Conference 7.286::digital

	re: .0

	where was that article in the Globe? couldn't find it in mine;
	perhaps a regional add-in (I get the "Boston" edition in Newton)...

	fwiw, the "laptops" generally used in police cars usually bear
	little resemblence to anything we could supply "off-the-shelf"...
	last time I looked, Motorola was the king of this hill...only
	folks I would think could handle this would be perhaps CSS, and
	then probably not with a Digital/DEC product...

	_kelley

    I didn't want to start a new note for this, so I'm replying here (I
    would have replied to 4073 if this note hadn't been created today).
    I found the article below on Usenet.  The author may just be blowing
    smoke, but it could be a potential sales opportunity.  Can someone
    please make sure that the appropriate person sees this?

    Thanks,
    Alfred




From: [email protected] (John D. Kilburg)
Newsgroups: comp.unix.osf.osf1
Subject: Re: Disappointing speed of 21164 CPU (8200)
Date: 12 Sep 1995 18:42:06 GMT
Organization: Department of Computer Science, UNLV

In article <[email protected]> [email protected] (Walter Brueckner) writes:
>I post this again because my previous posting was hard to reply to:
>
>We recently acquired a Alpha 8200 with 6 of the highly praised
>21164 CPUs.
>The 21164 rates (in the Cern catalogue) at 88 Cern units.
>We measured the speed of two large applications, one
>monte carlo ("hmc") and one particle track reconstruction ("trident"),
>and the speed results are rather disappointing.
>...
>I wonder whats wrong? Was that all a big mistake?

Some code runs better on some architectures than on others.  At the
physics department here we tested code on a 8x00 with EV5/300's,
SGI with an R8000, and an IBM RS/6000 370(?).  Some code ran really
fast on the Alpha, some ran faster on the R8000, and some did fine
on the RS/6000.  Of course, all of the machines were pretty darn fast.
Your mileage may vary and I may not know what I am talking about.

While I'm at it I'm wondering if any DEC people can point me to
a decent DEC salesperson (not one of those third party people!!!!!!).
We're going to spend a fair amount of money on machines in the next
month and the local DEC salescritters and local third party
sales folks have given us the runaround.

							-john

    re: .0
    
    If they really mean laptops, it'll be interesting-- the typical 
    laptop would have an MTBF of about 3 days in a squad car.
    
    I was the architect for a computer-aided dispatching system
    Digital SI (then SWS) did several years back for one of Detroit's 
    larger suburbs.  The Motorola/MDI in-car terminals we integrated
    into the solution are built like tanks, and they still need
    serviced on a regular basis (and they don't have any disk
    drives, LCD displays, or other relatively fragile components).
    
    It's interesting... I've talked on a few different occasions with
    the bureau head of computer services there about using laptops
    or other technology to allow the road officers do their own
    data entry.  It always boils down to the following:
    
    	1) It's cheaper to have the officer fill out a form (mostly
    	   check boxes) and have a data entry clerk enter the data
    	   (the officer costs more per hour than the clerk).
    
    	2) The above approach leads to better quality data, since
    	   fewer people are doing the data entry, and better
    	   controls can be imposed.  
    
        3) They'd rather have the uniform officers on patrol than
    	   typing at a keyboard.
    

    The new move is to a mobile mounted screen and keyboard. These have
    been in place in CA for many years. Other areas are starting to catch
    on. Stratford CT used the mobiles to do plate checks directly with the
    RMV and had a suprisingly high hit rate on cars they were looking for.
    {Sometimes they'd wake up the perps, other times the go back and get
    the warrents.}
    
    Federal mandates require that nothing be in the way of a depolying air
    bag. This has significantly reduced the area that portable units, gun
    racks etc. can be placed in a crusier.
    
    Do they really mean laptops? And what do they really want to do with
    them/

        Hi,

    If Boston is doing what other departments are doing, they are
    going to use laptops for things like:

    Report Writing
    Case Management
    FI's
    Hot Sheets
    Gang Specific Information (including photographs)

    There is a program in place now at a department in the greater Seattle
    area that uses laptops to do what I have described above. BTW, the
    laptops are off the shelf laptops as opposed to MDT's. The MDT's
    typically have other functions like receiving dispatching information
    and database inquiries. In fact I was talking to the Homicide Sgt. last
    night about elements of that program. He and I worked together when I
    was a police officer and I still keep up with some of their computer
    related projects.

    shoe 

    Any ideas/leads about .2?

    Alfred

    Alfred,
    
    Regarding .2:
    
    Jack Sunderlage is listed as the unit manager in VTX CALOOK for UNLV.  
    He's at 544-3136 and can be reached via e-mail @SLO.  Please forward
    the memo to him for action.
    
    Regards,
    
    Don Canney
        

    I've forwarded the message to Jack.  Thanks for the pointer to VTX
    CALOOK, and thanks also to Jane Decarteret who contacted me via MAIL
    and helped track down the right person.

    Alfred

    RE: .2 
    
    I have forwarded this note to the sales exec. for this account. Though
    not directly involved with this potential sale, I was under that
    impression that we had performed very well in the customer's benchmark. 
         
    John Georges
    Las Vegas Sales Support 

    Regarding .0  
    
    From present experience,  MDT have totally different functions then the
    Laptops.  There are lots of Police Departments buying laptops to write
    reports while in the field.  The current police department I am with
    uses compaqs.  There is nothing special about these laptops.
    
    FWIW....
    
    Chris

Re: .2

There is not a NEW sales opportunity at UNLV.  We are well aware of the
opportunity and have been working it very vigorously.  We have run benchmarks on
both a 2100 and an 8400 with fairly good success.

The problem is strictly political for several reasons.

o Besides Digital, we have at least two distributors *FIGHTING* over this
opportunity, who call on them regularly,

o When we first started these discussions many months back, they were provided
with ballpark pricing for some sample configurations, those numbers become "the
price".  When the actual pricing came out, it was higher than expected so they
feel that they were given the run-around.

o While this was going one, this department actually bought some workstations
from one of the above distributors and rather than hold up the entire delivery
because of the availability of the remainder of the memory, they were shipped
with less memory so that they could start getting them configured.  The
remainder of the memory would be shipped as soon as it became available.  They
were unhappy with this and immediately after this happened is when the customer
wrote his response.

Up to this point, we have not had any problems or indication of problems.  We
have been very responsive to the customer and their wants and needs.  We have
tried very hard to work with them on benchmarks, pricing, and configurations. 
And we continue to do so.  We now have a formal RFP to respond to and hope that
Digital wins the bid, either directly or through one of the distributors.