Conference hydra::dejavu

	Maybe neither.  It might be that it was a residual image from a 
"dying message" telepathic contact.  Suppose while your godmother was dying,
she missed you sufficiently so that she sent you a message telepathically
(did you ever feel a close bond that could lead to such a linkage?).  Further
suppose when the message reached you, you were in no position to receive it
consciously.  Under such circumstances, it might be that you received it
subconsciously, and it was stored for the equivalent of later "replay" when
your mind was less preoccupied.

Being asleep would be a perfect time for it to filter up far enough in your
mind to perceive it.  Your mind then might put it in the form of a dream.

Steve Kallis, Jr.

Mmmm.  If there was some way to be sure, and I had to bet, I would guess this
one to be a "normal" dream, though there's a distinct chance I'd lose my bet.

Stories very similar to the one you described are common.  Where this story
differs from my impression of the "vericidal" ones is the amount of time after
the death.  Most of the stories with an internal "proof" of paranormal origin
place the event at, or very soon after the death (occasionally before clinical
death occurs).  This includes cases where a long period elapses before the
death can be confirmed.

No information was passed to you which you didn't know but which could be
checked.  There was therefore no evidence that the event was in anyway external
to you (which is certainly not equivalent to there being evidence that it
wasn't).

I would therefore bet on a perfectly ordinary, psychological origin.  It would
be rather surprising if you did not feel grief, fear and guilt (both for
missing her funeral, and for every little wrong you did to her in your whole
life, which you now can never make up to her for).  You were in need of
reassurance.  At the same time, part of your subconscious, since you were
mentally healthy, knew that this was wrong: not what she would have wanted at
all.  The result -- a nice healthy dream, complete with a simulation of your
godmother that allowed you a resolution of the internal conflict.  It didn't
really matter whether or not you believed that the figure in the dream was
really your godmother, as long as you believed that it acted exactly as your
godmother would.

		Topher

This is not quite the same but is along the same lines.

Last February my wife and I visited her father in Florida who was recovering
from a serious cancer operation.  We both knew at the time that he was
terminally ill.  About a month later, she awakened one morning around 5:00 am
for no aparent reason, thought of her father, a went back to sleep.  About
8:30 am we got a phone call tht he had died that morning.  As near as we
could cross check the clocks his death occurred at the time she waked up
within � (+ or -) of a couple of minutes.
						Bill

re .3:

That clearly seems to be a case of telepathic linkage.  This is more likely
to occur in cases of close blood relatives.

Steve Kallis, Jr.

	My wife had a very similar occurance when her dad was sick in canada
and no one would believe her.  In fact she saw a psychologist who sugested
just that.
								Jorge'

This story was told to me by a close friend of my Mothers.  During
WWII she was a nurse in England.  One evening she was on duty at a
remote field hospital - alone - except for the hospital "mascott",
a dog.  She was working on charts when the screen door opened. She
looked up and saw no one, but noticed that every hair on the dog's
body was standing up.  The dog was growling strangely.  She watched
the dog "watch" something cross the small foyer then disappear up
the stairs.  A few moments later the dog again watched something
walk back through the foyer, the screen door opened and slammed
shut.  She went upstairs immediately afterward to check out the
patients and found that one of them, alive 10 minutes previously
had *just* died.

Comments?
Stasia

re .6:

Did your mother tell you what the patient died of?

Steve Kallis, Jr.

    I can relate one experience very similar to the ones described here.
    I would not believe it if I had not been present.  I was attending
    this summer a workshop with a close friend of mine. Her mother had
    been quite ill and the prognosis was very dim. In fact, we almost
    cancelled the trip, we were worried that her mother might die while
    we were gone. Her mother promised before my friend left that she
    would hang on until my friend returned - and ironically on the last
    day of the workshop, as my friend and I had breakfast, she very
    suddenly left the table and before I had time to ask, she said stay
    and finish, but I must go back to the room. When I returned to the
    room she was on the phone with her husband who had just called to
    tell her the sad news of her mother's death. She related to me later
    that during breakfast, she had a feeling of death and release very
    suddenly "wash" over her, and that was why she left so quickly with
    no explaination - this feeling occurred at almost the same moment
    her mother died, approximately 400 miles away. 
    
    As I said, I never would have believed this story had I not been
    present - but apparently this sort of thing is not unusual.
    
    Emily
    

    A little over a year ago, I had an experience where I woke up in
    the middle of the night and could feel a "presence" in the room.
    I decided not to pay too much attention to it, but it did make me
    look at the time (1:30 am), then went back to sleep.  Later that
    day, my boyfriends mother called and said she had some bad news.
    Skip had died at 1:30 am.
    
    At the wake, I remember hoping for a sign of some sort that he knew
    I was there.  There was a picture of him set up in the room.  All of
    sudden the picture seemed to jump up and land in the middle of
    the room, some 6 feet from where it was placed.
    
    This is just a couple of instances where things like this have happened.

         The night my grandfather died I dreamed of a huge sympathy
    card for my grandmother.
    
