Conference 7.286::atarist

    Oh, you mean the "rock monster"! Lots of players find him tough.
    One technique is to lure him to a gate, and then close the gate
    on him. The constant pounding of the gate will reduce him to rubble.
    If a gate is not handy, I found that casting a cloud of poison seemed
    to do the trick. You may want to keep the remaining small rocks
    to use in your sling, if you have one. I haven't found any real
    use for the big rocks, tho.
    
    I'm now mapping level 9, but several others have previously mentioned
    that they've finished the game - all 14 levels.
    

    Another approach, useful with other monsters too, is to back into
    a room and then move in a circle hitting it as soon as it moves
    in front of you.
    
    Let me know if you want a list of all known spells.

    While mapping out the underground dungeons, I've come across several
    areas that potentially could contain rooms. When I've tried to examine
    these via the use of the X-ray vision spell, I've noticed that some
    of these areas contain hidden rooms, and some of them in turn have
    things of value in them. While many of these rooms can be accessed
    via false walls, a pit on a higher level, or tiny wall buttons,
    there still seem to be some that can't be accessed at all, in spite
    of numerous attempts.
    
    I don't know if this is a failure on my part to detect some special
    clue(s), a game feature, or a game bug. Has anyone else run into
    this? If desired, I could post coordinates of these areas, using
    North as positive Y, and the lower left part of the 32x32 level
    matrix as the origin (1,1).
    

       On lower levels there were so many pits, secret rooms and stairs
    I had a hard time telling what was what. I do remember a couple
    of large spaces on level 7 that I never could enter.
       BTW there is another note on Dungeon Master in Weapon::cfrp.

	re .3
    
    	This list of spells should available real soon now.
    
    	Look for UNXA::SYS$USERDSK:[HASLOCK.DOOM]SPELLS.LIST
    
    	I also took a set of maps of levels 1-7 from GENIE. I will upload
    	them too, together with a version of PICSW so that you can look
        at them.
    

Like others who are at the more advanced levels of play in Dungeon Master,
we have found a number of instances where the game will lock up. This often
seems to happen when one of your party gets killed. This is a bug and there
is no way for a player to fix it. Instead, send your disk back to FTL for
a replacement. The address is:

     FTL Games
     Suite C206
     6160 Lusk Boulevard
     San Diego, CA  92121

Send no money. This info is straight from FTL themselves. I called information
to get their number, which is (619) 453-5711.

When I asked about a sequel, the woman on the phone mentioned there was
a smaller addendum (don't know her exact words) to Dungeon Master coming.
Those who sent in their registration cards will automatically be notified
when it becomes available.

   Don Peters

   I got no registration card, so I imagine that the UK has no proper
    support. However, I still play the game in the hope that I don't
    get killed! I have run in to a few problems a long way down, and
    I wonder if anyone out there can help ...
    
    
    I'm at the level where the two-sworded knights roam ... I can kill
    these after a heavy fight, but I can find no way into a couple of
    the rooms on the level - I've got into the topaz room, but there
    appears to be nothing of use there. Near the topaz room is another
    locked room ... how do I get in there ? Also, near the Darc armour,
    there is a door with no lock and no apparrent button to let me in.
    How do I get in there ? One more question ... How do I get the diamond
    edged sword on the previous level without getting gassed ?
    
    
    
    
    			Cheers,
    
    				Jamie.

    Finally. The first set of maps and the map viewer are uploaded.
    
    Look for map1.arc and picsw7.arc in unxa::sys$userdsk:[haslock.doom]
    
    Given enough interest, I'll get the other set.
    
    Note that the maps are in no way the answer to all of your problems.
    	Good Luck  
    		Nigel

             I can't help you specifically but maybe some general help. I
    finished some time ago and did not take notes.
         
         Some of the hidden (hard to see) buttons open doors that are
    not near the button. If pushed a second time may shut door again.
    
         Spoiler
    
          About locked door. As one of the knights was walking towards
    me it fell into the hard to see pit in the first room.  Later on
    I climbed down and found the fall had killed the knight.  I found
    the key I needed in his belongings.
    
          As for the diamond sword, the way I got it worked but is
    probably not the correct way.  I took the sword and waited for the
    gas to dissipate, healed then walked ahead until the gas started
    again, backed out of the gas and waited.  I did this the whole way
    out. Watch out for the darts. The sword wasn't worth the trouble.
    Hope this is a little help, I should take notes since time takes
    my memory.
    
    
  

    Hi All,
    
    	Last night, I downloaded the maps - What a super job they are
    excellent. As Nigel said they do not tell you all you have to do
    but do enable you to check if you have solved all the puzzles on
    a level.
    
    Thanks
    	John
    
    BTW - I only missed  a couple in the first 6 levels as far as I
    have got. 
    		John
    

    Re .5
    
    When I try to read your directory, I get login-information invalid
    I really could use thos maps.
    
    Thanks
    
    Joe

The second set of maps are now available.

UNXA::SYS$USERDSK:[HASLOCK.DOOM]MAPS2.ARC

Note disk does not have an I.

Good Luck.

p.s. any hints on how to avoid dying to flying serpents would
be appreciated.

		Nigel

     I used fireballs to battle the flying serpents. But if you don't
    have enough mana or strength to fight them, I found the horn of
    fear to be useful. The serpents will usually flee when you "blow"
    it.
    

