Conference misery::feline_v1

Have you thought of getting a new fianc�?

Just :^)

Tom

Now wait just a minute... Don't put any ideas in her head!!!!
							-(Cathy's) fiancee

A new fiancee is DEFINITELY out of the question!

If you've ever been truely IN LOVE, you wouldn't even suggest such a thing!

now... any real suggestions??

Cathy

that a girl, you tell `em!				-fiancee

    Yeah.  I have a suggestion.   Many people who are allergic to cats have
found that can live with them by following some common sense guidelines.
(And I don't mean shots.)   Bear in mind that that part of the "cure"
will include some "becoming immune" to the kitties so it will involve an
adjustment peroid.   If you're still interested, I'll type in an article
or two (if I can dig them up).

                                    
tlh

I'm allerigic to cats myself (I can tell because if I am away from home for a 
few days it pretty well clears up, and if I'm around a strange cat indoors 
very long it gets worse); but I wouldn't give up my cat!!! In fact, when she 
finally goes the way of all of us (she's 13 years old now), I WILL replace her 
with at least 2 kittens! You can get used to a cat (allergy wise) by living 
with it for a while. It's really the same process as for shots. All the shots 
are is very low doses of the allergen (what causes the allergy) to cause your 
own immune system to "get used to" the allergen, and not react so violently to 
it (remember that an allergy is the over reaction of the immune system to 
something [very coarse terms]).

	/s/	Bob

RE: .5

YES!!! I'm very interested in the articles... if you can find them PLEASE
type them in for me (and for interested others).  I really don't want to get
rid of my cats, but thought that i had no other option.  Thanks in advance
for the info.

Cathy

   Okay dokey.  One of them is lent out right now, but I've asked for it
to be returned.  I'll see if I can dig up and post any others this weekend.

tlh

    I dug, as promised and found two more articles.

    I'll paraphrase as I'm a *rotten* typist.

    From CatFancy February, 1984 in the "Catching up" column.

Relief for People Allergic to Cats:

    The specific element in cat saliva that causes the allergic reaction
has been isolated and work on a treatment is proceding.  Preliminary reports
are encouraging.  In the meantime, Dr. Charles Shaubhut of ASPCA's Henry
Bergh Memorial Animal Hospital has these suggestions to help allergic animal
owners deal with the problem:
    "Use a wet towel to wipe the down the animal every day to remove much
of the saliva and the loose hairs containing it.
     Shampoo the cat every two weeks with a good pet shampoo and rinse its
coat with a solution of 1 tablespoon fabric softenerto a quart of water.
     Brush the cat 2 or 3 times a week with a soft brush.  (Stiff brushes
can scratch the cat's skin and make the problem worse.)"

    For more information, call the Henry Bergh Memorial Animal Hospital
at (212) 876-7700.


    From Cats October, 1985 in the "Let's Talk Cats" column.

    In addition to suggestion similar to the ones above, the author suggests
 that you make the bedroom off limits to the cats (at least at first).  Not
only can allergens reak havoc with you at night but also you can give your
body an 8 hour vacation from the allergens.

   "Yes very often our systems will adapt and we will build up our own
immunuities to our own cat or cats.  A lot of the trouble with people is
that they have tendency to rush things and want instant success.  Unless
you have the kind of allergy resulting in asthma and difficulty in breathing
that can be life threatening, then you should be able to spend some weeks
or months in trying to adapt to a new cat or dog.  Check with your doctor
of course, but do ask him about one of the antihistimines.  Sometimes taking
those coupled with bathing and grooming the cat and keeping him out of the
bedroom, will result in total success and you will find that you have no
allergic response to him!
    Other things to keep in mind are never to touch your eyes after you have
petted your cat as this will give just about anyone instant itchiness and
redness.  Frequent vacuuming and washing or cleaning of drapes or curtains
is a help too.  Change filters for the furnace and air vents frequently to
keep them effective in filtering out hair."

"I know that building up your immunity is a valid remedy as I can sleep with
a cat in arms all night and wake up without a single reaction.  Just let
me pick up a strange cat though and my eyes water and my face itches!"

That's the gist of it.  When my other article is returned, I'll see if it
has anything to add to this, and enter it if it does.

tlh

re .9

Thanks so much for the information... I'm going to try all the recommendations.

