Conference hips::uk_audioo

	Wow, my first time using notes, and already somebody's talking to me.

	About a fortnight ago I decided to upgrade the turntable (I've got
	a Dual CS505-1, see note 19.16 for the rest of the kit). I've been
	meaning to upgrade for some time after a couple of my mates bought
	some good kit. Up to that point I would not consider myself to be
	a hi-fi buff and always poured scorn whenever anybody suggested that
	a mere record player could approach my CD for quality.

	One of the chaps got a Roksan Xerxes/Ittok/??. He seemed to know his
	stuff and had specifically chosen the Xerxes over the LP12. He also
	selected the Ittok arm over the RB300.

	The other guy bought an Elite Rock/Excalibur/Eroica, I can't recall
	what he selected it against.

	So me and my mate (the one with the Rock) booked up an introductory
	session at Farnborough Hi-Fi at short notice on Saturday 2 weeks back
	for an hours listening. The chap at the shop (John Mayes, the Manager)
	played our records and some of his on various turntable/arm/cartridge
	combinations and actually seemed to enjoy educating me as much as I
	enjoyed it.

	It was quite obvious that John is a Linn *EXPERT*. We listened to
	Axis/Basik/K9, LP12/Basik/K9, LP12/Ittok/K9, LP12/Ekos/K9, and then
	compared the latter with LP12/Ittok/Troika. The Ekos came out on top.
	All this was through Exposure VI/VII/VIII into Ruark Sabre speakers.
	Three hours later we left and I still hadn't heard anything other than
	Linn turntables so I booked another session for the following Tuesday
	to compare the LP12 with the Roksan and Pink Triangle.

	On the Tuesday I took in my Dual deck then and we were talking about
	CDs, so he spent three and a half hours proving that my aged Dual deck
	was more musical than a �900 Marantz CD player which is widely
	considered to be one of the best around at any price. We didn't
	actually get around to the turntable comparisons. So I booked another
	session for the Thursday.

	On Thursday we actually got round to comparing the three decks:
	LP12/Basik/K9, Pink/RB250/K9 and Xerxes/RB300/K9. The Xerxes was a
	bit thin, but the LP12 and the Pink were both very good, but different.
	After a total of nine hours I was still undecided. At no stage had
	there been any pressure at all or even expressions of exasperation
	from John. As I left the shop he couldn't be sure that I would even
	go back there again.

	Now that's what I call a good shop.

	So on Saturday just gone I went down to Soundwaves near Southampton
	to listen to a Roksan/Ittok against an LP12/Ittok. (At this stage I
	had the impression that Farnborough aren't so hot on Roksan, and my
	mate had chosen a Roksan/Ittok over an LP12/Ittok). We heard this
	through Naim amps and EPOS speakers. The Roksan sounded streets ahead
	of the LP12, but that was because the LP12 sounded diabolical. I'm
	no expert but it must have been really badly set up. It was also on
	a Tripod stacking system which also housed the amps, whereas the
	Roksan was on a dedicated table. My mate said it was feedback, I'd
	call it resonance as the bass booming was ridiculous.

	Throughout the demo the guy was making obvious his anti-Linn stance
	(he can't be a preferred dealer because he hasn't had the Ekos arm
	yet - Farnborough have already sold about ten). We then compared the
	Roksan/RB300 with the Roksan/Ittok. I preferred the Ittok as being
	substantially better, but the dealer said that for the difference in
	sound quality I'd be better off buying �300 worth of records.

	Verdict: He seems like a good dealer (so long as you don't want to
	consider Linn kit). Incidentally his wife (co-owner of Soundwaves,
	I presume) was featured in the Dealer Comment page in the November
	edition of Hi-Fi review.

	So we charged up to Reading Hi-Fi (Harris Arcade) to compare a
	Michell Gyrodeck, LP12 and Pink Triangle. This was through Exposure
	IV/VII/IX (mega-dosh) into Celef (?) speakers (never even 'eard of
	'em). The Gyrodeck was amazing - all those little cylinders of
	highly polished brass rotating under the platter, and the see through
	glowing power supply. Wow. Pity it didn't sound very good. Perhaps I
	ought to buy one of those for my mantelpiece. We ruled out the
	Gyrodeck pretty much straight away and then it was a straight fight
	between the Pink and the LP12. We played three tracks on each, the
	LP12 was better on two (Sign your name across my heart by Terence
	Trent D'Arby and Sad old Red by Simply Red), and the Pink was better
	on the other - Solitude standing by Suzanne Vega.

