Conference govt02::basingstoke

    All the ECOxxxx cleaning products are very friendly but supermarkets
    don't tend to stock them, you need to go to your local health food
    shop.
    
    Simon.

    AMWAY products are Environment friendly (no CFCs etc...)
    
    Ray.

	AMWAY products are great. The pyramid selling racket directly 
	connected with the products is not (and it is pyramid selling
	regardless of what the people involved try to make you believe). 

re .3:

>	AMWAY products are great. The pyramid selling racket directly 
>	connected with the products is not (and it is pyramid selling
>	regardless of what the people involved try to make you believe). 

Pyramid selling is ILLEGAL. So if AMWAY is pyramid then how come they are 
still in business?

Pyramid selling is when a company sells stocks of products to it's rep's who
then have to sell them to customers.

AMWAY sells through a distribution network. If the last person in the world 
signed up for AMWAY they would still benefit from the products at warehouse 
prices, so where's the racket?

Dave.

Yes, AMWAY are environmental friendly and also make products which can be 
used with septic tanks which is why we use them.

Dave.

    A slight rathole, or maybe not...
    
    I was approached last week to sign a petition protesting about proposed
    implementation of EEC rules which will force health food/organic
    product shops to close in 1992 when we all join the "free" market.  The
    supposed reason was that many of the products do not comply with
    EEC requirements, in particular they haven't got enough preservatives
    in them.  In other words, they're *too* environment-friendly.  
    
    Anybody else know anything about this ??
    
    
    Ian
     

    The thing in 1992 that will force health food shops to close has little
    or nothing to to with organic food/preservatives......in 1992 only
    chemists will be able to sell the item the keeps all these shops
    going.............VITAMINS and all the related, fiendishly expensive
    mineral supplements etc that currently are normally only found in
    health food shops.
    
    Health foods actually make very little profit, if any, and most of
    these shops only keep going on the VITAMIN sales, it would seem a shame
    to lose the other hard to get things they sell if they can't survive. 
    
    
    Sam

    
    On the subject of environment-friendly goodies...
    
    Ark, an environmental action group, have just released an environment-
    friendly range of cleaning products. They are aiming to get these
    into supermarkets (I think Tesco already stock them) and charge
    a price not much higher than chemical-ridden nasty products.
    
    On the subject of health food shops...
    
    Most of these shops have petitions on the counter about 1992. If
    you want to see these shops continue trading sign on the dotted
    line. Or write to MPs/MEPs/anyone else. 
    
    Paul the Contractor                    
    -------------------

    
    Playing devil's advocate for a second or two, if the environment
    friendly range of products aren't significantly *cheaper* than the
    nationally advertised brands then I for one will need a lot of
    convincing of their efficacy.
    
    As for campaigning to save the "health food shops", similarly I'm
    not interested. They charge more for products than I'm prepared
    to pay.
    
    Sure I like organic vegetables, but I prefer to grow my own, and not
    pay a bunch of profit grabbing neo-hippies for the pleasure of
    believing that they don't cheat...
    
    Similarly I prefer chemical free meat, but if I have to I'll go
    and hunt a deer or two, kill a few dozen brace of grouse, pheasant
    and partridge, and catch my own fish, (not to mention the abundance
    of rabbits just ready for the snaring) before I'll pay a health food 
    store a penny a kilogram more than for the "factory farm" variant.
    
    Vitamins, minerals, etc... well according to a piece on "That's
    Life" last night iron pills are lethal, so heaven only knows what
    multi-vitamins and mineral complexes do to your vital processes...
                                     
    /. Ian .\                                                         

re .9:

Those "cheaper products" have a hidden cost, the environment. 

Dave.

    
    Re: .9
    
    As .10 says, these green products are cheaper on a wider scale than
    the immediate impact on your wallet. My main reason for buying these
    things is that I'm not very keen on damaging *anything*, the
    environment included.
    
    I am not very interested in the vitamins and cure-alls side of health
    food shops. I don't take vitamin supplements, I feel OK without
    them. I am, however, a vegetarian and I find that my local health
    food shops stock a pretty good range of veggie food, not to mention
    all of these other "green" products. Also there are some people
    who find the pills and potions beneficial.
    
    The price of green products is an interesting point. There is no doubt
    that they are expensive, the blame for this seems to come from many
    directions. The health food shops themselves suffer from the corner
    shop syndrome - they just do not have the buying power and economy
    of scale of supermarkets. The producers also have increased costs
    due to low volume production.
                       
    This does not mean that there is no profiteering within the green
    product industry. Our standard farming concerns are grossly
    inefficient, while most organic farms are forced to run at a high
    level of efficiency to stay alive. The result is that there should
    be little or no differntial between organic vegetables and chemically
    treated ones. Retailers still charge higher prices though, including
    one reported case of a (nameless) large retailer asking an organic
    grower to charge a higher price so they could justify the price
    they charge on the shelf. Many similar cases have been reported.
    
    In the end, though, my conscience wins out over cash and I still
    try to buy environemnt-friendly products. Seems stupid, but that's
    me all over!
    
    Paul the Contractor
    -------------------