Conference ilbbak::us_sales_service

    
    > I have seriously considered writing my own version of AQS which is
    > based on "Quattro Pro" or "Paradox" .. that loads the prices from a
    > "basic" text file output from AQS.
   
    	I just purchased Borland's Object Vision which includes a sample
    application called 'Order'.  For ~$100 might save you a lot of time.
    
    Jerry
    
    P.S. No I haven't learned OV yet so I can't answer any questions about
    'Order'.
    P.P.S. 'Order' might not be a bad way to get started designing AQS-2?
    

I have been "playing" with this issue for some time.

The biggest obstacle is getting a reliable data feed.

I don't know how to accomplish this.  Frankly, I haven't
tried to get access to the corporate price file yet. History 
tells me that this will be difficult to impossible but I
should give it a try. 

If anyone has any suggestions here I would like to hear 
them.

There is no reason why all these new portables can't have
a new AQS running on them.  Ideally they would be 
completely standalone.  The size of the data may
make this tough but I believe it is possible.  Updating
is may be tough but I think that is possible too.

Unfortunately, the people responsible for implementing
these things have never felt the heat of getting a
quote out and having to reformat it or explain our 
format.

I also fear that the "vision" of people doing these tools
is the same vision as was used for AQS.  

1)  Create a timesharing system to automate a particular
task

2)  This vision is being "extended" to:  Create a front
end client server application the displays to a PC


I see the following problems with this:

1)  The initial vision of creating a Automated Quoting
system was pretty good.  As .0 points out.  Unfortunately
I believe that people think this is and end in itself.

We do not exist to do quotes.  Quotes are a necessary part
of what we exist for.  We exist to solve customer problems.

Because of this we need a consultative system to solve 
customer problem.  The output of this could be a quote that
gets done "automatically" without part numbers etc.

2)  If we create MS-Windows front ends but still require
people to be tethered to the "mother ship" all we have
gotten is a sexy interface to AQS.  What we need is a
portable environment (being tethered to accomplish a task
is not protable).

RE: Paradox, ObjectVision and Visual Basic.

I have used Visual Basic extensively.  I have used
Paradox and Dbase somewhat and ObjectVision a fair
amount.  My impressions...

Paradox and Dbase don't do windows so I eliminate them
automatically.  This will change but for right now, I
don't think they are useful.  When this does change they
may be better than Visual Basic.

ObjectVision.  I have tried to implement two "projects"
in ObjectVision.  Each time, I have given up because
of some "brick wall" in ObjectVision.  My belief is
that OV is good for simple things but cannot be used
for anything very complex (I beleive this leaves it
out as an AQS 2 engine).

Visual Basic.  I am completely impressed with this.  It
takes more work for simple things than OV but it can
do the complex jobs also.  You would likely have to get
some additional controls (from MS, DEC or others) and 
you may have to write some 3GL but you could absolutely
write AQS 2 with it.

Ken Slattery

    Publishing the price file and the SOC on CD-ROM would be
    one possible way to start cutting the cords to the mother
    ship.
    
    It would give notebook based applications a way to load a
    subset of the data base without too much pain, and would
    also be a less expensive way (and save_a_tree) to put information
    in the Customers hand.
    
    Lots of our present Customers systems have CD-ROM capability now,
    I understand all Alpha systems will have a CD-ROM drive, its
    certainly turning into a good distribution medium and rapidly
    gaining popularity.  (DAK will even sell you a CD-ROM drive for
    a PeeCee for $199!)
    
    Jeff  (who just got one on his home PC, and is overwhelmed by
           the amount of data that will fit on one of them little disks!)
    

    About three years ago I was part of a field study group regarding how
    to "fix" AQS.  We shared frustrations and wish lists.  We were told
    these problems were well known and efforts were underway to make needed
    changes.  As far as I can tell, nothing has changed significantly in
    three years.
    
    Sigh.
    
    I believe - and have suggested - the "grandmother test" is the goal we
    should strive for in a printed quote:
    
    	1.  Give a AQS quote to a likeable grandmother and ask her to read
    	    it.
    	2.  Watch her eyes.
    	3.  If they glaze over, the quote system needs improvement.
    
    Why do we insist on using DECspeak like:  CW LIC w/ WARR?  Why can't the
    product description be in English to say: "200 points of Cluster-Wide
    COBOL license with one-year conformity warranty" or the like?
    
    And that's just on the AQS front end!!
    
    I think part of the problem is that management is too far removed from
    the real issues in the field and with customers.
    

    I think the main problem is that AQS is run by the Admin. function, and
    not considered to be a selling support tool !
    
    If it were designed to be effective as a selling support tool, most if
    not all the known problems with the systems wouldn't exist and in
    addition, it could even provide Digital with a competitive advantage
    (or at least remove the competitive disadvantage it creates !).
    
    Any volunteers to attack the Admin. fortress ?
    
    David

.4> Why do we insist on using DECspeak like:  CW LIC w/ WARR?  Why can't the
.4> product description be in English to say: "200 points of Cluster-Wide
.4> COBOL license with one-year conformity warranty" or the like?

