Conference napalm::guitar

    I live in Switzerland and would like to know what the price of a
    (new) Gibson ES 335 D (sunburst) is on the U.S. market.
    
    Regards

    Current ES-335 Dot has list price of around $1300, sells for around
    $800 in Sunburst finish. It would be about $60 less in a painted
    finish.
    
    Danny W.

    Actually, Mail order maybe 800, but I did pricing about 9 mos ago,
    and found the major (Boston) stores getting closer to 850-900 for
    a sunburst Dot 335.  The Ebony were 799.
    
    /paul

    Just checked with my mail-order dealer, Paul Schein of Washington
    Music Center (301-946-8808). He says the price is $825 for a "second",
    $895 for a non-second, including shipping to the East Coast. Seconds
    usually have only minor finish blemishes.
    
    Black or Cherry is under $800. He also has a white w/ gold hardware
    for $850.
    
    I was using yesterday's Gibson price list when I replied before.
    Sorry bout that.

       GEEZ, I GUESS I REALLY DID GET A DEAL. I STRAPED ON A CHERRY
    335 DOT "SECOND, I COULDN'T TELL" AND FELL I LOVE. IT WAS EVERYTHING
    I HAD EVER THOUGHT A GUITAR SHOULD BE, IT FELT LIKE A WOMEN. I PAID
    ......$400....NO CASE. HONEST. IF YOU ARE IN THE N.H. AREA I WILL
    INTRODUCE YOU TO THE DEALER.
    
    LATER
    

Re: 5
    
    This happens to many guitars that are not seconds. Almost all the
    blemishes I've seen are small finish checks on the back or sides.
    I doubt that the missing finish on the binding would do it.
    
    Gibson sometimes labels perfectly good guitars as "seconds" to give
    extra price breaks to selected dealers.
    
    Danny W.

    
    	Not to change the subject, but a sleazy boston music dealer
    	was selling Gibson seconds at the same price as the others.
    	Gibson identifies it's seconds by stamping a large "2" on the
    	back of the headstock. My friend asked about the "2", they said:
    	"Oh, thats a color code".
    
    	Guy Novello (former '69 335 owner)
    

    Gibson started stamping "Second" in the late '70's, but has since
    returned to the use of a "2". More sellable this way.
    
    Danny W.

    re: .4
    
    Dealer cost on dot second sans case is over $500, and Gibson almost
    never ships a guitar without a case. I wonder how he does it.
    
    Danny W.

    
    re: -1
    
    Does that mean if a salesman tells me that the new Gibson
    I wanna buy doesn't come with a case, he's, ah, "mispeaking"??
    
    Frank 

    re: -1
    
    More 'n likely.
    
    It's not so much that Gibson wants to sell cases (which I'm sure
    they do), buts it's much easier and safer to UPS them in the case.
    
    They do price the cases separately for most guitars, which seems
    to imply they can be had without, but in fact, I doubt it.
    
    Danny W.
    

    Could you describe the guitar a little more? Is it an archtop or
    a flattop. Does it have fretboard inlays and what do they look like.
    Could the label read "Style L-7"? Does it have a cutaway?
     What kind of shape is it in?
    
    The serial # puts it around 1963, but the same #'s were used in
    1944. Further description would help.
    
    Danny W.

    It is archtop
    It does have fretboard inlays. (don't have the guitar here, so can't
    say what they look like)
    What is a cutaway?
    I don't know how to judge its shape/condition
    Will look at it at home to answer rest of questions
    
    			herb

    You are correct, the style is L 7, not I 7 as I earlier said.
    It is archtop.
    The inlays are "pearl". There are two of them more or less on
    alternating rows. The inlays are parallellograms.
    If a cutaway is what I think it is then yes the body has 2 cutaways,
    one on either side of the strings. The cutaways look vaguely like an
    elongated and skinny Ss (the letter Ess). Or perhaps vaguely like a
    G-clef(?).
    There is a hairline crack in the body.
    
    			herb

    I think your talking about F holes, yes? Holes cut in the top of
    the guitar.
    
