Conference hydra::dejavu

    I'm probably the someone you are thinking of.  I don't know quite how
    karma is served.  I know of one other person who is part of a split
    soul.  We were discussing this one day, what we have been able to
    remember and/or be regressed into remembering, and in both our cases,
    it was caused by someone or a group of very powerful person(s)
    deliberately trying to destroy us.  In her case, she was powerful
    enough to make several people afraid of her - they had to do something
    take her down, although she was not abusing her power.  In my case, I
    tried to stop someone from doing harm, and he needed me out of his
    way.              
    
    Hope this helps...
    
    Elizabeth
    

    Is splitting the same as twin souls or soulmates? My hazy understanding
    of these is that we ALL have a twin soul, who may or may not incarnate
    at the same time as us, we may meet them in this lifetime, we may
    not ....Jane Roberts' twin soul was Seth
    
    Teresa

    In the Egyptian (Khemite) religion, each person had a soul and a
    soul-double.  The soul departed a body, which was visited periodically
    by the soul-double after death.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.
    

    Not quite.  Someone with whom you have split souls is either in
    any given respect either the same as you, or the opposite.  This
    often does not make for a good relationship, as you would expect
    from soulmates.  A person can have quite a few soulmates, with whom
    she has spent several or many lifetimes.  These are kind of like
    friends whose friendship lasts more than a lifetime.
    
    Elizabeth

    
    re .3
    
    Steve, are you speaking of the _ka_ and the _ba_? I may have to
    unbox a few reference books...
    
    -Perry
    

    Re .4:
    
    Yes.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.

    
    What exactly IS a soulmate, and how would you know you had one??
    
    -renee.

    It doesn't go into a whole lot of detail about the soul-splitting
    soul-rejoining concept, but I found the most comprehensive work
    on soulmates to be "The Bridge Across Forever" by Richard Bach (the
    same guy who wrote Jonathan Livingston Seagull and Illusions).
    
    -Jody
    

 Soul-splitting?
 I was a twin at birth, but my little friend, didn't completely develope
and died before he/she was born.  But,I feel I will link up with them at
some point in this life...Could this be possible?



Soulmates are terrrific.

  A friend or lover that you feel connected with emotionally/spiritually.
someone with whom you feel their happiness is more important than your own.
By making them happy, you become happier.  Its the closest thing to 
unconditional love I've ever felt....Its also a warm feeling inside *just*
because you know they are there. How do you know when you meet one?
Well, you feel like you already know them and automatically like them.
Atleast this has been my experiences.  I also read that you hang around
with the same group each carnation, thou they may change sexes and places?

    
    The definition of a soulmate that I've been told and that I agree
    with is at the initial time of incarnation the soul became polarized
    and split into to souls, one yin, one yang.  You can only have 1
    soul mate.  He/She is your "other half".
    
    There is also something called Twin-rays.  Twin-rays are people
    who have at least 4 of the 7 bodies of consciousness in alignment.
    
    Linda
    

    re: .10 (Linda)
    
    	This is the first time I've heard mention of Twin-Rays.  Any 
    	other information you can provide would be much appreciated!
    
    	Am honestly surprised this topic hasn't taken off more than 
    	this, but attribute it to the fact that (I feel) a Soulmate 
    	and one's relationship with him/her is the ultimate in Things 
    	Personal, a relationship extremely intense and even more so
    	private.  Especially if only one of the two is aware of the
    	connection.
    
    	Wonder which is more difficult to deal with--knowing who your
    	Soulmate is and being able to see him/her regularly without
    	possessing present ability to incorporate him/her into your 
    	day-to-day life, or having no idea who he/she is and living 
    	in a state of blissful unawareness?

    						Carla
    

    
    To go into twin-rays further, I need to mention what the 7 bodies
    or vehicles of consciousness are:
    
    	1) The Physical Body		5) The Monadic Body
    	2) The Emotional Body		6) The Vibrational Body
    	3) The Intellectual Body	7) The Astral Body
    	4) The Spiritual Body
    
    To be a twin-ray the person would have to have at least 4 of the
    7 bodies in alignment (or atunement) with yours.
    
    You can have more than 1 twin-ray.  You can have a twin-ray that
    is not involved with you in a physical relationship (in which case the
    physical body is not one of the bodies in alignment with yours,
    4 other bodies are).
    
    A soul-mate may have NO bodies in alignment with you.  Hopefully
    your soul-mate at least has the physical body in alignment if you
    wish that type of relationship with your soul-mate.  Twin-ray
    relationships (romantically speaking) can actually be better (easier)
    than a relationship with your soul-mate if your soul-mate is not
    a twin-ray with you (i.e. less than 4 bodies in alignment).
    
