Conference 7.286::sports_91

Hawk,

That's exactly what I was thinking of when I mentioned Nintendo.

I think that kids ultimately have to develop a sense of discipline,
and they learn that from their parents.  Discipline is what breeds
Olympic Champions and Hall of Famers......

While we've kind of strayed off the sports path here, this discussion
is worthwhile, and does in a way apply to sports.  

how many times have we seen parents who push their kids too hard in
sports endeavours and/or try to live out their own fantasies through
their kids?

Parenting must be one helluva hard job, and I hope I'm up to it when
the time comes...

'Saw

    
    What exactly can these Nintendo hand-eye coordination skills be 
    transferred to?  Higher-developed video games?
    
    As a father of three, I intend on holding out and being a hard-ass for
    as long as I can as concerns these things.  Like Hawk suggests, once it
    gets started, it may be difficult to nip in the bud.  I know I won't be
    able to dictate what my kids can and can't do forever, but I'll do my
    damndest trying (I think I'll probably be one of those guys asking
    guys like /Don to check their johnsons at the door, too... ;-) )
    
    glenn
    

The coordination developed by Nintendo is transferable almost
to anything.

Nintendo tends to develop fine motor coordination (as opposed to
gross motor coordination) and those skills (hand-eye and sharpened
reflexes) are applicable to many things a youngster does.

For example, to strengthen his eyes, a former NHL goalie (Glen Wresch
I believe) used ot take an ordinary piece of pegboard -- you know,
like you'd use in your garage to hang tools on), cut it in a circle,
then mount is on a nail or peg in the center.

He's spin this around, and then try to insert a golf tee into the various
holes as it was spinning.  Could that coordination gained only be applied
to a better version of spinning peg board?  Nope, it translated into
quickening of the eye reflexes, and the hand coordination needed to
get in front of the puck..  Same principal....

hth,
'Saw

PS  I'm going to open a SPORT VIDEO GAME topic and we should move this
    discussion there....

    Hey, how'd that LA Law stuff get in here?  You guys are moving stuff
    around so fast my head is spinning...
    
    I hear you on the coordination stuff, 'Saw, and that was the answer I
    was expecting.  The remark about more advanced video games was made
    only slightly in jest.  The real point I was trying to make is that 
    while a generation may be developing ultra-sensitive pure hand-eye
    coordination, what good does it do?  It might help the kid who plays 
    the game in moderation as compared to the development of his (in my 
    opinion) more important gross motor coordination, but I don't believe 
    that's what's happening in most cases.  The net effect in all too many
    instances (like with Hawk's acquaintance) is dullened, out-of-shape 
    kids.  The few that might really use this fine-tuned coordination 
    after they become hockey goalies or pilots or whatever are few and far 
    between.  On the other side of the coin, everyone benefits from being 
    in good physical shape.  I'm led to believe that the kids would be
    better off kicking a ball around...   
    
    Re. parenting:
    
    Hawk, I've thought about it often and I know what you're saying. 
    Everything is not going to go as perfectly planned, and adaptation and
    compromise will be critical.  But for now, while they're young and
    accepting of whatever comes their way, I'm building up my defenses.
    I mean, I've got to have some credibility when it comes time to draw
    the line, right? ;-)
    
    glenn
     

    I've found that the best way to have credibility when holding a
    line, is to have a good, solid reason why that is my line and tell
    the kid the reason.  Can lead to some *very* interesting discussions
    on what I value versus what other folks value, and why the differences.
    
    The good news is that most kids outgrow the addiction to
    video-anything, especially if their parents have other interests
    and encourage the kids to share them.  I watch the tube a lot, almost
    always sports.  Last year my kid turned off the TV, and he hasn't
    turned it on in over 12 months!  He now regards it as pretty stupid,
    and prefers to read a book when he has some free time.  If you'd
    asked me if I ever thought this would happen when he was in grade
    school, I woulda answered an unequivocal no.
    
    A&W

	HAs anyone here every played the arcade game Cyberball?  It's not on 
nintendo (although I think Sega has a version for it's home system.)  It's an
arcade game put out by Atari.  It's supposed to be  futuristic football played
with robots.  One to four people can play.  When four people play it's is two
people per side each team having their own monitor. There are different type's
of robots each having their own characteristics.  Linebackers are big hulk-type
things, Safteys quickier and smaller, Wide recivers are spindly roboots mounted
on a unicycle type wheel and are quick, there are also tight ends, the 
quaterback, outside linebackers and others. You get a choice of three categorys 
of plays on offense (run, pass and option) and defense (long, mdeium, short).
Once you choose the category you can choose from 4 different plays.  The 
offensive plays change from play to play and each team has some special plays
designed for it's offense (Run, pass, or balanced attack.)  There is no punting
or field goals in the game.  Instead of 4 downs and 10 yards you have to  
defuse the ball by advancing over midfield or coring a touchdown.  The
ball has a status (cold-cool-warm-hot-critical) and if you don't defuse it 
(bringing the status back to cold) once it is critical it will blow up (maybe
blowing up one of your players with it) and the defense will gain possesion.
Players who blow up are replaced with slow version of that type.  You get funds
throughout the game when you defuse the ball or stop people on defense and you
can use these funds to upgrade players.  It is one of the best sports arcade 
games I've ever played.

