Conference napalm::guitar

        
    	Im told if tons of volume isnt required the 75w simul class
    	with evm speaker is the one to go for  for best tone  - is this
    	true???
<<<<<<<<You can get "volume" out of just about any amp that is of decent 
        quality. (Especially the Boogie you mentioned. 
	 However, lots of volume does not equal lots of "presence" 
        and it's the presence of your sound that (in my opinion) should be of 
        paramount importance to you.  Here's my simple rule - presence is 
        directly proportional to the amount of cubic feet of air that you move 
	with your speaker(s).  Turning up to eleven will not buy you anything 
        but volume.  It's that combination of volume and presence that makes 
	for a respectable sound.

        In a 3-piece environment would I be missing some 'fullness'
    	with only one 12inch speaker in the Mesa Boogie.
<<<<<<<<Fullness is another term for presence.  The "big"/"full" sound is 
        achieved by moving more air (not by cranking the volume).  But if 
	you're into quiet really low volume gigs, a single speaker amp should 
     	do you just fine.  And be advised that the Boogie amps with one 12" 
	speaker do a fine job of providing some presence/fullness, but not 
	enough for me - (personal opinion).  Other lesser quality amps don't 
	even come close to the strength of a Boogie with a 200/400 watt EV.
    
    	Finally, are they what they're cracked up to be (for the money)?
<<<<<<<<YES - absolutely, but I'm bias, cause I own a Mesa Bass 400 and the 
	lead guitarist in my band (he can be reached at HAVOC::DESROCHERS - 
	you should probably get his opinion too) has a Mesa guitar amp and 
	while I respect the sound he achieves, I am routinely trying to get 
	him to add another cab.  

<<<<<<<<<<Dan

	. No idea where they're sold in the U.K.  However, Mesa Boogie
		does sell direct retail.  I've been told that their
		dealers actually have to pay list price, and therefore
		they normally add a premium to the price for their profit.
    
	. The 75 watt Mark III simulclass is *the* boogie of choice.
		If you have a gig at Madison Square Garden, you might
		go for the Coliseum simulclass, but otherwise 75 watts
		is plenty enough to go deaf on.
    
	. Speaker is a matter of taste.  Personally I don't care for the
		tone of the EVM.  If it were me, I'd choose the 75 watt
		head, and run it through a 4x12 celestion loaded cab.
		There is less 'fullness' with a 1x12 configuration.

	. The wood cab isn't pine, its oiled hardwood. It's only cosmetic.

	. Lastly, IMO, they are *not* what they're cracked up to be.
		They are great sounding amps, and I've got friends who
		swear by them and wouldn't play through anything else.
		But even they admit that Boogies can be tempermental,
		and are not the most road-worthy amps.  I came very
		close to buying one, but in the end I simply could
		not justify the expenditure.  I remain happy with
		my trusty fender :-).  There are many amplifier
		options between peavey on the low end and boogie
		at the top.

	Good luck!

	Steve    

    Well, you have now perked my interest. I am on my 6th Boogie. I
    currently own two... 1) A colleseum simul-class (150w) and a Caliber
    .50 (which I use for practice and to occasionally slave the power
    amp section to run stereo).
    
    I *LOVE* these amps. I don't care to use anything else, and IMO
    they are worth every penny. 
    
    I run the 150w monster (it's 200w if you use all 6L6's) pretty loud,
    and I'll say this... As this amp gets louder, it continues to sound
    great, as opposed to say Fender Concerts (and others) I've played
    that as you turn them up they loose the sweetness and begin to sound
    just LOUD.
    
    I HAVE owned a 75w Simul-Class model (it burned in a fire at a Club
    I was playing at - I watched it burn) and it's a GREAT amp - and
    all most folks will ever need. The only difference between that
    and my colleseum is that the colleseum has just that much more of
    everything that makes a Boogie what it is.
    
    FYI - I believe in this product, and the company that stands behind
    it. They still custom-make and test every amp - and they are superior
    quality musical instruments. Try to deal with Fender if your Concert
    (or whatever) is making a funny noise.
    
    BTW - My .50 is for sale (this is not a formal 4-sale note), I'm
    keeping the Colleseum FOREVER... but am moving toward (very soon)
    making my gig setup the new Quad-Preamp/Stereo Simul-Class 400.
    
    Now, after all that - do you think I'm biased? 
    
    If you have *any* questions about these amps - feel free to drop
    me a note at CASPRO::PELLERIN
    
    -BAP

	I have a Mark III, 60 watt simulclass. I'm very happy with it
	and it is plenty loud. I don't think there is anything that
	has the snap and brightness of this Boogie, but that is subjective.
	It is my last guitar amplifier!

	Before I got it, I was very concerned about whether
	it would be loud enough. I was playing in an 8 piece band,
	that would sometimes get volume competative, if you know what I mean.
	But I never had a problem breaking thru.

	They didn't have a 100 watt unit in stock so I went with the 
	60. I have used the 100 watt rig, and it was outrageously loud
	if you wanted it that way. I was able to destroy lightbulb
	filaments by running the MKII 100 watt rig near 10 it in my 
	basement.

