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| Title: | GUITARnotes - Where Every Note has Emotion |
| Notice: | Discussion of the finer stringed instruments |
| Moderator: | KDX200::COOPER |
|
| Created: | Thu Aug 14 1986 |
| Last Modified: | Fri Jun 06 1997 |
| Last Successful Update: | Fri Jun 06 1997 |
| Number of topics: | 3280 |
| Total number of notes: | 61432 |
2870.0. "Live Music Scene Survey Results (off USENET)" by TECRUS::ROST (If you don't C#, you might Bb) Mon Jan 03 1994 11:54
Off USENET. Some food for thought, a survey of what live music scenes
are like in various locations. Might be interesting for folks to
compare impressions of their towns with what people in the survey had
to say!
Brian
P.S. This is LONG...over 700 lines.
From: [email protected] (Greg Skinner)
Subject: Live music in your hometown (long)
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Date: Thu, 23 Dec 93 17:13:58 GMT
About a month or so ago, I posted a short survey on local live music
scenes. The survey was prompted by some discussions I was having with
some people about why the LA live music scene is doing so poorly. The
general impression I got from the survey responses is that in other
parts of the country, there is a commitment among the local residents
to support live music, despite economic conditions, crime, other forms
of entertainment, etc.
The survey questions were:
* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
supporters of live music?
* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
your hometown?
and the responses were:
From: Stephen Schmidt <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
In article <[email protected]> you write:
>I have a few short questions for those of you who are involved in
>your local live performance scene:
My local scene can be defined three ways: Palo Alto area, San Jose
area, San Francisco area. I'll try to answer for all three...
Live music is not too bad in Palo Alto, given that we're mostly a
bedroom and university community. It's not what you'd expect in a
big city, but then we're only 20 minutes drive from...
San Jose's music community stinks. Lots of modern dance, a _small_
amount of blues, and that's about it. Name bands don't even bother
to play there. The most famous San Jose musician is Hammer, if that
gives you some idea ;) Fortunately, Palo Alto is only 40 minutes from..
San Francisco. Greatest city for live music in the world, especially
when you consider that Oakland/Berkeley just over the bridge. Primus
sucks!
Palo Alto isn't that supportive but it's not too bad. Having the
university helps, students provide most of the support that there
is.
San Francisco is just a mecca for musicians, which is why it thrives,
has been ever since Haight-Ashbury was the center of the musical
universe ;)
San Jose is just a totally dead town. There is no entertainment of
any kind, really, except the bars. Actually that's not entirely true,
there is some Hispanic community with traditional Hispanic music and
other entertainment. Mostly however, San Jose is just dead in all ways.
Not much at all in any of the three areas; the economy has been very
good here all the time I've been here (nine years). Silicon Valley
you know...
From: [email protected] (Michael Waldron)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
I live in the big city/rural town of Bozeman, MT. Music is thriving
hellaciously here. Probably the biggest reason is that this is a college
town, so the bars are not just places to sit down and drink, but rock
& rolling, country pickin', blues wailin' places to party.
I frequently refer to Bozeman as Little Seattle, because of the
number of bands (we must have 30+ here, and the population is only 40k or
so during the school year, and 30k during the summer) and also because of
the weather. :-)
I don't know if the economy stimulates this industry or not, but
the economy is *BOOMING* big-time. Bozeman's growth has been described as
"explosive" by the national news media, and is expected to quadruple in size
over the next ten years.
The local populace definitely supports live music in the area. I
recently worked a dance where a band monikered "Father Midnight" played, and
the place was packed to the rafters.
Hope this helps, and as usual. . .
Keep the faith.
From: Ken Kaliszewski <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
Absolutely! The Denver music scene is really gathering some speed.
Particurly ORIGINAL music.
>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
I suppose...
>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
N/A - other than I HATE all of those other mediums as much as I hated
disco. Why would anyone want to go hear a bunch of drunks singing
"Handyman" or such nonsense with karoake?
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
I think it may have something to do with it. Colorado is a boom town
right now...
Ken
From: Len Moskowitz <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
Yes. Incredibly so.
>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
Partly. Also because this is one of the centers of the recording,
television, and movie industries. And a huge city.
