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Conference vaxaxp::vmsnotes

Title:VAX and Alpha VMS
Notice:This is a new VMSnotes, please read note 2.1
Moderator:VAXAXP::BERNARDO
Created:Wed Jan 22 1997
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:703
Total number of notes:3722

228.0. "Backup very slow to a RF73 disk." by PADKOA::COSTEUX (Le Plat Pays qui est le mien...) Thu Feb 20 1997 11:31

    A customer using OVMS VAX-V6.1 does a BACKUP [dir...]*.* to either a
    tape or a disk. About 986000 blocks are saved on the create saveset.
    - when he does this backup to the tape (TZ85) it takes about 48
    minutes.
    - when he does this backup to a disk (RF73) it takes about 1h22 ..
    As you see no qualifier is used (only the /SAVE while backing up to the
    disk). How can we explain a such difference ? We checked the quota to
    optimize the Backup work but the Backup remains faster to the tape than
    to the disk.
    
    Thanks for comments
    
    Jean-Pierre
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228.1MOVIES::WIDDOWSONRodThu Feb 20 1997 12:2123
    So the commands are
    
    $ BAckup [dir...]*.* disk:[toto]
    
    and
    
    $ backup [dir...]*.* tape:/save
    
    ???
    
    In this case the "/SAVE" is instructing backup to do completely
    different things.  In the former case the customer is doing what is
    effectively a file by file copy (and at that to a single directory) and
    in the other he is creating one saveset.
    
    If this is the case, the customer will see a different time again when
    he does 
    
    $ backup [dir...]*.* disk:[toto]sauve/save
    
    Which is more analogous to the tape command
    
    /r
228.2Disk may be fragmentedKEIKI::WHITEMIN(2�,FWIW)Thu Feb 20 1997 15:0512
    
    	As a test
    
    1. $Init the disk
    2. $Mount the disk
    3. $set rms/extend=1000
    4. $Backup ......
    
    	To at least have a crabapple to apple test
    
    
    					Bill
228.3AUSS::GARSONDECcharity Program OfficeThu Feb 20 1997 17:1021
re .1
    
>    So the commands are
>    
>    $ BAckup [dir...]*.* disk:[toto]
>    
>    and
>    
>    $ backup [dir...]*.* tape:/save
    
    No, .0 says that /SAVE is on the disk.
    
re .0
    
    As .2 says, check for fragmentation on the output disk and the RMS
    extend size is very important.
    
    Check for other user load on the output disk.

    Also check where the various devices are in terms of buses and
    controllers.
228.4I'd do this firstCERN::HOBBSCongrats to the Ignoble Peace Prize winner! (http://www.eecs.harvard.edu/ig_nobel)Fri Feb 21 1997 02:3023
.1>    3. $set rms/extend=1000

What is the extendize?  Please note that BACKUP uses the default, so unless
something has been set backup will

	* go to write a single buffer
	* notice that the file needs to be extended
	* extend the file by the default (or maybe MAX (default,buffersize))
		* access the bitmap
		* modify the file header
		* write the file header to the disk
		* read the file header back from the disk (data-check)
	* write the buffer

Not only are you doing lots of extra reads and writes, those extra reads
and writes are pulling the head away from the data being written.

And, I'd think that /extend=1000 is pretty mild - I usually use /ext=65535
for any significant backup (you are going to have to truncate the file
at the end of the backup anyway, so what's the big deal if you truncate
40,000 blocks or 400?)

-cw
228.5replied to quicklyMOVIES::WIDDOWSONRodFri Feb 21 1997 04:241
    ... my mistake....
228.6Alternative w/disk-to-diskGREGOR::OPPFri Feb 21 1997 07:1217
    RE: .0
    
    	If you (the customer) is going to do a disk-to-disk back-up,
    why not preserve the directory structure in the backup:
    
    	BACKUP /VERIFY SRC$:[source...]*.*;*  DST$:[000000...]
    
    It's been a while since I've actually done this and the syntax is
    a bit tricky as I recall.  But if you're backing up the disk to 
    another disk, it's not *necessary* to flatten the directory or 
    encapsulate all the files & directories in a save set.  
    
    	However, I'm sure the customer has a good reason for doing it
    this way.  Right?
    
    Greg
     
228.7Simple reasonPADKOA::COSTEUXLe Plat Pays qui est le mien...Fri Feb 21 1997 10:225
    As the tape was unavailable the customer decided to make a backup on a
    disk and stated the problem mentioned in .0
    
    Thanks all for your comments.
    Jean-Pierre