Conference napalm::guitar

    Larry,
    
    	I played a Rockbloc the other day.  Expensive, but what a sound!
    It comes with a built-in chorus, flange and digital delay as well
    as the distortion.  It sounded to me like the old Vox amps that
    Brian May (Queen) uses.  There's a couple of places for a foot-
    switch (reverb,delay,channel switch...)  I really liked it, but
    didn't want to pay the $800 they were asking for a 1-12 amp.
    Certainly a lot of thought went into the design and the thing
    looks like it's built to last.   I didn't use the amp in a gig 
    situation, but it sounded pretty good in the store.   Good luck,
    
    	Ted

    
    Traynor amps have been built by a company in Canada called Yorkville
    Sound.  Recently they appear to be changing from the Traynor brand
    name to "YS".
    
    I own two Traynor bass amps and find them to be very reliable. 
    Low resale value, if that's important.  
    
    

    Larry,
    
    	Are you in the market for a new amp now ? I am. Is your GK 
    giving you more greif? I bought a Gallien Krueger 2000cpl preamp
    in January, but returned it after experimenting with it for a few
    weeks. I couldn't get used to the sound of it, and couldn't get
    the sounds I want out of it. I would like be able to get sounds
    ranging from clean country sting like Duanne Allman used to gritty 
    Beck style distortion to a Carlos Santana Feedback effect. I am not 
    interested in playing Heavy Metal, but I would like to get distortion
    effects like ZZ top uses, or like George Thoroughgood uses. Problem 
    is what amp is going to give so many differant sounds ? A lot of
    companies claim to be able to do just that, but no one has really
    nailed it down as well as they claim. Seymour Duncans "Convertables"
    are designed to be the most versitile tube amp you can buy, and I am
    sure they are very versitile, but the modules are not designed for 
    quick or frequent changes at all. These amps use edge connectors, so you
    can imagine the potential long term reliabilty problems.
    
    	Is the Rock Block amp solid state or tube ? I believe it is
    Solid State. You should look into the Carvin X series amps. You
    mentioned that you were happy with the Carvin Power amp you use
    with your band. The problem is where can you demo Carvin Products.
    
    You should also check out some of the industry standard tube amps 
    like Mesa Boogie, Marshall Jubilee, New Twin Reverb**. You can't beat 
    tubes for sound. If reliability is a big concern, most of these amps are
    pretty reliable. None of the Transistorised amps on the market have
    a perfect track record iether, especially GK. One thing about tube
    amps that can iether be an advantage or disadvantage (depending
    on your playing style) is that with a tube amp, if you place the
    amp so that your pickups are right in the perfect position, you
    can get a real ballsy feedback effect, which you can control simply
    by turning slightly away from the amp (ala le Carlos Santana effect).
    Out of all the amps that I have demoed in the past six months the
    two I liked the best were the Fender Twin (don't underestimate this
    amp until you hear it), and a Marshall Jubilee Stack. I haven't
    checked out Mesa Boogies yet. I am almost afraid to. I couldn't stand
    the sticker shock, or the thought that I might fall in love with an
    amp that I can't afford.  I have my eye on an abscure Fender amp
    head (Fender 75). It is of course all tube, has channel switching,
    an effects loop, overdrive channel, and a 6 spring reverb. I think
    I can pick it up for 250-300. Groove tube makes a full range of
    tubes ranging from #1 soft to #10 hard, so you can make a tube amp
    sound cleaner or dirtier, to suit you taste.
    
    	Enough ramblin for now. What was the original question anyways?
        
    Mark Jacques
    
    

    Sorry if I rambled on that last night. Notice the time. It was late
    and I was computing while under the influence.
    
    Mark
    

    It sounds like it has some great features. The 3 channel operation
    reminds me of one of the Mesa Boogie models. The mesa has 3 channels,
    one for clean, one for crunch rhythm, and one for lead. It doen't have any
    built-in effects though, other than reverb and Graphic EQ (both
    optional). You could never touch this amp for $800 though.
    
    The more I look at amps, the more I realize how much the amplifier
    effects your sound. I decided a long time ago that my old Twin
    Reverb don't cut it. At bare minimum, I need an amp with channel
    switching, a good clean channel, and a great distortion channel.
    The little 15-30 watt amps don't cut it either. I need at least
    50 watts. I also find that solid state amps do not put out the same
    sound pressure levels as tube amps. If your compare a 100w tube
    amp with a 100w solid state amp, in most cases the tube amp will
    drown out the solid state amp (considering comparable speakers in
    both amps). When I demoed the Gallien Kruger 250ML (with an external
    speaker cab with EVM's in it), I was dissipointed that the amp didn't
    play very loud even when cranked to the gills. Theoretically these
    amps have 100watts (2x50w), but most 100 watt tube amps blow them
    off the face of the earth as far as raw power and developed SPL.
    
    It seems like a never-ending quest...the search for the ultamate
    sound. 
    
    Mark

    
    RE -1
    
    yeah, but you have to remember that the Gks have that built in
    compression, hence them not sounding as loud because they have no
    real transients.
    
    Then you have the english amps that are underrated watt wise. i
    had a 30WT Hiwatt for a while that sounded like anyones 100WT
    music man (or 130wt fender twin)!
    
    tubes have more balls!
    