I'm not too sure how much they're going to like being shampooed, but it's 
definitely worth a try.  

thanks again.

Cathy

    I decided to revive this note for any discussion about my favorite
    breed - I'd personally be interested to read anything at all about
    Siamese, Colorpoints (shorthair) and Oriental shorthairs -

    ... as an example of what may or may not be typical behavior, my
    sealpoint Benjamin Elmo goes into his condo (always apartment #3)
    and licks/chews slobbers all over the tip of his tail - he only does
    this when he's happy - if I've been gone for most of the day (work),
    I'll come home to a dry tail, which has turned quite copper-colored
    - when we watch TV, Benjamin goes back and forth between my lap and
    his apartment - and he ONLY goes to his apartment to "work" on his
    tail...

    so, let's hear other stories before i get too carried away ...

    karen

    Re .11:
    
    Well, there's Karamaneh.  She is the _boldest_ Siamese I've ever
    met.  Intelligent (thank Heavens, though, not as brilliant as Merlin;
    with her personality we'd be climbing the walls), and lastely, _quite_
    spoiled.
    
    She developed tumors, and after the operation she looked so pitiful
    that my wife showered affection on her.  So now, she gets away with
    all sorts of things that, had I told my wife she'd be doing for
    the kitty when we got married, my wife would have said, "You're
    tappy!"
    
    Karamaneh sleeps in her spots, including, when she's feeling very
    affectionate, above my wife's head in the bed.  She _demands_ food,
    particularly when we're having a meat dish for supper (or when we've
    potatoes).  As with many other kitties, she wants her attention,
    and will flop on a newspaper if we're reading one.
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.

    Ref:  .11
    
    I have two almost 15-year-old, apple-cheeked furs at home.  Kali
    Mutu is half seal-point and half blue-point; both her parents were
    Grand Champions (from New Jersey).  She is 15 years old, going on
    1 - very playful, exceptionally intelligent, very talkative (gets
    hoarse!).  Munchkin is half seal-point and half chocolate-point,
    and is diabetic.  Munch comes from a line that my mother-in-law
    began in India in 1960.  My in-laws have two daughters from one
    of our litters.  Munch is truly more "dog" than cat, and since he's
    become diabetic, loves to play the "dying Siamese" with only me!
    
    My husband and I have been looking into other breeds, because we
    don't like the standards for the Siamese.  Have been checking into
    Tonkinese, Burmese and Balinese.  
    
    For the breeders out there:  how are the standards decided, and
    who decides?  If you don't agree with them, how long and how do
    you go about changing the standards?  To me, the new Siamese looks
    like a cross between a mouse and a kangaroo (sorry if I've offended),
    and lots of people who have the older-style Siamese agree.  I know
    "mean and lean" is in, but really :^)  So, here you are with a Siamese-
    lover, who adores their intelligence, feistiness, affectionate nature,
    and really doesn't want another breed, but is left with little options.
    Any ideas?
    
    J.
    

    I don't want to depress you about the siamese (I'm talking about
    the current show type) but there is little chance that the siamese
    standard will be changed back to the old type.  The standards for
    each association are decided on by the siamese breed committee for
    each association.  In order to be on the breed committee you have
    to meet certain criteria.  The criteria vary from association to
    association, but basically (I hate to use that word 8^) ) you have
    to be a breeder of siamese, a member of the association, have bred
    X number of litters, bred X number of cats that achieved grand champion
    status in that association, etc.
    
    And then once you accomplish the above and you are on the breed
    committee, the whole committee writes up the standard, so you have
    to get the rest of the committee to agree that apple-headed is in.
    And then once the committee agrees that apple-headed is in, they
    have to convince the association!  
    
    I am not on the breed committee for my breed (I don't qualify) so
    I can't vouch for the exactness of the information given above,
    it is just a rough outline of the process.
                                                                  
    As far as picking another breed, if you are fond of the pointed
    cats, have you seen/considered a Birman?  They are recognized in
    four colors in CFA, sealpoint, bluepoint, chocolate point, and lilac
    point, although they are seldom seen in chocolate and lilac.  They
    have a medium long coat and white paws.  Very cute! 
    
    They do not have the siamese voice or level of activity.  They are
    quieter than a siamese and a little less active so if these are
    the two things that endear the siamese to you then perhaps you won't
    be as happy "settling" for a Birman.  If you want to talk Birmans
    send me mail.  I will be breeding mine in a few months and would
    love to send a kitten to a fellow noter.
    
