh charkra we feel the cool vibrations in our
hands and fingers and passing from the seventh centre at the top
of the head. Particular sensations such as pain, heat, or
tingling in one of the fingers can be decoded to a specific problem
with its representative Charkra. Specific techniques using the
Kundalini are used to work and balance the Charkra needing
attention.
Whereas in the past a 'Guru' was required to tell the seeker where
the Kundalini was, the condition of the Charkras, and what is
needed to correct the problem. After Self-Realisation you become
your own 'Guru' and do this for yourself. It is something quite
normal and balacing ones charkras becomes part of ones normal
routine. The meditation experienced after this is more likely
to be in the realm beyond the seventh centre, and not tied to
a problem with one of the charkras.
As referred to at the beginning of this note this ability allows
you to descriminate between 'pure' or true knowledge, about the
charkras for instance, and untruth. A coefficient of truth is the
Kundalini if one puts ones attention on something, or read some
information, if it is truth the cool vibration increase and a
feeling of wellbeing is experienced. If it is untruth the cool
vibration stop and you may feel heat, or pain in the hands.
This has been verified amoung many Sahaja Yogis.
For instance take two sheets of paper and write on one
"There is God" and on the other "There is not God". Blindfold
the participants, placing their hands towards each sheet of paper
the Sahaja Yogi can feel the cool vibration emitting from the
statement of truth, and no vibrations from the other. I know I
was involved in an experiment like this when I first visited a
Sahaja Yoga Centre. We learn to trust this all pervading power and
not so much the vagrancies of the conditioned, rational mind.
Chris.
|
| 401.178 | Shri Mataji to visit the U.S. | SHIRE::PHILIP | Phil Ward Mgmt. Sci. Geneva-Etang | Wed Apr 03 1991 07:37 | 33 |
|
Shri Mataji will be visiting the U.S. at the end of April this
year. Don't miss this opportunity to see her and meet her in person!
===================================================================
Shri Mataji believes that world peace and collective consciousness
can be acheived only through the inner transformation of human
beings. Her system of meditation, Sahaja Yoga, manifests a subtle
energy. This is experienced as vibrations which are felt on the
central nervous system and lead to greater awareness and deeper
intuition. Rather than requiring a "leap of faith", it is an actual
experience of the integration of our physical, mental, emotional,
and spiritual being. It thus brings about complete balance and
inner peace. By bringing together people of all religious, ethnic,
and social backgrounds, she has proven that the human bond is more
than skin deep and that all ideologies are encompassed by the same
universal values and truths.
====================================================================
Shri Mataji will be speaking at a public programmein Honolulu,
Hawaii, on Monday April 22. For more information please contact
Dave Dunphy at (808) 235 46 71
On Wednesday, April 24th at 7:30 p.m., Shri Mataji will speak in
Los Angeles at the Ebell of Los Angeles Theatre, 743 South Lucerne
Blvd. (at Wilshire). for more information please contact Philip
Trumbo at (818) 989 07 94.
Then on Friday, April 26th, Shri Mataji will have a public
program in New York at The Theater in the Park, Flushing Meadow
Park, in Queens. More details from Carolyn Vance at (914) 636 44 06.
|
| 401.179 | Her sched. | CGVAX2::PAINTER | And on Earth, cooperation... | Thu Apr 04 1991 17:30 | 6 |
|
Hi Phil,
Any chance she'll make it to Boston?
Cindy
|
| 401.180 | Interview with Shri Mataji | SHIRE::PHILIP | Phil Ward Mgmt. Sci. Geneva-Etang | Wed Apr 10 1991 04:36 | 208 |
| (Re. .-1; Cindy, no, not this year. However, there are plenty of
Sahaja activities in Boston; contact Howard PACKER::Handy for more
info.)
The following interview was conducted with Shri Mataji in 1983
before her visit to the US, and published in Zirius magazine in May
that year. During the interview the writer gets his
self-realization...
SHRI MATAJI NIRMALA DEVI
"AND THE COOL BREEZE"
by Stan Bostock
The aim was to talk to Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi about her
forthcoming North American tour. What happened was something that
is only now, a week later, starting to make sense.