	To get "fullness" I drive a marshall 4x12 slant cab with my MKIII
	at 8 ohms. Fattens it up quite a bit, you are less likely to
	get speaker distortion at high volume, and it seems warmer
	to me. ( I have also used a Marshal 100watt head to drive the 
		4x12, and my little boogie blows it away)

	I just went to a seminar on sound reinforcement. They instructor
	from Peavy (Marty something) was very knowledgable, and
	he said something about the difference between 100 watt and
	200 watts is about 6db, if I recall correctly. Don't know if
	I have my db's right, but I do recall that the concept was that
	when you double the rated power, you get a very small increment
	in add capability to increase loudness. He demonstrated a
	5600 wattt PA setup, at pretty high volumes, in a 30x30 ft room,
	and I can still hear, so that might give credence to the theory.

	If you don't get enough out of the amp itself, the direct out
	or effects send can be sent directly to a PA.

	Price performance is another thing. I think they get way too much
	money for them, but I'm not planning on trading mine in either.

	Go for it.
	

    I agree with all the endorsements so far.
    
    They are outrageously expensive, but there's nothing else out there
    that sounds as good to me and I *want* that sound.  
    
    I think the most endearing features of the Boogie to me are:
    
    	o That "singing" lead sound 
    
    	o It has a very wide variety of great overdrive and crunch sounds
    	  although they are not all immediately accesible (the Quad amp
    	  sorta solves this problem.)
    
    	  Boogie overdrive sounds very "pure" to my ears.  Not as "edgy"
    	  as, say, a Marshall.   Of course, some people like that Marshall
    	  edge, but to me it sounds too buzzy and Marshalls compress
    	  far too much for my tastes.
    
    	o The Boogie is EXCEPTIONALLY responsive to the dynamics in
          playing.   There are things it does that just don't "happen"
          on any other amp.
    
          Even in an overdrive setting, you lay off the pick a little
    	  bit and you get an almost rhythm mode type of sound.
    
    	o Wide variety of very sonorous warm rhythm tones.  Lots of amps
          are good only at one thing (lead or rhythm, even PARTICULARLY
          sounds).   I think the Boogie is the most versatile, although
          as I've said, you can't get quickly from one sound to another
          always.
    
    	o I couldn't disagree more about Boogies being unreliable.  This
          is counter to all I've read and experienced.   In fact, the
    	  company started out by taking Fender amps and making
          modifications that made them more reliable.  ALL Boogies go
    	  through some pretty ridiculous tests (including taking a hammer
    	  and knocking on various parts of the chasis and power supply!!!).
    
    	  Part of the expense of Boogies is the special mounts for the
    	  tubes, chasis and power supply, and the industrial strength
    	  box which is suspended from the cabinet (rather than mounted).
    
    	  It's all this extra stuff to make it rugged that make them
    	  so damn heavy.
    
    My Boogie a 1980 Mark IIB (wood cabinet) btw.   
    
    	db

Geez!  With all of these hardcore boogie owners ganging up on me,
I feel like I've got to make a few additional points in my defense.

First, I don't mean to be bad-mouthing boogies. They are unquestionably
excellent amps.  The price, however, is absurd.  In an objective price/
performance analysis, I believe there are other amps that would come
out on top.

I can't help but think that boogie owners are to some extent afflicted
with the 'Mercedes Benz owner satisfaction' syndrome.  Once you've paid
$1500.00 for a 1x12 combo amp,  are you going to admit it if you later
feel that you could have been satisfied with an amp for $500-$1000 less?

Lastly, (and I'm sure I'm gonna get some flack about this) Boogie wasn't
around when rock & roll was being invented.  99 44/100% of the original,
influential sounds from the 50's and 60's which became known as rock&roll
were produced by Fenders and Marshalls.  There's no accounting for taste,
but I was *very* impressed by many of those early sounds.  The tri-mode
Mark III claims to be able to sound like a Fender or a Marshall or a
Boogie.  It certainly sounds like a boogie, but in the other modes it
only sounds like a boogie imitating a Fender or a Marshall.

Don't get me wrong - if money meant nothing to me, I'd own a Boogie.
But as I said in .2, my Fender keeps me (and more importantly, others
who listen to me) happy.

Ciao,
Steve

    The only gripe I have that's been said about boogies is "so responsive
    to dynamics"  The boogies I tried were so compressed in the distorted
    mode it wasn't funny.  Great sustain, but kinda noisy and compressed
    to hell!

	How much does a 75 watt simul-class boogie retail for?  What is
considered a "good" price?  What is considered mega-bucks (besides the
Pensilvania state lottery)?

	I know that I may be opening up a can of worms here, but is Daddy's
the only authorized Mesa-Boogie dealer around the northern Mass./southern NH
area?  What is the gereral consensus on Daddy's sales/service/prices, etc.?
(This time I'm asking opinions, Dave, not giving them, ha ha!)


				A potential Boogie owner (mortgagee?)
						Brad

    I agree with Buck, the Boogies I've tried seemed to compress the
    signal too much.  It's interesting that others have the opposite
    impression; obviously "responsiveness" means different things to
    different people.
    
    re distortion, I also find the Boogies buzzier than Marshalls,
    again a difference in perception.  I'm referring to the straight,
    no frills, Marshalls with EL34s, not channel switchers or mods.
    There's a sound that straight a Marshall gets, Eric Johnson calls
    it the "100 lb. violin tone" that I've yet to hear duplicated by
    a Boogie type amp; that, to me, is smooth distortion.

