Conference hydra::amiga_v1

    
    so the A500 should handle this - Just a quick thought here Paul...
    
    will you game allow the use of the Amiga Mouse as a substitute for
    a joystick? or is this not practical
    
    Games like Marble Madness make use of this and it might be a nice
    selling point...?

How does the second player control his half?

Do you unplug the mouse and add a second joystick?

John

    
    
    Count me in !!
    
    My little brother and I will give the game a real good tryout we
    love games.
    
    Harry
    

Wow!  Thanks to everyone who sent me mail!  It's very exciting to see so much
interest.  I have more than enough play testers.  During lunch I'll send
out replies to the first 10 people who sent me mail.  I'm tempted to allow
more copies (for fun) but I hope you can understand that I feel nervous about
sending too many out.

re.2

	For a one player game you use gameport 1, for a two player game you
have to replace your mouse with a joystick.  I haven't implemented a keyboard
interface yet, or a mouse interface (which would be possible).  

Paul -

Here are a couple of quick comments.  We'll do the questionaire later 
when we get some more experience:

1.  The idea that you can replace the objects with ones you do
yourself is a great one.  I replaced the small rock with a caricature
of my son - he was really surprised when he blasted a large rock and
three Adams came out!  I can hardly wait to customize it further. 
The doc mentions a dPaint brush that has the color map, but I
couldn't find it.  Could you upload that? 

2.  I liked the cheat, too.  Who wants to play by the rules all the 
time?

3.  You asked about strategy.  Here's one you may not have expected:
I found that the game slows down when there are a lot of objects on
the screen, and that you can create a lot of objects by activating
the cheat and hitting KP9 before a ship appears.  Instead of getting
the complete megagun, you get a set of gun components that blossom
from the middle of screen each time you press the key.  If you do
that a half dozen times or so, the screen starts to fill up and the
action slows down.  Then you can waddle over to the other, non-gun
objects and zap them. 

- Cliff

PS:  Great starfield movement!

Thanks, I think I may have forgotten to include the brush on the disk...  I'll
have to upload it.  I see you found the cheating instructions on the disk...

	...I didn't expect that.  I'm more interested in non-cheating strategies.


	For anyone who mails back to me the original disk I sent, I will return
an updated disk.  Already I have made some improvements:

	- Much less slow down when screen gets crowded
	- Title screen
	- Fixed a bug concerning the MEGA-GUN
	- Fixed pause bug.


QUESTION:  Should I post the messages sent by play testers here for all to see?

    Definately - otherwise your going to have to wade through various
    messages etc which probably have duplicate info eg: 3 testers all
    report the same bug etc - will save time for those testing as well
    cos I dont know about the rest of you guys but I aint the fastest
    typist in the world!!
    
    Yep - I'd like to see replies (my disk hasnt arrived yet so I'm
    eagerly reading this stuff !!!)
    
    Phil

    How do you edit the shapes?
    
    Matt
    

From:	Z::TENNY        "Dave Tenny - VAX LISP Development"  3-FEB-1989 10:08:50.29
To:	AITG::WISNER
CC:	
Subj:	Space killers


Wow, the version you have at AITG is considerably improved on
the last I played.  Took me awhile to figure out the new stargate location
method.  I like it.

Greg Mangan and I played for awhile, the biggest problem seems
to be for the extra gunner whenever the driver turns.
While the gun still points the same way, the gunner is completely
disoriented by the motion.  When I played gunner, I tried using
the long-range screen and positioning my gun to shoot things as
they entered.  But with any real driving, I couldn't hit anything
up close because I couldn't see which way I was pointed!

Some possible solutions to this might be:
(a) bigger or more visible gun
(b) a dual "ghost" image in the status board on the right,
    which looks just like the gun on the ship and rotates with it,
    but is always set in the board.  So this would act like a dial
    that the gunner can watch if the driver is moving a lot.
    The gun *still* has the usual representation on the ship, but also
    has a duplicate on the board.  This is probably a better solution
    because there really isn't room on the screen for a bigger
    gun.

It seemed as if the gunner attachment could almost be used to
destroy things by ramming, can it?  Or was it just that the gunner
always got off a good shot at impact time?

Your cheapo joy stick (the one like mine) has a bad firing button.
I was thinking of bringing mine in today if you're going to have
the machine around for some 5PM games.  (Greg and I played for
at least an hour yesterday.)

The sound effects and laser looked good.  I noticed that
the machine seems to stall more with two players shooting.

Later..