Mc

Glenn (can't remember if it's one "n" or two, and I don't feel like
quitting this editing session to go back and look, so apologies up 
front) --

I hear you on the outta shape kids.  That's where, I think, trying to
mold your kids to be well rounded helps.  No kid of mine will ever
sit inside and play Nintendo on a gorgeous day when he/she and I could
be out throwing a ball around, taking a walk, or even exploring
old railroad track (right Hawk?).....

The more we talk about this, the more I realize just what an awesome
responsibility parenting is....

'Saw

Not sports related, exactly....

Does anyone know if Nintendo makes a version of Crystal Caves,
the arcade game where the bear runs around picking up the little
crystals, avoiding all the bad thingies?

deen to wonk,
'Saw

    'Hawk,
    	I had to smile when you mentioned thinking about your daughter
    dating when she's 15 or so.. ,My best friend's daughter is seventeen
    and I remember her going out on her first "car" date when she was 15 or
    16. My buddy snuck up behind her as the doorbell rang,opened the door
    and said to the surprised guy(in front of his daughter) "So where are
    WE going tonight!
    
    No and I don't think he checked out johnson's,that final withering
    stare did the trick.
    
    MikeL
     

    >The real point I was trying to make is that 
    >while a generation may be developing ultra-sensitive pure hand-eye
    >coordination, what good does it do? 
    
    On the other side of the coin, while the skills that video games
    develop may not contribute greatly to one's physical well being, the
    can be a nearly unmatched aid in developing a logical thought process
    in youngsters.  Particular games are only solved through careful
    thought processes which reveal a unique (and hopefully consistent
    solution).
    
    While this skill can present itself useful in many walks of life, one
    place in particular I think it can help is standardized tests such as
    the GREs which have an entire section on logic.
    
    Dan

    
    I don't like video games.
    
    Must be the coordination and logical thought thing that gets me.
    
    Dickstah the scatter-brained stumbler
    

While I have a Nintendo at home, if I'm in an arcade, I'd much rather
play pinball, also.

One of my fondest memories was playing a Captain Fantastic Table down
in Wash DC on a trip in my freshman year of college....

'Saw

    
    I never played much pinball even as a kid, but I used to pump a lot of
    nickels in the ski-ball machines at the beach.  If you scored 180 or
    more you got a coupon.  Saved 'em up for a whole summer and got this
    gawd-awful plastic lamp and some chalk-like statue that was supposed to
    be a soldier, but looked more like some phallic symbol.
    
    Mom:  "Oh, Dickie, why that's just... umm....lovely...why don't you put
    them on your father's workbench in the cellar.  I'm sure he'll be so...
    uh....surprised."
    
    Dickie
    

    Ah Video Games, I seen alot of money go into those little slots,
    use to hang out at the good ol Kelly's Lanes in maynard when I was
    a boy...Althouth I was lucky my uncle owned a vending maching service
    I use to work for him cleaning the machines (spent more time playing
    than cleaning) I Have to say the basketball games are the most intense
    of any of the sports machines...I do like blades of steal for nintendo
    
    I wish there was just One football game, there's seems to be about 10+
    different football games out now..........Now JM has one coming out
    too....Money talks....
    							M.Air.Brooks

    Mike, I've seen that robotic football game in an Arcade near
    Disneyland.  I have to admit it looked great when I saw these 4 guys
    playing 2 on two.  Being 4 screens wide and a new game, they charged 50
    cents a game, so I gave it a shot, me against the computer.  My 50
    cents goes in, I played, not having much of a clue what I was doing,
    and the game was over in about 6.2 seconds.  I said waitaminue, no game
    gets the best of me, so I plunked down another 50 cents, and played
    about 7.1 seconds the second time.  I figured that after about 10
    bucks, I'll have played for a minute and went hunting around for a
    better investment.
    
    Dan

�                                        In one case, a mom was almost
�    in tears about how her "A" student son's grades were destroyed because
�    of too much Nintendo.

My wife's a psychologist. (Everybody laughs and nods knowingly when I
say that. She claims that I've made her more happy-go-lucky.. and she's
calmed me down quite a bit... Can you imagine what I USED to be
like?!?!)

Anyway, she had this parent in - a guy - and he was going on and on
about the amount of television the kids watched, and how grades
were suffering, and the kids seemed lethargic, and didn't play outside
much... blah, blah, blah,
so  Big Suze says `Why don't you shut off the Television?' 
and the guy gets this amazed look on his face and says ` EH?!?'

Some people are just total boneheads.

I think you are right about the hand-eye thing. Can't hurt. I know
Michael is about the best fielding pitcher I've ever seen (course he
works at it, too), and I don't think Nintendo has hurt a bit.
From the time he got it, though, there were some limits on the amount of
time expended on it...  and school work never suffers because of
ANYTHING.