    Linda

    How do yin/yang soulmate advocates explain homosexuality?
    
    
    
    John M.

    re: .13
    
    Very Easily....
    
    First of all, Yin/Yang refers to male/female characteristics, not
    genitalia.  Everyone has yin and yang characteristics.  The trick
    is to try and maintain a balance of the yin with the yang within
    yourself.
    
    In a relationship that is harmonious, there also has to be a yin/yang
    balance.  (I.E. If both people try to "wear the pants" - yang -
    in a situation, there will be arguments, problems).  It does not matter
    what the external sex organs are in a harmonious relationship.  In
    order to have a harmonious relationship, for a given situation one
    person should be the yin counterpart, the other the yang counterpart.
    
    Soulmates can incarnate as the same sex.  It all depends on their
    karmic situation, what the individuals are to learn in this life,
    and what the individuals are to learn within the relationship. 

    Linda

    RE: .14 (Linda)
    
    >   It all depends on their karmic situation, what the individuals are
    to learn in this life, and what the individuals are to learn within the
    relationship.  <
    
    
    To what end?
    
    John M. 
    

    RE: .15
    
    >   It all depends on their karmic situation, what the individuals
    are to learn in this life, and what the individuals are to learn within
    the relationship.  <
     
     
    > To what end?  <
    
    	If one believes in reincarnation and that as one reincarnates
    each time in order to reach a higher understanding of one's self
    or the whole, then one must have a reason to reach a higher under-
    standing.  
    	Such as it may be or have been that in one life an individual
    lacked understanding or acceptance of other individuals because
    of their beliefs, race, religion, cause, or in the case as mentioned
    in .13, then it may be in the next life this entity may reincarnate
    into exactly that form to which they could not cope in a previous
    life.  
         In this manner they may gain a greater understanding of the
    other existences that they themself had a problem with in the past.
    Now they may find themselves living the same existence, experiencing
    the same persecution by others such as that that they may have been
    a part of in a past life.  They may begin to see and understand
    that the reasons why certain entities exist in certain plains can
    be many.  They may be by choice, by their upbringing, by influence,
    by some unknown cause, by lack of understanding, or by desire.
         Regardless of ther reasons behind one's pattern in life or
    devotion to cause, to each his own, for one only has to find
    satisfaction in our own cause, whatever it may be.  The reach one's
    higher self, once must reach an understanding that each other entity
    that they come across in this existence at least deserves the right
    to their own beliefs regardless of politics, race, sexual preference,
    religion, etc.
         If you choose not to agree with anothers beliefs then this
    is fine.  Again you have a right to your own beliefs, but you should
    not persecute others for theirs or you may find yourself in their
    shoes at another time and in another place!
    
    ****Learn in this life, or learn the hard way in the next******
    
    

    
    Re.16 (Entler)
    
    That was superb!
    
    Reading recommendation - "Androgyny", by June Singer.  She was a
    student at the Jung school in Switzerland, and this book received
    an excellent reviews from many people, including Joseph Campbell.
    I'm only partway through and don't recall reincarnation being addressed
    specifically, however it does present some new ideas in this area.
    If anyone wants to see the table of contents, I'd be happy to bring
    in the book and post that information here.     
    
    Cindy                                      

    
    Re. 16 (Entler)
    
    That was great!  I couldn't have said it better myself!!!
    
    Ditto...
    
    Linda

    re: .9
    
    _Wow_! Thank you, this explains mine and my SO's relationship to
    a T. Also my best friend and I, who haven't seen each other in about
    two years, but still are extremely close. (she lives on the west
    coast and I in Ma!)
    
    When I met my SO, I was a confirmed Man-hater. They all did me wrong
    so the hell with them!! Then HE walked in and it was just like you
    just explained!! All the other guys I had had "relationships" with
    (and I use that term loosely!) were always a struggle, a feeling
    of constant insecurity. Not this one, I think of him and get
    unexplainable chills all over. I thought it was _just_ love, but
    now that I've read on I know it's much more. I'll think something
    without saying it and he'll say it!! I always wondered what the
    term for that was!!
    
    Thank you again!!
    -renee.
    
    p.s.
    HAPPY SECRETARIES DAY!!! :^)

    RE: .16
    
    Well written.  But what is the supposed goal of all of this
    "perfection?"  And why do spirits not start off perfect from the
    very beginning and save all the trouble?
    
    
    John M.

