Conference napalm::guitar

    I'm no Fender historian, but I seem to recall the Squire strat is
    made in Japan with parts left over from the time Fender was closed.
    Can somebody verify this?
    
    Anyway, I have one, and I think it plays better than the "American
    Standard Strat". The American Standard has a new design tremelo,
    and some kind of enhanced tone circuit. 

    The Squire has a "vintage" feel, ie, small boat-shaped neck, 1-5/8"
    at the nut, and a 7-1/4" radius. Plus, it has a vintage sound, (READ
    noisy).

    The only true complaint I have is with the tremelo. It's pure trash.
    The string height can't be adjusted without stripping the screws, and 
    I broke the bar after a week. You're better off replacing it.
    
    In all, it's a decent guitar for the money. 
    
    Dan

    
    I don't know what the exchange rate is, but they're going for $199
    here in L.A. I have one, and (supposedly) they are more like the
    vintage strats than anything except the "vintage" series.  I also
    heard that they discontinued the Squire line because of the less
    favorable exchange rate.
    
    Mine plays like a strat, has a beautiful finish, and the standard
    type Fender tailpiece.  Sofar I have had to replace the nut (too
    much whammy bar) with a graphite nut, and I'm going to replace the
    volume pot and maybe even rewire the sucker this weekend.
    
    I don't think they'll carry the same resale value as a regular strat,
    but they'll probably carry more value than another (like Fernandes)
    copy.
    
    For $200, I can't see anything better, if you're buying a new guitar.
    
    Ashley in smogland

    I don't own one, but I've played several Squire Strats & Squire Teles
    and was very impressed with all I played.  There was a review in Guitar
    Player quite awhile back and they rated them very highly. I especially
    liked the Squire Teles, don't know why I didn't buy one, I seemd to buy
    one of everything else at the time... 
    
    Frankly, I couldn't tell the difference between the 'real' models and
    the Squire models, except for the decal on the headstock and the price
    tag.  The real ones which I played were mostly older used models.  I
    was afraid I'd drop a new one or scratch it up or something and have to
    sell my car to pay for it.
     
    Seemed like a great guitar for the $.  I'd probably replace the
    pickups though (did on my Strat, EMG active set, absolutely maaavalous,
    Dahling).
    
    Greg

    
    I Owned a Squire Strat and traded to a JAP strat. All-in-all I liked
    the Squire with two exceptions: 1- Pickups, not quite the right
    tone, I would replace with EMG's or Duncans. 2- Tremolo, pretty
    crappy, I would replace it with your favorite trem.
    
    I like the JAP strat though, put Duncan's Hot Stacks in it, plays
    nice too.
    
    Regards,
    
    Tony

To go back to the last part of Richard's base note. Any Fender experts out there
care to give us the definitive word on the different sorts of Fenders available.
I thought that Squires were made in Korea but what about Fender Japan and then
there are USA Fenders? 

Could the Fender Squires be a marketing exercise to sell guitars with the Fender
name but without lowering the price that the mainstream models command? 

Do they have anything to do with the Fender Esquire?

Nigel Barker

    The Fender Esquire is a Telecaster with only one pickup. They
    date back to the early fifties when Fender changed the name
    Broadcaster to Telecaster. The names Esquire and Squire have no
    relationship. I have seen the name Squire on Strats, Teles, and 
    even on some of the inexpensive transistor amps that Fender is 
    selling. Building guitars in Japan is nothing new for Fender. They 
    were making acoustic guitars in Japan back in the early 70's. 
    
    I think Fender is hurting themselves with all the confusion
    about the differant models they make, and where they make them.
    I hear so many stories, that I don't know what to believe. For instance,
    I heard that their new tube amps (Twin Reverb, Showman, Champ12,
    are being made by the Sunn factory in the USA. Can anyone confirm
    this ?
    
    Mark Jacques
    

    The american standard strat is being produced right here in the
    U.S.A. They are selling for $399 and are as close to the originals
    as I have ever seen. They are really well made and have that "strat"
    sound (unlike the japanese junk they have been trying to pass off
    as a strat for so long). I guess it's like coke vs old coke and
    coke classic.
    
    Jim
    

    
    I'll take a stab at clarifying the Fender situation.
    