>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
What's a DJ? :^)
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
Everything is thriving. More clubs and more music from World-class
bands than you could possibly listen to. Every night of the week.
Every style of music.
By the way, don't you want to know where this is? NYC, of course!
Len Moskowitz
[email protected]
From: Russ Evans <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Edinburgh, Scotland. Live music isn't doing too badly, but it could
be better. I think it's more to do with the willingness of local
musicians to work for very little, than with support from local folks.
Half of the audiences are themselves musicians, most of the time ...
In many parts of the UK karaoke and DJ's are encroaching on the gigs
available for live music, but things aren't too bad in Edinburgh --
neither of them are exactly popular!
I think the Edinburgh Festival is a big problem for the local music
scene. It imports audiences for a three-week bash, and leaves the place
deserted the rest of the time. The locals are willing to come out, to
some extent, for the Festival, but not for "non-Festival" gigs.
Russ
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
From: 19-Nov-1993 1017 <[email protected]>
I live in Northboro, MA, a suburb of Worcester, MA about thirty five miles from
Boston. Boston has a thriving scene, Worcester has a weak scene, the town I
live in has exactly one place that live music is played, mostly amateur/hack
rock bands. One possible bright spot is a very successful folk music club the
next town over in Westboro, MA.
The main problem seems to be the idea that live music is entertainment. Most
music is really an inducement to get people to go to bars to meet romantic
partners. Boston has a decent "art" scene, supporting folk, jazz and classical
music in addition to the bars.
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
Not much. In the twelve years I've been in MA, things have stayed about the
same. Of more impact may be that with Worcester being close enough to Boston,
people can always drive in to the "big city" to make up for the lack of musical
option locally.
Brian Rost @tecrus.enet.dec.com
From: "deborah lynn gillaspie" <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Greg,
It's funny you should ask right now. The last three weeks, the Chicago
Trib "Friday" and Sunday Arts sections have had articles about the jazz
scene here. We're experiencing a renaissance of sorts. This used to be a
BIG jazz town, as I'm sure you're aware, but there was kind of a slump
for awhile. Now, all of a sudden it seems, there are new jazz places
opening up, and big band music is popular again. Local groups seem to
be filling the gap left by the demise of the big touring bands. We still
get a lot of headliners in the small jazz ensemble idiom, but local
bands seem to be doing well, too. You can find local jazz almost any
night of the week (Monday seems to be the day off here.) Blues clubs
have pretty much been around and doing ok all along. There's a fair
amount of "world music" around in various venues. I can't really comment
on the rock scene, it's not my thing. But there are groups playing on
the North Side; Joe Kaplan from the percussion list would know more
about that scene.
I noticed a fair number of local CDs when I ws up at Tower Records
last week; that's a good sign, in my opinion. We've got some terrific
local people who are even touring on the national level; e.g., Willie
Pickins is on tour with Elvin Jones right now, they're headed for a
gig in Japan. Larry Gray (bass) has just brought out a CD that has
been well reviewed. And Paul Wertico lives here...
Hope this helps,
--Debbie
From: [email protected] (Dave Hardman - MD34)
Message-Id: <9311191635.AA15404@frc710>
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
Only Heavy Metal music seams to thrive on the live scene.
>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
I think most metal bands are made up of high school and young musicians.
These musicians are willing to play for pennies.
>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
I think part of the problem is that here in Sacramento, anyone who is
really good has moved to LA or San Francisco. The opportunity to hear
live music made by competent musicians (other than heavy metal) is limited.
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
Not sure.
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
From: John Shepherd <[email protected]>
In article <[email protected]>, you write:
> I have a few short questions for those of you who are involved in
> your local live performance scene:
For me that would be the Washington, DC and surrounding areas
(Northern Virginia, and most of Maryland, including Baltimore).
> * Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
Well, I believe compared to other parts of the country, we're thriving.
The last couple years, I think have slowed slightly, but it seems to be
picking up speed again.