    Tonkinese are lovely cats, as are Burmese.  The balinese of today
    are very similar to the show siamese soooo you may not like them
    either.  I have also heard that the color point pattern occasionally
    shows up in Maine Coon litters so you might keep your ear to the
    ground for that one.  Maine coon people probably wouldn't like to
    see one of those but I sure think they would be beautiful.
    
    Hope you find something you like.
    Jo Ann

    AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!
    
    Pointed Maine Coons!!!!??????
    
    NEVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    Pointed variety of Maines is not recognised in any association.
    You can get pretty close, though, with a van pattern (color on ears
    and tail, no more than two body spots, at least 75% white).
    
    Dave

    Actually,
    The pointed Maines might be a little too close to Birmans for me.
    Just throw in the white spotting gene....and voila...BirMaines ;^)
    
    A person I know who breeds maines has told me that she wants to
    breed pointed maines!  Something about the pointed gene being 
    recessive and possibly showing up in foundation cats?  Do any of
    the associations allow foundation cats? (my sense of a foundation
    cat is a cat whose parentage is unknown but who could become a basis
    for future generations, please confirm or clear up this idea)
    
    Anyway, I didn't mean to shock you like that...
    
    next time I will put in a warning ;^)
    
    Jo Ann

    The pointed gene, i.e. siamese, is dominant.  Foundation cats are
    as you expressed, but most associations have a depth limit for
    registered cats.  In TICA, for instance, a cat must not have any
    unknowns within three generations to be recognised as purebred.
    
    Dave

 
    If the pointed gene is dominant, then her theory doesn't hold water.
    She would have to mate a Maine to a foundation cat that actually
    was pointed in order to start producing pointed maines.  And then
    breed them for three generations and then start petitioning to get
    them accepted.
    
    As an aside - I attended a judging school that was taught by Gloria
    Stephens from TICA last weekend.  The school turned out to be a
    mini genetics seminar rather than a breed study course.  All of
    her information boggled my mind!  I am afraid some of it was too
    advanced for me at this point.
    
    Jo

    I am looking for an apple-faced bluepoint Siamese stud for my
    female.  I live in Windham, New Hampshire and hope to find one in
    New Hampshire or Massachusetts. 

    These is an owner of a sealpoint who has thrown bluepoint
    kittens (in Worcester, MA), but I would prefer blue or lilac.

    My female is a mixed breed similar to a Birman -- she is a
    bluepoint with four white feet, with the head and body of the
    Siamese of 15 years ago.  I, of course, think she is beautiful.
    She is extremely affectionate, very athletic, and in love with my
    much older and neutered lilacpoint Siamese male.

    P.S. I saw several Birmans at the Boston cat shows this summer,
         and thought they were wonderful -- but stud fees are
         now up to $400.

    				Julie

    I have a registered Sealpoint named Holly Berry.  She was 
    born Sept. 17th, 1985, (I'm not sure of the year).  
    
    When I got her she fit perfectly on my chest.  
    
    Holly Berry is strictly an indoor cat.  The only time she
    goes out is when she has to go to the vet's or go down to
    our summer home, which she loves because then she can watch
    all the birds and bugs.
    
    Holly loves to try and catch bugs, she goes crazy when she 
    finds one.  Its a lot of fun to watch her go throught he
    house trying to catch up with it.  
    
    From a cat lover,  Peggy

    re: -1  I LOVE that name!!
    

    RE: -.1
    
    Me too! (-:
    
    Holly
    

    Can someone help me with the traits of a siamese cat?
    
    the story:  Husband, child and I were walking in the woods and low and
    behold a siamese cat (around 11 months old) came running up to me
    crying it's little heart out.  Seems he was hit by a car and his
    hips were a bit crocked and his tail was pretty tough looking.  Brought
    him home (this was a Friday late afternoon) put some peroxide on his
    tail, gave him some liquid antibodics (vet prescribed) and let him
    hiss at the other two cats in the household for the weekend.  Went
    to vet on Tuesdsay (closed on Mon) and was positive for Feline Luk!
    
