Conference hydra::amiga_v1

    I don't know about a -B7 but the -B2 is described as supporting
    VGA(640x480),SVGA(800x600),SVGA Plus(1024x768), and 8514/A(1024x768)
    
    Sounds like a standard multisync with support for the high end 
    resolutions.  You need to find out how low it will sync to see
    if it can handle the 2000's RGB.  Otherwise, as you guessed, you
    will need something like a flickerfixer to generate a signal it
    can see.
    
    Dave

    Rob,
    
    	Specs for this beast are:
    
    Horizontal synch          30 - 37 kHz
    
    Vertical synch	      50 - 90 Hz
    
    Refresh                   70.08 Hz
    
    I seem to remember that the VR241 synchs at 31.5 kHz (dont hold me to
    it!) and they work - so..........
    
    cheers,
    Glenn

    Nope, the VR241 runs at 15.75KHz, compatible with the Amiga's standard
    RGB video port.  A 31.5 KHz monitor will require one of the "VGA"
    display enhancers (A2320, FF or FFV).

    RE: .3
    
    Yup, I think I agree...damn it. Here I was, thinking that I had a
    relatively cheap way of getting a decent display.
    
    My mistake was 525 lines X 60Hz (NTSC)= 31.5 Khz
    and            625 lines X 50Hz (PAL) = 31.25Khz
    
    whereas I should have multiplied by 30 and 25 respectively.
    
    Sorry Rob.
    
    Glenn
    

Thanks for the info all ... 

I'm a little wiser as to what's required now.

Cheers,

Rob

    Well, I'm still confused.  Can the PC4XV-Bx be used with a stock Amiga? 
    Or is it a good choice for displaying the resolutions available with
    the new chips set (eg. productivity mode, etc.).  I've been wanting to
    get a VGA monitor for when I get the new chips, but have been holding
    out for a good price.  Can someone enlighten me?
    Would the monitor come with the correct cableing to hook it up to an
    Amiga (RGB or deinterlaced signal, etc.)???
    
    
    				Jason

    
    With a stock Amiga that isn't a 3000, no.
    
    And since most of the monitors are designed for the ibmpc clone market,
    they expect you to have a DB15 port for them to connect to.
    
    To get that on non 3000 Amiga's means buying a flicker fixing device. 
    That has the DB15 connector and generates a VGA like signal that should
    work with most VGA monitors.  Unknown if it works with PC4XV-Bx, I
    don't know of anybody who has tried it yet.
    
    The new chip set (and the old chip set) use the DB23 port.  That means
    you need to buy the cable for your specific monitor.  Unless you buy
    the Commodore 1084 Monitor (or whatever number they are calling it
    these days).  And the new chip set will require a VGA or multi sync
    monitor to access some of the newer graphics modes.
    
    The easy way to not be confused is to forget about the PC4XV-Bx for
    now.  Wait until somebody tries it.  It was designed for the ibmpc
    clone market, not the Amiga.  The closest I've found to a match for
    the Amiga is the Diamondscan - it can handle composite video,
    the normal Amiga output, and it is also a multi sync so it can handle
    the VGA and higher frequencies.  Now if only it had stereo speakers :-)
    
    Dave

    re .7
    
    	Any true multi-sync will work without a flickerfixer. All you need
    is the right cable. I have run the Diamon scan directly from the RGB
    port.
    
    		Steve P.
    

I'm curious- I've often contemplated going the flickerfree (i.e., *any* of the
"display enhancer" boards) route, but each time the combined cost of a
multisynch *and* one of the various boards has put me off.

I've often seen slams of the Commodore monitors, but I've never seen a non-C=
monitor display without a flickerfree board. Is the quality noticeably
improved even without the board? I might get the monitor first, board later if
this is so.

Bob

    Thanx for your info people... Does the DiamondScan handle Overscan too?
    
    
    					Jason
    

    re .9:
>I've often seen slams of the Commodore monitors, but I've never seen a non-C=
>monitor display without a flickerfree board. Is the quality noticeably
>improved even without the board? I might get the monitor first, board later if
>this is so.
    
