Conference napalm::guitar

    Tubes heavier!!!you got that right.
    I have a SVT head. 80+lbs.sounds good.(tube)
    Then there's a Marshall 200wt power amp,and an Ashly preamp I'm
    scoping out. Also sounds really good.(solid state)and weighs about
    50 lbs less.and is rack mountable+++
    
    Jeff_also_a_bass_player_and_wants_a_compact_unit

    
    	However MESA engineering claims that their tube bass amp has
    more dynamic range than ANY solid state unit - even with twice
    the RMS power. I dont know why they can make this claim...
    Anyone else know??
    
    	Joe Jas
    

    I have got a Peavy MegaBass amp which is solid state. It's the best
    amp I could (not!) afford when I was looking around. As far as tonal
    quality is concerned, I seem to be able to get any sound I want,
    so long as I can imagine the sound (so far) it seems to be in there
    somewhere - the only problem is finding it. It doesn't weigh much
    at all (the cab makes up for that tho), it's very compact, rack
    mountable, got an n-band eq, chorus and crossover built in. I think
    it is a very good amp, for me at least. Maybe it just suits my
    particular bass very well, don't know. I love it.
    		There again, I haven't played for donkey's years, I
    only listened to half a dozen or so alternatives, and in any case,
    I probably wouldn't know a good bass amp if it stood up and bit
    me. Last time I was playing regularly, 10+ years ago, I had an
    H & H solid state head which, back then, I thought was a pretty
    good amp for the money (don't ask, I can't remember - must have
    been pretty cheap tho').
    I'm very happy with mine anyway - but I wouldn't take anything I
    say seriously, I don't know my a** from my elbow when it comes to
    things like this.
    Charles.

re. -1

gee charles, in this world of ours where everything is relative, and
wishy-washy nerds like ziggy become national heros - it's really good
to hear from a man who really has the courage of his convictions and
isn't afraid to stand up and speak out for what he believes in...

i think...

8^))  8^))  8^))  8^))  8^))  8^))  8^))  8^))  8^))  8^))  8^))  8^))

but seriously,

when you (or anyone else) say your amp is rack mountable, does that mean that
it conforms to some ANSI size standard?

-max- 

    Just thought I'd throw in my two cents worth at this late date on
    the tube vs. transistor debate.  For bass, the story is alot different
    than for guitar.  On guitar, there is no doubt that tubes provide
    superior distortion characteristics although there are some solid-state
    units which do sound awfully good.
    
    With bass, the main difference is in DAMPING, that is how soon the
    speaker cone stops moving after the input stops and HEADROOM or
    how the amp will respond to an overload.
    
    Damping on tube amps tends to be poor, giving a muddy bottom end
    which some players like.  Listen to older (60's) type players and
    you can hear what I mean.  Modern styles prefer clean crisp bottom,
    which solid state definitely can deliver.  Yes, the speaker cab
    does get into the picture which is why an Acoustic 360 sounds muddy
    despite being transistors.  The muddy bottom can give the ILLUSION
    of more bottom end.
    
    The headroom question is one of how do you like your overdrive?
     On solid-state amops, as s oon as you overload the amp, it starts
    to give a raspy sound unless the amp uses FETs in the circuitry.
     Tubes will also overdrive, but smoothly in a way that sounds OK.
     This is why most bass rigs sold today have compressors and limiters.
     Anyone who has used a Peavey where an LED tells you when clipping
    is being prevented may be suprised to see how often the peak light
    comes on!  If the limiter was not there, that peak would distort.
    
    The result is that since tubes provide a "soft" distortion, they
    can be allowed to overdrive on peaks, providing more heradroom,
    i.e. they play louder.  For example , I use a Traynor TS120B which
    is 140 watts, solid state and a Bassman which is 50 watts, tube.  
    The Fender sounds just as loud although it tends to be muddier on the 
    bottom which is great for blues or reggae but not for funk.  Hope that 
    clears it up for you.

    Re -.1: I'll argue that some solid state units have `superier'
    distortion characteristics.
    