Herein lies *the* most time consuming and non-productive element of AQS.

For all practical purposes the quotes are unintelligible to the potential
new DEC customer.  Worse than that, I, after 15 years of selling for DEC,
sometimes have to take an educated guess if the model number that I entered
*is* the model number that I wanted based on the description!

We've taken to entering, one item at a time, new descriptions for 99% of
the elements on a quote ... then ... if you "model" another quote based
on that .. wala ... the descriptions go bye-bye.

AQS most assuredly *is* a selling tool!!!!!!!  I've rarely sold anything without
giving a customer or potential customer a quote.  There are times when a
customer will request a configuration with various alternate elements, say:

		(1) "Top of the line" configuration
		(2) Above (1) without networking
		(3) Above (1) with variations "a", "b" and "c" on
                    networking
		(4) Above (3) with variations on disk/memory configurations.

etc ... What should take perhaps a few hours can in fact take a few *days* to
complete.  Then, if you "make to many changes" to the quote ... bingo .. you
start over.

I thought that the USMC taught me a lesson on volunteering .. but ..
give me one programmer and some time ... in FY 94 we won't be having this
discussion.

Jerry

    Whether or not you get the programmer, the way things have been and are
    going, in FY94 we may very well be having another kind of discussion.
    
    David

	Re: .0

	Jerry,

	I'm sorry to hear that you are having so much trouble with AQS,
	but no one in the development group has ever heard of a problem 
	caused by changing a quote too many times.  It does sound like we 
	have a support problem, though.  Would you send me the details on
	this incident so that I may work with your experts to correct
	this perception? 

	AQS *does* allow you to discount and/or allowance line items 
	individually.  Discounting without agreements may be done by 
	entering "exception" in the Agreement Number field.  This will 
	allow access to the Adjustment Percent and Amount fields on the 
	line item entry screen.  Allowances may be entered as percents or 
	amounts on the line item screen at any time, on any quote.  The
	example you cited, being for competitive reasons, seems to imply
	that an allowance would be more appropriate. 


	Re:  "AQS-2"

	There is a lot that we can do to improve AQS.  

	AQS work is prioritized by the Quote Board.  Each of the US 
	geographies has a Sales Rep sitting on this board.  Working with 
	your local rep is one way to ensure that your needs are being 
	addressed.  Another way is using the FDCV14::AQS notes file.

	We know that the system's functionality is poorly understood and
	hard to find, as the base note demonstrates.  We can address this
	with user interface improvements.  We can also go a long way
	towards improving the understandability of the quote
	documentation.  As was mentioned earlier, much research has
	already gone into this process. 

	Many of the problems are outside of the AQS software.  Having 
	additional programming resources will not solve the problem of 
	poor product data.  Getting good product data continues to be, 
	and has always been, a problem.  The quality of the product
	descriptions and the ability to select products without using
	model numbers both fall into this category.  The quality of the 
	data coming into the process has a large impact on all of the
	succeeding processes.  AQS does not have the responsibility for 
	gathering this data, but is continuously trying to elevate the 
	problem.  The needs of the Sales organization must be better
	represented in the product acceptance process. 


	Re:  AQS on "untethered" PCs

	I find this very interesting.  Several solutions have been 
	proposed.  I'd like to hear some more input.

	As you know, the product information set is HUGE.  It is possible
	to produce sub-sets.  The question I have is, what is an
	acceptable number of misses?  If one out of a hundred items is
	not in the local sub-set, is that acceptable?  What about one out
	of twenty five?  How about one out of ten?  At what point do you 
	feel that it would be easier to just plug the phone cord in? 
	
	What about timeliness?  The pricing information can change daily.
	When does the local data set become too outdated to quote 
	against?  Does it need to be refreshed at least weekly?  Daily?
	At what point does the downloading effort outweigh the benefits 
	of running standalone?

	There are other ways to split the system besides having just the 
	interface on the PC and everything else on the VAX.  One idea is 
	to plug in just for adding line items.  This leaves the reference 
	data on the VAX, but allows for local manipulation and selection 
	of service offerings, adjustments, etc..  Another idea is to have 
	just a model number file on the PC, allowing for the entry of 
	items locally, plugging in to pull across pricing information, 
	and then manipulating it locally as above.  Do either of these 
	ideas have merit?

	
	Re: organizational alignments

	Resources are tight everywhere.  Virtually every organization 
	requires major system changes at this time.  No substantive work
	will be done on AQS unless it is a high priority for the US
	country team.  Admin, now US Logistics, will assign resources to
	the systems they support based on these priorities.  Are the 
	Sales needs being actively represented at the country level?  

	We understand your pain.  We keep pushing for change from this
	end.  Please keep pulling from yours. 


	Joe

    Re: .8   (How big does the local database need to be)
    
    Joe,  When AQS gets the data for a quote it goes out to the Corporate
    files to get pricing and other information.
    
    Is any kind of record kept about which information is pulled each time?
    
    Judging from the quotes I see as a CTS, there are relatively few items
    that make up the majority of configurations.  If AQS could prioritize
    the highest used items, then it should be fairly easy to define the
    size of data base needed for a given hit rate.
    