    Fender Japan makes :
    
    
    Squier Strats, Teles, P-Basses, and J-Basses  (Low end prices)
    
    Fender Standard Strats, Teles, P-Basses and J-Basses (Med prices)
    
    At one time : even the vintage replicas (57 etc.) but not any more
    (I think)
    
    
    
    
    Fender America makes :
    
    
    American Standard Strat (re-worked tremolo, pickups)  More $$$ than
    Japanese Fender Standard Strat.
    
    Vintage RE-issues (57 etc)
    
    High-End Strats (Strat-plus, Eric Clapton and Yngwie Malmsteem Models)
    
    
    
    
    So... In price order it looks like this:
    
    
    Squier Line - Inexpensive Strats, Teles, Basses etc.   Made in Japan
    
    
    Fender Strat Line -
    
       Fender Standard Strat      Made In Japan
       American Standard Strat    Made in USA
       Strat-Plus                 Made in USA
       Vintage Re-issues          Made in USA
       Strat Signature Models     Made in USA
       Custom Strats              Made in USA at the Custom Shop
                                  (prices vary according to your desires)
                                               
    Fender Teles, Basses
    
       Standard Models            Made in Japan
       Vintage Re-issues          Made in USA   
    
                                                    
    
    I hope this clarifies things.
    
    Tony

    Regarding the reference to Coke. Coke has suffered greatly
    since they started messing with their cola products. Just
    goes to show when you have a good thing....don't mess with it.
    
    Mark
    

    Fender now owns Sunn. It would not surprise me if they have
    consolidated their manufacturing facilities. However, I have not facts
    to back up the latter claim.
    
    	- Rick
    

    Just to keep this note going, and because I am interested in a Squire
    Strat......
    
    Is $300 for a new Squire Strat w/case a decent price?  I was told
    that the list is $399, so that makes it about 25% off list.
    
    Anymore good/bad input about the Squires?
    
    Also, there'ss a new line out called the Squire Bullet.  The dealer 
    claims it's made in Korea, and it is cheaper than the Japanese Squire,
    but he didn't seem too enthusiastic about it.  I forget what the
    price was for the Squire Strat Bullet, and I really didn't take
    a real close look either.
    
    John

    I would not advise getting a mail order guitar, unless they have
    a liberal return policy (i.e. Carvin).  But here in LA you can buy
    squires all day long for $189.  Probably w/o case.  
    
    I'm sure you can get it for a similar price wherever vous may be.

    
    re .12  or anyone else who's familiar with Squire Strat Bullets
    
    Did the Squire Strat Bullet that you saw have a 5-pointed Star on
    the headstock (was part of the name decal)?
    
    I saw a Squire with a star decal on the headstock the other day,
    but I can't remember if it said "Bullet" or not. Just trying to
    find out what it was. Cost $199. New. Rosewood Fingerboard.
    
    Mike D

    
    Yes, the Bullets usually had a star decal on them.  For $199, that
    sounds like a Bullet all right.

    

    
    re -1 ???? What do you mean? 
    
    Mike D

    re .17
    
    I wrote a note but somehow the text got lost and only
    the title came through. never mind.

    Anybody know the difference between a Squire and a Squire Bullet?
    
    I am thinking about getting a bullet for $199, new.
    
    
    
    Don

    
    A Bullet is a student guitar, there are a couple of Strat-like
    models, but it aint a Strat.  The body is a bit smaller, the headstock
    is Tele-style, the pickuyps are cheaper, only one tone, no sunken
    jack.  $199 is a reasonable price.
    
    

    
    
    An comments on Squier P Basses? How do they compare with recent
    vintage "standard" series basses with respect to quality and price?
    
    Tom
    

    

    There are no more "standard" basses except the Squiers and the
    (expensive) U.S. vintage models.  
    
    The current Precision and Jazz offerings are Japanese made, have
    no pickguards, etc.  The Squiers are at least $100 less than these.
    and probably $3-400 less than the "vintage" series. 
    
    Quality?  Current Squiers are Korean made and feel very light compared
    to the U.S. models.  Not sure what kind of wood they use.  Hardware is
    OK, but then there *was* a reason that people used to replace bridges
    and tuners on old Fenders, the parts are just stamped metal, rather
    than die-cast like most replacement parts.  Compared to most
    late-seventies U.S. made basses, I would say they are just as good.
    Compared to the mid-eighties, revitalized Fender basses like the
    Vintage and Elite series, well, do you want to save $300 or not??
    