    WJB

    GUESS WHAT?????!!!---CHICKEN-BUTT!!!; no but seriously, now you
    can have both; at the same time and it's footswitchable. just tried
    a Blue Tube today-and it sounds G-RRReat!!! -140$ and stomp box
    size,A.C powered. Definitely getting one!
    -Bill Kron/Peavey Devotee(but open minded!!)

    
    Curious as to where you found the Blue Tube in stock.  I've been
    interested in checking one out.  Did they have the rack version
    as well?
    
    							Brian

    Brian, ROGUE MUSIC 30th street in NYC, has all varieties of the
    stomp-style unit but no rack-mounted units.....I put a deposit on
    the LAST BLUE TUBE yesterday. I also saw them at Sam Ash on 48th
    street (guitar heaven up there!!!!) Good luck finding one buddy!!
    -Bill (psyched-4-that-sound!)

     After a week of extensive testing........this blue tube gizmo is
    fantastic....fattens and warms up the sound much better than a chorus
    or any other pedal I've ever used. And you can distort the sound
    but still keep the bottom. Sounds very natural and un-effect-like
    Definitely strongly recommended to all!
    happy-bass!
    -Bill

    
    
    
    	I'm still interested in hearing:
    
    
    	A. How you bass dudes get a manageable 4 ohm bass cab put together.
    
    	B. How much power would I need if I were to play out in clubs.
    	   I'm using a 50 watt bassman now into an 8 ohm single 15" Gauss
    	   cab, and I'm concerned that the bassman isn't happenin maximum 
    	   because it's looking for a 4 ohm load to push, but even if it
    	   was would it be enough power to deliver bass in a club setting.
    
    	So... how much power to "gig" out and how to get a compact, easy to
    carry bass rig would be my questions.  Bill, Bri, Joe, Tom, Rick, Tony,
    anybody???
    
    
    Gree Vee

    Re: .11
    
    One way to get a 4 ohm cab is have a 4 ohm speaker (duh...).  Anyway,
    Peavey sells 1-15 cabs that are 4 ohms. You might talk to your friendly
    speaker service center about having the voice coil in the Gauss
    changed to a 4 ohm coil.  
    
    In general, a Bassman will be adequate for small clubs but won't have a
    lot of dynamic headroom and will definitely *growl* when you drive it
    hard.  At volumes above 7 it will start to distort sweetly, if you like
    that kind of thing.  You really would want a 4 ohm load to get the full
    power of the head.  I used to use mine with either one of those 4 ohm
    Peaveys or a Traynor 8 ohm 1-15 in a C&W band and it was fine.  I've
    also used with an 8 ohm 1-15 EVM loaded cab in a blues band situation
    and that was OK, too although I was getting a reasonable amount of
    distortion (OK for blues, but someone who likes a crisp, ringing sound
    would have gagged at the tone).  I have even tried it with a 1-12 EVM
    cab at home and that would be enough for a lot of small gigs, too. With
    a larger 4 ohm cab (say 2-15, 4-10, 8-10) it will be loud enough for a
    lot of R&R situations, with the same disclaimer about the distortion.  
    
    The real question is how efficient are the cabs.  Think about a
    Marshall stack running two 4-12 cabs.  That's only 50 watts, and nobody
    complains about not getting enough volume. 
    
    As far as compact cabinets go, about the smallest 1-15 you can have
    would be the EV-type Thiele aligned cabs.  These are *very* efficient.
    You can get plans for these free from EV, you can build them yourself
    for about $30-40 including all the hardware, stuff in a good 4 ohm
    driver and you will have a compact but kick-butt setup using the
    Bassman for a head.  
    
    							Brian

    
    
    
    	No kidding, Brian.. all I've seen (but I've been sheltered) is 8
    and 16 ohm speakers.  As it turns out I'm going to have my Gauss looked
    at this week cos the dust cover is cracked and I could have the dude
    take a look at it then.  Good idea.. but my (substantial) gut says that
    staying with standard 8 ohm speaker cabs would be the way to go.  I dew
    have an EV12L cab, but I've been leary of wiring it in parallel with my
    Gauss.. afraid of damaging it...  The EV12L is made for guitar, right? 
    Wouldn't bass frequencies "blow it's little mind"?  If not, Proble
    solved.. I'll make up a patch cord that parallels my two cabs and that
    will provide the 4 ohms I need to load my Bassman with.  Right, Bri,
    huh? Right?
    
