Conference back40::soapbox

	I saw Jerry Garcia this morning on Forest Ave in Hudson MA. He was
riding a bike. The man LIVES!

    
    While coming in this morning, on this big rock in Marlboro it
    was painted.....
    
    		"Jerry is dead,
    		Now we can be Grateful"
    
    

    
    carrying "sky-cam" at the last superbowl...
    
    -b

In the freezer case at Stop & Shop.

    That was me you IDJIT!!!!

    re; .5
    
    Wait a minute, I thought you looked like some guy on 
    "Friends".
    
    

Jack, you were in the freezer case at Stop & Shop?  Cool!

	Jack is a chameleon.....

    
    and apparently, a very cool individual

    "I said ALFREDO Garcia, you moron...."  

I saw him on my way to work this morning working on a new album...

he was busy decomposing...

/scott

    
                    {GROOOOOAAAAAAANNNNNNNN}
    

    Jerry, Elvis, Jimmy Hoffa and Bigfoot were spotted together in a 
    7-11 in Little Rock, Ark.

    Jerry got "set up with the spirit in the sky, it is where ya gonna when
    you die, when you die and your laid to rest your gonna go to the place
    that's the best"
    
    
    Lynne:-)

	Somewhere I have a button included in a large set of buttons
	I bought in 1967 which sez:

		The Grateful Dead Should Be

	Jerry Garcia has a goatee and black hair and weighs under 200 lbs?



Glen

    re .18
    
    
    				you just described my dad
    
    
    		

Glen, you're a dad?

    >	Jerry Garcia has a goatee and black hair and weighs under 200 lbs?
    
    if this is 1967, perhaps... :-)
    
    -b

    ZZZ            -< Glen Silva Looks Just Like Jerry Garcia!!! >-
    
    No...Glen looks like Glinda...the witch of the north.
    
    NNTTM

| <<< Note 515.20 by NOTIME::SACKS "Gerald Sacks ZKO2-3/N30 DTN:381-2085" >>>


| Glen, you're a dad?


	Had I gone thru with my origional plans I probably would have been...

| <<< Note 515.22 by MKOTS3::JMARTIN "I press on toward the goal" >>>


| No...Glen looks like Glinda...the witch of the north.

	YES! Luv that gown with the sparkles!!!! And oh.... that magic wand...

As I've said before, I've spotted Jerry Garcia in the WWW 'box pages. He is 
one Mr. Bill.

Tom 

    
    well that was a nice slam on mr. bill then Tom, as Jerry Garcia was
    not a handsome man. Santa Claus looking yes.

    You mean he ain't a boinkable celebrity, or famous person, to have sex
    with somewhere at?

	      ....        ....	
           .adAMMMb.   .dAMMMAbn.
        .adAWWWWWWWWWAuAWWWWWWWWWWAbn.
     .adWWW__|   |__|__|__|__|   |_WWWbn.
    dMMMM     \_/	      \_/   MMMMMb
 ..adMM	       _               _        MMbn..
    dMMMM  __ /	\ __ __ __ ___/ \___MMMMMb
     "~^YUM  |   |  |  |  |  |   | MUP^~"
          "~^PMMMdMAbammdAMMMMMMP^~"
              "^UMMMMMMMMMMMMU^"   
               "^Y^YUWWWWUP^"
         
          
    
    

    Where did you get that from?

    What editor did you do it with?
    
    What computer did you do it on?
    
    Where's my brain at?
    
    in!
    
    out!
    
    (baring shoulder)

    
    hey, you ain't got no fangs, mz_deb....dat ain't your bite...
    
    

    
    Those are canine teeth, not fangs!
    
    

    
    
    ...also known as fangs...but you ain't got none...you had 'em file down
    or sumfin...*i* still have mine all pointy and whatnot...gotta think of
    a reason to have them filed down and to have it covered by insurance...
    right now it's considered cosmetic (as would be filing them little
    bumps on the bottom of my teeth that have been there since my 'big
    girl' teeth came in) and i don't have the $$ for that... :<
    
    

    
    What ARE you babbling on about?
    
    

    
    And why would anyone have their teeth filed?  I'm so confused 8^/.

    
    
    Just remember, once you file them you can't defile them.....

    
    raq, you got sharp pointy teeth..... hhhhmmmmm ya don't say.....
    What cha doin' this weekend.... ;->
    
    OBTW - NICE TEETH MS DEB ! ! !
    
    Dan

    .35> And why would anyone have their teeth filed?
    
    Dunno why, but duknow where...
    
    
    (extra points if you already know)
    
    
    Under T, of course
    

    
    "C'mon down, to Doctor Dan's `Under-T' dude ranch!"
    