    $75.00 dollars later, my husband was heartbroken.  He fell in love
    with this siamese because of it's personality.  Vet told me of
    a lady in town that raises siamese and she could get me one.  What
    I need to know is are there personality always friendly, playful,
    attentive?  I was thinking of getting my husband one for Thanksgiving.
    
    Can anyone help me out?  Vet told me the lady who raises the siamese
    is an excellent breeder and highly recommended her.  The other cats
    in our household are also 'walk-ins' - Tina is 11 yrs old and a tiger,
    and A.J. is around 3 yrs old and is mix something, he thinks he's
    a dog!

    well, Panther and Eirene are only part Siamese, but they have many of
    the traits. They are very agile, good jumpers, very intellegent and
    they have an opinion on everything. In fact, the two of them will hang
    out in the garden window and literally carry on a conversation with
    each other (or maybe they are just gossiping). They will talk to
    humans, too.Both of themare semi-lap cats. By that I mean they will
    sit on my lap, but htey have to initiate it.
    
    Deb 

    My Benjamin is a 3 year old seal-point.  He talks non-stop and is
    very VERY affectionate.  He is sometimes difficult to control (no
    point try to close him out of certain rooms, he cries louder than
    a baby) but on the whole he is positively a joy to have.  
    
    I don't know how siamese cats got their bad reputation, but Benjamin
    is very friendly and gentle.
    
    dm

	I've only known three Siamese cats, and all are/were UN-affectionate and
	aloof, and two were known to bite without provocation.  I adore cats and
	never would have believed I could dislike any as much as I did these;
	I've pretty well decided the breed is not for me!

	Based on the notes here I might have to re-think that position -- lots
	of my fellow noters seem to have friendly Siamese!  I just wanted to 
	point out that it doesn't seem to be true of the entire breed, even if
	the ones I know just happen to be the exceptions that prove the rule.

	If you really want to be sure you get a "lap cat", I'd like to suggest
	adopting an older cat (doesn't have to be OLD, just not a kitten) --
	that way their personality is already established and you'll know in
	advance if they are what you seek.  Of course, just to keep us on our
	toes, cats have been known to dramatically change their personality if
	their environment changes but I would make the rash assumption that it
	would only be for the better (ie an abandoned cat would become more
	friendly once it had a secure home).

	Good luck, Siamese are beautiful cats!


	Hope I didn't offend any owners of Siamese, I was just trying to offer
	a different point of view.  My eldest is half-Siamese and he is much
	like what many of you described -- affectionate and talkative!

	Jan    

    
    I have three Siamese kitties.  All three are affectionate in their own
    way.  They all like to curl up on reclining humans.  They all are
    talkative.  And they love to have kitty races all over the house when
    they aren't 'reclining'.  But, each has a unique purrsinality. 
    
    And I have had other Siamese cats over the years.  And they have been 
    real joys to have around.
    
    Mary Jo 

	Re - Jan - no offense taken, as I used to feel the same way about
	Siamese.  My husband talked me into trying one out, and we now have
	four of the most loving, friendliest cats I've ever known.  I don't
	know what the difference is between the Siamese I had heard about 
	(and had known), and the ones I know now, but I *think* that the 
	nasty ones were of the apple-headed variety, not the wedge-heads 
	that are so popular now.

	Re .23 - here's a description from the "Encyclopedia of American
	Cat Breeds":

	"As a pet the Siamese is alert, active, personable and dog-like. It
	has a banshee-like voice when in heat and can be persistent when it
	wants.  They are content to be alone but love to be with their 
	owners.  They are touchingly dependent and demonstrative with their
	owners for whom they hold a great admiration.  Life to them is a
	game and they love to learn tricks; they also love children and
	overall are very active.  Their voice range is amazing with many
	different tones and different cries for every occasion.  All in all,
	the Siamese is very smart, agile, active, enchanting and above all,
	very Oriental in its beautiful features."

	As far as them being lap-cats - now that it's getting colder out,
	I can't sit on the sofa without them (all four) on me.  They all
	sleep with us as well - the two females insist on sharing my
	pillow! :^}

	Sandy, with Tas (seal), Jenn (blue), C.C. (blue), and Beau (choc.
	lynx).

    .28
    
    Thanks for the definition of the Siamese breed.  What we liked about
    our guy (rest his soul) was he loved Alex (3.5 yrs old), loved my
    husband (like a litter mate) and was extremely warm to us.  Considering
    what this guy has been throught.  He also had the most beautiful
    eyes I've ever seen on a cat.  We really miss him and he was only with
    us four days.
    