    MAPS2.ARC has a file size of 0 (ZERO).  I presume theres a spell
    I have to cast to get the file to grow to its correct size :-)
    
    	Ray

    I just received version 1.2 of Dungeon Master after sending in my
    version 1.0 disk for a bugfix upgrade. Unfortunately, this new disk
    has lots of problems (gates don't open, weapons don't recharge after
    use, fireball spells never end, etc).
    
    So I just called FTL and described my problem. The rep said they
    had been having problems with their drive scratching disks and the
    drives had just been repaired. She asked for my name and address
    and promised to send me a new disk today.
    
    Incidentally, I just returned from a 10 day vacation in California.
    While there, I visited San Jose Computer, the largest Atari store
    in the States (even tho its size is only about 25' x 30' inside).
    They said their best selling software, by far, was Dungeon Master!
    The only problem is, the salesman said, is that after a customer
    has finished playing it they come in again and want a game similar
    in quality. But there is really nothing available of that caliber.
    I guess we'll have to wait for a sequel or for Ultima 5.
    

    I have just uploaded maps2.arc for the second time. This time dir
    says that there are 99 blocks of data sitting there,
    
    The arc also contains the spell list.
    
    I am finding flaws in the maps, i.e. goodies in different places so
    use at your own risk.

    I am a bit of a beginer at this game. I have got down to level three
    but canot get past the door just after "Horn of fear" can someone
    tell me how? 
    
    I have just got Nigels Spell list but which is good but havent found
    a use for the ZOKATHRA spell yet.
    
    I am also having a problem getting to see the maps could someone
    be more specific on how I should view them.
    
    Thanks in advance Mick. 

    The maps are Low Res Degas pictures. There are a number of public
    domain programs that will allow you to display Degas pictures. Some
    will even allow color pictures (like these maps) to be displayed on a
    monochrome monitor. If you like once you have a map displayed on the
    screen you can use ALT-HELP to print it out on your printer.
    
    	Ray 

    Re: .17
        Hmmm, isn't that the level where the mummy is behind the pit?
        Did you kill the mummy?
    
        You won't NEED the ZOKATHRA spell until near the end of the
        game. But I found it useful to create disposable objects that
        in turn could be set on floor "tripswitches".
    

    re .17
    	PICSW7.ARC is a shareware picture viewer that will let you view
    the maps on any monitor at any resolution. That is why it is in
    the same place as the map files. Getting prints is a completely
    different issue.
    
    		Good Luck

    
    
    	I am having immense trouble with the main hall on level three
    with several gates on each wall.  Do all need to be explored?  I
    have a compass but it's useless in the matrix.  Which are the best
    champions to take on the quest?  Do I need to use my ST on the system
    to download maps and spell lists?  Do I need a VT emulator to do
    this?
    
    I am confused,
    			Darron.
    

         About exploring all areas,   Most areas have something you
    need, some have items that are necessary to exit current level,
    such as a key to a door on current level or lower level.  Specific
    hints will be given on request. 
         
         You can probably finish the game with any set of four if you
    take your time and practice the arts. Some champions make the quest
    easier. My son and I have tried three different groups with little
    different end results.
    
    
    

    

    The rooms of the main hall on level 3 contain keys to open the four
    doors further down the main corridor. After three doors is an "Alter
    of rebirth". A fifth key is available for an anex after the doors
    but before the stairs to the next level which contains a few items
    but nothing vital (as well as "rock monsters" and another "dangerous"
    switch). In the matrix room try going round the edge and keep a
    look out for small buttons on the wall.
    
    With regard to getting the Maps I think I am on the trail. If I
    get them I will post detailed instructions on this note for all
    to read.
    
    Regards Mick

    I have heard a lot about this game, and it sounds great. Could someone
    give me a review of this game? By the way, I saw an ad for the first
    advanced Dungeons&Dragons game, and it was called the pool of something
    of other, I think. Anyone seen this around?
    
    Dave

         Dungeon Master is a role playing game in which you control
    four characters as you search the dungeon for the Firestaff. According
    to the instructions book, The Gray Lord was searching for the power
    gem, when he used the wrong spell and blew up the universe. The
    Gray Lord was split into two entities, one good and one evil.
         The Gray Lords evil side controls the dungeon but does not
    know how to retrieve the power gem.
         The first thing you will notice about this game are the graphics.
    You actually seem to be walking in a dungeon. The three dimensional
    display is more the just convincing, it is spooky. 
         You start the game by choosing four characters from twenty-four
    frozen in time on the first level. 
         You must keep your eyes open. At first the traps and secret
    levers are easy to see, but as you go deeper they become harder
    and harder to find. The monsters get tougher as you go along. My
    favorite are the scorpions.
         About the monsters, the graphics are great, skeletons look
    like skeletons, the zombies look like zombies and the red dragon
    will make you want to run and hide. Some monsters are very hard
    to kill or can only be killed by magic. Also if not killed they will
    follow you around, hitting you from behind. 
         The sound is amazing. When you get hit, you character emits
    a rather life like scream. This game made me jump more then once
    when hit by an sneak attack. Most monsters make some sound as do
    door opening and closing.
         I fell that its the best done game over all yet make for the
    ST. Or any other computer for that mater.
    
         Try it you'll like it.
         Tom
        
    
    

    re .25
    
    Well,you've convinced me! I'm halfway to the computer store right
    now!
    
    Dave

    There are apparently two different light spells one can cast - regular
    light spells and "magical" light spells. I've noticed no difference
    between the two. Is there?
    

    
    
    	Can someone tell me if food gets scarce in the deeper levels??
    I'm only at level 4 but already I have noticed a lack of food and
    water around.  How does the ranking system go?? I've a Craftsman
    Wizard, is this still a fairly low rank??
    
