Conference misery::feline_v1

I saw part of it last night but got way too distressed to watch the whole
thing.  I've never seen anything so horrible on television and can't believe
that they really showed what they did.

This company supplies laboratory animals.  They showed the company president
swear that they never deal in live cats (saying that they provide a service
by selling dead cats from shelters) but then showed how the company truly
treats live cats.  The person who supplies the company with cats has been
indicted for, I believe, falsifying records showing that he had the owner's
permission to dispose of their cats when he didn't.  The whole thing was
incredibly gruesome.

Pam

    The truth IS horrifying.....and unfortunately, not enough
    people are willing to become involved or are educated enough
    to even recognize cruelty/abuse of animals.
    
    L-

    Did anyone see the 20/20 news broadcast on the VA hospitals? That sure
    caught the public awareness. I am sure that all the reaction was not
    from people who have have a veteran in their family. However, it has 
    now gone into a complete investigation on the federal level. The one
    hospital administrator has already resigned.
    
    I personally do think these "horror" news casts get results. The shock
    that they make brings up the justice/injustice feeling in most humans.
    Remember the baby seals....?
    
    Barbara 
    

    I listened but I covered my eyes.  Apparently the company has
    been indicted or somesuch.  It might pay for people to contact 
    their local high schools and find out just how they obtain the
    animals in their biology classes.  Thank God cat dissection wasn't
    required when I took biology;  I might have actually done
    it, being young and ignorant and then had to live with that the
    rest of my life.
    

    
    	Well I can say that I'm glad I didn't know anything about
    	this.  How truly awful.  I too hope that this will raise
    	someone's awareness....anyone.
    
    	re: -1  Senior year advance biology in my school was required
    	to dissect cats.  Fortunately I wasn't smart enough for that
    	class so I didn't have to deal with it directly.  However,
    	I *did* have a study hall in that classroom.  It's very hard
    	to concentrate on your studies when all you can smell is
    	formaldehyde and know that there are 15 cats behind you 
    	that are waiting for the next class.  If I had been smart
    	enough for that class I would have refused.  I probably would
    	have failed a semester but I still wouldn't do it.  Baby
    	pigs were bad enough my junior year.....
    

    I had a hard time dissecting a frog!!!  I would have never done that to
    a cat - never, never, never - it upset to hear that they even did that
    back then & especially now!!!
    
    

    I had a tough time dissecting a worm (I *hate* worms!!!!)
    
    Ms. Packer, our biology teacher, had us dissecting rats too.
    I couldn't touch the stuff.....I'll never forget her, as she ripped
    the stuff off the bones and made an analogy to chicken legs......I
    still couldn't do it.
    
    I was ill when I found out they did the same to cats.....I decided then
    that `biology' wasn't for me.

    I can't believe that you do that in Biology - cut up cats and pigs!
    That is revolting! I'm sure we don't have that in the UK - we stop at
    rats, fish and eyes and THAT is horrible enough. I couldn't face
    biology at school either - we used to call it bilge  :-}
    Anyone in the UK know what people do in biology these days.
    
    Yuk, what a rotten start to the day.
    
    Lisa plus PR&F
    

    I think that some of you missed the point here.  Dissecting was not the
    issue.  This company that was filmed is supposed to pick up cats that
    have already been put down by the local humane society and transport
    them to schools and universities.  Instead, they have been abducting
    LIVE cats, people's pets, dumping them into gas chambers and for those
    that did not die, drowning them.  It was appalling!!  Some of these
    poor creatures were STILL twitching when they pumped the formaldihide
    into their bodies.  Inhuman, horrible and extremely cruel!!!  THAT is
    what upset me.  I really hope that this kind of activity can be
    stopped.  I can't imagine anyone being capable of inflicting such pain
    on an innocent little animal.
    
    Arlene

    There is one very positive point to that newcast folks.  Not too long
    ago something like that NEVER would have made it to a major channel
    on prime time TV because NO ONE WOULD HAVE CARED! (By no one I mean
    the general public).  The fact that that was aired as it was indicates
    a shift in the general public's views on animal rights.  Keep Pushing!
    We're obviously making progress.
    