    Are they territorial?  As I mentioned I have two other cats already and
    we are thinking of a siamese kitten, male specifically.  

	I don't find them to be any more territorial than any other breed.
	In fact, our calico seems to be the worst at this, but then again,
	she was our first cat, so it's understandable.

	On thing that's so neat about Siamese is how they like each other.
	All of ours get along like they were family, even though they're
	from three different litters.

	When were you planning on getting a kitten?

	Sandy and the fuzzy five :^}

    
    	My hubby and I just acquired a seal lynx point siamese a 
    	few weeks ago.  Granted she's just a baby and all kittens
    	are affectionate but I have never come across one more 
    	affectionate than our Audrey.  I sit down, she's in my
    	lap.  She loves to sit on Cary's shoulders.  Her favorite
    	place to sleep at night is curled up under my chin or
    	next to me with her head resting on my neck.  She is an
    	absolute love!  Our himmie took to her almost instantly
    	and Sasha, who is very picky, took to her after only a
    	day and a half.  That in itself is a miracle.  I had heard
    	stories about Siamese being nasty but I just couldn't pass
    	her up....and I'm so glad I didn't!
    
    	JJ
    

	> On thing that's so neat about Siamese is how they like each other.
	> All of ours get along like they were family, even though they're
	> from three different litters.
    
    Dundee is like that with other folds.
    
    re: Applehead vs wedgehead and personality.  All the applehead siamese
    cats I have known were very nice kitties - some more aloof than others,
    but none could be categorized as "nasty".
    
    

	Re Nancy - I'm not sure that I'd ever categorize (heh) any cat as
	'nasty' but I still can't figure out where the common perception of
	Siamese as unpredictable comes from.  I can't tell you how many 
	people have repeated that belief when I've told them that we have
	four Siamese.  I knew a couple of appleheads when I was a kid, both
	of whom were quite aloof, and one of which actually turned on his
	owner, so I mentioned that as a possible source of the reputation.

	Andy's theory is that in the 'old days' some people may have
	treated Siamese as 'ordinary' cats - i.e., as possessions, mousers,	
	etc., and largely ignored them.  He thinks that without the human
	attention that they crave that they might have turned into less
	than loving creatures.  Knowing how much attention ours demand,
	that seems like a plausible theory to me.

	Sandy

    .30
    
    The vet we are working with (personal friend) said the kittens will be
    ready by Thanksgiving.  So, I'm going to secretly pick one up for my 
    husband and bring it home for him.  The woman who breeds them is
    only charging me $20.00 (for shots) and that's it.  After vet told
    her of our heartbreak the woman said, have them come over and pick
    one out!!!  Are people great!

    I think that the Disney movie Lady and The Tramp is responsible
    for the idea that Siamese are nasty.  :^)
    
    Jo

    
    Jo,
    
    I agree it certainly didn't help.  I have a Siamese cross (The Princess
    Panther Jane :-) and she is an absolute love!  She is all black (or
    havana brown if you want to get technical) and small and quiet!  Don't
    get me wrong, when she wants something, she can WAIL!!! and the sound
    would break your heart, or make you think something terrible was
    happening to her!!!  (Thank goodness she doesn't do it too often, only
    when she really WANTS something, as only a Siamese can WANT!)
    
    She is very regal, she likes to sit on my lap, she sleeps under the
    covers with me, and takes warm baths with me in the winter. (Really!)
    
    Her housemate (Spot) is a Maine Coon cross, also black and bigger and
    actually talks more than Panther.  I would love to have a purebred
    Siamese, or Russian Blue (came close once!) or Maine coon...or just
    about anything when it comes right down to it!!!  I LOVE THEM ALL!
    
    Felines are the Greatest!
    
    Sue & Panther & Spot       

    
    I tend to agree with the commment that Siamese can become less than
    affectionate if not given the attention they need.  Siamese cats
    *require* attention.  If a Siamese cat 'speaks' to you then you must
    speak back.  I have an 8 year old applehead and he and I have at least
    one 'conversation' a day. (Especially if I am late home from work)
    
    I have also noticed that Siamese cats have a greater tendency that
    ordinary moggies to *choose* who they belong to.  It does not
    necessarily have to be their owner. Once they have chosen who they
    belong to, they tend to be less affectionate with other humans.
    