    TTFN
    		Darron.

        I finished the game with out ever having any real problems with
    food or water.   On lower levels you may have to go up a few, kill
    a monster or two and grab some worm steaks(etc). Always carry all you
    can and make a cache on a lower level, water is easy to find
    till level 9 after that you may need to go back and forth. 
        I can't recall the ranks but when you get real high level characters
    they will have power symbols after there rank. 

    I found that I kept running out of food and water because I would
    move in one direction, then turn around and update my map. So, to
    the game it appeared that I was wasting time, and my food and water
    ran out rather quickly. Then I discovered that the Escape key would
    freeze the game. So, for mapping, I virtually kept one finger on
    the escape key and froze the game whenever I did my map work. That
    helped tremendously. I also piled up lots of food just outside the
    "screamer room" (level 4?) and returned there several times to stock
    up. Now, I've just finished level 10, and haven't had any food or
    water problems for several levels.
    

    re: Level 2 "Choose your fate"
    
    After a few tries I have managed to get all six keys from the six
    different options.  You can only use five of the keys on level 2,
    the last gives you access to the "Short cut" which cuts out abou
    half of level 3's worm killing.
    
    re: Level 7/8 "Trap"
    
    One of the things you MUST do on level seven is open the long stairs
    with the skeleton key.  I didn't and I now find that a wall has
    closed behind me on level 8 and there is no way to get up.  I am
    stuck!  And worst of all, I had gone down to level 11 before I realised
    this.
    
    re: Indestructable knights
    
    Help! after opening the small room in the large arena on level 11
    I found a VERY nasty knight, at that point I had not used the 'Fury'
    sword.  In the hands of a wizard, you can cast fireball with it,
    (in another game I accidentaly cast it at a wall and did 220 damage
    to my party (one person survived!))
    
    So I start blasting...
    
    Ten minutes later 'Fury' is out of charges, all my characters are
    out of mana, two are dead, the other two are very ill, and I still
    have a very much alive knight on my hands.
    
    I must have thrown about 12 'Fury' fireballs (220 damage each),
    about 5 level '=' fireballs,
    and coutless hits with the diamond edged sword and fury.
    (I also threw several darts, throwing stars, and arrows at it but
    I found that they just bounced off!)
    
    Can anyone help me kill these guys?
    
    re: Elementals
    
    So far I have found two types of elementals (Fire and water).  Water
    elementals are on level 10, They are just puddles with eyes, I found
    they were quite easy (if teadious) to kill.  Fire elemantals, I
    have found one below the pits on level 11.
    
    re: The Firestaff
    
    By the way, the object of the game is not just to get the Firestaff.
    The true object is to kill (yes kill) the evil side of the grey
    lord.  To do this you nedd the firestaff, but you also need the
    power jem, then you go and kill him.  Without these things I would
    not advise attacking him as he is worse than the dragon (if anything
    can be worse)
                                      
    Sorry about the length of this note
    
    Chris (level 11 but stuck)
    

         Re: Killing the dark side, the light side with out the dark
    does not make a complete being.  Some thing interesting to do after
    getting the firestaft is going back to the top level and trying to
    get out of the dungeon. It is some what enlightening. Save game
    before entering the last passage.
    
         Re: Knights they can be killed without to much trouble if your
    party is strong enough, also they can be tricked into falling into
    the pits just inside of level 12.

    Hi,
    	I'm looking after the house of a friend while he's away on holiday.
    He's got an ST & D.M. so I thought I'd give it a try. Now I can
    'become' characters easy enough, but what next ? I simply can't
    leave the Hall of Champions. I've scanned through his book & can
    find no help. 
    
    There's a nice gate with a 'box' on the floor which goes click when I
    stand on it, but what am I supposed to do ? 
    
    	Any help for an absolute beginner ?
    
    		Stuart P.

    	Re: Getting started, You must have (4) four characters for the
    door to open.  If you have four then I don't have a clue.

    Hello,
    
    	Can anyone tell me how to get the chest from the room with
    	the eye on the wall and the switchs on the wall which will not
    	raise the doors only turn on a transporter.
    
    	Can anyone tell me how to get past the pit before the wooden
    	door on the same level.  Some writing on the wall says "cast
    	your wisdom cast your might" or somthing like that....
    
    	Thanks
    
    	Chris

    	Re: Chest and transporters, as I recall each door has a button
    beside it, pushing the button beside the door with the chest in
    it will move the chest out into the hall eventually. Keep following
    the chest to the different doors.
    
    	Re: Pit and wooden door, not much help from me on this one if
    no one else answers, I'll bring my notes in next week.
    
    	Tom,  WAITING for sequel.

    Thanks for answer number 1 should have known....
    
    Chris

    Spoiler:
    As I recall (it's been a while), there's a spell you should know at
    this point that has an effect on some doors; thus the reference to
    "wisdom".  If you get that figured out, the "might" should become
    clear.

				*** Daryl ***

    
    	ref note -1
    
        Yes I found I had to cast a unlock door spell and throw an object
    	then the door opened.
    
    	I'm now at the next level and boy is it tough.  What can kill the
    	worms?
    
    	They wiggle from the doors and I keep losing my characters 
    
    	Chris
    

    	The worms are one of the more difficult monsters to get by.
    They take a lot of hits.  Mild spoiler
    
    	This is a good level to build up food and characters. Stay by
    a door, or know where one is, so you can escape easily. Have cure
    poison and healing potions ready.  Take your time, once you can
    can get by the worms, fighting on the next couple of levels will
    be easy.