    I didn't see the broadcast (thank God!) but I heard about it from
    two other Feliners.  I called PETA.  They had some advice about what
    WE can do to help.  I'm not sure its ok to post it here since it
    involves letter writing, but contact me via VAXMAIL and I'll tell 
    you what they said.  They are very much away of Carolina Biological.
    The USDA is investigating this issue currently.  What we need is
    Federal Legislation protecting animals from "bunchers". Those people
    who go around collecting animals froms shelters and wherever else they
    get them from and selling them to places like CB.  
    
    Also, there are alternatives to disection and the schools should be
    made aware of these alternatives.  I am planning to get more info
    on this.
    
    Finally, Years ago when I was in Nursing school at MGH we were given
    cats to disect.  We worked in teams.  (This was before I ever had
    my first cat)  The first day I worked away with my team, but the 
    second day, after things had had some time to sink in, I became
    aware of what it was we were disecting and I refused to touch it
    again.  Now that wasn't such a big stance because there were two
    others in the group who would do the work, but that was when I made
    the decision to NEVER again disect anything.
    
    I think most of the battle is being made aware of what you're doing.
      Nancy DC
    

    re: .9
    I think you missed a very important point too.  If there wasn't
    a market for these animals bunchers would be out there stealing
    and gassing them!  We need to put these #$&($^@^'s out of business!
    

    Ok, one more point.  There have been laws up for consideration
    concerning "pound seizure" which is the practice of obtaining animals 
    from pounds for various uses - disection, lab research etc.  Many 
    people believe, and I agree, that there is something particularly 
    heinous about taking an animal that was formerly a pet and used to 
    kindness from humans and subjecting it to the tortures that occur in 
    labs etc.  I agree!  The legislation would make it illegal for any 
    institution to purchase lab animals from "bunchers" or to obtain them 
    from shelters.  That would definitely put a kink in CB's operations.  
    
    The woman I spoke to from PETA is from North Carolina and she said
    NC has NO legislation to protect animals from this sort of abuse.
    What dead animals are used for is one issue, but the right to a
    humane death is a BIG ISSUE.
      Nancy DC

    

       I saw this sickening report, and it seems that ALL of the noters
    here missed some aspects of it....
    
       (1)The company---Carolina Biological---is the largest supplier of
    boilogical specimens in the country. They supply everything from
    tarantulas to ant farms to schools. According to their LICENSE, they
    are ONLY to supply cats that have been humanely euthanized by
    vets and pounds. They are NOT to have any live animals nor do they have
    any license to kill animals. A reporter interviewed on of their Vice
    Presidents on the air, and this slime-bag LIED and said they "never" had
    any live cats. When confronted with the photgraphs, he almost had a
    stroke...(I wish he had!!). Then he did admit to this. The company is
    presently under Federal investigation for this and other possible
    violations of the law.
    
      (2)There is an individual who supplies most of the live cats to this
    institution. This reincarnation of Mengele has been arrested and
    charged in other cases for violations of the law. HE is the one who
    tried to run down the ABC camera crew with his tractor. He is NOT an
    employee of the biological supply company, but is their supplier. He
    has a license to sell animals that he supposedly obtains from people
    who don't wan them. He is under investigation for allegedly TRAPPING
    people's pets. He has been arrested, charged and convicted in other
    cases of violation of the law, but somehow he still has his license.
    This sort of person is, in my opinion, less than slime. I do NOT
    understand why this individual still has a license to sell animals of
    any kind--or to even be allowed to be in CONTACT with animals.
    
    
      PETA is a good place to write, but also to get information from so 
    our legislators---both Senate and House---can be written to. ONLY by
    applying pressure through the political process to STOP the U.S.D.A.
    from the multitude of abuses that they both perpetrate and allow are
    we ever going to stop these practices...
    
    
    John McD
      

    There is something of a solution--keep at your local school system to
    discontinue the practice of hands-on dissection.  It's unnecessary, and
    sends the wrong message to young people about how animals, dead or
    alive, should be treated.  
    
