Conference 7.286::sports_90

    And they picked one hell of a  town to sign that baby in, too, didn't
    they ???
    
    And if anybody ever really wants to know just how great a man was
    Thomas Jefferson, give the Declaration Of Independence a read-through.
    
    And he built a great university, too, didn't he ???
    
    Bob Hunt

Excuse me, but did I get misconnected to JINGO::LUV_IT_OR_LEAVE_IT???

It must be summer, cause the junk notes are in bloom again.

    Good note, 'Saw.  Why don't you print that, send it to Jesse Helms, and
    tell him to read it right good.  It may remind him that artists, women,
    gays, minorities, environmentalists, and children have rights too.
    
    	--dan'l

    I didn't see any *luv it or leave it* type of message in the
    basenote.  We usually set up a note for holiday wishes and such
    when they come around.
    
    Claybone

    Saw,
    
    What no reflections on the flag burning amendment?
    
    ML

   Some answers as to what happened to the 56 men who signed the
   Declaration of Independence:

   Five signers were captured by the British as traitors and tortured
   before they died. Twelve had their homes ransacked and burned. Two lost
   their sons in the Revolutionary Army, another two had sons captured.
   Nine of the 56 fought and died from wounds or the hardships of the
   Revolutionary War.

   They signed and they pledged their lives, their fortunes, and their
   sacred honor.

   What kind of men were they? Twenty-four were lawyers and jurists.
   Eleven were merchants, nine were farmers and large plantation owners,
   men of means, well educated. But they signed the Declaration of
   Independence knowing full well that the penalty would be death if they
   were captured.

   Carter Braxton of Virginia, a wealthy planter and trader, saw his ships
   swept from the seas by the British Navy. He sold his home and
   properties to pay his debts, and died in rags.

   Thomas McKeam was so hounded by the British that he was forced to move
   his family almost constantly. He served in the Congress without pay,
   and his family was kept in hiding. His possessions were taken from him,
   and poverty was his reward.

   Vandals or soldiers or both looted the properties of Ellery, Clymer,
   Hall, Walton, Gwinnett, Heyward, Ruttledge, and Middleton.

   At the Battle of Yorktown, Thomas Nelson, Jr. noted that the British
   general Cornwallis had taken over the Nelson home for his headquarters.
   The owner quietly urged General George Washington to open fire. The
   home was destroyed, and Nelson died bankrupt.

   Francis Lewis had his home and properties destroyed. The enemy jailed
   his wife, and she died within a few months.

   John Hart was driven from his wife's bedside as she was dying. Their 13
   children fled for their lives. His fields and his grist mill were laid
   waste. For more than a year he lived in forests and caves, returning
   home to find his wife dead and his children vanished. A few weeks later
   he died from exhaustion and a broken heart.

   Norris and Livingston suffered similar fates.

   Such were the stories and sacrifices of the American Revolution. These
   were not wild-eyed, rabble-rousing ruffians. They were soft-spoken men
   of means and education. They had security, but they valued liberty
   more. Standing tall, straight, and unwavering they pledged, "For the
   support of this declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of
   the Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our lives, our
   fortunes, and our sacred honor."

   How long does the struggle for our rights continue?

   As is probably obvious the struggle is eternal. There is no discharge
   from this battle. Over 200 years have passed since the signers of the
   Declaration of Independence committed their lives, their fortunes, and
   their sacred honor to the struggle for liberty. The struggle for
   liberty in the 20th century is the same struggle as it was in the 18th. 
   Only the players, the words, and the music have changed.

    Hey, who says we can't tie this into sports!?!  You history buffs
    correct me if I've got anything wrong.  
    
    Because the fighting in New England was so fierce, Cornwallis decided
    on a different strategy.  Noting that the Revolutionary soldiers were
    being fueled by supplies (food, weapons, etc.) from the south,
    Cornwallis decided to cut off this lifeline and thus, cripple the
    hard-fighting minutemen.
    