    RE: .20
    
    > Well written.  But what is the supposed goal of all of this
     "perfection?"  And why do spirits not start off perfect from the
     very beginning and save all the trouble?  <
    
    	Let me answer the second question first.  Life is a learning
    experience, thus as we learn of our imperfections and reconize them
    then we become more perfect as you may put it, I would prefer to
    say more knowledgeable and understanding of what goes on around
    me.  
    	As a young child, growing and learning about life as we grow
    older, just how much would you learn if everything was given to
    you on a "silver platter".  No matter what you did wrong or even
    right, no one was ever there to tell you.  When you finally reach
    the age of 18 or 21 or whatever is acceptable in your place in society
    to move out and be on your own, do you think you would be ready
    to cope with life, with your neigbors, with other entities?  I very
    much doubt it!                
    	I don't know about you, but if everyone and everything was perfect
    from the beginning, life would be very boring, there would be no
    surprises.  There would be no need to make an effort to move forward,
    but rather we could become stagnate on one plane of existence.
    	Then "What is the supposed goal of all of this PERFECTION?"
    To reach a greater understanding of your relationship to other
    entities.  Being accepting of the many different existences that
    are possible.  Acknowledging that material items carry no real value
    personally unless perhaps you use them to help others less fortunate
    than yourself.  Eventually a greater understanding of yourself and
    your growing need to expand your innermost thoughts.  Moving forward,
    progressing to higher levels of existence, becoming a greater part
    of the whole!
    	The goal to reach a point of understanding that everything you
    do and say has an effect on others around you and the overall purpose
    to use your words or thoughts depending on your plane of existence
    in a positive helpful manner!
    
    	(DO YOU REALLY WANT TO STAY WHERE YOU ARE TODAY FOREVER?)

    
    Well, being a vegetarian in California probably isn't all that bad 
    of a life.  For some.
    
    Pity though, that John is probably going to wake up one day just
    like Woody Allen did in "Sleeper" and find out that sugar and
    preservatives are on the path to true enlightenment (right up there
    with the Orgasmatron - a replacement for those who write shopping
    lists or lie there and think of England), and truly discover what
    he was missing for all those years back in the 1980's.
    
    Cindy
                        

    re: 11
    
    Carla,
    
    Not knowing...;->
    
    TL

    re: .23 (Tade)
    
    	See you in mail over this one, my love...
    
    					Carla
    

RE: .21
    
    >	I don't know about you, but if everyone and everything was perfect
    from the beginning, life would be very boring, there would be no
    surprises.  There would be no need to make an effort to move forward,
    but rather we could become stagnate on one plane of existence. < 
    
    
    I disagree.  All that is required is a system where perfection is
    satisfying.  If perfection were a natural part of life, you, as
    a creature operating under its constraints, would find it the normal
    way to be.  Imagine a perfect being discussing OUR lives and remarking,
    "Wouldn't it be a bitch to go through all that?"
    
    Birds are born knowing how to fly south.  They attain their goal
    without having to study it.  Flying south in the winter is of supreme
    importance to a bird, so nature has chosen to give it the knowledge
    it needs without having to waste precious time learning to fly south.
    By the same token, if the supposed spiritual perfection were the
    supreme goal of humankind, why wouldn't we just be BORN that way?
    If it's really that important, it should just be there; like an
    instinct.
    
    Forgive me, but I still don't see the point in all this supposed
    "learning."  Once you reach perfection, you will be perfect forever,
    right?  So what's to stop you from getting bored then?  Anyway,
    infinity is infinity.  It really doesn't matter if an entity who
    has been perfect for 50 trillion years was born that way or not.
           
    
    > (DO YOU REALLY WANT TO STAY WHERE YOU ARE TODAY FOREVER?) < 
    
    Regardless of my wishes, the Grim Reaper has the last word.
    
    
    John M.
                                                                  

    RE: .22
    
    Er...Cindy, I'm a vegetarian in *Seattle* (although I come from
    sunny CA).
    
    
    John M.

    RE:  .25
    
    > Forgive me, but I still don't see the point in all this supposed
     "learning."  Once you reach perfection, you will be perfect forever,
     right?  So what's to stop you from getting bored then?  <
    
    	Well, John, first let me apoligize for not being clear.  I was
    rushed during that reply with calls and was not satisfied when it
    when I logged off.
    
