Conference back40::soapbox

    "Baywatch" babes
    
    or is that just a myth ? no no please don't disillusion me !
    
    ric

    
    Mud.
    
      bb

>    well...if it will keep people from moving here, fine with me.
    
I thought people are moving out in droves.  No?

    Things wouldn't be so bad in California if people didn't live there.
    
    

>                            -< most are still here >-

OK, so only 49% have left.  So sue me.

	The node name "SWAM1" takes on deeper meaning,
	given the recent weather pattern.

    An old joke of course, but worth repeating: "California is like
    a bowl of granola. What ain't fruits and nuts is flakes."
    
    -b

    P.S. I hope all of our left coast contributers are weathering the
         storm OK...
    
    -b

	All kidding aside, I hope all the West Coast 'boxers are
	getting through the storms safely.  Saw some incredible
	footage of flooding and mudslides in SoCal last night.

	Got me to thinking about the LA river, and others, normally
	nothing more than a creek in those massive concrete river beds.

	Hang in there, ladies and gents.	

    I figured those concrete river beds were for more than hollyweed car
    chases and Terminator 2 truck vs motorcycle duels.
    
    When I was out there in 70 and 71, hot and dry seemed to be the rule, 
    I could have never imagined the current weather conditions and all the
    flooding. Hope y'all pull thru it OK.

    The downright balmy weather in the Northeast is being at least
    partially attributed to the poor weather conditions on the
    west coast...
    
    I'm sure digging the weather here right now, although I certainly
    wish it were not at the expense of our left coast friends.
    
    -b

    
    there is a place in california, not too far outside of san francisco on
    route 1 where i saw the town sign:
    
    	dogwood
     	pop: 30
    
    
    i almost weeed myself... :>
    

>    	dogwood
>     	pop: 30
>    
>    i almost weeed myself... :>

The population of Weed, California, near Mt. Shasta, is only slightly higher.

/john

    .16
    
    subtle, /john.  i like it.

    Don't tell Sheriff Weed of Methow, Washington...

    
    temp was 88 degrees today.
    stopped by the beach. It was real nice.
    
    

    
    Los Angeles last week found a illegal garment factory
    hold more than 40 Thai women as slaves for as long as
    seven years.  Those women finally were freed by raid of
    California labor department and LA police.  INS was tipped
    about three years for possible illegal immigrant in the
    sweatshop.  INS agent did investigation on the factory
    and found no hard evidence.  But INS did asked US attorny
    for search warrant.  US attorney, Nora Manella refused for
    lack of evidence.  He said, "No amount of hindsight can alter the
    fact that an uncorroborated tip of an anonymous informant, without
    independent evidence of criminal activity, cannot justify a federal
    search warrant".
    
    The sweat shop could have been broken into three years ago had
    Nora asked for search warrant.  The state labor department received
    a tip this time then asked the court for search warrant.  The US
    attorney is accused for "indifference to slavery".
    
    So do you think US attorney was doing the right thing three years
    ago by doing nothing on slavery tip?   In my opinion, he should
    go to the court and let the judge make the decision.
    
    
    J.

>    So do you think US attorney was doing the right thing three years
>    ago by doing nothing on slavery tip?


No. It would certainly appear that he should have taken some action
earlier, and one would hope that he will be queried/prosecuted on
the matter. I'd even go so far as to say that he should be penalized.

Are any further details available, Jason? E.G., were the women in question
living as members of the community during this period, or were they
confined to quarters for this lengthy period?

I ask only because if they were not confined, then it would appear that they
were complicit in the operation by hiding their illegal immigrant status.

re : 20
    
   >US attorney, Nora Manella refused for
   >lack of evidence.  He said, "No amount of hindsight can alter the
   >fact that an uncorroborated tip of an anonymous informant, without
   >independent evidence of criminal activity, cannot justify a federal
   >search warrant".

	Yes, Nora did the right thing. A search warrent should never be
	issued solely on an anonymous tip.

    
				Robert.

    
    <-----------

    I must certainly agree with you Robert.  It's a shame when the bad guy
    gets away with things, but the other option is MUCH more dangerous!

    Dan

Why was this characterized as slave labor?  Were the workers held against
their will?  There are dozens of sweat shops in NY's Chinatown where
immigrants work for less than minimum wage.

    You just can't go barging in on a search warrant issued on an anonymous
    tip or a hunch.
    
    Wait, never mind, you can, you just have to either pay them 3.1 million
    afterwards or make sure they all burn up so there's no one left to sue
    you.
    
    ahem.

    They said on the news that they were held against their wills in a
    razor-wire-surrounded compound and forced to work as much as 22 hours
    a day for $1.60/hour and threatened with rape, death, and harm to
    relatives.
    
    Sounds a lot like slavery to me...

>    You just can't go barging in on a search warrant issued on an anonymous
>    tip or a hunch.

Actually, you can. And, believe it or not, if you are professional and
rational, you can do so politely and without threat. And, even more
unbelievable, I presume, if you find that you were in error, you can
quietly leave and graciously apologize after the fact, and prevent all
manner of repercussion, not to mention taking advantage of a golden
opportunity to improve public relations.

It doesn't happen often, but it's not impossible.

    Actually, you can't.
    
    A tip, yes.
    
    An anonymous tip, no.
    
    A hunch...well, define hunch.
    
    Hunch: Cop wakes up in middle of night, thinking: "Hey! I bet that
    garment place on 43rd street is using slave labor!"
    
    Educated hunch: "Hey! That garment place on 43rd street (which I
    started observing after I got an anonymous tip) has cotton going in,
    clothes coming out, but no workers going in or out..."
    
    Judges will not issue a warrant based on an anonymous tip.

    >    An anonymous tip, no.
    
    Well...  ever heard of programs like "Turn in a pusher", "Drop a dime"
    and the like that encourage folks to anonymously tip off the cops to
    drug activity?
    
    They promise anonymity, and they bust down doors (with or without
    warrants I have no idea) based on the info.  Or at least they used to
    do that.  Maybe (hopefully) they don't do that so easily any more.

    
    > Actually, you can. And, believe it or not, if you are professional and
    > rational, you can do so politely and without threat. And, even more
    > unbelievable, I presume, if you find that you were in error, you can
    > quietly leave and graciously apologize after the fact, and prevent all
    > manner of repercussion, not to mention taking advantage of a golden
    > opportunity to improve public relations.
    
    BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.......
    
    {snif},{snif}.......
    You're in rare form today Jack!
    
    :-)
    Dan

    WOD allows anonymous tips for warrants, as it is part of the War on
    Rights.
    
    This only dealt with human rights, so no need for hurry.  
    
    meg

How is it that the labor department has the jurisdiction to order this?

    
    Perhaps, in the case of a store that was dealing directly with the
    sweatshop, the sweatshop has a "sub-contractor" status that makes the
    store, as the contractor, liable for the back wages, especially if it
    can be shown that the store was aware of the conditions.
    
    Just guessing, of course.  But the story I posted in News Briefs says 
    the same thing: the stores will be on the hook for the back pay.
    

    
    re: .34
    
    BATF Wannabe??

    re: .20
    
    Yes, I think the Feds did the right thing.  I only wish other Federal
    agencies had this much respect for the law.
    
    Bob

    Being in the business of making and enforcing the law, they naturally
    think themselves to be above it.