Conference napalm::guitar

    
    These types of chords are also known as suspension chords, since
    a major fourth or other interval is suspended within the chord 
    voicing. If you were around during the sixties folk/rock era,
    you must remember the hundreds of popular songs that were based
    on the "Pedal Point" technique. They would start with a major
    chord, suspend the fourth note above the major third, then drop
    down to the second below the major third. Heres a good example
    which centers around the open A chord.
    
    	====== nut 	====== nut 	====o= nut
                              	
    	------          ------          ------
    	  234             23              23
    	------          ------          ------
                            4
    	------		------          ------
    	open A chord    A/Dsus          A/Bsus
    
    Heres an example in open D
    
    	======      	======        	=====o (open)
    	
    	------          ------          ------
    	   111 bar         111 bar         1
    	------          ------          ------
    	    2               23              2
    	------          ------          ------
    	open d chord    D/Gsus          D/Esus
    
    
    
    	There were litterally hundreds of songs done in open A or D
    using this method. If I need to do this in the key of E, I would
    use a capo on the second fret, and play it as if it were in open D.
    It's tough to do this with bar chords but if you play a four note
    major chord (non barred), you can do this anywhere on the neck.
    A few examples of songs that use this were "Mr Tamborine Man",and
    "Needles And Pins". Many of them were done on 12 string guitar which 
    gave them a real big full sound.      
                              
    You don't usually  hear anyone play suspension chords with the
    suspended notes in the bass registers, but it is ocasionally done.
    A good reference for understanding chord positions is a book called 
    something like "The guitarists picture chord book" which gives chords 
    in standard notation along with a closeup photo of a person playing 
    the chord. I have this book at home and find it quite helpful when 
    reading sheet music. It is also helpful if you are arranging,
    composing, or just trying to learn new chords.
    
    I hope this helps !!!
    
    Mark J.
    
    
    Hey Mr Tamborine Man, play a song for me, I'm not sleepy and there
    is no place I'm going to....twang,twang,twang,twang...........
                                               

    
    While it's true that an E major chord with the A addded is a sus4,
    I always thought that E/A meant an E major chord with the A added
    as the *bottom* note....
    
    I.e. if you had a bass player, he would play an A under that chord
    instead of an E.  If you just wanted Esus4, it would be so notated.
    
    

    Since I am a bass player,and I dont read,I always used it as a
    bass note.
    
    			/tomg

    .2 & .3 are correct...and most times you don't have to sacrifice
    any tones of the chord...I can think of quite a few ways of playing
    an E triad with an A on the bottom. Even with the example you gave,
    playing an E in the first postition, using an open A, you take care
    of the fifth (B) with the open 2nd string.
     
     Most pianists notate charts like this, maybe because their instrument
    is alot more visual than ours. I've seen alot of A/B, when it could
    have been A11th, but that could spawn a whole new discussion on
    what name to give a chord, as in most cases there is more than one.
    like G13 #11 could also be C# 7th #9/G (bass)??? (food for thought)
    

    
    .2, .3, & .4 are correct in their analysis of E/A in which A (or
    the second note of the two) is to be played as the bass bote.
    
    If reference to a question like E/B, where B is already included
    in a E chord (be it major or minor), it is then suggesting a specific
    inversion of E to be played.  E/B is E is with the 5th scale degree
    in the bass (second inversion).  You might also see E/G# which would 
    be E Major with the 3rd degree in the bass (first inversion).  E/G
    would be E Minor with the b3rd degree in the bass.
    
    A typical example of E/G# you might recognize is the final E chord
    in `A Day in the Life' by the Beatles.  It's a very recognizable
    sound.
    
    wjb

    A/B is also occasionally notated as A/II.

>    I've seen alot of A/B, when it could have been A11th, 
    
    I think you meant A9 right?  But actually you really meant A add9
    (sometimes spelled A+9).
    
    Not that I want to start another name that chord debate but Asus4, A11 
    and A+11 are three different chords.  They each imply a distinct
    set of notes.
    
    	db

    > I think you meant A9 right?  But actually you really meant A add9
      (sometimes spelled A+9).
    
