Conference napalm::guitar

>     A5 MULTI-FX : comp, exciter, 3 band eq, chorus/flanger, reverb/delay.
    
    This is the only one that I wanted to try and the store closest to my
    house only has the other 2 in stock.  
    
    Supposedly, they are a takeoff design from the successful A2 and A3
    processors.
    
    They have 25 factory presets and 5 user-definable presets.
    
    They LIST for $350.  You could probably get them relatively cheaper.
    
    Mike

    I tried an A2 once and if the A5 sounds like that it's real cool!
    
    dbii

    These floor units make MUCH more sense to me then the rack units
    (what db saying "don't buy rack"!!!).
    
    If you're anal retentive about complexity (and I am), the bottom line
    is that with rack units you got more individual pieces to worry about
    and more cables to deal with in setup and break down.
    
    I'm sorta waiting for some of these killer rack units (particularly
    the ones with tubes) to get packaged into a single-unit floor box.

    I know these aren't the same things (I think) but I just bought some
    used KORG PME analog pedal effects things that are a lot like the
    Boss multi-effects pedal, except that the effects are actually like
    modules or cartridges that plug into the board. I thought that was
    pretty cool, since one board can hold four effects modules and I
    have nine of the suckers to choose from. Most of them sound ok.
    
    Here's the question: has anyone else ever heard of these? I never
    did before I bought 'em. How much do they usually go for new? and
    does anyone know where you can get more modules for them?
    
                                        just curious :^)
                                           trickey
    

    What I can't figure out is why they only put in a THREE band EQ. 
    That's pretty useless IMO.  I like the little 7-8 band stomps, and even
    a 5 band might be ok, but 3 just doesn't cut it.  This was one of my
    big complaints with the SGE.
    
    Greg

    I thought this unit sounded familiar in more ways than one.  I entered
    something on it in 93.34 last week.
    
    Mike

    re: .3
    
    I don;t know why a rack has to be more complex setting up. After the
    initial wiring/debug my rack has run flawlessly for over a year. To use
    it I have to hook up 1 power cord, one guitar cord, one midi cable and
    two speaker wires..not really that much for what I'm getting out of it,
    and it seems to be much much more reliable than a bunch of stomp boxes
    hooked together, which always seemed to fail on me after I stomped them
    a few times...
    
    FWIW
    
    dbii
    
    

    Dave, a rack is more complex because you need to have something
    in the rack, and something on the floor (sounds like you don't
    have a floor control unit to switch sounds while you're playing).
    
    If everything was on the floor you need only one unit.
    
    While it may not seem like that much of a big deal to run a few
    more cables from the floor unit to the rack, you have to understand
    that I play two instruments in my band and thus have to do twice
    as much setup/debug/breakdown/transport as most other people.
    
    Plus on top of that my band doesn't have roadies so we also have to
    setup the PA and such.
    
    I think a rack is a good idea if you have SEVERAL units that you can
    (or don't need to) control from a floor unit.  But most people just
    seem to have something like a GP-8 to do everything and for that
    I think something that is entirely contained on the floor is easier
    to deal with.
    
    I'm actually considering selling my GP-8 in favor of something like
    an ME-5.
    
    	db

    Know what I hate about stomps ??  I just remembered last night
    when I stomped my Marshall pedal...
    
    I HATE WHEN YOU STEP ON THEM AND THEY FLIP OVER, OR FLY ACROSS
    THE ROOM, OR YOUR FOOT SKIDS OFF THE SIDE OF THE PEDAL OR YOU UNPLUG 
    IT WHILE TRYING TO STOMP IT OR...
    
    Whew.
    
    Anyhow,  I kicked my Marshall switch under the baseboard heat register
    trying to step on it for a lead last night at rehearsal.  Pi$$es me
    off when  that happens...  And it just DOESN'T happen with a 15 pound
    MIDI controller.
    
    jc (hope this helps)   ;)

re: Coop and stomps:

Just be glad it wasn't a rake

(Insert picture from Three Stooges with somebody stepping, er, stomping, on a 
rake and getting hit in the face)


:') x 1000

Will

    Re: coop & stomps
    
    That's why they make pedal cases ;-)

    Dave I am using a midi pedal, I still think 1 cable from the pedal to
    the rack is better than 1 cable for each effects unit, all of which see
    stress each time you setup vs. the few cables I hook to the rack to get
    running...to each his own I guess...personally I hate bending over to
    get at the knobs too...not to mention the "flying stomp box symdrome"
    that got mentioned here...
    
    dbii

>    Dave I am using a midi pedal, I still think 1 cable from the pedal to
>    the rack is better than 1 cable for each effects unit, all of which see
>    stress each time you setup vs. the few cables I hook to the rack to get
>    running...
    
