Conference koolit::vms_curriculum

    
I think that in some chapters the theory is going too far for "simple"
application users, especially writing command procedures.
Realize, the students are "simple" application users. They have to know a few
DCL-commands, creating textfiles, running command procedures, working with
directories, using help and manuals and be a secure user.

"VMS for application users"
=============================
1) The sequence of the chapter should be:
     1. Logging in and out of a VMS system.
     2. Issuing DCL commands. 
     3. Creating and editing text and data files.
     4. Working with files.
     5. Getting HELP.
     6. Making sure you are a secure user.
     7. Setting up your terminal.
     8. Sending messages to other users or system personnel.


Chapter "Logging in and out of a VMS system"
============================================
1) Please include the figure TTB_X0313_88_S "Enter a valid username and
password"

2) What is a REMOTE/LOCK switch and where can I find him?

3) The enumeration of the legal characters for a password is not clear. Please
put them beneath each other.

4) Put a figure of a lavc with terminal servers, terminals, VAXes in the book,
when you talk about logging in through a terminal server (page 1-8).

5) Remove the subject dialing in. I think it is not important for a "simple"
application user. Besides are the steps mentioned on page 1-8 the same for
every modem. If not, please remove it, because it will give the instructors a
lot of questions.                                                                

6) The theory of a disconnected dial-in session is also possible for a session
on a terminal server. So put it at the subject "logging in through a terminal 
server".


Chapter "Using the terminal"
============================
1) Put this chapter not as second one. Most of the terminal setting will say
nothing to the novice user.

2) Remove the subject "defining keys". Which application user shall define
keys. Besides the instructor has to tell about writing a LOGIN.COM, otherwise defining
keys has no useless. This is a subject for an advanced application user.

3) Nice to talk about the setup of your terminal and the command SET TERMINAL,
but give also the differences between them with examples, otherwise this theory
is useless. Mention also the action fields and their function.


Chapter Issuing Commands
========================
1) Please put the DCL features behind the subject "entering a DCL command",
because at this stadium of the chapter it says nothing to the students.

2) Include the figure TTB_X0314_88 "The elements of a command line" at the
subject "Constructing a DCL command" page 1-8.

3) Also mention the word option for the word keyword. See HELP-utility.


Chapter Creating Memos, Reports and Data Files
==============================================
1) On the title page of this module there is a comma to much, after the word
Reports.

2) Remove the remark on the instructor page 1-7a "invoking eve", about defining
the symbol EVE. Each student has to type the command EDIT/TPU, but the
instructor uses the symbol EVE. This will give the instructor problems.

3) I miss the figure TTB_X0320_88 "EVE keypad definitions"

4) Mention on page 1-9 "entering text", the F14 functionkey for changing from
insert to overstrike and vice versa.

5) Mention on page 1-10 "moving around the document", the DO key for giving EVE
cursor movement commands.

6) I miss the option of using the F10 functionkey for saving the modifications
(page 1-13).

7) I miss the usage of the following keys: HELP, SEL, INSERT, REMOVE, 
NEXT WINDOW, PREV WINDOW.

8) You talk about GOLD/KP8 (page 1-15) and the command FILL, but a user doesn't
know to how to select text.

9) I miss journalling, although it is very important for every user.

10) Maybe it is possible to replace the commands SPLIT WINDOW, SHRINK WINDOW,
ENLARGE WINDOW, GET FILE, BUFFER etc to the appendix.

11) Very good, putting EDT in the appendix.


Chapter Using VMS File Specification.
=====================================
1) I miss the figure TTB_X0327_88 "Naming directories". The user will have a
good overview of the directory structure on a datadisk.

2) I prefer to begin this chapter with building up the directory
stucture CREATE/DIR, walking through the directories with SET DEFAULT and SHOW
DEFAULT and after this using the filespecification. After this you can talk
about displaying info of the files DIRECTORY together with the wildcards.

3) What is the benefit for a "simple" application user of the qualifier
/COLUMNS=n together with the DIRECTORY command.

4) Create enough exercises about creating en walking through directories,
because a lot of student have problems with this subjectmatter, also in the
continueing courses.

