Conference back40::soapbox

    
    So what did you do _now_ /John?
    
    -b

Have you been panned from wimminotes again?

    
    Oh jeez 8^p.

It wasn't me.

    	Do any notes ever get deleted from ASKENET?  Or do the offending
    	notes just get sneered at...

	John, it may not have been you that got deleted, but was it your note?

    Whad e do ??? telmi telmi telmi !!!!

    Anyone want to guess how many of the offending notes are religion or
    abortion based?  

    Anyone care to guess how many notes....
    
    are notes asking about notesfilesin ASKENET?  
    are notes asking about new topics in HOME_WORK?
    are notes advertising tickets in CLASSIFIED_ADS?
    are notes on homosexuality in CHRISTIAN?
    

>    are notes asking about new topics in HOME_WORK?

Zero.  HOME_WORK hasn't been actively moderated in years.  It shows.

    It was tongue in groove Gerald, I follwed the pre/post 1991 debate with
    great interest.
    
    Brian

    The following was written by a moderator of Womannotes.
    
    
    				-- edp
    
    
            <<< IKE22::NOTE$:[NOTES$LIBRARY]WOMANNOTES-V5.NOTE;1 >>>
                        -< Topics of Interest to Women >-
================================================================================
Note 69.69                   Signing up for THE LIST                    69 of 70
ASDG::FOSTER "Like a Phoenix Rising"                 34 lines   5-OCT-1993 12:58
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Suzanne, you recently wrote me a mail message asking that I not
    respond to you. I had planned on staying silent. However, the little
    smiley face at the end of your note does not in any way soften the
    ugliness of throwing in my face the fact that I'm single and you're
    getting married, and you feel that you can lord it over me.
    
    I find your comment petty, childish, offensive... and typical.
    
    Under other circumstances, I would be rather happy for you. But since
    you have demonstrated your ability to be snide, rude, and ugly while
    hiding under the guise of a happy face, I thought I ought to call you
    on it.
    
    Suzanne, I personally believe that your voice is one of the most
    detrimental women's voices in the file, and I consider the fact that
    you are noting less to be a distinct relief, both as a moderator and as
    a noter. On countless occasions, I have elected NOT to use moderator
    powers to silence that voice of yours; it is not my way. But because I
    honestly believe that you have crossed the threshold of ugliness and
    toyed with something extremely personal and painful in my life, I do
    not see any reason why I should not speak my mind as a noter well.
    
    Suzanne, I find your writing style abhorrent. It is critical, it serves
    little useful purpose except to bait people and extend the level of
    tension in the file. On occasion, I have seen you write valuable
    material. However, it is usually so completely buried beneath your
    attempts to stifle others whom YOU feel "don't belong" that its lost on
    most of us. And you have created a legacy. For as long as I remember
    Womannotes, I will probably remember you. As a woman who took it upon
    herself to play "champion of the file"... and made such a botch of it
    that she drove WOMEN away with her ascerbic, abrasive, destructive,
    critical, and generally tactless way of noting.
    
    I hope you're proud of yourself. Have a lovely wedding.

    I missed that one.

    
    go ::foster!!!
    
    
    

    Steve, it's from 1993
    
    edp, you shouldn't have posted that.
    
    My 2c

    re: .15
    
    I just noticed the time stamp on the note.  I wasn't even
    a read-only in that particular conference until early 1994 or
    thereabouts.
    
    
    -steve

    
>>    edp, you shouldn't have posted that.

	er, yeah - what's with this posting of other people's notes?
	if edp did it, it's probably all legal and what-not - he could
	probably cite chapter and verse of every rule, P&P, etc. 
	involved, if any - but it hardly seems ethical, does it?

    Re .15:
    
    > edp, you shouldn't have posted that.
    
    Why?  It's accurate, and Digital policy permits the reposting of notes
    from one conference to another.
    
    
    				-- edp
    
    
Public key fingerprint:  8e ad 63 61 ba 0c 26 86  32 0a 7d 28 db e7 6f 75
To find PGP, read note 2688.4 in Humane::IBMPC_Shareware.

My intention was that this would be a place for note authors to post their
own notes when deleted in other conferences.

/john

    Re .17:
    
    > . . . but it hardly seems ethical, does it?
    
    What do you perceive to be unethical?  The author wanted it to be seen;
    that's why they posted it in the first place.  What rule of ethics
    compels people to keep publicly-posted notes secret?
    
    
    				-- edp
    
    
Public key fingerprint:  8e ad 63 61 ba 0c 26 86  32 0a 7d 28 db e7 6f 75
To find PGP, read note 2688.4 in Humane::IBMPC_Shareware.

	the author intended that it be seen at that time and by
	that audience.  the author's attitudes might have changed
	in the interim and the author might not appreciate the attitude,
	the conflict, the situation, or whatever, being resurrected
	or brought to the forefront now.  

re: <<< Note 401.18 by RUSURE::EDP "Always mount a scratch monkey." >>>
 � Public key fingerprint:  8e ad 63 61 ba 0c 26 86  32 0a 7d 28 db e7 6f 75
 � To find PGP, read note 2688.4 in Humane::IBMPC_Shareware.
    
