Conference hydra::amiga_v1

re:	.0

If you want ALOT more capability from uEmacs as well as having it run on
AMIGA, VMS and ULTRIX, try looking at:

	COOKIE::DISK$GZ_DISK:[WECKER.EMACS.UEMACS]

There is a UEMACS.EXE for VMS, one compiler switch needs to be changed in
ESTRUCT.H to get it to compile on ULTRIX or the AMIGA.

It has:

	Regular expressions
	startup files
	macros
	smart scrolling regions
	slow speed (1200 baud) searches (1 line windows)
	sub process windows (on ULTRIX)
	lots more (see UEMACS.HLP)

It's the only editor I use on all three operating systems.

dave

P.S.	Yes, I got GNU to run on VMS... it's too big to be useful to me
	so I gave up on it.

When I do "^H-a macro" in my VMS GNUEmacs, it lists seven commands containing
the substring "macro": Append-Kbd-Macro, Call-Last-Kbd-Macro, End-Kbd-Macro,
Kbd-Macro-Query, Name-Last-Kbd-Macro, Start-Kbd-Macro, and Write-Kbd-Macro.
Does your's do this?  If so, is that not enough?  I guess I don't understand
what you need.

I don't have micro-GNUEmacs yet, so I don't know that these functions exist in
the (I assume) stripped down micro-version.  If it's just that they aren't
documented, you might get by on the manual from the latest version of
(VMS-compatible) GNUEmacs from THEBAY""::SYS$KITS:[GNU] (courtesy of Matt
Thomas).  WARNING: It's a big distribution, even in compressed form.

ANOTHER WARNING:  I've been trying to get this latest version to compile under
VMS, and have been getting big headaches (in close correlation :-).  Now that
the holidays are over and I have the latest field test version of VAXC (which
happily includes an implementation of QSORT), I'll be wrestling with it again.
If you are interested in getting GNUEmacs up on your VMS system, or
if you just want to get a copy of the manual without trying to swallow that
mammoth distribution, drop me a message.

Re: .1.  GNUEmacs is the only text editor I use on VMS.  I haven't used UEMACS
so I don't know how it stacks up feature for feature, but I have formed quite
an affection for the editor that saved me from the horrors of EDT, and MockLisp.
As far as I know, GNUEmacs has everything Dave mentioned.  It also has a real
LISP for its extension language, I don't know how many modes (including TeX
mode, Towers of Hanoi, Doctor, etc.) and all kinds of nice things I once tried
to hack up in MockLisp (such efforts resulting in recurring headaches and bloody
noses :-).

Your friendly local free-software pusher,
-Matt Birkholz

P.S. The GNU notes file will contain pointers to new versions of GNUEmacs, plus
     other information about the GNU movement.

I do not think that "true" GNU Emacs has ever been ported to the Amiga.
It is a very, very large program.  I believe that it requires either
one-half of a megabyte or three-quarters of a megabyte just for the code.
This is no problem on a 2.5 meg Amiga, but for those of you with out
expansion ram, I don't think it will fit.

MicroGNU Emacs is a variant of micro Emacs that has GNU-compatible key
bindings and a few new editing functions necessary to support the more
common GNU editing operations.  MicroGNU Emacs does not have an extension
language.  It is just a prettied up micro Emacs.

I do not know how close the new microGNU Emacs (as found on Fish disk 42)
is to real GNU Emacs.  I would like to find out, however.

Re .3:

I just though of a fairly major problem with real GNU Emacs on the Amiga.
If the code is that close to a megabyte, GNU Emacs probably would not fit
on an 880k diskette.

MicroGNUEmacs is just uEMACS hacked up to look like GNU?!?!?
I'm glad I found this out before wasting too much time or money getting it!
Now I can wait.

Perhaps someone else who has or is getting it could clarify whether this is
all just a hoax?

Re: .4 -- My VMS version of GNUEmacs has a 688 block image that maps in
1200 blocks of (I guess) lisp-ish stuff.  Either one will fit on a disk
(AND the map file won't have to be that big if you don't need 200 modes [so
I exaggerate] simulateously).