Dave

From:	16BITS::OMALLEY "10-Feb-1989 1704" 10-FEB-1989 17:07:23.39
To:	AITG::WISNER
CC:	
Subj:	SpaceKiller comments

Paul,

First of all, I want to say that you did a very nice job!

I received the disk yesterday, and played for a couple of
hours last night.  I didn't try and go through more than 
one Stargate, I had my hands full trying to get a handle on
the space ship.

I think the gameplay is great, just frustrating enough
to make you want to spend more time to learn it.  I spent
a lot of time chasing shields and crystals last night.  
Diabolical.

The sounds are also well done.  The woman's voice saying
"Approaching Stargate" is a nice touch, sounds like something
out of Star Trek.  I've got a pair of powered speakers that I'm 
going to crank up louder over the weekend.

It wasn't clear to me how much time should be spent on each
level, but as I said, I was trying to learn the controls.  Again,
I think this is good.  You'd get tired of games that you can
master right away, SpaceKillers has staying power.

The space creatures, merchant ships, enemy ships, etc. are good.  
My only nit would be that the space ship should have a bit more
detail.  But that's a small point, I'm glad I got my mail to you
in time.

Peter

P.S. Just out of curiosity, is it all assembly language or is there
     some C or Modula-2 in the code?

From:	NOBHIL::BODINE_CH    13-FEB-1989 18:04:37.65
To:	AITG::WISNER,BODINE_CH   
CC:	
Subj:	RE: SPACEKILLERS

No,
	Unfortunately I meant that it "froze up" for good. I had to reboot.
I was, however, running it from my hard drive.

Chris

From:	HANNA::CROMACK      14-FEB-1989 08:54:27.61
To:	Aitg::wisner
CC:	cromack
Subj:	SpaceKillers

Paul,

here are my initial comments on SpaceKillers.  I like the display, the
sound effects.  I like the fact that the play field is so much bigger
than what you can see at one time and with the "radar" in the corner it
makes playing very interesting.  The sound effects are really good.  The
number of object on the screen at once makes for an interesting game also.
You didn't mention anything about the shield "crystals" in the documentation.
I got the idea after awhile.  The color coded radar is good also.  Sorry
this is so stream of thought :).  One bug I found was that if I try to
use the mouse to select a menu item (I assume there are none) the system
hangs and I have to reboot.  I have kind of a cheap joystick which may be
why I run into the following problem.  Sometimes one of the monsters is
right between the two angle at which I can shoot.  Especially the small
monsters.  Would it be possible to have the rotation of the ship accelerate
as opposed to the kind of two speed motion I get now( 0 or fast)?  It sounds 
interesting to be able to change the pictures of the monsters but this also 
means it take a long time to load the game.  So far I have only collected one 
mega gun part before getting hammered, but I think that is due to my inept play. 
Is there some advantage to collecting the orbis crystals on the higher levels
as opposed to the lower easier ones.  One of my stategies is to try to
collect as many as possible on the lower easier level.  I noticed sometimes
when you run the game that all the merchants are selling the same part of
the mega gun - at least on a given level.  Oh also I really like the way it 
looks when you fire your gun, a multi-colored ray.  I noticed that the sound
of your gun changes when you get a mega gun part but have not yet seen the
advantage of having a single mega gun part (if there is one). Finally I like
the fact that so many aspects of the game are randomized.  I'm not sure about
the way they are randomized.  Sometimes when I play the orbis crystals are
few and far between, at other times I lose a bunch of them because I can't
chase them all.  Oh one more thing.  Being able to fire retro rockets to slow
down is a really nice touch.  I sometimes use them to move slower in order
to get close to one of the merchant ships.  Wait, wait, one more thing. I
like how when you hit something or are hit but a weapon you "feel the impact."
it accelerates you in the direction of the missle.

						Dean Cromack

From:	NOBHIL::BODINE_CH    13-FEB-1989 17:58:25.03
To:	AITG::WISNER,BODINE_CH   
CC:	
Subj:	SPACEKILLERS

Paul,
	Just a few quick comments on my first impressions.

1) Better than average shoot-em-up type game.
2) Unique perspective. I've never seen a game with quite that style of 
   movement (ie: stars scrolling).
3) This game gets very tough at level 4 and above. So far I've only been able
   to accumulate 2 pieces of the mega-gun.
4) Your chances seem to increase in 2 player mode.

I enjoyed it. I must have played it for 3 hours or so. My 10 year old sister-in
-law played it with me in 2 player mode.

After reading the note left by ZIMMER, I realized that maybe I missed some 
documentation included on the disk. I will have to read that before I make
any more observations about the game.