I telephoned the number Shri Mataji's followers in New York had
given me, and found myself, an hour later, knocking on the carved
door of a five storied terraced house in London's classy
Knightsbridge district.
The door was opened by a young Indian who ushered me into a
reception room as ornate and rich as a jewel box. Furniture covered
with rose silk, tables inlaid with ivory, carved and gilded wooden
screens, pale pink crystal chandeliers.
I heard Shri Mataji before I saw her. "How are you? How is
America?" Then the lady appeared, short, plump, with long dark hair
falling free, and a smile that chips away all defences.
Tea was ordered and I was asked to sit down.
Before I could get the first question into gear Shri Mataji asked,
"Do you know what the chakras are?"
I mumbled something about subtle energy centers along the spine.
"Thats right," she said, and tapped the base of her neck with her
index finger. "This one is called the vishuddhi. In the universe
the vishuddhi is North America. Australia is the lowest chakra, the
mooladhara. India is the kundalini, which can link all the chakras
together," she traced a line from the base of the spine to the top
of her head, "but America is the vishuddhi, isn't it? Such an
important chakra."
Shri Mataji then touched the red spot in her forehead. "This
chakra," she said, "is the agnya. It is presided over by Lord Jesus
Christ, isn't it? The agnya is forgiveness. It shows that the
spirit cannot be destroyed, just as Christ could not be destroyed,
but rose again, didn't he?"
Shri Mataji quietly contemplated the risen Christ for a moment,
then jabbed her fingers towards the base of her neck again.
"The vishuddhi, its presiding deity, you could say, is Lord
Krishna. The vishuddhi stands for diplomacy and sweetness and
self-esteem and communication and collectivity - like your Abraham
Lincoln, he stood for collectivity. Abraham Lincoln was a saint -
did you know that? - a realized soul. You have had many great men.
Roosevelt now, he said, `poverty anywhere is a threat to prosperity
everywhere'. So clear. America is so great. It is protected by Lord
Krishna's discus."
Shri Mataji held up the index finger of her right hand and twirled
it, and I swear I could see a bright glittering disc whirling
round.
"As long as that discus is there," she said, "America can never be
invaded."
"Could that protection ever be withdrawn?" I asked.
Shri Mataji shrugged expressively, and raised her eyebrows high.
"Perhaps," she said. "If the land of diplomacy stopped being
diplomatic, the land of communications communicated bad things, the
land of sweetness turned bitter, then yes, perhaps Lord Krishna
might withdraw the protection." Suddenly she laughed. "on my tour I
shall tell everybody how to stop that from happening."
I asked Shri Mataji if she was visiting North America just to sound
such a warning.
"There are seekers of money, seekers after power, seekers of
physical gratification," she replied, "and then there are people
who have done all those things, and are now seeking the truth,
seeking their spirit, seeking God. There are many, many seekers of
truth in America. Great, great seekers. Oh so great. I want to meet
them. Show them how they can get what they have been looking for
for probably ages. Lifetimes even. Their self realization"
"What is that exactly?" I hadn't yet asked one question from my
carefully prepared list.
Tea arrived. Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi, the spellbinding visionary,
turned into Mrs. C.P. Srivastava, the attentive hostess. Did I have
the right amount of sugar and milk? Would I have a biscuit? (Which
turned out to be a cookie.)
"Self realization," said Shri Mataji, "is the yoga, the union. The
joining of the microcosm to the macrocosm, you could say. The
raising of the energy in each of us called kundalini. (There is no
English word for it. You should invent one. There is a good job for
you, invent a good English word for kundalini.) The linking of
that energy with the all-pervading energy of God, that is what
self realization is."
"What exactly does it do?" I felt a fool at the naivety of the
question.
"It brings about a change in awareness. You feel it as a cool
breeze, cool vibrations, you could say, on the top of the head and
on the hands. It is an actual happening! Not self-certification.
Not saying `I am born again!' or `I am this or that!' You actually
become! If you desire self realization, and you get it, then you
become collectively conscious, truly sweet and truly diplomatic. A
true blue American, you could say." And the joyous laughter flowed
into every corner of the room.
I asked Shri Mataji if she was the only one who could grant this
self realization.
