Conference hydra::amiga_v1

    It may be awhile before the 500 and 2000's hit the street. So I
    wouldn't hold my breath waiting. 
    
    The 2000 sure is slick and the 500 less expensive, however I feel
    you can't go wrong with the original.
                                           
    Other than the (stupid!!!) differences in the expasion interfaces
    between the Amiga offerings, an Amiga is still an amiga.
    
    I don't like the 500 because of the attached keyboard, I like to
    sit back in the chair with the keyboard in my lap. This would be
    very difficult with the 500 ( Considering it would have a second
    drive, memory expansion, and hard disk attached)
    
    The 2000 appeals to me. However the extra bucks required to pick
    up the IBM clone capability just wasn't worth it, and I won't be
    adding more than one or two meg of memory and a hard disk, needs
    which can be readily meet by the current hardware for the 1000.
    If it turns out that having a clone is really important, I'll wait
    for SIDECAR.
    
    Unless you plan to add alot of fancy hardware for music,video etc
    I think the 1000 is the best investment. Everything you need is
    already commercially available. The 500 and 2000 options from third
    party suppliers is still just vaporware.

RE: .0

I've had my 1000 since they were first commercially
available.  I enjoy it thoroughly.  My *opinion*,
if you can wait, get A2000.  Of course, if you buy it
as soon as it becomes available, you'll pay lots more
for it than people will 1 year later.

But I think that in terms of peripheral investment
that accompanies the machine, the A2000 will ultimately
have more available, and that possibility of a 68020
in the special slot is always attractive.

Also, the A2000 is rumoured to list for 1695,
while the 1000 probably can be obtained for 895.
This is only $700, not the $1000 that you mentioned.

Of course, if you wan't it now.  Get the 1000,
I certainly have no regrets.

I don't think the 500 is worth considering.
But I'll spare this conference my views on that.
(Although I do think the 500 as a mass market item is good :-)

Dave

    I'm in the same boat, waiting to get my Amiga, and unless I'm convinced
    otherwise I'll likely get the 2000. IBMness isn't an issue so much
    as expandability, plus the fact that this is Commodore's new machine.
    I'm guessing that they will push harder for 2000 add-on cards &
    capabilities (especially with the recent change in top management).
    The 500's new of course, but more limited in expansion potential.
    
    You experienced CBM customers, any comments?
    
    -Keith Y.
    

    If IBMness is important to you, wait for the 2000 (in my opinion).
    I have heard the rumor that you can't plug anything else into the
    expansion port if the SIDECAR is attached.  Pretty much rules out
    other add-ons.
    
    -jim

    Re: .3
    
    If I had to do it all over again, I guess I'd get the 2000, for
    the various expandability reasons cited already.  However, ASDG
    has promised an A2000 box add-on for the A1000, so you'll be able
    to add any 2000 peripheral to a 1000.
    
    I DO like the new VT-like keyboards, (I always loved the ST's layout,
    but hated the cheap feel) but I think the keyboard garage of the
    1000 is the greatest invention since popcorn.
                  
    If a hard disk, Genlock, and several extra megs of RAM are all you'll
    ever need, I'd get a 1000 without any hesitation.

    Not to push it but...
    
    re .2
    
    If you dont think the added 700 dollars is a lot of money.. There
    is a nice bridge in NY I would like to sell you.
    
    That is almost twice as much as the 1000 and all you get for the
    trouble is a full meg. The IBM card is NOT supplied witht the 2000.
                          
    I know that the expasion cage is bundled in the price, but I decided
    to defer that cost (ala PAL Jr. etc) to when I actually have an
    axpasion card I really need to get (or can afford)
    
    The promised expansion cards are just that ... PROMISES!
    
    It has taken along time for the 1000 stuff to really start showing
    up, I can only expect the same kind of delay for the 2000. Maybe
    worse given the current changes at Commodore. (read below)
    
    re .3
    
    The changes in management at Commodore doesnt rue well for the 2000.
    I am afraid the TOYS"R"US bunch has won the battle at Commodore.
    Which is good for the 500. Rattigan was pushing for the high end
    of the market with the 2000, Gould is more in favor of mass market
    appeal the 500 would generate.
    
    I kind of agree with the above. The 64 & 128 are getting a little
    old and need something to firm up the bread and butter end of thier
    business (IT IS A BUSINESS AFTER ALL) and since I have an Amiga
    I really would like Commodore to stay solvent.
    
    I really don't expect to see the 2000 activly marketed, the 500
    however just might be. I do expect to see the PC-10 get more money
    than either of the others.(DUMB MOVE I think).
    
    All of the above is speculation, opinion and in general can be ignored
    by anyone who really MUST HAVE a 2000. Because when it comes right
    down to it you should really but what YOU really want.
    
    Like Bill Cosby say's "After all, ITS MY MONEY"
    
    <jim
               
    

    The 2000 has been in the shops over here (in Munich) for quite some
    time now. It sells for DM 2998,- usually (the 1000 is around DM
    1700, both prices without monitor). 1 US$ ~ DM 1.80.
    