4) Also show the student how to copy files from directories on other disks and
on other nodes. Don't talk about proxy-accounts.

5) In the RENAME command on page 1-34 there is a mistake, namely $ RENAME
inpout-file-spec etc... The right command is $ RENAME input-file-spec etc...

6) Please replace the subject "Logical names" to advanced application users.
This subject is very difficult for "simple" application users and not
necessary.

7) I think in example 1-12 "Determining the equivalence of a logical name" there
is a mistake. DJAO has to be DJA0, so not an O but a 0.


Chapter Communicating with other users
======================================
1) It's allright that you skipped the utility PHONE, a lot of student know this
utility before coming to the course.

2) In the instructor notes on page 1-7a there is a note which says that the
command SET EDITOR not is included in this material. How can a user write
mail with the command SEND/EDIT without using the EVE-editor. I think this
command must be included in this chapter, otherwise you have to learn the
student also the EDT-editor.

3) Give on page 1-26 in table 1-6 also the /PRINT qualifier. It's a very handy
qualifier.

4) I would start with the command HELP in the utility MAIL. After HELP you can
mention all the other commands. It's the most important command in an utility.


Chapter User Security
=====================
1) Very nice that you put this chapter in the course. I think it's very
important to teach a student to be a secure user.

2) What is the benefit of the command SHOW SYSTEM for a "simple" application
user.

3) When will a "simple" application user change his privileges. I think never.
So skip this out of the chapter.

4) Please include the figure TTB_X0330_88 "Interaction of access categories".
This figure gives a good overview of what type of users there are.

5) A "simple" application user has problems enough with the normal
UIC-protection, so don't talk about ACL's. This is a subject for the advanced
application user.


Chapter Getting HELP
====================
1) Where is the text about "using the master index of the VMS documentation
set" and "using the documentation set"


Chapter Creating Command Procedures
===================================
1) Only teach the students that theory that is necessary for creating a simple
command procedure. Just like how to put command in a command procedure. 

2) I prefer to indent a command line in a command procedure, page 1-18
"guidelines", nice for labels in the future.

3) Replace the next subjects to the advanced application users course:
    - using symbols
    - terminal input and output
    - passing parameters to a command procedure

4) The subject "Creating a LOGIN.COM" only has a meaning for a "simple" 
application user, if he can put definitions of symbols, logicals en keys in it.
In mine opinion replace also the subject "Creating a LOGIN.COM" to advanced
application users.

5) Use the symbol EVE instead of ET, page 1-13.

6) Is the next syntax possible?
   Syntax for a single line: IF - THEN - ELSE

7) Creating a login.com must contain more examples of login.com


Please include a lot of exercises in this course. A "simple" application user
needs a lot of exercises.

                       
                                                        Regards Ed Janssen

As a result of the first pilot of "VMS for Application Users I", some 
changes have been made in the course.  These include:

- Parts of the material seemed too technical for the target audience, so 
  some technical detail (particularly relating to command procedures) has
  been removed.  We made sure the pieces that have been removed from this 
  course have been covered elsewhere in the course string.

- The chapter on using file specifications was too long.  It has been 
  broken into two pieces:  (1) naming and storing files (file specifications
  and directories), and (2) manipulating files (COPY, PRINT, etc.)

- A new chapter replaces the one on command procedures, and serves as a 
  sort of wrap-up for the course.  "Customizing Your Working Environment" 
  contains logical names, symbols (only enough to create command synonyms), 
  defining keys, and writing a LOGIN.COM file.  

- Where appropriate, examples of "common errors in..." have been added.

- The new order of the chapters:

	1 - Logging In and Out of a VMS System
	2 - Issuing Commands
	3 - Naming and Storing Files
	4 - Creating Memos, Reports, and Data Files
	5 - Manipulating Files
	6 - Getting Help
	7 - Communicating With Other Users
	8 - Protecting Your Data
	9 - Customizing Your Working Environment

These files are available in PostScript form in SUPER::ES$REVIEW:[RA0293]

	RA0293_CHAP_1_LOGIN.PS
	RA0293_CHAP_2_COMMANDS.PS
	RA0293_CHAP_3_FILES1.PS
	RA0293_CHAP_4_EDIT.PS
	RA0293_CHAP_5_FILES2.PS
	RA0293_CHAP_6_HELP.PS
	RA0293_CHAP_7_COMMUN.PS
	RA0293_CHAP_8_PROTECT.PS
	RA0293_CHAP_9_CUSTOM.PS  (not available until May 2)

    I taught this course last week (week of 9 sept) and will do it again
    next week (week of 23 sept).  Both of these teaches are two days.
       
