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Conference hips::uk_audioo

Title:You get surface noise in real life too
Notice:Let's be conformist
Moderator:GOVT02::BARKER
Created:Thu Jul 28 1988
Last Modified:Mon Jun 02 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:550
Total number of notes:3847

193.0. "The Turntable in Europe" by KISHOR::HIGINBOTHAM (North Sea Brent) Thu Aug 09 1990 17:18

	Here in the US, turntables seem to fall into two categories:
	crummy, and too expensive. Finding a decent, reasonably priced
	unit has become a unicorn hunt.

	I recently received some copies of TT reviews in Hi-Fi Choice,
	and saw some others from WHAT HI*FI. It seems to me, that you
	have choices that we don't, particularly in that elusive range
	between crummy and too expensive. I saw well-received TT's from
	Rotel and NAD, neither of which is available here. These two
	manufacturers offer NO TT's here, if I'm not mistaken. I saw
	unknown units from NVA, Origin Live and Pink Triangle. Even the 
	(non Japanese) TT's we get here -- Rega, Revolver, Ariston and
	Systemdek, for instance -- are sparsely represented and extremely
	difficult to come buy.
	
	Is the European market for turntables so much more healthy than
	ours? What TT's are you buying? Are LPs still readily available?
	I'd appreciate some insight into this area. Thanks,

							bIGhIG
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193.1TT's + vinyl in HollandHLFS00::STEENWINKELThe Taming of the ScrewWed Aug 15 1990 15:0738
    Re: .0
    >	Is the European market for turntables so much more healthy than
    >	ours? What TT's are you buying? Are LPs still readily available?
    >	I'd appreciate some insight into this area. Thanks.
    
    
    To start with the second question, it depends very much on the music
    category (and hence the shop) if vinyl is abundant or not. Classical
    vinyl is dead. Jazz is getting scarce, except for a couple of the more
    easy-style labels: almost no new avant-garde and minimal jazz on vinyl,
    or at least the stores don't stock them where they have the same title
    on CD in the racks. Blues OKish, but trend is noticeably down, and no
    re-releases anymore generally. Stores here seem to specialise in one of
    these categories, or else sell anything but blues, jazz and classical.
    
    In the 'popular' category, vinyl seems to consist mostly of hardcore,
    heavy metal and experimental. Also quite a number of smaller independent
    labels still account for a substantial portion of vinyl. But maybe I'm 
    slightly biased here as my primary supplier has a largish heavy metal  
    crowd in his customer base.
    Other stores don't offer half of what he has available, so they get
    only a cursory glance when I come past one. That glance shows 10-15% of
    floorspace dedicated to vinyl, mainly top-100 junk. The store I buy
    most of my records still has 30% vinyl, spacewise, and offers a decent
    cross-section of global music output.
    
    
    As for record players, those are getting scarce as well. Japanese and
    Korean rack jobs are seldom offered with record players (which may be
    just as well). But long-time TT makers like Linn, Thorens and Dual are 
    still building them and even releasing new models. And HiFi dealers
    have them ready for demo, they don't go digging for a dictionary when
    you mention the magic word Vinyl. The three brands mentioned are the
    ones most frequently seen new in HiFi stores, and a good start when
    you're looking for something decent.
    
    
                                                    - Rik -  
193.2BAHTAT::SALLITTDave @RKG, 831-3117Thu Aug 16 1990 13:2824
    re last....
    
    You surprise me, Rik. I was in Boudisque in Amsterdam last week and
    they had 1000s of LPs, mostly rock though and no Jazz. Lots of Blues,
    mostly imports from the UK.
    
    re .0....
    
    I read in HFN/RR a while ago that it's primarily the UK that's
    sustaining the LP market. How long that'll last I don't know. I don't
    understand why the TTs between "garbage" and "celestial" are so
    expensive in the US. Maybe someone is laughing all the way to the bank.
    
    I visited Linn a while back. They say business has never been better,
    even for the Sondek. They send about 75% of their product abroad,
    mostly to Japan. They can't make their top arm (the Ekos, around $2200
    in the US) fast enough to meet demand.
    
    I firmly believe that the concept of the dead LP and dead TT is a myth
    perpetuated by the music and hifi industries. As far as the LP is
    concerned, it is the marketing policies of the big labels and greedy
    retailers that keeps them out of the shops, not buyers' preferences.
    
    Dave
193.3AMSTERDAM .nes. [rest_of_holland]NMGV15::FIELDThe Taming of the ScrewFri Aug 17 1990 13:4923
    Dave, Amsterdam is a different matter with regard to music than the
    rest of Holland. Lot of specialised stores, one entirely dedicated to
    cassettes (Staalplaat). Rotterdam has its share too, but further east
    (where I live; near the German border) good record stores get scarce.
    Two in a town of 100.000 inhabitants is the average. With good I mean
    stores that offer more than the top-100 and the big names. And very few
    of them have a decent blues/jazz collection on vinyl.
    I know Boudisque, we (= record library in Enschede) order most of our
    exotic stuff there. And I've been to Virgin and HMV in London two years
    ago, they then had still more than 50% floorspace dedicated to vinyl
    (rough estimate). But two years ago 'my' record shop also had about
    half its space lined with vinyl. It just steadily declined since then,
    and things are getting harder (though not impossible) to get on vinyl.
    Longer backorder times, quality fluctuates.
    
                                                      - Rik -
    
    
    Aside: the record library has as of now 18.000 vinyls and 6.500 CD's.
    And about 2.000 members. CD accounts for 85% of our income (5% each
    jazz and classical, 2% blues)...   And when people ask 'Do you have
    <mumble> by <foo>' and I answer 'Yes, that's record number VP 13587
    (Vinyl Popular)' they invariably reply 'No, I mean on CD'. AARGH.