    This is the route I took.  I have a Diamondscan hooked to my 2000 and
    no, the quality isn't noticibly improved.  (And the lack of speakers
    is the most noticible part).  I upgraded the monitor first since all 
    the "available real soon now" video upgrades need/want a multi-sync.
    I don't consider a flicker-fixer enough of an video upgrade to be
    worth it.  I'd rather get higher resolution & more colors.
    
    regards,
    dennis

    
    	I also have a diamon scan on a A2000. The diamonscan handles
    overscan, flickerfixer or not.
    
    	As to image quality, I think it helps. It is not as good as a
    flicker fixed display, but I think it looks better than a 1080 or 1084.
    
    	I also have a A3000 with a diamonscan at it works great. All the
    new display modes work with it.
    
    		Steve P.
    

When I ordered my 3000, I chose to get the 1950. My rationale was that
although it wasn't a great bargain when compared with other monitors in the
same price range, I knew that it supported ALL the VDE/flickerfixer and
standard Amiga display modes, and it allowed for a display overscan to
eliminate the black borders. When my system came in and the monitor didn't
arrive, my dealer let me borrow his until it did arrived. I was happy with it
until...

When my monitor finally arrived and I took it home, I noticed right off that
it was different. CBM has made some changes (either to accomodate other
CRT manufacturers or types, or as part of cost reduction).

1) It had a much rounder CRT than the other. It was so curved that my shell
   window looked like it was bent inward. VERY VERY curved.

2) The dot pitch looked bigger (but I can't swear it was).

3) The 9 pin connector had some pins not run.

4) The phosphor quality was BAD! There were discolorations that made ProPage
   look horrible. (I had no ability to try an degauze it, but the display
   would still have looked worse that the other 1950 I used).

5) There was a brown-gray plastic insert around the CRT that was obviously added
   to allow this different and more curved CRT to fit. Also made it 1/4"
   deeper.

6) Some metal parts were now plastic


The display discoloration and quality were so bad I brought it back to the
dealer. Fortunately for me, he allowed me to trade with his original monitor so
now I'm quite happy, but I don't recommend that people buy the 1950 in it's new
configuration.

    re:.8  
    
    That depends on how you define "true multi-sync".  I believe the
    Diamondscan is one of the few multi-sync monitors that can be directly
    hooked up to the RGB port for normal Amiga RGB.  Most won't sync that
    low.
    
    re: non-flickerfixer quality
    It really depends on how sensitive your eyes are.  I find the picture
    quality is about the same as the 1084D, probably because I haven't 
    stressed it by running anything higher than 640x400.  I've found that
    having the composite video input to very useful - just run the video
    out from your VCR to it, and you get to see the full picture (you can
    see the overscan areas that don't display on the TV).
    
    The negative parts are:
    1. it's big, heavy, and most of the controls are on the back.
    2. no speakers.
    3. the quality control on the phosphor wasn't so good.
    4. I'm still waiting for the ECS chip set to come out for mere mortals,
       not just developers.
    
    One other thing to watch for - the Amiga uses interlace in the 400 line
    mode, some of the multisyncs don't handle that well.  Also note, any of
    the positive or negative "features" could change by the time you try to
    buy a monitor, it isn't just CBM that likes to do production line
    changes :-)
    
    Dave

Re: .8

>Any true multi-sync will work without a flickerfixer.

Be careful.  A lot of the newer and higher end multisync monitors have
been designed so that the slowest frequency they sync up with is VGA
compatible (like the flicker fixer) in order to better support high
frequency signals from workstation class graphics adapters.

The documentation for multisync monitors states what range of frequencies
the monitor supports.  Check that the range includes what you want to
display.

Re: .13

>2) The dot pitch looked bigger (but I can't swear it was).

Could very well be.  Early 1080 monitors had finer dot pitch than later
1080 and 1084 monitors.