> * If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
That's a big part of it. Why? DC's got a music history in several genres; Jazz (Duke Ellington), Country/Bluegrass/Rural (Jimmy Dean, Roy Clark,
Patsy Cline), Rap/GoGo (believed by some to have originated in DC), rock
(Joan Jett), punk (Dischord Records), and the list goes on. People don't
want to see that history forgotten. In fact, theres a non-profit
organization called the "Washington Area Music Association" (WAMA) that
exist with the purpose of promoting DC as a successful music business
center for all forms of music. They hold annual award ceremonies
("Wammies") and hold charity performances and put out compilation CDs
of Washington music. They also provide a means of networking with other
people in the business.
> * If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
I don't think any of the above had any detrimental effect on the
music scene here. If anything, MTV inspired people to dust off their old
guitars and get their buddies together to form bands.
> * To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
The economy has caused a few live music clubs to fold in the past. I
don't know of many that have switched to other entertainment to stay open.
I think those that did found it less lucrative then live music.
Fortunately the last year has seen the opening of a few new live music
venues, so things are actually looking up.
From: Marc Sabatella <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
In newsgroup rec.music.bluenote you wrote:
> I have a few short questions for those of you who are involved in
> your local live performance scene:
Uh-oh, so are you looking to move now :-) What's up?
> * Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
It's actually doing pretty well, especially if you consider the entire region
(like, say, a 60 mile radius) so youmcan include Greeley, Boulder, and Denver.
There is a "frontier" mentality here, with each town entirely self-contained
and generally separated by 10-20 miles or so of open space, and I think this
is actually conducive to live music - each town has its own clubs, etc.
> * If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
I guess so, what else could it be? It seems kind of split, though - this is
definitely a "suburban" feeling town, although we're not a suburb of anything.
There are many families, and people with kids here don't tend to go out much.
But this is also a college town, and a yuppie/DINC town (HP is largely
responsible for that); also many people come here to experience Colorado, and
that tends to attract a lot of people into folk and/or country who support the
music.
> * If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
There is thankfully almost no karaoke in Ft. Collins. I suppose there are a
couple of DJ-oriented dance clubs, but I never go to those or think about them
anyhow. A lot of people head into the mountains over the weekend; that is
probably the biggest competition for entertainment.
> * To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
There is an "Old Town" section of Fort Collins that, when I first moved here,
was largely deserted. It had recently been renovated, and was gaining in
popularity as sort of a tourist attraction, but there wasn't all that much to
do there. Now, it is clearly the cultural center of town. I suppose this is
related to Colorado's emergence from the recession over the last few years.
Fort Collins is reported (by its own Chamber of Commerce) to have one of the
highest ratios of restaurants : citizens, and I think, in general, that scales
also to "places with live music". Bars, restaurants, and coffeehouses all
feature live music from 2-6 nights a week, with emphasis on folk/rock and
blues, but also an above average dose of country and jazz and original rock.
There is relatively little in the punk/underground/alternative scene, although
there is plenty in Boulder.
From: Jay Kadis <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
> * Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
In a way, yes. There is no shortage of bands willing to play for little or nothing and plenty
of clubs presenting live music in some form or other. (San Francisco Bay Area...)
> * If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
I'm not sure why things keep going. It's pretty hard to get a large turnout for most of our
gigs. I think many bands coerce, cajole, or bribe their family, fans, etc. into coming.
> * If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
Yeah, to some extent. There's also the ageing of the population to blame, I think.
> * To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
>
Interestingly, I haven't been able to attribute any specific change in the live music scene
to economic conditions...alcohol still sells!
> Please reply via email. I will summarize.
>
> Greg Skinner
> [email protected]
Jay Kadis
[email protected]
From: [email protected] (Craig F. Ochikubo 103639 x47870 R10/2342d)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
I play in some outside and avant garde type groups here in Los Angeles
(I noticed this is a UCLA address). For the size of LA, there is really
a very small number of events, although the scene is sustaining. Not,
on its own, people who play improvised music (jazz, outside, etc.,) seem
to make a living doing something else, and play more creatively on their
own. The folks I can think of are Vinny Golia, Michael Vlatkovich, Nels
Cline, Alex Cline, Fowler Bros., are some of the names of people with
groups that are regular groups.
Some of the venues that support this sort of thing are: LA Harbor College
in San Pedro, the Aligator Lounge in Santa Monica, LA County Museum of Art,
hmmmm ... that about it, for places that support this sort of music on
a regular basis.