    Of course, I agree Boogies are great amps.  They just don't do
    everything imo.
    
    /rick

    I think boogies have a very distinctive sound and are great amps
    if you only use one sound ie: singing leads...they bite for playing
    clean or crunchy rhythm
    
    IMHO
    
    dbii

    
    I don't think Boogies are overpriced at all.
    
    I only know about the bass gear (that's all I've priced) but check
    this out:
    
    Boogie Bass 400 Head $1299 list
    Ampeg SVT head $1700 !!! list (at discount maybe $1100)
        
    Cabinets:
    
    Boogie 1 X 15 400 watt (EV) $379 (factory or dealer)
    GK 1 X 15 200 watt (EV) $420 at EUW
    EAW 1 X 15 200 watt $500 at Union
    Joe's 1 X 15 200 watt (JBL) $450 at EUW
    
    As far as the guitar stuff goes, how much cheaper is Marshall (which
    seems to get no grief as being overpriced)?
    
    What about raw speakers?  Mesa will sell EVMs including UPS postage for
    about %10-20 less than most MA EV dealers can do (also very cheap
    "vintage" Celestions).  One dealer showed me his cost sheet and he pays
    more for the speaker than Mesa sells it for! 
    
    Daddy's, like most Mesa dealers, sell at the same price as the factory.
    If you buy in Ma, you pay sales tax versus shipping from the factory.
    In NH, you save the shipping.  The selection is limited to what they
    move the most of, i.e. single 15 bass cabs, Road Ready bass cabs, etc.
    have to be ordered, you can get it faster by ordering it yourself. 
    
  

	Re...price

	The MKII simul-class, 75w goes for $1495, the last time I 
	looked. I've seen them considerably cheaper in the want
	advertiser.

	I've been told that you can't get a new one at anything less
	than about $100 under list, but I might have been hornswaggled.

	Buy the way, about a month ago.. Daddies in Salem had A MKII
	100 watt. It was real dirty, but I took it home for a week
	as a loaner, and it really screamed. The speaker might have been
	a bit worn. I think they were asking somewhere around $900-$1k.

	re...	Daddies repair

	About a year after I got mine, I decided to
	play bass thru it. I connected up a fender bassman 15", 
	disconnected the 12", and went at it. It got a real nice bass
	sound, but to get any volume I had to run it at 10. It did
	shake the windows, but I ate some tubes in the process.

	Anyway, I took it into Daddys for service. They gave me
	the MKII as a loaner, (After I tried out a Marshal and was
	disappointed). 

	Anyway, the service department really went out of their way
	to satisfy me. They had difficulty finding the problem, and
	kept it on the burn-in-bench for a couple days. I talked 
	them into replacing a few of the tubes, even though they checked 
	out okay under test. The noise problem was gone when I got it
	back, and has not surfaced since.

	We agreed that it was fixed on friday evening around 6:00.
	They missed the last truck for the weekend to take it to 
	the store, so the service manager personally drove it
	to the store himself, after he got off work, so that I
	could have it for the weekend. I though that that was
	a pretty nice thing to do.
	
	So, my experience is that the service was superb.

Rick

re: .6:
    
    "The price, however, is absurd." 
       
    >Definately your OPINION. In my book, it is ABSURD to pay less for
    an amp that I believe is not the best sounding amp for me. And BTW,
    a 60 watt boogie (which will eat Marshall 100 watt for lunch) is
    around the same price and you can talk with the guy WHO ACTUALLY
    BUILT YOUR AMP !!!! Try *THAT* at Marshall!!
    
 "Boogie wasn't around when...." Here comes your flak.
    
    > Randal Smith (the founder and owner of MB) was around in San
    Fransisco and playing then. He also was working in a repair shop
    BEEFING up those "special sounding" Fenders for people who complained
    that they simply didn't have enough Balls. 
    
    This note and its replies is all based on opinion. I happen to believe
    that Boogies are worth the money, and *I* can get nearly any sound
    I want out of mine (including a Marshall *crunch* sound). If you
    go into a store and try a used Boogie that has had its tubes replaced
    with Groove Tubes and has been beat to hell and is set up to sound
    lousy so you'll buy one of the stores "own line" of amps, don't
    run out and say "Boogies get a great lead tone but they bite at
    crunch tone or clean tone or are too compressed.
    
    If, on the other hand, you are willing to sit and learn how to operate
    a Boogie (they are different animals) and play it for a while and
    then decide it doesn't "float your boat" then fine, you're like
    me when it comes to say... Brussel Sprouts. I hate the evil things.
    
    I have walked up to a Marshall 50 watt and made it sound almost
    identical to my Boogie. (Steve - if you're out there back me up
    here). I think its a matter of getting "your" sound, and I always
    come pretty close (for me). And when I sound good I play better.
    
    -BAP
    

	Well we are chasin tail again......


	In the last three years I have owned a 68 Marshall,62 Fender twin
and now I'm using a Boogie preamp.