    Just MY opinion, though, I have never been too excited about stock
    Fender basses. 
    
    BTW the current "Jazz" basses, the Contemporary Jazz and Power Jazz are
    really Precisions with an extra J-bass pickup mounted near the bridge. 

    Has anyone heard of a new "USA series" Squire Strat?  I played one at a
    local store and the guy there (who I trust) told me that these were
    made in the USA and Fender wasn't really advertising them much.

    Anyway, it was an excellent feeling guitar!  It has a slim maple neck,
    with a separate maple fretboard, medium sized frets, and a fairly flat
    radius (maybe 12" or so).  There is a satin finish on the neck, not
    that thick sticky lacquer.  The body is made of some light weight wood,
    as it felt very light.
    
    It appeared to have a nice finish and had a good tone (through a little
    GK amp) and was well set up.  The price with a case was around $350 or
    so.
    
    Anyone heard of these?
    
    Greg
                          

    Just to add a little more info to the last note.  I went back and
    checked these guitars out again last night and there is the "Made in
    USA" legand on the headstock decal.  Kind of odd a USA Squire
    instrument, but it was MUCH nicer then any of the other recent Squires
    I've played.  The early Squires were pretty nice but the ones I've seen
    the last couple of years I thought were junk.
    
    I don't think the one I looked at last night wasn't the same one I
    played the time before though because the finish wasn't as nice.  It
    was  still a very nice playing guitar.  It was light weight and
    comfortable to play.
    
    Basically I had the following nits about it.  The maple fretboard and
    neck back were not well matched as far as color went, the fretboard was
    a much lighter maple.  The body finish was just ok, it looked like they
    didn't finish buffing it out good and it had big buff scratches in it.
    The string guide tree for the E and B strings didn't have a stand on it
    so it was screwed down to the headstock making the string angle over
    the nut pretty extreme.
    
    Greg
                           

	They've now got squires and squire 2's. Mark J. can probably
	correct any inaccuracies....

	American Standard			USA
	Standard/Lite/HM			Japan
	Squire				Korea w/Assy in USA
	SquireII				Korea

	I played a "Made in USA" Squire a couple of months ago and it
	felt like a piece of cheap junk.... should become a classic.
	There was a Made in USA ElCheapo Fender bass that I pulled off
	the wall for a while that had many of the attributes that you
	described for the guitar - very light, well balanced, satin
	neck... what was it called? Gosh I can't remember & I've given
	up trying. I try 'em all cuz I can't keep track up the names
	anymore.

	ccb-a-Fender-convert-(this-week)

    
    
      Anyone tried the "Comtemporary Squire"
    
      Floyd licensed tremelo
      1 humbucker, 2 single
    
    list $379 in AMS?........
    
    
    RichC
    

    I haven't seen a USA made one, but I've seen some of the Korean made
    updated Squires.  I thought they were comperable with the normal Korean
    made Squire guitars (not that great).
    
    Greg

    Are these the Charvel/Ibanez copies with the pointy headstock ?
    I played one at Prosound and was mildly un-impressed... In the
    guitars defense, it wasn't set up properly, and I was playing thru
    a very lame Marshall model 4000somethin' ...  I thought the humbucker
    reminded me of a Seymour Duncan Invader with all the squeeling it did.
    
    That same day I played thru a Strat+ and it had a HipShot trem-
    setter doo hickey.   It was rather annoying since it had a very
    tangable "click" to it's action.  Anyone else notice this ?
    
    jc
                                                                          

    
    
    re: .26
    
    	I don't think it's a USA model. I'll check the catalog when 
    I get home tonight.
    
    

    
    
      No pointy headstock. Looks like a strat one.
    
    
    RichC
    

    I've noticed that the Squires are generally lighter instruments. Why,
    my American Standard Strat weighs almost as much as a Twin!

    I've noticed a difference in weights too.  I played a Silver
    Anniversary strat for a while and it was VERY heavy compared to my
    American Standard !  Sounded a lot richer too ....
    
    Scary

    
    
    Any comments on the current Squier "standard" series basses?
    (not the Squier II's). 
    
    Are they Korean? Japanese?
    
    The reason I'm asking is that I'm looking for a finished P-bass
    body w/hardware/pickguard and electronics to stick by favorite
    bass neck on. This could be a fairly cheap way to do that. 
    