Another good hand-eye activity which can start building character. Every
once in awhile I take Mike to a bar to shoot pool. Some people
(including Big Suze) aren't sure this is the best of ideas, but he's 12
years old, and I started shooting pool in bars when I was 8, and look
how wonderful I turned out... (anyone with snide comments can just put a
sock in it!).

Mike JN (SIDJNOTY)

....also...

Nintendo is coming out with a 16 bit machine now that is supposed to be
really super.

It's out already in Japan, burt not available (I don't think) yet in the
U.S.

Mike JN (SIDJNOTY)

Dan,
	
	All of the ones that I've seen around here are $.25 a period (six 
periods in a game.) 1.50 a game/per person.  The games last pretty long once
you played a bit and pick plays a little faster.  At 2.50 a game I don't
think it would be worth it though.   

  It's gotta be played two-on-two to get the get the full effect.  The graphics
and sounds are great.

mc

    re .25 mc.
    
    Cyberball is the best arcade game IMHO. I am pretty good and will take
    on anyone who puts their token in on the other side, (unless they
    chicken out). My favorite team is the California Crush. 

    Cyberball, never seen it...I personally enjoy games that rely solely
    on hand eye cordination and quick reflexas...a good example are any
    of the pac-family games (well most of them).  You have to keep track
    of all 4 ghost against just you relying on coordination and reflexas
    to keep going....I love pac-man when you get up to the key levels and
    mrs pacman after about 150,000 get pretty exciting as well......
    
    As for sports games is usally just comes down to you against another
    person, in video games a computer is usally more skillful than a
    breathing apponent although most games VS computer are not difficult
    enough...Some of the newer games have selections for difficult level.
    
    								MAB

    How about the arcade game, NFL Quarterback ? It's played between two 9
    man teams, and you have about 15 different offensive plays you can
    choose from, and almost as many defenses. It is for up to four players,
    and the part about it I like the most is that for a quarter, you get
    100 units. You can buy performance-enhancing equipment for different
    amounts to help your team perform better. And with my run and shoot
    variation, I score an average of 55-60 points a game ....

RE: .26 J_hernandez


	Where do you play?  I've gotten pretty good at it also.  Maybe we
can get together for a game some time.

Mc

    Let me get this right, you dump in QTR's untill you have more units
    than your oppenant...Just how much money can you spend on this game
    and what happens if your opponent has alot more money than you ????
    THis game sounds expensive...
    								Mab

    re .30
    
    No no, it's not like that. In fact I usually play a very tough computer
    opponent. I figure to play a full ballgame costs around $4-$5. But you
    do get your money's worth believe me !

    	Hey Doc, I heard when the temperature drops a few degrees in
    the arcade your run and shoot offense bites the dust.
    
    				/Don

    I is in Colo. Spgs. I play at either Play America, Aladin's Castle,
    Boardwalk or the one in the Citidel. 

>    I is in Colo. Spgs. I play at either Play America, Aladin's Castle,
>    Boardwalk or the one in the Citidel. 

	too bad...New Hapshire to Clororado is too far just to play Cyberball.


Mc

Anyone seen any SPORTS games for that new super Nintendo system, wif
da 16 bits?

'Saw

Saw,

	Forget the SNES!!  Get the 16 Bit Sega Genisis and get the NHL 
HOCKEY game.  it Rulz!!  line Changes (on the fly), checking, fights,  
great sound, off-sides, penalties. Has all 22 teams based on last years players
 (Sharks are based on what they thought they would be like this year.) Each 
team has three regular lines (scoring 1 & 2 + a checking line) and two Power
play and penalty killing.  You can play one player against cpu  or two players
head to head or as teammates.  It has a playoff mode where you try to bring 
your team through the playoffs.  IN playoff mode you get hightlights from 
the other games during intermissions.  And I almost forgot INSTANT REPLAY.  At
any time you can stop the game and watch instant replay of the last 10 seconds.
You control the instant replay, forward, reverse, slow mo, stop action.  Best 
sports game i've seen.

	Plus there PGA GOLF, John Madden Football....

mc

I think my brother has a Sega Genesis.  I'll have to find out.  If so
he might have that game.

Might have to take a trip over there one of these days under the pretext
of seeing how he's doing....heh heh heh.....

'Saw

    The only SNES games I've seen advertised are Super Marioworld and a car
    racing game.

    
     So I got the video game for christmas...  A Sega Genisis, 16 bit
    machine.  Pretty cool...  Got John Madden football and NHLPA hockey.
    Man are these game realistic and complicated.  John madden football 
    is really a trip.  it has many many different offensive and deffensive 
    alignments and plays.  You can audible for run to pass and pass to run.
    it calls penalities realisticly and has a game clock.  You can play
    in snow, wind, rain, in a dome or in fair weather. The
    runners/receivers can put on a spin move and break tackles.  Defenses
    can call a blitz from several locations, safety, full, corner...
    very interesting...  Lot o` fun.
    
     Hockey is cool too.  It call offsides the players fight and get thrown
    out.  There are real injuries (football too)...  Amazing stuff
    
    BG