Craig Ochikubo
[email protected]
From: [email protected] (Mike Porter)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
No, not at all.
>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
Yes, to a great extent, because of economic considerations. Also, though,
live music is generally played in bars, and they are under fire. Police hassle
people leaving bars, whether they show intoxication effects or not; the "witch-
hunt" that people like MADD have propogated lends weight to this. Plus, the
federal government has blackmailed (literally!) all states to raise the drinking
age to 21 from 18, which cuts out a huge percentage of the college crowd. The
entertainment scene in general is changing; I'm not sure live music is going to
have any sizeable place in it...
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
Sorry - I sort of answered this before, but "yes". That's WHY things like
DJs, karaoke, etc. have become more popular.
---Michael...
From: [email protected] (Dennis Ciul)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
GU>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
Yes, live music is doing well here in Toronto, Ontario.
GU>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
GU> supporters of live music?
Yes. Some stuff makes money or at least pulls patrons for bar, club
& concert promoters; some stuff needs (and gets, at least so far)
govt & private support, but there's LOTS of live music here, and
good, knowledgable audiences.
GU>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
GU> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
Not so I could notice it. Last wedding I was at had live music
(a string quartet). I know of a bookstore opening that had a
harpsichordist.
GU>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
GU> your hometown?
Some of the "serious" (def "music that needs to be subsidized")
outfits are having to cut back concert schedules. Mainstream
"classical" ones are tending program more conservative,
"crowd-pleasing" pieces (please, no more Puccini!, not Swan Lake
*again*! stop, stop, it's another Beethoven's symphony).
The "new music" outfits are not able to commission as much new
stuff, so we are hearing "old" new music (some as much as 10 yrs
old!), but I don't mind, as much of this stuff has never been
recorded, and I am happy for the chance to hear it a second time. I
really can't tell about the
GU>Please reply via email. I will summarize.
If you want to see more of the sort of things going on here, I
can send you copies of "NOW" and "eye", our weekly entertainment
magazines. E-mail snail-mail address to me if interested. I
recommend it, I can't begin to give you an idea of all the live
music going down here in one little note.
Regards,
Dawn Lyons Toronto, Ontario
From: [email protected] (Loyd Blankenship)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
In article <[email protected]> you wrote:
: I have a few short questions for those of you who are involved in
: your local live performance scene:
: * Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
Well, I'm from Austin. Hell yeah. :-)
: * If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
: supporters of live music?
The Austin Chamber of Commerce actually sells "Live Music Capital of the World"
bumper stickers. Most people around here to see live music on a semi-regular
basis. More would go if stuff started earlier.
: * To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
: your hometown?
Going to see local bands is still cheaper than a movie/dinner date. I don't
think economics hit too hard. Besides, after the oil bust of the 80s, current
economic problems seem like a whimper to Texans. :-)
From: Michael Deninger <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
No.
>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
Yes. Dance clubs are everywhere.
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
Maybe a little for classic rock type bands that play the one or two bars
that have bands and a blue-collar clientele.
I live in a college town. So if the band isn't some greasy-haired
alternative band, only older people give a damn about them.
Muff Armpit Studios VII
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
From: [email protected] (James Hale)
In general, Ottawa is a pretty active music scene for a city of
only about 400,000 (900,000 metropolitan, but that covers a
wide area, including many rural regions). For jazz and blues
specifically, it tends to go in bursts. We have an annual
10-day jazz festival that is a bonanza for music, and a national
cultural festival that brings in performers from Africa and
Europe as well as Canada. The National Library also has an
ongoing jazz series that concentrates on Canadian performers
like Renee Rosnes and John Stetch (both of whom live in NYC).
The club scene hasn't been very active for several years, but
a new club, Woody's, has just started a very active jazz
series that is bringing in musicians from across Canada.
There are also occasional concerts featuring the likes of
Bill Frisell or Wynton Marsalis. Being the federal seat of
government helps a lot, since there is a lot of grant money
for shows of a "cultural" nature, and fortunately the
government tends to view jazz in this light. All this is
very good for me, since I'm the jazz columnist for the
local daily newspaper. Hope this helps.