    
    

	Maybe Mark J. can help out on this.

	As I understand it, it goes like this:


	Series					Origin
	==================================================
	SquireII				Korean
	Squire					US assy, Asian parts
	Standard				Japan
	American Standard			USA

    I'm not up on Squires that much. All I know is it says on the Headstock
    where each instrument is made. One of the guys in the band I'm playing
    with has four Squires. Two are Teles (one blonde, one black) one is
    a black Strat, and the other is a Squire P-bass. I believe all of his
    Squires are made in Korea. He complained of cheap pots and jacks and
    replaced all of em. I haven't seen the P-Bass, but he claims he loves
    it. His main axe is the Blonde Tele. You should hear this thing through
    his Vox AC30. Apparently the pickups in the Blonde one are wound
    differantly than the black one as it has a much bighter sound.
     
    The Fender imports I like best are the 50's series and 60's series
    instruments. These are so close to the USA vintage series, it's 
    hard to justify the added expense for the USA instrument. I've seen
    50's series Teles and Strats, and 60's series Teles, Strats, and
    Jazz Basses. All were nice and under $500. Fender also makes a
    re-issued 62 Telecaster custom which is only made in Japan. Apparently,
    Fender didn't want to bother setting up the equipment for doing binding
    in the USA plant. 
    
    I'm planning to save my money and wait a few years until people start
    selling off their reissued guitars and amps. Then I'll pick up a
    Bassman re-issue, a Tele Thinline reissue, a 62 Custom reissue, and
    maybe one of them '57 Shorline gold Strat reissues. Can't get enough
    Fender benders.
    
    Mark
    

    I've thought about getting a Squire Tele and changing the pickups,
    provided I could get a steal on one.  I need another guitar like a hole
    in the head.   8^)
    
    Scary (who's got a Marshall 4x12 that he'll probably NEVER use again ..)

Anyone have any idea what a fair price for a used Japanese 
Squier P-bass is? Assuming excellent condition.

My guess is around $225. Am I close? 

Also, any idea what book value for one of these is? 

Tom
(who's taking a look at one this friday and wants to be armed.)

       
       
       
       
       
       Is there any truth to the rumor I've been hearing lately that the
       imported units' bodies are made from particle board with some
       real wood laminated over?  I can't really believe this, but maybe
       someone's noticed while swapping pickups or something?
       
       
       
       
       

    I just talked to a dealer about these instruments at lunchtime today
    and he said that they are laminated bodys, like plywood, but he didn't
    say anything about particle board.  This is an honest guy and a friend
    and I think he would have told me.
    
    BTW, I don't know if anyone's mentioned it, but the Squire p-basses
    with the rosewood fretboards are made in India, not Korea like the rest
    of them.
    
    Greg

	You can get some mid-80s Japanese made Fenders for $200. Like
	that nasty looking red Jazz Bass...

re:  .-2
	The Squier Korean models are going for $197-$225 new, 
	a little less for a Squier II .

	The older (discontinued) Japanese Squier P-basses are going
	for about the same used. 

	IMHO,  The Japanese Squiers are the same quality recent vintage
	Fender labelled "standard" (Japanese) Basses. It wouldn't suprise
	me a bit if the old Squier factory is cranking out Fender labelled
	guitars and basses. 

	Since the Squiers don't hold their value as well, as "genuine
	Fenders" , they represent  a pretty good value, when you can 
	find one.  


re:.-1

	I think it's pretty rare to find a Japanese labelled Fender  for
	so cheap. Fender  products seem to hold their value quite 
	well, whether justified or not... Of course the bass your
	talking about was a pretty terrible color (IMHO, I *hate*
	metalflake  finishes!)

    
    Does anyone have any "history" type data on Fender Squier series 
    instruments?
    
    I recently bought a Japanese Squier P-bass, which in all respects
    is *identical* to a Fender P-bass, except that the serial number
    is on the neck plate rather than the headstock. It's a full 34"
    scale, large headstock, large shaft tuners, etc. It also sports
    a 3 color sunburst finish. 
    
    I dropped by my favorite music store the other day and saw another
    Japanese Squier P-bass. This bass was a lot different than mine:
    
    	- 32" scale
    	- Smaller headstock
    	- Serial number on headstock
    	- Smaller shafts on the tuners
    	- Fender logo was silver, no gold colored, like mine. 
    
