Conference back40::soapbox

    
    Is this a `Politics Of The Left' issue (topic 47) or a 
    `Crime And Punishment' issue (topic 44)?
    
    :^)
    

     I think it's an insult to claim that the jurors had no intelligence.

    I think you're being lead by the media.
    
    However, liberalism will continue to die because more and more of the
    goo goo's will get screwed, get beaten up, get mugged, and finally
    realize that social engineering won't work and people are ultimately
    responsible for their own actions, not society.
    
    -Jack

    re: .5 
    
    Although people ARE ultimately responsible for their own actions,
    society plays a HUGE role in influencing those very same actions.
    
    Amanda
    

    Amanda:
    
    Due to the fact that the crime rate during the depression was
    exponentially lower than crime in the inner city today, one has to
    assume that deviant behavior is learned in one's immediate environment.
    
    If Johnny killed for an apple because he was hungry, it isn't societies
    fault because he didn't have his own apple.  There were other options.
    
    -Jack

       Jack, instead of talking about "inner city", why don't you simply
       say crime among blacks?  Stop using your code words, Jack, we know
       what you mean.

    
    
    Criminy Donald, give the guy a break.  Yer sounding like wordy.....

    
    Ooops, not wordy, I meant the mule.

>    One of the crowning achievements of the liberalism was the exposure of
>    judicial injustice against the minorities in the south and the struggle
>    to create an environment where all people had equal access to justice...

Please, tell me.  Do you think this was a good thing or a bad thing?

ZZ    Jack, instead of talking about "inner city", why don't you
ZZ    simply say crime among blacks?  Stop using your code words, Jack, we
ZZ    know what you mean.
    
    No, actually Topes I believe inner city is very appropriate here.  The
    reason is because the inner city in my mind stands as a trophy or a
    monument to the effects of liberalism in this country.  Because of our
    beloved AFDC, which has successfully diminished African family
    traditions to just about non existence...because of the Great Society
    which has proven per Lady Bird Johnson that welfare out of control will
    go amuck...because most people who have any sense of worth or any sense
    of achievement are leaving in droves to move to the country or to the
    suburbs....the inner city has become the mecca of social engineering
    and implemented liberal philosophies....all these wonderful oversights
    of liberalism has brought about the plight of violence, government
    dependence, illegitimacy, and a myriad of those wonderful fruits of 
    dysfunctionalism.
    
    I have no doubt that Mr. Topaz will have the common sense NOT to move
    to the Mission Hill area...right Topes?  
    
    -Jack

       
       I hate it when you say "inner city", Jack, because it sounds like
       you're too much of a coward to say what you mean: you don't mean
       inner city, you mean BLACK.  In Boston, Beacon Hill is in the
       inner city, and there are rich people and poor people and black
       people and white people who live there -- but you're not speaking 
       about Beacon Hill when you say inner city.  The North End is in
       the inner city, and Italians and yuppies live there -- but you're
       not speaking about the North End when you speak of the inner city.
       South Boston is in the inner city, and it's full of Irish and
       Polish people, most of them poor, but Jack Martin isn't talking
       about the South Boston when he speaks of the inner city.  Nor is
       he speaking about Brighton or Roslindale, Neponset or Back Bay.
       
       No, when Jack speaks of the inner city, he is using code words,
       the code words people use when they wink to say, "you know what I
       mean."  When Jack Martin says inner city, he means one thing and
       one thing only: poor black people.  Period.
       
       I don't doubt you'll fall over yourself trying to backtrack your
       way out of this, Jack, but the simple matter remains: when you
       say inner city, you mean poor, urban black.  Next time, say what
       you mean instead of using the code words.
       
       --Mr Topaz
       
       p.s.:
       
       > I have no doubt that Mr. Topaz will have the common sense NOT to
       > move to the Mission Hill area...right Topes?  
       
       Jack, I've lived on Mission Hill, on Calumet St.  And you know
       what?  It's a mixed neighborhood:  older Irish people, poor
       students, upper-middle class yuppies, blacks, immigrants.  The bad
       section of Mission Hill is in the projects; the rest of the Hill
       is a perfectly fine place to live.  Once again, you cast
       aspersions on a whole set of people (this time a neighborhood)
       because you are misinformed.  You really can be contemptible.
       

    
    	You wonder how stupid one must be to break down the door of a
    	house that has been identified as a "drug house" by an inform-
    	ant.
    

      ZZ     When Jack Martin says inner city, he means one thing and
      ZZ     one thing only: poor black people.  Period.
    
    Ohhhhhh....is that what you were hinting at??  Like you really think
    I'm into code words on purpose??  Like I'm afraid to speak truth no
    matter how ugly and sobering it can be?  Oh Topes, you don't give me
    enough credit.  I'll be glad to spell it out for you or anybody else
    who is listening.
    
    Fact, there are exponentially more white single women on welfare in
    the United States than all minorities combined.  This is taken from the
    US Bureau of Census.  Now, lets get back to the exact pinpoint of the
    conversation...that being liberalism...LIB-ER-AL-ISM Don...and the
    mecca of liberalism.
    
    Okay Don...question one.  Which segment of society in the inner city
    has the highest illigitemacy rate in Boston?  Correct.  It is black
    single teenagers.  Which segment of Boston has the highest crime rate? 
    Correct, it is black on black crime.  Which segment of Boston per
    capita has the highest school drop out rate Don?  Yes, it is black
    males in the Boston Public School system.  What segment of Boston has
    the highest rate of gang violence Don?  Correct it is black gangs in
    the Roxbury/Dorchester area Don.  
    
    So What?  What is the point of this exercise Don?  Well, here is the
    good news.  I categorically deny that problems are due to one's skin
    color.  What I submit to you Don is that the conditions are as they are
    because YOUR POLICIES created the environment for problems like this to
    fester!  
    