P.S. The game did freeze up on me one time in 2 player mode when the action was
getting hot and heavy.

Chris

From:	LDP::MCCARTHY     "Mike McCarthy DTN 297-4531 MR04-2/C17" 14-FEB-1989 14:08:45.40
To:	AITG::WISNER
CC:	MCCARTHY
Subj:	Space Killers

Paul,

	Just a quick note to tell you that I got the disk last week.
I gave it a shot over the weekend, and I'm impressed.  I'm still trying
to get used to the controls.

	I was able to force a GURU.  I moved the pointer and hit the 
front to back icon.  A few seconds later, the GURU was staring at me.
Otherwise, I have had no problems during game play.

	I'll have some more informative comments as I get further into
the game.  I am interested in some of the programming details.  What 
language is it written in?  Any chance of getting some development war 
stories?

Mike

P.S.  Could you send me your home address so I can return the disk to
      get the updated version?

From:	AITG::WISNER       "PAUL WISNER, AI MARKETING ... DTN: 291-8050" 14-FEB-1989 17:54:57.99
To:	NM%LDP::MCCARTHY,WISNER
CC:	
Subj:	re: space  killers

Hi Mike,

	Glad you like the game.   My home address is 

	9 madison lane
	acton, ma 01720

	Space Killers is written in C, and soon I will optimize the intermediate
assembly.  I think the development story for this game is interesting (and 
encouraging to new developers).  I was thinking about putting together an 
article (for Transactor?).   There are many subtle things you have to learn
about; things that are mostly undocumented or vaguely documented.

	As you've discovered.  Mouse operations will really mess things up. 
This is because I write my own custom copper lists at startup time (based on
a double buffering example  I found in one of the Sybex Amiga books).  If you
arrange the screens, the Amiga OS will rewrite one of my custom copper lists!
My program flips it's display list pointer between the two on every frame.  
Pressing the SPACE BAR pauses the game, but I also put in the additional side
effect of redoing the copper lists when you pause.  In certain situations, this
won't work.  I guess I should dissable the mouse.  

	-PAUL WISNER

    mutter mutter - still waiting for the NZ post office to deliver
    my disks....

    
�< Note 2186.18 by NZOV01::MCKENZIE "Nuke the Leprechaun!" >
�                             -< damn post office! >-
�
�    mutter mutter - still waiting for the NZ post office to deliver
�    my disks....
	
    Me too, Royal Mail still hasn't come up with the goods. I'm anxiously
    checking the mail every day.
    
    				Alan T.

    re: .18, .19
    
    	I owe you guys a BIG-TIME apology.  I hesitated when sending yours
    out because I was worried about international copyright protection. 
    Then I got real busy and forgot.  I will give them to the post office 
    tommorow morning... I promise.   Sorry I didn't let you know what I was
    doing.  You'll get a better version than everyone else has...
    
    	...remember... anyone who mails their disk back to me gets an
    updated version...
    
    Paul Wisner (9 Madison Lane, Acton, MA, 01720, USA,,, )

    re: .10
    
    On the Space Killers disk (an ordinary DOS disk) look in the :source
    directory for documentation.  Instructions on editing shapes are in the 
    "Players Handbook" file.

From:	NZOMIS::MCKENZIE     "NUKE THE LEPRECHAUN" 26-FEB-1989 15:06:55.69
To:	AITG::WISNER
CC:	
Subj:	

Hi Paul - Well my Disk arrived last Thursday and a friend and I spent
Thursday night,friday and most of Saturday putting Spacekillers through
the paces. 
    The following comments are meant to be constructive:

(1) During the time we tested Spacekillers, almost everyone who watch 
    the game load remarked: "Is THAT the title screen - That Sucks!"

    I am hoping the the title screen included is TEMPORARY as it is
    definately NOT a selling point. When (or if) you put a new title 
    screen together dont forget to add the copyright notice to it. My
    version only had a copyright notice on the disk label (which could
    easily be peeled off by some unscrupulous Bastard!" 
 