    FWIW, they also had a Squier J-bass which looked about the same. 
    
    Does anybody know which bass is older? I suspect that my bass is
    an earlier issue, since it's 'burst finish and I believe more
    recent issue Squiers only come in black or white. 
    
    Anybody know the truth? 
    
    -Tom

    The short scale (32") Squiers are definitely newer then the original
    Squiers.
    
    The earliest Squiers sold in the US came in three flavors, Strat, Tele
    and P-Bass only, about 1984.  Construction was similar to early 80s US
    models.
    
    Shortly after CBS dropped the company, 32" scale P-basses and Bullets
    were introduced, including some Japanese Fender (not Squire) Precision
    Standards.  These seem to have disappeared a few years ago (I believe
    all current models in the catalog are 34").  Bullets with 30" scale
    were also made.
    
    						Brian

    I just bought an early 80's Squire Strat to add to my collection. Price
    $200.  It had a few minor scuffs and dings nothing really obvious and
    for an honest evaluation.....
    
    	Neck..... Well I really like the neck. I kad a friend with a
    reissue Strat and to be honest I like the feel of this neck far more
    than the feel of his guitars. It's not to thick and not to fat. I like
    the neck on my Charvel much more but hey....
    
    	Pickups... Again I actually enjoy the sound of these pickups. I
    A/B'd them with an American Standard and really felt they had more
    punch and bottom end than the stock p-ups on the American Standard.
    Nice tone actually.
    
    	Action... Needed to be lowered big time, but It came down quite
    well w/out any BUZZZ thank you.
    
    
    	Generally I really like the guitar. It won't become my main axe but
    if I ever need that fender sound and I want to play a halfway decent
    guitar guitar at the same time I bought one that can meet those needs.
    If your looking for an low price alternative to a Fender Strat these
    are damn nice guitars for the buckage.
    
    Brian

    
    	My friend (Alan Nichols) has a Squire and it has a real silky
    	neck.  He likes it better than mine (Am Std Strat) too, and 
    	I can see why although I like mine just fine.  His seems a bit
    	thinner and smoother.  Both are maple.

     I just bought a Squire II ( made in Korea ) and I,m happy with it.
     it's a very light guitar , witch is a plus in terms of playing for
     long periods of time. The price was/is $199 and in the lead position
     (bridge pickup) , It gets the strat sound convincingly enough. For not
      alot of money , this is a h*ll of an axe.
    
     Gonzo

    
    Had the opportunity to compare a Squier Strat and My (JAP) Fender
    Strat over the whole weekend in the privacy of my house.
    
    The Squier Strat is most definitely lighter than a Japanese made Fender
    Strat. No question. So, this seems to explode a myth that Japanese
    Fender Strats are just rebadged Squiers.
    
    Necks had subtly different profiles. Felt the Squier was more square
    than the Fender. Could just be the different vintage Fenders they were
    modelled after.
    
    They certainly both sounded much the same although I felt the Squier
    lacked a bit of top end sustain (but this may be just the strings, in
    fact I would say it was).
    
    Apart from this (and of course the lack of a FENDER logo!!!) really not
    a lot to choose.
    
    Richard

>    The Squier Strat is most definitely lighter than a Japanese made Fender
>    Strat. No question. So, this seems to explode a myth that Japanese
>    Fender Strats are just rebadged Squiers.
    
    Actually, all the current Squire instruments are made in either Taiwan
    or Mexico (I think).  The original Squire line were made in Japan and
    were nicer instruments then the current Squire lot.  Fender  dropped
    this line and subsequently added the Japanese made "Fender" labeled
    instruments, hense the story that these were relabled Squires.  
    
    I have played the Japanese Squires and the Japanese made Fenders, and I 
    could easily believe that they are the same instruments.  Not the same
    as the current set of Squire instruments though.
    
    Greg

    I've seen Squiers made in India recently.  
    
    						Brian

   I just noticed that the new Squires are doing an illusion act on their 
headstocks....   In the area that used to have the "Contoured" headstock
logo (at least on the Amer. guitars), that they have put the name "Squire"
in that location.
   The "squire" name is reduced in size so it's not really noticeable and
they now have the product name  in it's usual place ie; Precision Bass, 
Stratocaster, etc...


Almost faked me out!

