Conference 7.286::digital

    Well, in some senses, the entire business structure is a form of
    virtual reality.  
    
    It's certainly not real reality . . .
    
    --bonnie

    They had this running at Uniforum in San Fransisco a few months ago -
    BP demo'd a Laptop PC running OSF and did a WWW demo from it as well.
    
    
    Good show

>>    BP demo'd a Laptop PC running OSF and did a WWW demo from it as well.

Just for the record, the notebook that BP showed (6.9 lbs, Active Matrix color,
etc.) was a 140 MHz Alpha 21066, not a "PC".

--RS

    re: -.1
    
    PC == Personal Computer
    
    Notebook, 1 user, i.e., personal
    
    AXP processor, i.e., computer
    
    Works for me!
    
    --- Gavin

    I and others would think that PC is a common abbreviation of IBM
    PC(tm).
    
    You will hear people refer to a PC as an architecture.  For example, is
    the game Ninja Smasher IV available for the PC or the Amiga?  Used in
    this way, PC means IBM PC or close compatible.
    
    

    (Continuing this rathole)
    
    I would put it differently: "PC" now generally refers to the Intel
    architecture, and compatibility (e.g. for AMD or Cyrix) is measured
    against "Intel Inside" machines. These days IBM is such a
    (relatively) minor player in the PC space (not small, but in no way
    controlling) that compatibility with IBM is not an issue any more. 

DEC sells Alpha systems with "DECpc" written on the
front panel.  Therefore we think that an Alpha can
be a PC.

(I agree, but then, I've had a PC since about 1985.
 My first PC said "VAXstation II" on the front panel).

>DEC sells Alpha systems with "DECpc" written on the
>front panel.  Therefore we think that an Alpha can
>be a PC.
    
    It doesn't matter what we think -- when customers hear PC
    they think "Intel chip, DOS, Windows."
    
    Intel's "Intel Inside" campaign in the past few years has been nothing
    short of brilliant.  They stole the concept of PC away from IBM.  Until
    a few years ago, IBM owned the word "PC" (they still own "mainframe").  
    When people talked about a PC, they used to say "PC or (IBM) clone." 
    Intel changed people's perception of "PC" from "box built by IBM" to
    "box with our chip in it."
    
    Being able to gain control of the public's perception with a word
    or concept is the key to marketing success.
    
    The funny thing is, Digital OWNS a word, one that we could probably
    use to help get us back on track: minicomputer.
    
    					andrew

Maybe a "pc" is a "personal computer", and a "PC" is an "MS-DOS (or PC-DOS !)
(possibly with MS-Windows) Personal Computer with an Intel 80*86 Inside"?

On the other hand, I hear that, in the U.S., "PC" also means "politically
correct" (or "political correctness"). Furthermore, "PC" can also be the
abbreviated name of a certain muscle, but it might not be politically correct to
mention this in a Notes conference (and much less to *explain* it in a Notes
conference !).

When I was a student, I once had a summer job in a power station. The "control
room" was called "PC", probably abbreviated from the French "Poste de Contr�le".
I think that is common slang in Belgian powerplants, chemical plants &c..

     Most people consider the Macintosh a PC, and it's not Intel, DOS, or
    windows.
    
    --bonnie

    I still think of a PC as a programable controller, but now I guess they
    call them PLC Programable Logic Controller.
    
    Sparky Who_may_be_showing_his_age

    Yes, the Macintosh is a PC, but if you gathered together 1,000 random
    Americans, and played free association with them, I suspect that the
    majority would answer "Intel" in response to "PC," just as they would
    respond "Campbell's" in response to "soup."  
    
    Obviously, there are other PCs and other soups -- but these companies
    "own" these words -- these companies are the ones people think of when
    the generic term is mentioned.
    
    For years, if you said "minicomputer," the response would have been
    "DEC."  We *still* own that perception, and we have the opportunity
    to own another: "64-bit computing."  If we can associate DEC with
    the idea of "64-bit computing," then it won't matter whether or not 
    HP alliance works or not.  We will own the field.

    re: .12 (1,00 in a group, ask the 'PC' question)
    
    I don't know. There's a good protion of people I know (friends, family)
    that equate PC to anything that has a keyboard and a monitor. As for PC
    == Politicaly Correct... I can't wait for this concenpt to take on a
    new name.
    
    --- Gavin

Re: <<< Note 3174.12 by OKFINE::KENAH "Every old sock meets an old shoe..." >>>

>    Yes, the Macintosh is a PC, but if you gathered together 1,000 random
>    Americans, and played free association with them, I suspect that the
>    majority would answer "Intel" in response to "PC," just as they would
>    respond "Campbell's" in response to "soup."  
    
I think they would answer "IBM" in response to "PC".

-stephen

>>    Yes, the Macintosh is a PC, but if you gathered together 1,000 random
>>    Americans, and played free association with them, I suspect that the
>>    majority would answer "Intel" in response to "PC," just as they would
>>    respond "Campbell's" in response to "soup."  
>    
>I think they would answer "IBM" in response to "PC".
    