    
 � Why ?
    
    Courtesy, common sense, ethics, style ...
    Remember the honey and estragon episode from elsewhere.
    
    
 � It's accurate, and Digital policy permits the reposting of notes
 � from one conference to another.
    
    There's more to human interaction than what is manifested in Digital 
    policies.
    
    	
    Heiko

    

>                                           The author wanted it to be seen;
>    that's why they posted it in the first place.
                ^^^^

Does this mean that ASDG::FOSTER has multiple personalities?

edp, I find the posting of that note to be 
childish, petty, vindictive...and typical
of your noting behavior.  You should be 
ashamed of yourself.

Well, whatever. But it certainly appears that it WAS a great note.
Almost kinda make ya wanna wonder if you've been correct in avoiding
some conferences . . . 



NAH!

    .25
    
    hear hear
    
    i'm staying out of there
    
    duh thats the second time i've agreed wholeheartedly with you today -
    spooky huh
    
    ric

Do soon-to-be-deleted notes count?

Take a gander at WECARE::ZKO_SUGGESTION_BOX notes 274.*.
Trust me, they're a hoot.

    I used to sit next to one wimmin-noter, across from another.
    Both very liberal. As a self-proclaimed conservative, and
    one that rather kept to himself, I was still a convenient
    target when it came time to vent their frustrations. Oooh
    boy, could these ladies vent.

    I already knew about John Covert, Joe Oppelt and a variety
    of other soapboxers _long_ before I ever opened it for the
    first time... my right ear has started producing voluminous
    amounts of wax, and I swear I can trace it back to when
    I used to have to listen to their diatribe about those evyl
    wimmin haters... :-) :-)

    -b

WECARE::ZKO_SUGGESTION_BOX notes 274.*.

Absolutely priceless.

>>Absolutely priceless.

	aye. ;>

    Wimminotes scares me,I must admit.
    
    Come to that,women scare me full stop. ho!ho!
    
    

    .31
    
    scare? is that all? *TERRIFY* is more like it! 8^)
    
    (but in a nice way - like peeking from behind the sofa at Dr Who)
    
    ric

    Wow, I had totally forgotten about ::Foster's note to me.  (So much
    for the myth that I get some sort of automatic 'special treatment' from
    the =wn= moderators, though, eh?)  This note is a wowser!  :/
    
    I remember what happened in this situation - 'ren accused me of hating
    the men in Womannotes (whereas, she loved them) so I said something
    like 'Well, I don't hate the men in =wn= all THAT much since I'm engaged
    to marry one of them' (which sorta indicated that I liked at least ONE
    of the men in =wn= a whole lot more than she liked ANY of the men in
    =wn=.)  :)
    
    My husband and I actually met in Womannotes several years ago, although
    he was most often fairly quiet there.
    
    He's also very conservative.  He became exceptionally fond of Womannotes 
    anyway.

    	I don't see the purpose of posting the ::foster note and ensuing
    	discussion, nor the ZKO_SUGGESTION_BOX pointer.  I thought this
    	topic was for DELETED notes, not notes that still exist.

I thought that posting the ZKO_SUGGESTION_BOX pointer might lead to the
deletion of the notes in question.

    Like many others in Soapbox, it has obviously become a ratholed
    topic, and as such probably doesn't fit the desired goal of the
    basenoter.  
    
    howsomeever, I thought there was a quiet understanding that permission
    from the original noter was supposed to be obtained before
    cross-posting their note(s)
    
    meg

    that harmless bastion of fun ::MOVIE have the right idea, don't remove
    notes, just move them to the tail end of some long forgotton thread on
    Teddybears or something, they just get lost in the noise.   I think
    they got that idea from Raiders of the Lost Arc.
    
    Reg.  I. Jones.

    The purpose is clear- when somebody is feeling censored from a
    conference they don't control, they want to be able to come in here and
    strut a little.  John clearly was providing an opening for a note Nancy
    Morales had written that was hidden in womannotes.  Soapbox being what it 
    is, and womannotes being what it is, John evidently feels a need for a
    convenient whipping post.
    
    His mileage will vary, no doubt.
    
    DougO

    Prticularly, as John knows, the note was reposted as originally
    written.  

Control is a funny thing.  Some peoples just gots to have it.

    
    This note is illogical.  Any note added here is moved, not deleted.
    
    So, no notes logically belong here.
    
    
      bb

Err, umm, re-posting without permission has been verboten for some time...
Oddly enough, I actually had to take action based on this when it got out of
hand.

-former goderator of ::ASTRONOMY

A deleted note, for your delectation.  Hope you enjoyed it!