"Oh no," came the reply, "once you have it you can pass it on to
others."
"But it all seems to start from you," I said, "Why you?"
Shri Mataji's face became serious. "As far as I know," she said, "I
am the only one who can do it en masse. Once, in India, 6000
villagers got it at the same time. But if there is someone else who
can do it, then I am only too happy to retire. I am sixty [68 now]
years old." (At times she looks half that.) "I am happily married.
I have a beautiful house as you can see. It would be good to settle
down and stop all this travelling round all the time. But until I
find someone else who can do it, then it is up to me, isn't it, to
meet the seekers and let them know how to gain this gift that is
their own, their right, this Union with God."
"Could I receive this gift?" I asked.
Shri Mataji's eyes danced, "Put your hand above your head," she
said.
I did as I was told. There was a faint, oh so faint coolness on my
hand. I looked round to see if there could be a draft coming from
anywhere, but there was no air conditioning and the windows were
closed.
"You feel it?"
I nodded, tentatively.
"That is the beginning. Perhaps while you were drinking your tea
you said to yourself `I'd like that experience,' and..." Shri
Mataji snapped her fingers,"...you got it. It can only happen if
you desire it. Give me your hand."
She took my hand and started tracing a cross over the palm.
"You think too much," she said. "Your mind is busy, busy, busy,
thinking away."
From that moment on it wasn't. It was hardly thinking at all.
"Too much thinking can give people diabetes. It is not sugar that
causes diabetes, it's thinking. We can cure diabetes. After
realization. And this new thing AIDS. After realization we can cure
that too. With realization you become your own guru. You can
diagnose your own problems and those of others, and you can cure
them. Anybody with their realization and the desire to develop
their spirit, can cure and be cured."
At this point a wave of most pleasant well-being swept over me. It
wasn't a trance or a hypnotic state (I've experienced those) - it
was a feeling of deep peace.
I regretted my next question. It caused the smile to fade from Shri
Mataji's face. "How much are you going to charge Americans for this
experience?"
"It is part of evolution," she replied. "It is a gift of love from
God, who is the ocean of love, the ocean of compassion. How can you
pay for that? God does not understand money. How can you pay for
your evolution? Did you pay to stand up on two legs? Anyway, why
would I want money? I come from a wealthy family. My husband is
Secretary General of the United Nations International Maritime
Organization here in London. I do not need money. I do not accept
money."
Shri Mataji let go of my hand and smiled.
"Better now?" she asked.
I nodded.
"That is because your brain is not so active. You are more
balanced, more centered, more relaxed. Have some more tea?"
I put my hand above my head again. The coolness was still there.
Perhaps even stronger.
"There are so many great seekers in North America," she said. "I so
want to meet them."
Now, almost a week later, when I sit down quietly, that sense of
peace and relaxed happiness returns. I am hoping it won't go away.
|
| 401.181 | Meditation Course Offered | PACKER::HANDY | | Mon Jun 03 1991 13:08 | 22 |
|
Sahaja Yoga invites you to free lecture and meditation sessions:
For a seed to sprout, you cannot pay. Simply put it in the earth
and it happens. Same with the Yoga state. In the proper environment
Yoga triggers itself effortlesly and flows as a joyful cool breeze
through your nervous system.
Nothing to buy, nothing to read,
Just get it, enjoy it, and master your life.
Find out at our next Sahaja Yoga meditation course.
Begins Monday June 3 and seven consecutive Mondays at
the Hunt Recreation Center: 90 Stow Street, Concord, Ma.
at 8:30 pm. For more information call 508-369-7790.
( You cannot pay for what is your birthright.)
|
| 401.182 | Europe 1991 ? | GENIE::MORRIS | | Tue Jul 23 1991 10:09 | 5 |
| Are there any plans for a program in Europe this year. I would be
interested in going along.
Chris..
|
| 401.183 | Workshop coming to Hudson | PACKER::HANDY | | Tue Jan 28 1992 10:52 | 13 |
|
Hello All,
I would like to announce an introductory workshop for
Sahaja Yoga.
It will be held WED. FEB. 5th at 7:30pm
At the Alchemist Health Food Store on Rt# 85 in Hudson, Ma.