    /J

    Yeah, what used to be "Squier" is now "Fender Squier Series" and "Squier
    II" (el cheapo) is now just "Squier".  Good luck for people dealing in 
    the used market after the original owbner removes the "made in XXXX"
    decals....
    
    Prices seem to be about the same.
    
    							Brian

    Brian,

    Right. Very confusing indeed. Maybe the serial numbers would help if
    there are different prefixes. If anyone knows how to decipher the newer
    products' serial numbers, this would be a good place to post them.

    --Ron

    I just did the whole Squire/Fender telecaster series thing before
    Christmas. Here's what I found. (Apart from the fact that you US boys
    get as much guitar for a $ as we get for a �. 
    
    Frontline music in Ayr Scotland, I see that I can get a new Korean
    Squire Telecaster or Strat for about �150. Thinking that this is
    probably less than the net present value which I spent on a complete
    wreck of a used Kay copy when I was 14, I was overjoyed and was busy
    asking about what colors Santa could get me it in, when the salesman 
    lost the sale. 
    
    "What about this special deal on a 2nd Quality Mexican Tele for only
    �200?"
    
    Before I had left the shop, I had tried every tele in it. 
    
    Models: 
    New Korean Squire Telecaster: only �150! 
    	This played very nimbly, had a nice slim neck, but a slightly
    	rough  and jagged tone. The body was particularly slimmer than all
    	other models I tried and the finish was a little un refined.
    	Machine heads were cheap pressed steel type - yuck! Over all - not 
    	quite a Fender, but a very respectable guitar at that price. 
    
    Japanese Squire Telecaster: ~ �200
    	Now we're talking. Nice paint finishes, tidier edges on the neck
    	and finishing on the frets; a standard width body and a slightly
    	more mellowed tone and decent machines - Gotohs or Grovers I think. 
    	It didn't appear to play as fast as the Korean model - perhaps the 
    	sharper edge of the Korean's tone encouraged a looser, faster style - 
    	- I don't know, but this guitar made me	realise that all the guitars 
    	were not the same save for the 'made in' badges. 
    
    Mexican 2nd Qty Fender Squier-I think-Telecaster: �200,typically~�250
    	Not a lot to distinguish from the Japper, except for a slightly
    	more delecate finish on the woodwork, a very white maple wood neck,
    	and a lovely cherry lipstick red paintjob. The only problem was
    	with a thubmsized blemish in the paint, only visible in some
    	lights, and generally would be hidden by your wrist, but there all 
    	the same. But most important of all, it said FENDER in BIG letters
    	on the headstock. I nearly bought it. 
    
    USA Fender Tele (classic heritage-or something like that) �300ish -cant
    remember exactly 'cos I didn't have that budget and just wanted a
    comparison with the 'real' thing.
    	Smooooooooth! 
    	More mellow and not as jagged as the rest. Finishing - all there. 
    	The neck was by comparison, to the others, a tree trunk, and made
    	of a much more yellowish wood - I didn't ask which, but is still
    	quite pleasant and typical of old Fenders - I'm told. If you want 
    	a richer tone, you will love this one and soon get used to the
    	broader left hand reach. 
    
    I left the shop in confusion and hit the city (Glasgow) the next weekend 
    to see if I could improve on the pricing. Nothing much was doing,
    until I found one new and one second hand -old model- Korean Tele.
    
    Korean(old model)Squier Telecaster. new: �185 (McCormacks aren't
    normally the cheapest) 2nd hand (with plywood case ad a bit of
    haggling): �175. 
    	This appeared essentially to be the same spec as the new Japanese
    	models, with full size bodies and nice paint finishes. The 2nd hand 
    	one appeared better set up and a bit more lively - and it had a
    	lovely semi-opaque butterscotch paint job. One disappointment was
    	that the chrome had not lasted well on control plate and machines,
    	and the pots switch and socket all needed contact cleaned. (and it
    	still said 'fender' - in little letters however)
    
    I bought the 2nd hand Korean butterscotch and I absolutely lurve it!
    Through my Session Rockette amp and Boss Chorus - when needed, it's
    bright, its mellow, its, raunchy, it's crunchy, it's bubbly - its
    amazing how much you lost by adding another pickup to make the strat Leo! 
    - but each has thier own taste. 
    
    Hope this helps rather than confuses. 
    
    Raymond_look_out_kieth_richards_Kirk. 
    