From: [email protected]
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
- Live music is surviving but not thriving
- Bar band type music as well as the odd art music performance is
the norm. Very little original stuff is supported. People want to hear what
they already know.
- Even if the economy was better, this norm would be same.
From: [email protected] (Michael R. Kesti)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
My home, the Nevada City/Grass Valley area of Northern California's
Nevada County (about 50 miles north of Sacramento) has a VERY active
live music scene.
>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
In many respects, yes, but the community is very oriented towards
art of all kinds, which is a big factor.
>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
DJ's get no club work here, they get only the private party/wedding
reception business. Karaoke has some presence, but has not really
caught on (thank Bog!). MTV is, beside being a wasteland, not really
a factor in the live music scene.
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
Not greatly. The scene is just as active now as it was, say 10 years
ago when the economy was a bit better. I attribute this primarily to
the community's art orientation, largely.
From: [email protected] (Magnus Enorson)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
Not by means of actual public gigs, but there's a vast number of bands
practicing like crazy, although not many that are very good.
>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
First and foremost by DJ's which is a shame because if they didn't rule the
scene the bands around would be a lot better.
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
Totally, because who would book a live band when they know nobody will
show up and pay for watching it.
Magnus Enorson
[email protected]
University/College of trollhattan
SWEDEN
From: [email protected] (Arthur Kenyon)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Live music is almost dead in my hometown (Lowell, MA, pop. ~100K). 10 years
ago Lowell had at least a dozen bars that supported live entertainment, and
there were at least a dozen more in its suburbs. Most of these places had
live entertainment Thursday-Saturday and often on Sunday night as well (open
mike, etc.) Today, I'd estimate there are about 6 in the entire area, and many
of these places only book bands on one weekend night (and have Karaoke and DJs
on the other nights).
As I see it the following are the causes (in the order of influence):
1. Exponential increase in the enforcement of and penalties for DWI offences.
I'll not debate the relative merits of the issue, but this is the major
factor (IMO, based on talking to people who used to go out regularly, and
now are pretty much too scared to go out and have a few beers at a bar.)
These laws took the casual fans (the ones who would go out a few times a
month to see bands) out of the loop. While these people didn't go out a
lot, there were a lot of them, so they added up to a lot of patrons over
the month.
2. MA raised the drinking age from 18 to 21. This coupled with #1 probably
eliminated at least 75% of the "bar crowd" in the places I used to play.
Lowell is a "college town" and the live music scene used to be packed with
college-age kids (the college even had concerts a few times a month). Once
this audience was legislated out of existence, I think half the bars in
town either closed or stopped booking live entertainment.
This audience is the flip side to those in #1. The number of people is
much smaller here, however, these people go out every week (often on
both Friday and Saturday (and the (rich) die-hards go out Thursday and
Sunday as well.))
3. The basically bad economy. Despite the common belief that this is a major
factor, I think it rates far below #s 1 and 2. We had recessions in the
early 80's and the clubs were doing just fine. Clubs only started to fail
on a large scale when Dukakis declared war on drunk driving (enacting,
among other things, the legislation that resulted in #'s 1 and 2).
I'm no scientist; these are just observations made since I was 18 (I'm 32
now) while playing and watching the bar scene for the past 14 years.
Arte Kenyon
From: [email protected] (Paul Young)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
|> * Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
Well - I live in the Chicago area, and the answer has to be YES.
|> * If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
|> supporters of live music?
It is clearly a big part of the lifestyle around here - going to see
local bands any day of the week for $1 to $8 cover charge.
|> * If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
|> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
It seems that the DJ thing is moving in on the wedding/party market, although
most wedding bands I know are busy every weekend throughout the year.
Karaoke is present, but not very widespread.
The original music market is very big. There is also a big market here
for "tribute" bands - Rush, Zeppelin, Genesis, the Dead, etc. There's even
an REO tribute band here!
|> * To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
|> your hometown?
It doesn't. It is seasonal in that the summer has a LOT more opportunities
to play, but there is never a lack of an audience or of places to play.
Cheers!
From: [email protected]
Message-Id: <93Nov22.095319pst.14544(1)@alpha.xerox.com>
Ok, I'll bite.
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
No, it's in its worse state in years.