    
    
    deb...you have nice flat teeth...flat on the bottom...remember
    WWWWAAAYYYYYYYY baq when your baby teeth fell out and your new teeth
    grew in...well the tops of them were more than liqely *not* flat...rather
    bumpy...well, some people, after they have braces, sinc the dds is in
    there filing off the adhesive, thay also make the bottom of the teeth
    flat.  other people, as time goes by, the bumps wear down...well, not
    mine!!  they are still bumpy and i hate it!!! 
    
    i'll show ya at lunch what i mean!
    
    
    
    

    re: ,29
    
      Frontal view of Spiny's choppers???!!

    Berry Garcia

    Does anybody have any idea what all those dead heads are going to do
    now?
    
    They may need a support group of some kind, a couple of pyschologists,
    a drug rehab speacialist, etc.
    
    I betya the funeral procession will be quite the sight.

    
>    I betya the funeral procession will be quite the sight.


   The funeral was Friday and private.


 Jim

    new album: "jerry garcia UNPLUGGED"

    
    <---------------
    
    BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ! ! ! !
    
    :-)
    

    heard the first slew of jerry jokes this weekend...didn't think it
    would take that long...
    
    
    

    
    re: .43
    
    >Does anybody have any idea what all those dead heads are going to do
    >now?
    
    >They may need a support group of some kind, a couple of pyschologists,
    >a drug rehab speacialist, etc.
    
    Probably attend a co-dependency roundtable...
    

     >Does anybody have any idea what all those dead heads are going to do
     >now?
    
     I understand that Jerry is being freeze dried and sold by the gram.
    The lungs are reported to sell for top dollar due to the high resin
    content.

    CNN carried part of a memorial service held for Jerry in San Fran
    (yesterday, I think); looked pretty cool to me.  People were
    swaying to music, etc. :-)
    
    Garcia's wife and Bob Weir spoke to the crowd and told them to
    "wave to Jerry" and the crowd did.
    
    

    
    <------
    
    Did they look up while waving... or down??
    

    
    They waved, but Jerry was occupied, having to listen to the same Jim
    Nabors/Barry Manilow duet album OVER and OVER....(wasn't this
    a Twilight Zone/Night Gallery episode ?)
    

    
    Oh! So they were looking DOWN???  :) :)
    

    Somebody, I think in this file, said that the first crop of Jeffy
    Garcia jokes has already surfaced -- and quicker than they'd expected.
    
    Then they had the temerity to NOT post ANY of 'em.
    
    'BoxCulcha expects every 'BoxDenizen to do their duty.
    
    |-{:-)
    

What did one deadhead say to the other deadhead when the drugs wore off?

Geeziz, this band really sucks, doesn't it?

    .54> Jeffy
    
         Jerry
    
    nnttm
    
    
    (Tnx, Jack!!)
    

    
    > Garcia's wife and Bob Weir spoke to the crowd and told them to
    > "wave to Jerry" and the crowd did.
    
    The crowd at a funeral did a wave ?
    

    Dan,
    
    It wasn't a formal funeral; everyone was outside (huge crowd) in the
    Haight Ashbury district (I think).
    
    The actual funeral had been private and held the day before; this
    was a memorial service that allowed fans to participate.....
    
    

    
    So they did a wave at the memorial service....
    
    Didn't all that up and down make the mourners tired?
    

    The service was at Golden Gate State Park.

>    The service was at Golden Gate State Park.

Did anybody jump?

Golden Gate State Park is actually miles away from the bridge.

/john

    
    Did they have to shoo away any bums??
    

 Are we talking Golden Gate Park?  I grew up in the SF area and don't recall
 it being a state park, though of course that could have changed.




 Jim

    
    well, when i was there back in january (saying hi to your mom), the
    area with the garden thing and the planetarium was highlighted on a
    local map as being the golden gate state park...
    
    

 Thanks for saying hi to my mom, btw..



 Maybe it is a state park then..of course maybe it was when I lived there
 and didn't know it ;-)

	you lived there and didn't know it ?

You lived in Golden Gate Park?

Andy, you find Jim's bum attractive?

    
    He has a bum living with him??? Is she single??
    
    I thought all he had were cat pieces!!

    I seen him today, in the SHR3 cafateria in the salad bar line :-)

>	you lived there and didn't know it ?


   Hey, it was the 60's!

    Well, last night when I was pulling my pants down, I could of sworn I
    saw this Garcia dude.

    
    You have mucho gray hair???
    

    
       Oh my, he was in your pants?????

I heard last night that the final coroner's report indicated
that Jerry died of clogged arteries. Tests showed he'd used
cocaine within 5 days previous to his death.

