Conference napalm::guitar

    Lots of excellent used guitars in here.  New or used, the most common
    problem is the pitch (angle) of the neck is not right.  It should
    feel easy to play.
    
    How to judge wood.  TAP with your thumbnail equaldistance from the
    bridge on all places of the guitar.  It should sound the same. 
    Tap on very good guitars to know what it will sound like.   
    
    Look for close, straight grain running in the same direction with
    no imperfections.   Rosewood sides and back.  Thin spruce top. 
    That is the most important for big sound.  Even, good wood improves
    with age.
    
    It should play in tune.  Play the harmonic over the 12th fret, then
    play the note.  If the bridge is not adjustable, it should sound
    the same.
    
    And most important, you should like it.
    
    Don't expect a guitar to do double duty, electric and accoustic
    in a flat top, and expect both the be satisfying.
    

    
    	Some of the Gibsons *ring* like a bell when tuned to proper
    pitch, A=440 Hz. I dont know if every brand new Gibson will do this,
    so it'd pay to go thru a number of them - like a drummer would
    pick cymbals by how they sound - to find one that does. Perhaps
    this attribute can only be found in a used Gibson nowadays. Perhaps
    you dont want it to ring like a bell when tuned to pitch. I dont
    know!
    
    	Joe Jas

    
    A friend of mine is selling a Fender 12-String acoustic guitar,
    in exellent condition.  If you're interested I could find out the
    price for you.
    
    -Tony
    Reading, England

    
    	I would look for a dreadnought acoustic with square shoulders.
    They have about the deepest sounding bass and nice sweet range of
    tone. Most people think Jumbo's have a deeper bass than a dreadnought,
    but they don't. Most jumbos have soft shoulders, and most of tone
    comes from the front bout of the instrument. All that extra wood
    behind the bridge doesn't contribute to the bass much. Jumbo's are
    bigger and bulkier, not as comfortable to play, especially sitting
    down. I have a Jumbo guitar, and would like to swap it for a dread-
    nought.
    
    	As far as brands I would go into all the major music stores
    in your area and check out as many differant brands as you can.
    In your price range, look at the Guilds, Takamine's, Washburns,
    Martin Sigma, Yamaha.  I believe the latest Gibsons (Nouveau)
    series are nice, but slightly out of your price range. Gibson
    is still making Epiphones, and they aren't too bad. Ovations have
    a few guitars in that range that are nice too, especially if you
    want Acoustic/electric. The best acoustic/electrics in your price
    range are Ovations, Takamine, Guild, and Washburn, in that order.
    Guild is one company that is making some fine guitars these day,
    especially since the company was purchased by George Gruhn, and
    3 of his associates.
    
    	If you are willing to buy a used instrument private sale, you 
    might be able to get into something like a Martin, or Alverez Yairi.
    You might run into some of the old Gibsons for sale. Keep away
    from the humingbird, and dove acoustics, and any of the others with
    real fancy inlay work on them. The tops are so heavily laquered,
    that they sound muffled. The Gibson J200 or (southern jumbo) is real
    nice, if you like Jumbo size acoustics.
                                          
    Good luck and have fun looking
    
    Mark Jacques

	RE: .4

	The one Gibson Hummingbird I played had about the sweetest and
	least muffled sound I've ever heard from a guitar.  Then again,
	that was back in 1973, and the guitar itself was a 1971 or 1972
	model.  I can't say what the modern ones are like.


							John

    
    I'd look at Takamine, can't say much more specifically 'cause it
    depends on what you like.  I've steered a lot of my friends looking
    for acoustics toward Alvarez, but lately I've been thinking that
    I don't like the sound of them as much as I like the playability
    of them.  Ovations sound great amplified, but not so great acoustic,
    especially if you are playing without a pick.  Without a pick the
    plastic sound can be kinda dead.  Just a couple of my thoughts...