    	The whole purpose is to develop yourself spiritually with the
    hope of reaching a greater understanding that you are only a part
    of a greater entity or force in the universe.  Each persons actions
    affects others around them.  Just as beating on a drum affects the
    molecules in the air and are eventually passed across great distances
    to someones ear as the sound of beating on a drum.
    	Even your replies to me and many others throughout this conference
    has a great effect on others.  I am coerced into responding to your
    replies by your lack of understanding and repeated questions regarding
    the subject at hand.  Even though we may not agree with each other,
    the end result is that we are affecting others that are taking the
    time to read these notes, and in some cases responding.  They may
    add value to the subject matter, perhaps doing a better job of
    clarifying the topic then either of us may be capable of!
    	
    >So what is the point of all of this learning?  Once you reach
    perfection, what's to stop you from getting bored!<
    
    	The point of all of this learning, is that you will gain more
    knowledge and understanding of the things around you.  Since we
    all do not learn at the same speed and it may take us several
    reincarnations to reach specific goals in our spiritual development
    then those who have already reached those levels may become teachers
    helping others to understand and grow spiritually.
    
    	Unless everyone were to reach perfection at the same time, then
    the universe will never be perfect.  Again I don't like that word
    [PERFECT] for it is only perfect in the eye of the beholder.  What
    may appear perfect today, may be improved tomorrow thus being more
    perfect, IMPROVED, the development may continue forever to new levels,
    such as within yourself on the spiritual plane.  Since others will
    not reach perfection at the same time, then all is not perfect!
    Then it may be up to you to help them achieve perfection on certain
    planes.  Others still on higher planes above you may help/teach
    you the knowledge and understanding to reach upper levels.
                                                              
    	Last you mention of the Grim Reeper having the last word!  Not
    unless you do not believe in life after death!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    Dan
    
    	

    What happens to a soul who does not wish to learn? For if
    all this is learning process that one MUST go through - where
    does free choice enter into this. If a soul chooses not to
    endure a teaching process then it seems to be punished for
    this choice by being subjected to more and more difficult
    lessons until in the end it submits.
    

    
    re: .9
    
    Thanks, this explains our relationship to a T.     

    When I met my Sue, I was going through a divorce and really was not 
    interested in trying to build another close relationship. Then WE met 
    and it was just like you explained!!  It almost feels like we have always 
    been together and yet, at the same time, as if we just met.  We now are 
    married with 2 intelligent (keep'um on their toes types) children (boy - 5 
    and girl - 2) but it still feels like we only met yesterday.

    The best part is that I (we) am still learning from her (from each other).
    Its great.
    
    Thanks,
    
    peace

    re .27 NEXUS::ENTLER

�    	The whole purpose is to develop yourself spiritually with the
�    hope of reaching a greater understanding that you are only a part
�    of a greater entity or force in the universe.  

It seems to me that the goal is to *be aware of* how one fits in to the
universe, whatever that relationship may be.  I think that predefining 
the awareness to be gained as [any concept]   prejudices the outcome.


�                            ......  I am coerced into responding to your

I don't think one is coerced to do anything.  If one responds, one does
so by choice.


re .28 BPOV09::GROSSE                                        



�    What happens to a soul who does not wish to learn? For if
�    all this is learning process that one MUST go through - where
�    does free choice enter into this. If a soul chooses not to
�    endure a teaching process then it seems to be punished for
�    this choice by being subjected to more and more difficult
�    lessons until in the end it submits.

I think it is the choice of each individual.  At some level, one is 
always learning (something...).
If the choices that an individual makes points one in a direction
away from spiritual development, at some point the individual will 
get to make the same choice again (and again....).


My preferred definition of "perfection" is the process of being as
aware as one is capable of being at any particular instant.  I think that 
it is that awareness that leads to growth (greater awareness).


	bruce
    
                                                              

    
    RE: .28     Sorry about .30, terminal locked and ^c out, aborted
    message.
    
    RE: .28
    
    	I think you did quite well in answering your own question!
    
    > If a soul chooses not to endure a teaching process then it 
    seems to be punished for this choice by being subjected to more
    and more difficult lessons until in the end it submits. <
    
    	Isn't this true throughout life?  As a child when you did something
    wrong, your mother or father often repeated the word "NO".  At first
    it didn't make since to you, or perhaps have any affect.  Perhaps
    accompanied by a little slap on the rump or being picked up and
    put back in your playpin something eventually clicked and you began
    to realize that when you heard "NO", it meant to stop whatever you
    were doing.  You also got rewarded, they didn't slap you on the
    rump on put you back in the playpin!
    
    	In life, things are not always so simple.  There are many habitual
    criminals that either have never learnt or choose not to learn the
    acceptable paths that are open to them.  They will no doubt die
    without ever learning anything of value from there experience. 
    