    Books, video tapes or films can show more than doing it first hand, and 
    would remove the demand for the animals.  I remember having a 
    head-to-head with my daughter's biology teacher who wanted her to bottle 
    up a spider in a mason jar and observe it.  I asked why!  The
    teacher said it would teach Hazel about a spiders life cycle.  I hit the 
    roof, bought my daughter a good book on spiders and let the spider go.  
    I don't like spiders but wish them no harm.  I dread to think what I 
    would have done if she had been asked to dissect a cat.
    
    As long as there is a profit to be made, someone will make it.  Perhaps
    this should be on every Feliner's New Years Resolution list--to stop the
    dissection of any animal in their local high school.
    
    I do not condone violence of any kind but can't condem those who use it
    for the protection of animals--more vulnerable than children to abuse.
    In Great Britian the animal right's activists are being charged with 
    using terrorist tactics--after the Jenning's broadcast it's easy to 
    see why?
    
    

      Re .14
      Not to mention the fact that there are some HUMANE supply houses that
    don't supply animals but realistic PLASTIC MODELS that can be taken
    apart and the organs identified. John Hopkins Univ. in Baltimore has
    worked with supply houses to develop these and alos to develop MANY
    alternatives to the usage of live animal in medical research. In this
    day and age, with the technological advancements and computer modeling
    that is AVAILABLE, there is NO reason to use animals...except for human
    greed and laziness of the individuals who are to stupid to look for the
    alternatives.
    
    
     John McD
    

    > In this day and age, with the technological advancements and computer 
    > modeling that is AVAILABLE, there is NO reason to use animals...except 
    > for human greed and laziness of the individuals who are to stupid to 
    > look for the alternatives.
    
    Or just plain lack of a reason.  That's where we all come in.  We can
    supply the reason and the motivation.  We can keep at these people
    until they give JUST to get us off their backs!
    

    Nancy,
    
    Please send me the info you talked about in an earlier note.  Hey
    fellow feliners, I am really falling apart over this.  Perhaps I am
    taking the whole thing too hard but I just can't help it.  I can't
    sleep or eat.  I can just barely concentrate on my work.  I find myself
    getting all emotional at the slightest thing.  I just keep picturing
    all those helpless animals crying and suffering.  I NEED to know that
    something will be done to STOP this individual from continuing his
    behavior.  I don't know him but I hate him.  Those responsible for the
    slaughter must be reincarnates from Hitler himself!!  I was planning to
    call channel 5 and find out how I could write to Peter Jennings to get
    the latest info regarding what is being done as a result of his
    broadcast.  Sounds to me like you, Nancy, already have that
    information.  Again, please send it to me.
    
    Thanks,
    Arlene

    .17
    
    Me too!  I didn't see the broadcast but heard about it from many (non
    feliners) cat lovers.  Having just lost Miss Flea, the torment of the
    thought of something like that happening to her will haunt me to my grave.
    
 Just the thought of an animal being hurt drives me crazy.
    
    Three and me.
    

    
    
    There are two issues here.  I believe that the Peter Jennings
    report focused on the torture of LIVE animals.  That is awful.
    
    Once an animal is dead, I don't see the harm in donating it to
    medical research.  Heck, I've got an organ donor sticker on my
    drivers license!  I would gladly give my kitties bodies to research
    after they were dead so that people could learn how to treat
    live kitties, just as I would give my body for the same thing.
    After you're dead its just a body.  My soul and my kitties
    soul is elsewhere!!!
    
    I can see that disecting cats in high school is unnecessary.  It
    forces adolescents to confront something that could really harm
    them.  Some kids/people are very uncomfortable with blood/death
    and I just don't see the benefits.   However people studying to
    be vet's SHOULD practice on dead animals.  Would you want your
    kitty to be the first kitty a vet had operated on?  I don't see
    why the schools don't just gete rid of the middlepeople?  Why
    not just get the kitties directly from vet's and the humane
    society?  A good computer network, just like they have for organ
    donors would work very well!
    