    A cutaway on a guitar is
    a deviation on the basic hour glass shape of the guitar. On the
    treble side, where the strings are thinest or the bottom as you
    hold it like you were playing, the body would have a section cut
    away in the shape of a backwards C to allow access to the fretboard
    above the place where the neck joins the body. In other words, the
    body of the guitar is not semitrical. 
    
    Lets pretend I can draw curved lines on a CRT:
    
    
    			| | neck
    			| |
    			| |
    		     ---  |
		    (     (_  <-- cutaway
    	body ----->  \     /
    		      )   (  
    		     /f   f\  <-- s shaped F holes
    		    (_______)
    
    
    Dave.
    

    Well, only a backwards C if you look down at it while you play!!
    
    D.

    thnx for the picture

    I believe the body is symmetrical, that is to say there is no cutaway.
    I will check at home and comment if not true. I must say, that i
    associated your picture with electric stringed instruments rather than
    acoustical, but perhaps that's my limitation.
    
    So yes, i was describing F holes, not cutaways.

    grins

    Okay, so we know it's a non-cutaway L-7, from either 1963 or 1944.
    So, what color is the label? Does the G in the Gibson headstock
    inlay have a descender and is there a dot over the i? Does the b
    have an open loop in the top or is it solid? Is the s connected
    to the b at the top or at the bottom? Since it is non-cutaway, it
    is more likely from the '40's than the '60's
    
    If you can answer these questions, we'll know what year it's from.
    A non-cut, L-7 is worth around $1000 in really nice shape. As for
    the size, at 17" x 3-3/8" it is the same size as Gibson's L-5--in
    fact, it is an L-5 with different trim. If you think it is large,
    try a Super 400.
    
    Danny W.

    Hey getting interesting!!!!
    
    Will answer remaining questions this evening.

    So, what color is the label? 
    	It is old, but i'd say either tan or yellow
    Does the G in the Gibson headstock inlay have a descender 
    	Yes, but maybe just barely. Let me elaborate. The G, 
    is SLIGHTLY lower than the rest of the letters. The b is lower than all
    but the G.
    Is there a dot over the i? 
    	no
    Does the b have an open loop in the top or is it solid? 
    	Open
    Is the s connected to the b at the top or at the bottom? 
    	Top
    I measure the size as 21 x 3-1/2. But I spose it can be measured more
    that one way. Are you measuring the 17" from the bottom of the fret
    board to the bottom of the body, or from the top of the body to the
    bottom of the body? Borrowing from Dave's picture, the neck extends
    about 4" beyond the top of the body, thusly...

        
                       | |
                       | | neck
    		       | |
    		       | |
|    		     --| |--
|		    (  | |  ) 
|    	body ----->  \ --- /     
|    		      )   (      |
21"    		     /     \     17"
|                   /       \    |
|                  /         \   |    
|    		  (___________)  |
    
    
    
    
    				herb

    The logo and label neatly pins this to 1944, so, you have a 1944
    non-cutaway L-7. This makes sense, since 1963 L-7's were cutaway
    except by special order, and I doubt that many non-cuts were ordered
    in the sixties.
    
    The top end dealer price for a really nice one of these is around
    $1000, but you had mentioned a crack. Any significant finish wear
    large scratches or dings, or other cosmetic defects will reduce
    its value, as will any structural problems. It is impossible to
    accurately appraise a guitar like this without seeing it, but $850
    is probably realistic. If it was an L-7C or L-7P, it would be worth
    twice that, since the cutaway models are more desirable.
    
    The 17" dimension is the *width* of the guitar at the lower bout.
    The body length is pretty irrelevant.
    
    Danny W

    Gee, sounds like i ought to learn how to play it.
    