    	"So what happens to them?"   These criminals may end up coming
    back in another life and become the victims of the vary type of
    crimes that they committed in their prior life!  Now they may pass
    on again, but having experience both sides of the issue.  Perhaps
    they may have learned what needed to be learned as the victim. Perhaps
    not.  It may be necessary again to return as a criminal and see
    if they reform after being identified as such.  If not then the
    process may be repeated, with variations, over and over again until
    this entity submits and becomes enlightened by experience!
    
    	I know that some of you might say, "GEEE, this could take forever!"
    For some it may, but what is time but something that we in the physical
    sense have made up to set our routines to.  On the Spiritual plane
    time, as we know it, may not exist.  
                         
    Dan

    
    Re: .28
    
    It is my understanding that a soul, prior to an incarnation, chooses
    or agrees to many factors of the up-coming life, factors such as parents,
    children, relationships, which karmic lessons to learn from in that life,
    etc.  So even if the soul refuses to learn all the karmic lessons of that
    life or creates more karma (which all of us have done or we wouldn't
    still be here...), it's still in the life-death-cycle and will have to work
    it out in the next life(s).  Since the soul created the karma in
    its life, it is up to that soul to work off their karma.  No one is
    punishing the soul, other than that soul.  It was the soul's free-will
    choice to create the karma, and it is the soul's free-will choice
    when and how it can be worked off.  That soul is totally responsible
    for its lives.

    Once all the karma has been worked out, then the soul will ascend
    to the next plane of existence, a plane of higher consciousness.
    
    Linda

    My understanding is quite close to Linda's in .28.  However, I've
    got a slightly different view of Karma; perhaps just one of the
    many different ways of looking at something.
    
    My understanding is that the soul decides, with the help of guides
    and advisors, on the lessons it wants to learn in an incarnation.
    Then, again wth help, a particular life is chosen that is likely
    to afford the opportunities to facilitate those lessons.  My
    understanding is that that life plan is called Karma.  It's not
    earned or assigned, but chosen by the spirit.
    
    Then once incarnated in human form, and with much of it's spiritual
    awareness tucked back and away in the unconscious, the spirit/human
    then proceeds along with it's life and it's lessons.

    It is (certainly) possible that the Karma or life plan won't be
    followed exactly, or that something is done that, upon later review,
    could use further study to understand fully. 
    
    After the physical body is shed, the spirit, along with advisors,
    reviews the events of the past incarnation.  The things that were done,
    not done, etc are analyzed and a new Karma/life plan developed.
    
    My understanding that once a lesson is finally learned, that the spirit
    may not necessarily have to spend extra incarnations trying to balance
    the ledger (so to speak).   After all, the idea is to learn, not to work
    off demerits, and expending incarnations in this manner would only serve
    to hinder progress.  
    
    
    The discussion on soul-splitting brings to mind a description I read of
    the relationship between God/{name-of-your-choice},higher selves
    and ourselves.
    
    In a nutshell, it was something like a large glowing sphere connected
    by gold cords to a multitude of smaller glowing spheres.  These
    smaller spheres were, in turn, connected by silver cords to a number
    of still smaller glowing spheres.
    
    The largest sphere was the source (God/{name-of-your-choice}).  The
    next smaller spheres were spirit entities that correspond with our
    higher self.  And, the next smaller spheres were the individual
    entities that were the various experiences that the higher self
    was engaged in (like an incarnate human or whatever).  Once the
    individual entity was developed, I believe that it, along with all
    it's experiences, were merged back with the higher self.  In turn,
    the same thing ultimately happens between the higher self and God.

    I believe that this description came from 'the Laz book' (Lazarus'
    'The sacred Journey', to the more formal ;-) )
    
    As a side comment, the ol' ego initially wasn't too pleased to learn
    that it was effectively a spawned subprocess!  :-) :-) 
    

    Kak

    re. .31 .32 .33 .34
    
    I am still confused on the matter of "free choice" as it seems
    that if Karma dictates what needs to be learned then the soul 
    has no choice but to choose situations that will teach this
    or that. I, personally, find it unsettling to think that there
    is no choice allowed in this matter. i.e. why can't a soul
    learn in between incarnations what it should have learned
    as a result from its former life and decided right then and
    there not to repeat the same errors and in doing so choose
    not to endure any further lessons in a next life as the
    soul in question "has learned" from the most recent life?
    