>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
Perhaps, but I believe it has more to do with apathy than anything. I think
more people are staying home for many reasons including, apathy (it's easy to
sit in front of the tube), money (it's expensive to go out), fear (it's
dangerous to go out), and ignorance (if they haven't heard of the band, they
don't want to make an effort to find out if they are any good.)
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
Significantly. It's expensive to go out these days, and money is tight all
over. I know it's affected me. I don't go out nearly as much as I used to.
Just my opinion....
~Pat
From: [email protected] (Georg Feil)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
(Toronto, Canada) Yes.
>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
Yes, but more support would be nice. Canada has a fairly small overall music
market so more vigorous individual support is important.
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
This one is hard because the Canadian "recession" has been going on so long,
I forget what it used to be like. There are probably fewer people at the clubs,
and certainly less money to be made by bands (usually just a fraction of the
door, you're lucky to walk home with $20 each after splitting the take).
Georg.
From: [email protected] (Peter Nuwayser)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
In article <[email protected]> you write:
>I have a few short questions for those of you who are involved in
>your local live performance scene:
>
>* Do you feel live music is thriving in your hometown?
YES. I live in Boston. There are zillions of bands here. However, there
is definitely a movement happening here... eurohaus is very slowly taking
time and people away from local live shows.
>* If so, is it because the citizens of your hometown are active
> supporters of live music?
I would say yes... there is a huge student population here that is mostly
in support of mainstream and alternative rock, rap/hiphop, and blues.
The natives tend more toward mainstream AOR and blues and hiphop (in that
order).
>* If not, is it because live music is being replaced by other
> forms of entertainment (DJs, karaoke, MTV, etc)?
If you live in Boston you have a ton of choices... live music (rock, house,
classical, jazz, funk, folk, country... I think there are even a couple of
zydeco bands) and dance clubs... and many places also feature karaoke (it
stuck here in a big way).
>* To what extent have economic conditions affected live music in
> your hometown?
Simple. There is a surplus of bands here and only so many places to play...
therefore club operators have their pick of who plays and who doesn't, and
they can cram six bands into one evening, make every band pay the house
sound guy, charge only $5 for admission (mostly students here...),
and get away with compensating the bands with beer. In a nutshell, it
generally doesn't pay to be a musician around here unless you plan on
leaving and you have a solid plan to do so.
Thanks for asking!
From: [email protected]
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
I live in Seattle. Live music is thriving due to the 'grunge boom' that
continues to evolve and inspire a lot of musicans around here (and,
apparently, from other places as well).
Unfortunately for me, I don't play grunge/alternative rock. So the kind of
musical snobbery that goes along with the climate that's currently active
in this town doesn't leave room for folks (like me) who want to play
more funk-oriented popular songs (our band doesn't even have a GUITAR).
There is a hint, however, that things may be evening out. Not so much
because the alternative scene is dying out but because bands like ours are
carving out a niche for people to come out and see something that has a
backbeat (these folks have been staying at home for the last couple
of years).
With a bit of luck, I'll know a lot more in a couple of months when I
expect that we'll be working a lot more. Get back to me then if you're
still interested.
| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 2870.1 | Sucks | GOES11::HOUSE | You sick little monkey! | Mon Jan 03 1994 12:55 | 6 |
| I followed up that posting with some observations about the Colorado
Springs music scene. To put it in a nutshell, if you're not playing
moldy old covers, preferably in a reduced format (solo or duo), this
place is dead.
Greg
|
| 2870.2 | | TECRUS::ROST | If you don't C#, you might Bb | Mon Jan 03 1994 14:01 | 10 |
| Re: .1
Greg,
Sounds like you need to move to Denver 8^)
Seriously, the weirdest thing is how many people said their local scene
was happening. Bozeman, MT?????!!!!!
Brian
|
| 2870.3 | | KDX200::COOPER | There's a moon in the sky! | Mon Jan 03 1994 14:50 | 15 |
| Greg and I have never agreed on this, but I'll say it anyway. :-)
Being a native of Mass, I'd say the scene here is better than Boston
with the exception of the all_original_scene. There is boat loads of
dough to be made doing country, classis/blues, metal etc...