         That same night my sister and her ex-husband both dreamed he
    was in their bedroom talking to them.  --  Have any of you couples
    had the same dreams?
    
    janice

    RE: .10
    
    I've never shared a dream with an SO that I know of, but I used
    to have a friend that would share dreams with me frequently.
    
    Kathleen
    

    This is an interesting story that was told to me by two friends
    who experienced it, so I'm not giving it first hand.  These two
    women friends were rooming together, and one of their neighbors
    had a dog that use to stop by to visit with them every now and
    then.  One day the dog came by and as usual they let him in.  He
    went over to the fireplace and stretched out in front of it and
    stayed there for most of the afternoon.  They were busy doing this
    and that, but they did notice that the dog stayed by the fireplace
    and didn't look for food handouts, as was his habit.  I don't know
    if they touched him.  After some time, he got up and went to the
    door and they let him out.  The next day they saw their neighbor
    and mentioned that the dog had been over to visit.  To their
    surprise (probably more like shock) the neighbor told them that
    the dog had passed away the day before.  
    
    Carole
    

    A small twist on most of the replies here:
    
    My mother's (2nd) cousin's husband, not a blood relative of mine,
    though a person I considered to be an uncle (I have a small extended
    family), was dying of cancer.  At some point I was told he would
    live somewhere from weeks to months.  Then I was told he was in
    the hospital for surgery.  This was on a weekend - either Saturday
    or Sunday.  I didn't see him very often those days, and didn't keep
    in very close touch with his condition.  On the following Thursday
    night, I was lying in bed, and started thinking of him - and started
    crying for him and because I would miss him.  I didn't have any
    special feelings that he was dead - just the knowledge that he was
    going to die within days or weeks was in my (concious) mind.
    
    The following day he died, having entered a deep coma approximately
    when I was thinking about him - within the usual hospital granularities
    for these things - a couple of hours.
    
    Could have been coincidence, but I was surprised that the feeling
    came over me. 

    UNUSUAL SENSITIVITY??????
    
    LAST JUNE 5TH I SMELLED CARNATIONS VERY STRONGLY IN THE DOWNSTAIRS
    OF MY HOUSE.  WHEN I ASKED MY SON AND HUSBAND IF THEY SMELLED ANYTHING
    UNUSUAL, THEY BOTH AGREED THAT I WAS LOSING MY SANITY. (I SEEM TO
    SENSE THINGS BY SMELL, AT TIMES).  THEY SMELLED NOTHING.
    
    WELL THAT NIGHT AFTER FALLING ASLEEP AND GOING INTO THE MANY DREAMS
    THAT I ALWAYS GO INTO, I HAD A FRIGHTENING ONE.  I WAS IN AN OLD
    VICTORIAN HOME WITH FLOOR TO CEILING WINDOWS AND I SENSED THAT THERE
    WAS SOMETHING BAD TRYING TO GET INTO THE HOUSE, SO I FRANTICALLY
    RAN AROUND THE HOUSE DRAWING ALL THE DRAPES BUT UNSUCCESSFULLY,
    WHATEVER FORCE WAS OUTSIDE THE HOUSE CAME THROUGH THE FRONT DOOR.
    IT WAS AN AWFUL FEELING AND WOKE ME UP.  I TURNED TO LOOK AT THE
    TIME ON MY CLOCK AND IT WAS 4:30 AM.  I FELL BACK TO SLEEP AND WOKE
    UP AGAIN AT SIX.  I WAS GOING TO CALL MY MOM BUT WAS RUNNING LATE
    AND BY THE TIME I GOT TO WORK I RECEIVED A PHONE CALL THAT MY MOM
    HAD DIED.  IT SEEMS THAT AT 4:30 AM SHE STARTED GOING INTO A SEIZURE
    OF SOME SORT WITH HIGH FEVER AND WAS RUSHED INTO THE HOSPITAL WHERE
    SHE DIED.

    IS THERE ANYONE OUT THERE WHO SENSES THROUGH SMELL?
    
    I SEEM TO KNOW THINGS BY MY SENSE OF SMELL.  I FEEL THE PRESENCE
    OF ??? SPIRITS ??? BY EITHER SWEET HONEYSUCKLE AROMA OR THE SWEET
    AROMA OF PIPE TOBACCO.
    
    I ALSO WAS IN A PSYCHIC CLASS WHERE WE WERE EXPERIMENTING WITH OBJECTS
    TO SEE WHAT WE FELT FROM HOLDING THEM.  I PICKED UP A VERY STRONG
    SMELL OF PARAGORIC FROM THE OBJECT I WAS HOLDING.  THE OBJECT ITSELF
    DIDN'T SMELL OF PARAGORIC BUT THE AIR AROUND ME DID.  I LATER FOUND
    OUT THAT THE PERSON WHO OWNED THE OBJECT (HER HUSBAND) HAD USED
    PARAGORIC FOR YEARS FOR SOME AILMENT.  
    
    AND AS MENTIONED BEFORE, I SMELL CARNATIONS BEFORE A DEATH OF A
    FAMILY MEMBER.
    
    ANYONE SHARE MY TALENT??????
    