(2) Game playability was reasonable; I particularly like the sound effects
    and the voice simulation; excellent value and just right for the game
    There are the following though that I would like to see implemented:

    o Allow ship to dock at space-station until player presses [ENTER]
      I found it very damn annoying when I flew thru a couple of space
      stations: only to run into a rock coming under the space station
      and therefore out of sight! You should not be hurt or killed while
      docked at the station. When [ENTER] is pressed, the appropriate bit
      of the megagun is released (or not depending on the crystal numbers)
      and the ship is released. Perhaps have this as an option prior to game
      start.

    o I would like to see a [HYPERSPACE-PANIC MODE] button that could be pressed
      when the user got into deep SH*T with those firing monsters. this 
      button would randomly fire the player to another part of the galaxy
      (which could be in the middle of an asteroid shower!) and should cost
      x number of crystals every time it is pressed. If the user does not
      have x crystals then no go!

    o How about a difficulty factor question at te beginning of the load
      sequence? Base the difficulty calculations on number of monsters
      and how fast they fire; the harder the game level the more monsters
      and the faster they fire! I'd also like to see a [CONTINUE] option
      at the end of each game so that badly-coordinated-but-stubborn-folk
      like myself had a chance at the emperor. As a solo player (while my
      friend drove down the road for hamburgers and beer) I found that it
      was a little frustrating to have to start from scratch each time.

    o Perhaps a smart-bomb option which gives you 3 smart-bombs! once
      these run out - thats it. Smart bombs could destroy everything on the
      screen except you INCLUDING shield tokens and crystals so you would
      have to be careful when you used them. 

    o Is there any documentation with the game? my disk came solo but I 
      havent checked the disk itself for doc files.
     
    o How about a Hi-score board where you can enter your initials and
      save your score. If the [continue] option is used then the game
      scores should be zeroed between each game.

    I'm sure you have already thought of most of the above so I wont
    bother you any longer - otherwise - a great game - we really enjoyed
    it.

    Regards

    Phil

From:	RLAV::WEGER        24-FEB-1989 13:21:25.87
To:	AITG::WISNER
CC:	
Subj:	SpaceKillers play tester initial reactions.

Paul,

	Neat game!
	Sorry that I couldn't get back to you sooner but with Net U.
and the like it just wasn't possible. 

I like this game.  The mining of the crystals is a nice aspect 
and the fact that there is no time limit may help justify
the seemingly high (in my opinion) number of crystals needed to
do business with most of the space traders.

This feeling may be in part due to my inability to accurately
maneuver the ship. I may improve over time, I hope :')

I have managed to acquire one part of the mega-gun. It was a
"rapid-fire" attribute. Worked great, but I was soon out of
ship/shields.

I like the idea of being able to replace objects with my own
custom objects/monsters... I don't have Dpaint (yet) but it
sounds like fun.

Some things I'd like to see....

Surprise me with a 'shield diamond' poping out of j-random killed
monster or blasted meteor. I can never get enuf shields.

Radar enhancements such as "show me ONLY shields or mine-layers
or the like.

More detail on MY ship i.e. better fire/exhaust.

Music would be neat.

Some possible bugs....

Occasionally the chip ram indicator pops up on the bottom of the
screen. I'm sure others have seen this.

Sometimes, after my ship is destroyed, I am forced to re-enter at
a rather remarkable high rate of speed. Kinda have to close my
eyes and pray.  Is this intentional?


I'm looking forward to playing 2-player this weekend.  I'll let
you know how I make out.

Thanks for giving me the opportunity to help evaluate your game.
The concept and implementation are both GREAT keep it up!

Regards,
		Bruce Weger

From:	AITG::WISNER       "PAUL WISNER, AI MARKETING ... DTN: 291-8050" 27-FEB-1989 10:53:10.13
To:	NZOMIS::MCKENZIE,WISNER
CC:	
Subj:	RE: SpaceKillers

Hi Phil,


	The title screen suck huh?  Which title screen do you have?  There are
two possibilities.   One has a squid with it's arms wrapped around a ship.  The
other has just the squid.  I appriciate you're honest criticism, keep it coming. 
The title screen is by no means finalized.

o  Smart bomb idea: destroy even shields and crystals... I like it!!

o  I like the hyperspace idea too.

I thought of this before.  What do you think about having to buy smart bombs and
hyperspaces from the merchants with crystals?  Maybe start with three of each,
smart bombs would be outrageously expensive.  

Hi-score board is a good idea.  

I like the idea of continuation between games.  I had thought of an option to 
continue, but starting two levels back.  (with or without MEGA-GUN parts? 
Crystals?)

RE: Rocks hidden behind Merchant ships.  I admit this is a bit nasty.  I don't 
think it would be wise to make the player ship invincable while docing because 
you could (ab)use it as sort of a shield.  Disabling your lasers during docing 
would make docing even more hazardous than before!   What if I ensure that all
objects overlaping the merchant ship will appear in front of it?  

What is the highest wave you reached (without cheating)???