    How are A2000s being received over there?  Are they a popular item?
    I'd really like to see the Amiga win back some of the market share
    lost to Atari due to the long-delayed European Amiga introduction.
    
    

re .6

I wasn't saying that $700 was a trivial amount.
I was merely pointing out that the price differential is\
not $1000 dollars, as was suggested previously.

For your extra $700, not only do you receive the additional
half-meg, but a built-in expansion chassis and larger power
supply (?), which are not present in the 1000.  Purchasing
an external chassis for my 1000 is much chancier because
it's hard to be sure which peripherals work with other
peripherals.  (For example, will a CLtd. Hard disk work
with my COMSPEC memory board?).

Also, buying the 2000 insures that you are getting the latest
and greatest and, presumably the most compatible machine
with future Commodore machines.  

As for Commodore management problems et. al.,  the risk has been
there since the A1000 came out, and it is still there, but
not like it was.  If you buy the machine, you take the chance
that the company won't always be there to support it.
But at least I don't own a PC Jr. :-)

Dave

    What's all the fuss about? In 3 or 4 years all this stuff is going
    to be obsolete anyway and we will want the new toy with a gigabyte
    of memory and a 64bit chip and 20 million colors on the screen at
    one time etc. :^)
    
    Seriously, buy the system that is going to meet your needs for the
    next few years and don't worry so much about future expandibility.
    I mean what kind of lifespan are we really talking about for a pc
    anyway.
    
    Chris
    
   

    re .8: I haven't seen any figures yet. The 1000 has been doing quite
    well after the drastic price drop here last fall (as I've stated
    elsewhere, an Amiga 1000 and Atari 1040ST [both without monitor]
    are roughly the same price depending on where you buy). At least
    one sees lots of classified ads in the magazines offering used 1000's
    'because of upgrade'.
    
    I haven't seen any 500's in the shops yet, but haven't been to any
    shops in past 2 or 3 week either. I'd bet it will sell like hot
    cakes here.
    

    Well, sometime is difficult to make a choice. I got an A1000 since
    it was available ( last september). Now I got the chance to exchange
    it for $200 ( YES, 200$US) with an A2000. But There are no add-ons
    available ( I have: starboard 2megas,Genlock,Digiview, Soundescape
    etc..). I've used the A2000 for a while, and I still prefere the
    A1000 ( question of feeling ?? ). I also want to keep the keyboard
    under Amiga etc.. The greatest think of A2000 is the clock ( Imiss
    it a lot) and the expandability. And it's a lot better manufactured.
    If you look the inside it's a total different story!
    With the A1000 we had to give-up MSDOS compatibility. No way to
    have it work with Harddisk AND memory at the same time ( unbuffered
    bus, you know!). So the idea is to stay with a1000, but...
    Our club also sells Amiga to members with some discounts and we
    have been told by Commodore Italy that NO MORE a1000 will hit the
    market. Finished. Out of production ( Pal version , at least !!).
    So, if you want a A1000, buy it now or never ! 
    BTW, some of the external device that works with A1000 may not work
    with A2000 ( power supply problems). This is the case of the PAL
    version of Genlock. A new version will be available next week, I've
    been told by Interactive Co. ( UK).
    
    Does this help ?!?!?!
    
    

RE:   < Note 493.12 by CESARE::ZABOT "Marco Zabot-Adv.Tech.mgr-Turin ACT" >
>                                -< Dilemma !! >-
>
>                                ...... Now I got the chance to exchange
    it for $200 ( YES, 200$US) with an A2000.                      
            
   WOW. How'd you manage that.
    ... .  .     Rich

    Well, I can sell my Amiga A1000 for almost full price ( 2,300kL)
    via the Amiga-club and pay the A2000 with a large discount (2,550KL).
    The price for A2000 here is L.3,000,000 = US$ 2,300 including the
    Monitor ( new version of the old one, no long persistance ) and
    a second drive ( Panasonic ). This price includes Sales TAX which
    is the 18 % making the price in NewHampshire 1,950 bucks!
    The is regular member price. Discount price for 'special' people
    is in the range of 25%. NH price=1,460 $ including Monitor and second
    drive. That's my projected price you may expect from ABEL shortly!
    Good luck!
    

    Now you've got me wondering...What's better, mail-order from a
    reputable supplier (ABEL seems to have a good name on the Usenet),
    or buy from a local dealer in case you need to return something
    within the warranty period? I'm in Colo. Springs & would probably
    buy here or Denver. But those discounts sure can be alluring..
    
    KY
    

Re: .15

>What's better, mail-order from a reputable supplier... or buy from a
>local dealer in case you need to return something within the warranty
>period?

It depends.  Personally, I recommend buying locally if you need handholding
or it would be a hardship if you lost use of your system for two or three
weeks.

If you are computer literate, and up to assembling the system when you
get it, mail order is a good idea.  Assembling an Amiga is less hard than
connecting all the components of a stereo.

However, suppose you use your computer to run your business.  If losing
use of your computer for a few weeks by sending it back to the mail order
house for service causes problems, then buying locally may be the way to
go.