    JO-ANN
    

    Wow, Jo-Ann.  I had chills reading your note. 
    
    I had a similar experience several months ago.
    I was asleep, but awake and it was black, very
    black.  As if I was blind.  No, as if there was
    absolutely no light in the room.  I guess I was
    not in my body (this is hard to describe) because
    I was fighting with something that was trying to
    take over my body.  I remember that I felt such
    strength and determination.  It was not really a
    physical struggle, but in a way it was.  (this is
    getting muddled, isn't it?)   Then I woke up and
    was in my body in my bed and I was shaking and
    scared.  
    
    I told a friend about this experience and couldn't
    stop crying.

    
    (More Spirit Experiences)
    
    Has anyone experienced being visited by a spirit the same month
    around the death or birthday of a loved one?
    
    My father in law died in March 82 and I believe his spirit visits
    my home on his birthday and anniversary of his death.  This has
    been happening for the last five years.  Whenever something strange
    would happen in my home I'd sit and try to understand what or who
    it could be.  Then "it dawns on me" it's my father in law.  In life
    he always said he'd come back to visit with me because I believed
    so much in another world (the spirit world).
    
    I do believe it's him.
    
    Jo-Ann...
    

    	About 7 years ago my animals and I had a beloved friend come
    	back to say good-by.  I have two dogs, a shepard and a little
    	mix and the neighbors down the road also had the same (the little
    	dog that they have is a sister to mine).  Well, all four would
    	always be together and when I went riding Pepe' (the neighbor's
    	Shepard) would always come with mine.  They LOVED the woods
    	and would go for hours with me.
    
    	Well, to make a long story shorter... one afternoon (a Saturday)
    	I took my dogs once again riding with me and I did look for	
    	Pepe' but I hadn't seen him around for a few days (He was a whole
    	male and he sometimes wandered).  So we went out as usual and
    	were going along when my horse started to look behind him and
    	I looked back but saw nothing... then the dogs looked too and
    	I looked again.  Well, around a bend in the trail I saw Pepe' 
    	- I was happy to see him and called him over - Kemo, my shepard 
    	started wagging her tail at the sight of her buddy (Benji just
    	looked in that direction).  Pepe' wagged his slowly and about 
    	20 - 30 feet away.  He hesitated, and really seemed to want 
    	to go with us but, just stood there (he didn't make any sound)
    	and then slowly turned around then walked away...
    
    	I walked my horse to the bend and looked down the trail ...
    	NO Pepe'... I thought it funny that he didn't want to come
    	with us and that he took off (apparently) so fast.  We went
    	on our ride - but that bothered me.
    
    	The next day my husband was talking to Pepe's owner and she 
    	said that Pepe' had died on Thursday night (of heartworm).
    
    	I know I SAW him... my ANIMALS SAW him too... he came to say
    	good-by.  I loved him and still miss him.
                                                    
    	It was nice of him to see us again..
    
    	Susan

         
    RE: Pepe
    
    That's really nice - thanks for posting that.
    
    Cindy

    
    
    
    Thank you very very much for posting that....  I'm sure it makes
    all of us animal lovers feel warm all over to know.......
    
                             Ahhhhhhhh
    
                                                       KIM

    
    	Thanks..
    
    	I am very close to all my cridders and the things that they
    	pick up and sense are something!
    
    	I could accept the fact if I KNEW Pepe' was gone - then I 
    	could of accepted that I imagined it - but my cridders saw
    	him too.... and I didn't know.  
    
    	When my husband told me about him - I had to sit down.  I was
    	filled with grief - but the really silly thing was - it was 
    	like he came back to show me he was going to be ok and not to 
    	worry and this made me feel better.
    
    	I have never had that experience since.
    
    	I did "see" a man in my folk's house once in awhile.. but only
    	if I was the only one left in the house for the night.  You	
    	know, you pick it up out of the corner of your eye...  I used
    	to try and ignor it as this scared me silly as a kid.  Then
    	one day I really saw him in the upstairs hallway (my room was
    	right at the top of the stairway) He was dressed in a black
    	suit (of course! ;^}) and was kind if baulding with gray fuzzie
    	hair around his ears and at the back of his head.  Not a bad
    	looking man - just stern looking.  He gave me one long look
    	and walked toward my folk's beadroom.  I shut my door for the
    	rest of the night!!
    
    	I told my mother the very next day and she just looked at
    	me kinda funny and said I dreamt it...  MANY years later
    	I learned that the man that owned the house before us 
    	died in my folks bedroom.  Kinda spooky huh?
    
    	Susan

    
    Reading that last reply reminded me of a story that a friend of
    mine's mother told us once.
    
    She had been asleep for hours, it was about four in the morning
    and was woken by someone sitting on the end of her bed.  She sat
    up as she thought it was one of her children, she could make out
    long blond hair but couldn't quite make out the face but when she 
    put the light on to find out what the matter was....it had gone!!
    
    She later found out that the house had been built on top of an old
    riding stable that had burnt down many, many years ago....and that
    a little girl who used to work at the stable in the school holidays
    died in the fire!!!