    Ah, I see the source of confusion.
    
    Dave, these units are multi-effects units that sit on the floor.
    (Observe the title of this note).
    
    Thus, you don't need to run cables between units - there is only
    one unit.
    
    The idea is that you have something like a GP-8 except that the 
    actually signal processing is done entirely in the pedal board
    instead in a remote unit which sits in a rack.

    It sounds to me like what everyone wants is a wireless, thirty-pound
    effects pedal board that switches by telepathy!
    
    I'd buy one! :^)
    
                                       trickey
    
    On second thought, how 'bout it's only 1 pound but bolted to the floor!
    ;^)
    

    I received the new AMS catalog today.  They have all 3 flavors of the
    A5 for $279.
    
    Mike

      
    
      I think there's a little oversight here on one of the complexity
    concerns regarding the difference between stompers and racks and
    "progammable self-contained floor units such as the A-5". 
      If you're using the effects loop on an amp (or preamp) then you
    have to run one cable out to your floor box and one back on top of the
    AC power cable. SORRY! I like plugging my axe into a rack, the speaker
    into the rack, the remote foot controller into the rack, and have ONE
    AC power cord, then I'm ready to rock. Besides I don't think stomping
    on a self contained unit helps it's durability as all. 
      I've seen the new Korg units. I haven't plugged into them, but even
    though they seem cheaply built, they aren't expensive either! 
    
    							_B()()M_

    re: .16
    
    I think you will find that most of these "guitar" effects units will
    advise AGAINST running in the effects loop.  My GP-8 manual certainly
    does.
    
    The "guitar" units have "instrument level" (impedence) inputs and outputs.
    
    They are made to take the input directly from the guitar.
    
    If you use it thru the effects loop, to get the best performance
    you must do one of the following:
    
    	o Get a unit that takes "line level" inputs (Quadraverb,...)
    
    	o Do a (commonly done) modification on the amp
    
    It will "work" in the effects loop, but you'll have an impedence
    mismatch which will probably translate to more noise and a certain
    amount of distortion.   You also can't guarantee that it won't damage
    the box although that is, according to my limited understanding,
    not particularly likely.

    I got a chance to road test an A-5 today. This was the "guitar" model
    with the distortion/overdrive, rather than the exciter. But i think in
    other respects it is probably the same as the multi-effects model.
    
    First, let me say that these guys must have their ears open. The user
    interface on this is almost exactly what I would want, and what I think
    a lot of people would like based on comments I've heard. Unlike typical
    rackmount multi-effects units, and unlike other cheaper "multi-stomp
    box" units (or actually using multiple stomp boxes), this thing can be
    used either as a pre-programmed device, or by selecting effects in
    real-time.
    
    Basically, there are six pedals, one of which selects between "manual"
    and "program" mode. In manual mode the other five pedals turn on/off
    one effect each. In program mode the other five pedals select a program
    each. In addition, there are five knobs just above the pedals, and a
    switch for selecting which of the effects the knobs affect. Turning the
    knobs when an effect is selected with this switch affects the
    parameters of that effect. It can be a little confusing since you may
    have one effect turned on, and be changing the parameters of another
    effect, but I think I could get used to this real easily. You can
    change the effects parameters in either manual or program mode.
    
    In other words, you can use this as if it were five stomp boxes in one
    box, or you can use it as a pre-programmed multi-effects device. And
    you can switch instantly between these modes. So, for example, you
    could have a bunch of pre-programmed lead sounds, and play rhythm in
    the manual mode. When you get to a lead part you can either kick in one
    of the programmed patches, or manually turn on whatever combination of
    effects you feel like.
    
    As far as programming goes, there are limitations. There are 25 factory
    presets, and only 5 user programmable patches. But frankly, most people
    seem to agree that it's not worth having a whole lot of prgrammable
    patches anyway, because you can't remember them all. The biggest
    limitation I can see in the way this is set up is that the 30 total
    patches are in 6 banks, which are selected by the same switch that you
    use to select which effect to edit. In other words, In any given song
    you're really limited to manual mode plus the five patches in one bank,
    unless you want to bend over in the middle and switch program banks.
    