    Perhaps -- until recently, I would have wholeheartedly agreed.
    That's the beauty of the "Intel Inside" campaign.  They're trying
    to win the perception war with the idea that "the only *genuine* 
    personal computer has an Intel chip in it." 
    
    If they succeed (I'm not sure they have yet) it will be one of the
    great marketing victories of the decade.

    re: .12
    
     I'm working at home today  while various service providers cleam my
    windows, shampoo my rugs, and so forth, so I conducted a brief survey
    among the crew.  "What do you think of when I say, "PC"?" I asked. 
    
    "Computers," they said.  
    
    Except for the neighbor boy who came to see if my son could play.  He
    said, "I'd rather have Super NES.  It's got better games."
    
    --bonnie
    
    p.s.  None of the three recognized Intel, and the only thing they knew
    about Digital is that I'm contracting here and we're laying lots of
    people off.  

    Next time, try this:
    
    		What brand do you think of when I say "PC?"
    
    I suspect the answer will either be Intel or IBM.  
    
    					andrew

I think in England a PC is a Police Constable.

    
    >> I think in England a PC is a Police Constable.
    
    Nope.
    
    It's an annoying Americanism.
    
    Ian.

    re: .17
    
    >>> Next time, try this:
    
    >>>		What brand do you think of when I say "PC?"
    
    >>> I suspect the answer will either be Intel or IBM.  
    
    I asked the one guy who was left -- he said "Microsoft"...
    
    I asked him for another, and he said, "I, um, well, I'm not sure -- oh,
    Lotus.  They do a bunch of PC stuff." 
    
    On further conversation, it appears that he doesn't think of the
    hardware at all, any more than he thinks of who might have made the
    coil in his toaster.  He sees what the interface he uses does for him,
    and that's what the computer is.  
    
    I'm not sure what that means.  It would seem to imply that even if
    people gave one of the answers we were expecting, it might not be for
    the reasons we expect. 
    
    --bonnie

    Thank you, bonnie -- a useful exercise.
    
    					andrew

    
    re .11  I certainly hope you're not showing your age.  After working
    for 8.5 years for a factory automation company, it took me a few
    to change from PC (programmable controller) to PC (personal computer).
    
    Ron

        You can get a lot of insights into a person's point of view 
        and/or priorities from her/his answer.

        Probably the most typical response among the general public 
        will relate to music.

        A reference to CDROMs will show up often within our industry.

        Bankers, lawyers, brokers, etc. are likely to be reminded 
        of investment certificates.

        Terry

 CD = carrier detect

    
    	I thought that CD = Corps Diplomatique.
    
    				Malcolm.

Back to .0 for a moment.

I find this particulary exciting. This is the right way to market the 64-bit
chips: get them embedded in the new high powered VR games. I was very sad to
hear that we were unable to get our chip to be used by Nintendo or Sega. 

Talking about PCs ... how many households currently own a PC. How many of them
have a Nintendo or Sega game ? My idea of a successfull AXP chip is one that
would be in every Game Boy or Game gear sold.

/albert

I don't understand this fascination with getting AXP chips into video
games.  The processors used in these games are almost always custom chips,
not general purpose processors.  (Sega does use the Motorola 68000; not
even a 68030!) 

What's more important is to get brand recognition for Digital's products.

				Steve

    At this point, what's important is getting sales volume.
    Nintendo or Sega sales volumes would have looked mighty fine.

Sega made a barrel of money (several barrels in fact) out of the
introduction of a 16 bit games console. The marketing people had no
difficulty selling the idea that a 16 bit system would be so much better
than an 8 bit system. I would have thought that a 64 bit console
(a Sega Alphadrive) would be all the more marketable - although it would
help to have games to exploit the speed. Bung an Alpha logo on the console,
and you promote brand recognition.

    Plus you can piggyback Alpha marketing on the already formidible
    marketing of Nintendo, Sega, NEC, or whomever.
    
    But I'm feeling cynical today, so...  Why would we want to do that?  It
    would be too easy!

    What is the price of the least expensive AXP processor?  What is the
    price of a SNES machine?
    
    -Bruce

>I would have thought that a 64 bit console
>(a Sega Alphadrive) would be all the more marketable - although it would
>help to have games to exploit the speed. Bung an Alpha logo on the console,
>and you promote brand recognition.

There already is a 64-bit video game system. The Atari Jaguar. Although
it's kinda questionable if it's a REAL 64-bit system or not... the bus is
64-bits wide, and the GPU is a 64-bit processor... but it also has a 32-bit
chip and I think a 16 bit chip (in fact, I think it's a 68000). It's also
RISC...

BTW, IBM manufactures these systems...

If DEC was able to get the alpha into a 3DO or somesuch CD-ROM home multimedia
system, then we could make money... Maybe we should try and convince 3DO to
use the Alpha chip for their 3DO-2???

/scott

I'm not sure whether we should really try to get Alpha into the game market.

Imagine an HP salesman telling a customer, "With HP, you need not run your
bet-the-business applications on a toy computer..."

Hans.

I doubt Intel feels that way.

	paul