    BTW.. any new Rost originals out there on tape??
    
    Stevie Grevie (charter member rhyming name club)... heh, go for it,
    Buck!!  [;^)  Buck, Buck, Bo Buck, Bo NANA BANA Bo Buck...

    The trick with the 12L is tuning the cab so that excursion of the voice
    coil is within safe limits.  No, you don't have to put a condom on
    the thing  8^)  8^)  I'm using mine with a 400w head as my bass rig at
    the old Hubcaps house gig.
    
    The cab I have is built to EV plans.  It can be tuned to either have a
    drastic rolloff at about 90 Hz or to have a smooth rolloff at about 160
    Hz.  At the same (flat) EQ, the smooth rolloff provides less low
    end...BUT...crank up the EQ at about 100 Hz, and the thing gets right
    on down to 60 Hz, no problem.  With the other tuning, the same boost
    will just cause the voice coil to bottom out (i.e. try to push the cone
    farther than it wants to go) and possibly damage the driver.  An open
    back cab is essentially untuned and would be even worse to use.
    
    Hope this explanation isn't getting into Mr. Wizard territory too much 
    8^)  8^)
    
    As far as originals, I got one new one on tape that might get a guffaw
    out of you, I've been too busy going to grad school to work on any more
    8;(  8;(   However, I have discovered how to get the "icepick from hell
    stuck right into your forehead" tone onto tape  8^)   8^)
    
    						Brian

    
    
    
    	Tune the cabs???   Are you kidding... I use open bass cabs... 3/4"
    plywood, what ever size the wood's in.  I guess I've got a lot to learn
    about bass gear, thanks for the free education, Brian... So, in and
    open cab, I would definately ummmmm..... violate my EV12L, right?

     buy another cabinet for the jobs that require full output.
    -Bill(who lost that option when he started usung a 2x18"cab!)

    Take the bass direct into the PA for added horsepower, using a direct
    box.  Use the amp for your onstage sound.  IMO, 50watts can be loud 
    enough, but you'll never get the tone and clarity you want, because
    a bass transient (like when you pluck the string) asks for huge
    amounts of power for a very short time.  With a 50watter, the signal
    will get clipped at loud volume.
    
    Use a 200 or 300watt head into a separate cabinet.  A Thiele enclosure
    with an EVM15B would be great (and reasonably portable).  I know two
    bassists who use 15L's in Thiele boxes with no problem.  One plays
    in a reggae band (:== *huge* bass sound ).  
    
    BTW, tuning the cabinet (re: back a few) is accomplished by adding
    a wooden plug to cover part of the port.  

    >           <<< Note 171.17 by PIPPER::KELLYJ "Tone droid" >>>
    >                   -< Remember the Outerspace Band? >-
    
    Funny you should say that, I just heard part of their cassette "Initial
    Contact" the other night.  I was interested in checking it out since
    I've known Klondike for a few years but never heard him play.  
    
    Back to our regularly scheduled program....
    
    							Brian

FWIW, I use an EV15L (400W version) in a thiele cab. I drive
it with a PVMKVIII head which does about 200W or so into
8 ohms. 

It's plenty loud.

    
    
    
    	Brian, or anyone else who's interested in jumping in.... now I've
    go another question...  I'm thinking of going with a 2x10 on top of a
    1x15 for bass speakers, so I've found a 2x10 cab and it's 4 ohms so I'd
    have a 
    
    1   1   1
    - + - = -
    8   4   2.7 ohm cab... ought to make my bassman work it's little butt
    
    right?   I've also got this brand new 70 watt Celestion speaker and so
    far, I'd never think of playing bass through that, but what if I put it
    in one of those acoustic suspension cabs, where the air is giving the
    coil something to push on... Would I be able to play bass through it
    without damaging it???  Would I have a cooler blues bass sound than the
    2x10???  Or.. should I just get the 2x10 ready made cab???  Huh, Bri,
    Huh???  [;^)
    
    
    Gree Vee

    Umm... I don't think you want to mix loads going into the amp like that
    Steve.  The smaller load will get more of the signal then the bigger
    load (ie, in your example the 2x10 will be a lot louder then the 1x15).
    