    I too have my eyes open for a Squier Strat or Telecaster. Now I know
    that this topic has been covered umpteen times in this note (and
    elsewhere), and that 608.53 contains a lot of useful information, but:
    
    Can anyone give an UPDATED view of the Squier situation from a 
    value-for-money point of view? I've seen a Squier Strat at a very good
    price but I didn't have time to give it the once over, let alone play
    it. Since the Fender product line seems to change on a weekly basis,
    I'd like to know your impressions as to what is worth buying and what
    isn't, for example:
    
    - Do ALL Squiers have plywood bodies?
    - Should the Squier II be avoided like the plague?
    - What are the relative merits of Squier Strats and Teles that are made
      in Korea/Japan/Mexico/India ?
    
    Sorry if this issue is boring people to tears but I HAVE read
    everything relevant in this conference...and I'm more confused than
    ever?
    
    Sincere thanks,
    
    Dom
    

    re: Dom
    
    I can't answer all your questions, but the basic thing I've observed
    with all the Squires has been inconsistancy.  Some of them are
    excellent playing and sounding guitars and some are utter trash.  Every
    Squire II I've ever tried has fallen into the latter category, but
    after the first few, I quit bothering, so there might be some good ones
    in there.
    
    Not all the Squires have laminate (plywood) bodies.  I'm not sure which
    ones do, and I'm not sure how to tell the difference, but I'm pretty
    sure that none of the early Squires made in Japan didn't.  A lot of
    those were really nice guitars.  I *think*, but could be wrong, that
    all (or most) the Squire IIs have laminate bodies.
    
    The bottom line for me would be, if the guitar played well and felt
    good to me, and it was a good buy, I'd probably get it.  If not, I'd
    pass.  Try a lot of them, there are some good ones out there.
    
    Greg

    
    
    	A good friend of mine bought the 'Wayne's World' squier strat
    around Christmas last year and is very happy with it. I can't vouche
    for the quality of his information, but he said he researched it, and 
    found that this particular model of the Squire was of better quality
    than others. He has replaced the stock pickups with Duncan's though,
    adding more $$$ to the cost of the axe.
    
    John

    Well, I had a better look at that Squier Strat on Saturday.
    Unfortunately, it was only a look because I was in a real hurry and I
    didn't feel like asking the guy to set it up for me when I only had
    five minutes to spare. There was no sales literature available either.
    
    Anyway, the price was about $295 (this is a rough conversion from lire
    - I'm in Italy, by the way!). It's brand new, jet black with a white
    pickguard, made in Japan and has Fender Squier Stratocaster written on the 
    headstock. And that's about it; I can't say anything else until I've
    played it, which is always the acid test anyway. I guess it's proof that 
    new Squier Strats are being made in Japan (as well as India, Korea, 
    etc.??).
     
    The shop also had new standard Fender Strats and Teles (both made in
    USA) selling at $710 and a nice-looking Jerry Donahue-endorsed Telecaster 
    at $2100 (I think I'll stick to looking at that!). 
    
    Here's hoping the quality of Japanese Squiers is as good as it was a
    few years ago, because that's what I've got my eye on.
    
    Dom

    There is also a japanese made Jerry Donahue Tele which is significantly
    less than the custom shop version. It is quite affordable and has
    gotten good reviews. This tele has a five position switch and is 
    reported to have some strat sounds as well as tele sounds.
    

Well I picked up a Waynes World Squire Strat the other day.

The electronics are so-so, The body is fairly light, but the 
neck is incredible. I talked to one of the factory reps and I 
guess the majority of the manufacturing costs go into the neck. 

I actually like the way this guitar plays, real low action, no
fret buzz and a smoooooth unfinished maple neck with rosewood 
fretboard. It's a very comfortable guitar.

I'm not sure which year Strat this was suppose to be modeled after 
but in my opinion it's a damn fine instrument for $239 BRAND NEW
including gigbag. 

For the price, I would highly recomment one of these guitars over 
one of the Korean Made Squire II's. Once again each guitar is
different. I've never liked most of the Squire guitars, but this
W.W. Strat really played well for me.


Happy Shopin'

Brian

    Hey Brian, do the stickers come off?
    
    Greg

Geezzzzze Greg...

I'll bet a little Goo-Gone would get the stickers right off. Then I'd have to
replace the Waynes World special edition Neck plate. 