	Verdict on the dealer: seemed a decent enough sort of chap (he can't
	find the beginning of a track for toffee tho'). The other thing is
	the demo room is very small and has quite a few other speakers in it.
	Apparently serious demonstrations should be done only in single speaker
	demonstration rooms as additional speakers will adversely affect the
	sound quality. My mate reckoned that Linn would be upset if they
	knew about it though no doubt they do and aren't. To be fair though
	it's a small shop and it would be an utter pain for them to have to
	cart speakers out of the demo room and into the shop since the two
	are separated, access being by the Arcade.

	Anyhow, after a lot of hard thought I decided to flip a coin and
	yesterday ordered a LP12/Ekos/K9 from Farnborough HiFi which will
	be delivered later this week. I have 100% confidence that John Mayes
	will set up the deck perfectly.

	Here is the reasoning behind my choice:

	The Ekos/K9 sounds similar to the Ittok/Troika though better and is
	slightly cheaper. I do not want to buy anything 'permanent' which I
	know I will be ugrading later - I would rather fork out the extra
	money now than lose �100+ by buying an Ittok and then trading it in
	for an Ekos. I regard cartridges as 'consumables' and at this stage
	can bear the thought of throwing away a �70 K9, but the thought of
	throwing away a �630 troika makes my wallet shudder (even if you do
	get a 35% allowance). Bearing this in mind I'll probably upgrade to
	a Troika when my K9 wears out.

	The LP12 was the trickiest choice: the Pink Triangle sounded better
	in some respects as did the Roksan Xerxes. (The results of the
	demo in Southampton I'd reduced drastically to compensate for the
	lousy LP12 they had). Both the Pink and the Roksan seem to sound more
	punchy than the LP12, but the LP12 is definitely more musical and
	somehow seems to flow better. By all accounts the three decks are
	all of comparable quality - it's just a question of which type of
	sound you prefer, and some music sounds better on one and other music
	sounds better on another. I decided on the LP12 because most of the
	mags seem to treat it as a reference source, the two top reviewers in
	Hi-Fi Review have got one, I like the sound, and I decided that it
	was the best deck of the three **for the type of sound I like** (also
	Roksan no longer do the tasty black perspex cover so there's no point
	going for one of them anymore). Oh yes, the LP12 is about �100 cheaper
	than the other two.

	I'm a bit curious as to how the LP12 will sound sitting on my usual
	turntable stand (an upturned cardboard box)...

	There, wasn't that interesting!

	By the way, I'll be upgrading the amp in the next few weeks,
	auditioning starts on Saturday. Without having gone into it in
	any great depth I'll most likely be selecting from Exposure, Naim
	or Linn gear. Has anyone got any other suggestions? The only major
	criteria I have is that it must sound at least as good as an
	Exposure VI/dual VII/super VIII system. If there aren't too many
	cries of anguish over the detail in this note, I'll post another
	when I've chosen the amp.

	Three days to go...

I've recently been to a couple of dealers in the Thames Valley area other
than Reading HiFi, and it would have been useful to know what to expect
beforehand, so here's some brief descriptions of the dealers I've visited.

I'd be interested to hear other people's opinions of these places.

Reading HiFi
------------

Situated in the pedestrian precinct between the Ramada Hotel and the Broad St.
Mall. The easiest place to park is the Broad St. Mall carpark.

They have two demonstration rooms, of which the larger of the two is by far
the best  (the smaller one has a very thin back wall, and suffers from
incredible bass boom).

I've found them to be very helpful and friendly. There are several staff (I've
counted at least 5). They will loan dem. equipment over evenings, weekends.

Newbury Audio
-------------

Situated in a pedestrian courtyard  off Newbury High Street. Best place to
park is behind this area in a carpark that you reach off a road parallel to
the High Street, and then walk through a gate to the shops.

There is one demonstration room, which is very nice, above the shop.

I understood that usually there is just the owner there, but he sometimes has
an assistant. I didn't get much chance to see what the place was really like,
as I was there on the morning that the Linn salesman was there, and the guy
was pretty busy with him. It seems to be a fairly analogue-oriented place
though (i.e., you buy your Sondek, then see how much you have left to spend on
everything else).

They didn't seem to be keen to loan dem. equipment, but would rather you
bought something, and returned it if you didn't like it. This may have the
same effect, but I feel it puts more pressure on you to buy.

Oxford Audio Consultants
------------------------

I can't remember the name of the street the shop's on, but it's close to the
railway station. There's a small parking area behind the row of shops.

There was one guy there, who was apparently the owner, who was very pleasant.
His approach was a bit different to Newbury - he advocated a more balanced
approach to buying components, rather than the  �1000 turntable, �100 amp and
speakers method. Given that he's selling  �2000 amps and speakers, I suppose
he would say that.