    Current Notes magazine (I think) had a note saying that if you are
    experienced in Dungeon Master, to try playing the game with just
    one member in your party instead of 4. They claim it can be done.
    My teenage son has started again, with one member, and so far has
    gotten down to level 6. As he found out early on, you can't afford
    to get "killed", as there is no one else in your party to ressurect
    you!
    

    Hello,
    
    My boys are driving me crazy .  They are on I think level2 or 
    level3 an can't get by a door that has no button or key.  On the
    wall beside the door is written something like this "don't let a
    closed door stop you".  Any Help?
   

    
    re. -.1
    
    Just from memory... spoiler:
    
    Have you got an axe or a falchion?
    
    
    Mat.   *:o)

    Thanks that was just the ticket!

    I've gone through level 1 several times but there is one chest
    behind a force field (looks like a transporter field) that I
    can't get to.  Also, around the corner is a door that saids something
    to the effect that I can't enter.  Any help on these? 

    
    re .-1
    
    Isn't this the same problem as before... it's a long while since
    I played Dungeon Master so perhaps I'm wrong?
    
    Spoiler?:
    
    If you get through the door, you can get the chest... both problems
    solved in one!
    
    To get through the door, use a weapon.
    

    
    Help ---
    
    	I'm on the 4 ? - Its the one with the first apperence of eyeballs
    	and rather thin attackers.  What I cant to is as follows:
    
    
    		1.  The room with the portcullis and transporter
    
    			I  cant get behind the portcullis
    
    		2.  Cant find the key that opens the door after the
    		    door with "I Hate Cowards".  Ive found the black sword
    		    and other bits and pieces but no other key.
    
    		3.  Cant get past the room with the portcullis which is
                    protected by the two transporters...
    
    
    
    	Any help

    
    Again from memory...
    
      
    	Possible spoilers?
    
    
    1.  Do you mean the room with portcullis, transporter, pit and lever?
        If so, experiment with throwing things at the transporter field.
    
    2.  Can't remember, but will try to find out if no-one else answers
        first.
    
    3.  If you mean the transporters which flash on and off...  for
    	each transporter, you must run through when it is off for a
    	moment.  This is quite difficult, and if you get the timing
   	wrong on either, you will be sent back to before the first
    	transporter.
    
    	What I do is use the keyboard (ie. anticipate when the field
    	is about to switch off, and hit the up arrow fast).
    
    	Oh.  Almost forgot.  Before you go through the second trans-
    	porter, I think you have to open the portcullis behind it.
    	As far as I know, you can only do this with a spell.  The spell
    	must also be cast when the transporter switches off!
    
    	After all that typing, I hope I got the right problem!
    
    	Mat.
    	*:o)
    
    	PS  Shouldn't all this be in the GAMES conference?

    
    Thanks for the help...
    
    1.  Will try the throwing did, not think of that !
    
    2.  The flashing transporters  !!  I have run through them even with
        all my men naked but I did not get very far will try again.
    
    
    	Regards,
    
    	Chris

    You can get through the flashing transports by using both mouse
    and keyboard. You can also hit the button on the protcullis this
    way. I didn't need to get the party naked either.
    
    The room beyond contains the key that you need.
    
    How does one get into the room in the I HATE TO BE IGNORED room?
    I mean the one opened up by a trip pad. I've tried piling 8 falchions
    and 8 wooden shields on the pad but it only seems to work when the
    party steps on it.

    re:.49 and .50  some help follows line feed.
    
    	49   1. Throwing did not work for me, try putting a heavier object
    like a shield, low in the transporter. 
    
    	49   2. There are two sets of two transporter. You have to
    time them just right.  I found it easier to move twice, stop then
    move the last two.
    
    	50   You must get at party of skeletons to stand on the trip,
    then either freeze them or move fast into the open door.  If you
    have killed all the skeletons, leave the room for awhile and come
    back.
          
        More spoilers in the form of questions.
    
    	I finished long ago and now my son is trying the game and has
    a two questions I can't answer.
    	1. On level seven,level with keys of Ra, there are four small
    rooms but only one key that I could find. Has any one opened the
    other three rooms. I finished with out open three of the rooms.
    
    	2. On level eleven, there are three doors close together, with
    one key on the floor between them.  The one key opens any one of
    the doors and I also found one in the COIN room but could not find
    the third key.  I got through the game without opening these doors
    but my son wants to open every door. Can anyone help?
    
    	Tom
      

    re:51.1	Unless you allow yourself to be killed in order to
    		open up each of the doors, it would appear that you
    		make your best guess. What's behind the door may
    		have something to do with the elemental directly
    		behind it however.
    
    re:51.2	The door to the right has lot's of Blue beastees
    		(you know the ones with the club)But i have only
    		found some coins for the coin room and some food.
    
    		The door to the left has many of the flying "bee"
    		type creatures that sting, (need lots of poison
    		potion or clouds here) but could find nothing else
    		of any value here other than what was mentioned about.
    
    		Never seen the middle door!!
    

    
    1.	On the level of the Firestaff there is a room just before the
    corridor with the elementals in passages off. In this room there
    is a hidden door to another room which has a stone giant in it.
    (seen with the see through solids spell) How do I get into this
    room? How do I get through the door?
    
    2.	Having got the Firestaff and the Gem and escaped the dragon
    I found that my retreat through the passage on the Dark Lord level
    had been blocked. I have never found the key to open the 'back stairs'
    door at the dragon level. How do my players escape?
    