    

    	I don't believe 50 watts on the left and 50 watts on the right
    equates to 100 watts total,I think it is still 50 watts......
    	
    

    I am not sure whether I agree with your thinking or not.
    If two speakers are wired together in parellel (which is the
    case on my Twin Reverb), the circuit is acting like a current
    divider. If the speakers are the same impedence, the current will
    divide in half. If you pump 100 watts into this circuit, you will
    dissipate 50 watts in each speaker. How does that differ from a
    stereo setup with 50 watts/side, other than the fact that stereo
    effects will send differant signals to each side. If a stereo
    effect is panning back and fourth from one side to another, then
    I can see where you would only hear the results from 1 of the 50
    watt amps at one point in time, as apposed to having the same mono
    signal coming from both speakers simultaneously.
    
    	I don't mean to start an argument over this point, but I would
    like to understand your reasoning a little better.
    
    	Mark Jacques
    

    
    	Alot of good points Mark and I won't argue about this but perhaps
someone in this conference can discuss this theoretically....? 
	A Fender Twin is a Class B Push/Pull amplifier capable of 80
to 100 watts depending on line voltage,power supply sag,preamp gain
and speaker load in mono......Push pull on each side of the waveform/signal.
right.... This Fender should blow a Gk off the stage in volume/db's if they
have the same speakers.....and the twin is performaning to optimal conditions.
it is a mono amp.(but could be stereoized) 
	A GK 250ml or Rl has a stereo Power amp with left and right signals
going to each power amp and speaker. I do not believe it has the capabilities
of going stereo to mono when effects are not in use. Each power section is 
isolated from each other. and identical in parts and design. Each having 50 
watts per side into a specified impedance.(8 ohms?)and 50 watts only...

	Now who can clear this up for us? Should this all be related
    to Decibels?
	What do you think Mark? 

    
    Thoery sez that it takes twice the wattage to increase amplitude.
    
    If you have 50wts, you need 100wts to get a 3bd increase in volume.
    ie - 75wts is no louder than 50wts.
    
    wjb

    or....

    If you have 50wts, you need a 50wt Marshall to get an increase in
    volume :-)

    
    OK, quick math....
    
    first, using current
    
    P = I*2 x R
    
    100 watts = I*2 x 4 ohms so I = 5 amps
    
    50 watts = I*2 x 8 ohms so I =2.5 amps
    
    now using voltage
    
    P = V*2/R
    
    100 watts = V*2 / 4 ohms  so V = 20 volts
    
    50 watts = V*2 / 8 ohms so V = 20 volts
    
    So if we have a 100 watt amp running a 4 ohm load vs. two 8 ohms
    loads each driven by 50 watts....
    
    In the 100 watt case, each driver gets half the current (2.5 amps)
    and all the voltage (20 volts) if wired in parallel.
    
    P = V x I = 20 x 2.5 = 50 watts
    
    In the 50 watt case, each driver gets 20 volts at 2.5 amps
    
    P = V x I = 20 x 2.5 = 50 watts
    
    So either way each speaker gets 50 watts.
    
    Assuming we use the same cabinet for both situations (assume we
    can wire the speakers up either way) in *theory* the speakers will
    output the same in both configurations.
    
    
    

    	Thank you  Dr. Rost...:^) So essentially we have a 100
    watt twin which is only really putting out 50 watts and a Solid
    state amp which has 2 50 watt amps putting out 50watts.
    
    						Rick
    

    
    Re: .14
    
    No, no ,no....
    
    The numbers were for *each* speaker...not *both* speakers....
   
    The point is that if you take two speakers, of 8 ohms each, and
    hook them in parallel to a 100 watt amp, each speaker dissipates
    50 watts.
    
    Now if you hook each speaker *by itself* to a 50 watt amp and feed both
    50 watt amps the same signal, you should, in theory get the same output
    as you did with the single 100 watt amp, with each speaker dissipating
    50 watts. 
    
    What's so confusing about that???  50 + 50 = 100 where I went to school
    8^)  8^)  8^) 
    
    
   

    	Brian, the point of this is not to start another rathole
    but I really feel that this all can be very misleading when
    trying to compare apples to apples. And perhaps a the twin
    example is also misleading. My point was that a mono amp of
    100 watts does not equal a stereo amp of 50 watts,however I
    do understand ohms law.....and speaker loads effect this I
    realize... 
    
    						Just trying to help
    
    							  Rick
    

    Larry,
    
    	I understand that you are currently using the GK head with
    a Marshall 2x12 cab. Why don't you sell the GK, and get another
    head, rather than sell the whole kit, and get a combo. The cab
    you have is a great cab, and with the right head can really crank.
    There are people that would KILL for a cab like yours.
    I think your main problem is the GK doesn't have the overhead
    to drive your speakers hard enough, especially when using compression.
    With the right head, you should be able to produce enough volume,
    so that you wouldn't have to mic or patch your amp into the PA.
    
    	I picked up the Want Advertiser this weekend. There are a few
    interesting items in there. One that caught my eye the most was
    a guy selling a 1953 Les Paul Gold Top for $850, and a 1978 Marshall
    50w combo for $525. I wouldn't mind taking both pieces off his hands.
    There is also a guy in Shrewsbury selling a Fender Super Champ for
    $255. These little amps are great for recording, or practicing.
    
    Mark J.