    	On thursday (day one) I covered mod 1 to 5.  Taught to about
    1420.  Turned students loose for lab and the last student left 
    at 1600.  On day two the atudents asked me not to teach module 6
    so I didn't.  I taught mod 7,8 & 9.   I was done at about 1400.
    
    	Due to student interest I Taught how to create and use an acl,
    How to write a command procedure to do something (labels, if statement,
    and goto.  
    
    	I had a small class and they were knowledgable but not with
    VMS.  After I teach this for a few times and try to streach it 
    to 3 days I can give a better opinion.  My opinion now is this is
    too simplistic, but I will with hold judgement 'til later.
    
    	I would however make a few changes.  I got through chapter 7 in
    less than 20 min.  I would like to handle this materal in this way.
    
    		1- in module 2 add the help pages from mod 7.
                   Teaching help here allows the skill prior
    		   to the first lab where they might need it.
    
    		2- in module 2 add an appendix and put the info
    		   about the doc set.  Don't teach it but point
    		   it out and suggest they read it.
    
    
    Module 6 has good info.  I would add REQUEST.  These users
    should know how to communicate with operations.  Also I would
    add PHONE as an appendix if anyone is interested (don't teach it).
   
    
    	I'll update my thoughts after next teach.
                                              
    
    Thank you
    
    Chuck
                                                 

Re: .3

Chuck 

Thanks for the feedback - please keep it coming. As soon as we have a good body
of information we can plan what we need to do.

Thanks again for taking the time to post the info,

Cheers,

Andy

    
    Thanks from me too, Chuck.
    
    Keep us posted. ANybody else taught it?
    
    Mel
    

    
    	It's next week!! I just got done day one of my two day.  
    
    		Background:
    
    			This is at a customer site.
    
    			12 students, interactive with PC terminals.
    
    			only 7 terminals.
                                   
    			students are mainframe types who just got
    			their VAX. Smart class so it is not a 
    			typical group.
    
    Today:  9-9:30  Intros and overview.
                 
    		11:50  done module 2
    
    		15:55  done module 5
    
    
    Observations:
    
    		1.  I added the help utility to module 2
    
    		2. I gave the rest of module 7 as a reading assignment
    
    		3. Mod 4 didn't go well due to P.C.'S.  Also would
    		like this module to have a window discussion, a page
    		of eve commands and show how to set up eve$init.
    
    		(I don't want to teach part of it here and some more
    		in the next course.  I do this now in with UC 1 and
    		UC 2.  In 2 we have to reteach 1 due to much of the
   		class not having prerecs.  If we do it all in the first
    		course then leave it along we are all better off.)
    
    		They also wanted me to cover EDT.
    
    		4. not much need for labs due to interactive lecture.
    		4 students stayed until about 16:45.
    
    Tomorrow:
    
    		I'll be doing mod 6, 8 & 9.  I expect it to go atleast
    		to 14:30 then have some meaningful labs.  For symbols
    		I would add the page from UC 1 that shows how and when
    		a symbol gets decoded.
    
    
    I'll fill you in on tomorrow some time next week.
    
    
                       

    Day two:
    
    	09:00 to 10:15   mod 6, more time on mail than I wanted but
    it was interactive and they wanted to try everything.  
    
    	10:15 to 12:30  Their pres. spoke and all went
    
    	12:30 to 1600  mod 8 & 9
    
    
    comments:
    
    		1. add a brief acl "how to"
                                    
    		2. add how and where symbols get decoded and how to force
    		it.
    
