| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 80.1 | Here is something. | COP01::BRUNSGAARD | Set network/fast_broadcast | Wed Mar 02 1988 13:53 | 23 |
| Hi Jeff
This is not much but nevertheless...
First of all.
SQL is just a language ie. Pascal, Cobol.
It is just dedicated to database handling and therefore superior
to 3Gl in this sense.
When this is said then the possibillities open up on a VAX using
Rdb.
SQL/VMS is using the same database system as Rdb (namingly Rdb itself),
giving user the oppertunity to use "the rest" of all products which
is capable of palying with Rdb (CDD(+), ACMS, Rally, Teamdata aso).
So choosing SQL/VMS is not a limitation for the customer, just another
way "into" the VIA environnement.
Hope you can use some of this.
Lars
|
| 80.2 | Product Managers | 32371::HIGGS | Festooned with DMLs | Wed Mar 02 1988 16:52 | 6 |
| The VAX SQL Product Manager is Wendy {BANZAI,NOVA}::CASWELL.
The Rdb/VMS Product Manager is Steve {BANZAI,NOVA}::HORN.
I'm sure that they would be happy to talk to you about this.
|
| 80.3 | Basics | AUNTB::BOOTH | A career of MISunderstanding | Wed Mar 02 1988 21:46 | 21 |
| The basic problem with Oracle's embedded SQL is that it forces the
customer to but Oracle pre-compilers. Not only are they an extra-cost
option, but they require the use of non-optimized code. No such
situation exists with the VAX product.
Additionally, the compile and link statements will be quite long.
The programs link to a number of Oracle files. Will that impare
it's ability to work with other DEC products? I don't know, but
it might create some FUD with the customer.
Oracle's SQL is vastly extended. That will hardly allow programmers
to learn a universal SQL (i.e. the ANSI standard that applies to
database activities). Rather, they will learn the Oracle version.
That's great as long as they only work on Oracle, but hardly helps
them if they need to move to a different environment. Don't get
the wrong idea, essentially SQL is SQL. Oracle has extended the
basic language until their version is quite complete for everything
from database activities to custom reports. But that was not the
original intent of SQL.
---- Michael Booth
|
| 80.4 | want some FUD? | CGOS01::MHAMMEL | This space intentionally left blank | Thu Mar 03 1988 15:43 | 17 |
| .3> Additionally, the compile and link statements will be quite long.
.3> The programs link to a number of Oracle files. Will that impare
.3> it's ability to work with other DEC products? I don't know, but
.3> it might create some FUD with the customer.
In a competitive situation a little over a year ago, a customer
tried using callable TPU from a PASCAL program. The purpose
was to implement something like 'editable segmented strings'.
Anyway, we had no problems with it using with Rdb/VMS and RDML,
but never did get the Oracle version to work. I can't remember
if the problem appeared at link time or run time, but it appeared
that some Oracle link files were trampling over something.
Maury...
|
| 80.5 | Callable TPU | PANIC::STOTTOR | Chris Stottor, City of London SWAS | Mon Mar 14 1988 10:33 | 11 |
|
Slightly off the subject - but I'd be very interested to hear
more about your success using callable TPU from PASCAL for
editable segmented strings - we had a similar issue here, but
eventually addressed it with Teamdata...
If inappropriate to reply here, any MAIL to PANIC::STOTTOR would
be received with great interest.
Thanks, Chris
|
| 80.6 | is it the database that counts ? | SNOC01::PARKER | Jeff Parker | Fri Mar 18 1988 14:17 | 22 |
| OK, back onto the subject.....
So, VAX SQL in its own right doesn't have any distinct advantages
over another SQL. I guess we're bound here by the standards. At
least we stick to it, not like Oracle. Is this right ?
The advantages really are with using Rdb and hence the other products
that can be used to support it, eg. CDD, DD, etc. The pre-compiler
FUD is interesting, however I'm really after hard facts.
Does VAX SQL talk DSRI ? If yes, then is it feasible for it to build
a query for VIDA ? Could this be a reasonable counter to the "we run
on and across anything" argument espoused by Oracle ?
Is it fair to say that functionally, a VAX SQL environment from a
programmers point of view is little different to developing SQL
with another database ? If this is true then it really comes back
to selling the database, doesn't it ?
Jeff Parker,
SWS, Canberra.
|
| 80.7 | some good news | BISTRO::WATSON | always showtime, here at the edge of the stage | Mon Mar 21 1988 13:04 | 8 |
| > Does VAX SQL talk DSRI ? If yes, then is it feasible for it to build
> a query for VIDA ?
Yes.
I've never tried it, but page 1-1 of the VAX SQL User's Guide thinks
so!
Andrew.
|
| 80.8 | | VNADC6::GEROLD | This note is rated 'PG-13' | Mon Mar 21 1988 16:51 | 4 |
|
I've tried it and it works.
Gerold
|
| 80.9 | | NOVA::CAMERON | | Wed Mar 23 1988 19:34 | 48 |
| RE 80.6
So, VAX SQL in its own right doesn't have any distinct advantages
over another SQL. I guess we're bound here by the standards. At
least we stick to it, not like Oracle. Is this right ?
>> Last time someone looked, VAX SQL was closer to ANSI than
>> Oracle. That was about a year ago and I think Oracle has
>> had a release since then. I know they are claiming DB2
>> and ANSI complience. This is impossible. DB2 does somethings
>> differently from ANSI. By the way, there is no ANSI validation
>> suite for SQL.
>> By the way, the following are the major priorities for VAX
>> SQL
>> V1.0 DB2, ANSI draft
>> V1.1 ANSI Standard, DB2
>> FUTURE ANSI Standard, RDB/DSRI FUNCTIONALITY, DB2/SQL2
>> Overall I will agree. SQL is a standard language so they
>> should all be similar.
The advantages really are with using Rdb and hence the other products
that can be used to support it, eg. CDD, DD, etc. The pre-compiler
FUD is interesting, however I'm really after hard facts.
Does VAX SQL talk DSRI ? If yes, then is it feasible for it to build
a query for VIDA ? Could this be a reasonable counter to the "we run
on and across anything" argument espoused by Oracle ?
>> Yes, VAX SQL talks DSRI and yes it talks to VIDA. We run VIDA
>> access tests as part of our nightly build/test system.
>> As far as this being a counter for the 'we run on everything'
>> the answer is usually no. Oracle runs on IBM systems, PC's,
>> VAXen, ... Rdb/SQL/CDD/DD ... run only on VAX VMS systems.
Is it fair to say that functionally, a VAX SQL environment from a
programmers point of view is little different to developing SQL
with another database ? If this is true then it really comes back
to selling the database, doesn't it ?
>> Yes. Yes.
>> David Cameron
>> VAX SQL development
|