    3.	Killing the dragon is fun. He is slow and clumsy and easily
    avoided. Killing the Dark lord seems to be impossible... help!	

    Spoilers follow
    
    Maybe major spoilers
    
    1. I not sure but I think you are missing a secret door.
    
    2.  Once you get the gem there is no way out, All ways are
    blocked. The end game is the only way out.
    
    3. I don't think you can kill the firelord. There are scrolls
    in the dungeon that hint at how to take care of him.  
    
    Bigger spoiler follows
    	Think of the good and bad side of the wizard and what you have
    that could correct the separation.

    I am new to this conference but this note is just what i needed,
    i cannot find the Vorpal Sword anywhere, is it behind the portculis
    in the room on level 6 with the trap and three presure points that
    i cannot get behind or is it behind the wall with the pressure points
    that the skeletons must stand on.?? I don't think i will survive
    level 7 without the sword.!!
    
    
    Cheers,
    Giles.

    Also while i am on the subject, where do i get the degas image from
    because those maps would be very usefull.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Giles.

    I have finally crept down to level 11 and I seem to be stuck.
    
    How do I let the knight out of the tiny room in the middle of the
    big room and how do I open the door in the corner of the level next
    to some of the DARC armor?

    	Most of the doors on the level with all of the knights are opened
    from switches a long way from where the doors are located. 
    	Some spoilers minor
    
    	The small room door button is in first room to the right of the
    room with the holes in the floor, the ones you almost cant see, the
    room just past the one with the locked door.  Sounds confusing.
    	The other room button I think you want is past the second locked
    door in the same direction.  

    A neighbor's son need some help.
    
    1. How do you open the secret door in the room with the clean flask
       and sundry supplies on level 7 in the Firestaff's tomb?
    
    2. How is the Dark Lord killed? Does fluxcage affect him? Spells?
       Fuse?
    
    I've never played the game so I don't really understand these
    questions, if they don't make any sense let me know.
               
    

    Re -1                                                  
    
    I too would like to know the answer to question 1.
         
    All i have left of the game is to kill the dark lord, i think you
    have to surround him in a fluxcage box and then use the fuse to
    destroy him. On this level what is in the little room at the far
    end with a deamon(s) in it, treasure wise.
    
    After you kill the Dark Lord, what do you do then.?
    
    

    	Spoiler about Dark Lord follows
    
    	I don't think it is possible to kill the Dark Lord, in any case
    this is not the way to correctly win the game.
        
         Have you tried to take the staff, before you get the gem,
    out of the dungeon?  You may want to save the game on a extra disk 
    before you get to near  to the exit door. 
    
    Big big spoiler
    
    	You have the right idea with the fluxcage and fuse.  The easiest
    way I have found is to try and get him in a corner, then put a fluxcage
    on either side of him. Then hit him with the fuse. It may take a little
    while to get it right.	
    	The item in the small room is handy for helping with the dragon, or
    the fireball throwing monsters on level 13.  But if you can get to the
    item you probably don't need it.
    	Tom

    -The best way of getting rid of these nasty little critters I've
    yet found is simply to keep zapping them with fireballs. Its best
    to keep them at a distance, as they have poisonous bites(the effects
    wear off after a short time so unless you have a really sick character,
    let them sleep it off). I thought they were bad until I met the
    giant scorpions!!!! - Nick F/S Leatherhead UK

    -WHOOPS! I should have read the date before replying to a year old
    prob.
     Anyway, does anyone in the States know anything about the Dungeon
    Master sequel which I understand is due to be released over here
    pretty soon. If so is it up to the standard of the original?-Nick(again) 

    Do anyone know when this game is over, is there any way out after
    getting the firestaf and killing the dragon, what I should do with the
    Dark lord ? Please help me I'm gonna be grazy...
    
    Mika.
    

    	There is a large note in the Amiga notes file covering D.M. 
    End game help is covered.  If you can't access this note let me know an 
    i'll post help here. 

    I have managed to get to the level with a message:
    
    
    	When is a Rock Not a Rock
    
    I presume as there is no way out I have to discover what its means
    
    
    Can anyone help ?
    
    Regards,
    
    Chris

    I am sure that I have seen the answers to both of the preceeding
    questions here in this very topic.
    
    re .66
    There is indeed a way out and it does not require the use of magic.
    
    re .64
    You have to use the firestaff on Lord Chaos. Make sure that he can't
    avoid what you try to do to him.

    Hello,
    
    Can anyone help...
    
    I have been to the bottom of the dungeon and I had two RA keys.
    So I have both doors opened
    However, I need another does anyone know where it is ?
    
    I don't want to read the rest of the help in this note as I don't want
    to spoil whats left...
    
    Thanks in advance...
    
    Chris

    RE: .64
    
    In your question about what you should do with the Dark Lord, you
    should set up a fluxcage with the firestaff in front of him then when
    he moves into the cage (because he always moves the way he is facing)
    zap him with the 'fuse' command of the firestaff.  They Grey Lord will
    then appear and thank you for solving the game.  The object of the game
    is to capture the Dark Lord, not kill him.
    
    
    Wescott  (age 12)
    
    P.S.  If anyone has any hints on how to beat up knights, let me know.

    A complete set of maps, a comprehensive spell list and a guide to
    the attributes of all available characters is available over the
    net in postscript form, at
    
    DISTR1::DM.PS  (Size about 8200 blocks)
    
    DISTR1 is at 41.641
    
    Jon.

	Does anyone know what the rabbit's foot does?
	
