Title: | You get surface noise in real life too |
Notice: | Let's be conformist |
Moderator: | GOVT02::BARKER |
Created: | Thu Jul 28 1988 |
Last Modified: | Mon Jun 02 1997 |
Last Successful Update: | Fri Jun 06 1997 |
Number of topics: | 550 |
Total number of notes: | 3847 |
Gidday again folks! Question time regarding SOUNDSTAGING/IMAGING/FOCUS! (yes I have seen the related topic #2924 in the 'other' hifi conference!) Why do some amps image and focus better than others in reproducing the original soundstage? I'll tell you why I ask, the other night in darkest south Germany, I was at a friend's place helping him 'tweak' his newish system, speaker placement, shorting the CD coax output etc etc. His system is the Pioneer 75 CD player, Mission Cyrus PX (outboard power supply) and some DM3000 Infinity speakers (no idea which). Well I got the best soundstage together that I could with speaker placement but basically couldn't 'see' the instruments/vocalist and so on, all pretty vague but an improvement on before. he also has an old QUAD 33/303 he recently purchased for the bedroom (no jokes you buggers!).....me having a soft spot for old QUADS suggested it would be nice (for me!) to hear the QUADs in the system...........the Mission gone..........it was unreal........everything in the soundstage had size/focus/placement/depth. Now the Quad sounded pretty rough after the Cyrus (which sounded 'airer', more delicate) but no two ways about it, the sonic 'picture' was there!.............WHY?.............. over to you my hifi/music collegues cheers fjeff PS: This is not a plug for QUAD or my old romance with QUADs, even I know they sound 'muffled' soundwise to put it politely...I was as surprised as the next man.....I didn't expect anything really different!
T.R | Title | User | Personal Name | Date | Lines |
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340.1 | Interesting having to decide which you liked more huh ? | SKIWI::EATON | Marketing - the rubber meets the sky | Tue Jan 28 1992 20:36 | 10 |
I associate imaging (i.e. the ability of a system to let you mentally 'place' the instruments 'on stage' - a euphemism these days given the way recordings are accomplished), with timing. My brain associates depth with the delay in my (stereo) ears receiving the information from the same instrument. This delay is different for all the instruments on stage and so I form a mental picture as a result. A system which images is a system which is faithfully relaying this kind of information to me. | |||||
340.2 | Something put in or something left out? | BAHTAT::SALLITT | a legend in his lunchtime | Wed Jan 29 1992 11:03 | 47 |
There is more to "soundstage" than the ability to locate a sound source in space; another aspect is the ability of the system to reproduce individual sounds, each in its own "space" in the audio spectrum, whilst still contributing to the whole, as the musicians intended. These two aspects aren't mutually exclusive, but are difficult to achieve together, along with "accuracy" and "tunefulness", except at the high end. All sorts of aspects of the signal content contribute towards creating the sense of reality; once heard it can be hard to live without, if you're any sort of hifi casualty. On the other hand, some factors are more fundamental to this sense of reality than others and a lot depends on personal preferences. Some systems, in some rooms with some recordings, can excel in projecting these fundamentals, others excel in other aspects of performance. Jeff's experience with the two amps could be either that the two amplifiers simply emphasised different aspects of the CD player's signal, or that the new amp, being more "truthful" - whatever that is - allowed weaknesses in the source's signal to be reproduced, thus distracting the listener from what it was doing right, whereas the Quad's "tailored" response gave less emphasis to these weaknesses. I doubt this is the case, though, as obscuring defects usually results in obscuring desirable aspects too, so this "filtering" is unlikely to produce the changes heard. Personally, I suspect that the Quad may just have a more balanced set of virtues, within the limitations of the age of its design, than the new amp. The new amp, for all the fashionable "New World" aspects that seem essential these days, perhaps exaggerated defects in the CD player's output, distracting the listener. I doubt the differences would be down to the individual amplifiers' abilities to drive the Infinitys. It would be more likely that the differences were due to sins of omission in one amp and sins of comission in the other. Although it's probably old hat to many audiophiles, a recent "road-to-Damascus" experience with my Cd player taught me that many so-called deficiencies are down to something being inserted or exaggerated that shouldn't be, distracting me from what I should hear that was there all the time, rather than what I should hear actually being reduced or distorted in itself. [I will state categorically the digiphobia was *not* one of those "somethings"!] Dave | |||||
340.3 | Infinity! | MUNMCC::BUERKERT | HEINZ 57-Varieties | Tue Feb 11 1992 15:03 | 7 |
nevertheless, Infinities can be real biests, connected to the wrong ;-) amp. ? Which one is NOT wrong ? heinz p.s. stopped suffering from them |