    He lead his troops down south expecting easy victory.  What he found
    was Francis Marion, the Swamp Fox of South Carolina.  Marion kicked
    British butt.  Cornwallis then decided to take Charlotte.  (For those
    of you in the area, I think the Battle of Cowpens off I-85 near
    Gastonia was the sight of one of the biggest battles of the
    revolution.)  
    
    Cornwallis' gamble backfired as the people of Charlotte fought
    fiercely.  This prompted him to retreat stating, "It's like a hornets
    nest in there."  They retreated up to Virginia where they were cornered
    on the peninsula and surrendered at Yorktown.
    
    Hope I got all the facts correct as this has been taught to me over the
    three years I've been in Charlotte.
    
    	--dan'l

Great note, Mike!

(I counted 57 names, but I counted the part that said "attested to by
so-and-so".)

I'm definitely not an "American love it or leave it".  Yes, I love this
country, not because I was born here, but because of what documents like
the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution espouse.  The
bedrock of this nation is stated also in the great speeches that her
statesmen have delivered.

Read through the Gettysburg Address sometime, or the stirring speech
given by Patrick Henry.

The beauty of our country is that the founding fathers never said
we couldn't change it.  There is no provision in our Constitution
that says we can't throw it all away....

As to the flag burning ammendment, if anyone is interested, personally
I'm not in favor of it.  One of the prices of the inalienable right
of free speech is that *everyone* must have it, even if what they
say is not something we like to hear.

I'm sorry, but censoring rock music, rap music, art, and even flag
burners is not right in my book.  If we espouse free speech, then
we must allow the speaker the right to be heard, even if it offends us.
Then, if we are offended, we make our own value judgement on the speaker.



And finally, looking back at Mike's note, I truly wonder just how many
of us, who daily reap the benefits of what those 56 men did over two hundred
years ago, would be willing to pledge our lives, our fortunes, and
our sacred honor for this country today........

    WOW, I tune into sports.note and find out all of the things I slept
    thru in high school.
    
    A safe and happy 4th to all
    
    
    JaKe
    

See Jake, SPORTS truly is the Cheers of Digital.

(Speaking of Cheers, I caught the final half hour or so of that
Clint Eastwood FireFox movie last night.  Cliffy (John Ratzenberger)
had a bit part as one of the submarine crewman that was refueling
the plane.  He was like a petty officer or something, kind of in
charge.  It was pretty funny.)

Wait till I get wound up about Veterans Day....

'Saw

    'Saw
    
    I think it's hilarious to see someone like John Ratzenberger playing a
    different part after seeing him for years as Cliffy.  I always think
    he's going to play the part AS Cliffy.
    
    
    JaKe
    

    
    Re: .11 Cliffy
    
      "Say, ah, Nawmie, didja happen to see that theah destroyah through
    yer, ah, periscope?  May you oughta fiah a couple of them theah,
    ah, whatchamacellem miss-iles at 'em, y'know?"  
    
    "I don't think so, Cliffy, I'll just have another beer."
    
    

                          I watched `Tango & Cash'

                          "FUBAR!.....Big Time!!!"

   Mike JN

    I love seeing the diversity of the noters (especially Saw). You can be
    so eloquent and knowledgeable and than raunchy and hilarious. Its
    appropriate in a sports note where athletes have to have a diversity of
    skills and use them to be successful!! Also love the Hornets lesson,
    was wondering where their name came from. Very Appropriate for sports
    note as well.

    This holiday is special for me in more ways them just the history. But
    it is the freedom of this country and the tenacity of our people that 
    give me confidence in our survival. We are going to stumble and argue
    among ourselves but we will always be the better for it. It may take
    disasters, wars, or holidays but somehow we always seem to "Rally
    around the Flag" so to speak.  

    Can you imagine 57 people at Digital being told to come up with a
    charter. First thing they do is form a committee and then in a couple
    of years come up with 57 missions and objectives that no one will ever
    understand or agree to. By then the window of freedom would have passed
    us by! And 217 years ago they did not have word processors so they
    had to only had 1 version, no 1.1 available.......:-)
    
    

    Mike JN,
    
    re:  FUBAR!....Big Time!!!
    
    you liked that too??????
    
    wheel

    
    P.S.  Another nice holiday reflection, Mr. 'Saw.  I can't wait till
    Groundhog Day to read your flowering thoughts on Punxatawny(sp?)
    Phil.
    