    Thankyou VERY much for your patience and your ENCYLCLOPEDIC knowledge
    
    			herb

    and if one were interested in selling such a guitar, what would be the
    way to do it? 
    Obviously, my guitar is only worth $1000 if somebody wants to pay it.
    It has a crack in the body, would it make sense to have it restored
    before trying to sell it?
    Are there consignment shops?
    Is that a bad approach?
    Are there particular audiences who might be interested in such a
    guitar?
    Gee, for all I know there may be some organization of GIBSONophiles.
    
    
    				herb	

    There are dozens of vintage dealers who would sell your guitar for
    you. Typically, they get 25% commission for a consignment, or will
    pay you 60% of the resale value for cash. Often, they will give
    you full value against a trade. Some high-volume places are Gruhn
    Guitars and Mandolin brothers. Check the classifieds in Guitar Player.
    
    Depending on the severity of the crack, it may cost you as much
    to repair it as the increase in value it will bring, but it would
    certainly be easier to sell. On a vintage guitar like this, make
    sure the repairer is truly qualified; the average Strat butcher
    is likely to ruin the instrument.
    
    Danny W.

    can you recommend one or more reliable repairers in Eastern/Central
    Mass?
    
    

    First off-  
    	MacDuffs.  Period.  IMHO, One of the best, if not *the* best
    in central Ma, and dare I say, Massachusetts.  Right next to Spags
    and Leiser in shrewsbury.  Top notch work, and reasonable rates.
    
    Second to that, is wurlitzers where Jeff-o had his guitar worked
    on...Worcester, perhaps?  Jeff?
    
    /c
    

   On a $1K guitar, it's worth your effort to schlep the guitar around,
   talk to several luthiers, and look at samples of their work.  An
   adequate repair could be worse than none at all.

   MacDuffs is adequate - cheap, effective, but lousy on cosmetics.
   Worcester Wurlitzer's or Cambridge Music Center are maybe a bit better.
   Music Emporium in Cambridge is superb, expensive, and slow.

   Good luck,
   Dave

    discussion continued @40
    
    				herb

    A friend of mine has an axe that I've never heard of.  I told him I'd
    find out what I could about it.
    
    It's a Gibson Les Paul Special circi 1962.  It's red and has two
    baby humbuckers on it.
    
    Can anyone tell be what it might be worth and maybe a little history? 

    Thanks !
    

    
    See note 1092 for a discussion of the various Les Paul models.
    
    If it has baby humbuckers and it's from 1962 then it is no longer
    stock.  Is this an SG shaped model?
    
    
    

    Affimative.
    
    Understand that I have yet to see the axe, I'm only going on how
    he has described it.  Thanks for the pointer to 1092.
    
    jc

    Strong agreement with .1
    
    SG Special replaced LP Special in '60, so date is suspect.
    
    Small humbuckers intro'd in '67.
    
    Belongs under "Creative Anachronism" note.
    
    '60's LP Specials are usually $500-$1000. I've seen asking prices
    on '57's as high as $2250, but I don't know what they've actually
    sold for.
    
    Danny W.

    RE: .3
    
    So if I read you right, this axe (disregard info on p/u's 'til
    I see it...) is most likely pre-1960, since they replaced the LP
    special with the SG special then ?

    Understand that this guy bought this guitar at a jockey lot for
    a disgustingly small amount of money.  It's history is a little
    flakey, since the owner knows little about guits.

    
    
    At one point in time, I had what I thought was a '61 Les Paul
    Special.  It was a double (rounded) cutaway with two black pickups in
    what Gibson called a "limed mahogany"  finish.
    
    I had dated the guitar from a book at my local music store.  The book
    clearly identified the guitar with a picture and said that the
    difference between the '60 and '61 versions was that on the '61 the
    neck pickup was moved farther away from the neck to make a stronger
    neck join.
    
    Was this not a '61 Les Paul Special?
    
    Kevin

   re: -.1
    
     Sure could be--there was a period when Gibson was shipping both
    SG' and LP Specials, and it lasted into '61.
    