    I hope this question is less confusing than I am regarding
    this as it really concerns me to think that there is no
    free will to say enough is enough.
    
    cb
    

    RE: .34
    
    	I couldn't have said it better myself!
    
    Dan
    

    re: .35
    	Very good question.  I will try to complete the answer with
    what I understand.  Karma Impells it does not compel.  It does not
    dictate-it guides.   .34 was very well put.  probably not all lessons
    have to be learned on the physical plane but there are a few lessons
    tied to physical gratification that seems quite necessary to confront
    on the physical plane of existance.  I used to have the same question
    about Karma: if we never took that first step into physical life
    then we would never have to worry about negative or positive karma
    and learning lessons-until I realized that just by becoming soul
    entitiees separate from the God-force we are subjected to the influence
    of Karma.  I want to take this idea one-step furthur and say that
    we as souls separate from the god-force and eventually take on physical
    life so that we may gain in total self awareness which in turn
    increases total self-awareness of the God-force enabling "God" to
    grow in awareness.   I think that words attributed to "God" such
    as "omnipotent" ect are only labels provided by humans because of
    our limited understanding.  I want to remove the label and allow
    God to grow even beyond our vaguest understandings of what WE think
    the word omnipotent means.  
    	Gettinhg back to choice.  Not choosing to take on Karma is
    a choice.  And in its own way the act of "not choosing" prevents
    one from actively choosing to become aware and return to the
    God-force, which becomes a hell in its self.  When a soul takes
    on physical life, it can only determine if it actually learned the
    lesson by participation.  One can intellectualize whether a lesson
    is learned but to actually experience the situation is "proof of
    the pudding".
    
    	did I muddy it up any more or perchance lessen your confusion
    to any degree (I hope).
    
    

    I hate to wait in line. Any line. For any reason. No matter what
    line I choose, that's the one with the slowest checkout person.
    That's the register that needs new paper. That's the one where
    everybody is either writing a check or is overdrawn on their
    credit card of has merchandise that is not priced.
    
    Perhaps one of my life lessons is to learn about my 
    relative unimportance, about the meaningless of our
    concepts of time, or just to be prepared and always
    carry something to read [I already know everything about
    Elvis' love tryst with the space aliens that wish to know
    (maybe my karma is to learn not to scoff at space aliens)].
    
    I think it's difficult to truly know what one's karma is; it
    seems to me that the best one can do is to deal with *all*
    aspects of life as best as one can, to try to understand
    as much as possible from as many different perspectives as
    possible, and to not worry about whether it's "karma."
    I have it on good authority that god/goddess/all-that-there-is
    gives extra credit, and that neatness counts. attendence is
    mandatory.
    
    	bruce

re; < Note 354.35 by BPOV09::GROSSE >

>    I am still confused on the matter of "free choice" as it seems
>    that if Karma dictates what needs to be learned then the soul 
>    has no choice but to choose situations that will teach this
>    or that. I, personally, find it unsettling to think that there
>    is no choice allowed in this matter. 

From my personal experience, I have come to the following conclusion (and of 
course, conclusions are subject to change when more experience is added);

A later reply said "Karma impels, it does not compel".  What I think, includes 
that.

From reading tarot cards, I realized that what I was saying to people was based 
upon where they were at that particular moment; their fates were headed in a 
certain direction, but only *at that moment*.  Anything and everything that the 
person did from the time of the reading, on,  effected the direction (of the 
fate) in which they were moving.  This leads me to think that, at any time, we 
can change our mind about the lessons we choose to learn here.  Once again, 
like with the magic mirrors, a change in decision about life's lessons is one 
which sounds pretty easy, but involves layers and layers, like an onion.  You 
have a general direction set in which you are moving; everything you have done, 
have been, have known, has led you to choose your direction for the "future", 
but you can change the plan, which means re-perceiving (!wow, a new word!) all 
of your beliefs about yourself and your life (or, at least the ones that are 
pertinent to whatever change you want to make).

It all impels.  It is *we* who chose to perceive it as compelling.  (Did I do 
ok on that one?) ;-)

Meredith

    re.38
    first I want to say that sometimes when writing things they are
    micnstrued as snide, so to prevent that from happening I want
    to clarify that what I want to ask is a sincere question seen
    from my point of view.
    You mentioned that standing in the check out line waiting so
    long etc etc. may be happening to teach you that you are
    one of many of the masses so to speak...
    So here's my question, I am forever ending up inthe slowest
    line but looking at how difficult it is for stores to find
    help this is almost inevitable that there are more new
    people behind the registers and therefore slower than there
    are experienced help. Wouldn't it be possible that ending
    up in the line with such people is merely good odds that
    anyoe will rather than believing that the experience is
    karmic?
    