    Dickster
    

�    you liked that too??????
    
    wheel

   Yeah... It was kind of hokey... sort of a cross between Batman and
   James Bond...  but it made me laugh a few times... put me on the edge
   of the seat a couple of times... and generally held my interest... 
   (I never ask any more of a flick... if I want deep meaning, angst, and
   neo_pseudo_pop_psych_babble, I can always read a movie critic.)

   Mike JN

Well, kind of picking up on Bob Hunt's theme, I think there are a couple
of major factors that influenced the Declaration.

First, they decided to let one man draft it.  (Right away, that blows
the Digital method out of the water 8^))  And the man they picked
was, quite literally, a genius.

If you ever want to learn about someone who is worthy of emulation, I 
think Jefferson would be the guy.  He was a true Renaissance man.
Would that we had a few more men like him in Government today.

In fact, when you stop and think that "our lives, our fortunes, 
our sacred honor" is just about everything worthwhile about a man,
it makes you wonder just how many people would pledge that today
were the call to come...

Semper Fi,
'Saw

    Thomas Jefferson truly was a genius, Saw.  No doubt about it.  If
    you ever get the chance to visit his home, Monticello, do it.  I
    was there back in 1976, and really enjoyed it.
    
    In regards to flag burning, this past Sunday our pastor's sermon
    had to do with the Constitution.  One point he made really hit me:
    
    He said that since it was soon to be the 4th of July holiday, we
    should all go out and buy a couple dozen of the small American Flags.
    
    Display them on the holiday, then put them away until the Fall.
    
    When you are burning leaves this fall, and the police and/or firemen
    show up to stop you, just put some of the flags on the fire.  You're
    home free at that point.  "Strange document, this Constitution"
    is how he ended it.
    
    A good issue there.  It's illegal to burn leaves, but not our flag.
    
    Lee
    

Actually, burning the flag has, for years, been the approved method
of disposing of it.

In my home town, the American Legion would always make it known that
old and worn out flags should be given to any American Legion member.
Once or twice a year, they would gather them all together, and 
burn them.

Burning the flag in protest has been a recent kind of phenomenon.

Our flag represents what we are, it is not us.  Men who fought and
died didn't die for the FLAG, they died for the freedoms that we
believe in.

The most heinous part of this whole flag ammendment thing is that
this is an election year, and, politicians who couldn't even begin
to think of carrying Thomas Jefferson's jock (little sports reference
there) decided to make an issue of this "Americana" type thing.
Talk about prostitution....

Just some of my opinions.

One of these days, if I get inspired, I'll write you all a diatribe
on the Constitution....8^)

HTH,
f�

    Frank,
    
    You sentimental sap.  Everyone KNOWS that the American Revolution
    was really about Americans, those manly of men like Thomas Jefferson,
    Patrick Henry, et al, who REFUSED to play namby-pamby European games
    like Soccer.   They said, tax us without representation, impose
    your tariffs, but don't make us play any of your sissy sports. 
    The Brits refused, and decided to force a match between their elite
    guards and the Lexington-Concord Strikers soccer team.  Of course,
    the LEx-Concord boys wanted to play manly games, and refused to
    play.   They were forced into it, and the Brits, under threat of
    violence, made them play.  In a tense, poorly officiated match,
    the undermanned American squad played the Brits to a 1-1 tie.  In
    OT, however, Kyle Rote Sr. Sr., kicked a 20 footer by the outstretched
    hands of the Brit goalie.  Pandamonium reined.  Th Brits were angry,
    and took to a fit of nastiness, while the Americans rejoiced.  Rote
    was hailed as a hero, and the results of the match, when made public
    in England, caused an uproar.  The Brits sent orders to arrest the
    team, and bullwhip Rote.  Rote's kick, by now called "The Shot Heard
    Round the World" by his teammates and the various soccer groupies,
    had made the AMericans more sure of themselves.   One thing that
    came from it was the Americans, saying they proved they could play
    the stupid game, refused to play it anymore.  The Brits, of course,
    said "Play or you Die".  On their way to the rematch, with an armed
    guard, they were ambused by the Lexington-Concord second-division
    squad, "The Minutemen", sponsered, of course, by Betsy Ross' Linens'
    and Thangs, Inc.    The rest, of course, is history.  
    