    During '61, Gibson used both the '50's numbering method of ink-stamped
    numbers (1 XXXX) and pressed in numbers from 100 to 42440.
    
    Ther might even be '62 LP Specials, but most were SG's and non had
    small humbucks.
    
    Danny W.

    Thanks Danny!  I had been calling it a Les Paul Special for a long
    time; it's nice to know I was right. 
    
    You would be handy to have around when reading the
    guitar ads in the Want Advertiser.  Some folks don't believe in
    truth in advertising.
    
    As an aside, I bought the guitar for $89.  I sold it for more 8-).
    
    Kevin
    

    Okay, my pal sez the s/n is 923551 and is painted on the upper back
    of the head.
    
    It is also label Les Paul Special.
    
    Can anyone fill me in on the year and place of manufacture, and
    take a guess at what it might be worth ?
    
    Thanks,
    jc

    Just going by this serial #, the guitar is late '59.
    
    Since inked-on #'s are easy to fake or alter, I'd make sure the
    rest of the instrument is consistent with the date.
    
    In mint condition, a dealer would ask $1000 to $2000 for it. Few
    of these instruments are even close to being mint. In average
    condition, expect $500-$750.
    
    DannY W.

    Does anyone know how to find out the age (and value) of a Gibson
    SG from the serial #? I believe it is an early 60's model.
    
    Thanks,
    Ross

    You generally can't tell from just the serial number
    
    but, what is it?
    
    Danny W

    Gibson kept changing the neck joint and pickup placement because of
    it. I own 2 60's SG's (Ones a white 1960 Les Paul SG (the model that
    caused a lot of friction with Les Paul) with 2 soapbar pickups
    and a stop tailpiece bridge - doesn't have any of the intonation risers
    cast into it, the other is a cherry red 1964 standard with  2 soapbar
    pickups and and trash vibrato - the vibrato was removed - also has a
    stop tailpiece, but has the intonation risers cast in). Tell us more
    about your guitar (Finish, Pickups, Bridge, Tailpiece, placement of
    pickups - how far away from the neck & bridge) and any inlay/markings
    on it).

							Jens

    The serial # is 342976. As far as the bridge, etc., not much of
    the guitar is stock. 
    
    It had a Badass bridge when I bought the guitar. There are just
    (3) holes left in the body where the old bridge (tremolo style I
    presume) used to be. As far as the pickups, they are not original
    either. I got rid of the Dimarzio that it had in it a long time
    ago and replaced it with a Seymour Duncan '59 Les Paul model. 
    Even the pickguard was not the original, though it was a better
    shape than the original (I used to have another one of these).
    When I pulled off the pickguard, It had a mahogany block filling
    in the hole for a neck pickup. There was, however, no hole in the 
    pickguard for a neck pickup. I chipped the block out, cut a hole
    in the pickguard, and installed an old Gibson Firebird pickup. The
    Firebird pickup is oooolld (I'm not sure what the time frame was
    that they manufactured those) and has a very nice tone for blues.
    
    I'm not sure if I still have the original pegs, I think I may have
    lost them in a move. They were the 3-in-a-line ones with white/
    cream colored peg heads. They wouldn't stay in tune if you paid
    them, so at one point I replaced them with Grovers (this used to
    be my main guitar). 
    
    The headstock is very basic. It is just gloss black with the Gibson
    logo in gold (looks like a sticker). There is no pearl inlay.
    
    BTW, there is only one tone knob and one volume knob, so I believe
    the guitar was one of the single soapbar pickup types. The previous
    owner must have routed the body for a second pickup at one time
    and then either he/she, or another owner decided against that idea.
    
    The finish is also not original. In fact, it is a bad staining job
    (done by me in my younger days). I'm planning on refinishing the
    body in the near future. Somebody told me that there is a product
    that will soak the stain out of the body. I'm not sure what I will
    do once I'm back to bare wood. Maybe one of you is thinking "what
    are you nuts, that won't work". 
    