    Also, I didn't think the Bassmen liked a load less then 4 ohms...
    
    Greg

    
    
    
    	Rats, I wasn't clear, Greg... I'd take the load into a y-cable and
    plug er right into the speaker jack.. yep, you're right, Bassmens don't
    like loads less than 4 ohms... I'm wondering how big a deal it would be
    using a 3 ohm load?
    
    Steve

On a related note:

	Won't more of the power output go to the speaker box with
the lowest total ohm rating? I thought I noticed this when I had 
a 1x15 (8ohm) and 2x10 (4 ohm). I thought the rig sounded kinda
thin and wimpy since I was driving the 10's more than the 15. In
my mind, I'd want to drive the 15 with more power than the 10s.

Does this make *any* sense.. ;^)

    Re: mixed ohms
    
    Yeah, the lowest impedance sucks more of the power.  Remember that the
    voltage across each leg of a parallel connection is equal (vs. series
    connects where *current* is equal).  Anyway, quick math, asuuming the
    cabs are 4 and 8 ohms:
    
    Power is P = V X I, but since V = I X R, P = (V X V)/R
    
    So since each cab has the same voltage across it, the 4 ohm cab sinks
    *twice* the power of the 8 ohm cab.  Of course, efficiency of the cabs
    comes into play, too...if the 8 ohm cab is super efficient and the 4
    isn't, the balance will be better, vice versa and things get even
    worse.
    
    I would *not* run that Bassman at 2.7 ohms.  I've overheated and
    smoked mine a few times (no damage beyond some melted insulation
    luckily) trying such shenanigans.  You could rewire the 10s in series
    for 16 ohms (they are likely two 8 ohm drivers in parallel) then this
    in parallel with the 15 gives 5.3 ohms and more power goes to the 15.
    
    Tom, I'm still trying to figure out how you power speakers in your
    mind, do you get a better tone than with tubes or transistors?  
    8^)   8^)
    
    GreeVee, real men play with 15s anyway  8^)  8^)  Forget those wimpy
    10s.
    
    						Brian

re:.-1

	Nyuk, Nyuk. It took a while but I finally got it..

;^)

-t

        Remember that current,  no matter how small/large travels the
        path of least resistance.
        
        Matt

    
    
    	Yes.. I got it now.. turns out that I have a cab that I put an 8
    and a 10 into just to dub around with.. wired them in series for a 16
    ohm load and then connected that in parallel with my re-coned 8 ohm
    gauss.. and the gauss absolutely sounds like it's getting more signal,
    really the perfect setup, cos' I wouldn't want a bunch of juice going
    into a 2x10 cab instead of the gauss... woiks great.... How come when I
    turn it up I start to get distortion???   I know dumb question, but is
    it the same as guitar??  Is that the amp???  I figured that I never be
    able to get this gauss to rumble... or umm, did I mess up my ported cab
    design???  [;^)  Oboy one more thing to be compulsive about!
    
    
    Greee Veee

    You will defintiely get distortion with a Bassman.  Varies from amp to
    amp.  Mine hits grunge at about 5-6 and melts down above 7.
    
    The speaker cab can be causing *extra* distortion.  Possible causes:
    
    1.  Bad port design.  You have a frequency band where the port is not
    driving enough and the speaker excursion is max (i.e. the voice coil
    can't go any further) and you crank up a bit more....this is how you
    blow speakers.
    
    2.  You have a lousy seal and the cab is resonating due to air leaking
    out somewhere.  Easy to check by running your hand (or ear) over every
    seam, etc. and also check where the speaker mounts to the cab (you
    *did* gasket it, I hope).  I had a leaky gasket give me an ugly buzz
    with my 12" til I sealed it up.
    
    In both cases, the distortion will appear only on some of the notes
    (typiclly the lowest ones).
    
    						Brian

     also remember to dampen the cabinet.....you know
    fiberglass insulation stapled to the back and sides to 
    eliminate standing waves that turn your signal to MUD!