Chris.

    >Err, umm, re-posting without permission has been verboten for some
    >time...
    
     My understanding has been that a posted note is open game; private
    mail is not. Posted notes are "public" (at least within Digital) and as
    such are not prohibited from being reposted to other conferences
    (except you can't repost a note from a confidential conference, etc.)

 This reply intentionally left blank

>     My understanding has been that a posted note is open game; private
>    mail is not. 

Mark, how about if you removed all evidence of the sender?  Could you
post a received mail message then?  I want to post some mail I received
this morning.

    >Mark, how about if you removed all evidence of the sender?  Could you
    >post a received mail message then?  I want to post some mail I received
    >this morning.
    
     Can't you just get permission?
    

>           <<< Note 401.46 by WAHOO::LEVESQUE "luxure et supplice" >>>
>     My understanding has been that a posted note is open game; private

Check ::MODERATORS. I haven't been in there in a long time, but I believe
that's where I got it...

    It's worth pointing out that Soapbox doesn't exactly toe the policy
    line in a number of areas, which makes the question kinda moot.

>Can't you just get permission?

Nah, if I sent mail asking for his permission, I'm
quite sure that he'd carry through on his threat of 
contacting my supervisor in order to file a claim
of "harassment".  

Quite the sand thrower.  Bad sand throwee.

	I can name that noter in .... 1 note.

Was the mail message sent after 10:22 this morning?

Indeed it was!!!

    	re .34
    
    	I have been informed via mail that the ::foster note was
    	deleted, so I stand corrected that it doesn't belong here.
    	(Though I thought the spirit of the founding of this topic
    	was for noters to post their OWN notes deleted from other
    	conferences...)
    
    	So, Eric, what are you doing holding onto a note that was
    	neither written by you, nor to to you, nor about you?  Does 
    	your system have lots of free space?  :^)
    
    	BTW, I took a look at ZKO_SUGGESTION_BOX.  I don't often
    	agree with you, Eric, but it seemed that you had a fine
    	suggestion about getting it delivered to the front desk
    	instead of the shipping dock.  I think you were unfairly 
    	treated in that discussion due to prejudgements.  I won't
    	say that the prejudgements were unfairly earned, however.
    	It's kind of a boy-who-cried-wolf thing after all...

    If only I could say what I really want to say...
    
    mmmmfffftttttmmmmmmfffffttt

    this is soapbox.  what's holding you back?
    
    DougO

    Restraint. :-p

| <<< Note 401.32 by RDGE44::ALEUC8 >>>


| (but in a nice way - like peeking from behind the sofa at Dr Who)

	Dr Who is cool....

    
    >Note 401.61 by JULIET::MORALES_NA "Sweet Spirit's Gentle Breeze"
    >Restraint. :-p
    
    
    Nancy is into bondage?!  ....does Tom know?

 =:-O

    DEB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    
    :-)  You stinker you.

    probably part of the religion-guilt thing
    
    "ooh ooh tie me up and punish me cos i'm a naughty girl"
    
    8^)
    
    ric

    I'm sure you and Tom can work this one out, unless of course Tom likes
    that kind of stuff. You're both very lucky people.

    -2
    
    WELLLlllllllll I NEVAH!!!

    
    	It's not too late to start.
    

    
    deleted snarf?

    Ken and his brother used to keep their private Pipers in the
    corporate hanger at Hanscom, where hanger fees are $500 and up
    and have a very long (3-5 year) waiting list.  A few years ago,
    I wondered "out loud" in a note whether Digital received any
    compensation or if the IRS knew about the arrangement.
    
    Boy did the notes police ever jump on that...

>    Boy did the notes police ever jump on that...

Who, specifically?

  ZZZZ 461.38 deleted for insult
    
    Ho ho ho....that's rich I'll say!!!!

    
    The story I posted in 172.33 was set-hidden-end-of-discussion in
    KAOSWS::CANADA, for violation of copyright.
    
    If, indeed, it represents a copyright violation, I'm curious as to
    why the same thing doesn't happen here.
    

    That was just an excuse.

Posting a single article as part of a discussion generally meets
fair use guidelines as long as it is not

	Extensive  (a whole edition of a paper or an entire feature series)
	Systematic (daily postings of every article)
	For Profit (part of a product or service that you're making money on)

/john

    
    .76
    
    It was not any of those.  The text I quoted was the Reader's Digest 
    condensed version, representing about 30-40% of the total article.
              

> I'm curious as to why the same thing doesn't happen here.
    
Cuz our mods here are enlightened intellectuals, unlike the mods in
other conferences.

>Cuz our mods here are enlightened intellectuals, unlike the mods in
>other conferences.

mighty brown tongue you got there bub... :)

Chris.

    From choklit donuts, right?

    HOOVER ALERT!!
    

    Kirby would be proud.

    
    Glad to see it wasn't me....
    
    Dan