    My Grandmother's Siamese chose me to belong to. I was the only one of the 
    grandchildren who could pick him up and cuddle him and wallow around with 
    him and even tug on his tail (NO ONE touched this cat's tail!) and come 
    out unscathed.  My Siamese has (fortunately) chosen me to belong to.  He
    likes my husband well enough, but if push comes to shove he would
    rather be draped around my neck than his and I am the one he follows
    around the house.
    
    I don't know where Siamese cats get their bad reputation.  It is
    certainly undeserved from my point of view.  Siamese cats tend to be
    more moody than other cats and they seem to be better equiped for 
    expressing those moods.  Perhaps this is where it comes from.
    
    LaDonna

    > I don't know where Siamese cats get their bad reputation.  It is
    > certainly undeserved from my point of view. 
    
    Perhaps Siamese cats just exercise the most autonomy of all the cat
    breeds.  Its that autonomy and independence that scares many people
    and is the reason why some folks HATE cats.  It seems logical that
    the cat that is most autonomous would get the worst reputation
    for being nasty.
      Nancy

    Ok, now for my 2p worth.....
    
    Florence is an oriental - very close to a siamese and she is the cutest
    most beautiful little love bug in the whole world!
    
    
    :-) :-) :-) :-)
    
    
    Lisa plus Pookie, Rolf and Florence.
    

    And, now for a spoil sport in the bunch.  
    
    I'm not going to comment on Siamese cats at all, since I don't really
    know much about them, but a word or caution.
    
    You said the siamese was put down because it was Leukemia Positive...if
    this cat had direct contact with your other cats, your other cats have
    now been exposed to the Leukemia Virus.  Especially so if they shared
    litterboxes, food or water dishes, or were licking or playing with each
    other.  
    
    Since the Leukemia Virus can be dorment in the blood stream for up to
    90 days, I'ld consider having your other cats tested for leukemia in 90
    days BEFORE adding another kitten to your family.  
    
    It would be heartbreaking for your current kitties to have contacted
    Leukemia from the siamese, but even more heartbreaking to pass it on to
    yet another kitten.
    
    Sorry for spoiling the fun...
    cin
    

    .40
    
    the other cats in the household were separted from this other one that
    was Leukemia positive.  The Leukemia positive cat had his own catbox,
    own paper plate for food, own room to crash in, own cardboard box
    with towel in it for him to sleep in.  
    
    We were extremely careful, since many moons ago, we took in a kitten
    who was feline leuk positive and the vet educated us that day.
    
    My cats also have had all the shots as a precaution to feline leukemia
    over the past few years, and they go for their boosters on November
    2nd.
    
    I know how dreadful this diease is, so I'm cautious when taking in a
    new four-legged critter into the house.
    
    Thanks for your concern, but we are very educated to feline leukemia.
    
    Kathy

    Great!  I was worried because your original note said that you brought
    the kitty home and let it hiss at your other two cats for the weekend. 
    Many people don't think about isolating a newcomer until it's too late.
    
    Just wanted to make sure that we didn't follow this with another sad
    story in a few months.
    
    cin
    

    Sorry for the confusion Cin, the other cat (sick one) was in one
    room and the other two cats stood outside of the door, like a mexican
    standoff and hiss into the room.  They never came within 20 feet of
    the other cat.  We had quite the show for those 4 days!
    
    We always isolate any 4-legged critter until the vet has OKed
    the new one prior to playing/hissing/running with the other family
    members.

    Went over to the house last night to pick out our siamese kitten
    which we will take home in the middle of December sometime, and
    need to ask a question.
    
    The cat has a trangle face, very pointy chin - is this a appleface
    that you folks have been talking about?  By the way, it's a seal
    point siamese and we are taking the little male, who is gorgeous!
    
    Someone help?

	As far as I know, the appleheads have short, round heads.  The one
	you have sounds very much like mine.  The wedge-head is the type
	that is being shown as Siamese, at least in all the shows I've
	been to.  Breeders in the file will know better, I'm sure, but I
	think that appleheads have to be shown as AOV, right?