    Ross
    
    

    You've got a 1965 SG Junior or Melody Maker. The MM would have a
    narrower headstock, the SG a standard one.
    
    I think it's an SG Jr, but with all the mods, it probably no longer
    matters.
    
    Danny W.

    The local want ads ran this last night:
    
    "Gibson Guitar model 125, Early 50's model, Hollow single body cut-in
    $300 or best offer"
    
    Anyone familiar with this model?  Is this a good deal?
    
    Mike

    re: -.1
    
    Depending on the condition and how original it is, it could be a
    reasonable deal.
    
    Prices run from around $300 to $750.
    
    Danny W.

    THIS GUITAR SOUNDS EXACTLY LIKE MINE.
    I WAS TOLD IT WAS A 62 SG JR WHEN I BOUGHT IT.
    ITS SMALLER THAN A STANDERD SG AND HAS THE SAME BLACK HEAD
    WITH STICKER LOGO.MINE ALSO HAS BEEN FITTED WITH LEO QUAN
    BADASS BRIDGE,GROVER TUNERS,TWO DAMARZIO PICKUPS,EXTRA KNOBS
    AND PHASE SWITCH,I LEFT PART OF THE OLD TAILPIECE IN INSTEAD
    OF HAVEING THREE HOLES,IT LOOKS GOOD WITH THE EXTRA CROME.
    THE ACTION ON THIS GUITAR IS THE BEST IN THE WORLD,I CAN
    REALLY MOVE ON THIS THING,ITS BY FAR MY FAVORITE AX AND I
    HAVE OVER A DOZEN,NOTHING EVEN COMES CLOSE.

    re: .5
    
     An SG jr is the same size as a regular SG.
    
    Danny W.

    RE:.6
    
    Then why do they call it a jr ?
    Mine is a little lighter than other SG's that i have played,maybe
    they are just thinner ?
    I checked the serial # on it last night and its not too far off
    from the guitar in question. Mine is #200332
    

    re: .7
    
    They called it a Jr. cause it was the cheapest SG model and they
    had already used Custom, Standard and Special. All the
    SG's were the same size: 12.75" x 16" x 1.312". Since these guitars
    are made of wood, the weight probably varied from piece
    to piece. Also, the Jr. had lighter hardware, with its simple
    tailpiece,cheap tuners, single P-90, two controls,
     no selector, no binding and minimal inlay, so it was certainly
     lighter than an SG Standard. But no smaller.
    
    Yours is a 1964 model.
    
    Danny W.

    RE:8
    
    Do you have a book on Gibson serial numbers ? 
    If so,I have a couple of other Gibsons I would like to know the
    age of,or maybe you could suggest a book that i could buy that
    would help me out.
                                                THANKS
                                                      T.G.

    There are a number of sources for Gibson serial numbers, but there
    have been periods when numbers were reused, so it is necessary to
    understand all the other details before you can accurately put a
    date on a Gibson
    
    The best source is "Guitar Identification", by A.R. Duchossoir,
    which includes info on Gretsch, Fender and Martin, too. For early
    instruments (up to '61)," Gibson Electrics, Pt 1" by the same author
     is highly recommended. Pt 2 is about 6 years overdue.
    
    Or, we can keep playing the guess what year it is game through the
    notes :-)
    
    Danny W.

    	I used to collect these little devils, I have a 120T, 125T, 125,
    and a 125TDC. The TDC was the most expensive of the lot at $260 with
    the original hard shell case. The guitar was in very good condition
    though there was some checking of the finish. Most of these models
    sport the traditional Gibson tobacco sunburst finish, gold decal
    logo, and the trapeze style tail piece. Mine date from 62 to 67 so
    an older model from the fifties may be worth a little more. By the
    way, the $260 price tag was in 86'. These were considered student
    guitars at the time and were at the low end of the Gibson line.
    (Which is not to say they weren't well built, they are!)
    	These can be very nice guitars for rhythm/jazz/blues that do
    not require alot of high end. A very nice electric/acoustic sound.
    I would probably not go above $300 for one of these unless it was
    an exceptional instument or a very rare model. (few of the low ends
    are considered rare or collector stock) I am just waiting for David
    Lindley and Ry Cooder to start playing 125's to initiate a new trend!
    	If you take one of these guitars, plug it into a Marshall, turn
    the gain up to 10 and just set the guitar in a corner and it will
    play itself. (-8
    
    Earotica,
    DonH
    
    

    Has Gibson moved from Kalamazoo, Michigan? 
    