	The points I'd like to make are based on my own personal experiance:

	My 50 watt Plexie in a years time went through 2 set's of tubes and
had great tone,a week before the debut of the band I was playin with I blew a 
fuse. Now I pretty much babied this amp with checkups,weekly to insure it
was road worthy. Why the fuse blew I don't know....I ocassionally noticed
other mystical anomalies.... I also used a Fender Vibrolux(70's) with 1 12
and had a 4 12 cab with 2 12's for the Marshall and 2 for the fender and
A/B switched to either amp.
	From there I ended up with the vibrolux with 4 12's,but this was not
enough volume and back pains settle in occasionally with lugging the cab 
around. This amp was also maintained regularly....It had it's problems but
very minor. 
	I used a Seymour Duncan 60 watt convert for a month and didn't like
it. And saw the other guitar player in the band have a host of problems,for
the most part and found a Fender Twin used to use.
	The Fender Twin was a decent amp,however it was non-channel switching
and somewhat finicky...
	I liked my Marshall,Fenders and like my Mesa Boogie.

	My first point being is this if you intend to play in a "working" band
buy something that is roadworthy. New is always preferable not always 
economical.
	My second point is avoid hardware issues and problems as it is more
important you concentrate on the music.
	My third point is these are all good peices of equipment and they all
cost money and what's more important is to satisfy your ear. 
	My fourth point is unless you are playing for musician's the general
public couldn't tell you the difference between a Marshall,Fender or a Boogie

	I'm very picky about my equipment,sound and reliability. I've heard
stories and personal experiance on most of the amp's people have talked about.
	
	Comment's on Daddy's in Nashua follows:
Sales:

	If you know what you want and they have it they are better than a
lot of other store's I've been in. I can site specifics if you want I have 
had nothing but good experiance's with them. I drive out of my way to shop 
there as there prices are better and they're trade in policy is fair. They 
are knowledgable to a certain degree...They are corteous and will have my 
buisness until this situation changes. 

Service:

	I've have not had any need for there repair service.....


	I've always like Mesa stuff since I saw and used it in 1974,It's
good reliable equipment,but so can Marshall,Fender etc. 
    

>    The boogies I tried were so compressed in the distorted
>    mode it wasn't funny.  Great sustain, but kinda noisy and compressed
    
    This description raises some flags.  You have exactly described what
    happens when your power tubes finally go.
    
    But if you've heard this on SEVERAL Boogies....
    
    	db

>The price, however, is absurd.  In an objective price/
>performance analysis, I believe there are other amps that would come
>out on top.
    
    I agree.  This is absolutely true.
    
    However the price/performance argument is but one consideration
    in a sea of considerations.  If it were regarded as the only
    consideration, everyone would be driving Hyundai's and Porsche
    would be out of business.
    
    It's a question of "where you compromise".  I have to compromise
    and drive a Subaru instead of a Ferari because I don't have
    $60,000 to spend on a car.  If I did, I darn well might be driving
    a Ferari.
    
    Most of us can afford a Boogie even if we have other ways we'd like
    to spend the money.   So while Boogies may be outrageously expensive,
    we want that sound and we can afford it.
    
>Lastly, (and I'm sure I'm gonna get some flack about this) Boogie wasn't
>around when rock & roll was being invented.  99 44/100% of the original,
>influential sounds from the 50's and 60's which became known as rock&roll
>were produced by Fenders and Marshalls.  
    
    You darn right your gonna get flack: Boogie *WAS* around when
    much of the classic amp sounds you mentioned were becoming famous.
    Randall Smith was the guy hot-rodding those classic amps to get
    those sounds.
    
>I can't help but think that boogie owners are to some extent afflicted
>with the 'Mercedes Benz owner satisfaction' syndrome.  Once you've paid
>$1500.00 for a 1x12 combo amp,  are you going to admit it if you later
>feel that you could have been satisfied with an amp for $500-$1000 less?
    
    This phenomena of behavior is called "Post-rationalization".
    
    It's not something anyone can "deny" as a possibility because the
    denial itself might be a post rationalization.   However, even
    non-Boogie owners rave about Boogies so there's good reason to believe
    that Boogie owners have more legitimate reasons to rave about Boogies.
    
    If a Boogie 'isn't worth the price' to you, that's fine.  No Boogie
    owner would deny that there ARE compromises you can make.  I think
    however, that you will find that Boogie owners are uncompromising.
    
    That's been my consistent observation.
    
    Peace.
    
    	db

    
    
    I don't own a boogie and am not likely to in the near future.  I have
    tried a few, though, and might as well throw my .02 in.
    
    I agree with everyone who said that a 1 twelve combo (or sep. cab) will
    never push as much air as 4 12's, 6 10's, etc.  But, it may not have
    to.  If you mike your amp through the PA, you are only relying on the 12
    for stage volume, which it will do easily.  If you don't mike the amp,
    well, IMHO 1 twelve just won't cut through the rest of the band.  Sure,
    it may be loud directly in front of it, but it won't disperse like a
    4 twelve cab.  
    
   
    That's OK, though.  The original reason for combo amps in the first
    place must have been weight and bulk.  Why carry around a Marshall
    stack when you can carry a small (although HEAVY) combo and rely on the
    PA.  Ever lift an Ampeg SVT cabinet? 
    
    The major objection to the boogie seems to be changing sounds; it's not
    always possible to quickly go from a good lead sound to a rythm sound. 
    That could be a problem if the rest of the band is waiting while you
    twiddle knobs.  Maybe the MK III solves this?
    
