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Conference tecrus::mormonism

Title:The Glory of God is Intelligence.
Moderator:BSS::RONEY
Created:Thu Jan 28 1988
Last Modified:Fri Apr 25 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:460
Total number of notes:6198

24.0. "Freedom of Choice" by CACHE::LEIGH () Thu Feb 04 1988 08:22

The Lord has placed many restrictions on our conduct.  We are restricted
in our speech, our dress, our food, our thoughts, and our actions.  These
restrictions hover over us 24 hours a day.

Many people resent these restrictions and feel that their free agency is
being taken from them.  To an extent at least, these feelings of resentment
are a normal part of being human.

I've created this base note so we can share our feelings and experiences
with each other.  How have you handled your feelings as the Lord through
the Scriptures and the Church tell you what you should and should not do?
How are your children and spouse if you have them handling theirs?  What
are you doing to help others adjust to the social, ethical, and moral codes
of the Gospel?  What has worked for you?
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24.1Stay within the ringCACHE::LEIGHThu Feb 04 1988 08:3431
I was reading a conference talk by Elder Dean L. Larsen this morning in which
he talked about restrictions (Ensign, November 1987, p. 11).  I would like to
share his comment because he gives an example that will be understood by our
teens (as well as us adults).

"When I was a young man, I enjoyed participating in athletic activities of
various kinds.  I was never very expert in these things, but this did not
diminish my interest nor the satisfaction that came from my participation.
I was particularly interested in track and field events.  In my school
years I competed in the hurdle races as well as in the shot put and the discus
throw.  These last two events required that the participant launch his effort
from within a ring that was marked out on the playing field.  So long as the
competitor remained within the ring while making his throw of the discus
or the put of the shot, his effort was qualified to be measured in the
competition.  If he stepped outside the circle, his effort was disqualified as
a foul.  Generally, three preliminary attempts were permitted in each of these
events, and then three more for those whose tosses were long enough to
qualify them for the finals.  If a competitor fouled in each of his attempts,
he was out of the competition."

"Those of us who participated in these sports learned the importance of staying 
within the mark."

Elder Larsen then went on to discuss Chapter four of Jacob in which Jacob
said that the Israelites had gotten themselves in trouble because they were
blind to spiritual truth, 'which blindness came by looking beyond the mark,
they must needs fall'.  He expressed his concern that we stay within the
bounds set by the Lord and not 'look beyond the mark' at things that would
harm us.

Allen
24.2To Do or Not To DoMDVAX1::DULLTamara Dull @STOMon Feb 22 1988 18:0837
    This is a difficult topic to address.
    
    Speaking for myself *only*, there have been times where I have viewed the
    commandments as a list of "do's" and "don't's."  Do this . . . don't
    do that . . . At times, I have become critical or resentful of some of these
    *rules* we *have to* obey.
    
    In hindsight, I can see what has brought me to these times of criticism
    and/or resentment.  It's usually not the commandment I am having
    trouble with, but rather, the fact that I have been told I have
    to do (or not do) something.  That fact alone can cause me to rebel
    because I start to think, "What difference does it make if I do
    such and such or if I don't do such and such?  What's it going to
    matter?  I can repent later."  Is this a familiar tune for anyone
    else?!
    
    I have to constantly remind myself that I am a child of God, that
    I do have value and a purpose in this life.  And even though I may
    not fully understand the purpose for any given commandment, it doesn't
    mean that I am exempt from obeying it.  In time, I will come to
    understand and really appreciate God's wisdom in giving it to me,
    His child.  There are some commandments that I don't think I'll
    see the wisdom in until the next life - and that's where my faith
    and trust in God kicks in.  I have to trust that He knows what he's
    doing, and that it is for my own personal benefit and growth that
    He has given me this *rule*.
    
    I can't exactly say that I'm excited about all the commandments
    God has given us, but I do know, that without them, I would never
    be able to be with Him again.  It's my choice to choose whether
    I want to be with my Heavenly Father again - no one else can make
    the decision for me.
    