    A friend of mine has a J45 acoustic (Ser. # BOO783) that must be 
    at least 18 : 22 years old. I told him I would try to get it dated 
    for him through this notesfile, or the company. I called the operator 
    for that area to get the phone #, and she told me there was no "Gibson 
    Guitar(s)" listing in Kalamazoo. Did I ask for the wrong "company name"?
    
    After reading .10, I realize that dating this guitar may not be
    possible. 
    
    dep

    
    Gibson has been in Nashville, TN for a number of years.  
    
    Some old Kalamazoo employees have started up the Heritage company
    (that's why the Heritage guitars look so musch like old Gibsons). 

    By the way, Billy Lee has a '64 SG in MINT condition if ya
    like SG's
    
    -Dave

    Re .12, 
    Thanks for the info.   dep

    I sent a mail note to the "expert" Mr. Weber for help with my request.
    Here's the same question for the general noting public:
    
    I just acquired a Les Paul Deluxe configured with:
    
    T.O.M. bridge
    Stop tailpiece
    Pearl inlays
    Edge binding
    Cherry Red finish (no sunburst, solid red)
    Baby Humbuckers
    
    All stock hardware, no mods, beautiful condition. 
    
    SN# 00133887...........How old is this guy?
    
    woops, I just got a mail message from Mr. Weber, never mind....

    Danny just informed me it's a 1976 model...."wine" red, not cherry!
    
    Steve_one_happy_camper_Dandrea

    The current U.K. price of a 335 'reissue' cherry dot is 949 pounds!
    
    Can someone tell me how much these cost in the States? The model is 
    ES335 reissue cherry dot, nickel hardware and the latest bridge design
    (all this comes out of the latest catalogue -- apparently prices went
    up recently).
    
    Thanks
    
    Richard.

    
    My wonderful wife bought me an ES335 dot for my birthday.  Natural
    finish color, '59 (or '57) reissue humbuckers, with hardshell case 
    for $1070 thru American Music Supply.
    
    -pat

    Hopefully you'll have beter luck from them than I did ... sent 'em a
    money order for a Marshall head - which had to be back ordered.  Waited
    over 4 months, after calling once a week.  Sorry, still on back order.
    Had to get my lawyer to give them a call before they'd send me my money
    back ... a$$holes !
    
    Ain't it nice to have a wife that understands a musicians "needs" ?
    
    
    				Scary

    RE: "aint it nice to have a wife that understands a musician's needs?"
    
    Dunno....but I sure know what the inverse is like....used to, anyway |)
    
    
    Steve D. (yuk,yuk)

    
    	It arrived last Friday after only a week and a half wait!  It is
    *beautiful*.  I had a good time playing it this weekend.  I'm gonna
    have Steve test drive it this week to make sure everything is cool,
    but it seems great to me so far.  I set the KH to a overdriven clean
    channel and it sounds great.  
    
    -pat

    Sounds like you grabbed a good one ! Congrats to ya !
    
    
    				Scary

I need a date on a Gibson Les Paul Custom...

My neighbor has one and he's interested in trading it for
my Charvel Model 4.  I'm tempted because I already have a strat
metal unit from hell...The Ibanez.

It's a wine red Custom in pretty good shape.  The only things
not stock are the tuning pegs (shallers) and lead pickup
(DiMarzio SD).  The original PAF is in the case, so I could 
put it back in.  He also moved the strap tit behind the neck (ouch).