	-Paul

    I do not have much to say about the game because everybody has said
    it for me.
    
    On my disk there is about 200,000 bytes free.  If you still have
    not used up that space you could include more digitized sounds during
    the game (like having the enemies grunt at you when you see them),some
     music while playing the game would make the game more exciting,instead
    of trying to draw a title page maybe you include a digitized picture
    and edit it with digi-paint or deluxe paint and having a background
    like Goldrunner instead of just stars.
    
    Would using the extra disk space require a meg.
    
    Matt
    

Right now the game barely fits into 512K.  The game loads everything into RAM
when it boots up.  One of my goals was to avoid disk access during game play.  
My reasons are (1) to increase reliebility (2) to avoid long pauses between
waves.

I'm not convinced this is more important than adding more animation of the
creatures and adding more sound.  (????)

VERSION/NEW FEATURE CHART

0.6F	Original distribution (USA)

0.7	- Title screen 
	- debugging messages removed (causing small increase
	  in the frame rate).

0.7-1	- Smart Bombs (3 per game, bonus bomb every 50,000 points)
	- option to continue game starting two levels back
		WITH: 1 SMART BOMB (or more if you had them when you died)
		      All the MEGA GUN pieces collected so far.
		      0 Points
		      0 Cystals
		      5 Shields

	- experimental "Hyperspace" feature, doesn't really work like it should.

    how about a piece of music while the game loads?
    
    something like 2001 - A space Odessy (sp?)
    
    have you decided on a format for your title graphics - or will you
    stick with the current theme...?
    
    One point which definately needs some work is the end phase after
    you kill the emperor - I would find the current ending extremely
    dissapointing - YOU NEED TO HAVE A BELLS AND WHISTLES ENDING
    
    mabye the whole screen explodes or a picture of the pilot recieving a
    medal / fancy music or something???? - The end IN NO WAY justifies the work
    a player has to put into the game. 
    
    Cheers Paul 
    
    Phil    

	How about a fresh set of test players ??   

	The existing test players already know the game too well, but
they could stay on as  "Consultants"  :-^) 

	Reg	{Yes, I AM volunteering}

    What a good idea!  I would also be glad to do some testing,
    if Paul approves the idea.
    
    Steve

    I've just about given every suggestion I can think of - if paul
    agrees - mabye I could forward my test disk to another player...?
    
    Phil

My arm could also be twisted :-) to be a 'new' tester.  And I'm sure I
could force my 12 year old son to play it.  Surely, Paul, you need feedback
from youngsters to give your game a broad market appeal :-).

    I, along with my son would also love to help you test the game.
    Just think Paul - The guys with the kids give you more votes for
    money!  
    
    

I submitted the game to Electronic Arts for evaluation.  They didn't want it. 
John Manly of EA was very encouraging.  He thought it should be published, but
not by EA.  He spent over an hour on the phone with me relating suggestions 
from EA's evaluators.  He is a summary....

o	John called it "A Wave Game".  He used the words "Wave Game" as though
	it was derogatory.  I dissagreed with him, to me a Wave game would
	be something like Menace, where you encounter waves of creatures (in
	Menace you encounter them in the same order, only one creature type
	at a time, and they always move in the same pattern).  I wonder if
	I should have used the word "Levels" instead of "Waves"

o	The images are humorous.  I should put effort into making them even
	sillier.  John cited examples from "Skate or Die".

o	They wanted their to be more different types of scenarios.  Like
	getting out of your space ship when inside the stargate.   Dave Tenny
	suggested that you should have to maneuver the ship through a worm-hole
	type effect when you go through the stargate.

o	Intermediate rewards for collecting crystals.  Rather than one big
	reward (completing the MegaGun).  

o	John said that EA was mostly interested in simulations, sports games and
	adventure/discovery games.

o	Asked about the possibility of making it a modem play game.  I think
	their would be too much data needing to be transfered.  I'm not 
	sure.

o	When I asked if the testers had tried two-player mode, he couldn't
	tell me for sure. "I'll have to check on that" he said.  This is sort
	of funny, because I wrote "A TWO-PLAYER GAME" all over everything I 
	sent them.  

o	I asked what level they had reached.  "Level 5" was the answer.  I
	asked if they had used the cheating feature to see what was up at the
	higher levels.  He said "I'm not sure, I'll have to check."  I told
	John that they hadn't seen most of the game.

Overall, they were very friendly and encouraging.  John said I should try 
submitting it to some other companies that would be more interested in a 
fast-action game.  He said to re-submit it if I added a few new scenarios.

