Conference azur::mcc

>  It seems to me that TSAM is a product end of life .

TSAM ran out of support a long time before the NetView announcement.
V1.0.4 is the last version available (thanks to the personal effort of 
Dave Fonseca).

The bad thing is that nobody in product management ever dared to say
"folks, it's over", or "yes, here is some funding, do it". In my view,
this module went dead silently and we - support people - got the job of
telling this to the customers. 

>  Note ; Don't forget the message DECMCC will be supported for at least 3 years

This obviously does not include anything but the base kit. TSAM was
built in a different part of our organization (Terminal Server
Engineering). Consider it an "inhouse third party module". 

Regards,

*Robert
(frustrated by 11 open IPMT calls for MCC)

RE:   (frustrated by 11 open IPMT calls for MCC)

Thats because engineering ***knows*** which ones you put in, 
and saves them all up until every other one is closed.  :-) :-) :-)

Actually, It's because those that you submit seem, for some odd
reason, to have been tested and well documented, and not devoid
of any usefull information as some of the CLDs are.  As a result,
they tend to be real problems, none with simple work arrounds,
and fairly difficult to fix.

Many of the CLDs seem to be of the form "I upgraded everything,
and now when I run MCC, it crashes."  No other information,
no versions, no list of what was changed (never mind from what to what),
no commands, not even a stack dump.  In general, no usefull information.

As one who reads *EVERY* CLD that comes in, I generally ignore
yours and just pass them to engineering as real bugs they need to fix.
I really wish more of them were written as yours are.

drl

	Here's the official answer I got from engineering on a CLD which 
	has been raised a few weeks ago.
	Hereby I include the most important parts of this CLD.
	If you want to see the whole CLD send mail to
	HOLE18::IPMT$SERVER with Subject IPMT SHOW CASE uvo101206 FULL
	
	Ton Beekman

-------------------------------------------------------------

Entry Name:           CFS.9917
Abstract:             DECnet/OSI support of DECmcc TSAM
State:                Closed
Creation Date:        1994-03-09-06:41:44.310-05:00
Last Revision Date:   1994-03-22-10:20:25.005-05:00
Request Id:           UVO101206
Severity:             2
Product Name:         TSAM

>
>UPDATE to IPMT DATE: 1-DEC-1993 14:28:24
>Entered by Jon Stanley
>NPSS::STANLEY
>
>                                ENGINEERING STATUS
>                                ------------------
>        ACTION PLAN UPDATE:CFS.6319
>
>        I have talked to the ENG who has supported
>  TSAM in the past. He is currently starting
>  a new job and will not be able to support TSAM.
>        Additionally there is not a supporting TSAM
>  organization or Product Management to support
>  this product.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Event Number:          4
Event Type:           Updated Status
Date & Time:          1994-03-10-10:02:54.956-05:00
Actor:                Bill Wade  (NPSS::WADE, DTN 247-3024, (BADGE\309756))

.
.
.

From the call it appears that you are running DECnet/OSI V5.7 which is not
supported by the 400 kit.  Please discuss this with Gail Ferreira 
(DELNI::FERREIRA - 227-3756).  I am trying to contact a product manager for
TSAM but I think your problem is with the 400 kit and DECmcc's support for
DECnet/OSI 5.7.

Bill Wade
Network Product Support



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Event Number:          10
Event Type:           Solution
Date & Time:          1994-03-17-11:54:08.920-05:00
Actor:                Tom Lizotte  (vcsesu::lizotte, DNT 247-3023,
(BADGE\069510
))

Status Update:   17-MAR-1994 10:02:56
Entered by Tom Lizotte, Network Product Support
NPSS::LIZOTTE DTN:247-3023, (508)858-3023

  
                                ENGINEERING STATUS
                                ------------------

	This case involves a request for DECnet/OSI support of DECmcc 
	TSAM.  The current version of Terminal Server Access Module (TSAM)
	does not support DECnet/OSI.  This support would be a major 
	engineering effort which is not planned since the product is
	in maintanence.

	Because this is a request for added functionality to the documented
	support of TSAM, no further action will be taken by engineering.
	I've attached a note from Product Management.

From:	NPSS::DELNI::FERREIRA "NETVIEW/NETWORK MANAGEMENT PROD MGNT MGR 
227-3756; ELLEN 3768  16-Mar-1994 1436" 16-MAR-1994 14:38:52.03
To:	NPSS::LIZOTTE
CC:	FERREIRA
Subj:	TSAM for DECnet/OSI

Tom,

As we discussed, there are no enhancements planned for Terminal
Server Access Module.  Since this product is in maintenance, 
no further enhancements will be done, especially large ones
such DECnet/OSI support.

Gail 

				ALTERNATIVES
				------------		
	The alternatives for managing terminal servers is to use
	TSM V2.1 which works with DECnet OSI.  This is acheduled to 
	be available some time in Q4.  Also, NETVIEW running OSF
	is scheduled to be available in this calender year.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Event Number:          12
Event Type:           Closure
Date & Time:          1994-03-22-10:20:24.895-05:00

    

RE: -< The ignore yours, you know, because its YOU. >-

:-) :-) :-)
At least I seem to be well known - or shoud I say notorious?

Don't take my comment too serious. It had been a long day... I know that
you are all doing your best - with diminished staff. 

We're all struggling to make ends meet; let's keep on!

*Robert

Hello,

  For sure we are in a (silent) transition phase, but PNM400 will be supported
  for the next years. There is a team 'somewhere' that is in charge of it.

  All CLDs will be corrected one day, just a matter of time.

  So, TSAM is not dead, just in maintenance mode.

  Regards.

  Pierre.  
  

Here the good news:

I was asked yesterday to make an estimated of how hard it would be to make
PNM400 or DECmcc EMS or whaever You call it run on DECnet/OSI. The request
includes explicitly TSAM as well as ELM.

The good news is that TSAM is supported.


The bad news is that support moves from here to there. And DIgital is extremely
good in loosing knowledge or pieces of software.

I hope all negociatioons run well. In that case You can expect answers to
TSAM-related issues starting in the summer.


Aswer to .0
===========

The reason(s) are simple, and frustrating: TSAM uses the DNA4 access module to
get nodename-to-address translation and other things. It is identical to doing

  NCP show node MYSERVER all char

This does not work on DECnet/OSI.

The second reason is even simpler: access to the Ethernet wire needs some
enhancements. In some cases it works on DECnet/OSI in some it won't


Hope this makes it clearer



Dirk