Question:

-Serial # (painted on back of headstock) is 00116494
 What year does that make it ?

-What would a fair price be for a used but well cared for
 guitar like this be ?

-How bad is it marred by the addition of the second strap
 tit (thus leaving the original hole) ?

    1) If the serial number is really a decal, rather than "painted", it's
    from 1976.
    
    2) These are generally around $750 at vintage dealers, if in good
    shape.
    
    3) If the extra strap button is in the heel cap, no problem. If
    it is in the back or side of the neck, it might have some effect on
    value, but it could always be removed and the hole filled. If you want
    to leave it where it is, put another strap button in the original hole.
    
    Danny W. 

    A coworker has a '66 Les Paul and a '71 (or possibly '72) ES335.  He's
    wondering what the value of these are.  Anyone know?
    
    Funny thing is he just moved here from back east, and doesn't play the
    guitar at all.  He asked me if I wanted to buy them so he can buy some
    new hi-fi speakers.
    
    Mike

    In that case, the Les Paul is worth, oh, about $120.  And I'd guess the
    335 is worth about $75.     8^)
    
    Scary

    
    Yup!  He's abbbolutely wight!  Although I'd go as high as $150 for 
    the Les Paul.
    
    8^)
     
    J.

    wouldn't that be great! ;-)  Too bad I'm honest ;-(

    What about the value of a ~1972 Les Paul Deluxe??
    
    Chris D.

    Since Gibson did not make any Les Pauls in 1966, this guitar is truly
    priceless. It's very difficult to put a value on an instrument without
    knowing the real year of manufacture and the condition.
    
    Danny W.
    

    Yeah, post the serial numbers...
    
    ;)

    I'll post the serial number as soon as I get them from him.  They're
    enroute from Mass.  He mentioned today that he also has a '60ish Fender
    Strat.  This guy royally cracks me up! ;-)  
    
    He said he and a friend have a partial interest in Electric Ladyland 
    studios.  He bought the axes for the studio's use and had no intention 
    of learning.  Plus he said they were a great deal at the time.
    
    He wants a pair of $5K hi-fi speakers.  I figure he could probably come
    close to paying for them ;-)
    
    Mike

    
    Mike, you have his address?  
    
    Hey, Coop?  Wanna go midnight guitar shopping?
    
    ;^)
    
    J.

    Even if I doubled what he paid for all 3 it would still be less than
    what that Radius costs!

    Some confirmed details are in on the Les Paul (waiting on the other 2).
    According to the sales receipt in the case:
    
    1958 (built in November) Les Paul Limited Edition Custom with Ivory and
    Ebony inlays.
    
    Any value estimates would be appreciated,
    Mike

    What condition is it in?

    It's Mint!  Never been played!  Same for the ES335 and Strat.

    
    DROOOOOOOOOOOOOL!

    A '58 LP Custom in mint condition is worth an easy Five Grand. The
    custom inlays may increase or decrease the value somewhat, depending on
    their tastefulness.
    
    32 year-old guitars in mint condition always make me a little bit
    skeptical. Verify that the #'s,and features are consistent with the
    claimed year. Don't go by the sales slip--these can easily be faked.
    
    Danny W.

    More info here.  I edited out the mail header to protect the innocent.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike,

 Thanks for the info etc..As I mentioned I am not well versed in the area of
guitars and would probably never have dug farther had not you and Bob pushed 
    a bit.  I called my friend from whom I had purchased these a long time ago 
    and asked him why he gave me "those" particular units etc...
 As it turns out the Les paul (sp.??..) is a special one in that he said :if
you look at the neck you will see it is autographed by Les Paul himself" It
is a new "gold top" and the decorative inlaids were chosen by Paul himself.
He mentioned this is all documented in the packet in the guitar and notized..
Hummmm...Then he told me if I sold it he has first dibs and something about
me being a sh*t head etc..Oh well I guess friends can get away with that..
(ooops that should read notarized)..
 The other units have special histories also so...I shall chat with you when
I see you again..