    As far as the effects go, here's a rundown. I wasn't impressed with the
    compressor, but it was hard to tell for sure unless I was using my own
    equipment. The distortion was fair, I'd say typical solid-state.
    Overdrive likewise, certainly no tube sound miracles. The eq is pretty
    good, three bands with parametric on the mid-range. The chorus seemed
    pretty nice (there are stereo outputs, also). It does flange, delay and
    slapback as well. I don't use these, so I can't comment. There are a
    number of reverb and echo sounds, which seem adequate, but I like my
    springs better.
    
    There are seperate level controls for each effect, as well as input and
    output levels and a bypass switch. As I said, there are stereo outputs,
    as well as a headphone jack. As input for a volume switch. Oh yes,
    there are also programmable master volume and noise reduction levels.
    Power by wall bug, no batteries. The switches seemed very solid and
    durable, overall quality seemed very high.
    
    Basically, I was very impressed with this unit, which seems like a lot
    for the money. It's the easiest multi-effects unit to program I've ever
    seen, and seems like about the most flexible I could imagine. Hopefully
    this will set an example for other vendors, and we'll see more stuff
    along these lines. I may get one, but I want to go back and check out
    the preset patches more to see if they are useful.
    
    - Ram
    the

    I was reading about this unit in several guitar magazines and the 
    general conclusion was that it was rated very highly.
    
    re-1
    I know that there is 2 versions for the guitar,one has dist/over and
    the other has not but,it has another pedal in its place(can't remember
    what).This seemed like a good idea to me as most people who play guitar
    have distortion in some way or another.I use the distortion/gain from
    my Marshall 5425 and I'm quite happy with that.
    

    The A5 Multieffect is the one you need if your amp has decent
    distortion/overdrive.  On the 5 pedals you get chorus/flanger, 
    delay/reverb, compression, exciter, and 3-band EQ.  
    
    Mike

    A couple of other  points on the A5 series:
    
    1.  Adapter is 18 VAC.  Not easy to replace if it gets trashed.  And
    with the small cord....this is one of the weakest points of this type of
    box.  I'd pay $50 to get the supply built in.
    
    2.  The volume pedal input can be used with any passive type volume
    pedal and just a cord from the pedal out.  Nice feature.
    
    3.  There's a gain trim you can tweak with an LED overload indicator to
    maximize S/N ratio.  Good idea.
    
    4.  I'd also pay $50 to have this built of metal.  I don't like
    stepping on plastic.  Especially $350 pieces of plastic.
    
    5.  I hate presets.  I hated them on synthesizers, and I hate them on
    FX units.  Especially one that's little more than a collection of
    stompers with *knobs* on it for pete's sake.  They don't even have the
    excuse of a difficult programming interface.  It suggests they figure
    the typical user does not understand how to set up simple effects!!!!
    And since all the presets are in banks separate from the user patches
    *plus* the bank switching is *not* a footswitch (who thought of this
    idea?) it makes using the presets *and* the user bank together
    inconvenient.
    
    So close, yet so far...they could have had an *incredible* $450 unit
    instead of a good $350 unit.  
    
    						Brian

    I'm thinking about getting either the A5 for bass, or a used Yamaha
    SPX90 (roughly the same price range).
    
    Is the A5 operable at line level?  I'd like to run whatever I get
    through the effects loop of my preamp.
    
    Peter

	> I'm thinking about getting either the A5 for bass ...

	I've heard that the A5 is all plastic and pretty fragile.

	/ravi

    
    
      Hey - Maybe Korg read Brian Rost's reply in .21!
    
        I glanced over the new A4 guitar processor quickly awhile
      back. Well first off, it's plastic (just like the A5) and 
      uses the dreaded wall wart power supple. So why would I want
      to even consider one of these for my compact practice/backup rig?
        I was really considering using my KH patch bayettes to switch stomp
      effects in and out. I already have a BOSS CH-1 chorus, so I'd need a
      Digital Delay and Compressor and maybe a few cheapie extra pedals.
      then add an AC power supply so I don't go broke buying 9 volt
      batteries, not to mention spare patch cords. All of a sudden it's not
      that cheap anymore!
        Re-enter the Korg A4. For around $400 you get all the effects the
      normal, and slightly abnormal, guitarist needs plus a built in chromatic
      tuner (yeah!!) and two external control outs (amp channel switching/
      reverb switching). Add to that some kind of speaker simulation and 
      headphone outs and MIDI in/outs. There's a LOT of bang for the buck
      here.
        From the sound of it these are 16 bit effects and there's a lot
      more distortion/overdrive variations available than on some similar
      units.
        Why I'm considering one:
    
        I can control my portable (two space) REXX 1602/601 rack ENTIRELY
      from the A4 and have all the effects I could possibly use plus a 
      tuner? That's a mighty powerful compact rig. To think I (almost) 
      considered a combination of the BOSS SE-50 multiprocessor and the 
      TU-50 tuner as a compact rig, but that's over $700 and doesn't
      include the switching! I'd have to use my KH patch bayette's again!
      The whole idea is not having to cart around the ACCESS rack around
      all the time! It's not light OR small!
    