If there is interest it is possible to schedual follow up meetings
there as long as people are interested.
The meeting is down stairs in the new room.
Peace,
Howard
|
| 401.184 | Sahaja Yoga - excellent! | TNPUBS::PAINTER | let there be music | Fri Feb 07 1992 17:07 | 36 |
|
RE: the Sahaja Yoga workshop in .183
I attended the workshop, and would like to thank Howard and the
other Sahaja practitioners VERY much for their time and their efforts!
Sahaja Yoga is what it says it is. I recommend it to everyone here.
The techniques are very simple, and I've begun using a few of them
already with good success.
I plan on writing up a trip report to provide additional details about
the workshop and my own experience. Stay tuned!
Did I feel the 'cool breeze'? No. In the room itself, I could not
distinguish between the room temp. which kept fluxuating due to space
heaters, the thermal temperature of my hand, and the presense of the
'cool breeze', so if there was a cool breeze above my head, I couldn't
detect it...that, and I had some major energy blocks which didn't help
either. I did experience some profound energy shifts though, and the
migraine I walked in with was totally gone by the time I left, thanks
to one very kind Sahaja woman who took the time and worked on my 6th
chakra and helped to balance my right side. I also slept better than I
have in a very long time...probably since my last trip to Kripalu. (;^)
Instant realization? For me, no. I've had shakti-kundalini experiences
before, and have also experienced the same energy while at Kripalu,
particularly in the presense of Gurudev, so this wasn't new to me
either. So it is from this perspective that I'll write up the trip
report.
However, I'm very impressed with the simplicity of the techniques,
and I believe that Sri Mataji is who she says she is. The Sahaja
people are doing some great work!
Cindy
|
| 401.185 | Ready to look further | ESMAIL::ESOMS | Trusting in the Universe | Wed Feb 26 1992 15:55 | 13 |
|
Cindy,
Thank you for writing about your experience. I have been
intersted in Sahaja Yoga since reading about it in here and
would like to attend a session, but was a bit nervous because
of the enthusiasm exhibited in this note.
If there's another session, please let me know. I would
like to explore it a bit more.
Thanks,
Joanne
|
| 401.186 | Sahaja Workshop Trip Report | TNPUBS::PAINTER | let there be music | Wed Feb 26 1992 18:45 | 172 |
|
Re.-1
Thanks for the reminder to write a full report, Joanne!
Continuing on...
Many thanks go to Howard and the other Sahaja yogis who presented the
workshop! I really appreciated their time and efforts.
The Sahaja workshop was held in the downstairs of The Alchemist in
Hudson, Mass. There were 8 of us total - half being Sahaja yogis,
and the rest of us being novices.
Side note: I went in with somewhat of a nagging migraine headache
with the pain focused primarily at the 3rd eye/6th chakra.
I've suffered from common migraines most of my life, and
take preventative medicine with good success, however
eventually I'd like to stop taking the medicine and find
a natural way of alleviating/preventing them.
Back to the workshop...
Howard presented a full-size diagram model of how the kundalini
flow works in the body. He talked about it for about 15-20 minutes,
and did a very nice job. It was similar to other models I've read
about, particularly in "The Body Of Light", by Lar and Short.
There was a picture of Sri Mataji with a candle present - very
traditional - there are pictures present of the various gurus and
their gurus at both the Self-Realization Fellowship (SRF), the group
that Yogananda founded, and also at Kripalu Center.
We watched a videotape of Sri Mataji herself holding a workshop for
some people at the United Nations. While watching, we also followed
her instructions for unblocking our chakras and getting the kundalini
to flow. It was quite simple.
To summarize the exercise...we sat with shoes off, left hand palm up
on the left knee toward her picture, and used the right hand to focus
in on 7 (or so) different centers - lower left abdomen, upper left
abdomen, heart, left neck/shoulder, forehead, back of neck/head, and
crown chakra. While at each center, we also said the equivalent of
affirmations focused in on alleviating guilt and offering forgiveness).