	And on level 3, what does the big `eye' on the back wall of the
chamber of the guardian do?

thanks,
--mikie--

    Pick up the mirror and place over the eye... See what happens...
    
    
    I am on the level of the snake ---
    
    
    	Help please grovel grovel help !!!
    
    
    	How do I get to the next level.
    
    
    The stairs I have found just lead to the clockwise room....
    
    
    Cheers,
    
    Chris

    	Spoiler follows
    
    	I'm not sure if you start clockwise or counter clockwise, you'll
    have to try both ways.  Start in one direction and go half way around
    the square, reverse directions to the starting point, if the starting
    point is different reverse directions again and you will come to a
    door.  You will need to repeat these steps to find the key and a few
    other items.
    Tom

	Still, does anyone know what the rabbit's foot does?  Make you lucky?
--mike

    I've got a question.  Is there any easy, or easier, way to kill the
    stone golems on level seven than just to open the door smash them with
    magic and slam the door on them, while you are hacking away?
    
    Wescott

    AAAAANNNNNNNYYYYYYYYYBBBBBBOOODDDDDDDY
    HHHHHHOOOOOOMMMMMMMMEEEEEEEEE????????????????????????????????????????

    Couple of helps:
    
    
    
    
    1. The knights - keep bashing at them or get them to stand in a
    door way and drop the door on them.
    2. The water monster - try spells that destroy non-physical beings.
    
    
    Chris

    Can anyone tell me what spell I need to cast for the x-ray vision?
    
    I know there are a few hidden rooms around and would like to use
    this spell now and then to check them out before going in
    
    Thanks in advance
    

    WELL, I can give you the names of the symbols.
    
    here they are
    
    
    
    POWER FIRST (WHICHEVER YOU CHOOSE), OH (THIRD IN ELEMENTAL LINE, EW
    (SECOND IN FORM LINE), RA (SECOND TO LAST IN CLASS LINE)
    
    WESCOTT

    Wescott, thanks for the answer to X-Ray vision.
    
    Do you know where there is a list of all the spells?  I don't have
    a modem so can upload.  Is there a list somewhere in NOTES?
    
    Thanks again for your help, I am now on level 5 and still battling
    with the combination room.  I have solved the combination once,
    but cannot remember what it was.  Never mind ... I have not got
    that many more to try out!!!
    
    I started all over again and now all my character are adept wizards
    and priests and also they have varying degree of ninja and fighter
    levels too.  This practice makes perfect motto really does work
    but it also take a lot of patience.
    
    Collette

    Can anyone tell me what the difference is between the following
    
    a GREEN magical box  (which has only one option - to freeze life)
    
    and a BLUE magical box (which also only freezes life)
    
    
    

  Further to 12.80....
  
  Another request for a list of spells, available to those of us stranded 
  without modems. Could someone please make the list available.
  
  Thanks a lot,
  J.O.H.N

    re:12.70
    
    I am unable to get hold of the .PS file indicated. I've tried to copy
    previously and got an ACP failure. I'm now using FTSV and am failing on
    remote node not currently reachable. Has anyone succeeded in copying
    the file over - is it just a case of waiting for the node to come back
    up, or will I still get some failure?
    
    J.O.H.N - who's been waiting 2� weeks for DM to arrive mail order.....
    

    re -1.
    
    John et all,
    
    DISTR1 is no more!! I will endeavour to scan in the maps and spell
    lists again and make the file available on a more stable platform!
    
    Jon.
    

    
    Level 8 and stuck ...
    
    I have opened the secret door with the skeleton key, but the stairs
    down in that corridor just seem to go down and down with no way
    out !  I know there are more stairs nearby, through the secret door
    behind the skeleton corridor ... but how do I open it ?
    
    Neil

    	Spoiler follows
    
    	There is a door, in a passage, in the west wall. You may need a key
    to open the door.  If the door needs a key there is one on the floor
    near the north wall, very hard to see.  There are a lot of push buttons
    and secret doors on this level.
    Tom

    Another request for a list of spells and maps. I can use all the help I
    can get.
    Kicking_Monster_But_and_taking_names

    And yet another request from me......I have a copy of some of the maps,
    but, they are not complete. I have mapped on my own as well, but, I
    know they aren't complete. I had an original copy of the spells list as
    well, but have recently lost it. Please, Please, Please, could someone
    make these available....... 
    
    Lost ON level 5 again.....
    
    Swaff
    

    	I just got off the phone with the Software Discounters of America,
    which has on the shelf, copies of Chaos Strikes Back.  Cost $25.00
    while supply lasts.  This is not an add for the above named company. 
    	If anyone is interrested their number is 800-225-7638. I have
    ordered many times thru this company with no problems. There add is in
    most any issue of Start magazine.
    
    	Tom
    
    
    

Back in .33 (about a year ago) Stuart asked how to open (or get passed) the
first gate. Well we just got Dungeon Master and are in the same boat. We have
spent 3 or 4 hours with DM and have not been able to figure out how to get any
further than picking the characters. No one answered the question when
Stuart asked but I'm hoping I'll have better luck. How do you open the gate at
the VERY BEGINNING of the game? We've tried clicking on it, casting spells,
hitting, shooting arrows etc.. Nothing seems to work. I'm not much of a 
game  player in fact I just recently purchased my first few games for the ST. 

Any help on getting started on playing DM would be greatly appreciated.

  Thanks,

	Ray

    Well,
    	The answer was very clever backup protection !
    