    No, I meant A11th...analysis... A/B, an A triad over B bass, A triad
    being A, C#, E, the A is the dominant 7th, C# is the 9th, and E
    is the 11th in relationship to B...now it might not be the best
    voicing of an 11th chord seeing how I've omited the 3rd and the
    5th tones, but that's a common thing with guitar players...6 strings
    and five fingers and whatnot (10 if you're Holdsworth... ;-)
    

    
    No 3rd, well that's stretching things a bit far, even from jazz
    standards.

    
    Re: .7
    
    Sorry, Jeff, but while you have indeed described an 11th chord,
    the root is *B* not A, since as you pointed out, the A is the dominant
    7th, etc.  
    
    So at best it would be a B11.....
    
    But the point of notating A/B is so you *don't* play the F# or D#
    that would be the 5th and 3rd of a B chord.
    
    

    Sorry, my mistake...I did mean B11th beacuse I was describing the
    tones in relationship to the B major scale...just got them mixed
    up. (B/A...A/B)
    

    Sorry Brian...;-)
    you have me,and my more musically knowledgeble brother confused.

    But I thought it was a simple question!
    
    Richard
    
    Thanks for the input, I will print off and analyse accordingly.

    Funny about leaving out thirds.  It used to be that when working
    out arrangements I could just look at the keyboard player and he'd
    go "yeah, ok Dave, I know - leave out the third".
    
    It just always seemed to me that most chord voicings in which the
    third appeared more than once didn't sound right.  You can double,
    triple or quadruple the root or the fifth and it still sounds
    cool, but double the third and it usually sounds "busy".
    
	db

    
    re: .14
    
    Doubling the thrid always works in traditional counterpoint,
    better than fifths and roots.
    
    To me, a tension really isn't a tension unless the third is in the
    chord.  Like, for instance, play A and G say that sounds like a
    dominant 7th, but C# and G and there's no question.  Same with ninths
    and 11s.                                          
    
    Maybe just this persons view,
    
    wjb

    I almost never leave out the third.  I usually told the keyboard
    player that when he was supposed to be lurking in the background.
    
    To my ears, whenever he played a third, particularly as part of
    a compact triad it brought the keyboards too far front and sorta
    made everything sound busy.  I suppose that's related to why you
    say 5ths sound wimpy, but sometimes that's called for.
    
    On keyboards, I almost never play thirds with the left hand unless
    its the very bottom note (when the bass line moves to the 3rd).

    	db

    
    
    Personally, I use octaves and ninths for keyboards, but I thought
    wez wuz talkin geetar.  I think guitars emphasizing thirds sounds
    ballsy, esp with a lot of midrange and distortion (make them real
    up front!)
    
    wjb

    Can someone please explain standard and tablature notation?
    
    Thanks,
    Mike

    Standard notation is normal sheet music notation...with a staff,
    clef, time signature, etc.
    
    Tablature is a shorthand which has lines representing the strings
    of the instrument (6 for guitar, 5 for banjo, 4 for bass, mandolin,
    fiddle, etc.) and numbers representing fret locations.  

    Tab is usually considered an "easier" notation because it directly
    indicates fingerings.  However, it is typically only found in
    instructional materials.  You wouldn't expect to do a gig playing
    from charts and find anything but standard notation there....unless
    you're in Nashville, where they use the "Nashville system" yet another
    type of shorthand notation.

    I'm two years behind reading these notes but if you're still out
    there....
    
    
    I (Bassist) would play a B if I saw A/B same as .2,.3 & et al.
    
    By the same token, if I saw E/B, I would play B.
    
    I compose with Bass and Guitar and submit that if you see E/B
    and you have a Bass player to play the B, the guitarist need not
    play the 2nd inversion ...he could play I, II or III.
    
    Sometimes it is very desirable that way.  If you've no Bass player
    then perhaps you would have to play the 2nd Inversion in this example.
    
    My point is that if a B is played at the Bass note (by whatever)
    the inversion is up to the guitarist etc.
    
    Baz.