Please don't laugh, but I'd like to know if anyone has seriously considered
a virtual paging AMIGA.  As I understand it, the TURBO AMIGA doesn't page,
though all it would need is a Memory Management Unit to complete the hardware
requirements, and a UNIX license or completed GNU system on the software end.

Any takers?

-Matt

I stand corrected on the size of GNU Emacs.  I have never seen an
executable, I just remembered some comment I read in the GNU
newsletter.

I have an earlier version of microGNU Emacs from Fish disk 23.  Unless
there are two programs calling themselves microGNU Emacs, I believe
the situation is I described in .4.

The problem with paging on the Amiga isn't CPU related hardware: its
disks.  Paging on a floppy is to ludicrous--too damn slow.  Furthermore,
since I have a 2.5 Meg Amiga, I can just see the system requester for
"Please insert Swap Disk #3 in any drive." :->

Maybe the hard drives on the Amiga might be fast enough to allow swapping,
but I am not that eager to find out.  Instead of paging,  I would like
to just see a memory protection scheme that prevented errant tasks from
corrupting the system.  Most of the time, it has been my experience that
a buggy program simply causes a "Task Held" requester to be put up, and
the rest of the system will still function normally.  But real buggy
programs (like Egad!) will blow the entire system up.

    Thanks for the responses.  I'll probably try Dave's uEmacs first
    to see if it has keyboard macro definitions -- that's my primary
    concern.  I much prefer typing the keystrokes with a "sample" string
    and seeing what I want to happen, happen, to trying to figure out
    ahead of time what the keystrokes should be and testing the definition
    (as with EDT).  Re: .2, what you describe sounds like what I want
    to do, but with the VMS Emacs I'm using now, I type CTRL-X, CTRL-(,
    the keystrokes I want, CTRL-).  So that's what I tried, it didn't
    work and I was stuck.
    
    The other reason I'll try uEmacs first is the size of GNUemacs.
    The version of MicroEmacs I'm using now allows me to edit 150K files
    with 512K of memory.  As I like to keep things together in one file
    I wouldn't want to be limited to smaller files.
    
    But it is helpful to know that some documentation exists for GNUemacs.
    The VMS Emacs I'm using only has oral documentation; MicroEmacs
    is a bit better because of the pull-down menus.
    
    One (minor) concern I have about MicroEmacs is the number of versions
    floating around.  The last Usenet submissions I saw were two divergent
    versions posted at the same time.  I think they were the same ones
    placed on the same Fish disk.  But my copy is an entirely different
    strain (ported by someone at Commodore I believe, version 0.9).
    There was some talk about merging the versions after the Usenet
    posting, but I haven't seen anything about for a while.
    
    Again, thanks for the help.
    
    Dirk Voss

re:	.7

->	On my uEMACS you type:

		^X-(	- starts a keyboard macro
		^X-)	- ends a keyboard macro
		^Z	- to execute the macro

	The reason for the wierd execute (^Z), is that I wanted a single
	keystroke for execution (so you you can hit them fast), and ^Z
	was the only one really available. You can of course rebind the
	keyboard to anything you want.

	BTW: you don't get named macros, only this 1 unnamed macro.

->  	Size on the Amiga is about 60k

->	No menus on mine. You've got the help file, and can ask for help
	via either ^X-? (describe key) M-? (describe bindings) PF2 or
	M-X help (gets you the help file) or you can ask me (when all else
	fails).

->	My version is NOT compatible with ANY of them... lots of rewriting
	(you get what you pay for).    

dave

    Is there a kind soul out there that would be willing to snail-mail
    me a copy of Dave's u-emacs? as I am unable to download it myself.
    I'll gladly send back a blank (or full) disk.
    
    If you are willing, please send me E-mail at Dneast::pfister_rob
    
    thanks

Does anyone out there have an ARC file of a compiled version of Daves
UEmacs for the Amiga? 

 I transferred the sources over to my system but am not yet into 'C'.

Thanks,

John

    
    
    GNUE emacs is on FF disk 68. I'll put you on the express list for
    upload.
    
    
    		Steve Peters
    		

	Version 2 of MicroGNUEmacs was supposedly posted to comp.sources.misc
recently.  Does anyone have a copy?  I don't get comp.sources.misc, but would
like to take a look at mg2a.

Thanks,
Mark