	Sandy, Smudge, Tas (Sealpoint male), Jenny, C.C. and Beau

	Oh, and CONGRATULATIONS! on your new baby boy!! Do you have any
	names picked out yet?

congrats on the new kid....wedge head, for sure.  Mind you, some of them are
quite lovely...8^}

an apple headed cat has a head that is wider, squarer at the chin, and shorter
in the muzzle...more like a regular moggie in profile.

    
    
    	WEll now I know that Audrey is an applehead siamese... =)
    

    Appleheads aren't shown in CFA, in AOV or any other class.  Some other
    associations might accept them though.
    
    Jo

>    Appleheads aren't shown in CFA, in AOV or any other class.  Some other
>    associations might accept them though.
    
I'm pretty sure the appleheads aren't winners at any showing.  However, them
that loves them don't usually care.  8^}

Plan on an applehead as a pet, not a breeder or a show cat....

    No, you have one with a Dorito head.
    

    
    	a what?  who has a dorito head?  =)
    
    	Well since we got Audrey at the Humane Society we have
    	no papers on her anyway.  I wouldn't trade her for the
    	world either!  She wins over the hearts of everyone she
    	meets.  
    

    .46
    
    No not yet on names, it's up to hubby, since this is his baby
    
    .51
    
    Maybe I'll suggest we call him Dorito!!!!  :')
    
    Thanks to all to straighten the 'head thing' out.  I didn't understand
    the applehead vs the 'dorito look'!
    
    Going to wait till the little guy is 10 weeks old before I pick him up.
    Want to make sure he is fully weaned.
    
    Thanks everyone, again..........

    Applehead siameses look much like a lighter version of the
    Tonkinese (one of my favorite cats).  
    
    It is my understanding that CFF has or will be openning up a 
    class for "traditional" or applehead siamese however, i have
    yet to see any at the shows.
    

    Pick up the little guy last week (now 10 weeks old), my husband
    named him Taco.  He is so beautiful and so vocal!  He talks, and
    talks and talks and talks and talks, about everything and anything.
    
    He is a pure bundle of energy (at 2 pounds) and flys around the house
    with such ease.  My other two cats are a bit 'tiffed', but they just
    can't seem to catch him to sniff him out yet.  
    
    It sure if fun having a kitten in the house.  It seems so long ago, my
    other ones were just 'kids'.
    
    Kathy with A.J., Tina and Taco

    Those Siamese cats!!!   At the shows the Siameses usually follow
    the Scottish Folds because the breeds are judged in alphabetical
    order.  Well, I was showing Shadow this weekend in Haverhill and
    after three rings of sitting in the ring cage between those chatty
    siamese kittens He started chatting too!  You'd hear all this
    "maowing" and I"d look up to see Shadow's mouth moving right along
    with the siamese kittens!
      :-)))))

    
    Uh-oh - now he'll go home and teach all the others, and then you'll
    really be in for it! :^}
    
    But calling Siamese kittens 'chatty' is kind.  I'm sure after listening
    to a gaggle of them all day, you could really get an appreciation for
    the softer-spoken varieties.  Our four aren't too bad, as they've
    pretty much said everything there is to say to each other.  But
    bringing any one of them to the vets is a real treat - you get yelled
    at all the way down and all the way back.  None of them are happy
    riding in the car :^}
    
    Sandy
    

    Mouths are catching.  Little Bit is my first Mouth, Holly had
    been with me for a few years before LB arrived.  now when I hear
    What Is Going On I Am Not Pleased is there Another Cat Outside Get up
    And Feed Me Even If It is 3 AM it's as likely to be Holly as LB.
    

    re: .57 - well, this gang is chatty anyway.  You ought to hear Halie
    and Batman.  And Percy, soon to be renamed Sir Charles, is full of
    trills and churbles.  That's one thing I love about the folds.
    

well, since we got The Flash, Hannah has begun to ask for food...that was the
one thing she never did.  She always simply sat and watched me do my work
in the kitchen, seemingly assured she would get her share when it was time.
Now, however, the little one has taught Hannah to sing for her supper....well,
she actually simply asks once - politely..but it is more than she used to
do.  Now, mealtimes are like this:

	big and little flame points walk into the kitchen, sit at my feet
	and notify me that they are hungry.  They both then move to the side
	and sit side-by-side looking adorable until I offer food.

I'm trying to get a camera on-hand when they work in tandem - it is truly
adorable to see them.  Of course, I could be just a little biased on this...