    cb
    

    re .40
    
    I tried to say that it may or may not be karma...  if we all wait
    in line, maybe we all have that aspect in our karma... maybe there
    are many lessons to be learned from the same situation...
    
    in any event, i would rather not be annoyed... so my choice, as
    i see it is to learn to accept it, or learn to deal with it
    another way...  learn to live without lines, learn to meet new
    friends, solve differential equations, etc...   it almost
    doesn't matter how i deal with it...   i don't see any point
    in making myself miserable just cause i'm waiting in line (or
    for any other reason, either)...   there are lots of "productive"
    things to do in life...  and one can define "productive" any
    way they like...
    
    
    	bruce

    re.39
    Merideth,
    I found the same thing regarding Tarot reading, it seemed that what
    was being said at that point of time could very well be true like
    "if all things contiunue in this manner" however in the event
    of the reading someone could make a decision that they would like
    to change the direction they were "at that moment" heading.
    
    you explained it all very well and I am less confused "at this
    point in time" ;_)
    
    cb
    

    	Well then, what would cause a soul to split?  Would the 
    	two halves incarnate at the same times?  How long would
    	they be separate, and just how separate are they?
    
    						Carla
    

    re: .37 (Wagner)
      
        I like your explanations on this one.  
    
    
        Karma exists only if you want it to.  You have the choice to
    either keep it or release it.  You are not somehow "stuck" with
    it.
    
    
        Nothing "causes" a soul to split.  If all time is simultaneous
    (except for our illusion of the physical plane) then all our lifetimes
    are, too.  It has been said (by guess who?) that we could have 
    overlapping lifetimes but that it would be *unlikely* that any of
    us would have that happening for very long (that is, maybe a year
    or two, e.g.)  You are not, therefore, likely to mate with the 
    "other half" of yourself.  Each of us is a whole unto ourselves.
    That you choose to consider someone a "soul-mate" is real nice,
    but it is a CHOICE.  Does this mean you have a past-life connection?
    Maybe yes, but not necessarily.  It is a choice, only.  *YOU* decide
    that the connection is strong (by whatever criteria) and again
    decide that this person(s) (or animal) is one you wish to be with "forever."
         I don't know if I read this in DEJAVU or it came from elsewhere
    but it is an interesting thought:  A man and a woman decide to be
    "soul-mates".  The woman dies within a few years.  The man, after
    perhaps several years, meets someone whom he loves deeply and after
    a period of time, decides he wants to be "soul-mated" to her.  This
    can be compounded, but leaving it simple...what happens when they've
    all died?  Is the man "soul-mated" to the first or second woman?
    Is the second woman "soul-mated" to the first?  From this one can
    see how ludicrous the concept of soul-mates *CAN* become.  It should
    be clear that the soul-mating occurs moment-by-moment, only.  That
    it is there only because of a decision and by a choice.  It also
    implies cooperation and a mutual decision, which can be kept or
    broken at "free" will.  
        I think the term "soul" is being misused here.  If one sees
    the soul as a lens to God/Goddess/All-That-Is, it is not likely
    to see it as "splitting."  If, on the other hand, one speaks of
    the Higher Self and sees within that all lifetimes and all events,
    then it is much easier to see a connection between aspects of
    "self" to "others."  It is not a splitting, at least not anymore
    than multiple lifetimes could be similarly considered.  I do not
    feel I am a split of anything...but I do feel that I am an aspect
    of something much "greater" than I am.  I have met many people in
    my life (mostly women) with whom I have felt a great and wonderful
    bonding.  It is clear from the life that has ensued, that we are
    not "soul-mates" for we've moved on (for the most part.)  At the
    present I have a special person in my life who *could be* a soul-
    mate...and then, again, maybe not.  If one reads all the books about
    soul-mates, one will very often find that the mates the author had
    has since moved on to another, or vice versa.  Seems to me that
    that puts a chink in the armour of this whole concept of "soul-mates."
    My suggestion is that not too much weight be put on the idea.  That
    it, like karma and destiny, is a choice.  And like everything else,
    it is subject to change at THOUGHT.
    
    Frederick
    

    
    Re: .43
    
    It is my understanding that the splitting of a soul occurred(s) during
    the FIRST incarnation of that soul.  It occurred when it first
    undertook a physical form.  The splitting is due to a polarization
    of the soul that occurred just prior to incarnation.  (I don't know
    if it is the initial force of taking on a physical body, or what.)
    Not all souls split.  There are people who have no soul-mates because
    of this.  When both soul-mates have broken the life-death cycle
    and ascended, it is up to them whether or not they want to merge back 
    into one soul again.  It is not a necessity to merge back to one
    soul.
    