    		3. add to command procedures
    
    			a. "if f$Mode()..." command
    			b. parameters
    			c. term. I/O
    			d. if/goto
    
    I think my suggestions will enhance things enough to make it a good
    3 day course.  labs for mod 9 will have to be beefed up if the
    changes are made.  (remember no mod 7 now, so maybe break up 9)
    
    Remember, I had abnormal classes and did both in two days.  How
    it goes for three days, I do not know yet.  There should be some
    done by now so lets hear about it.  If you decide to change any-
    thing it should be done in the other courses that use the modules.     
                         
    Chuck

    ADDITIONAL COMMENTS AFTER 3 CLASSES NOW.
    
    	All classes have commented that there is too much time spent
    
    doing mail and almost nothing with command procedures.  They would
    
    like that reversed.  

    I have done the VMS for operator 3 times now.  The first 2 times
    did not flow too well.  I did modules 1,2,7,3 to 15 in that order.
    The third time I did module 11 first then 1,2,7,3, etc.  The info
    in 11 helped them understand the other chapters (1-10) better. 
    I thought about doing 10 second but thought better of it because
    there were too many new topics that they would not understand
    yet.  Moving 11 (hardware) to the first chapter gave them the
    background they needed and they did not need to ask a lot of
    questions in the subsequent chapters.  It therefore flowed better
    and faster.
    
    	The old oper course had a chapter on how operators handle
    disk, tapes, etc.  It was chapter 9.  I would like to see it added
    to our new course.  It contains things that the oper. should be
    doing.  This course is the place for it.  It is a chapter we gave
    as a reading assignment so it will not add to lecture time but
    will add to the quality of the course and add the needed info
    to make this course an operator course and not just a junior
    system manager course.  It shows the operator that he/she has
    responsibility in the maintainence of the system.
    
    Thank You
    
    Chuck Naughton

    
    Hi Chuck,
    
    Thanks for the suggestions. The old chpater 9...did it have
    hardware specific stuff in it? We are attempting to stay away
    from hardware specific materials that require tremendous efforts
    to keep up...or can we do what it did generically? [Sorry, I don't
    know what was in that chapter...and I am being lazy by asking
    rather than going to find an old course...]
    
    The re-ordering is certainly a possibility. And if we cna do it
    generically, I don;t have any objection to a reading assignment
    piece.....Andy...what do you think?
    
    Mel
    

    	The old chapter 9 covered operator duties in reference to their
    preventive maint. responsibilities.  As an old hardware man, I have
    seen a need for years that the customer understand that taking care
    of their equipment is, to a large extent, their job.  In the Oper
    class I think we have the vehicale to say this.  Some P.M. is the
    duties of those who maintain their equipment (we hope it is us)
    but we are not there every day and much can be done by the operator.
    I'll send you a copy of chapter 9.  
    
    	Believe it or not many customers think the F.S. contract is
    an insurence policy and they do not have any responsability.  The
    old ch. 9 and the new ch. 15 helps lay out who should do what.
    I do not think we need to mention any option by device name. 
    Generial terms like disk drives, tape heads, etc. is enough.
    
    Thanks, Chuck Naughton   

>    The re-ordering is certainly a possibility. And if we cna do it
>    generically, I don;t have any objection to a reading assignment
>    piece.....Andy...what do you think?
>    

No objection to reading assignment.

Reordering... what do the rest of yuou think?

Andy

    Apologies if this is not the right conference or the right topic...
    
    Locally, training seems to have been outsourced to various third party
    companies. The following query comes from one of those companies.

    Can anyone shed any light?
    
------ FORWARDED
    
Digital Learning Services (DLS) appears to have cut all courses by one day,
without apparently altering the course content.

The course I am doing on Monday/Tuesday is shown as three days in the course
materials, with suggested timings of about 6:30 per day (total is actually
19 hours).

Have the people who prepare the course materials in fact restructured the
courses to be a day shorter (which would imply that DLS has not supplied
the updated course materials)? Instructor Guide is ... "OpenVMS Skills for
Users" Instructor Guide (June 1994)

  No, the courses have NOT been reduced to four days,  I suspect
  that it is a Country decision to reduce the days.  Then again,
  I'm only familiar with the English/U.S. version of the courses.
  
  $