            
       A friend of mine said that not to long ago she had been hearing
    strange noises,doors opening and closing and cabinet doors opening
    and closing.One night she was sitting on the couch and all of a
    sudden she saw her father-in-law standing in front of her,just standing
    there not saying anything.When she put her head down for a second
    to say to herself that it couldn't be happening,she iooked back
    up and saw nothing.She said that he looked shorter than he was before
    he died.She had also said that she had been taking a shower one
    night and someone was trying to open the bathroom door,but her husband
    nor anyone else was home.
                                     Becky
    

    WHEN I WAS YOUNGER, I WAS VERY CLOSE TO MY GRANDFATHER.  HE DIED
    WHEN I WAS ABOUT 11 YEARS OLD.  I WAS VERY UPSET WHEN HE DIED. 
    BUT EVER SINCE, I HAVE HAD STRANGE FEELINGS.  WHETHER THEY WERE
    STRANGE DREAMS, OR DEEP FEELINGS OF HIS NEARNESS, IT SEEMED ALL
    OUT OF THE ORDINARY.  ONE NIGHT I WAS ASLEEP IN MY BEDROOM (A ROOM
    CONVERTED FROM A DEN WHERE HE SPENT A LOT OF HIS TIME) WITH THE
    DOOR SHUT(I NEVER SLEEP WITH MY DOOR SHUT, THIS WAS JUST ONE NIGHT)
    I WAS WOKEN UP OUT OF A DEEP SLEEP BY A VOICE SOUNDING JUST LIKE
    MY GRANDFATHERS CALLED OUT MY NAME, AS IF HE WERE STANDING RIGHT
    NEXT TO ME.  IVE ALSO HAD A STRANGE EXPERIENCE WITH A OUIJA BOARD
    WHERE I WAS SUPPOSEDLY TALKING TO HIM.  WELL, I NEVER TOLD ANYONE
    ANY OF THIS UNTIL ABOUT A YEAR AGO, AND I HAVEN'T HAD ANY STRANGE
    HAPPENINGS SINCE.  I KINDA WISH I NEVER TOLD ANYONE.  MAYBE THIS
    ALL MEANS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, BUT WHO KNOWS!!!!!
    
    JC
    

    Re .24 (JC):
    
    Please ... use upper and lower case.  Upper case only is SHOUTING
    and is rough on the eyes.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.

    I have several experiences with spirits in my life time, but 2 stand
    out more than the others.  I guess I just learned to accept them
    as a normal fact of life.
    
    1.  When I was about 11 or 12 my girlfriends grandfather died. 
    He had said before he died that no one was to sleep in his bed for
    at least 2 months after his death.  He made this very clear as a
    warning.  The night after he died.  Her brother was sleeping in
    his (the grandfathers) bed and my friend in her grandmothers next
    to it, when she sat straight up and called her brother to wake up.
    He just rolled over and looked at her and then all of a sudden he
    was lifted and thrown to the end of the bed just as a brick came
    through the window and landed on his pillow. 
    
    Well, because of this incident the kids would not spend the night
    at the house the next night, so my mom brought them over to our
    house.  Our mothers decided to go out that night and left us kids
    alone at home.  Our bedrooms were upstairs and so was the family
    room (located like a foyer at the top).  After we went to bed and
    maybe awhile later I heard the banister on the stairs shift.  It
    did this when ever anyone touched it also had a few creaky stairs.
    I heard these and woke up my friend.  I thought our mothers were
    home and I just didn't hear the cars.  I checked this out, but could
    not see anyone.  We became quite frightened and ran to my room,
    what or whom ever followed.  We could hear it coming down the hall
    and stop outside my door.  When it came in the room there was a
    slight breese like someone blowing in your ear across our faces.
    My friend seemed to get very comfortable and then she said "grandpapy
    I'm ok"  Then it walked out of the room and back the way it came.
    
    2.  I had a very similar experience in my mothers home just last
    year.  I had had a very rough night the night before and was not
    feeling at all well.  Marriage trouble.  I went to my mothers house
    to rest upon her say so.  She was not at home.  I went into the
    house and went into her room and lay down on the bed.  I had closed
    the door just about all the way, when all of a sudden it flew open
    and I felt this breeze on my face again.  I felt very calm and knew
    it was my mother's grandmother.  Just checking up on who was there.
    I wasn't supposed to be there.  I told her it was ok mom said I
    could come over and lay down on her bed.  She left the room and
    closed the door.  
    
    I have no doubts about what happened.  For I know I was fully awake
    both of these times.
    

    For me the strong scent of flowers, especially carnations and roses,
    like I'm surrounded with huge quantities of them usually indicates a
    death or impending death in the family.  I always associated the smell
    with the wakes of my parents where the rooms were packed with flowers,
    not with any psychic ability.  When I smell the flowers I get very
    apprehensive and nervous wondering what I will here.  It is nice to
    know I am not the only one.
    
    Pat
    

    I was traveling on the road with my husband, on my honeymoon when
    someone whispered in my ear, "and they will find her in the morning".
    As the words came in my ear I repeated them verbally to my husband who
    was in tune with my thoughts and feelings most of the time. Not needing
    any explanation he said "I'm sure that's how it will be" and no more
    was said until I received the call two days later that my sister had 
    found my mother..in the morning.  She had passed away.