    Seems that this would be very valuable information for Marketing too.
    As a stockholder I would hope to see a direct correlation between the
    effort put in to developing a product and the frequency with which we
    quote it to our Customers.
    
    Jeff
    

RE:                     <<< Note 134.8 by IAMOK::SNIDERMAN >>>

>>	AQS work is prioritized by the Quote Board.  Each of the US 
>>	geographies has a Sales Rep sitting on this board.  Working with 
>>	your local rep is one way to ensure that your needs are being 
>>	addressed.  Another way is using the FDCV14::AQS notes file.


This is the first I heard of this.  Could you give us a pointer as to who
is on this board?

    "Quote Board"?  As with OHARA ... never heard of it.  Please tell us
    more.  I would like to provide some input to this organization.
    
    Jerry

	The following salespeople are on the Quote Board:

		Alex Barenblitt @DCA

		Dan Haynesworth @LAO

		Susan Szilvasy @ACI

		Robert Woodbine @WAO

	The Southern Area is not currently represented.


	Regards,

	Joe

    
    The Electronic Connection (ESTORE) uses AQS for its Distributor 
    customers.  We are also initiating a price file transfer with
    Avnet, Total Tech, and some other key distributors.  This is a
    weekly transactional feed of the model (mdl), price (pfmv), and
    long description (ppdesc). The customers receive full file updates
    near the beginning of each quarter while using the weekly transaction
    file for updates.  The particular customers are using this data to
    load into their databases for use with their quoting system to quote
    to their end-customers.
    
    Some technical tidbits:
    
    	The reference model (mdl) file contains over 500,000 records of
        which 220,000 are current, the others are mostly history records
        with some being pre-posted future records.
    
        The price file (pfmv) file contents are 1 record for each price
        associated with each model number (current and history) on mdl file.
        Here again, there are more records contained in this file then are
        actually current.
    
        The Long Description file (ppdesc) although structured with
        inverted  effective date logic (same as mdl & Pfmv) does not
        usually contain history records.
    
    
        All pricing models (including AQS) use the same subroutines to 
        obtain pricing info.
    
    		Pricalc, Ref_server, Service_calc, Das_calc, SOS_Calc.
    

        All discounting is based on the Discount agreement tables and
        handled thru DAS_calc.
    
        Although it may be possible to generate a subset of files for
        a PC based database, the processes & calculations need to be
    	Identical so Pricing/Discounting is consistant  across all
        Internal Systems.
    
    Brian
    

    
    
    Just in case anyone is still following this discussion....
    
    To follow-up on 134.13... 
    
    I am running the "Price Files Service" off the ESTORE described by 
    Brian Dole in 134.13.  It's more than a pilot now - in use with the 
    following accounts:
    
    Avnet Computer
    Total Tec Systems
    Wyle Labs
    Merisel
    Shlumberger
    ASK Computer
    EDS (GDS and Unigraphics divisions)
    McBride Associates
    Spokane Computer
    Info Tech Computer Systems
    
    These accounts are in test/evaluation...
    Arrow
    IDX
    Sabre Systems
    Data Logics
    
    
    We have'nt promoted this (free) service - customers demanded it.
    Y'all probably realize it - since you're close to customers - but
    in the same way Digital can't buy/sell something unless its in the
    Price File -- customers (generally) can't buy/sell unless our 
    products are in their Price File (especially for Resellers).
     
    As previous notes described, the sheer volume of model numbers 
    can be daunting - 150k active & maintenance USA products/services.
    I seem to recall these file(s) take-up approx 70MB - most likely 
    unreasonable for a laptop.
    
    I'm working on ways to remove the unnecessary model numbers from 
    this file.  Unfortunately, I have no technical support - the author
    of .13 was TSFO'd.  Since I work at the ESTORE, it occurs to me that
    I could read our QUOTE_HISTORY file over the last x years and reduce
    it to single occurances of MODEL_NUMBER. Then merge PRICE with those 
    MODEL_NUMBERs and maybe end-up with a small, useful, file.
    
    If I were to create such a file, would Ken (from 134.2) and/or others 
    be willing to author a WINDOWS3 application(s) which...
    
    1. Let the user browse/scan the list in a spreadsheet-like way. Maybe 
       using Classification Codes of some type?
    
    2. When the user finds a product/model-number they're interested in,
       they can click a QUOTE button, which pastes the model number, 
       description, etc into a QUOTE FORM.  Lets the user repeat this
       action any number of times.
    
    
    3. Let the user FILE-->SAVE or FILE-->PRINT the QUOTE FORM. With 
       FILE-->PRINT, possibly the document could be FAXed to DECdirect 
       which already accepts orders via FAX.
    
    
    4. Build-in the ability to process Price File update files locally.
    
    5. Build-in the ability to dial-up the ESTORE and KERMIT download the
       Price File updates (ZIP-format).
    
    
    If an application like this could be built and demonstrated to
    Management, might just be possible to get (official) funding 
    and support. Maybe to get this built-into the Sales Laptop 
    Program?  Sometimes you gotta show people.  I'm ready.
    
    Mike Reich
    297-2324