    
    As for whether or not a boogie is worth the $$ seems to be a religious
    question.  I can honestly say that I have not heard another amp
    anywhere near its size that sounds as good.  All this noise about the
    "singing lead" tone is true.  I also think that the hardwood cabinet
    and cane grill look real cool.  But $1500 will buy you a lot of nice
    stuff.  You could get a new Fender Twin AND a nice Les Paul and still
    have money left over.  If the boogie sound is worth it to you, put your
    check in the mail.  If it's not, there are many other small/loud amps
    that you could look at.
    
     
    Kevin
    
    

>        Does anybody know the address of THE Mase Boogie dealer(s) in
>    	England

According to the info that came with my Boogie (which is a list of 'repair
stations', whcih may or may not be actual dealers), there are two listed
for England:

Rocky Road Company
Simon Hart
Unit #1, Horshoe Close
West Hampstead
London, England NW2 7JJ
011-441-886-7513

and

Southern Music
Melvyn Taylor
194 Church Road
Hove

Alan S.

    I just wanted to jump in here and second the mention (a few notes
    back) about learning to use a Boogie.  When I got my MkIII, I fiddled
    around and got some great sounds for my Gibson ES175T (a thin, hollow
    body).  A few years later I bought a Schecter Strat-ish guitar.
    It sounded good in the store and stayed in tune.  However, I didn't
    bother to lug my Boogie to the shop to see how it sounded through
    it.
    
    For a few months, I was very disappointed with my choice of the
    Schecter because my "tried-and-true" Boogie settings didn't sound
    very good with the single coil sounds.  Finally, I remembered that
    it took me awhile to get those good sounds for the humbuckers and
    invested the time to find the settings that sounded good (to me)
    on the Schecter.
    
    The lesson I learned was that the Boogie gives you lots of control
    options and that to get that great sound, you'll have to experiment
    more than I had with any of my previous amps.
    
    I love my Boogie but one must realize that it takes a bit of time
    and trouble to get "your" version of that singing tone.
    
    Buy what is right for you; don't justify $1000+ on someone else's
    experience.  Good luck!
    
    - John -

    On the issue of how much stuff to have on stage, I agree
    whole-heartedly with Kevin.
    
    Awhile back I noticed that without exception, the best sounding bands
    I'd heard all had very minimal onstage amplification - only what was
    needed for monitoring.  Instead of lugging around enormous expensive
    cabinets, they buy a few SM57s and direct boxes and run everything to
    the PA.  Doing this allows you to control the house mix, which what's
    most important.
    
    Back in the 70's when everyone had stacks and stacks of Marshall
    cabs, I remember seeing this NJ band, "Sam the Band", that had
    almost nothing onstage and being totally blown away by how well
    I could hear everything.  It was the first band I had seen go
    with minimal onstage volume.  And their 4-part vocals were always
    incredible because they singers didn't have to compete with
    stack and stacks of cabs just to hear themselves.
    
    	db

    	Thanks for all the inputs guys.
    
    	didn't mean to start a riot ... and by all means carry on after
    	Im finished.
    
    	.. but from what I gather the general consenses is that most
    	Boogie owners are pleased with their purchase... and after all
    	$1500 isnt outrageous... a bit more for us over here Im afraid..
    
    	Most of you use 4*12 or 2*12 cabs for a 'fuller' sound ... but
    	than again your gigs/venues are probably 4 times the size of
    	ours (here in the west of Ireland : Galway).
    
    	A lot of you praised the tonal qualities of the boogie, that
    	'singing sound' .... Can you reproduce the Mark Knophfler (sp)
    	sound with the boogie ??? I use a 73 strat with standard pickups.
    	Id be interested to hear if this sound can be produced??
    
    	also, as an aside - Ive recently sent away for a 'Riff-o-matic'
    	as advertised in Guitar Player (a floor mounting cassette player
    	with foot pedals!). Has anyone used/got one....
    				Any comments.
    
    	Ray
    

>>    	A lot of you praised the tonal qualities of the boogie, that
>>    	'singing sound' .... Can you reproduce the Mark Knophfler (sp)
>>    	sound with the boogie ??? I use a 73 strat with standard pickups.
>>    	Id be interested to hear if this sound can be produced??
    
	Knophfler sound! You bet. Mark was over my place last night
	doin' it on my 73 "straight and natural" strat. Oh, wait 
	a second, that was me! (Don't I wish I had Knoffler down
	that good, but the sound is right there, if you take the time
	to diddle with the knobs a bit) 

	I use a pick, so I don't quite get the Knoffler thing exact
	on the button, but team up a strat with a Boggie, and
	you abilities are the only thing to stand in your way.

Rick

    Do Boogie dealers discount much?  What is the best price you've
    seen for a 295 Simul-Class?
    
    Mike_who's_curious

    
    In general, Boogie dealers do not discount one penny.  You pay the
    factory price, period.  Depending on where you live, sales tax may
    or may not balance shipping from the factory.  I have heard of some
    dealers charging over list to cover freight costs, particularly
    on special orders.

    
    
    
    	Yup... as a matter of fact Boogie dealers who do discount can lose
    their franchise...  passion for customers and all that rot!
    