    I was traveling down a highway and saw a pigeon take up, nearly
    straight-up from the median strip. It got about 5 feet up and fell
    dead.
    
    Maybe it was 6 months later my father died, and I was still traveling
    this road , and put my approximate position at this area at the time of
    his death. 

    I was addressing a group of high school students on psychic phenomena
    and related subjects, and at the end of the session, I asked if any of
    them had had any such experiences that they would like to share.  A
    friend of my daughters stood up and told us about an encounter that she
    had experienced in my home and had then forgotten, until I had jogged
    her memory. She knew nothing of the things that I was involved in until
    she was informed about the lecture in the school auditorium and had
    decided to attend, out of curiosity.
    She was on a sleepover at our house and my daughter had her sleep in
    her room so that she would have more privacy. In the morning my
    daughter asked her how she slept the night before and she said that she
    had been awakened several times during the night by the dog jumping up
    on the bed and wanting to play. She put him out of the room and he kept
    returning.  My daughter asked her to describe the dog and she said that
    it was a small black poodle.  My daughter was shocked and informed her
    that we no longer had a dog, she had died a few weeks before, having
    been hit by a car in front of the house.  The phenomenal thing is that
    she always lay on my daughters bed and would try to bite her toes if
    she moved them during the night.
    
    Neither my daughter or her friend thought to say anything until I
    talked about some of my previous experiences.
    
    By the way, I was asked to address just one high shcool class on a
    given day and as the word got around regarding the subject, the class
    was moved to a lunch period so that all who had expressed an interest
    could attend.  Imagine the shock when I walked in and found the
    auditorium filled and people sitting on the stairs and standing against
    the walls. Just to show you the amount of interest that people show and
    their willingness to tell of experiences that they had encountered and
    never told anyone because they were afraid of being made fun of or not
    being beleived.
    
    Pat
    
     

    Pat .30,
    
    Wonderful!  Both the story of your poodle returning and your 
    endeavors to make it okay for people to share these kinds of
    experiences.  There is and will be much more need for the work 
    you are doing in this area, imho.
    
    Peace & blessings,
    
    Karen.*

    I had some real wierd experience.  One night when I was a junior in
    high school, I had a dream that I saw my grandmother dressed in her
    lavender suit which she only wore for special events.  I saw her
    crystal rossary in her had. I remember asking her where she was going
    but she won't answer.  I woke up becuase it gave me the chills. I had
    felt like someone had their had on my shoulder. The next morning
    my cousin called and before she could tell me anything I said
    "Granny died right."  The funeral was in a couple of days so I
    went to the funeral home. I fainted there because she was dressed
    exactly per detail to the way I saw her. And she had the rosarry in
    her hand.  I talked to my brothers and sisters and they all
    said they had almost the same dream.  I still say she follows me
    because I keep have reocurring dreams about her and people often
    look like her.  I guess because I was so close to her.

    Topher (or anybody that can provide some info), you around these days?  
    I have a question.  I was talking to a friend this weekend about some 
    experiences she's had over the years in a relative's house.  One 
    particular experience puzzled me.  In one of the bedrooms she's been in 
    there is a peculiar bed.  It seems that she can feel a 'hot spot' in the 
    right-hand foot end of the bed, hot as if someone had set a hot iron on 
    it - not just warm.  It's not a once in a while occurrance but has 
    happened consistantly.  I think she also told me, she is the only one 
    sensitive to it.  There are also some other spirit things going on in 
    the house and have been for years - nice ones.  Do you have any possible 
    explanations or have you heard of anything like this before?

    Thanks,
    Terry

    Yes, I'm still around.

    Cold spots or "tingly" spots are more commonly reported but I've heard
    of a few hot spots.  For whatever its worth (really not sure of the
    relevance) the one context I know of in which a feeling of heat is
    frequently reported is in "laying on of hands" type healing.  Heat
    (not just warmth) is frequently reported as flowing from the hands into
    the treatement areas -- even when the hands are not in direct contact.

    The "simplest" explanation, since only your friend can feel it, is that
    the sensation is purely a subjective experience.  This is in no way
    a put down or a claim that the experience is not "real".  It only means
    that the very real experience relates to internal associations with
    some aspect of that location rather than with some essentially sharable
    ("objective") characteristic of that location.  The other "spirit
    things going on" may be unrelated, or may also be purely subjective
    (since I know no details, I have no way of judging how plausible that
    is in this case).

    If we rule out a purely subjective experience for purposes of
    exploration, we can say that the experience is either caused by
    conventional physical or by paranormal phenomena (perhaps filtered
    through some subjective interpretation -- after all, if you secretly
    touch an ice cube to someone in a crowd of people smoking they will be
    absolutely certain that they were burned with a cigaret).

    I cannot think of any conventional physical mechanism which would
    produce such a sensation strongly and reliably for just one person.
    That doesn't mean one doesn't exist however -- my lack of imagination
    is not a constraint on the universe.