Weekend project.....

Actually I am planning on changing pickups and getting Spretzels (sp?). It's a
lot easier to make many smaller investments than 1 large one (at least with
my wife it is.  ;^) 


Brian

    Going back to the issue of plywood bodies on Squiers, are they to be
    considered a definite "minus" in terms of quality? I can appreciate
    that they'd be more vulnerable to wear n' tear, but I would have
    thought that apart from this, the lighter the body the better.
    Likewise, I've often thought the same thing about the issue of 
    rosewood vs. maple necks on Fenders - is it just a question of appearance 
    or what? 
       
    Incidentally, I was playing an American Strat Standard during the
    lunch-hour today and I asked the sales assistant a few questions. He
    said that they don't stock Squiers because they think that Fender
    guitars are American - period. He went on to say that Ibanez and
    Washburn make mid-price guitars that have a better cost-quality
    relationship than Strat Squiers, even if the latter cost slightly less.
    
    Friendly and informative as he was, he didn't totally convince me. I
    don't know, it seems that so many shops nowadays seem to cater more for
    the heavy metal kids. The salesmen are in love with Charvel, Ibanez and the
    like and can't understand why anyone should want to buy a Strat or -
    saints alive! - a Telecaster. 
    
    Just my very naive opinion,
    
    Dom   

> He went on to say that Ibanez and
>    Washburn make mid-price guitars that have a better cost-quality
>    relationship than Strat Squiers, even if the latter cost slightly less.
 
    A friend of mine who managed a music store told me the same thing...and
    he sold the Squires.  He said the quality on them was far inferior to
    the Ibanez EX series models which they were selling for a similar
    price.  And he wasn't a kid, and wasn't into heavy metal, he's probably
    around 40 and had a passion for the blues.  He can certainly appreciate
    a good Tele or Strat, but also a good value.
    
    Greg

   - RE; Plywood bodies:    There *are* good sounding plywood bodies out
there! It all depends on the wood and how well they're laminated. You just
have to try a few hundred of them to really know....

   

Junior Buggy Whip

    ES-335/345/355s all have laminated tops and backs; most ES-175s
    too I believe.

    I'm told that the NON-Squires (Fenders that are made in Japan) are 
manufacured in the Ibenez factory! My significant other found out from
one of the Fender reps who is part owner. I hope that this is not old news -
it's new news for me...

/J

    Went shopping with my nephew at the weekend to 'advise' him on a guitar 
    to get as an 18th birthday present from his parents. Found a lot of 
    mediocrity in his price range around the stores, but then came across a 
    used Squire Telecaster, about 3 years old, and in excellent condition. It 
    is a Korean made, butterscotch finish with a gloss varnish maple neck (much
    nicer than the 'satin' varnish of the Squire IIs). It plays really
    nicely with a good action, and has a wonderful tone. Neck pickup in 
    particular gives a beautiful bluesy sound, quite mellow. We even got a
    good deal on it for cash !
    
    Had a slight 'funny' with a small practise amp we got with it though.
    On getting the guitar and amp home we found that the speaker was making
    a kind of buzzing/tearing sound (flatulence sound :-) ) when lower
    frequency notes were played, but this went away on higher frequencies.
    It sounded like a torn speaker cone, but after re-stringing the guitar
    and lowering the bridge pickup height, the sound seemed to go away.
    
    I don't think the strings were physically touching the pickup, even
    when vibrating (no nasty buzzes when played unplugged) but it was
    certainly set too high.
    
    Could pickup height have caused the sort of sound I described ?
    
    Pete
    
      

    
    Buzzing with lower frequencies? If you heard it with one of the three
    lower strings, it was possibly loose windings on one of the wounded
    strings, that is, when these strings get worn out, the windings often
    come loose ----> trash it and put on new strings.
    
    Poul
    

    
    Friend of mine had a similar problem on a Squier Strat. Turned out that
    the slots in the nut where too big and the G, B and E strings were
    vibrating when played open. So, if the sound only occurs on open
    strings try looking at this.
    
    Richard

    No, the erroneous noise happened even when playing bar chords, but only
    when the lower strings were played. The tone/pitch of the noise was
    always the same, which is what made me think it was a fault with the
    speaker cone. It seems to have gone for now - I hope it doesn't come
    back. Looks like either new strings or lowering the pickup fixed it.
    
    Pete