EA was the only company I've tried so far, because they were my first choice.  
Today I sent it to Infocom.  The owners of The Memory Location" told me that
they have recently become interested in arcade games.

At the same time I will be sending it to microIllusions in California.  All
these companies have a formal process for people like me to submit potential
products.   I thought that was suprising.  

I appreciate the interest of those volunteering to be new game testers.  

Right now the risk doesn't seem worth it.  I've been pretty trusting about
sending copies out so far.  And, in general, I feel I can trust the members 
of this conference.  BUT (you just knew there would be a but), if even one copy
got out of our hands, the results would be ugly.  My copy protection sceme 
helps and I don't know of a way to beat it, but someone out there might.

So the answer is a regret filled "no more new play testers".

Paul

    Hey Paul - how about putting a reply here describing the version
    that you sent to EA - I'd be interested to see what your final
    choices were with all the suggestions you recieved:
    
    best of luck with the software crowds
    
    Hope its a smash!
    
    Phil

It was version 0.6F.  The version that most of you have. 
It had no title screen, a bug with the MegaGun and debugging messges 
on the screen during game play.  Not that out of date.

What are some other companies that publish games like this?

    I haven't seen the game, so I can't say for sure, but it seems to
    me that Psygnosis, might be a place to look.  They've got a new
    line of games under the "Psyclapse" label which appears
    were not written in-house.  They seem to specialize in fast
    action, "wave games."
    
    You might also try DigiTek Software.  I read an article about them
    a few months ago that made them look like a great bunch to work
    for.
    
    These are not the "big boys" so you might have to be careful, but
    if 'twere me, I'd rather deal with smaller companies.  They're more
    likely to take a chance.

    Good Luck!!
    
    I'm looking forward to seeing it in the stores.
    
    
    Gary

    You might also try Acolade and Firebird (no idea where their based)
    
    Phil

re  < Note 2186.34 by AITG::WISNER "Paul Wisner, ...I have a totally traditional haircut..." >
>                          -< About new game testers. >-

>  I appreciate the interest of those volunteering to be new game testers.  

>  Right now the risk doesn't seem worth it.  I've been pretty trusting about
>  sending copies out so far.  And, in general, I feel I can trust the members 
>  of this conference.  BUT (you just knew there would be a but), if even one copy
>  got out of our hands, the results would be ugly.  My copy protection sceme 
>  helps and I don't know of a way to beat it, but someone out there might.

>  So the answer is a regret filled "no more new play testers".

>  Paul

	Gee, sounds like flattery to me:-^)  I just WISH I had half 
the expertise it would take to even ATTEMPT to break anyone's copy 
protection scheme.  Maybe you should bet a bag of donuts that nobody 
in this conference can break your scheme (tested on something not 
worth copying, natch),  get some testers for THAT part of your product 
too !

	R

    
    Paul,
    
    
         Perhaps I am missing the point of this whole exercise.  Did you
    write this game with the intention of making money?  Do you intend
    to sell this game to people?  If these answers are yes then why
    not simply offer to sell the game to anyone who wants it?  Since
    there is no middle man you would get all the profit and would get
    free advertisement as well.
    
    Harry

   Doesnt Paul have to officially copyright the game with some Govt
    dept first?
    
    then theres international copyrights as well
    
    Paul - would you like me to return my copy to you?
    
    Phil (looking forward to the final version)
    
    

    In the United States you don't have to register a copyright for it to
    be effective.  Just placing the copyright notice on your document,
    using the prescribed legal form, is sufficient.
        John Sauter

re: .40 demo version?  Not a bad idea!  It will be hard to decide what to leave
out!

re: .41 sell copies?   Well, yes... the point is to make money.  I think if I
sold copies it could upset any potential publishers (whom I am actively
soliciting).  If I'm not going to make *alot* of money, SpaceKillers might
possible become PD. (Since FAME is almost as important as FORTUNE). Naturally I
am hoping to make a bundle! 
It depends on how much I can get.  I have a certain amount in mind.
 
re: .42 No need to return your copy Phil.  You can keep it.  I'll update you
with the final version when the time comes.

re: .43 Right. You only need to display the Copyright notice.  Although the 
copyright office recomemnds that you register it with their office as legal
evidence.  I haven't done this yet, but I figure I have the source code and
a whole bunch of witnesses.  

-----------------------------------------------------

Does anyone have suggestions for new monsters???

    how about a monster that fires heat-seeking missiles - ie: missiles
    that follow you round the screen - you only lose them by VERY evasive
    tactics
    
    Phil

How about a Large monster that tries to eat you - Ship and all!