It's also easier to get a gig, because the ratio of musicians/club
is greater here than in Boston. Ergo, maybe there are 400 guitarists
per live-club in Boston, where there is maybe 40 players/live-club
here.
Also, Denver is right up the street, and Pueblo is just south, and that
town rocks! Two large clubs in Pueblo, and it a small town!!
jc
|
| 2870.4 | | GOES11::HOUSE | You sick little monkey! | Mon Jan 03 1994 15:06 | 23 |
| > Sounds like you need to move to Denver 8^)
Yeah, from what I've been reading (local rags), the Denver scene sounds
like it's really hopping.
Jeff and I still disagree, I don't consider one or two clubs per
musical genre (with maybe one club in town that'll hire anything
original) to be "happening". The only market that I've seen offering
anything much is the old "we all play the same set list" classic (barf)
rock thing. In perusing the entertainment section of the paper, it
would seem that there's not even much market for country, in live
music. There's *one* club where you can play metal, and they're real
picky about things like...how big your hair is, and how pretty you are.
Boatloads of money? I haven't seen it, and I personally couldn't care
less whether I get paid or not.
Besides, what interests me (as a listener) is original music. Gee, now
that it's 1994, I have a choice of a big *one* club here in Colorado
Springs where I can see an original band...and I have to suffer through
watching them with a bunch of teenie boppers because it's all-ages.
Greg
|
| 2870.5 | food for thought | FRETZ::HEISER | no, I'm very, very shy | Tue Jan 04 1994 10:41 | 5 |
| > Being a native of Mass, I'd say the scene here is better than Boston
Well since the major music magazine editors consistently rate Boston,
New York, San Francisco, and L.A. as their top 4, I find it hard to
believe that Colorado Springs could compare.
|
| 2870.6 | | KDX200::COOPER | There's a moon in the sky! | Wed Jan 05 1994 12:08 | 6 |
| For the average *listener* perhaps, Mike, but I'd easily compare
Colo. Spgs for a musician wanting to gig... Folks in LA have to
buy tickets to their own shows in advance, and sell them for a profit
to even get PAID!
jc
|
| 2870.7 | | CSC32::B_KNOX | Rock'n'Roll Refugee | Wed Jan 05 1994 15:28 | 15 |
| Yo Jeff,
I gotta agree with Greg.... The Springs sucks!!!
The Union Station is no longer booking bands, The Rack is going the
same way soon, The Cavalcade is no longer booking bands (Pueblo),
The Chief doesn't hire many local acts and the Gardens only books
young hair-bands from outta-town (Scott actually told us that we were
the best band he's had in there in ages but we weren't young hair-heads
so he couldn't pay us more... I can't print our reply to that statement!!)
When I lived in the Boston area, I played 50 weeks a year without
really trying hard... out here I'm very lucky if I work twice a month)
/Billy_K
|
| 2870.8 | | GOES11::HOUSE | Often imitated, but never duplicated | Wed Jan 05 1994 16:42 | 10 |
| Yo Billy, you got it... Here's a few more places that used to have
bands the won't anymore. Both the Clubhouse and the Deluxe had
announced that they wouldn't have bands (at least on the weekends)
after Jan1. Thunder & Buttons burned down last year and got rebuilt as
something other then a club. The only "new" club that I'm aware of is
Pure Energy, and it's all ages and caters to the really young crowd.
You won't make much money there 'cause they seem to want to book
several bands a night.
Greg
|
| 2870.9 | "D.J's was a cool club in it's prime" | COMET::LAURICH | | Fri Jan 07 1994 00:41 | 14 |
|
Yea, I agree this town sucks for the live thing. If you
want the money you have to go to Denver. That does'nt matter to
moi cause I like that thrash stuff, and Pure Energy books a lot of
it. It is a drag when the place is full of kids though, because that
is usually when the band I want to see is playing. :^(
But at least I can look forward to
White Zombie in Febuary;^)
Jeffy
|
| 2870.10 | Fatso Fogerty's (West) | CSC32::B_KNOX | Rock'n'Roll Refugee | Mon Jan 10 1994 10:05 | 8 |
|
Fatso Fogerty's (West) just opened up recently (the old "Institute")
and they are doing live rock bands. We just played there on New Year's
Eve and it turned out much better than I expected (seeing as they
advertised us on a "dance hits" radio station). It seems like they
might be able to make a go of it, but who knows in this town...