    I first run with a backup copy, and of course all things looked swell,
    you just couldn't get past the gate. The moment I ran with the real
    copy (Which I hate doing, I'm so nervous about corruption), all went
    well!
    
    	Stuart P. 

Thanks to the two responses on my problem of not being able to get past the
first gate.

There is NO button beside the gate (which I think is how you are suppose to
open it). This fact and the two response indicate that the disk I have is a
backup (bad one) of an original. The disk I am running from has the dungeon
master label on it (ie: looks like the original disk) but as I bought the game
used anything is possible. Sounds like I need to contact the person who sold
me the game and find out what the story is.

Thanks for the quick response and usefull information.

	Ray

    I bought CHAOS yesterday, but have only had an hour on it. The
    difficulty level seems to start about where DM left off.... so you
    need some powerful characters to start with (I lost two 2nd level
    master wizards in the first room the first time I played).
    
    Basically, if you liked DM you'll love this. If you havn't played
    DM, you will spend a lot of time dead...
    
    		Merry Christmas
    
    			Roger

    Hi,
    
    Ok, i know this is a bit late and you all seem to have done DM,
    but, i would like a copy of the maps and spells (if they still 
    exist) but does anyone have them in .LN03 format?
    
    Waiting in keen anticipation....
    
    Lewis.

	Hi,

	I've had both Bards Tale I & Dungeon Master for quite awhile,
	and upon first playing them i thought they were great !

	But after 2/3 weeks and not getting very far i gave up on 
	these. Having seen the depth of both games (in notes) when a 
	little futher into them, i have decided to start up again.

	As you probably all know when, after a couple a weeks when they
	still seem the same as when you first bought them, they seem
	to lose their appeal .

	As i am not too good at these kind of games i tend to get
	extremely frustrated when, after mapping, i end up in a dead
	end and die (especially in DM !).

	Most of the problem seems to come from my mapping and i was
	wondering if anybody had any tips on mapping.
	Some other causes of problems is the 'hidden' things. How do
	you know where a secret passage is in DM without walking into 
	a wall all the time and causing damage to your characters ?

	Is there someway you can tell ?

	I have an ST, and would also like to know if there are any
	differences between the 2 machines for each game.

	If anybody has any helpful tips on these sorts of games it would
	be most appreciated in this direction.

	~lewis.

	a_soon_to_be_very_fustrated_DM/BT_player.

	N.B. 	I am posting this on both DM and BT notes for both
		Amiga and ST.
    

    I find it boring to map. I didn't map DM and managed to complete
    it; you tend to get a "feel" for the dungeon after a while. However,
    I probably missed a few secret room that I wouldn't have done if
    I'd have mapped the game (but then I probably would have got sick
    of the game before finishing it). I think the loss of continuity
    you get when mapping really screws up a game. You can at least cut
    your losses when walking into walls but first casting the "look
    through solid objects" spell to see if there's anything on the other
    side. Mind you, you only get hit for 1 or 2 damage anyway, so it's
    not going to hurt you TOO much ;-)
    
    It's definitely worth perservering with though; it's a great game.
    
    
    
    				Jamie.

FYI: Regarding notes .91 and .93 (my having trouble getting past the first
gate) -

It was indeed a problem with the disk, which FTL has since replaced (no
charge) with a new disk (two weeks from the time I mailed out the bad disk).
The new works great and we (wife, three kids, and myself) are all happilly
trying to figure out how to get more light now that our tourch has gone out.

Thanks again to those who help in determining the problem.

	Ray (getting my chance at becoming a DUNGEON MASTER :-)

    On the subject of mapping, have just read in New Computer Express that
    the author of Dungeon Master Editor is just about finishing the sequel.
    This is for Chaos Strikes Back. Surprise surprise.
    
    I don't like mapping either.
    
    Carl
    
    
    

What is a "Dungeon Master Editor"?  Taken on it's own it sounds like it allows
you to create your own dungeon. Taken in the context of your note it sounds
like it is a tool for mapping the dungeon.

	Ray

    DM Editor, I suppose when all is said and done, is a cheat program. It
    contains maps for all the levels of the Dungeon. In addition, if you
    feed it your party's present position (DMGAME.DAT), you can edit away
    impassable sections of wall. You can also use global cheats like OPEN
    ALL DOORS. These latter I don't use personally (OK, I was forced to
    open just one wall), as they're definitely spoilers. The maps might be
    spoilers too ... but they're good if you find the mapping aspect of the 
    game a chore. 
    
    I'll give you the address of the company tomorrow ... unless someone
    knows it now.
    
    Carl
      

    
    To get more light (this is from memory)  try 1 4 and cast...
    from the spell list...
    
    Chris

But - Ray, I hope you brought along a magik user }8-)}

			Bill

    Dungeon Master Editor is by Edward Penman. The company that owns it is
    SOFTEX; and they're at:
    
    		212-213 Broad Street
    		Birmingham
    		B15 2JP
    		England
    		(021) 643 8358
    
    The cost is about 9 pounds.
    
    Carl
    

    To the person who asked about walking into walls, the see through
    walls spell is not of much help. It shows if there is space behind
    the wall, but not if the wall is an illusion. The easiest way to
    check (and avoid bloodied noses) is to fire an arrow at the wall
    or stand back and throw an object. If it disappears, thats yer illusion.
    By the way, dont be tempted to throw a fireball if you're standing
    up close......                                       
    
    Adam.

Hi,

Does anybody have any valid pointers to the location for the Maps and Spells
for Dungeon master.

Most preferably I would like the PS file. But if you have the file that used to 
be located in UNXA::SYS$USERDSK:[HASLOCK.DOOM] I would be happy.