John

    How about a big black hole that sucks you in it.
    
    matt
    

Thank you to everyone who has tested the game.  Today is my last day as a co-op
at DEC.  In June I will graduate.  If I manage to get a job at DEC I'll be back.

I will continue to provide updates to those who send back their SpaceKillers
disks.  My new address from now until the June 15 is:

	Paul Wisner
	273 Ferry St.
	Malden, MA 02148
	(617)324-9162

The game has been submitted to Infocomm and MicroIllusions.  I'll tell someone
in this conference about what happens. 

I had alot of fun!

	-Paul

Well, I'm finally a perminant DEC employee in the AI Applications group in
Marlboro.  I haven't done any work on SpaceKillers since I last left DEC 
four months ago.  But, after a week of programming DECwindows, I'm starting 
to get the itch again.  I'm committed to having this game come out by the end
of the summer... I may make it a PD game- since I enjoy fame almost as much as
money.

What happened?  MicroIllusions sent me a five sentence letter:

	"...thank you...  
Your submission is not compatable with our product line."

Infocomm promised to reply to all submissions within four weeks.  Well it's
been four months.  I could have called them, but I was putting this whole
effort on hold during my last days of school.

What now?  There's one part I plan to add to the game.. a suprise ending.
I'll probably take away the option to start a new game at the point
where your last game ended.  Then, make it slightly shorter to get through
the levels (less time required).

-Paul Wisner 

Welcome back Paul.  Your plans sound neat.  Those of us that didn't get
to test the earlier versions may get to see a "final" version late this
summer, huh?  It sounds like something you've put a lot of work into.

Good luck!

...richard

    Hey Paul - Good to see you back!
    
    Phil

    
    Welcome home,
    
    I never got a chance to tell you that I created a gameport control
    for playing space killers which greatly enhanced the play.  The
    control was all buttons and no joystick.  The buttons were laid
    out in the same pattern as the buttons on Asteroids.  I felt that
    a rotational based game would work best if the rotation was controled
    by push botton.
    
    This was the layout:
    
    Left Button | Right Button | Down Button | Up Button | Fire Button
    ------------|--------------|-------------|-----------|------------
    Rotate      | Rotate       | Brake       | Accelerate| Fire
    Counter     | Clock-wise   |             |           |
    Clock-wise  |              |             |           |
    ------------------------------------------------------------------
    
    This gave me a great deal of control over the motion and the ability
    to fire sweeping bursts at my opponents.  I really enjoyed your
    game and it gave me and my little brother hours of pleasure.
    
    
    Would you be interested in designing in game options for more
    sophisticated custom gameport devices?  My next project will be
    to design a gameport device with an analog joystick and the maximum
    number of buttons the amiga can support.  I hope to follow that
    up with a conversion circut to allow the joystick to act as a switch
    based joystick.
    
    Anyone interested in this idea can send me mail at:
    
    CAM::ARENDT 
    
    Or call at:
    
    DTN 238-4313
    
    Or home at:
    
    203-644-4606

	If you have an idea for a great suprise ending for space killers then
send it to me via top secret VAX MAIL.   Of course, I'll never reveal if I used
it or not, you'll have to play the game for that!  This message will self
destruct in...

    If you make spacekillers PD then are you going to include the source
    code?? What did you program this game in?? I you still want to publish
    it you should make the enimies more realistic looking. My friends
    said they thought the game was fun but needed a more professional
    look on the figures.
    
    Me and a couple other people are working on a game that could be
    published!! Maybe I can get some people to test it..
    
    matt
    

I've been giving alot of thought on improving the graphics.  There's a definite
tradoff between good images and performance.   Large images and images that use
lots of colors really kills performance.  To maintain performance, I am 
restricted to smallish images and clever use of colors.  

For SpaceKillers, a great deal of artwork is required.   Anyone interested in
doing artwork for SpaceKillers- please contact me!  DPaintIII is one outstanding
tool for this, because you can now create an animated brush.  I can convert the
animated brush into a SpaceKillers creature.

This game is programmed in MANX C 3.6A.  I'll have to give some thought to
releasing the source code.  Gee... this could be embarassing!  

Work on the game is proceeding nicely.  SpaceKillers Release 1.0 is emminant 
(yes, you can start holding your breath- at your own risk).

Finally!  SpaceKillers 1.0 is available.

Please see note 2876.3 for kit location and installation instructions.

    When I try to list the archive on AIAG::  I get "Arcive spacekillers is
    invalid...  Empty directory?!!?"
     
    was it a good upload?  Or did I miss something?
     