    As for paranormal explanations -- its too wide open.  She is picking up
    something, but what?  A fire?  A scalding incident?  A place where an
    old fashioned bedwarmer used to be put?  Healing energy?  A psychic
    beacon, without any particular significance to the heat?  A spirit
    prank?  Only with a very thorough investigation would there be any
    basis for saying one is more plausible than the other, and there is no
    way even then to be certain.

				    Topher

re: .34 (Topher)

     Thanks a bunch!  Interesting ideas - fur shure.  If I get any more
     details I may ask some more.  I knew I could flush you out of the
     notes ether :-).

     Terry

Re: .33 (mine)

    Topher,

    I rechecked the details with my friend and most of what I wrote was 
    correct, however, she's not the only one that feels the hot spot, but it 
    only happens when she's in the room.  Also, the other spirit happenings
    are a family kind of thing and everyone in the house as well as some
    visitors are aware of the presence(s).  

    Thanks again,
    Terry

RE: .36 (Terry)

    That would make your friend a medium in the broadest sense of the word
    -- perhaps a highly specialized medium with a connection to this single
    spot, but a medium nevertheless.

    That leaves several possabilities:

    1) The experience is still purely subjective, but she manages, by overt
    word or subtle action to set up an expectation in some people which
    causes them to have a similar experience.  Remember, for about 1 person
    in 5, their normal waking state shares many characteristics of the
    hypnotic state in others.

    2) The phenomenon has a conventional physical cause which somehow
    requires her presence.  I find this highly implausible (assuming that
    I've gotten an accurate impression about what is going on), but cannot,
    of course, completely rule it out.

    3) The phenomenon has a conventional physical cause but people don't
    notice it until she calls their attention to it.  More plausible than
    the last but, if the sensation is as strong as described, still rather
    implausible.

    4) A basically subjective phenomenon which she paranormally projects
    into the outside world, causing others to actually feel what her
    mental associations lead her to expect them to feel.  This might be
    done by actually heating the area, by affecting the nerve endings to
    produce the sensation, or by projective telepathy creating a
    touch-hallucination.

    5) Same as 4, but she is picking up something "real" on the paranormal
    plane and projecting it to others.

    6) She acts as a more-or-less passive catalyst allowing others to
    experience what is paranormally there.

    7) She acts as a more-or-less passive route for non-corporeal
    personalities to create sensations in others.

    8) Combinations of the above.

				    Topher

    re: .37 (Topher)
    
        You mean she isn't a large medium, not a small medium, but
    most likely a medium medium?  How mediocre.
    
    Frederick
    ;-)

re: .37 (Topher)

    Thanks again!  I shared this info with her and she found it helpful and
    interesting.  She thanks you too.

    Frederick,

    Medium-medium.  Sheesh...  If she were smiling while someone read-ended
    her car would the cops charge the offender with 'Striking a happy medium'?
    :-)
   
    Terry

    Re .37 (Topher):
    
    >4) A basically subjective phenomenon which she paranormally projects
    >into the outside world, causing others to actually feel what her
    >mental associations lead her to expect them to feel.  This might be
    >done by actually heating the area, by affecting the nerve endings to
    >produce the sensation, or by projective telepathy creating a
    >touch-hallucination.
     
    Small point: if she manages somehow to be "actually heating" the
    area, then the phenomenon is objective, not subjective.  There are
    those who have been called "fire starters" or "pyrotics," who are
    reputed to use some power to heat an object, usually to the point
    of combustion.  This could be a mild case of that.
    
    It would not be the same as 5, since she would be (unconsciously)
    the heating agent.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.

RE: .40 (Steve K.)

    Yup, Steve, you're right, and I was aware of it when I said it (I
    wondered if someone would call me on it).  It just seemed like the
    easiest way to communicate what I meant.

    The problem has to do with the distinction between proximate and
    ultimate (or at least less proximate) cause and also between
    "why-causality" and "how-causality" (the hard sciences generally deal
    with the latter).  The objective/subjective confusion here is one of
    the interesting/frustrating things about parapsychology.

    The how-causality under these circumstances is clearly objective.  The
    hand feels heat because there is heat (or the nerve endings are being
    stimulated -- which I would also class as an objective event, though
    prone to subjective misinterpretation).  There is heat because of PK on
    the part of the agent (the friend).

    But why-causality is more relevant and less clear.  *Why* does the
    percipent (witness) feel heat at that spot?  The proximate cause is
    the same -- heat or direct neural stimulation.  One step less proximate
    is again the same -- PK.  But for the why-causality we can take one
    step further back and ask *why* the PK is being invoked then and there.
    For the answer (according to this hypothesis) we must step into the
    subjective realm -- subjective associations of the agent to some
    characteristics of the location.  This distinguishes it from later
    hypotheses in my list where characteristics of the location itself --
    without regard to personal associations of the agent -- "select" the
    location for the phenomenon (though such associations might "select"
    the agent for the phenomenon).