Thanks for any help !!

/Stefan

I just uploaded the file DMASTER.ARC which can be copied from -
	OLDTMR::$1$DUA8:[WALLACE.PUBLIC.ST]
It contains dungeon master maps (in low res degas format), spell list, list of
valuable items available on each level, a program from easily manipulating
multiple saved games.

	Ray

    
    
    With regard to an earlier note about getting stuck in the Hall Of
    Champions I am in the same situation. I have four champions and
    can open the door but from there I can't seem to get into the dungeon.
    
    I don't mean to seem totally stupid but could someone please tell
    me how they entered so I can enjoy the game. I'm starting to get
    to know the Hall Of Champions Like the back of my hand ;-).
    
    Thanks,
    
    Rob.

    
    	Hello,
    
    	You should pass a gate, when you step up to it it opens,
    	from here on you are in the Dungeon proper ---
    
    
    	Chris

    re .107
    
    	I domnloaded the file DMASTER.ARC,but when I tried to dearc
    it with arc.ttp,the ST bombed
    
    	Is the problem with me or the arc file.
    
    	cheer
    		Brian..

If you downloaded it using KERMIT then the download probably corrupted the arc
file. You will have to run DMASTER.ARC thourgh cvtarc (with v option) on the
VAX and then download it again.


	Ray

I just looked for a copy of DMASTER.ARC at
OLDTMR::$1$DUA8:[WALLACE.PUBLIC.ST] but couldn't find it.  Has it moved or
been deleted?

mike

DMASTER.ARC has been deleted. Can someone who has copied DMASTER.ARC make a
copy available to Mike please?

	Ray

>
>DMASTER.ARC has been deleted. Can someone who has copied DMASTER.ARC make a
>copy available to Mike please?
>

Yes I still have it available on the net, together with some other DM files.
Regarding the maps I have had some problems converting them to something 
printable in either Postscript or sixel, but in the same directory you can find
the file DM.PS that contains all the 14 maps.

The files are available in STKEIS::ROOT$IS:[BYSTAM.DM]

Directory STKEIS::ROOT$IS:[BYSTAM.DM]

1SECRETS.DOC;1     
ALLLEVEL.TXT;1     
DM.PS;1            
DM.TXT;1           
DMASTER.ARC;2      
DMMAP1-7.ARC;2     
DMMAP8-14.ARC;6    
DMSPELLS.TXT;1     
DMSPELLS.ZOO;1     

Thank you.  I really appreciate the files.

mike

    According to the May issue of ACE magazine, the cursed armour of
    the knights is untrue ... it's not cursed at all. Can anyone confirm
    whether this is true?
    
    Regards,
    
    Carl

    Hi,
    
    Somebody's gonna shoot me but.....
    
    Where can you get the ps format maps from (8200 blocks size!) I have
    read this conference and the Amiga one to no avail...... I am
    desparate!!
    
    PLEASE help - I am at my wits end!!!!
    
    Thanks, Dave 
    

    Dave,
    
    	As I speak (type ?) I have just copied it to YOUR default
    decnet account (COMICS::).
    
    	If it gets deleted before you grab them,  mail me.
    
    		Stuart P.

    If anyone else wants a copy:
    
    		bbunny::sys$public:dun.ps
    
    Cheers,
    
    Chris

    Hi,
    
    Thanks all! You've just made an adventurer extremely happy. Still,
    having the maps doesn't make the game much easier!!!
    
    Dave.
    

Call me old fashioned, but I'm just getting into Dungeon Master, and I am
stuck :-(

I'll hide my question behind a spoiler just in case I'm not the only person
who hasn't finished this game yet.

** Spoiler alert **


I've just come down the stairs and into the clockwise room. I've been around
the room in both directions and have found the sabre, some leg plate and an 
iron key. the problem is that I get to a keyhole and I don't have a key to fit.

(I've got an iron key, a gold key leftover from a higher level, a RA key and
a skeleton key, but none of them work).

Have I missed an important key somewhere ??

Any and all help appreciated !

Cheers,

    Derek.

    	The key that you need is in the clockwise room.
    
    	Did you notice the wall where its written,TURN BACK.
    
    	Try going around backwards.
    
    
    			Brian.

Thanks for the help Brian - I must be nearly there now but I'm still a
bit stuck ...

** Possible spoiler (but I doubt it !) **


I've walked backwards round the room (why didn't *I* think of that !?), and
I've found the locked portcullis-type door. I opened this with the iron
key (found earlier in this room) to get at a chest. The chest contains a
'solid key' which fits in the ornate lock with no door next to it later on
in the clockwise room. 

So I've fitted the key in the lock and .... nothing. Have I opened a door
which is elsewhere in the clockwise room ? I've even tried going back to the
stairs then up a level and back down via the stairs accessed using the
skeleton key to see if I could get at the rest of the clockwise room level that
way, but no joy.

What does unlocking the 'solid key' lock do ???

Please help !

Cheers,

    Derek (who can't wait to get out and try the 'morningstar' weapon !)

	Well, I guess by now, you are fighting for your life. It is 
	just amazing that in this game, when you open a door, that all
	of a sudden, you find yourselfs face to face with a foe that
	just seems impossible to beat. What you have to do to get out,



	is go to where you found the chest. You will find that the
	wall behind it, is now open for your use

Thanks for the help - I'll try it tonight.

Cheers,

    Derek.

(Mr Moderator - .0 should have been a reply to my 12.123, could you move
it please ?)