/Billy_K
|
| 2870.11 | | GOES11::HOUSE | Often imitated, but never duplicated | Mon Jan 10 1994 10:16 | 11 |
| I had a guy tell me last week that there are some investors in this
town that deliberately open and close clubs to prey off the initial
interest people have in a "new club". They'll fire up a new club,
which will draw a lot of people for a few months, then when the draw
starts dropping, they shut it down and move on. This guy claimed that
they could earn between a million and 3 million dollars in a year this
way. But we're talking about the bigger places, and probably more
dance oriented then band oriented (but we had been talking about the
clubs that host bands...).
Greg
|
| 2870.12 | had my second cup, thanks | EZ2GET::STEWART | always took candy from strangers | Mon Jan 10 1994 11:04 | 18 |
|
So what, even established clubs go through lots of format changes.
This seems to be primarily true of the clubs targeted at the 18->25
demographic, but it's like any business, you gotta do something new to
get people's attention.
Club start-up costs aren't that high in the first place, so if they can
load the place up for awhile and then sell it while the numbers are
good they're just doing smart business. A club make-over costs even
less, 'cause the licenses, hardware, and staff are already in place.
I don't think the novelty factor helps with live venues, though --
people will only take so much risk with their entertainment dollars --
they'll try a new club if the attraction is one they're familiar with,
or they'll try a new band in a familiar venue, but it's harder to get
them into a new joint for a band they've never heard of.
|
| 2870.13 | | GOES11::HOUSE | Often imitated, but never duplicated | Mon Jan 10 1994 11:47 | 7 |
| I didn't say there was necessarily anything wrong with doing that. But
it does tend to explain the flux of clubs in this area, and why a group
of clubs will open and close under different names and formats
ceaselessly. There's one club that I *swear* has had at least 6-7
different names since I moved here 6 years ago.
Greg
|
| 2870.14 | | CSC32::B_KNOX | Rock'n'Roll Refugee | Mon Jan 10 1994 12:07 | 9 |
|
I think that the crackdown on drunk driving has had a serious impact
on the club scene. Folks are so paranoid about being caught by the
local constabulary that they opt for staying away from the clubs.
I've played in plenty of clubs here in the Springs where the cops
sit right across the street and prey on folks as they leave.
/Billy_K
|
| 2870.15 | | NEEPS::IRVINE | Sobriety has it's own drawbacks! | Tue Jan 11 1994 05:16 | 13 |
| I can't really agree with -1....
If your gonna drink & drive you deserve to be caught! This has not had
an adverse effect on Clubs / Pubs in the UK. Most towns / cities have
reasonable public transport into the early hours... but if not, the
town is usually small enough to take a cab without it costing the
earth!
Why a perfectly effective method of policing social/criminal behaviour
should stop people going to club makes no sense!
Bonzo
|
| 2870.16 | | TECRUS::ROST | If you don't C#, you might Bb | Tue Jan 11 1994 06:09 | 17 |
| Re: .15
You hit the nail on the head. The US is so auto-obsessed that in many
areas, you *can't* get any form of public transportation to get to and
from the bars, especially in the suburbs. In Boston, trains stop at
12, clubs close at 1 or 2!
Most states lowered the drinking age to 18 around 1972, but since then
it's been hiked up again almost everywhere to 21. Stupid thinking
there, since you get to vote *and* get drafted...go die for your
country but don't drink??? Anyway, this screwed up clubs catering to
college students because 3/4 of them are now excluded. At my alma
mater, they closed down the on-campus pub because it was "unfair" that
only some students could go. So there was one live-music venue gone in
an instant.
Brian
|
| 2870.17 | | CSC32::B_KNOX | Rock'n'Roll Refugee | Thu Jan 13 1994 10:49 | 12 |
|
Club-hopping via public transit in Colorado Springs????
Now that I've finished my fit of hysterical laughter...
I know it's different in London, Boston or New York, but out
here in the cultural wastelands, one needs to drive to get
to any club. The local constabulary are very serious about
drinking and driving. These two factors have been the death of
the club scene here in the Springs.
|