    Linda

	Re: .44
    
    	It is my understanding that you do NOT CHOOSE your soul-mate.
    	As I've mentioned in previous notes, you only have 1 soul-mate,
    	but you can have many twin-rays.  A lot of people make an
    	assumption that just because a relationship is very good and
    	very strong that it is a soul-mate relationship.  This is not
    	true.  Soul-mate relationships can be the most difficult
    	relationship possible for the individuals.  Soul-mates can HATE
    	each other in a life-time.  I think that a lot of people do
    	not fully understand the concept of a soul-mate and that a lot
    	of times the relationships are with twin-rays, and not soul-mates.
	Sometimes for a given life-time, the best relationship for a 
    	person is with a twin-ray and not his/her soul-mate.  It all
    	depends on the karmic lessons that the person needs to learn in 
    	that life-time.

    	I agree with you that each of us is a whole unto ourselves.
        That is one of the karmic lessons that we must learn due to the 
        splitting.  Because the balance was not maintained and a split
    	was caused, the two resulting souls must maintain the balance
    	within themselves, and eventually a balance between themselves.

    	As for the story you told....  The man cannot choose to be
    	soul-mated, but he can choose to be married for eternity.
    	These two concepts are vastly different.

	I want to stress that you can only have 1 soul-mate, but many
    	twin-rays.  And I want to stress that just because soul-mates
    	have a relationship in a life-time does NOT mean that life
    	will be all rosy & wonderful.  Soul-mate relationships can
    	be the most difficult relationships of all the types of
    	relationships; and just because soul-mates have a relationship
    	does NOT mean that they will spend the rest of their lives
    	(this life or the next lives or the prior lives) in perfect
    	bliss....  Soul-mates can break up their relationships.

    	If you can master a relationship, regardless of it being a
    	soul-mate or a twin-ray relationship, you can break the
    	life-death cycle.

    	Linda

    
    Linda,
    
    How would one "master a relationship"?
    
    Cindy

    re .47
    
�        How would one "master a relationship"?
    
    whips and chains??

    re .47
    
�        How would one "master a relationship"?

cute on the control devices, bruce!

personal opinion;

there are moments when mastery of a relationship exists
those moments when you are you and you are letting the other person be, too
and love is flowing between you
and the walls have dropped
and the projections have faded away
and for that moment, you feel good about who you are
and good about who is that special other person

it is at that time that you (both) have mastery of the relationship
treasure the moment
for in the real world
it will surely slip away
and appear again, as does a wave.

    Re: .47
    
    It is my understanding that in order to "master" a relationship one
    thing that must happen is that a person must maintain the balance 
    & harmony within the relationship while maintaining the balance & 
    harmony within him/herself.
    
    It's really a very simple idea when you think about, but, boy, can
    it be difficult to do!!  The difficulty, I believe, stems from the
    fact that the person you have a relationship with "pushes" certain
    "buttons" in you, some good, and some bad.  If a "bad" or negative
    "button" is pushed, the emotional body gets out of balance, unless
    the person, whose button is being "pushed", can learn to "ACT, NOT
    REACT".

    Linda

    
    Is it just for marriage-type relationships or is it for friendships,
    etc. also?
    
    I'm hoping that after the divorce happens that we can work on a
    deep and long-lasting friendship and that is our goal.
    
    Everything happens for a reason.....just have to keep reminding
    myself of that.
    
    Cindy

    Re: .51

    Cindy,
    
    I would assume that it would be for marriage-type relationships,
    i.e. the "ultimate" commitment.  In friendships, you usually don't
    have to deal with the person day in & day out; and the commitment
    is not the same.  If you want to break up a friendship, it is a
    lot different than breaking up a marriage-type relationship.
    
    I stress, though, that this is only ONE way of mastering.....
    
    I think it's really good that you are trying to maintain a friendship
    with him.  This will enable you & him to keep on working out the
    karma between you two.
    
    Remember, everything does finally work out for the highest & the
    best....
    
    Linda

    RE .35
    
    There is a choice.  If one has Karma (good or bad), it needs to
    be worked off.  You have the choice of correcting the situation
    (it may be painful), or to run away from it (it will tend to catch
    up).
    
    You're going to move, one way or another.  If you choose not to
    work on improving yourself, you will regress into something less
    than you are now.
    
    Elizabeth