Conference 7.286::sports_90

    Also in (not a complete list, just from my memory):  Tom Landry, Franco
    Harris.
    

    
    DON'T FORGET TOUGH GUY JACK LAMBERT OF THE STEEL CURTAIN
    

    
    Still no Al Davis, what a shame. Landry makes it first time around and
    ole AL die to mass predjuice s still on the outside looking in....
    
    others were Buck Buchanan and Bob StClair(I think he was a lineman for
    the niners in the early sixties and was voted in by oldtimers)...
    and Ted Hendricks...
    
    mike
    

    Is there a limit on how many an get voted in in one year?
    
    Charles

�    Is there a limit on how many an get voted in in one year?
    
    I think I remember reading that there was, and it was acheived this year.

    
    correct Mac 7 is the limit and here's a recap for all
    
    Franco Harris and Jack Lambert from Pitt
    Buck Buchanan  Kansas City Chiefs
    Bob Griese  Miami
    Ted Hendricks Raiders/Colts
    Bob St Clair O-Lineman for the Niners picked by old timers (pretty sure
    it St Clair)
    Tom Landry  Senility U.    ;^)
    
    mike

    John Mackey, the greatest TE ever to play the game (pre-Winslow)
    was jobbed again by the voters.
    
    A damned shame .....

    
    Glad to hear a good word about Mackey, DrM.  He was one of my
    favorites.
    
    The NFL Hall of Fame has some strange criteria.  More so than baseball,
    it seems that the "Fame" part of it plays a huge role.  Mackey's out,
    Ditka's in.  Guys who were fortunate enough to play on great teams
    really get a boost.  I don't want to single any one player out, but I
    don't think Bob Griese was a Hall-of-Famer.  I think John Brodie was
    better from the list of qualifiers.  Griese was the leader of some great
    teams, yes, but not a *great* quarterback.  Under these criteria, the
    Hall of Fame will soon be filled with modern-age quarterbacks and 
    running backs sporting gaudy statistics and boasting Super Bowl heroics, 
    while some great players from lesser teams go unnoticed.
    
    Wonder what's happening to Elway's stock...
    
    glenn

    Glenn, IMHO, whatever happens to Elway's stock is his own doing.....
    Argue all you want about it's a team loss and all that, but if Elway's
    the "great" quarterback that we hear about, then let him show us that! 
    He's been in the big one 3 times now, and he's gotten worse each time. 
    And, I'm not bashing the guy, just telling you what I see (or haven't
    seen).
    
    Quote in today's paper from Michael Brooks, Broncos linebacker: "We did
    not take charge.  That's what a quarterback's supposed to do."  I agree
    100%.
    
    Hawk

�    The NFL Hall of Fame has some strange criteria.  More so than baseball,
�    it seems that the "Fame" part of it plays a huge role.  Mackey's out,
�    Ditka's in.  Guys who were fortunate enough to play on great teams
�    really get a boost.  
    
    I think that is because football is much more of a team game than
    baseball.  In baseball you can accomplish many things without the help
    of your teammates.  You can't do that in football.  In baseball a
    player doesn't get much help from the team to achieve a high batting
    average, but you'd better believe that a QB won't have a good
    completion percentage without a good OL and receiver corps.

    Being a Texas newspaper, the article on the HoF inductees naturally
    centered on Landry.  In it he was credited with bringing many things to
    the Pro game.  One of them was the 4-3 and flex defenses.  These were
    supposedly designed to shut down the "daylight" that Lombardi coached
    his offenses to run to.

    
    	As a youngster I watched John Mackey play tight-end and
    that was my position in high-school and junior college.
    Although Mike Ditka was a good tight-end he should not
    have been voted into the Hall of fame before Mackey.
    	There were many a kid around the block who emulated
    big John after catching a short pass and trying to bowl over
    their buddies. (smile)
    	What exactly is the bad rap on John Mackey?
    
    	Mike

    
    Don't get me wrong.  Unlike Tarkenton, I don't think Elway's deserving
    of the HoF based on what he's done in regular season play.  We never
    hear about his performances per se, but about the "intangibles", i.e. 
    doing what it takes to win.  These Super Bowl appearances, especially 
    this past one, have been nothing but tangible, tangibly pathetic, in my 
    eyes.  In my opinion, anyone who has ever put on the Bronco uniform 
    behind Elway ought to be flat-out insulted by the insinuations that the
    Broncos are nowhere without him, which is what the media would have us
    believe.  Hell, Craig Morton, another two-time Super Bowl underachiever, 
    did as much as Elway to get his teams (including the Broncs) to the Big 
    One, versus much stiffer competition.
    
    Still doesn't change my argument that "ink" = "Hall of Fame".
    
    glenn
      
                                                                 

    re .12
    
    John Mackey challanged the NFL's reserve clause in court, much like
    Curt Flood. In fact, he won, and the NFL came up with the "John
    Mackey Rule" (?).
    
    However, the players union did not follow up on his triumph, and
    hence the NFL does not have baseball's level of free agency.
    
    I'm pretty certain that the NFL establishment (a pretty conservative,
    right-wing bunch) is behind this shafting of Mackey.
    
    I wish that some sports commentators would bring this matter to
    the public's attention. I saw Mackey plead his case on HBO's This
    Week In The NFL, and Dawson and Buonoconti did nothing more than
    mutter some cliches and go on to the next topic. Wimps ....
    
    re Griese,
    
    Glen, I agree thoroughly. Bob Griese is a good QB on a great team.
    No better than Archie Manning, IMO, but how many of you want to
    bet that he'll be in the HoF ?
    
    Griese should not be in the HoF.
    
    As for Elway, if he wins a SB, he could sit on his behind the rest
    of his career and make the HOF. Kinda like Joe Namath.
    
    BTW, one of the inductees is Bob St. Clair of the 49ers. A 6'9"
    offensive tackle, he once blocked *10* kicks (FG's & PATS) in one
    year. Phenominal ....
    
    the Doctor

    	John Mackey belonged.  I watched him play and think he's better
    than Winslow.  Remember that in San Diego's offensive scheme, receivers
    saw the ball a lot more than they did on the Colts.
    
    				/Don

    Re Mackey:
    
    Another problem Mackey ahs with getting in is that there are very
    few TE's in the HoF.  I believe Ditka was the first.
    
    Bruce

    Maybe Bruce, but Mackey was voted the Greatest TE in NFL History.
    There is no way that Ditka should have been in there ahead of Mackey.
    
    Plain and simple, it's petty, vindictive politics that is keeping
    Mackey out.

    
    Hey Dr,
    Maybe they could open a John Mackey/Al Davis wing.