    
    

    
    
    
         Up here in Canada that's called price fixing and is illegal
    but it's still done a bit. They also cannot have exclusive dealerships
    here either. A wonder there's not more mail order houses up here

    I tried the Boogie MKIII 60wt combo over the weekend.  Nice little amp
    but I thought it was a pain to mess with all the knobs, etc.
    
    Mike

    After hearing Brian "Damage" Forsythe's Mark II live for the  4th time
    this past week, I'm almost convinced to go out and buy one.  He gets 
    such a cool, fat, R&R tone from it!!

    
    Oh, my God!  Can this be happening?  Buck wanting a Boogie?
    Nah!  This must be a dream...
    ;^)
    
    J.

Does anyone know the difference between the SimulClass 295 
and the SimulClass 395? Is it just the "Switch Track" stuff, 
or is there more...?

I've seen a few used 295's around the papers and such...  Can 
someone give me some specifics on output power, tube-type 
(6L6, I assume), reviews or comments??

jc 

>Does anyone know the difference between the SimulClass 295 
>and the SimulClass 395?
    
    100.
    

*smack* !!!

I knew that, ya blarney keyboard-puke !!

:-)

jc (Celbrating St. Patty's day with the above commentary)

    From my Mesa/Booger catalog:
    
    "The Stereo 295 boasts all of the Simul-Class features of the Mark III
    section including: 2 types of interchangeable power tubes, Class A
    Triode operation, STR 6L6's and EL34's, with power levels of a
    conservative 95 wpc independently switchable down to the tightest,
    fiercest 30 watts you've heard!"
    
    4 rack spaces high, contains 4x12AX7's, 4x6L6's, 4xEL34's, cooling fan. 
    Each channel has 2x4ohm and 2x8ohm speaker jacks, � inch input jack,
    input level control, Class A/Simul-Class power switch, weight = 37 lbs.

Drool!!!!!!

I guess the 395 is similar, but does "Switch Track" stuff...  Ergo, the 
TriAxis will switch from one power amp channel to another (for volume 
boosts and tonal changes..via presence).

I saw one recently for pretty cheap.

Hey Mike, whats the catalog say about the Strategy 500 series??  Can you 
scan and send it to me ??

I thought the Boogie 50/50 amp was cute too.  :-)
jc

    My catalog is a couple years old so it's missing the 395 and Strategy
    500 (only has 400).

    After eating some great Mexican food in Santa Ana, CA, I drove into a strip
    mall to find some frozen yogurt for dessert and saw a small music store
    with a lot of Boogie amps in the window, Walking in for a better look,
    I discovered it was a Mesa *factory store* , filled with virtually
    everything in the catalog from the V-2 pedal to a monster Dual Recto
    stack. I would have loved to have ruined my hearing trying everything
    out, but I didn't have time for more than a quick look around.
    
    If you're in the area, it's on the Santa Ana side of the South Coast
    Mall
    
    
    Danny W.

    
    We locals actually refer to it as South Coast Plaza.  But, yeah, it's a
    mall...
    
    Danny, if you're still around, there's a Leo Fender exhibit you should
    catch while you're in town.  Let me look around for the info...
    
    

    
    
            Has anyone tried one of those v-2 pedals? The salesman said it
    is awesome, but you know what that's worth. The thought of a pre-amp on
    the floor is pretty cool.
    
    
                                    Jeffy

    The Boogie store isn't in the South Coast Plaza itself, but in the next
    strip mall over. I was only in the area for a day.
    
    The V-2 Pedal is better than I expected it to be. It has a bypass
    switch which puts you right into your amp, so you can put it in front
    of, say, a Fender Vibro-King, have that incredible Fender^2 sound
    straight, and then get two flavors of Boogie overdrive when you want
    it. If you've got a basic amp that has great sound and would like more
    flexibility without doing a mod to it, this pedal is a good way to go.
    
    Danny W.

    Huh?  What is a V2 pedal?  I don't read GP anymore, have I missed the
    newest hot toy?  How much does it cost?
    
    							Brian

    
    
    OK, now I know where the store is...I bought my fiance's engagement
    ring at a store in the same strip...which is why I haven't been in
    there...
    
    

    coming soon, the ME262 pedal!
    

    Sorry, it's the V-Twin pedal. I just keep having brain flashes.
    
    Danny W.

>    coming soon, the ME262 pedal!

     Yeah, and the ME163 Comet pedal, and the ME109, ME110......

     Pedals of the Luftwaffe!!

     	I prefer the V1 Buzz-bomb pedal myself

     8^)
     Neal
     	

>                           -< for those BOC covers >-
>    coming soon, the ME262 pedal!
    
    For distortion like 7 screaming diz-busters.

Hey guys you can have all those me things, I'm sticking with the real winner:

my extortion pedal...

dbii

    Ty Tabor (of King's X) has been using the Dual Rectifier head on tour
    and is reportedly very dissatisfied with them.

    Donno where you hear that, but in the current Guitar Player, there's an
    interview with Ty where he says he likes the Dual Rectifier, used it to
    record the latest album and is using it on stage too, with a 2:95 power
    amp fed from it's line out, powering three Boogie 4x12 cabs.
    
