Conference ulysse::rdb_vms_competition

    Michael,
    
    From your note I understand that prices went up on all platforms by
    the same order of magnitude (right?). Would it still be fair to say
    that O is priced higher on VAX than on other HW (HP, Sequent) in the
    same performance class?
    
    Thanks,
    
    
    Henny

    Oracle prices are based on the price of the underlying CPU.
    Consequently, Oracle is more expensive on VAX and other proprietary
    systems than on comparably powered Unix systems.
    
    As an example, the "top of the line" prices are:
    
    HP-UX, model 9000/855s - $103,000
    HP-MPE/XL model 960/200- $193,000
    IBM Powerstations (Models 320, 520, 530, 730) > 64 users - $79,000
    Pyramid & Sequent > 256 users - $174,000
    Sun 3 & 4 Workstations, Data General Aviion > 128 users - $141,000
    Digital RISC DECsystem 5820 - $79,000
    Digital VMS 9000-440 $224,000
    IBM 3090-600J - $281,000
    
    ---- Michael Booth
    

Michael,

	Does Oracle quote prices of U6000/80 and U6000/60 platforms?  We are
working an RFP for the Florida Department of Law Enforcement and Oracle is one
competitor.  They have teamed with Unisys and quoted a UNIX platform consisting
of the above two UNISYS boxes.  (Actually, 2 of each).  They quote the U6000/80
as being 80 mips (16 x 5 mip 80386 chips....?).

	Anyway, if you have any info about Oracle on this platform, it might
prove useful.

Thanks, Rusty.

    There are no Unisys prices in the Oracle pricing literature, which
    leads me to believe that Unisys itself does the Oracle port to this Unisys
    hardware, or that these Unisys boxes are really OEMed from Sequent or
    Pyramid (probably Sequent). Sorry I can't offer more concrete data, but 
    there simply are not any prices from Oracle on this type of Unisys box. 
    Didn't I read somewhere that Unisys would OEM these from Pyramid or
    Sequent?
    
    Oracle (RDBMS-only) Sequent is by # of users:
    >256 $174,000
    129-256 $127,000
    65-128 $103,000
    33-64 $74,000
    1-32 $53,000
    
    Pyriamid pricing is exactly the same as Sequent pricing.
    
    
    ---- Michael Booth

What about DECsystem 5000 pricing for Oracle ?

Paul.

    The only RISC machines in the price list are the 5400, 5810, 5820, and
    3100.
    
    ---- Michael Booth

    I believe that the per-user pricing is not just for Sequent and Pyramid
    platforms, but for all UNIX/ULTRIX (including DEC's) platforms.  It's a
    common complaint from the VMS (and probably IBM) Oracle users.  I
    talked with Neil Mendelson from Oracle (he's one of the Oracle on DEC
    people that are measured by the volume of DEC business) while at
    DECworld, and he pretty much said that they knew people were not happy
    with it, that it didn't make any sense, that they might change it
    someday, but that it would not happen anytime soon.  

    WRONG, WRONG, WRONG!! The per user pricing seems to have nothing to do
    with the OS!
    
    I am looking at the Oracle price list dated 7/1990. That's pretty
    current.
    
    The following platforms are priced per user:
    
    Apollo DN3000/4000 (Domain SR10)
    Aplool 10000 (Domain SR10)
    AT&T, Model 6386 (Unix)
    Convergent NGEN (CTOS/VM) 
    Data General Aviion (DG/UX)
    Digital Microvax Products (VMS and Unix) - breakdown by 1-10, 1-20, and
    unlimited. In other words, it matches the operating system.
    HP 9000/3XX, and 9000/870s (HP-UX)
    IBM PowerStation 320, 520, 530, 730 (AIX)
    IBM RT (AIX)
    MIPS RS2030 RISCstations (RISC operating system)
    NCR Tower 32/825 (Unix)
    Pyramid (OSX)
    Sequent (Dynix)
    Sun 3 (Sun OS)
    Sun 4 (Sun OS)
    Sun 386i (Sun OS)
    Wang VS 5000 (VS)
    PC Compatibles 286/386/486 (SCO Xenix, SCO UNIX, ISC 386/ix, PS/2 AIX,
    CT-SPC Series)
    
