[Search for users] [Overall Top Noters] [List of all Conferences] [Download this site]

Conference ulysse::rdb_vms_competition

Title:DEC Rdb against the World
Moderator:HERON::GODFRIND
Created:Fri Jun 12 1987
Last Modified:Thu Feb 23 1995
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1348
Total number of notes:5438

121.0. "Help on AS?" by WARDER::MEAKINS (Clive Meakins) Wed Apr 20 1988 12:01

    Does anyone have any information on IBM's AS running with DB2? 
 
    We are in a competative situation with IBM and are presenting our
    proposal on friday 22nd April.  Having found out that we are competing
    with AS we have a chance to push the better features of RALLY against
    AS.  It's unfortunate that we are unable to present RALLY v2, but
    the customer won't entertain any discussion on futures.

    This note has also been posted in Rally Competition notes file.
     
    regards,                          
    Clive Meakins.
T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
DateLines
121.1bits and piecesCOOKIE::JANORDBYTue Apr 26 1988 17:4210
    I only have a couple of tidbits.
    
    AS is sold with almost every DB2 installation. 
    
    It has a reputation as being very expensive both in terms of initial
    price and resource utilization. AS will use up praportionally more
    resources of a more expensive hardware solution than will Rally
    or 3rd party tools.
    
    Jamey Nordby
121.2Personal LookQUILL::BOOTHA Career in MISunderstandingThu Apr 28 1988 15:4143
  I have seen AS at a large account. I also had the opportunity to talk
to some of the users.
  AS is IBM's info center and end user information manipulation and display
system. It accesses both DB2 and VSAM files. VSAM files are treated as tables
that can be "joined" as needed. At least in the version I looked at (6 months
ago), DB2 tables had to be "imported" and that had to be done via the AS
application language. The customer expected that access difference to be
resolved soon.
  AS has many components. It has a spreadsheet, graphics, application
development language, report writer, etc. packaged with a PF-Key (function
key) driven user interface.
  The graphics component is very good. The graphics system is based on IBM's
GDDM. There are 8 standard graph types with numerous modification options.
There is a good bit of flexibility built-in to the graphics software. As
an example, the size of the graph can be scaled. Labels on the graph can
be moved at will (e.g. the labels on a pie graph default to outside the
pie. The user can select to move them inside). The "other" threshold on
a display can be user-selected (e.g. if the user wants an item displayed,
even though that item represents on 5% of the whole, the user can set the
threshold at 4%, thereby displaying what he wishes.
  As users complete such report and graphics development, the reports can
be stored and recalled by PF Keys.
  The application development language is very similar to PL/1. Consequently,
it is the least-liked piece of the product. There are very few end-users
willing to learn that language. But the basic components are complete enough
that the development language is not often needed.
  Keep in mind that AS was developed by IBM European development group.
That group came from the old IBM European time-sharing group. Those people
know the end-user community. They designed AS with a good user interface.
It does not look like a "typical" IBM software product.
  As for price, I'm not familiar with the list price, but it must be subject
to considerable discounting. My customer had AS on a 3090-200. The customer
paid $60,000 with unlimited free updates. That's competitive!
  Yes, AS does use system resources. But most users expect such software
to consume sizable compute cycles, so it isn't a nasty surprise.
  To summarize, AS is not perfect. It's development language is difficult,
and it does consume resources. But this is not old-style IBM software. The
interfaces are very well designed, the graphics are powerful and flexible,
and the report writing capability is more than adequate. AS sales have
increased dramatically (up 223% in 1987 vs. 1986). It is becoming the dominant
software in this category in the IBM world.

---- Michael Booth
121.3GUIDUK::KRUGWed May 04 1988 00:201
    See 94.3, especially points 2 and 3.