What else is new?

    So, it was fat that killed him.
    
    		Robert.
    

         SAN RAFAEL, Calif. (AP) _ Jerry Garcia's heart simply gave out,
the coroner has concluded.
         The Grateful Dead leader had used heroin within days of his
death at a rehab center Aug. 9, but that didn't contribute directly
to his heart attack, Marin County coroner's investigator Gary 
Erickson said Tuesday.
          ``He was a 53-year-old man with hardening of the arteries,'' he
said. ``This was a mechanical process.''
          Tests results indicate that the guitarist's most recent use of
heroin was ``likely from before the time'' he entered the
rehabilitation facility.
         Despite a diabetic coma in 1986 that damaged his heart, Garcia
had a difficult time exercising and staying on a diet. He was
admitted to a hospital in 1991 when he became exhausted.
         Two of three arteries leading from Garcia's heart had been
reduced to ``a pinpoint'' with 85 percent blockage, Erickson said.
The third artery had 30 percent blockage.
         The Grateful Dead has been one of the nation's most popular
concert acts for years, grossing more than $50 million in ticket
sales last year. 
	

    
    
    >Despite a diabetic coma in 1986 that damaged his heart, Garcia
    >had a difficult time exercising and staying on a diet.
    
    
     I guess the words "or else" never sunk in... Either that or the drug
    induced stupor made it sound (to him) like "Keep up the good work!"
    

    i heard it was heroin (he had used shortly before)

So it appears.

I'm not sure that that's a significant difference, but ...

    I suppose there's also the possibility that the heroin "within
    the last days" didn't help much either.  I read an earlier article
    that said he started out at the Betty Ford Clinic, but after two
    weeks he begged his wife to allow him to leave there and enter a
    clinic closer to home.
    
    So, he had to have de-toxed quite a bit at BF; he ingests more
    heroin before entering the new treatment center.  If the drug was
    high quality and he was partially de-toxed, it could have been 
    more than his severely damaged heart could handle.
    
    

    Garcia got what he deserved. What a waste. Here is a guy who had
    everything going for him and he throws his life away on ridicules
    indulgences. Darwin was right!

    Garcia fathered several children in his 53 yrs, and presumably left them a
    considerable amount of money.  Hard to see how this makes him a
    failure in terms of natural selection.
    
    -Stephen

    >Hard to see how this makes him a failure in terms of natural selection.
    
    He is prematurely dead. What else needs to be said?

    While I regret Garcia's passing, I think it can be accurately said that 
    his life was a successful one in many ways.  You invoked the name of
    Darwin in condemning his (admittedly reckless and self-indulgent)
    lifestyle.  I commented that, since he had children and did a
    considerable amount to provide for the well-being of his descendants,
    his life can be considered a success in Darwinian terms (though
    Darwinian terms aren't really appropriate in such a context, IMO.)
    
    -Stephen

I recall seeing something within the past few days about the distribution
of his estate, but I don't remember all of the details.

As far as he and his demise are concerned, I can't really put a lot of
ill will toward him. He spent his life doing what he wanted to do, to
the best of my knowledge he never intentionally caused harm to anyone
else close to him, and he brought a lot of pleasure into the lives of 
those who appreciated his music.

Was his lifestyle (in terms of drug usage, etc.) admirable? No, not
necessarily, but it was his choice. Should others emulate his habits?
No, not  necessarily, but that's their choice.

As far as the heroin within the last few days of his life is concerned -
who knows? maybe it eased his way out. Should he be begrudged that?

    
    Darwin's theory comes to mind when opining about such as:
    
     James Dean
    
     Jimmy Hendrix
    
     Janis Joplin
    
     The "Who" guy...
    
     Same category as the idiots lying in the middle of the road on the
    double yellow line...

    I just think that every life is important, especially a life that has
    the ability to produce value, both for themselves and society. It
    angers me when that kind of life is uselessly wasted. Because when it
    is, everyone loses out on all future value from that life.

  "uselessly wasted"?  the guy makes a whole bucketload of contributions
  and then kicks off.  more than most of us will be able to say for ourselves,
  i'll bet.

    OK you win, I agree with you. It is good that he died. :-) Actually, killed
    himself.   

    Seems to me he would have died at this age regardless of his habits.
    85%+ clogged arteries? Hereditary problem I'd say. Not only that he was
    born with it.

    Anyway, I'm with Di. He made a lot of money, made a lot of people
    happy, helped a lot of people. He probably even dropped trou now and
    then.

    I didn't say it's good that he died.  But his life was hardly
    "wasted" compared to most people's.