    So there *was* method to my madness. :-)

					    Topher

    On the night my sister died in an auto accident, my husband and
    I were watching NOVA on TV - to this day I don't remember what the
    episode was about, but I do remember that at the exact time my sister
    was in the accident, my husband and I were discussing death.
    
    After getting the call that my sister had passed away, I went back
    to bed and she visited me at my bedside "Give me a hug sister" she
    said to me (as she always did in life).
    
    When my mother and I went to visit her husband in the hospital the
    next day, I was driving down a road and suddenly said to my mother
    "This is were it happened", come to find out, it was - I hadn't
    been told were it happened, and have never been to that area before.
   (There was also no sign of an accident having happened there).
    
    To this day (6 years later), my sister still frequently visits me
    in my dreams - but mostly the dreams are that she is still alive
    and everyone had thought she was dead.  Can anyone help me with
    this?  Why do I dream that she is alive  - knowing everyone thought
    she was dead?
    
    Meg 
    

    The traditional explanation for dreams of that form (which are very
    common) is that some aspect of your mind has not yet accepted her death
    and its denial of her death shows up in your dreams.

				Topher

    Re:24.42
    Meg - My daughter died when she was 18 and I sometimes dream about her
    as well.  One night I was dreaming that we were having a party and she
    was standing beside me as I was preparing food for the party.  I told
    her that I thought she was dead and she answered that it only seemed
    that way.  A few days later I mentioned my dream to my other daughter
    and she told me she dreamed the same thing, the same night and
    described her dream which was identical to mine.  I guess it is very
    common to dream of those who have died and in our dreams they are still
    alive.  That happens often with my mother, grandmother, etc..
    but I don't understand why my daughter and I had that identical dream.
    I would welcome any ideas on the subject.

I would say that the dream both you and your daughter had could be actual
reality (not this phyisical one though) and that what your other daughter
said in the dream, "it only seems that way", is actual truth, from her point 
of view. I tend to disagree with the explanation that it is just an aspect of
the mind and think it's useful to take these dreams as real as you can.
Maybe the dream states we are in are the only time for spirits to reach most
of us because during the day we're so focused on physical reality that we
don't expand enough to 'listen'.  Why your daughter had the exact same dream
I don't know.  Maybe she wanted to visit the both of you.  There are infinitely
many realities, but if we can be in 'this one' together, why not in other ones?   

A good book to read on this is "One" by Richard Bach.  It goes into
subjects such as alternate realities and is very readable.

Paul

    Paul - thanks for your comments.  I will try to get the book and read
    it.  I have had a few other dreams in which my daughter has mentioned
    very simple truths to me.  One dream was in the chapel at church and
    she said something like "if only people would love and help one
    another - that's all there really is". I knew in the dream that she was
    dead - but I also felt that she was right there and that she could pass
    back and forth between her "now" reality and ours.  It was a good
    feeling and she looked very well. 

    re .44 and .46
    
    My mother also has similiar dreams to mine regarding my sister.
    And, we seem to have them at roughly the same times.  I strongly
    believe that she is communicating with us.
    
    A nice side note - my sister was my half sister (same father), and
    was 16 years older than me, so became like a second mother to me
    while I was growing up.  Well, I had a baby girl this past May and
    she bears a striking resemblence to my sister!  And, she seems to
    possess my sister's sunny disposition!  It's nice to kind of have
    her back again!!
    
    Meg

    My daughter died at age 6 1/2 five years ago.  A few months after her
    death I had a dream that I went to the cemetary and she was sitting on
    the side of the road near her grave.  After my initial shock, I told
    her we had to call the hospital to let them know and get her back into
    treatment for her disease (cystic fibrosis).  Her answer was "why?? I'm
    not sick any more".  I believe that was a message from her letting me
    know that she's o.k. now.  She doesn't "visit" me nearly as much as I'd
    like, but on occasion I've received other little messages from her.
    

    RE: .48  Hopkins
    
    
    I just wanted to let you know that I was touched by your note.
    Please know that your daughter feels your love.
    
    Carole

    My wife is currently experiencing some sort of presence that she
    believes is repeatedly opening locked doors in otherwise empty houses with
    her, and contacting her auditorially.  She believes that there are one to 
    three at a time, and that they are asking for me.  They say they won't
    go away until she promises to get me to contact them. 
    
    My question is :
    	Do you think I should try to protect her from them, or should I
    	try to contact them ?   If contact, what is the safest way,
    	considering that these seem neither angelic nor demonic in nature
    	in her opinion.   
    
    					todd

    Hi Todd,
    
    
    Those are the invasion of the dead spirits trying to possess your wife
    and you.  It may sounds strange but those thing does exist in this
    strata.   Allow me to explain to you even many readers of this notes may 
    not agree.
    