    Tamara
    
    
    
24.4CLIMB::LEIGHThe song of the righteous is a prayerFri Dec 02 1988 12:1927
There are two freedoms--the false, where a man is free to do what he likes;
the true where he is free to do what he ought.

 -- Charles Kingsley



God who gave us life gave us liberty.  Can the liberties of a nation be secure
when we have removed a conviction that these liberties are the gift of God?
Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just, that his
justice cannot sleep forever.

 -- Thomas Jefferson



One fact stands out in bold relief in the history of man's attempts for
betterment.  When compulsion is used only resentment is aroused, and the end
is not gained.  Only through moral suasion and appeal to men's reason can a
movement succeed.

 -- Samuel Gompers




And most importantly, D & C 121.
24.5MIZZOU::SHERMANLove is a decision ...Fri Dec 02 1988 12:4642
    I had a roommate from Pakistan that became a very good friend of
    mine.  We played a lot of ping pong on weeknights after work.  I'm not 
    sure what his religion was, but he was very devout in his prayers and
    was very honest, kind and sincere.  In his country, the custom is for
    the parents to select spouses for children, and he was in this manner 
    engaged to be married within a few months.  His bride-to-be and family
    were in Pakistan.
    
    One of the women in the complex had been seeking my friend out and
    had been attempting to set up situations where she would coincidentally
    be alone with him.  He began to sense that her purpose was primarily
    to find time alone with him.  This left him confused, aroused and
    alarmed.  This became an issue of private discussion between us.  
    I explained to him my basic beliefs about morality and the needs to 
    maintain high moral standards including abstinence before marriage 
    and fidelity during.  He shared his feelings with me and I with him.  
    I shared with him my feelings about how important this was to holding 
    the family together and so forth.  I let him know that I cared, that 
    I would be happy to talk with him about it at any time, and that I 
    would pray for him to be strengthened.  And, my concerns for him were 
    prominent in my prayers.
    
    Some time later, she asked him to take her on an errand. This was not 
    unusual since many of us didn't have cars and he was known to help
    just about anyone with such errands.  It was during this errand that 
    she attempted to seduce him and offered to provide sexual services
    for $20.  He told me that it was partly because of my support that
    he was able to turn this offer down.  
    
    He later married his intended spouse having remained true to her and 
    to his principles.  At my latest contact with him he was living very 
    happily with his bride and both were very near to attaining American 
    citizenship.
    
    $20 seemed such a small price to pay at the time and I know the
    temptation was very great for my friend.  But, had he succumed to
    it his life may have now been in comparable ruins.  I was glad that
    I could be there at a time when he was separated by distance from the 
    moral support of his family and when he had few other close friends
    that shared his sense of high moral standards.
    
    Steve
24.3CACHE::LEIGHLet your light shineWed Jan 23 1991 08:3128
I've been thinking about the problems we face in life and causes of those
problems.  I think the problems are due to three factors.

1.  Natural laws.  The Lord created the earth and set in motion eternal
laws that govern the elements.  The San Francisco earthquake and the
resulting suffering are due to those laws.  They are part of our mortality.

2.  Other people using their free agency.  God made us free, and if I want
to hurt you, He will not stop me.  A large part of our suffering is due to 
misuse of our freedom to choose.

3.  Our using our free agency.  We are free to choose, and we are accountable
for our choices.  We all make unwise decisions and suffer because of them.
I remember reading a few years ago about a woman who was raped at 2 am in
the Boston combat zone.  She made an unwise decision to be there at that time,
and someone else made the decision to violate her.  The combination of the
two decisions resulted in her suffering.

There is a common misconception that our suffering is the result of God's
actions against us.  I think this misconception is a result of Satan's
plan to make us not responsible for our own actions.  God is not responsible
for our lives, we are!  He has created a stage in which we can progress to
become like him, and we act out our lives, making our decisions and having
to coexist with the decisions of others.  We can minimize our suffering with
careful planning but we can not eliminate it, because we can not bypass the
principle of free agency. 

Allen