    I didn't mean that his life was wasted. I ment that his death was a
    waste. I think there is a differance.

    
    re: .94
    
    >85%+ clogged arteries? Hereditary problem I'd say. 
    
    Which probably could have been corrected and/or eased with proper diet and
    exercise...
    
     But what the hell!!! Who wants to do all that "crunchy" stuff???
    
    "eat, drink and be merry"... and all that...

    <--- Not true, you cannot erase a hereditary trait like that through
    diet and exercise. 
    
    Arthur Ashe is a good example.

    
    Glenn, Lady Di said that Jerry "dropped trou now and then"   I never
    knew!
    
    > "eat, drink and be merry"... and all that...
    
    Andy wouldn't that be "eat, drink, and be Jerry" :-)))

    
    That's why I qualified it with "and/or" and the word "eased"...
    
     I never stated you can erase, and perhaps my word "correct" was
    incorrect...
    
     You can definitely "ease" such a condition...
    

    
    re: .98
    
    Glenn,
    
     How long would Ashe have lived had he not contracted AIDS from his
    transfusion? Unknown, I know... but I would guess more than a few
    years...
    

    It was his heart condition that was his problem.

    
    But it was under control.. wasn't it?
    
    He was a superb athlete and I'm sure that had to do with how long he
    actually lived (and could have without AIDS)
    

    
    .97
    
    Andy, my father was a fanatic for proper diet and exercise starting in
    the early 70's, on doctor's orders.
    
    He had angioplasty in 1990 because his arteries were more than 85%
    clogged.
    
    In 1991 he had a triple bypass because his arteries were again more
    than 85% clogged.
    
    In 1992, right before he died, his arteries again were more than 85%
    clogged.
    
    Don't tell me diet and exercise would have corrected or eased that.
    
    
                                       

    Arthur had a quad bypass in his 30's.

    Diabetic who do not adhere to their diet/exercise program and do not
    keep their sugar swings under control frequently die early from heart
    or kidney failure.
    
    The heroin certainly didn't help, but the major contributing factor was
    most likely inability/unwillingness to change eating/exercise habits
    and not smoking the three packs/day of tobacco cigarettes he was fond
    of.
    
    meg

    
    
    mz_deb...
    
    There are always anomalies... My condolences that your Dad was one of
    these...
    
    The prevailing scientific evidence and progress they've made in these
    fields begs to differ with your conclusion...

    Arterial sclerosis is not an anomaly, it's a relentless disease that
    kills many.

    He shoulda been drinking red wine. ;-)

    yupper!

    re: .108
    
    >Arterial sclerosis is not an anomaly, it's a relentless disease that
    >kills many.
    
    Glenn,
    
     I'm not arguing that fact... and I think you realize that. I'm also
    not saying that people won't die from it no matter what they do. 
    
      The overwhelming evidence is that if you make your body as strong as
    you possibly can, you increase your chances of fighting off many
    diseases...
    
      *strong here being more than just physical...
    

    Well, I still contend that clean living wouldn't have made much
    difference in this case.

    
    
    >this case..
    
    Garcia???
    
    If so, see .106
    

    Heart and kidney failure is not arterial sclerosis.

    
    and at 53 is not a normal situation...
    

Deb, I gather your father died in his 70s or beyond.  If he had lived like
Jerry Garcia, he too might have died in his 50s.

    
    >  I'm not arguing that fact... and I think you realize that. I'm also
    > not saying that people won't die from it no matter what they do. 
    
    Well Andy I'm almost certain that most people, of most genders and most
    races, and most sexual orientaions will usually die eventually, that is 
    if something doesn't kill them first.
    
    :-)))))
    

                                                      
    Ah, thank God that wasn't so. 
    
    
    Actually, my father was 53 when the doctor told him he had to shape up 
    or he wasn't going to live much longer.
                                
    If Jerry Garcia had listened to his doctor, perhaps he would have
    lived another 20 years too 8^/.
    

    Mebbe some folks would feel better if he was found face down in
    a gallon of Cherry Garcia ice cream?
    
    

    re .111
    
    Please educate yourself on diabetes, particularly adult onset diabetes. 
    The reasons for heart/kidney failure is due to hardening of the
    arteries.  apparently out of control diabetes does ugly things to blood
    vessels which is why there are so many older diabetics on dialysis,
    oolder diabetics with missing limbs, and older diabetics with heart
    problems.  
    
    The only hope is strict control of blood sugar levels to avoid what is
    inevitable for those with diabetes.
    
    meg

    I've been told.

    
    RE: .120
    
    >Please educate yourself on diabetes, particularly adult onset
    >diabetes.
    