    Thanks,
     
    JK
    

you need ot run cvtarc on it:

	$ cvtarc u spacekillers.zoo

This is the first time I've ever uploaded anything.

As a test, I successfully downloaded it and extracted something from it.  I
used KERMIT.

Do *I* need to run cvtarc on it, or does something happen to the file when it
is copied across VMS systems?

-Thanks

I HAVE UPDATED AIAG::DISK$FUN:[wisner.amiga]SPACEKILLERS.ZOO by running
"CVTARC U" on it.  I tried "zoo -list" on VMS and it worked.  I'll do another
download test tonight.

I retained both versions (until I understand this better):

SPACEKILLERS.ZOO;2   ;; I RAN "CVTARC U" ON IT.
SPACEKILLERS.ZOO;1   ;; DIDN'T CHANGE IT.

Please let me know if you have a successfull or failed installation.

-Paul Wisner

cvtarc u file	for any download EXCEPT KERMIT and for VAX based utiltiies

cvtarc v file 	for KERMIT transfers

So why do we use KERMIT? It's slooooow

john

    I have an e-net hook up with Decstation 325c.
    I copied it to a 720k formated disk, and used Cross-Dos to get it to
    an Amiga formatted 3.5 disk.
    When I unzooed it, one of the entries (explode.samp , I think) came
    back corrupted and that bounced me out of zoo.
    I'll try the cvtarced version tonight and let you know.
    
    				  			Ed
    			

re :.61  So when wil the ST version be released?
About six months after someone volunteers to port it.

re: .62  So why do we use KERMIT? It's slooooow
I tried using XMODEM, but it failed ("excessive retries") on several successive
attempts.

    re: .62
    
    You don't need the "cvtarc v file"  for KERMIT transfers
    if you just tell kermit "SET FILE TYPE BLOCK" before doing the 
    transfer.  The default is file type fixed.  That way you 
    can use the VAX based utilities AND KERMIT.
    
    The trick is to do a DIR/FULL of the file to be downloaded, if it
    doesn't say stream_lf, use "cvtarc u file" to make it that.
    
    Dave  
    p.s. anybody with sources to the VAX kermit want to change the
    default to file type block?  That may make it easier to use, now that
    there are lots of VMS based utilities like zoo, arc, lharc, etc. that
    all like STREAM_LF files.  And make it more consistent with those 
    "other" file transfer utilities :-)  

    I just did a successfull download.   From the downloaded zoo file
    I built a working SpaceKillers disk.
    
    I used KERMIT and I did a "SET FILE TYPE BLOCK".  On the Amiga, I
    am using Smokey X0.3 (with Xfer Mode = Image and Convert = OFF).
    
    -Paul

I've downloaded this ang got it working successfully. There seems to be a
lot of flicker - is that to be expected or is it a 50Hz/PAL feature?

Nick

    I too had alot of flicker at first, but after cold-booting the game it
    cleared up...
     By the way, great game! Very addictive...
    
    								Ed
    

>    I too had alot of flicker at first, but after cold-booting the game it
>    cleared up...

	Thanks. Yes - we seem to have observed the same thing. Its OK now.

>     By the way, great game! Very addictive...

	My son would agree with that one!
	
Nick

    I have never seen the flicker.  But I have recieved one other report
    of it (from an early model A1000 user).
    
    Pressing the "P" (pause) key twice might clear up flicker (if you ever
    see it again).  (Pause has the additional side effect of rewritting the
    Copper Lists, which can get messed up if you press AMIGA-M/AMIGA-N.)
    
    Paul Wisner

    Paul,
    
    I get BAAAAD flicker on my A500 with 1mb memory. This stops if I
    switch off the memory card :^(
    
    Great game though, do you any objections if I send it to some PD
    libraries over here in the UK????
    
    
    Greg

  >  Great game though, do you any objections if I send it to some PD
  >  libraries over here in the UK????
  
Please send it!  Thanks!

If anybody else has access to Amiga bulliten boards, please don't
hesitate to upload SpaceKillers.  I have access only to Internet news groups
and to BIX.

-Paul

>    I get BAAAAD flicker on my A500 with 1mb memory. This stops if I
>    switch off the memory card :^(

Could flicker be caused by wait states in expanded memory? 

I just had an idea.    Try this.  Copy NoFastMem (from extras disk) into 
SpaceKillers:c/NoFastMem.  And add NoFastMem to SpaceKillers:s/startup-sequence.

 

    
    Consider it spread!
     
    JK