    A friend of mine has a Takamine 12 string that has got to be one
    of the best 12 strings I've ever heard!  When I look for a 12 string,
    the Takamine will be the first I look at.
    
    Mike

    
    Oh, about Epiphones...I have a 12 string, 3 years old, and I love
    it!!  On the other hand, its the only Epiphone I've been impressed
    with, as Epiphones have generally been lousy guitars the last 15 or
    so years.  They are owned by Gibson, made in Japan, and considered
    to be Gibson's cheapo line of guitars.  But I wouldn't count them
    out, they're definitely affordable, and you may come across one
    that you like as much as your last one.  Are you looking for a 6-string
    or a 12-string?   

    
    
    Thanks for all the info, peeps!

    Its a 6 string I'm after - the old Fender 12 is still going strong.
    I've had this Epiphone for about 10 years now, and I bought it used,
    so its probably considerably older than that..... it even survived
    having the head snapped off at a gig about 8 years back; being on
    t'dole at the time, I couldnt afford a new guitar, but could afford
    some woodglue - its been fine ever since!
    
    re -.1 Yes their 12's are nice arent they?
    
    The Hummingbird sounds interesting - what sort of price could I
    expect to pay for a second hand one?
                              
    Bob
    

    Bob,
    
      I have a 12 string limited edition Ovation.Its has a built in
    preamp with a three band equalizer.It has an incredible amplified
    sound,and fingers great.If the 6 strings are anything like the 12
    i would definitly buy one.In fact,i am planning to do that when
    i get the money.I have also seem quite a few country as well as
    rock artists,using them.
    
    Michael
    

    A good new guitar is only hinting at the sound the guitar is capable
    of after it ages.  Good wood, well made, will sound great.
    
    There is a spanish guitar maker on, Tatay who would custom build
    you a guitar for about the price range you are looking at.    I
    bought one of his classical's in 68 and it has aged beautifully.

    Go around a load of guitar shops until you find one that you like!
    My accoustic is a Jap made Epiphone Texan that I bought about ten
    years ago and although it's nothing fancy I have had alot of people
    in recent times offer me twice as much as I paid for it....
    Take the advice of tapping the guitar....
    There are some very nice guitars being produced by a company called
    Clarissa in Spain that are fundamentaly Ovation copies but very
    nice and very playable.
    A good guitar is what you want.....not the name on the end of it!
    Jeff Baxter's got it right in that respect!
    Regards
    Jeff Jansen  P&T  @ F1/10 SBP UK 

    If I were looking for an acoustic 6 string these days, I'd go audition
    a new Gibson J200. This is a jumbo thats been around for quite a long
    time. The vintage ones had quite a fine tone and then Gibson started
    screwing around with them in later years (fixing something that wasn't
    broke) and managed to screw them up. I understand that they have gone
    back to the original construction and supposedly they are quite nice.
    
    jim

>                               -< Gibson J-200 >-


I haven't checked out Gibsons lately, but Eric Schoenberg (Schoenberg guitars
are getting high praise from pro fingerstyle players) told me that he was 
considering having his line of guitars built at the Gibson factory instead of 
Martin.  

Also, an ultra-fanatic, impossible-to-please friend of mine told me that he
thinks Gibson is now making the best guitars.  He has owned dozens of vintage
Martins and has just ordered a custom Gibson.

Bob

Last I knew Martin cut out the parts for the Schoenenbergs but they were hand
assembled in Topsam maine by a guy named Dane Bourgeous (sp) who once did some
work on my strat....

dbii

>Last I knew Martin cut out the parts for the Schoenenbergs but they were hand
>assembled in Topsam maine by a guy named Dane Bourgeous (sp) who once did some
>work on my strat....

>dbii


I believe Eric told me that the guy in Maine voices the soundboard and Martin
does the assembly.  I coulda misunderstood.  Whatever, it's one helluva 
guitar.

Bob

Yeah I watched Dana voicing a soundboard one day at his  shop. Looked technical
to me.

I played one that day, nice axe!

dbii