Then we checked for the 'cool breeze' at the tops of our heads. One
fellow had success. I didn't, but also knew that my centers were
fairly well blocked, especially the 6th one (migraine pain). I did
feel the shakti energy present - it feels to me like when you're in
a situation where the hair on you stands on end...except in this case
the environment didn't change. I experienced this same sensation
back in September while Yogi Amrit Desai was doing his yogic posture
flow. While at Kripalu, it was primarily on my arms and heart area.
During the Sahaja workshop, it was up the back of my spine.
Then the other Sahaja yogis worked on us individually to alleviate
some of the blocks and raise the kundalini. The person who assisted me
first worked from the back on those chakras. I really felt her mani-
pulating the energy, and the subsequent flow. While she was working on
each 'side (left and right), suddenly when she worked on the right, my
right hand became bright red...and according to their model this meant
a block on the right side. Using a sweeping technique, she unblocked
that, and my hand color went back to normal.
Then she focused on my 6th front and back ones, using a technique similar
to one that I'd once read about while looking through Ro Flaherty's
library (;^). This took about 10-15 minutes or so.
One problem with the room was that the temperature was fluxuating due
to electric space heaters. So even after the yogi completed their work
on us, I still couldn't be sure if the 'cool breeze' I was feeling was
the thermal temperature of the room, my own hands (which tend to get
cold anyway), or the 'cool breeze' of kundalini flowing properly.
However, I was *extremely* aware of my surroundings in a way that I hadn't
been since doing the Vivation technique last (first done at Kripalu last
July). Also, my migraine was completely gone, and I had all SORTS of
energy! (;^) I slept extremely well that night too...and sleep is
difficult for me most of the time.
The next day I woke up at 7am and bounced out of bed. For anyone who
knows me here, this is a miracle in and of itself! The tech. writing
class I was in for 8 months last year gave me a button which read,
"Not a morning person doesn't even begin to cover it!" And I was voted
"most likely to be the last one to arrive at class" on any given day.
This state lasted for about 2 days, but then the blocks started to come
back. I've since met with Howard, and with his assistance have begun
doing Sahaja Yoga meditation for 30 minutes every night. It's been almost
a week now, and I'm beginning to notice definite results. The meditation,
briefly, consists of sitting in front of a picture of Sri Mataji with a
candle, some energy-sweeping and kundalini-raising movements, along with
soaking my feet in salt water (draw off negative energy) and a few other
things which are on my info. sheets at home at the moment.
When one works on one's blocks and manages to get them cleared over time,
one can use the Sahaja hand model to determine which chakra is blocked,
and then use the various techniques to unblock them. This information
about the techniques comes from one of the pamphlets...it isn't
automatically 'transferred' to the person by 'realization' (I wasn't quite
sure about how one got the knowledge back earlier in this note string as
it wasn't clear...and now I know that it is actually taught/presented at
the Sahaja workshops). I'm not that sensitive yet, however I'm progressing.
I plan on attending one of the Sahaja local group meditations on a semi-
regular basis, time permitting, and will keep you posted.
Parting thoughts...
What I really am impressed with is that Sahaja Yoga is free. The literature
and a few pictures of Sri Mataji, along with the time that the yogis gave
to assist the rest of us, was provided all without charge.
What I'm not impressed with is the rather fundamentalistic approach that the
yogis both in this note string and even at the session have...that this is
the One True Way, and that all other paths (even yogic paths) are probably
wrong. Because of this approach, I feel that those who are Sahaja yogis
are doing a disservice to those who are not, simply by turning others off
due to this approach. I know I have been less than willing to try this
path until now, even having been exposed to several other yogic paths over
this last year and a half.
A while back in this note string, I mentioned that I was practicing Kripalu
Yoga, and one of the Sahaja yogis replied that I couldn't really compare
Kripalu with Sahaja until I'd tried it myself. He was correct.
But now I have. (;^) And I still believe that they lead to the same place,
just the methods are different.
Unlike Sahaja, Yogi Amrit Desai (founder of Kripalu Yoga), when asked which
meditation technique is the best one, he replied that it is the technique
you practice with dedication and consistancy. Therefore, I can practice
Sahaja meditation at Kripalu, chant japa with the Kripalu mantra at the
Self-Realization Fellowship meditations in W.Newton that I attend on occasion,
and practice Kripalu Yoga before doing Sahaja meditation at home.