    
    
    
    	Yep.... Hmmmm.. maybe I'm being too picky... Mine stays nice and
    clean on the bass channel up to about 7 with treb at 5 and bass rolled
    a little off 7.  Sealed! Is that mother sealed... I was listening
    Brian, I'll check tonight for sure.. and yep, I used a gasket...  Bill,
    I didn't use fiberglass but I did use sheets of that 3 inch foam stuff
    that we use as packing (y'know the stuff that looks like 3-d sine waves
    all over one side and flat on the other)... 
    
    	BTW, I should have shared a little tip, you guys probably already
    know this one.. but I found this cool back plate for my box.. couple of
    �" jacks and push clamps in, but (Brian got the message across about
    getting the box airtighht except for the port) I couldn't figure out
    how to seal it... I wound up using a fiber (disposable) salad bowl from
    teh cafeteria (Yeah, I paid for it!)  stapled around the edges, caulked
    and then covered with the foam stuff.. made a great airtight seal for
    the cable.. just brought my zip cord through a tiny little hole and
    caulked it!  I'm puttin' together my acoustic suspension 1x12 tonight..
    look out!
    
    
    
    Gree Vee

    I'll soon be in the market for a new bass head. Any ideas?
    
    Thanks
    
    John
    

    I just upgraded to a Peavey Mark IV head and I love it.  It's a solid
    state amp with:
    
    210 watts @ 4 ohms
    300 watts @ 2 ohms
    
    2 channels:
    Channel 1 has bass, midrange, treble knobs, bright switch, graphic EQ
       switch, biamp output high/low frequency cutoff knob
    Channel 2 has bass, midrange, treble knobs, bright switch, graphic EQ 
       switch, midrange frequency parameter knob
    
    Also:
    High and low input jacks, effects loop for each channel, 5-band graphic 
    EQ, biamp high/low output jacks, line output jack, preamp input jack, 
    channel footswitch jack (I don't have the switch)
    
    In other words, it's got lots of power, and lots of tonal and
    configuration flexibility.  It's also not very heavy and promises to be
    reliable, from everything I've heard about Peavey.  I got it used from a 
    music store for $225 US a few months ago.  And it sounds great, too!
    
    Dave

    
    	see 2.2729 for a mint condition, great sounding bass
    	amp and cabinet.  Pretty sure it's still available.
    
    	Tom
    

    How's your back?  The old Ampeg SVT is still the benchmark for bass
    amps.  There's also a new, high tech rackmount version (still all tube)
    called SVT-III (I think; Brian?).  Mucho lbs and $$$, but still
    unsurpassed
    
    /charles_atlas

    Re:.34
    
    The original SVT is no longer made.
    
    The SVT-II at $1900 list is the successor, still big, heavy, all tube.
    
    The SVT-III and SVT3-PRO are rackmount models with tube preamps and
    solid state power (350/450 watts respectively) for $850/$1100 list.
    
    There are also some all-solid state models, SVT-200 and SVT-400
    ($800/$1100).
    
    							Brian

    re: .34
    
    If you decide to go this route and find a used one, be sure the tubes
    are still available.  I don't know what the SVT used, but some of the 
    old Ampegs amps used tubes that are difficult to find nowadays.
    
    Dave

    re: .31
    
    It'd probably help with the recommendations if you told us your budget.
    
    Greg

    Greg,
    
    I'd like to stay around $500....
    
    John

    
    
      My old Ampeg Portaflex used 7027A tubes. These are very hard to
    find these days. I think a good amp tech could re-bias the amp
    to use a more common tube. I'm not sure how *different* these 
    other Ampeg tubes are.
    

    The original SVTs used 6146 power tubes (6 of em); these put out a
    healthy 330 watts RMS.  Later models used 6550s, which dropped the wattage
    to a "puny" 240.  Ampeg purists favor the 6146s, and these are not hard
    to find according to Ken Fischer (owner of Trainwreck Amps and generally
    acknowledged Ampeg guru).  Just don't expect to walk into Daddy's and
    buy some.  I believe 6550's were used in 70's and 80's Marshall guitar
    amps (the American models) and are easy to find.
    