    Rachael
    

    Just want to let you all know that I called channel 5 today and
    requested the mailing address for Peter Jennings.  I plan to write to
    him tomorrow.  I will let you know the outcome.  Why am I writing to
    him?  I just want to let him know how deeply effected many of us were
    by him broadcast and thank him for exposing this "crime" to the public.  
    I also would like to find our what the status of the situation is.  For
    example, was that awful man's license revoked for kidnapping the little
    kitties in the first place.
    
    I will keep you all posted.
    
    See You,
    Arlene

    THis whole thing makes me sick, especially when I think back to high
    school biology.
    
    I was in an advanced class, and we had to pick projects.  One group of
    2 people chose cat dissection.  THe teacher had a catalog of supply
    items-- I guess models, equipment, stuff to dissect-- including cats. 
    They ordered the base model-- about $30 in 1982.  The more pricey ones
    had dye (such as blue and red) in the blood vessels for easier
    identification.  I think, in general, that there is particular
    preparation required for dissection-- i.e. you can't just go to the
    humane society.  For example, I think there cannot be any blood left in
    the animal.  I could be wrong.  
    
    It grossed me out.  I didn't partake.  I guess I was comfortable with
    the fact that since it was already dead, well then, who cares.  
    
    To be sure, I did see them work on it, and I think about how it looked
    even today as I watch Double saunter across the floor.  
    
    ------Becca+Double+Snuzzy

    
    h*ll, i couldn't even dissect the frog in college!  (made it through
    high school without having to.)  in my one college biology lab course, 
    we had one "legal" skip for the quarter.  i timed mine for the week of 
    the frog dissection.  didn't lose any points for refusing to do the
    lab; didn't have to do the dissection...
    
    diane, stella & stanley
    

    This sort of stuff really "haunts" me too.  I have to force myself
    not to think about it.  The only thing I can say is that trying
    to do something about it helps.  Poor Jack doesn't know what to
    do for me when I'm really upset about this stuff.  The feelings
    are pretty intense. (especially for a man, I guess)
      
    (BTW - re: vet colleges - they don't "operate" on dead animals. They
    operate on live ones. )
      Nancy
    

    For anyone who's interested, here are a couple of addresses
    for you.  For those from other states than Mass, just change
    the names as appropriate:
    
    Representative                       Senator
    Brian J. Donnelly                    John F Kerry
    
    US House of Representatives          United States Senate
    United States Capitol Bldg           United States Capitol Bldg
    Washington DC  20515                 Washington DC  20510
    
    
    Nancy DC

      One thing that should be noted... Regardless of what your political
    preferences or personal opinions are.....
    
      Senator Edward Kennedy of Mass is a proponent of humanitarian issues
    in the U.S. Senate. He has been a leader in initiating and supporting
    legislation to prevent and stop animal abuse and things such as the
    "puppy mills", "bunching" "pound seizures", etc... He's a good resource
    to write to on THIS topic as well...
    
      John McD

    RE: .24,.25
    
    This is starting to take on the sound of a letter writing campaign
    or some kind of a call to action. I'm letting the two previous replies
    stand, but I don't want to this string of notes continue alond this
    vein.
    
    Deb
    

    Hi gang,
    
    This is my first note so I hope I'm doing this right.
    
    I saw the Peter Jennings broadcast.  It upset me so much I woke up
    in the middle of the night a few nights later to tell my better
    half about it.
    
    I for one am glad they aired the show, hopefully thousands of people
    were watching and will now do something to stop operations like this.
    
    The cruelty they showed was beyond belief, the thing that bothered me
    the most and still does was why the people who worked For South
    Carolina Biology didn't feel bothered about killing innocent animals
    and complain to the authorities about it.
    
    Thanks God for that one person who did!
    
    I can still see the big eyes and frightened look on those kittys
    faces as those men stuck those large metalhooked crow bars into
    the cages to push each kitty out of one cage and into the cages
    being filled and shoved into the ovens to be gassed.
    
    I am angry and will join in the fight to stop these kinds of
    practices.  This could happen in any town or neighborhood.
    
    Robin/ and Bosco & Funny Money