    
    DROOOOOOOOOOL!!!

        THUD !
        
        Yo J., you still  wanna'  go  midnight guitar shopping ?  I'm
        game ! :^)
        
        Matt

    
    Sounds good to me!  
    ;^)
    
    J.

    I've run into a fellow who is trying to sell me what is reputed to be
    a '57 Les Paul. It supposedly is black with dots on the fretboard.
    Can anyone tell me what LP models and what there characteristics were
    during the 57 model year? Also what serial numbers would indicate a 
    57 vintage. I guess these would be painted on the back of the
    headstock?  I've not seen it yet but probably will soon. Any idea what
    LPs of this vintage in good to excellent condition might be worth?
    Anything I should be on the lookout for?
    
    suggestions appreciated,
    
    jim

    The better Les Paul models (Customs, Standards) have had block inlays
    since day one.  For a 1957 LP to have a dot neck it would have to be a
    model like a Junior or TV.  Don't recall those being done in black.
    
    						Brian

    What Brian said.  If it has dots, it's probably a Special
    (2 pickup) or a Junior (1 pickup).  They have a solid mahogany
    body with a flat top (not carved like a Standard).  If the
    pickups are original, they'll be black plastic P-90s.  The
    tailpiece is a one piece combination stop/bridge.
    
    I've never heard of one of these in black; the standard finishes
    are sunburst and "limed" (a weird yellow stain, also called "TV"
    because it showed up well on b/w TV).  I suppose it's possible
    that someone special ordered it black and the finish is factory,
    but more likely than not it's been refinned.  Something to always
    be wary of with old Gibson solidbodies that have been refinned -
    this was often done to hide a cracked headstock/neck joint repair.
    
    LPs from this era should have a five digit serial number inked on
    the back of the headstock.  The most significant digit is spaced a
    little farther than the other four, and indicates the last digit of
    the year (e.g. 7 5432 is a 1957).  If there's no serial number, it's
    a good clue it's a refin.
    
    Totally original Juniors and Specials run anywhere from $1000 - $2000;
    if it's been refinished, the range is more like $500 - $800.
    
    Good luck
    
    /rick
    

    
    I bought a beat-up Gibson Hummingbird a few weeks ago at Daddy's.  I
    paid $85.00 for it -- cracks and a bad repair job on the headstock.
    I bought it as a travel guitar, and I liked the way it played and
    it sounded better than any of the imports for twice the price, plus I
    figured it would look cool on the wall, if nothing else :-)
    
    On the back of the headstock are stamped  A150061 
                                              MADE IN
                                              U.S.A.
    
    Inside is an orange and white label -- says it's a Hummingbird Custom
    union made and guaranteed workmanship, etc.
    
    Any idea how old it is?  I doubt it's worth much because of the damage,
    but if anyone knows what it would be worth in good condition, I'd be
    interested to know.  It's a sunburst finish, mahogany back and sides,
    reddish pickguard with the hummingbird decoration.  When I got it, it
    was missing the original truss rod cover --  the replacement didn't fit
    right and caused the strings to buzz.  A friend cut me one out of the
    plastic stuff you'd make pick guards out of, but I'd love to find the
    real replacement part, if possible.  Thought it would help if I knew
    the year.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Justine
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    This is an early '50's guitar. Frankly, I think you got a steal--even
    poor condition Hummingbirds from this period go for over $500.
    
    Danny W,

    
    Wow, a steal?!!  That makes me feel better about all those times I paid
    list :-)
    
    Thanks,
    
    Justine -- whose parents have paid the sticker price for every car
               they ever bought, so I've had a lot to overcome..

    -1
    
    Hi Justine!!!
    
    8^)
    Buck

     -What ever happened to Jane?????
    -"remember?" "you said I was a good sport." -How are you Jane?"
    -"pregnant-I feel like jumping out of the window!"
    -"Say, you are a good sport!"