There didn't seem to be a demonstration room as such. The main shop is split
in half by a giant room divider, and the back half is where the demonstrations
happen. This area also contains various bits of junk (speakers, stuff in boxes
etc.). There is another room at the back, but that seemed to be not much
better (junk-wise), and I don't know what it's used for. I found this approach
a bit odd, especially considering the high-end nature of some of the equipment
they sell. I was told that this was to ensure that the systems always sounded
better in the customer's house than they did in the shop. I think I prefer the
more standard single speaker room.

He will loan out dem. equipment, and I got the impression that it didn't
necessarily have to be over a non-business period, but I'm not sure about
that. It may depend how serious you are.

.-1:  Good idea.  My comments on the same three dealers:

Reading Hi-Fi is the place I've used the most.  They know what they're doing
and are very helpful.  I find things invariably sound far better at home than
in the demonstration rooms.  However the big room is good enough to make
comparisons between kit as long as the differences aren't too subtle.  I've
successfully compared pickup arms there (SME V vs Artemiz on a Xerxes) but not
D/A converters (MF Digilog vs Arcam Black Box 2).

Newbury Audio (in Weavers Walk, Newbury):  This guy is a Linn bigot.  When I
was looking for a replacement for my Axis he suggested an LP12:  he said the
LP12 is the best record deck in the world.  Fair enough, quite a few people
think that and it's a valid opinion (though not one I share).  But then he said
the Axis is the second best record deck in the world.  Now hold on a minute, I
*know* my Axis, with all its faults, and while it does the job, it ain't *that*
good - even for the price.  I don't feel inclined to trust this guy's judgment.

Oxford Audio Consultants (in Park End Road, Oxford):  I've never bought
anything here but have listened to stuff.  It's good for high-end, particularly
American, kit.  The back room seems to be where you listen to the high-end kit. 
Yes, there's lots of junk (expensive junk!) in the room, but you can get a
surprisingly good sound there, and it's easy to hear what's going on.  I think
he tends to keep unused speakers out of the way; this probably helps.  The guy
here is friendly and helpful, and he knows what he's talking about and seems to
love music - always a good sign.  I like the place.

Nick

       My experience with Oxford Audio Consultants matches the other 
       comments here. I first went in about 18 months ago when I was 
       looking to replace my speakers. The back half had a lot less
       'junk' in it than now, although a Crystalle Reference with SME V	
       was there and producing some wicked sounds. I had a very relaxed
       demo of the speakers I was thinking of against on of their 
       suggestions (Warfedale 505.2 vs. Rogers LS2a). I eventually decided
       on the Warfedales and go a very good deal on them as the only ones
       left in the shop were the demo pair (nicely run in !!).

       I would personally recomend this dealer, although I haven't been in 
       lately as I moved away from Oxford.

    
    As I was passing through London last week, I booked a demo at Graham's.
    They won last year's Sony/HFN-RR "Dealer of the Year award". Their
    facilities include 5 demonstration rooms, including a multi-room setup.
    The address is Canonbury Yard, 190a New North Road, and there's a small
    parking area in the front.
    
    I thought they were very good indeed. I had an excellent demonstration
    from a chap called Brian Welch. He was very helpful, knowledgeable, and
    seemed to be a genuine enthusiast. It was probably the best demo I've
    ever had. 
    
    Trevor

Trevor,
	How did the Naim CD sound ? As good as an LP-12 ? As for Isobariks,
Yep they do have ``presence'' even with a crummmy old LK-2.

	Rik still-to-make-up-his-mind-on-CD.

PS What is there 'phone number ?

    
    The Sound Gallery's phone number is 0494 464670.
    
    How did the Naim CD sound ? Well, it sounded OK to me, but then my main
    source is a CD player, so I probably would think that...
    
    Trevor
    
    p.s., I noticed I'd got the owner's name wrong in .7, so I've deleted
    it and reposted it below...
    
        
    I've recently visited the Sound Gallery in High Wycombe, whom I also
    thought were pretty good. They have a tiny shop with one small and one
    large dem. room upstairs. They also have a separate dem. room for
    In-Car audio.
    
    They stock a fairly restricted range of products (mainly Linn, Naim,
    Meridian, plus oddments from Arcam, Mordaunt-Short, Creek etc). I had a
    demonstration with Colin Welford, who is the co-owner of the shop. He
    was a nice guy, friendly, very chatty. He spent a long time giving me
    his views on the Hi-Fi industry, which were interesting. Colin seems a
    little Naim-oriented, but not to the extent to which the bloke at
    Newbury Audio is Linn-oriented.
    
    They offer home trials of their demonstration stock, and they do
    part-exchanges.
    
    After listening to what I went there for, I heard a system that they
    were warming up for a demonstration the next day, which consisted of
    the Naim CDs, Spark/Kairn/LK280, passive Isobariks. I'd never heard
    Isobariks before - they certainly have plenty of "presence" ! They must
    sound pretty incredible with a bit more amplification behind them.
    
    
    Trevor