There is no conflict. True Gurus are not jealous of one another. 0(;^)
The word 'guru', in Sanskrit, means "dispellar of darkness".
This isn't to say there aren't fake gurus running around in the world,
because there certainly are, however Yogi Desai and Yogananda, like Sri
Mataji, are not among them.
I can understand the response that one might have to a Guru who has assisted
them in awakening their own inner awareness. This happened to me during
my first shakti experience just over 4 years ago, and it transformed my life.
It was a mind-blowing experience in the literal sense.
The shakti transfer, however, happened while in the presense of a dear friend
and not an 'official' guru, so I could not attribute it to anything organized
and go off proclaiming that it was the "One True Way" (this also happens in
the organized religions and even channeled entity circles). So in this way,
I can be more objective when it comes to the various paths. I've since had
similar shakti experiences while at Kripalu, while reading some of Yogananda's
works, and most recently at the Sahaja workshop. At the same time though,
I respect the gratitude that all show toward their guru, as I feel similarly
about my friend. However, all legitimate paths have things to offer, and it
is important not to become closed to the other legit ways in the process.
To those who are considering it, I encourage you to give Sahaja yoga a try.
There may be a meditation group or a workshop in the area you are living in.
If you're interested, post a note here and perhaps Howard can supply further
information for us.
To those unfamilar with some of the yoga-specific practices and terms and
would like to understand more before considering attending a workshop, I'm
happy to go into greater detail here.
Jai Bhagwan, {Sanskrit for "I honor the Light within you."}
Cindy
|
| 401.187 | I'd like to find out more | ESMAIL::ESOMS | Trusting in the Universe | Wed Feb 26 1992 19:42 | 15 |
| Howard,
I would like to know more about the workshops and if any are
coming up. Maybe we can get a few people from here to attend
too.
Cindy,
I was reluctant to consider this because of some the the things
you mentioned. Only because you took the first step and because
of the wonderful experiences you've been having, was I even
confortable with thinking of checking it out further. Thank you
for your reports.
Joanne
|
| 401.188 | The local group meets in Worcester | SUBPAC::HANDY | | Thu Feb 27 1992 07:58 | 55 |
| Dear Friends,
There is a free Sahaja Yoga Meditation Workshop Weekly.
This meditation I have personally found to be very deep and
dynamic. Absolutely a beautiful experience. Open to all and free.
Peace,
Howard
The Worcester meeting is at :
An Apple A Day Care Center
18 Oxford Street
Worcester, Mass
Tel: (508)-755-0030 or (508)-829-6433
Every Tuesday from 7:30pm to 9:30
Direction: From 290 High Way West bound, take exit 18 at light turn
right into Lincoln St. bear right into Concord St. At light,
continue straight into Salisbury St. Pass Worcester Art
Museum turn left into Lancaster St. About 1 mile at Chatham
St. turn right. Turn right into Oxford St.
#18 will be on your right with parking lot available.
I feel one note about Cindy's reference to our/my repudiation of false
Gurus. This is not something that anyone Says. The Kundalini itself
being a living intelligent energy, Can and will show anyone who can
feel it, the truth about anything. So there is noone standing around
telling anyone what to think, It is through each individual seeker
asking the kundalini about different things, then it is up to the
individual to decide. The one thing we say about guru's is according
to Shankariacharia three things point out the real one.
1. No money whatsoever.
2. That they are of highest spiritual nature and can uplift
the seeker.
3. That they give one their OWN power. Make the individual their
own Master. Not just in their presence, but to have Absolute
freedom and peace all the time. This is through
Self-Realisation.
So to me our talking sometimes doesnt help people, It is all for one
to discover for oneself.
Hope to see all the seekers here,
Someday,
Howard
|
| 401.189 | add'l | TNPUBS::PAINTER | let there be music | Thu Feb 27 1992 11:35 | 52 |
|
Re.188
Hi Howard,
Thanks for posting the information about the Worcester group! I hope
to join them when my choral rehearsals are over with in May.
About various gurus, given your list of criteria to judge who is a true
guru and who is not - the two other lineages I write of fulfill what is
on the list, except for money. However, both groups are non-profit,
and have been around for several decades each now without scandal or
even a hint of scandal when it comes to where the money goes.