    The following platforms ARE NOT priced per user:
    
    AT&T other than 6386 (Unix)
    Data General other than Aviion (AOS/VS)
    Digital (all platforms - Unix, Ultrix, VMS)
    HP 980/x, 960, 950, 925LX, 922RX, (MPE/XL)
    HP 9000/855s, 9000/850, 9000/840, 835, 845se, 9000/835, 835se, 832s,   
    9000/845s, 635sv, 645sv, 9000/815, 9000/500, 9000/808 (HP-UX)
    All IBM 370
    IBM PowerStations 930 and 540 (AIX)
    MIPS RC6280, RC3260, M/2000, RC3240, RC2030 (RISC operating System)
    NCR Tower all except 32/825 (Unix)
    All Stratus (VOS)
    All Wang except VS5000 (VS)
    
    
    
    
    

    Mike,
    
    Can you work up a quick pricing for all the components a 'typical'
    oracle shop would purchase for a typical VAX system (6410) so that I
    can update the comparison overhead?
    
    ORacle DB Engine
    SQL
    TPO
    Network access
    precompilers...
    dictionary(if they have one yet...)
    
    Cheers,
    
    Gil
    
    P.S. How's chi-town weather as compared to greater Nash-oo-way?
    
    

    RDBMS -              $103,000
    TPO   -              $ 41,200
    SQL*Plus -           $ 25,750
    SQL*Connect to RMS - $ 25,750
    SQL*Net -            $ 20,600
    DECnet Driver -      $ 15,450
    Precompiler -        $ 15,450
    -----------------------------
    Total =              $247,200
    
    Yearly Maintenance
    
    Year           Amount
    ---------------------
    1                   0
    2            $ 42,642
    3            $ 49,038
    4            $ 56,394
    5            $ 64,853
    ---------------------
    Total =      $212,927
    
    
    For the graphic, the yearly numbers should be:
    
    1 $247,200
    2 $289,842
    3 $338,880
    4 $395,274
    5 $460,127
    
    Yearly maintenance calculated as 15% of MLP. MLP increased 15% per
    year.
    
    SQL*Connect has been added since all tools that work with Rdb also
    offer transparent access to RMS. SQL*Connect merely gives Oracle tools
    same capability. Oracle will likely respond that SQL*Connect gives you
    "SQL" connectivity to RMS. I would respond with the question, "How many
    users will execute SQL queries vs. the number that will use the
    4GL/report writer for queries?"
    
    The weather here is much better, thanks. Dry and cool this week.
    
    ---- Michael Booth

    Thank You SIR!
    
    Gil
    

  Re: .0
  >I got my hands on the July, 1990 Oracle price list. Here's what it
  >looks like, generally. 

   I got *my* hands on one, too.  It's called "Digital's U.S. Software 
   Price Book. (Prices as of July 2, 1990)"  Order number is EE-C0167-38.
   See pages 120-132 for your one-stop data management software shopping.

   It doesn't have prices for all processors or for the updates, maintenance,
   support, etc., but call Oracle; they'll gladly tell you.


   Bruce
   Who's_presenting_Michael_Booth's_"Winning_The_Database"_to_2_sales -
   _units_next_month

                  I N T E R O F F I C E   M E M O R A N D U M

                                        Date:     28-Sep-1990 02:17pm PDT
                                        From:     
                                           
                                        Dept:     EIS Third Party Bus Mgr
                                        Tel No:   

TO: See Below

Subject: Oracle Alert!

There is some confusion regarding the Oracle prices in our price book.  
These prices are for ULTRIX ONLY.  Some sales reps are using these prices 
for VMS quotes and inadvertently creating a loss for Digital.  Oracle prices 
(and our costs) for VMS are significantly higher than for Ultrix.  We are 
trying to get the price book to more accurately reflect the description for 
the next release.

In the interim, ANY Oracle VMS sales quote needs to be obtained through me.  
I am at [Phone number deleted -For former Southwest area only].  Please 
distribute this as you think appropriate.