    $500 (or less) will get you a clean used SVT head.  Play one, and you'll
    never want anything else.
    
    /bill_wyman

    Heard a bassist the other night using an SVT with a Rick -- reminded
    me how good that amp sounds!

     Re - What Rick said

     Yeah, the 6146 is what alot of Ham radio guys use in their
     transmitters. They're not hard to find, just check the back
     of Amatuer Radio mag...there's loads of ads...sorta like in
     Guitar Player mag.

     Neal

    If you want a similar sound at a lower price and weight, try an Ampeg
    V4B.  A friend of mine uses one and I've always liked the sound.  100
    watts, all tube.  He retubed it recently and said he had a little
    trouble finding some of the tubes, but not *too* bad.
    
    For very low weight, GK makes/made some fairly nice sounding solid
    state stuff.
    
    Greg

    >Play one, and you'll never want anything else.
    
    Except a derrick to move it.
    
    							

    And you thought that Twin was bad...

    The attached is IMHO.
    
    This is the 90's.
    
    Ditch the cranes, derricks etc... and get yourself a GK800, Trace
    Elliot, Hartke etc...  I've heard SVT's, and while they sound GREAT,
    I don't think they sound so much better than the GK/TE/Hartke offerings
    that you can afford to supply the person-power to MOVE one.
    
    :-)
    
    I saw the bassist for Vinny Moores band had a Crown power amp anna 
    BBE bass PreAmp running thru a 8x10 Ampeg cab.  Twice as sweet, 1/2
    the cost and weight.  :-)
    
    jc
      

    Actually, a friend of mine used to use a Yamaha SPX-90 as a preamp into
    a Crown DC300 power amp into some sort of folded cab.  Sounded great!
    
    Greg

    HeadRoom == SVT;

    You know those MTV sports shows? They should have an SVT competition
    with a distance event where bass players run carrying an SVT head. Lead
    players can choose between the Twin event (carrying a twin in  each
    hand) or the Major event (two Marshall Majors). Results are measured in
    inches.

                                        Eddie Van Halon 

    
    
             <-S-W-R-> = good stuff.
    
             I don't admit to knowing diddly about bass rigs, but I've
          gigged with a few players with SWR rigs and they all sounded
          HOT!
             I thing Ampeg made great gear for their time, but just like I 
          deal with my guitar gear, I don't want gear that I can't by parts
    	  for in a couple years.
    

    
    Thanks for all the suggestions. Now where can I find all these amps to
    give them a try? I live in Derry N.H. and the only store around me is
    Daddy's. And all you can find there is Peavey.
    
    John
    

    >> I thing Ampeg made great gear for their time, but just like I 
    >> deal with my guitar gear, I don't want gear that I can't by parts
    >> for in a couple years.
    
    Hey Boom, ya mean like Kitty Hawks? :-)
    
    re SVT pulls, I love it!!!

    Ampeg can be found at Turn 1 Music (is that the right name? used to be
    Hamel's) in Chelmsford, MA.
    
    EU Wurlitzer's has SWR, Hartke, GK...you'll have to travel to Boston.
    
    Performance Music in Burlington has SWR.
    
    							Brian

>      My old Ampeg Portaflex used 7027A tubes. These are very hard to
>    find these days. I think a good amp tech could re-bias the amp
>    to use a more common tube.

    My Ampeg B-25 head uses 7027As.  They're not exactly easy to find, but
    I think they're around.  A friend who does amp work told me he thought
    the head could be modified to use one of the more common power tubes,
    and it would sound similar.  Mine has been extremely reliable, but who 
    wants to do that with a head that's already twenty-odd years old?  It 
    also uses a 7199 tube that's at least as hard to find.  (What's that
    tube do, anyway?)  And it uses a 5AR4 (GZ34) rectumfrier tube, which 
    may not be a good thing for bass.
    
>    $500 (or less) will get you a clean used SVT head.  Play one, and you'll
>    never want anything else.
    