    Personally, I like his sound on the new album better then the older
    albums.  It's basically the same, but has just a little more edge and
    clarity to it.
    
    Greg0

    He said it to someone after their appearance here last month.  The guy
    was shooting the breeze with him about his rig when Ty told him he
    wasn't happy with it.

    Sounds great on the album, that's all I know.  Maybe he's had
    reliability problems or something.
    
    Greg

    could be.  just remember that the next time you tell me I need a
    Booger.

    I didn't say there *were* any, just something that might have been
    happening.  Most of the people I've known who had Boogers said they
    were pretty reliable.
    
    Greg

    -1
    
    People like J-dot?

    
      Sounds like shades of the KittyHawk / Winger thing. Yeah they sound
    great, but what about durability? But my M1's are still chuggin' !!!!
    

>    People like J-dot?
    
    The only problem with his was bad power tubes.  After several years at
    that.  Hey, it's a tube amp, you have to do some maintenance on 'em.
    
    Greg

    I can't get rid of my M1

    I spent some time over lunch checking out the Mesa V-Twin pedal.  Let
    me start by saying the main thing I came away with was that I'd need to
    spend more time with it to really give a fair review.  I was rushed,
    and it seemed like I could have gotten better results if I'd played
    with it longer.  On the other hand, this also implies that the beast
    is probably not "point and shoot".
    
    I must've spaced on the name, or thinking about buzzbombs or something. 
    Anyway, if it ain't obvious, the name V-Twin is a reference to Harleys;
    this is made blatantly clear by the pseudo Harley logo on the front
    (I think I like the "pedals of the Luftwaffe" series idea better,
    myself :-).
    
    The V-Twin must be one of the most rugged pedals in existence.  It's
    all diamond plate chrome armour and weighs a good 5 pounds at least.
    You could probably run over it with your Hog during a solo and not miss
    a note!  There are two footswitch buttons, one for bypass and one to
    toggle between 2 of 3 modes; either clean <-> solo or blues <-> solo. 
    The toggle pairs are selected by a third, more fragile switch,
    obviously not meant to be controlled with your feet.  There are outputs
    for driving another amp, a power amp, and headphones.  There are also
    external jacks for controlling the two main switches.  Controls are
    what you'd expect; gain, bass, middle, treble, presence, and master.
    The knobs are big, knurled, Tele style.
    
    The V-Twin employs 2 12AX7s, clearly visible from above but well
    protected by the pedal housing.  The first sign of trouble is the power
    supply, a 12 volt wall bug.  I'm not convinced this idea of running
    tubes at low DC voltage really cuts it (but of course, your mileage
    may vary).  Anyway, I guess I was hoping for a full-voltage design.
    
    The test vehicle was a G&L Legacy Strat (maple board) and we ran it
    through a) a Peavey Bandit and b) a Peavey Classic 1x12.  Now here's
    where it gets weird.  Through the solid state Bandit, the thing was
    incredibly bassy.  Even on the bridge pickup, with treble and presence
    all the way up and bass and mids all the way down, the tone still
    had a dark, muffled quality.  Cut to the all tube 1x12; here the sound
    was too shrill and high endy, with not enough bottom.  In both cases,
    the bypass tone of just the amp was full and well balanced.  Weird.
    
    In general, despite the problems, I heard some good things in the clean
    and blues modes.  The solo mode didn't move me; I could get plenty of
    distortion, but no tones I really liked.  As stated earlier, it may
    require time to really learn how to use this beast.  Perhaps it's
    necessary to really dial-in to match the particular amp being driven.
    Or maybe it functions better as preamp, driving a power section or
    the mixing board.  Anyway, my first encounter was somewhat of a
    disappointment.
    
    /rick

    You forgot to say how many of my panheads I need to sell to buy one of
    these muthas...
    
    							Little Fauss

    Actually, the tubes run on high voltage from a DC-DC convertor.
    
    I was able to get a decent sound using it in front of a Vibro-King. In
    bypass, pure Fender, the other two modes gave the usual Boogie sounds.
    
    DRW

    The tag said $369.
    

    Can anyone offer info on the Mesa Simul-Class 90?
    
    Thanks,
    Kev --
    
    

    Kevin,
    
    You asking about the rack-mounted 2:90 power amp??
    
    If so - they induce mass hysteria and vomiting at full volume.
    This is good, btw.  These things ROCK!  BUT...  They aren't
    Simul-class...
    
    jc (Who loves loud)
    
    

    There sure are lot's of Mesa Booger notes. I just did a  Dir/title="Mesa" 
    and got a long list. I just recieved a mailer from Mesa Boogie over the 
    weekend.They have just introduced several new products which look to be 
    pretty interesting.
    
    	Baron - This is not a guitar amp product. It is an audiophile
    	tube power amplifier for use in home stereo applications or
        perhaps pro-audio. It uses 6550's for the power stage, and
    	appears to be built like a Mack Truck. It is a pure dual mono 
        amp with separate power transformers and power cords for each
    	channel. It can be run in 3 differant modes, all class A, which 
        can provide upto 150 wpc. The front-panel meters can be set to 
        display power output or tube bias. My guess is if you have to 
        ask how much it costs, you can't afford one  ;^)>
     
        20/20 Power amp - This little single-space rack box features
    	20 wpc from EL84 power tubes. Finally, someone comes up with a
        stereo power amp with just enough power, but not too much. I've
        been dreaming of a 20 wpc tube power amp to complete my rack
    	system, and this appears to be just the ticket. I would have
        preferred one with 6V6's but I wouldn't rule out this amp without
    	a thourough road test. I wonder how much these are selling for. 
    