    However, it shows the future vision and revolutionary thinking our
    forefathers had - knowing that people living in America would never
    want to play soccer.
    
    JD

    
    JD, somebody should have throwed your iced tea into the hahbah.
    What the hail did you put in it this morning? 8^)
    
    Dickster
    

JD --

I was *wondering* if you'd received the mushrooms I'd sent out.
Glad to know they made it okay!!!

Suck down a Red Hook for me, okay?

latered,
'Saw

    Just think, if it wasn't for them guys 2 hundred + years ago, YOU
    might have to stand in line for 3 + hours to get toilet paper.
    After a rough night of brewski's and pnuts and hard boiled eggs, that
    could cause a bunch of difficulties.
    
    
    JaKe
    

    
    Well, I'm outta here (for today, anyway).  I'm planning on a home
    Esplinade party tomorrow evening with a blanket on the floor, a
    $2.00 gallon of wine, the Boston Pops on the tube accompanied by
    the stereo simulcast blowing away the neighbors, and a mess of shrimp,
    and a block of cheese.  Oh, yeah, my bodacious wife, too.
    
    This is the obligatory "Don't get 'faced and drive" note.
    
    Avagood 1.
    
    Dickster
    

    Ever hear Bill Cosby's "Flip a Coin" routine?  It's been a long time
    since I heard it but I think it goes something like this:
    
    "I think they should flip coins before wars just like in football.  For
    instance, the American Revolution.  The ref comes out with the captains
    from both sides:
    
    'Captain from the American side, meet the captain from the British
    side.  OK captain from teh American side, you call it.'
    
    'Heads."
    
    'Heads it is!  OK, choose your war.'
    
    'All right.  Your guys have to wear bright red uniforms and march out
    in the open in straight lines.  We get to wear whatever we want and
    hide behind trees and rocks when we shoot you.'
    

   	I remember that skit.... pretty funny. You sure it wasn't a
   Newhart bit? I can't remember, but that is kind of his style, also.

   Mike JN

    RE: .21
    	Bravo JD!  The BOSS would be proud!
    
    				/Don

    Definitely Cosby -
    
    He also had bits about "Custer and Sittin' Bull"
    
    ref: Call it Cus!
    
    ref: He calls tails - its heads, OK, Sit, what will ya do?
    
    ref: OK, Cus, Sit says you and your army have to sit at the bottom of
         the hill and wait 'till he and all the Injuns in the world run
         right down on ya!
    
    Great comedy album - I think its the same one with "Noah - ping!" on
    it...

re .29:

That's correct.   I used to love to listen to his albums.

Noah, how long can you tread water?


Also, the Chicken Heart sketch is priceless....

Cos, who always does it clean.

later,
f�

Oy FrankWa,

That kid that almost got screwed out of his baseball jersey wrote me a letter!!

Did he send thank you notes to everyone??

Anyway, I was wondering if he lives in Trumboll, Tromboll, Trumbull,  or I 
suppose it could by Trombull, CT???  Could someone advise as I would like to
drop him a note back saying thanks - maybe a kinky post card from Switzerland
or something.

Sorry for answering here - somebody actually did write-lock the other topic!!
Big Brother is watching us...

rick ellis    

Rick --

Yes, he's sending thank you notes to everyone.  Several others I know
have received them.  My mom got one on Thursday.

The town is Trumbull.

I think it's be great if you dropped him a line.  I plan to when
I receive my note....

later,
FrankWa

    
>> I think it's be great if you dropped him a line.  I plan to when
>> I receive my note....
    
    Don't hold your breath, FrankWa......I told Matt not to send replies to
    girly-mon Liverpool supporters...
    
    PJ  (who won't take any ribbing until December 2nd)