    							_B{}{}M_

    
    			A4 - Guitar Multieffects
    
      I picked one of these up over lunch today. $400! There's a lot of
    bang for the buck. Not only is there digital delay/reverb/pitch shift
    but it's 21 bit!! And is does sound clean. There are seven
    distortion/overdrive types, three band EQ with the mids and highs
    parametric, compressor, and chorus. I was thoroughly impressed with
    the sound quality. 
      I brought my REXX 1602/601 along to see if the A4 external controls
    would switch channels w/o any problems and it worked flawlessly!
    The tuner is very easy to use. If you hit bypass the tuner
    automatically kicks in. If you hold the bypass down for about a second
    it mutes the output while you tune. The tuner displays the note in the 
    numeric LED display and there are arrow indicators similar to a Boss
    TU-12 for pitch.
      Now I just have to make up a tie-wrapped group of cables for the 
    external controls,power supply, and output to amp. I'll probably get
    rid of one of my patch bayettes since the Korg A4 and my ACCESS both
    have two programmable switches.
      Time to make some user presets!!!
    
    							-B{}{}M-

    How long is the digital delay in seconds?
    
    Is this a floor unit like the A5?

    
      The delay is something like 990 msec. I messed around with the unit
    last night using it into the Rexx and setting up the user programs for 
    channel changing. 
      This unit is actually based of the Korg A-3 effects unit. Even though
    it sits on the floor it is not a toy. In terms of bandwidth I can
    already tell that this thing smokes the old GSP-21! It's real easy to 
    program as well. Oh yeah - It has a headphone out jack and a speaker
    simulation parameter built in as well. 
      Hey Mike - I'll see how well the A-4 switches channels on my KH M1
    this week. I don't see why it shouldn't work. That's the really great
    thing about this unit. With the tuner and external control capabilities
    you can really make a fantastic sounding compact rig. The A-4 is about
    as wide as the A-5 but is somewhat deeper. There are five banks of 
    six factory patches as well as 5 X 6 of user patches (60 total). 
      
    							-B{}{}M-

	I just tried the new Korg A4 processor, and have been infected
	with the wellknown disease...

	I used a Fender Tele through the A4 to a VOX AC30 on one chan-
	nel and a Marshall vintage reissue combo on the other channel.

	I was impressed! It's hard to explain how this ju-hu box soun-
	ded, but it kind of inspired me...some of the patches sounded
	like typical Jimmy Page-sound to me.

	This weekend, I'll have a chance to bring it home for further
	testing (I keep saying to myself: 'You don't nedd this one,
	you REALLY don't need this one' ;-)...

	Poul

    Went to trade in my GSP-21 Legend over the weekend to get an effects
    processor that I wasn't pissed off at.  I wanted something simple that
    I didn't have to add much $$$ to the trade in, and that had the basic
    effects.  I really went in with my mind 80% set on the Boss ME-6
    because it had what I wanted and I've always had a very good time with
    any Boss product I've ever owned.
    
    I demoed the ME-6 for a while and decided it would do the job.  Then I
    tried the A4 because it was there and I vaguely remembered some
    positive statements about it in this file.
    
    Took about 2 minutes to decide on the A4.  The built-in tuner (with
    mute for stage tuning) is great, especially to keep my 12-string in
    check.  The other big plus is that all the parameters within an effect
    are accessible at once.  This is a BIG improvement in ease of
    programming over the Legend and the ME-6.
    
    Didn't hear alot of difference to my ear between the ME-6 and the A4...
    I think maybe I like the ME-6 compressor a bit more and the A4's chorus
    a bit more.  Don't care much that the pitch shifter is included in the
    A4... it'll be fun once in a while.
    
    Cost was $96 plus the GSP-21, which I thought wasn't too bad.  Now I'm
    happier.

    
     Good choice! I've got nothing but good things to say about my A4
    that's been my primary practice rig for quite some time. The tuner
    and programmable switch outs along with the decent quality of the
    effects were what did it for me. It's not the heaviest duty pedal
    around, but if you don't abuse it, it'll get the job done!
    
    							-B{}}M-