    Once again Don makes it a race issue when I am clearly stating the
    ba*tard beaurocrats and the gaa gaa do gooders are the chief agitators
    while inner city blacks continue toward a trend of self destruction.
    
    And you call me reprehensible???
    

re: Our Jack Martin

>    And you call me reprehensible???
    
Nah. He called you contemptible.

    Uhhhh....sorry

    
    	You really should [tm] that thing, Jack.
    

                     <<< Note 560.13 by CALLME::MR_TOPAZ >>>

>       No, when Jack speaks of the inner city, he is using code words,
    
    	Should we be expecting Glen to pop in here any minute to chastize
    	Don for saying what someone means instead of asking?
    
    	Pro'lly not...

    
    Hold onto your hats America, I'm about to bring up the ghost
    of Meowski... and somewhat agree with him.

    I think what we're really talking about here is socialism; what's
    being called "liberalism" in this thread is really about government
    social programs. And it all boils down to "mine and ours." The
    old people complain about welfare recipients while lining up
    for Medicare and Social Security. The middle class doesn't like
    welfare either, but they don't mind things like public education,
    student loans and the SBA.

    If the country ever gets serious about doing away with socialism,
    I'd be all for it. But the politicians are only interested in
    politics. And politics is about understanding what handouts
    your constituents like and which ones they don't. There's exactly
    one current presidential candidate who's talking about taking
    the axe to the entire federal government. One. For 10 points
    and a chance at this week's grand prize, can anyone name that
    right wing embarrassment of a human being who Bill Buckley says
    he can't defend (like Buckley's God's gift to Judaism...)

    -b

    Is this the same candidate who wants to "Berlinize" our southern
    border?  Sorry but I am one of the people he wants war declared on.  If
    I wanted to live in a theocracy I would have moved to Iran decades ago
    and converted, or returned to some of my roots and headed off to
    Dublin.  
    
    meg

    re: Note 560.22 by CSC32::M_EVANS
    
    }Sorry but I am one of the people he wants war declared on.
    
    It's already been declared.  I'll give you the cite if you don't
    know what it is.  
    
    Another thing while I'm in here, prolly the wrong spot, but it
    fits.
    Notice how everyone's got "us" bitching over tax cuts and how much
    we should cut, and at what level they should be implimented.
    Let's try and remember folks:  IT'S OUR MONEY IN THE FIRST PLACE!
    How deep is the gov't entitled to pick your pocket?

    the government will pick our pockets until we lop their arms.
    

	Mr Topaz speketh the trutheth, Joe. :-)

    
    re:.13
    
    >    I hate it when you say "inner city", Jack, because it sounds like
    >    you're too much of a coward to say what you mean: you don't mean
    >    inner city, you mean BLACK.
    
    aaahhh donny's using his well known mind reading abilities again.
    
>       In Boston, Beacon Hill is in the
>        inner city, and there are rich people and poor people and black
>        people and white people who live there -- but you're not speaking 
>        about Beacon Hill when you say inner city.  The North End is in
>        the inner city, and Italians and yuppies live there -- but you're
>        not speaking about the North End when you speak of the inner city.
>        South Boston is in the inner city, and it's full of Irish and
>        Polish people, most of them poor, but Jack Martin isn't talking
>        about the South Boston when he speaks of the inner city.  Nor is
>        he speaking about Brighton or Roslindale, Neponset or Back Bay.
    
    More mind reading, donny, you're simply amazing!
       
>        No, when Jack speaks of the inner city, he is using code words,
>        the code words people use when they wink to say, "you know what I
>        mean."  When Jack Martin says inner city, he means one thing and
>        one thing only: poor black people.  Period.
    
    hey donny, why don't you tell me what I think about gays?
    

    Dan:  Actually I did clarify my statements regarding the inner city.  I
    disspelled the notion I was winking an eye...as if I needed to use code
    words.  
    
    Fact:  The word "City" derives from the same greek word as
     	   Civilization.
    
    Cities are the mecca of civilizations.  The inner city is going to
    shambels in this decade and has been eroding for years.  
    
    The statistics I stated regarding inner city blacks are fact and have
    been acknowledged by the black leadership in this country.  It would be
    a lie to state otherwise.  I get offended when these facts are avoided
    in order to maintain Political Correctness.  I believe silence, just as
    learned in Nazi Europe, to be one of the greatest enemies of humanity.
    
    Now that the facts are out in the open, it seems as some have stated in
    this conference that it is a problem unsolvable by white America.  I
    saw the march in D.C. as being potentially good for this, depending on
    which way the leadership leads the masses.  
    
    -Jack

    Lucky Jack's daughter is a liberal. Liberalism can survive.

Well, thanks a lot for spreading that filth around for the world to see.

    See? And she loves her daddy.

She loves her daddy's checkbook.

    Her daddy is a softie who will do anything for his little girl.
    
    
    I think I'm going to be sick.

>    I think I'm going to be sick.

Well, I already suggested a bus tour to correct that problem.

    And a reasonable suggestion it was.

	this is too good to be true. lucky jack is blessed with a liberal
sibling. i think i'm gonna cry..... :'-(

    His sister is a liberal too?!?
    
    Oh my!

    
    My condolences Mr Del Balso, my condolences....

No, Glen, both of my sisters and my brother are fine upstanding conservatives.
This is my eldest daughter who Glenn has chosen to expose.

    I never touched her!

But you DID say you'd date her . . . 

    
    
    Maybe he should have the word "sibling" exlained to him...
    

    No, that isn't what I said. I said she was old enough for me to date,
    which was intended to make you feel old.

    Perhaps I should quit while I'm being misunderstood.

Hell, I'm not old. That's my brother.

    
    
    You got a twin too???