    
    In our body there is a subtle system:
    The left side sympathetic nervous system (libido) has the power to store 
    all that is dead in us.  It connects you with store houses of the 
    subconscious mind and also with the  collective  subconscious
    (Bhootlok or Paralok).   At the  backside of  the brain at the  apex of 
    this  channel the super ego exists like  a  balloon.   It  becomes heavy 
    by storing, the  conditioning  of the  mind  through libido.  So if the 
    tension is heavy it breaks the super ego into many fragment. If you still
    overexert  by  conditioning, a partial vacuum is created and this sucks 
    another dead personality from the collective subsconscious (Paralok) in
    your super ego. So in your pursuit of truth, if you take to futher efforts  
    and indulge in concentration in training of mind or forced abstinence or 
    forced meditation or complete slavery to emotional attachment of the mind, 
    the libido with the aid of the affected super ego may connect you to the 
    collective subconscious (Paralok) where all dead souls, bad, good or 
    saintly, exist. These souls start manifesting through you and you get 
    siddhis or extra sensory perceptions.  These are mistaken by a lot of
    people as "enlightment"!
    
    
    
    Those manifestation includes materialization power (enslaving masses for 
    money power or fame), visionary powers (Drishti siddha), speech powers 
    (Vani Siddha), curing powers (it actually replace one disease by
    another you don't know about), transcendental feeling (power of switching 
    off the mind), separation of body and many other powers are very 
    ordinarily found among those who practice the control of spirits 
    (Pretsiddhi or Smashan Vidya).  All such powers can be proved as powers of 
    the dead.  Actually these are the different subtle (dead) personalities 
    dominating us through super ego.
    
    
    These are no Divine powers because the Divine has no interest 
    in these gross subjects. The subconscious is an end by itself and one gets 
    lost who enters into its realms.   It is very dangerous to use the powers 
    of the subconscious which may become uncontrollable and torture the 
    practitioner and Sadhaka. Those who are temporarily benefited may suffer 
    irreparable loss to body, mind or grace eventually.
    
    
    I don't know if this help you or not.
    
    -Paulo

    Thanks a lot for your comments, Paulo.  Of all the possible and potential
    explanations and courses of action, I agree that the least likely 
    is that we are dealing with anything either 'divine' or 'demonic' in
    any literal sense.  
    
    Yours is a view I hadn't considered before.  I don't accept it as
    truth, as in 'this is what is happening,' but I think it might have 
    some meaning for me as regards my course of action.   I'll show it
    to my wife, too, to see what she thinks.  
    
    Thanks also to the others that were kind enough to offer feedback by mail.
    
    					todd

    Hi Todd,
    
    I would ask my wife to ask them "how" am I supposed to contact them and
    evaluate the answer that comes back. A reservation that these things can be
    playing with fire if the psyche of the contactee is not geared up to
    handle possible outcomes.
    
    -Brian 

    re: .53,
    Thanks for your comments, Brian.  

    you're being "blackmailed", Todd.  

>                -< They won't tell you what they really want! >-
>    you're being "blackmailed", Todd.  
    
    Yes, that's seems like the *safest* assumption to make, right now.
    
    	:-)
    
    	todd

    
    Why not simply ask them what they want?
    

>    Why not simply ask them what they want?
    
    I'm glad you finally got that house pried off of you.  :-)
    
    Here's the gist of the story, Mary ...
    
    They never approached me, as far as I am aware, and they refused to tell 
    the person they approached what they wanted when she asked them.  
    
    Several people were kind enough to offer theories and suggestions
    which ranged from a mild psychotic episode to a trio of directed spirit
    guides.  None of them seemed to think it was a good idea to 
    try to converse directly with whatever this phenomena was, either
    because it was psychologically unsound, psychically dangerous,
    or because the entities were likely to try to deceive us
    anyway.  
    
    Are you offering other advice, Mary ?
    
    No further contacts contacts/episodes have ensued in the mean
    time.
    
    								todd

    
    Todd,
    
    Personally, I like the psychotic episode idea....;-)
    
    
    guy

    Guy,
    
>    Personally, I like the psychotic episode idea....;-)
    
    	Ok, have fun with it.  Don't forget to come back to us, though !  ;^)
    
    					todd

    
    ...it's too late for me.....hahhahahhhhhhhhahaaaaaaa.....
    
    guy
    

    
    I'll tell you what I would do.
    
    I'd go with the person (your wife I think?) approached, to the place 
    where she was approached... then I'd ask (out loud) what they want.
    
    Your wife may be an unconscious channeller, you know.
    
    I wouldn't be afraid to converse directly with whatever the phenomena
    was... there are (I know) many who disagree with me but I don't
    believe you are in any danger either psychologically or psychically.
    
    I say this because I know you, Todd... I wouldn't necessarily say it
    to another person.
        
    That the entities might deceive you is scarcely a problem since you
    fend off deception every day through out the normal course of existence
    here in our Madison Avenue oriented society. :-) ... and knowing you, 
    I'm sure that your own good judgement and a healthy dose of skepticism 
    will keep you as safe from any spirit tricks as it does from the junk bond 
    brokers. :-)
    
    I would ask them what they want... understanding fully that you are
    under no obligation nor compulsion to respond to them in any manner 
    unless you choose to do so.... 
    
    because, Todd.... I have a feeling that this might have more
    to do with your wife becoming sensitive than with anything else.
    
    At any rate, the only way to know is to ask.  
    
    mary

    Those are great thoughts, Mary.  Thanks.
    
    							todd