    Well our little taco is now 12 weeks old and he seems very aggressive.
    For instance:  supper is on the table, other two cats sitting quietly
    under the table just waiting.....Taco comes leaping up the chair and
    lands in my plate!  Only to growl at me when I remove his mouth
    off my steak.  It was so bad, we had to lock him in the bathroom
    so we could eat our chicken dinner.  Is this normal behavior for
    a simease?  He also talks our ears off constantly, which is rather
    amusing at 2:30 am.  
    
    Also, I have used a spray bottle of water to keep him from leaping
    onto my plate.....and he likes it!!!  he's usually pretty wet
    by the end of supper.

    Sounds like a normal 12 week old to me.  Babies are fun....
    

    
    
    	Must be normal...Audrey does it all the time!  and she's
    	about 5 months old.....
    

    Thanks....I haven't had a kitten in the house for 9 years, and I just
    wasn't sure.  We are really having fun with him, just can't believe
    how far he can leap......you should see our Christmas tree..:')))
    
    

    
    	Must be another Siamese trademark....Audrey jumps much
    	higher than any of our other did when they were babies...
    	It's really funny when I'm vacuuming....
    

	I'm sure those of you who have Siamese have seen this:  Andy calls
	it a 'helicopter turn' - happens when a cat gets startled, jumps
	straight up in the air, and does a 180 degree turn before it hits
	the floor again :^}
	
	Regarding the cats jumping in your food, Tas did that when he was
	little, too.  We also had to close him in the bathroom so we could
	eat, but he's gotten better now that he's much more mature.  Now he
	just stands by, looking pitiful, occasionally head-butting your leg
	to tell you how much he really, really loves you.

	Sandy

    
    
    	re: helicopter turns
    
    	yes yes!! Audrey does that too!!  She's so cute.....
    

    Ha!  You ought to try eating in front of the TV with SEVEN kittens
    climbing into your plate!!!!!!!!!!!   And some Scottish folds are
    pretty amazing jumpers too.  That's how "Flier MacDougal" earned
    his name!!
    

    .68
    Seven kittens!!!! Yikes, I would eat in the bathroomw with the door
    locked!!!
    
    Taco has finally earned the affections of the other two adult cats.  AJ
    (my 18 pd male) really enjoys putting Taco in a head lock between his
    front paws.  It is so funny :'))).  Taco has also acquired a taste for
    muffins (any kind), he will leap up, grab one in his mouth, and run
    around the house growling at everyone, with this huge muffin.  Then he
    drops it and jumps up and down on it, does spins around it, talks to
    it, and then finally kills it with a loud growl.  Need to rent a
    videotape machine to film this, he crazy!
    
    The family hasn't enjoyed this many laughs in a long, long time.
    

    uh uh, you put the 7 or in my case 5 beanie weanies in the
    bathroom, then you eat like a normal person!
    

    
    
    	re: Nancy
    
    	Thanks but no way!  Audrey is bad enough.
    	(she's on mommy's **** list today...decided to use my face
    	  as a stepping stone in bed last night and left me with some
    	  nice scratches across my forehead and nose.... =(   )
    
    	JJ
    

    
    When I put Benjamin in the bathroom last week because we had 
    dinner guests, he chewed (not clawed, he has no front claws)
    all the toilet paper right off the roll.  (That'll teach mommy,
    right Benjamin?)
    
    dm & Benjamin

    
    I just purchased a Siamese kitten and was wondering what kind he is.
    
  He's white, with grey on his paws/feet and ears. Also there is a grey
    
  patch on his face. Eyes are bright blue with a very dark, grey tail. 
    
    Any help would be appreciated.
    
                                        Tom
    

    Your kitten is a bluepoint Siamese and you will find that as he ages,
    both his point color (color on the outer extremeties:  face, ears,
    legs, feet, tail) and body color will darken, but there will still be
    some contrast.  The gray "patch" on his face is called a mask and it
    will fill in and "expand" as he matures, eventually covering his whole
    face.
    
    Congrats on your new "acquisition!"
    
    --Roberta
    

    Thanks for the identification. The father looked exactly as you stated
    
    my kitten will as it matures. 
    
                                      Tom
    

    Tom -
      Will you be joining us at the catshows with your new baby??
    (After he's 4 months old, of course.)  Where are you located.
    I LOVE blue points.
      Nancy DC