Conference 7.286::digital

    Kam,
    
    The Partners programs are a way to share information among employees
    that have a larger need to know that casual interest employees. 
    
    Writers in these conferences have just a little bit more confidence
    that they won't see it next week in Digital Review because the
    conferences for the partners discussion are members only.
    
    There's no great barrier to becoming a partner. You find out what
    programs exist by the VTX main menu selection "Access", then
    "Contacts and Organizations", then "Field Management Guide to Support".

    re: .1
    
    the only problem with that is the"people who determine who has a 
    larger need to know" .....
    
    some of them don't have a clue, I spent two days trying to get access
    to one of these accounts just to get info on LED displays for a
    flamingo that was broke....
    
    

                            ** News Flash **

    OpenVMS is really not Open. A layered product called Notes can restrict 
    people from accessing specific information.

RE: .3

	That's bull-pucky. A single layered product doesn't make an
	operating system open or not. Besides, you can get Notes
	readers for MS Windows and Unix environments. And servers
	for OS/2 environments.

	Let us not confuse politics with openness.

	If I only had a nickel for every whining note in here...

							mike

    Uh, Mikey, get a grip!  .3 was poking fun at the base note,
    by restating the gist of the argument in plain English.

	The base noter's other point, that things like MS-DOS and Unix are
	more open, is also doubtful.

	Recently I got 386MAX for my home PC and eagerly installed it. Quite
	apart from the fact that the amount of available memory fell (this
	product is supposed to increase it) my mouse stopped working with
	MS-Windows. A week, several complete system restores, and several
	books later, I have a working system again.

	Having read the Microsoft manuals and struggled with files like
	DOSSHELL.INI, whose contents don't seem to be documented anywhere,
	I am inclined to prefer good old OpenVMS which at least offers
	the "orange wall" (now grey by corporate decree) of documentation.

	/Tom

    I assume your comments about the OpenVMS Partners were made without
    knowing who the Partners are; yes, in a sense we are all partners in
    our desire to promote products that will help the company, but most of
    us don't meet the criteria needed to become OpenVMS Partners.
    
    As was mentioned earlier, the OpenVMS Partners are an international
    group of men and women with outstanding technical and business
    expertise; they champion OpenVMS, but more importantly, they do the
    right thing for Digital.
    
    If you're interested in getting access to the conference, contact
    VMSMKT::VMS_PARTNER.  If you're interested in becoming an OpenVMS
    Partner, send your request to the same account.  If you qualify,
    you'll be sent an application form.

    				      	andrew

    I think a little additional explanation of the Partners programs
    are in order...

    The Partners programs, of which OpenVMS is only one, were
    instituted and are coordinated and supported by Marketing and
    Engineering on a world-wide basis to attempt to solve some
    problems that they were having.  The fact that the field is a
    major benificiary is an intended side-effect, but the drive came
    from Marketing and Engineering.

    These problems were basically how to collect information from the
    trenches about what our customers are demanding from or
    experiencing with our products without swamping the Engineering
    and Marketing organizations which would prevent them from doing
    their jobs.  Also, they wanted a mechanism to diseminate
    information to the field but in a manner that would allow some
    small degree of control over where that message went and guidence
    on how to interpret it.  If this sounds like Spin Doctoring, well
    to some degree it is.

    What the OpenVMS Partners organization came up with (and is
    mirrored with minor differences in most other Partners programs)
    was to designate individuals in each major field Sales Support
    organization unit, usually the Account Group.  These people were
    not some elite group, but they did have to have strong skills in
    OpenVMS.  In my area I can identify a couple people who I would
    consider my superior in technical knowledge of OpenVMS but they
    either were not interested in taking on the additional
    responsibilities imposed by the program or were otherwise already
    fully committed to something else.  Note that with the number of
    Partner programs extant that nearly everyone in an office may be a
    partner in a program.  The idea is to give Engineering and
    Marketing a *manageable* number of people to deal with.  The
    OpenVMS program has about 130 members that may decide to call the
    Product Manager for a given VMS release - that's still a
    significant number of potential interruptions but far less than
    you might expect without the program.  In return, Engineering and
    Marketing gives us a week long data dump every six months and then
    voluntarily sits in a panel and takes our feedback on what is
    working and what is broken.  Of course this process occurs via
    mail and notes and phone all year long, but at these meetings we
    really come loaded for bear - after getting input from our peers
    here in the Field.  It is this kind of unfiltered exchange that
    finally brought us multiuser licenses for VAX workstations, and
    helped move up the priority of VMS Posix and is causing
    Engineering to finally find ways to decouple new hardware support
    from the OpenVMS release process.

    We in the field have to commit time and effort to the program
    above and beyond our normal responsibilities - which requires
    local management support.  We are expected to be primary PID
    presenters and the main point of focus for interaction with
    Engineering and Marketing for our AG and a clearinghouse for
    information directed out to the field - which takes anywhere from
    10-25% off the top of our available time - time that the Sales
    Reps we support may initially begrudge but over time, at least in
    my area, have come to really appreciate the increase in both
    quantity and quality of information that can be applied to their
    sales efforts.

    Yes, we receive information via mail and a restricted conference
    that not everyone sees, but in return we are trusted to pass that
    information on where we see benefit to do so - I have never
    witheld information solely because I felt it was `sensitive' - but
    I do keep track of where I sent it and I provide the receiver with
    enough information to make their own determination of how to use
    the info - I am not a gatekeeper or a filter so much as I am an
    interpreter and a research aid.  When I have questions outside of
    my area of expertise I call my Unix Partner or my CASE Partner,
    etc.  When they need OpenVMS info they call me.

	Mike
	OpenVMS Partner for the Ohio Valley

    Oh, boy, 
    
    I'm in a feisty mood tonight and the base note made me mad!  Andrew and
    Mike in the last couple replies were really rational, so I only have
    this to add:
    
    Try accessing the UNIX_PARTNER notesfile if you're not a member of that
    group.  You will find that is also a members-only notesfile.  Try
    accessing the Network Partners' notesfile.   You will find this too is
    a members-only notesfile.  These are members only for good reason as
    the last 2 replies explained.
    
    But by your reasoning in .0, you must therefore imply that Digital's
    UNIX is not open and neither is Digital's networking.  And of course,
    this is absolutely the wrong conclusion.
    
    Try getting a bunch of people to agree on what "open" means.  It's a
    relligious exercise.
    
    But it's just silly to use the fact that a members only notesfile
    exists on a topic to determine whether something is "open" or not.
    
    - Greg Scott, tired OpenVMS partner in Minneapolis, probably in
    		  political trouble again.

    People,

    Give it a rest.  The question was asked and I answered it two hours
    later.

    The rest of the replies are just beating a dead horse.

    This is a misunderstanding over what the partners program is and it's
    been clarified.

    RE: .0
    
    Give me a break bill, you should know better!
    
    
    Now, tell me, how many members-only notes conferences have you
    moderated and/or created in your time at DEC?  I*KNOW* that it's a
    non-zero number....
    
    
    -bill