The 'realization'/shakti is free. As you say, you cannot buy that.
And in both organizations, provisions are made for those who cannot
afford either the SRF home study lessons. You can also attend the SRF
meditation group meetings without charge, and all of the books that the
SRF sells are priced far below the going rates for paperback and
hardcover editions. There is also one difference between Sahaja and
the SRF in that the founder Yogananda is no longer in the body.
At Kripalu, scholarships are granted for people to attend Kripalu
programs that otherwise would not be able to do so. Kripalu also has
a seva/service exchange program where you can stay for free in return
for volunteering to assist at the ashram doing things like grounds
maintenance, kitchen duties, and so on. This includes being in
Gurudev's presense if he is in residence as opposed to being on tour.
The purposes of the SRF and of Kripalu are different from Sahaja. Sri
Mataji is not establishing ashrams - places where people can go to
benefit directly from the spiritual lifestyle. Ashrams cost a lot more
to maintain (building, heat, food, etc.) than someone who is only
on tour holding seminars. Kripalu accomodates approximately 12,000
guests per year.
Granted, this intellectual comparison between the three groups, however
behind this I am speaking from my own very positive shakti experiences
with both groups as well. If, after practicing Sahaja yoga for a time,
I find a conflict with what I've written here about the organizations,
I will post it here as well.
Howard, in my earlier note, I wasn't referring to anything you had said
about other gurus, but rather other Sahaja yogis here and at the workshop
who had made passing comments that I didn't feel were based on their own
inner experience. For example, one fellow mentioned that he heard *from
a friend* that Kripalu was something to steer clear of...and that to me
did not feel like he had checked it out himself directly via kundalini,
much less applied the criteria you listed. Nor was he interested in
even talking about Kripalu with me. However, I could be wrong.
Cindy
|
| 401.190 | Next Sahaja Yoga Program | SUBPAC::HANDY | | Fri Feb 28 1992 12:03 | 21 |
|
Dear All,
There is a public program being offered presenting Sahaja Yoga.
March 8th at 3:pm. Cambridge, Ma. In Harvard Yard at the Boyleston
Hall. When you enter the yard from cambridge square if you proceed to
the interior of the yard Boyleston Hall is on the right. Facing the
yard. There is an Auditorium inside.
There will be an introductory talk about Sahaja Yoga given by
Gregoire DeCalbermarten. He is a UN diplomat and has travelled
extensively with Shri Mataji for over 15 years. His knowledge of
Yoga and the depth of his personality are to be enjoyed.
As allways this program is free and open to all. After the intro.
the experience of Self-Realisation is offered to all. It is not
something you can study for or practise, you must be there to have
the Kundalini awakened. Then one can practise Meditation.
Hope to see you all there,
Peace
Howard
|
| 401.191 | Also in Europe | VNABRW::EICHERT | Helmut Eichert, Linz | Mon Mar 02 1992 12:28 | 8 |
| Anyone from Europe around ?
There is also programs in various countries here in Europe. If you are
interested please send me a mail. A complete list would be too long to
type.
Love to all seekers,
Helmut
|
| 401.192 | More on Sahaja | TNPUBS::PAINTER | let there be music | Thu Mar 05 1992 12:49 | 27 |
|
Update on my Sahaja practices...
Last week I attended the regular gathering in Concord, and two of the
people from the Alchemist gathering in Hudson were there. We watched a
video on Sri Mataji going into detail on the 6th chakra, and from my
own experiences, readings, etc., she was right on. I gained a lot of
additional insights from it as well.
Then we went through the unblocking of the chakras exercise (though
there is probably a better word for it). Just after the exercise,
which takes about 10-15 minutes, the more experienced yogis again
worked on those of us who are less experienced, and they assisted
each other as well.
I still can't say I feel the 'cool breeze' on the outside of my body,
however from the sessions and my own practicing some of the basic
techniques at home, I feel a definite cool sensation in my 6th and 7th
chakras. It is like someone breaks a bubble filled with slow-moving
cool liquid at the top of my head, and it pours slowly down just on the
outside and also on the inside. It feels wonderful, as the migraines
I've had most of my life have always been accompanied by a lot of heat,
and they're very uncomfortable. I've used ice packs for many years to
alleviate the pain, and now the Sahaja techniques are doing a great job.