    The problem is, Rick may be right.  %^)
    
    Personally, though, I tend to agree with Coop - there's some outstanding 
    stuff out there now, and for $500 you can get a very nice head, 
    especially if you buy used.  The fact that it's lighter and I have a bad 
    back has absolutely *no* bearing on this opinion.  %^)
    
    re: Ron's competition
    
    And the keyboard players have to push a B-3 that's on wheels.
    
>    I live in Derry N.H. and the only store around me is Daddy's. 
    
    Far be it from me to recommend a store like *that*, but that's where I
    bought my Peavey head.  And don't write off Peavey until you've tried
    them; I think they make good stuff, if you don't mind paying less.
    
    The Music Factory in Salem (and Manchester, I think) carries Hartke and
    G-K amps; last time I was in there they had a used (recent, solid state)
    Ampeg head as well.  They're good people to deal with.
    
    The Music Workshop in Salem carries Fender and has a number of used
    amps.  They're good people, too, but I wasn't that impressed with the
    Fender amps I played through (although the prices were sometimes
    impressive).
    
    Dave

    Back when I was shopping for a bass amp (circa '89) I bought a used
    GK-400 on approval.  It blew up the first time I used it.  Around the
    same time my band saw Victor Bailey playing at the Willow in Somerville;
    his GK-800 blew up on stage, and the other players made comments to the
    effect that this was not an uncommon occurrence.  That's when I decided
    to buy SWR.
    
    SWR is nice, but you'll have trouble finding even a used one for $500.
    
    AMP made a nice head (ask Brian Rost), similar to the SWR but a bit
    less warm sounding.  No longer made, hard to find used, but if you
    do it'd probably come in under your budget.
    
    The Trace gear I've seen is extremely heavy AND expensive; the worst
    of both worlds.
    
    I found SWR the best compromise between sound and weight/convenience.
    If my back were up to it though, I'd drop it for an SVT in a minute.
    
    /bootsy

    Re: .54
    
    Hey, Rick, tell 'em about how the SWR blew on ya, too  8^)
    
    							Smokey

    True, my first unit from SWR arrived with shipping damage;
    crunched inner carton, minor case buckling, erratic performance.
    They eventually replaced the unit, it's been 4 years of bliss since.
    
    /ralph_nader

   I absolutely love my BBE 383 bass preamp.  I think I only paid about $189
   for it, new, from Thoroughbred Music.  You would of course need a power amp
   and a rack, which would add to the expense though.  Or do like I do and run
   the preamp direct into the PA.

   And I agree with the previous note that Peavey stuff shouldn't be ignored
   just because of the name.  They make good, reliable gear for reasonable
   money (REAL cheap used) and it doesn't sound bad at all. 

   -- Sam

    Not gonna say anything about your Carvin, Sam?

>    re: Ron's competition
>    And the keyboard players have to push a B-3 that's on wheels.
    
    Close, Dave. Actually it's the B3 PULL. Very much like a tractor pull.
    Takes place in a muddy parking lot at 2:45 AM.

                                            Jimmy McGruff

   Carvin?  Oh yeah, my *other* bass amp!  :-)

   That one's real nice too.  Small package, 150w into 1x10 speaker with 
   external speaker jacks.  About $330 new from Carvin.  And even with just
   the 1x10 its plenty loud to play with another guitarist and drummer, unless
   you crank it up to the pain threshold all the time.

   Eventually, when I break down and buy a power amp, I'm going to go out of
   my BBE's "high" biamp to the Carvin and it's 1x10, and the "low" biamp 
   output to the new power amp, which will then power my 1x18 cab.  Should be 
   able to induce involuntary bowel evacuation from the audience with that 
   setup!  (And not just from my (lack of) playing ability!  :-))  I used the
   above setup last night (sans power amp - the Carvin supplied all the power)
   and it sounded great.

   -- Sam

    
    I went to Hampshire Music yesterday and tried a  "Tube Works" amp.
    A little thing with 300w's 2-10's and a tweeter. It had a switch for
    solid state or tubes. There's also an ext cab you can buy with 1 15'.
     
    GREAT sound!!!
        
    Anyone else try one?
    
    And what stores would be good to go to in Boston?
    
    Thanks for your help!!
    
    John
    
    P