    
    My ex-wife has it...I've been educated more than enough about the
    subject tyvm...
    
     The education was quite informative... you should try it sometime...
    
    One of the first things the doctor advised, besides getting the sugar
    under control was to lose weight. How you say? Regular exercise along
    with monitoring what she ate...
    
     Granted, different people will have different symptoms and problems,
    as you  alluded to, but each case is different for a variety of
    reasons.
    
     What is so difficult to understand about the statement that if you're
    healthier/fitter/stronger you have a better chance at survival???
    
    

    |What is so difficult to understand about the statement that if you're
    |healthier/fitter/stronger you have a better chance at survival???
    
    Well, for a lot of healthy/fit/strong men, it meant dying in a war.
    
    Define survival.

    
    
    Come on Glenn... now you're grasping at straws...
    

    
>>     What is so difficult to understand about the statement that if you're
>>    healthier/fitter/stronger you have a better chance at survival???

	In general?  Nothing.     
    

    In general nothing here either.  However, no one gets out of this life
    alive.
    
    meg

    The point I'm trying to make is, for some people, no matter what they
    do, their number will be up. Some people will live like Garcia did
    well into their 70's, so what?

    Does survival simply = living?

    Garcia lived a lot in his 53 years, he could have lived longer no
    doubt, but he wouldn't have been Garcia.

    Ahhhh, who cares.

    
    
    And I exercise every day, try and eat right and still might get hit by
    a bus or truck while riding my bike to work someday...
    
    Don't mean I should go living the "Life of Jerry"...
    
    You're right.. who cares... it's Friday and I'm going tubing this
    weekend...
    

    
    Just surviving isn't _living_.

    Look what running did for Jim Fixx (sp); perfect specimen but
    he still dropped over from a heart attack.
    
    

    
    What I get a kick out of -- for no particular reason -- is
    watching someone take long drags off of a cigarette while
    ordering healthfood in a restaurant:

    "I want a salad... {draaaaaag} NO OIL... {draaaaag}
     and I want my chicken BROILED {draaaag} not FRIED...
     {draaaaag} and give me some bread {draaaaag} NO BUTTER...
     and a diet coke... {draaaaaaag}"

    -b

When I eat a chocolate bar and drink a Diet Coke, they cancel
one another out, don't they?????

    
    
    	of course chris!
    
    

    We can speculate all we want but the fact of the matter is that we will
    never know how long Jerry would have lived.  He probably crammed more
    into his lifetime than 10 of us have.  So far I have not heard anyone
    quoting him as having any regrets for his past behaviors so why should
    we sit here and tsk, tsk his life?  Doh! I know why.  Because he led
    an evyl, drug infested, anti-family valued, rock n' roll existence and 
    had a mental death grip on several generations of Dead heads all of
    whom are a complete waste to society and never amount to anything like
    poor Kevin McHale and Billy Weld.  They probably also watched Body
    Dance on Sesame Street too!  The horrors!  Quick, someone elect Pat
    Buchanan to be prez.
    
    

    
    Jerry's last words.....
    

    "...Thanks for the ice cream...."

    
    Re: 515.130
    
    Jim Fixx had been having chest pains for some time, and failed to 
    heed the warning signs.  
                           
    al

    re:  515.130
    
    Jim Fixx's family had a history of early death from heart problems.  
    His running actually did extend his life.
    
    DianneVV
    

    
    The Grateful Dead have announced that they will disband.
    

    
    Wow. What are all those tie-dye sales people going to do now?
    
    -b

    The music never stops.
    
    This is sad new indeed.  However, I will still be in my tie-dye.
    
    meg

    
    
    We Will Survive!!
    
     Dave
    

    
    
    Now all those groupies will have to find real lives...
    
    sigh...
    

    No they won't and you can't make them!

    
    
    They'll all probably become "mall rats" now....
    

    
    > They'll all probably become "mall rats" now....

    Aren't they a little old to be "mall rats"?

    
    >Aren't they a little old to be "mall rats"?
    
    
    
    Aren't they a little old to be "groupies"???

 Jerry Garcia wakes up in a white room surrounded by musical instruments.
 He sees Jimi Hendrix and Duane Allman pick up guitars, John Lennon sit
 down at a piano and Janis Joplin, Buddy Holly and Elvis line up at micro-
 phones.

 "Wow!", says Jerry. "There really is a rock and roll heaven, and I'm going
 to jam with the band!"

  Hearing this, Elvis leans over and says, "Heaven?"

  Just then Karen Carpenter enters the room and sits down at the drums.
 "OK everybody", she says "'Close to you.' one, two..."




  

    
    .....hey!
    
    

 Thought you'd get a kick outta that ;-)