Can't wait to tell my neurologist about this one! (;^)
Cindy
|
| 401.193 | Shri Mataji visiting North America in October | GVPROD::PHILIP | Phil Ward, Mgmt. Sci. @GEO | Tue Sep 28 1993 08:30 | 82 |
|
SHRI MATAJI TO TOUR NORTH AMERICA
---------------------------------
Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi, founder of Sahaja Yoga, will be
touring the U.S. and Canada during October. She will be offering
free lectures on self-realization and the "Sahaja Yoga experience."
Her itinerary includes visits to New York, Toronto, Vancouver,
Philadelphia, Los Angeles, and Washington D.C.
Shri Mataji believes that world peace and collective
consciousness can be achieved only through the inner transformation
of human beings. Her system of meditation, Sahaja Yoga, manifests a
subtle energy. This is experienced as vibrations which are felt on
the central nervous system and lead to greater awareness and deeper
intuition. Rather than requiring a "leap of faith," it is an actual
experience of the integration of our physical, mental, emotional,
and spiritual being. It thus brings about complete balance and
inner peace. By bringing together people of all religious, ethnic,
and social backgrounds, she has proven that the human bond is more
than skin deep and that all ideologies are encompassed by the same
universal values and truths.
PUBLIC PROGRAM SCHEDULE
-----------------------
(For information on the location and
time, please call the information numbers)
New York:
Monday, October 4th
United Nations
U.N. Personnel only
Saturday, October 16th
Public Program in New York
Info: (914) 636-4406
Toronto:
Tuesday, October 5th.
Info: (416) 614-9521 or (416) 614-7338
Vancouver:
Thursday, October 7th, 7:30 pm.
Robson Square Media Center
Info: (604) 850-7475 or (604) 261-0203
Los Angeles:
Monday, October 11th.
Info: (818) 344-9642
Washington DC:
Thursday, OCtober 14th.
Info: (301) 656-0675
Philadelphia:
Friday, October 15th
Harrison Auditorium,
Museum of the University of Pennsylvania,
33rd & Spruce Streets, Philadelphia.
Info: (215) 622-7985
A l l P r o g r a m s A r e F r e e
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
For more information about these upcoming programs or Sahaja
Yoga in general, call the local information numbers given above or
1-800-745-YOGA.
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| 401.194 | for the next tour... | TNPUBS::PAINTER | remembering Amber | Tue Sep 28 1993 14:27 | 7 |
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Phil,
If you have any way of making this request known, it would be wonderful
if Shri Mataji could visit the Boston area at some point.
Cindy
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| 401.195 | SAHAJA YOGA leads wanted.. | COPCLU::PEHANSEN | | Fri Oct 15 1993 09:21 | 13 |
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Hi.....
I am interested in an address here in Denmark that teaches Sahaja Yoga,
and I would also be very interested in a description of the practice as
mentioned i .0.....
I hope there are still someone listening out there, even if this note is
several years old.
Regards,
Paul-Erik
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| 401.196 | response | TNPUBS::PAINTER | remembering Amber | Fri Oct 15 1993 15:02 | 8 |
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Hi Paul-Erik,
If you don't get a response from a Sahaja yogi offline or online here,
send me mail and I can make contact for you via some of the yogis I
know outside of Digital.
Cindy
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| 401.197 | Moving On | GVPROD::PHILIP | Phil Ward, Mgmt. Sci. @GEO | Fri Jan 28 1994 09:36 | 22 |
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Dear everyone,
As I shall be leaving Digital at the end of this month, please
send any requests for information about Sahaja Yoga to any of the
following:
Chris Kyriacou @SNO
Laurent Dumonet @RTO
Howard Handy @HLO
Manfred Ringhofer @AUI
(I'll be back on Internet via CompuServe shortly, all being
well.)
I should take this opportunity to thank everyone in this
Conference for their friendly participation, and of course urge
everyone to try the divine gift of Sahaja Yoga for themselves!
All the best
Phil
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