	Mesa also has out several new combo amps including a few vintage
        style amps with no channel switching. 
    
    	Mark
    

    Mesa Boogie has a web site (just in case anyone was wondering)
    
    It's at http://www.mesaboogie.com   (gee tough to guess)
    
    It's in the process of being built but will include when done:
    
    ARTICLES BY FOUNDER AND 
        PRESIDENT RANDALL SMITH
    
    TALES FROM THE TONE LOUNGE 
        BY DOUG WEST
    
    ARTIST INTERVIEWS AND TOUR 
    SCHEDULES
    
    MESA PRODUCT INFO AND 
        TONE TWEAKING  <----  Real Cool
    
    
    Brian
    

    I was amp shopping *again* this week and stumbled onto a Mesa Boogie
    1x10 Subway Blues amp. After trying PV Classics and New retro Fenders
    ( Deville and Deluxe ), I was absolutely floored with this little amp.
    It's apppearently 20w. Very basic: 3 band EQ, Reverb, and FAT switch.
    Sounded like 50w 1x12...what's up wit dat?
    So, I checked out their web site but there was not product info
    available. The store had no literature either. Could anyone enlighten
    me on this little Mesa Boogie?
    Fwiw, it's retailing for $599.
    
    -kev

    This is discussed elsewhere under another note also. 
    
    I had one of these for awhile, and it was OK, but
    I ended up with a Studio Caliber (which cost about 
    what your price on the Subway is).  I decided I 
    wanted master volume, plus the Subway I had
    was humming, and didn't come on until the volume
    was louder than I like to practice.  Might have
    just needed new tubes though.  I think Daddy's had 
    Subway's on sale last summer, and Sam Ash sold them  
    for 449.00 plus shipping.  
    
    FYI the NAMM article in the recent GP says Boogie
    showed the Subway Rocket - like the Subway Blues, but
    with high gain and no reverb.
    
    If I had to do it again I'd try the Studio Caliber head 
    plus a closed back cab with a 12.    
    
    Dave
    

    Thnaks for the reply Dave. 
    I agree with the Master Volume being a necessity, for sure! I've been
    running a Fender Bassman for a few years now (silverface w/ Marshall
    4x10 cab).Great tone but it needs to be wound up to get it. The harp
    player in my band wants it, so it's basically sold. I just need to find
    *that* amp. You know, the one every body dreams of and no one makes...
    I sure did like that litte Subway. I'll have to give it a real good
    test drive before I decide. I'm afraid of losing the bottom end I crave
    so much. What was that thing like as you increased the volume? Did the
    tubes start to clip early or stay clean? Did it thin out? Could you
    give it a hypothetical volume rating....sounded like 40w or about its
    rated power. Is it class A? Should I stop this assult of questions now
    or continue........?
    
    thanks again, 
    
    -kev 

    I have n't tried that many amps, so I can't
    offer much comparisons.  I only turned the 
    Subway up past 5 a couple times, and it did get
    crunchy, like a power chord would sound 
    pretty cool.  I'd guess you'd get to the 
    overdrive level pretty easy if you were 
    playing rock with a drummer.  But that was
    too loud for me just noodling around in 
    the basement.
    
    Also the mid control
    is supposed to add gain at settings past
    three (same as on the Studio Caliber).  I really liked 
    the sound with mid all the way and the fat 
    switch on.  And I can get a sound alot like
    that on the Studio Caliber.  Good blues sound to my ears, 
    still basicly clean, but lots of "tubiness". 
    
    There is a speaker out, so I think you could
    get more clean volume with an extension spkr.(?)
    
    Dave
        

    Thanks for getting back to me Dave. One more question: Would you think
    this thing could hold it's own in a small club/gigging situation? You
    mentioned it being quite loud but you also said you didn't know about
    playing it in a band.
    
    -kev [How bout a run down on yer SC?]

    That I really don't know.  Last time I played in 
    a band (more than 10 years now) it was bass, through 
    an Acoustic 360 I wish I'd never sold.  That thing rocked.  
    And when I was a kid I used a master volume twin, which
    was also plenty loud.  
    
    Other noters with more band experience might be
    able to suggest a minimum guitar tube amp
    wattage.  It probably depends if you're doing
    much miking of the amp, the drums, etc.     
    
    Sorry,
    
    Dave
    

    No Problem...and thanks again for all the help Dave.
    
    ...And Happy Easter Man! 
    
    -kev

    just one data point for you.  I've done gigs with a Fender Super Champ,
    which is about the same power/volume as the Subway Blues.  Usually
    I was running it through a 4x10 and the amp was miked, but I had
    *plenty* of stage volume with that rig and could've done small
    clubs with no miking.  Many small amps sound surprisingly loud when
    put through a larger cab.
    
    If it worked out this would be a great setup.  The Subway alone would
    be nice and portable for home/low-volume-band practice, and with the
    added cab for stage work.
    
    /rick